Subject: MYSTARA-L Digest - 5 Dec 2002 to 6 Dec 2002 (#2002-315) From: Automatic digest processor Date: 07/12/2002, 19:00 To: Recipients of MYSTARA-L digests Reply-to: Mystara RPG Discussion There are 10 messages totalling 514 lines in this issue. Topics of the day: 1. Marilenev Rebellion (2) 2. Addakia, Alphatia and Yezchamenid 3. [jdaly@friend.ly.net: FW: Rejected posting 4. Addakia, Yezchamenid, and Nithia 5. Addakia and Yezchamenid 6. Bards in Mystara 7. Unsavory Facts About Elves (2) 8. Delayed Posts?! ******************************************************************** The Other Worlds Homepage: http://www.wizards.com/dnd/OtherWorlds.asp The Mystara Homepage: http://www.dnd.starflung.com/ To unsubscribe, send email to LISTSERV@ORACLE.WIZARDS.COM with UNSUB MYSTARA-L in the body of the message. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Fri, 6 Dec 2002 13:44:56 +0100 From: =?iso-8859-1?q?la=20Volpe?= Subject: Re: Marilenev Rebellion > After the actual revolt the cult would switch its > alliance over to Stefan and > claim him to be the true Halav reborn. This seems > like a very plausible > "backstabbing-Thyatian" scheme (no offence to > Captain Scaevola). Offence? It sounds Thyatian indeed. 8-) > >Or, until the PCs defeat Stefan and decide that > >they desire the throne for themselves... > > If they are backstabbing-Thyatians...not that > there's anything wrong with that! Not at all. Cool idea. Let us know how the campaign goes! ===== Iulius Sergius Scaevola Captain of the XXth Cohort Port Lucinius, Thyatis "We poor few forged as brothers in this furnace will emerge as the steel of future generations" -- from "Legionary's Prayers", by Ionaos Nolan ______________________________________________________________________ Per te Blu American Express è gratis! http://it.yahoo.com/mail_it/foot/?http://www.americanexpress.it/land_yahoo ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 6 Dec 2002 13:58:45 +0100 From: =?iso-8859-1?q?la=20Volpe?= Subject: Addakia, Alphatia and Yezchamenid A short resume' of ideas that got to the mailing list: 1) The use of Shedu as the Alphatian symbol may come from contacts with a lost pseudo-mesopotamic culture or with a shedu race or because they simply liked it or because they had that symbol when they lived in the planet Alphatia; 2) There could be, or could have been, in Addakia, a pseudo-mesopotamic culture that could have influenced some of the Yezchamenid Empire's cultures. 3) The Addakian culture had probably contacts with the enduks and manscorpions, that are mesopotamic in culture too. However I was thinking that we could also have a non human culture in Addakia, that could be related to the enduks. Possibly this could be also a very ancient culture. I don't know. I think I'll give a read at the enduks' early history and think about it. ===== Iulius Sergius Scaevola Captain of the XXth Cohort Port Lucinius, Thyatis "We poor few forged as brothers in this furnace will emerge as the steel of future generations" -- from "Legionary's Prayers", by Ionaos Nolan ______________________________________________________________________ Per te Blu American Express è gratis! http://it.yahoo.com/mail_it/foot/?http://www.americanexpress.it/land_yahoo ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 6 Dec 2002 10:09:03 -0500 From: Geoff Gander Subject: Re: [jdaly@friend.ly.net: FW: Rejected posting Morphail wrote: > I hope mister Daly who has contributed much to the list would concider trying to reconsider, unless he had other reasons for leaving it. In fact, I contacted Jeff privately, and expressed my hope that he would return. He did, as it turned out, have other reasons for leaving (RL). Geoff -- Geoff Gander, BA 97, MPA 02 Carnifex Loremaster/Mad Roleplayer Master of the Elemental Plane of Bureaucracy au998@freenet.carleton.ca : www.geocities.com/TimesSquare/Realm/2091 ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 6 Dec 2002 10:17:42 -0500 From: Geoff Gander Subject: Re: Addakia, Yezchamenid, and Nithia Agathokles wrote: > The extent of the Nithian Empire in not much known. They certainly arrived to the Savage Baronies, and perhaps even to the Nearhuman Kingdoms area to the west, and to Thotia to the East. > To the south, they probably did not colonize Davania--though they might have had contacts with the Milenians right before the destruction of Nithia, and to the north they colonized the Northern Reaches. According to the HW boxed set, Nithia did, in fact, try to colonise northern Davania. They enslaved Antalian tribes (ancestors of the Thyatian peoples), and brought them south to build a colony for them. The Thyatians, Kerendans, and Hattians revolted, and moved north in BC 600 to mainland Thyatis, but not before destroying the nascent colony. Presumably, there are Nithian ruins in the Hinterlands today, most likely along the River Torion (where Raven Scarp sits) - perhaps that lake further upstream has a ruined Nithian port and temple complex somewhere along its shores...? Geoff -- Geoff Gander, BA 97, MPA 02 Carnifex Loremaster/Mad Roleplayer Master of the Elemental Plane of Bureaucracy au998@freenet.carleton.ca : www.geocities.com/TimesSquare/Realm/2091 ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 6 Dec 2002 