Subject: MYSTARA-L Digest - 25 Nov 2002 to 26 Nov 2002 (#2002-305) From: Automatic digest processor Date: 27/11/2002, 19:00 To: Recipients of MYSTARA-L digests Reply-to: Mystara RPG Discussion There are 14 messages totalling 851 lines in this issue. Topics of the day: 1. Gold (changed title back to gold...) (2) 2. What is it called when you... 3. M-Babylon or M-Sumeria? (4) 4. Some general skills from my game 5. Nithians Inviting Alphatians [was M-Babylon or M-Sumeria?] 6. Nithians Inviting Alphatians [was M-Babylon or M-Sumeria?] 7. Carnifex (was: A Guide to Human Ethnography) 8. Wanted: Supreme Sky Diety 9. Possible way to buy "Fantasy Empires" (Mystara based PC game) 10. More NWN Images - Alfheim and Blackmoor ******************************************************************** The Other Worlds Homepage: http://www.wizards.com/dnd/OtherWorlds.asp The Mystara Homepage: http://www.dnd.starflung.com/ To unsubscribe, send email to LISTSERV@ORACLE.WIZARDS.COM with UNSUB MYSTARA-L in the body of the message. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Tue, 26 Nov 2002 01:05:46 -0800 From: Darth Darknerd Subject: Re: Gold (changed title back to gold...) Hi. Yep. You are correct. Most of my comments were directed to fringe -noids living on the edge of established societies. However, the -noids in Broken Lands, Northern Reaches, and elsewhere are established societies, and are in a different category altogether. The driving forces of scattered fringe -noids, are different than -noids of established societies. For fringe -noids, one has to think to whom can they trade their gold with? Why? For what? Would civilized societies trade? Or kill them on the spot. This adds some interesting dynamics. Take the fringe -noids in Karameikos. Many of the huanoids can trade with the Iron Ring, which has established relations with any goblin tribes (Module B10 Night's Dark Terror). Baron Ludwig von Hendriks retains regiments of Bugbears (GAZ1 Grand Duchy of Karameikos, and Kingdom of Karameikos, boxed set), so the bugbears their can exchange gold for goods freely. As the humanoids are considered blood thirsty savages in Karameikos, it would be considered treasonous to trade with them, especially weapons; though this may not any documented as a written law. The fact that Baron von Hendriks does this is unknown to the public at large. There are some historical incidents throughout Real World to draw upon as examples. There were the skaelings of New Foundland, whom the vikings did not want to trade their sought of metal weapons. Then their are natives whom acquired muskets, etc. The native groups often bartered, until their societies and infastructure was diminished. Though, unlike humanoids, whom are monsterous in appearance, natives were at least human (though not treated as such), and many accepted trade with them. - Joaquin > Date: Mon, 25 Nov 2002 22:15:43 -0500 > From: Christopher M Cherrington > > Subject: Re: Gold (changed title back to gold...) > > A couple of things that has not been brought up on > this subject... > Kobolds in the Northern Reaches are rich. They have > taken over a successful > kingdom of gnomish clans, and acquired all their > wealth by invading the > gnomish tunnels. Successes like this one, and other > successes like King > Loark in the Great Horde, would fill many humanoid > coffers for years to > come. Ardelphia was a whole city that was looted, > raped, and now lays in > ruins. These types of events brings wealth into the > humanoids hands, and > they are chaotic enough that they would continually > raid on each other, > passing the wealth around. The southern > principalities of Glantri give an > annual payoff to keep the goblins close to their > borders under their thumb > (to Glantri it gives them more time to study new > magics and not worry about > staging expensive, time consuming, protective > strikes that could keep > farmers away from their fields and not feed the rest > of the principalities). > Besides the occasional raiding, there is the > ransoming, tolling, and > kidnapping, even slave trading with foreign powers. > Slaves for gladiatorial > matches have to come from somewhere, why not from > unscrupulous merchants > dealing with the Iron Ring or the Hill Giants in > Altan Tepe? > __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail Plus - Powerful. Affordable. Sign up now. http://mailplus.yahoo.com ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 26 Nov 2002 01:07:27 -0800 From: Darth Darknerd Subject: What is it called when you... ...get aching joints under the sea? kopru-tunnel syndrome __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail Plus - Powerful. Affordable. Sign up now. http://mailplus.yahoo.com ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 26 Nov 2002 11:17:06 +0100 From: =?iso-8859-1?q?la=20Volpe?