Subject: MYSTARA-L Digest - 26 Aug 2002 to 27 Aug 2002 (#2002-223) From: Automatic digest processor Date: 28/08/2002, 17:00 To: Recipients of MYSTARA-L digests Reply-to: Mystara RPG Discussion There are 14 messages totalling 701 lines in this issue. Topics of the day: 1. Wrath of the Immortals II (5) 2. [WotI:2] Appendix: The Crown of Chaos (2) 3. RPG in spanish (3) 4. PWA3 (2) 5. 3E Epic levels: Abominations = Burrowers? 6. Taymor and Varellya ******************************************************************** The Other Worlds Homepage: http://www.wizards.com/dnd/OtherWorlds.asp The Mystara Homepage: http://www.dnd.starflung.com/ To unsubscribe, send email to LISTSERV@ORACLE.WIZARDS.COM with UNSUB MYSTARA-L in the body of the message. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Tue, 27 Aug 2002 11:16:34 +0200 From: =?iso-8859-1?q?Havard=20Faanes?= Subject: Re: Wrath of the Immortals II --- FHWT skrev: > > The scenario has many access points to high-level > adventures. Great work! I > even consider calling my "old" players to arms to > defeat that ugly Garethax Hi Laren, Good luck with kicking Garethax's ass! I'd be really happy if someone actually uses the stuff Im writing! :) Let me know how it goes.. Havard ______________________________________________________ Se den nye Yahoo! Mail på http://no.yahoo.com/ Nytt design, enklere å bruke, alltid tilgang til Adressebok, Kalender og Notisbok ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 27 Aug 2002 13:17:32 +0200 From: =?iso-8859-1?q?Havard=20Faanes?= Subject: Re: Wrath of the Immortals II --- Chris Furneaux Hi Chris, thanks for your comments! > I like this. Perhaps the NoS doesn't exactly drain > entropy after WotI, but > changes it into other forms of power for Garethax. > Still entropic, just not > straight magic/entropy. later you talk of a device > to capture immortals power. > Could Garethax have turned the NoS into one of > these? Rad doesn't die though, > but his immortal power is trapped in the device. This makes sense. I see the NoS as a sort of receptacle for Garethax, much like that of a Lich. It provides him with power, but also, his soul is now linked to it, so that destroying one will destroy the other. I like your theory about Rad and his power too. The PCs going through Mark of Amber might be able to free part of Rads essence, but not neccesarily all of it. (leaving him as a mortal). > > The Church of Gareth > Thyatis and Karameikos would not be my first choice > as examples of this. > Probally Ylarium and Heldan I would say, But I don't > think thyatis needs > immortal aproval as such. More the countries that > focus on immortal patronage > for their rulership (that wouldn't be Draokin now > would it) . After all the > current emperor of thyatis was put in power not > because of aproval, but Anya's > disapproval of Thincol. And Stefan does not claim to > "be" Halav, just doesn't > dispell it. Both Thyatis and Karameikos leave > religion fairly open in their > politics (although it does affect their bias) IMO. Good points. I was thinking more in the line of Immortals supporting _things as they are_ and the social order (ie nobility), giving peasants an excuse to revolt no matter what official policy is... > > Ogdoban Treel > As a plot device this works, but as an event I don't > like it. It should be > immposible to raise him after this length of time. > Though speak with dead might > work (which is why I would say he is there) . > Benekander never really died and > that is why he could become immortal. Maybe though > Ogdoban is already a lacky > of thantos, who spared him when he found out the > destruction and evil he had > managed to cause. With the new found powers of the > NoS thantos has been off > learning all he can from Ogdoban to see what damage > he can cause. This means > that Ogdoban has probally resurfaced and perhaps > (depending on weather he is > fully immortal, a demi-god, or still mortal) has > been supporting the > Brotherhood of the Radiance (and probally one of > them, but is really a lacky of > thantos and a spy) Makes sense. I originally envisoned him as simply a powerful demon, being raised by Garethax or Thanatos when they discovered his bones. > > The Master of the Desert Nomads I really don't like this. The mear fact they are > orcs should not make them ally > with the master. And the population would probally > not