08:08:31 -0800 From: John Calvin Subject: Re: Marilenev Rebellion > (I > don't have the Karameikan Gazetteer at hand now, so I don't remember what > it says about Sergeyev and the birht of the cult.) Well, I checked this out last night and it basically says that Sergeyev is a lunatic, and he founded the cult in the throws of madness. This would make the cult a very young one with a very small following. I like my idea better. To reconcile the two IMC I'm going to say that the cult has been around for at least 200 years (since the Thyatians first came), and is now currently split into two (or perhaps more) factions - the Marilenev faction and the Karameikos faction. Sergeyev merely took control of the Karameikos faction (he did not found the cult). > I suppose that somehow we could use this idea also > in connection to the alternate view on Stefan > Karameikos that I wrote some time ago. > The link to my old article is: > http://dnd.starflung.com/dkstefan.html I came up with another idea that might fit this well. Assuming that Stefan is not as nice as he appears to be, then consider this turn of events. 1) Lord Marilenev revolts. 2) Stefan uses military power to put down the rebellion. Stefan is victorious, and as a conqueror he -claims his rights- regarding the Lady Magda. 3) The child that the Lady Magda bears shortly thereafter is in fact the bastard of Karameikos. To conceal her pregnancy, Magda wears long black robes of mourning and locks herself up in her estate. None see her except for a few hand-picked servants and very close friends (perhaps Christoph Torenescu). 4) Lady Magda has torn emotions about the child after it is borne. On one hand she knows it is the only Marilenev heir left, and on the other she despises it for being a Karameikos. Christoph Torenescu convinces her to give him the child, and he will hide it from Stefan and keep it safe. 5) Christoph enlists members of the shattered Cult of Halav who refused to see that Stefan Karameikos is Halav reborn. He tells them about Magda's child and enlists them to help protect it. This breathes new life into the Marilenev faction of the Cult. This throws a few more twists into the plot. When Halav reborn returns to free his people he will do so as both a Marilenev and a Karameikos. He will be a true "half-breed" Karameikan, and instead of throwing out the Thyatian invaders (as his Traladaran followers may want), he may welcome them as brothers. -John ===== Rule #85. I will not use any plan in which the final step is horribly complicated, e.g. "Align the 12 Stones of Power on the sacred altar then activate the medallion at the moment of total eclipse." Instead it will be more along the lines of "Push the button." from "A Guide to Becoming an Evil Overlord" by Peter Anspach __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail Plus - Powerful. Affordable. Sign up now. http://mailplus.yahoo.com ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 6 Dec 2002 11:59:35 -0800 From: John Calvin Subject: Re: Addakia and Yezchamenid > Alternately, the Tower of M-Babel itself could have been a powerful > "transport chamber". Climbing it, one could see the entire world, and from > it, the Adakkian magic-users/priests transported their people. Oh, I really like this idea. This kind of creates an "end of the world" scenario, where the Addakians had some forsight into what was coming. Somehow they would have managed to get enough of their people far enough away that they would be spared from whatever catastrophe was to follow. So the question then becomes, what was the catastrophe that destroyed this ancient and powerful empire? And how did the Addakians learn of their fate before it was too late? -John ===== Rule #85. I will not use any plan in which the final step is horribly complicated, e.g. "Align the 12 Stones of Power on the sacred altar then activate the medallion at the moment of total eclipse." Instead it will be more along the lines of "Push the button." from "A Guide to Becoming an Evil Overlord" by Peter Anspach __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail Plus - Powerful. Affordable. Sign up now. http://mailplus.yahoo.com ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 30 Nov 2002 01:50:04 +0800 From: "Francisco V. Navarro V" Subject: Re: Bards in Mystara Hail Mystarans! Joshuan's Almanac lists Empress Lucianna Torion of Thyatis as a 5th-level bard. She is described as a jack-of-all-trades, skilled with etiquette, modern and ancient languages, diplomacy, singing, playing the lyre, cantrips for entertainment, some illusion spells, astrology. And she also goes out in diguise as a common bard and entertainer. Kit Navarro > Federico Kaftal wrote: > > > Dunno if this topic was already discussed before: > > are there official Bards in Mystaran Canon? > > > > I remember: > > - Robrenn Rakes (really Bards, AFAIK, but not defined Bards officially) > > - Ozata the Bard, from (AD&D) "Hail the Heroes" adventure module, based in > > Karameikos > > > > Do you remember other sources? ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 30 Nov 2002 01:43:22 +0800 From: "Francisco V. Navarro V" Subject: Re: Unsavory Facts About Elves Hail Mystarans of various races and methods of elimination! I must say I am pleased (and honestly, not entirely surprised) at the various viewpoints presented about elven elimination process. I admit that I started this inquiry about elven excretory systems out of frivolous curiosity more than anything. (Well, I must also admit that I *knew* asking this question out loud in the MML will generate a lot of... how shall we put this?... "talk," but hey, that's the intrigue-loving Glantrian in me! Sue me! Feeblemind me! Imprison me in the Tower of Sighs!) Anyway, I am pleased to see that this bit of capriciousness has actually elevated into a decent discussion--or *indecent* for those of more sensitive sensibilities. Here is my summary of the viewpoints, and some of my own: A creature that does not eliminate waste probably does not produce any waste, implying a 100% efficient metabolic system. In the natural world, this is scientifically impossible--or at least highly improbable. And in a FRPG world, this would imply magic at work (i.e. the old "We're so magical that we're pure!" argument). Ohad pointed out that elves are less magical than dragons, and I think everyone is of the impression that dragons do excrete waste products (unless of course this is what fuels their dragon breath--but then again, that's another argument!) Such zero-waste creatures would indeed have to be more magical than dragons. Ohad mentioned three examples (dryads, faeries and elementals) and it is quite imaginable that none of these excrete waste, at least the way more mundane mortal creatures do. I imagine that dryads are more like trees and plants, and probably eliminate their waste products similarly (through their skin and breath), which to other living beings (animals) may not be waste products at all (mostly oxygen and water)! Elementals probably produce waste that are also elemental in nature (such as smoke, ash, soot, dust, sand, salt, brine), and cannot be compared with the organic waste of living creatures. And what about the anatomical parts of these creatures, particularly the humanoid ones? Evolution shows us that disuse of an organ or body part will lead to atrophy or non-development (like the angels in "Dogma" mentioned by Thibault), or will allow for use for other functions (in this case probably, sexual). Hence, elementals, no matter how humanoid in shape, will probably be only as anatomically correct as Ken and Barbie dolls. And faeries and dryads will probably have appendages and orifices intact for purely sexual purposes. (Let's not go into the exact details, and just let everyone figure them out or fantasize about them, shall we?) Of course, the elf-hater Jason Murphy does present an interesting (and wickedly funny point of view), that the magical, long-lived elves might actually need to produce more waste, or maybe more potent waste products. I have a counter-arguement to that (not that I am siding with the elves, mind you). Instead of the arguement that magic is the reason why elven physiognomy is so efficient and produces little waste, perhaps it's the other way around: Elven physiognomy is so naturally efficient that all that, not only does it waste so little, but all that matter and energy can be tapped to generate strong magical energy. (This coincides with Chinese medical theory that with an efficient digestive system, so can generate more Qi or energy.) This is the same proposal above about dragons. Of course, this "unwasted energy = magic" idea would lead to more implications: that wizards, magic-users, and the entire Alphatian race, have better digestive/excretory/metabolic systems than most mortal creatures from Mystara. (At least, in the case of wizards having a healthier physiognomy, this is probably not true.) In any case, one thing I don't like is to let science get in the way of fantasy, role-playing, and magic! So let the humans speculate what the elves have underneath their trousers! Let the humans wonder what the elves do in the woods! As for me, I will include in my campaign some orc wokani or shaman, who is will be looking for elf droppings as an ingredient in some sick and strange humanoid ritual! Kit Navarro Glantrian Speculator and Rumormonger ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 7 Dec 2002 00:04:55 +0100 From: Thibault Sarlat Subject: Re: Unsavory Facts About Elves thank you for the smart (and fun replies) I really needed that now. I like the theories. Thibault Sarlat. ICQ 16622177. homepage http://www.mystara.fr.st Join me at:thibault.sarlat@wanadoo.fr;clenarius@hotmail.com ----- Original Message ----- From: "Francisco V. Navarro V" To: Sent: Friday, November 29, 2002 6:43 PM Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] Unsavory Facts About Elves > Hail Mystarans of various races and methods of elimination! > > I must say I am pleased (and honestly, not entirely surprised) at the > various viewpoints presented about elven elimination process. I admit that I > started this inquiry about elven excretory systems out of frivolous > curiosity more than anything. (Well, I must also admit that I *knew* asking > this question out loud in the MML will generate a lot of... how shall we put > this?... "talk," but hey, that's the intrigue-loving Glantrian in me! Sue > me! Feeblemind me! Imprison me in the Tower of