= Subject: Re: M-Babylon or M-Sumeria? I am working on Minotaurs of Minaea, in these days, and on the ancient history of that land. The Tarystians (of Jennite origin) that I have created for Minaea have a vague background, so I thought of making them a sort of Mesopotamian race...but I haven't done this yet. ===== Iulius Sergius Scaevola Captain of the XXth Cohort Port Lucinius, Thyatis "We poor few forged as brothers in this furnace will emerge as the steel of future generations" -- from "Legionary's Prayers", by Ionaos Nolan ______________________________________________________________________ Per te Blu American Express è gratis! http://it.yahoo.com/mail_it/foot/?http://www.americanexpress.it/land_yahoo ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 26 Nov 2002 11:22:57 +0100 From: =?iso-8859-1?q?la=20Volpe?= Subject: Re: Some general skills from my game > Dwarf Throwing: The ancient and noble art of hurling > dwarves, halflings, > gnomes and other small humanoids. A skill much in > favour amongst the pygmy > mountain giants of Norwold, as a sport and also as a > combat tactic in > adventuring parties with both giants and dwarves. LOL! > allows the use of the defensive > abilities and special column > from the spear description, with the attacking and > ranged possibilities > associated with the spear. Is there a typo or is there something I can't figure out, here? > Right Stuff: The knack of landing on ones feet. A > successful skill check > allows a thrown character (see dwarf throwing, q.v.) > to ignore all damage, > or provides a +4 bonus to any save against falling > or falling damage. I think this is a little exaggerated...I mean, it can help, but if you fall from more than 3 meters of height it begins to be dangerous to fall on one's feet...you would probably break your knees. Consider that when you fall it's generally better to learn how to fall using your side (take a look at the Wrestling guys - I know it's all "fake", but they've got cool numbers, and you can have a picture at stunting skills like falling or facing potential dangerous situations without suffering damage, like falling with your back, falling from some meters of height, etc.) ===== Iulius Sergius Scaevola Captain of the XXth Cohort Port Lucinius, Thyatis "We poor few forged as brothers in this furnace will emerge as the steel of future generations" -- from "Legionary's Prayers", by Ionaos Nolan ______________________________________________________________________ Per te Blu American Express è gratis! http://it.yahoo.com/mail_it/foot/?http://www.americanexpress.it/land_yahoo ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 26 Nov 2002 19:34:57 +0800 From: "Francisco V. Navarro V" Subject: Re: M-Babylon or M-Sumeria? Hail Mystarans! Thank you Andres for that great reply! I share that my interest in ancient Sumerian/Babylonian culture (as least for FRPGs) is influenced by the old Dietes & Demigods book, featuring the Sumerian and Babylonian mythos. So, if I understand correctly, there could have been a bronze age civilization on the Alphatian continent before the Alphatian Landfall. These the M-Summerians/Akkadians/Mesopotamians not only had contact with the ancient Nithians, and they also influenced the present Ylari people, at the least, and were their progenitors, at the most. They may also have had colonies as far east as the Arms of the Immortal, which evolved to the Enduk and Nimmur Empire. But unlike the RW Summerian/Akkadians/Mesopotamians, the culture did not reach the height of the RW Babylonians/Persians, because of the arrival of the Alphatians (which btw is believed to have occurred with the assistance of the Nithians... So could this have been part of some ancient bronze age plot by the Nithians against the M-Summerians?) When the Alphatians arrived on their continent, the common Alphatians eventually mixed with these people, and eventually integrated their culture. Hence, these M-Sumerians were forgotten as a civilization (and also, the ancient Nithians who remembered them, forgot them as well, thanks to the Oblivion