survive food wise if > they were orcs. Sind is poor, barren, and > overpopulated. The reason the master > has orcs is the deals he has made with them over > time and they have become part > of the population of Hule. I would more likely have > the master move more troops > (probally humanoids) into hule, perhaps this causes > some displacement of the > population into surounding regions and also allows > for a strenthening of the > masters position. Orcs become as overloards in some > areas, treating the > population as slaves. Perhaps there is a Crown of > Chaos but what it does is > allow the master to have greater control of his > humanoid minions. I think that > would work better. Perhaps this was a bit over the top, but I wanted the epic dimensions aswell. The lack of food is a good point, but wouldnt this simply drive the Orcs into making war (which is what the Master wants all along?) However, your version works too; perhaps there already are enough humanoids around and the Crown of Chaos simply draws them out and places them under the Masters command. I will post details on the Crown later, but I can reveal now that it inspires fanatic loyalty in humanoids and that it is connected to the very creation of the Beastmen in ages past. > I'm not so sure Loki would be comfortable with this > ally, as he is more about > clever trickery then distruction. Perhaps the KW > sends a large force to sind's > aid and Loki is forced to accept the offer, turning > the tides at the last > minute. The KW's armies, outmatched are forced to > retreat. The masters position > in sind is weakened but now Thantos and his allies > have a foothold. Loki could actually aid the PCs. In my original draft, he was simply pushed aside, but it would actually be in his nature to betray Thanatos and company so I dont see why not :) > > The Master now > > launches an attack via the Ahdri Varma Plateau > onto > > Glantri. > > bassed on the above it would be less so the master > and more the legions of > thantos and his allies. This would depend on the turnout of the adventure, but yes probably. A few Carnifex generals could take charge if the Master is placed in the background of things... > This is the one bit I really didn't like. Killing Ka > is one thing, but > I don't > know that it should be so easy to kill him on his > > home plane and if > Garathax is > killing immortals in this way wouldn't he take care > of the other > immortals that > got in his way like this too. I thought I'd get some reactions to that one! When I first read Wrath of the Immortals, I was really surprised that the whole adventure doesnt contain one single Immortal death (Rad, a possible exception). The battle between Ka and Garathax was to illustrate the immense powers of the Outer Beings, but perhaps you are right that going back to the guy's homeplane is taking it a bit too far. You are right in the fact that a Hierarch in his homeplane is something of immense power, but Garathax should present a real threat to the whole Immortal society. Thanks for the advice on my language usage too. Ill incorporate some of your ideas in the next draft. > Then he returns to Glantri. > I don't know that that should be the end of > Benekander, but the rest sounds ok. > See below though. This is more of a poetic idea of having WotI:2 remove all traces of the FSS Beagle from Mystara including the Radience, Benekander and Treel. Ofcourse, Benekander could return in WotI3.... Which brings me to another question: What happened to the Beagle itself? If the Engine was saved, how come the ship was destroyed by the reactor? Perhaps it too is around somehwere? > CONSEQUENCES: > > Alphatia?? > I like, although: > 1.) the immortals may have something to say about this! Yep. Many Immortals wont like it, but I think that they are getting much more careful about intervening on the Prime after the events of WotI 1&2. So Id say they are grumpy about it, but still decide to leave things as they are. > 2.) perhaps not in exactly the same position (hey it could fall on > glantri when the NoS blows up) ;D Take out both empires Hey, enough destruction already! Seriously though, when writing this, one of the things I had in mind was what the setting is going to look like after the adventure is done. Having Alphatia back was just an idea to have more adventure potential back in the Known World. But its interesting, perhaps