Sighs!) Anyway, I am pleased > to see that this bit of capriciousness has actually elevated into a decent > discussion--or *indecent* for those of more sensitive sensibilities. > > Here is my summary of the viewpoints, and some of my own: > > A creature that does not eliminate waste probably does not produce any > waste, implying a 100% efficient metabolic system. In the natural world, > this is scientifically impossible--or at least highly improbable. And in a > FRPG world, this would imply magic at work (i.e. the old "We're so magical > that we're pure!" argument). Ohad pointed out that elves are less magical > than dragons, and I think everyone is of the impression that dragons do > excrete waste products (unless of course this is what fuels their dragon > breath--but then again, that's another argument!) Such zero-waste creatures > would indeed have to be more magical than dragons. > > Ohad mentioned three examples (dryads, faeries and elementals) and it is > quite imaginable that none of these excrete waste, at least the way more > mundane mortal creatures do. I imagine that dryads are more like trees and > plants, and probably eliminate their waste products similarly (through their > skin and breath), which to other living beings (animals) may not be waste > products at all (mostly oxygen and water)! Elementals probably produce waste > that are also elemental in nature (such as smoke, ash, soot, dust, sand, > salt, brine), and cannot be compared with the organic waste of living > creatures. > > And what about the anatomical parts of these creatures, particularly the > humanoid ones? Evolution shows us that disuse of an organ or body part will > lead to atrophy or non-development (like the angels in "Dogma" mentioned by > Thibault), or will allow for use for other functions (in this case probably, > sexual). Hence, elementals, no matter how humanoid in shape, will probably > be only as anatomically correct as Ken and Barbie dolls. And faeries and > dryads will probably have appendages and orifices intact for purely sexual > purposes. (Let's not go into the exact details, and just let everyone figure > them out or fantasize about them, shall we?) > > Of course, the elf-hater Jason Murphy does present an interesting (and > wickedly funny point of view), that the magical, long-lived elves might > actually need to produce more waste, or maybe more potent waste products. I > have a counter-arguement to that (not that I am siding with the elves, mind > you). Instead of the arguement that magic is the reason why elven > physiognomy is so efficient and produces little waste, perhaps it's the > other way around: Elven physiognomy is so naturally efficient that all that, > not only does it waste so little, but all that matter and energy can be > tapped to generate strong magical energy. (This coincides with Chinese > medical theory that with an efficient digestive system, so can generate more > Qi or energy.) This is the same proposal above about dragons. > > Of course, this "unwasted energy = magic" idea would lead to more > implications: that wizards, magic-users, and the entire Alphatian race, have > better digestive/excretory/metabolic systems than most mortal creatures from > Mystara. (At least, in the case of wizards having a healthier physiognomy, > this is probably not true.) > > In any case, one thing I don't like is to let science get in the way of > fantasy, role-playing, and magic! > > So let the humans speculate what the elves have underneath their trousers! > Let the humans wonder what the elves do in the woods! As for me, I will > include in my campaign some orc wokani or shaman, who is will be looking for > elf droppings as an ingredient in some sick and strange humanoid ritual! > > Kit Navarro > Glantrian Speculator and Rumormonger > > ******************************************************************** > The Other Worlds Homepage: http://www.wizards.com/dnd/OtherWorlds.asp > The Mystara Homepage: http://www.dnd.starflung.com/ > To unsubscribe, send email to LISTSERV@ORACLE.WIZARDS.COM > with UNSUB MYSTARA-L in the body of the message. > ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 7 Dec 2002 07:45:02 +0800 From: "Francisco V. Navarro V" Subject: Delayed Posts?! Hail Mystarans! Something must be wrong with the MML server. I sent a couple of posts on Nov. 30 and it only came out today, December 7. The peculiar thing is, other messages posted later than Nov. 30 (such as those along about the Adakkian, Yezchamenid, Nithia topic) have already come out. The ironic thing is one of the posts in questions is an organized (if not entirely sober) summary on elven digestive and sexual biology (aka the Topic-thad-must-not-be-named.). Not that if this post would have saved the membership of Jeff Daly (He did have other reasons of leaving.), but methinks some trickster Immortal may be playing games with the MML. Or it may simply be some chaotic chronomancer, casting time delays on the message postings!1 Let us summon some priest of Tarastia or Djaea or Tubak the Lawgiver or Khoronus to exorcise the list! Kit Navarro ------------------------------ End of MYSTARA-L Digest - 5 Dec 2002 to 6 Dec 2002 (#2002-315) **************************************************************