spell by the Immortals.), save for a few remnants in Alphatian culture, such as the shedu (not lamassu). But of course, some M-Sumerian/Babylonian cutlure could rise elsewhere... Kit Navarro www.geocities.com/paparazzi_glantri ----- Original Message ----- From: "Andrés Piquer Otero" To: Sent: Tuesday, November 26, 2002 8:54 AM Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] M-Babylon or M-Sumeria? > As per onomastics and general architectural / cultural paraphernalia, the > closest thing to Babylonian / Assyrian in the KW are the scorpion men in the > SC (I know, that country has a name, but I don't have my Mystara library at > hand now! Is it Nimmur????). But Nimmur is SO marginal in the KW, it does > not shine as the big Mesopotamian empire!! > For some reason, also, there has been a trend to connect Alphatian culture > to Babylonian-Sumerian (or general Mesopotamian, it could as well look as > Achemenid Persian), if only for the drawing of a Lamassu in the cover of the > Alphatia booklet of Dawn of the Emperors. IIRC, some names also pointed in > that direction, but the line was soon dropped and Alph. got more "standard > Western World general fantasy" looking. Nevertheless, there are some > interesting paralells which could be exploited: Alphatia is a cultural / > ethnic mixup of Old Alphatian and Cypri (similar to Akkadian-Sumerian mixup > in RW Mesopotamia). The relationship between the copper skinned Cypri and > the Ochaleans is explicit in published products and some spoof / crackpot > history "theories" present Sumerian culture as linked to proto-Historic > China (not serious history, in which Sumerians are a big incognita, but > really cool stuff for FRPG). > More to go, Alphatia is a "cradle of civilization" in the ancient history of > Mystara, along with Nithia, again, quite similar to a Egypt-Mesopotamia > opposition in the RW Bronze Age. > Old Alphatians are Elementalist (Followers of Fire, Followers of Air). As > per some interesting Rabbinic folk tradition, Abraham accused Nimrod, > Babylonian king, of worshipping the elements... More of this, another > Mesopotamian culture, Achemenid Persian (cultural inheritor of Babylon) > worshipped Fire. > Linguistic traits (that's my fave, i'm a linguist after all): the influence > of Alphatia on Ylaruam was big (along with that of Nithia, but much of > Nithia's was lost through the spell of oblivion): we get the Ylari, > centuries later, who are a Semitic culture which speaks a clearly Semitic > language (Ylari, shaped after Arabic, and Nithian-Egyptian is NOT Semitic, > close but not quite so). Given that the Semitic streak is not felt in other > RW ethnic groups connected to the Ylari (Neathar/Oltec mix), we can conclude > that the "semitization" of Ylari groups came through quite extended > colonization by a similar linguistically bent people, that is, Alphatians!!! > That goes quite well with the linguistic information we have on Alphatian: > we know it has two differenced languages (Old Alphatian and Common > Alphatian) and that the Common dialect has quite a few dialects: that's a > close situation to that lived in Mesopotamia: Sumerian was kept (and well > mixed with Old Akkadian) in ritual, religion and solemn monuments, while the > populace progressively spoke simpler and simpler dialects (different > registers of Babylonian, Assyrian, and quite strange Akkadian in the Western > reaches of the empire). So, we could have a mixup of "Sumerian" (old Cypri > remains) and "Old Akkadian" (ancient Alphatian) for Old Alhaptian and some > kind of dialectally fragmented evolved Akkadian ("Assyrian / Babylonian") > for Common Alphatian, maybe simpler than the RW Babylonian and Assyrian > were. It's probable that a complex writing system (similar to cuneiform) had > been kept for O.A., while the common speech would use some kind of alphabet, > especially for practicalities of trade and diplomacy (in a similar way, the > RW Mesopotamia under the Persians, adopted Aramaic as the official and trade > tongue of their growing empire). That simpler common Alphatian would give > birth to the Ylari writing and speech. > As for Nimmur??? Well, I could place an Alphatian colony there, from whence > the scorpion men would assimilate the culture. It's not so hard to reach the > Arm of the Immortals travelling eastwards from the eastern reaches of the > Alphatian Empire!!! > > But well, that's all speculation, it seems that the first line at TSR was > having Alphatia like some kind of Atlantis... > Anyway, > > Alpatiya ila kalim!!!! > > Andrés > > ******************************************************************** > The Other Worlds Homepage: http://www.wizards.com/dnd/OtherWorlds.asp > The Mystara Homepage: http://www.dnd.starflung.com/ > To unsubscribe, send email to LISTSERV@ORACLE.WIZARDS.COM > with UNSUB MYSTARA-L in the body of the message. > ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 26 Nov 2002 14:19:43 +0100 From: =?iso-8859-1?q?la=20Volpe?