especially if Glantri goes the way of the Dodo (Or is brought to the HW as a flying continent??), to have Alphatia levitating above the Greater Brokenlands created where Glantri was... > 3.) I'm not sure if the populace would be thrilled (hey where are you taking > us!?! we like 24 hour sunshine! no more vampires!) What are they going to do about it? :D Glantri: > IMHO the most of the city should be destroyed in the > blast, but the > populace by > and large should have managed to escape before the > seige. Those that > remain > would have most likely been fleeing the conflict of > the immortals, or > involved > in the battleing (and hopefully outside the blast > radius). Im getting more and more inclined to wiping out the entire country, even though it is one of my favourite Mystara nations.... > > Rad > Perhaps his power is freed from it's imprisionment > in the NoS and he regains his immortallity that way. I like your theory. It makes sense, but it all depends on what you want to do with Rad in later campaigns. He might be cool to have around, just as a mortal really powerful mage aswell.. Håvard ______________________________________________________ Se den nye Yahoo! Mail på http://no.yahoo.com/ Nytt design, enklere å bruke, alltid tilgang til Adressebok, Kalender og Notisbok ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 27 Aug 2002 13:21:04 +0200 From: =?iso-8859-1?q?Havard=20Faanes?= Subject: Re: Wrath of the Immortals II --- John Calvin : Hollow World Purpose: > So in the event of an Outer Being supported Carnifex > invasion on the planet, > the immortals might start calling in trops from the > Hollow World in order to > battle the invaders. Portals could start opening up > with Nithians, Oltecs, > Jennites, Tanagoro, Millenians, Llomarians, and yes > - even Alphatians*, > springing out of them to do battle. Interesting ideas, John. What exactly is the nature of this corruption anyways? I assume it is something similar to what happened in (Old) Nithia. Will this eventually allow the Outer Beings to turn corrupted mortals into mindless slaves? Håvard ______________________________________________________ Se den nye Yahoo! Mail på http://no.yahoo.com/ Nytt design, enklere å bruke, alltid tilgang til Adressebok, Kalender og Notisbok ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 27 Aug 2002 13:41:21 +0200 From: =?iso-8859-1?q?Havard=20Faanes?= Subject: [WotI:2] Appendix: The Crown of Chaos WotI: 2 Appendix: The Crown of Chaos Hel’s armies of Giants and Dragons were failing to destroy the Blackmoor Civilization. She decided to create new armies of smaller, but more numerous monsters. This she did by creating five gemstones, the Crystals of Chaos, which collected the spirits of dead creatures with evil souls. The Gemstones then used the power of these spirits to create a new race, the Beastmen. In the beginning, the race was chaotic and did not breed true, dependent on the Crystals to spawn new generations of Beastmen. But as the crystals grew stronger, the race changed, and each gemstone started producing its own distinct breed of Beastmen. One crystal created what is now called Ogres another Bugbears, the third the Orcs, the fourth created the Goblins and Hobgoblins and the fifth the Kobolds. (Trolls are not really decendent from Beastmen although some trolls have inbred with these through the ages). The Crystals were given to leaders of each race. But some races were more powerful than the others and they waged war among themselves. Finally, a legendary Orc King, known as Drawakhaz, the Original Shadow Lord, was able to capture all the five Crystals, and he forged them into a Crown, known as the Crown of Chaos. The Crown inspires fanatic loyality among of the decendants of the Beastmen races who see it. Also, the wearer can turn armies of other mortal races into Goblinoids at will. ______________________________________________________ Se den nye Yahoo! Mail på http://no.yahoo.com/ Nytt design, enklere å bruke, alltid tilgang til Adressebok, Kalender og Notisbok ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 27 Aug 2002 09:00:49 -0300 From: "Jonathan L." Subject: RPG in spanish I'm working on a big RPG site for spanish speakers. It'll have a lot of = Mystara information. (I want to traduce all the information abount = mystara on the web to spanish) If anyone wants to help, by sending information, etc, i'll be very = greatfull. You can see a small presentation going to: www.juegos-de-rol.com.ar Thank you very much, Jonathan ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 27 Aug 2002 13:54:52 +0100 From: Colin Wilson Subject: PWA3 Hiya, Could someone tell me whether there was a map with the poor wizard almanac three. If so, what did it show. Cheers, Col. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 27 Aug 2002 09:06:57 -0400 From: Geoff Gander Subject: Re: RPG in spanish > You can see a small presentation going to: www.juegos-de-rol.com.ar > > Jonathan WOW! That's neat! It'll be interesting to see how it turns out. Geoff -- Geoff Gander, BA 97, MPA 02 Carnifex Loremaster/Mad Roleplayer Master of the Elemental Plane of Bureaucracy au998@freenet.carleton.ca : www.geocities.com/TimesSquare/Realm/2091 ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 27 Aug 2002 09:08:27 -0400 From: Geoff Gander Subject: Re: PWA3 > Could someone tell me whether there was a map with the poor wizard almanac > three. If so, what did it show. > > Col. The map shows the Sea of Dawn region, plus a large part of western Skothar (a fair portion of Minaea is visible). Geoff -- Geoff Gander, BA 97, MPA 02 Carnifex Loremaster/Mad Roleplayer Master of the Elemental Plane of Bureaucracy au998@freenet.carleton.ca : www.geocities.com/TimesSquare/Realm/2091 ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 27 Aug 2002 11:19:39 -0300 From: "Jonathan L." Subject: Re: RPG in spanish JAJAJ! Thanks. The idea is to do it like a book (or a dream). If any of you is intrested, we can exchange links, and info. Jonathan ----- Original Message ----- From: "Geoff Gander" To: Sent: Tuesday, August 27, 2002 10:06 AM Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] RPG in spanish > >You can see a small presentation going to: www.juegos-de-rol.com.ar > > > >Jonathan > > WOW! That's neat! It'll be interesting to see how it turns out. > > Geoff > > -- > Geoff Gander, BA 97, MPA 02 > Carnifex Loremaster/Mad Roleplayer > Master of the Elemental Plane of Bureaucracy > au998@freenet.carleton.ca : www.geocities.com/TimesSquare/Realm/2091 > > ******************************************************************** > The Other Worlds Homepage: http://www.wizards.com/dnd/OtherWorlds.asp > The Mystara Homepage: http://www.dnd.starflung.com/ > To unsubscribe, send email to LISTSERV@ORACLE.WIZARDS.COM > with UNSUB MYSTARA-L in the body of the message. > > ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 27 Aug 2002 07:47:33 -0700 From: John Calvin Subject: Re: Wrath of the Immortals II >> > > Rad > Perhaps his power is freed from it's imprisionment > in the NoS and he regains his immortallity that way. I like your theory. It makes sense, but it all depends on what you want to do with Rad in later campaigns. He might be cool to have around, just as a mortal really powerful mage aswell.. << I'm starting to like the idea that Rad is stripped of immortality, and then sent back to the prime as a mortal. Afterwards Rafiel would guide him into shadow elf lands and at the same time send visions to his shamans that a "great master" is journeying to the City of the Stars who will help the shadow elves complete the Chamber of the Spheres. THat might make for a great adventure as Rad must escape his enemies in Glantri, journey through humaniod infested broken lands and deep into the earth, past hostile shadow elves and right into the heart of their city, and finially must convince the shadow elf shamans that he is the great master of whom their patron spoke of. Lots of potential there. -John ===== Rule #85. I will not use any plan in which the final step is horribly complicated, e.g. "Align the 12 Stones of Power on the sacred altar then activate the medallion at the moment of total eclipse." Instead it will be more along the lines of "Push the button." from "A Guide to Becoming an Evil Overlord" by Peter Anspach __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Yahoo! Finance - Get real-time stock quotes http://finance.yahoo.com ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 27 Aug 2002 07:52:57 -0700 From: John Calvin Subject: Re: Wrath of the Immortals II >> Hollow World Purpose: > So in the event of an Outer Being supported Carnifex > invasion on the planet, > the immortals might start calling in trops from the > Hollow World in order to > battle the