= Subject: Re: M-Babylon or M-Sumeria? > So, if I understand correctly, there could have been > a bronze age civilization on the Alphatian continent > before the Alphatian Landfall. > These M-Summerians/Akkadians/Mesopotamians not > only had contact with the > ancient Nithians, and they also influenced the > present Ylari people, at the > least, and were their progenitors, at the most. They > may also have had > colonies as far east as the Arms of the Immortal, > which evolved to the Enduk > and Nimmur Empire. I don't know, according to Geoff's material (and from the info I am collecting for the Ethnography project) before the Alphatians there were the ancestors of the Yanifey, result of a Neathar/Lhomarrian mix. However, I believe that we should not forget the presence of non-human races when humans were living their prehistory. They could have effectively have lived on Alphatia and become ancestors of the Enduk civilization...but... ...hmm...I want to think about it, "we can work it out, we can work it out..." > the Alphatians (which btw is believed to have > occurred with the assistance > of the Nithians... Where does this come from? ===== Iulius Sergius Scaevola Captain of the XXth Cohort Port Lucinius, Thyatis "We poor few forged as brothers in this furnace will emerge as the steel of future generations" -- from "Legionary's Prayers", by Ionaos Nolan ______________________________________________________________________ Per te Blu American Express è gratis! http://it.yahoo.com/mail_it/foot/?http://www.americanexpress.it/land_yahoo ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 26 Nov 2002 21:26:54 +0800 From: "Francisco V. Navarro V" Subject: Re: Nithians Inviting Alphatians [was M-Babylon or M-Sumeria?] IIRC, the HW module on Nithia suggested that the ancient Nithians were so powerful in magic that they invited the Alphatians to settle on Mystara. Kit Navarro > > the Alphatians (which btw is believed to have > > occurred with the assistance > > of the Nithians... > > Where does this come from? > > > ===== > Iulius Sergius Scaevola > Captain of the XXth Cohort > Port Lucinius, Thyatis > > "We poor few forged as brothers in this furnace > will emerge as the steel of future generations" > -- from "Legionary's Prayers", by Ionaos Nolan > > ______________________________________________________________________ > Per te Blu American Express è gratis! > http://it.yahoo.com/mail_it/foot/?http://www.americanexpress.it/land_yahoo > > ******************************************************************** > The Other Worlds Homepage: http://www.wizards.com/dnd/OtherWorlds.asp > The Mystara Homepage: http://www.dnd.starflung.com/ > To unsubscribe, send email to LISTSERV@ORACLE.WIZARDS.COM > with UNSUB MYSTARA-L in the body of the message. > ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 26 Nov 2002 08:33:02 -0500 From: Castille Baromon de Preto Subject: Re: Gold (changed title back to gold...) > > From: Darth Darknerd > > Yep. You are correct. Most of my comments were > directed to fringe -noids living on the edge of > established societies. However, the -noids in Broken > Lands, Northern Reaches, and elsewhere are established > societies, and are in a different category altogether. > Humanoids in estblished societies, like Thar and the kobolds in Vestland, are always looking to further their territories and reach. The more area they control in the borderlands, gives them more fear and more likely for civilized lands to pay tribute. Of course if the smaller tribes responsible for border raids get caught, they get wiped out. I also smell a campaign hook here... What if all the gold and magical wealth of King Loark was never found. Are even just a small part of it, the best items from each nation he obliterated in his Great Horde. You would have a treasure trove of items from Traladara, Thyatis, Northern Reaches, Ethengar, Sind, Hule, and the Kingdom of Darokin. Many of these nations were at their peak before they were smashed down into the Mystaran Dark Ages. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 26 Nov 2002 16:04:38 +0100 From: =?iso-8859-1?q?Havard=20Faanes?= Subject: Re: Nithians Inviting Alphatians [was M-Babylon or M-Sumeria?] I've seen this in several places. I think it first appeared in the Dawn of the Emperors Timeline. I always imagined it to be the result of a Nithian SETI-type program. Pyramid-style, obviously... Håvard --- "Francisco V. Navarro V" skrev: > IIRC, the HW module on Nithia suggested that the > ancient Nithians were so > powerful in magic that they invited the Alphatians > to settle on Mystara. > > Kit Navarro > > > > the Alphatians (which btw is believed to have > > > occurred with the assistance > > > of the Nithians... > > > > Where does this come from? > > > > > > ===== > > Iulius Sergius Scaevola > > Captain of the XXth Cohort > > Port Lucinius, Thyatis > > > > "We poor few forged as brothers in this furnace > > will emerge as the steel of future generations" > > -- from "Legionary's Prayers", by Ionaos > Nolan > > > > > ______________________________________________________________________ > > Per te Blu American Express è gratis! > > > http://it.yahoo.com/mail_it/foot/?http://www.americanexpress.it/land_yahoo > > > > > ******************************************************************** > > The Other Worlds Homepage: > http://www.wizards.com/dnd/OtherWorlds.asp > > The Mystara Homepage: > http://www.dnd.starflung.com/ > > To unsubscribe, send email to > LISTSERV@ORACLE.WIZARDS.COM > > with UNSUB MYSTARA-L in the body of the message. > > > > ******************************************************************** > The Other Worlds Homepage: > http://www.wizards.com/dnd/OtherWorlds.asp > The Mystara Homepage: http://www.dnd.starflung.com/ > To unsubscribe, send email to > LISTSERV@ORACLE.WIZARDS.COM > with UNSUB MYSTARA-L in the body of the message. > ______________________________________________________ Få den nye Yahoo! Messenger på http://no.messenger.yahoo.com/ Nye ikoner og bakgrunner, webkamera med superkvalitet og dobbelt så morsom ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 26 Nov 2002 10:29:16 -0800 From: John Calvin Subject: Re: Carnifex (was: A Guide to Human Ethnography) > Were the Carnifex isolated to a single location on the planet, or were > they a > world spanning empire. If so, what does that mean for the human's > pre-history. > How did the Carnifex shape their world, and the fate of the humans? > Were they > responsible for the migratory patterns? Did the humans make war with > them, or > were they slaves? >> I can't remember where or why but I seem to recall that the carnifex are/were restricted by the climates. Being reptilian they tend to only exist in temperate/tropical areas. Because of this they would be restricted to mostly the upper parts of davinia and most likely not have that much interest in most of brun as it is too cold or dry. I remember the Korpu in X1 seemed to spend their time only in the part of the island most suited to their tastes. << Hmmm... This has spawned some interesting ideas. If the Carnifex were restricted by their habitat, then perhaps they would have developed various spells to allow them to venture further. Alter Personal Climate: With this spell the Carnifex could alter the envirenment directly around them (5 feet diameter). This was usually used to increase heat and humidity but other variations could be specified at casting time. This would negate any ill effects on the Carnifex brought on by a mild change of climate. The spell will not protect against harsh changes in climate (for example a creature comfortable in a desert climate could not use it to protect itself from an arctic snowstorm). There could be area effect versions, as well as mass versions. The spell could also be incorporated into magical items (like rings or the carnifex equivilent) in order to provide a constant protection. In this way the carnifex could still explore the rest of their world. Perhaps they couldn't colonize it in force, but they might still be able to exert some kind of influence. >> That said their effect on davinia is a whole other story, and 'old wives tales' of the danger of the southern lands could be a contributing factor to the lack of exploration of davinia by KW nations till about the last hundred years I think. << I like this. -John ===== Rule #85. I will not use any plan in which the final step is horribly complicated, e.g. "Align the 12 Stones of Power on the sacred altar then activate the medallion at the moment of total eclipse." Instead it will be more along the lines of "Push the button." from "A Guide to Becoming an Evil Overlord" by Peter Anspach __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail Plus - Powerful. Affordable. Sign up now. http://mailplus.yahoo.com ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 27 Nov 2002 08:12:30 +0800 From: "Francisco V. Navarro V" Subject: Wanted: Supreme Sky Diety Hail Mystarans! I am looking (again) through my RW mythology books, and I have come up with one peculiar observation about the Mystaran patheons and mythos: there is a sore lack of Immortal Patrons of the Sky, the Weather, the Air, and related spheres of influence. And stranger still, the RW counterparts of these All-Watching-Sky-Father-Supreme-Ruler-of-Heaven-Weilder-of-Lightning-and-Rai n-Controller-of-Weather-and-Storms-Master-of-Clouds-and-Air archetypes tend to be the supreme dieties of their respective pantheons! Note the examples of the Babylonian/Sumerian Anu, Marduk, and Enlil, the Aztec Quetzalcoatl/Ehecatl (god of wind), the Chinese Shang-Ti (heaven), the Greco-Roman pairing of Zeus/Jupiter and Hera/Juno, and the Norse pairing of Odin and Frigga. In Dietes & Demigods, the Ameridian Raven and the Indian Indra are also listed as sky gods. And while other RW pantheons (such as Japanese and Egyptian) have other types of supreme dieties, they do have specific gods who hold dominion over the sky, i.e. the Japanese Susanowo (storm god) and the Egyptian Nut and Shu. In Mystara, I can only recognize three definite sky/air gods in the various pantheons: Odin of the Northmen, Palartarkan of the Alphatians (of Floating Ar fame), and (a bit of a stretch here), Nyx as Nut, the Nithian Patroness of the Night Sky. So why is it that RW sky gods are numerous and even important enough to be supreme dieties, and Mystarans hardly have any at all? I can only propose two explanations (and even I am not thoroughly convinced). #1. The Philosophy of the Spheres of Power. This might be an intrinsic and fundamental idea in the ancient Mystaran belief systems, that there are the 5 Spheres of Matter (Earth), Energy (Fire), Time (Water), Entropy (Death), and Thought (Air), and that the Thought-Air-Sky-Heaven sphere is no less powerful than the others spheres. Of course, it can easily be argued that Mystarans do, in fact, give more importance to other 4 Spheres. We have many pantheons where the Energy Immortals hold the most prominent positions (i.e. Ixion/Tubak/Horon/Solarios/Otzitiotl and Rathanos/Ra). The earth-bound races worship Earth/Matter Immortals, Djaea, Terra, Djaea, Faunus, even Valerias. And the sea-borne races worship the Water/Time Immortals, Protius/Manwara. Which brings us to the Mystaran race most closely related to Elemental Air... #2. The Alphatians. The arrival of the Alphatians may have had a significant influence on why Mystarans do not worship and give importance to Patrons of the Air and Sky. The Mystarans may have come to believe that the sky which brought those powerful and evil Alphatians is not good and not worth worshipping. (But in this case, why are not any of the Entropic Immortals worshipped as sky gods?) This "Alphatians rule the sky." plot may also have been a deliberat act on the Alphatians' part, sending the message that "Fear our power over the air and sky alone. Worship us as your Immortals, or worship no other." (Could the Alphatians have been powerful enough to influence the Immortals not to becomes Patrons of the Sky and Air? But if so, why are they not powerful enough for Palartarkan to be worshipped as universally as Ixion or Thanatos?) Then again, perhaps the reason why the Alphatians chose to settle in Mystara (not just the planet or plane, but the dimension) was because of this sore lack of sky/air dieties, a void them the ambitious Alphatians one day hoped to fill with their own ranks! (But then again, with only Ar becoming Palartarkan, the Alphatians ain't doing a good job at it!) And of course, this still does not answer the question: why are there so few sky/air dieties in Mystara? Kit Navarro Mystaran Mythologist enchanter_from_glantri@yahoo.com ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 27 Nov 2002 00:55:39 +0000 From: adrian mattias Subject: Re: M-Babylon or M-Sumeria? There is actually an M-Babylon/M-Sumer/M-Persia