invaders. Portals could start opening up > with Nithians, Oltecs, > Jennites, Tanagoro, Millenians, Llomarians, and yes > - even Alphatians*, > springing out of them to do battle. Interesting ideas, John. What exactly is the nature of this corruption anyways? I assume it is something similar to what happened in (Old) Nithia. Will this eventually allow the Outer Beings to turn corrupted mortals into mindless slaves? << I guess I was thinking of the Nightwail series where Thanatos tries to block the SoP, and thus release more of his Burrowers. The corruption that followed would be akin to that caused by the Smoking Mirror. Yes, I see that as basically the same thing that happened in old Nithia (although through a different means - unless there were some BUrrowers under those Pyramids ;) ). I'm not sure that the OBs would be able to turn them into mindless slaves, but it would be much easier to tempt them with promises of gaining personal power. In this case I'd see a lot of the HW inhabitants turning from the worship of the immortals and toward the worship of the Outer Beings. Perhaps something similar happened to the carnifex of old, and that is why the immortals put a stop to them. -John ===== Rule #85. I will not use any plan in which the final step is horribly complicated, e.g. "Align the 12 Stones of Power on the sacred altar then activate the medallion at the moment of total eclipse." Instead it will be more along the lines of "Push the button." from "A Guide to Becoming an Evil Overlord" by Peter Anspach __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Yahoo! Finance - Get real-time stock quotes http://finance.yahoo.com ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 28 Aug 2002 01:26:40 +0200 From: =?iso-8859-1?q?la=20Volpe?= Subject: Re: 3E Epic levels: Abominations = Burrowers? > Anyone else have thoughts? > My only thought is "geez, I hope to update the "Dark Portal" soon...". By the way, the Burrower articles are there too. (end of commercial) ISS ______________________________________________________________________ Yahoo! Musica: notizie, recensioni, classifiche, speciali multimediali http://it.yahoo.com/mail_it/foot/?http://it.music.yahoo.com/ ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 28 Aug 2002 11:58:48 +1200 From: Chris Furneaux Subject: Re: [WotI:2] Appendix: The Crown of Chaos good history. > The Crown inspires fanatic loyality among of the > decendants of the Beastmen races who see it. Also, the > wearer can turn armies of other mortal races into > Goblinoids at will. Just a little too powerful for my tastes as it does not seem limited. I would have: Each stone has two powers: The primary power of the stone is to turn chaotic of evil aligned humans into Beastmen unless a save vs spells is made. If the save is made that victim can never be changed into a beastman. If it is failed, the victim is immediatly changed into a beastman of the repective type. The effect is that of a polymorph other spell and can be dispelled. However, victims are able to breed and children are real beastmen. Non-chaotic Humans will suffer a moment of emmense pain as any victims are being transformed, but will other wise be unharmed. The Newly transformed Beastmen will immediatly try to attack any non-beastmen, and should also be treated as an enraged berserker. Humanoids present are unable to act during the transformation as their very essence is being harnessed for the magic. Demi-humans are unaffected by the crown. How often the primary power can only be used depends on how many people it is used against. 0-5 Once a day 6-15 Once a week 16-50 Once a month 50-500 Once a year 500+ Once every century. No Mortal Beastmen can use the primary power of the crown. The secondary power is to inspire loalty in the respective humanoid race. This is a permanent effect. What do you think? ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 27 Aug 2002 21:21:44 -0400 From: Christopher M Cherrington Subject: Re: Taymor and Varellya How would the War Rafts fit into this scenario? I always thought of them as descendants of the Mileneans or Proto-Thyatians still wandering the oceans from their migration north. Could the rafts be descendants of Tamor peoples instead? ------------------------------ End of MYSTARA-L Digest - 26 Aug 2002 to 27 Aug 2002 (#2002-223) ****************************************************************