on Mystara. It is called the Yezchamenid Empire and it is located in Western Brun on the upper reaches of the Arm of the Immortals (i.e. North West of Nimmur). It is fan based material having been created by Christian Constantin, but he put a lot of work into detailing the environment and political strucute. There is also plenty of reference to the Yezchamenid Empire in the Zuyevo material. This can all be found at the ever-reliable Vaults of Pandius. He indicated to me at the time we were discussing the development of it, that he was modelling it on a number of different periods of RW history of the Mesopotamian region. Interesting stuff, and well worth a look. Cheers Adrian > From: la Volpe > Reply-To: Mystara RPG Discussion > To: MYSTARA-L@ORACLE.WIZARDS.COM > Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] M-Babylon or M-Sumeria? > Date: Tue, 26 Nov 2002 14:19:43 +0100 > > > So, if I understand correctly, there could have been > > a bronze age civilization on the Alphatian continent > > before the Alphatian Landfall. > > These M-Summerians/Akkadians/Mesopotamians not > > only had contact with the > > ancient Nithians, and they also influenced the > > present Ylari people, at the > > least, and were their progenitors, at the most. They > > may also have had > > colonies as far east as the Arms of the Immortal, > > which evolved to the Enduk > > and Nimmur Empire. > > I don't know, according to Geoff's material (and from > the info I am collecting for the Ethnography project) > before the Alphatians there were the ancestors of > the Yanifey, result of a Neathar/Lhomarrian mix. > However, I believe that we should not forget the > presence of non-human races when humans were living > their prehistory. > > They could have effectively have lived on Alphatia > and become ancestors of the Enduk > civilization...but... > ...hmm...I want to think about it, "we can work it > out, we can work it out..." > > > the Alphatians (which btw is believed to have > > occurred with the assistance > > of the Nithians... > > Where does this come from? > > > ===== > Iulius Sergius Scaevola > Captain of the XXth Cohort > Port Lucinius, Thyatis > > "We poor few forged as brothers in this furnace > will emerge as the steel of future generations" > -- from "Legionary's Prayers", by Ionaos Nolan > > ______________________________________________________________________ > Per te Blu American Express è gratis! > http://it.yahoo.com/mail_it/foot/?http://www.americanexpress.it/land_yahoo > > ******************************************************************** > The Other Worlds Homepage: http://www.wizards.com/dnd/OtherWorlds.asp > The Mystara Homepage: http://www.dnd.starflung.com/ > To unsubscribe, send email to LISTSERV@ORACLE.WIZARDS.COM > with UNSUB MYSTARA-L in the body of the message. _________________________________________________________________ STOP MORE SPAM with the new MSN 8 and get 2 months FREE* http://join.msn.com/?page=features/junkmail ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 27 Nov 2002 00:29:35 -0500 From: David Knott Subject: Possible way to buy "Fantasy Empires" (Mystara based PC game) For those looking for PC game "Fantasye Empires": If someone is still looking for this... not sure what there shipping is... Click here: ULTIMATE FANTASY BUNDLE AD AND D (UNLIMITED ADVENTURES,STRONGHOLD,DUNGEON HACK,FANTASY EMPIRES,DARK SUN SHATTERED ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 26 Nov 2002 23:18:56 -0800 From: John Calvin Subject: More NWN Images - Alfheim and Blackmoor Hi all, For any interested I have posted some more screenshots from my NWN culture pack project. This time I've updated the Alfheim armors, and added a Blackmoor Rising section (with some unique helms). http://www.geocities.com/chimpman.geo/NWN/NWNindex.html As always, comments are welcome. -John ===== Rule #85. I will not use any plan in which the final step is horribly complicated, e.g. "Align the 12 Stones of Power on the sacred altar then activate the medallion at the moment of total eclipse." Instead it will be more along the lines of "Push the button." from "A Guide to Becoming an Evil Overlord" by Peter Anspach __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail Plus - Powerful. Affordable. Sign up now. http://mailplus.yahoo.com ------------------------------ End of MYSTARA-L Digest - 25 Nov 2002 to 26 Nov 2002 (#2002-305) ****************************************************************