Subject: MYSTARA-L Digest - 14 May 2003 to 15 May 2003 (#2003-128) From: Automatic digest processor Date: 16/05/2003, 17:00 To: Recipients of MYSTARA-L digests Reply-to: Mystara RPG Discussion There are 8 messages totalling 364 lines in this issue. Topics of the day: 1. Mercs (6) 2. [MYSTARA] Questions, Porto Maldiçao and Porto Escorpiao 3. Blackmoor Preview ******************************************************************** The Other Worlds Homepage: http://www.wizards.com/dnd/OtherWorlds.asp The Mystara Homepage: http://www.dnd.starflung.com/ To unsubscribe, send email to LISTSERV@ORACLE.WIZARDS.COM with UNSUB MYSTARA-L in the body of the message. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Thu, 15 May 2003 01:31:12 -0600 From: John Hare Subject: Re: Mercs Nature's Revenge This mercenary group is made up of druids, rangers and animals. Including many awakened animals. They prefer to attack in wooded areas whenever possible. Their leader is a lvl 12 elven druid from Alfheim, and their goal is to protect nature and the environment. The normally use their gold to buy land, upon which they prevent hunting. When they do go to war in a straight up fight their units of armored bears are used as shock troops, wolves are used as flankers and harras horse troops, and hawks and eagles are used as scouts. They do have difficulty when faced with missile troops, thus magically summoned creatures are sent in first to cover the main attack. With the number of druids the have, they can almost always retreat in good order with well placed spike stones, wall of thorns or similar spells. They originally held land inside Alfheim itself, but were driven out when the Shadow Elves took over. Now they are based out of Darokin, but have not decided to settle there, as most of the animals find it too civilized for their tastes. They are negotiating with Karameikos and The Five Shires to establish a stronghold/nature preserve, whether they manage to do that depends on how much coin they can bring to the table. Due to the make up of this mercenary company, they very rarely take any job which would require them to be stationed inside a town, but will take almost any job which deals with raids or other quick strikes. They are also good at infiltration, especially with druids using Wild Shape to appear as horses, ponies or other draft creatures. John Hare "My good fortune is your good fortune." - Q ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 15 May 2003 08:32:42 -0700 From: Joe Kelly Subject: Re: Mercs Well on that footnote, there is the mercenary companies mentioned in = Secret Societies from White Wolf's Sword and Sorcery Series. They are: The Black Dragoons The Grey Legion=20 The Iron Legion=20 and a couple of others In my campaign in Freeport, I also have The Wolf's Dragoon's and a whole = bunch of others, visiting the port city.=20 JK Wolf >>> au998@FREENET.CARLETON.CA 05/14/03 07:38PM >>> Chris wrote: > You just reminded me of something. IIRC historical mercenary armies were > dangerous to have around. On several occations when they were no longer = needed > in the employ of a nation they banded togeather and continued marudeing = the > countryside to support and continue their lifestyle. If you look in the Vaults, you'll find writeups of various merc companies a bunch of us did a few years ago. It might be worthwhile for someone to look at them again, perhaps to see whether any of them might easily be incorporated into any of the scenarios we've been discussing lately. All this talk of mercs jogged my mind. Of course, if anyone has further ideas about other merc companies that might be operating in the Known World (or beyond it), your ideas would always be most welcome! :-) Geoff -- Geoff Gander, BA 97, MPA 02 Carnifex Loremaster/Mad Roleplayer Master of the Elemental Plane of Bureaucracy au998@freenet.carleton.ca : www.geocities.com/TimesSquare/Realm/2091=20 ******************************************************************** The Other Worlds Homepage: http://www.wizards.com/dnd/OtherWorlds.asp=20 The Mystara Homepage: http://www.dnd.starflung.com/=20 To unsubscribe, send email to LISTSERV@ORACLE.WIZARDS.COM=20 with UNSUB MYSTARA-L in the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 15 May 2003 13:45:42 -0400 From: Mike Donnelly Jr Subject: Re: Mercs Joe Kelly wrote: > In my campaign in Freeport, I also have The Wolf's Dragoon's and a whole bunch of others, visiting the port city. > You wouldn't happen to be a BattleTech player too? Mike ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 15 May 2003 11:49:18 -0700 From: Joe Kelly Subject: Re: Mercs No, I just liked the Character development and Squad Nick names out of = Wolf's Dragoons, so I used them as Mercenary Units. The Mercs in Freeport = are gathering to retake Arkdelphia. I plan on doing a day by day account = of the battle in My Freeport Lookout. JK Wolf >>> hersh67@BELLATLANTIC.NET 05/15/03 10:45AM >>> Joe Kelly wrote: > In my campaign in Freeport, I also have The Wolf's Dragoon's and a whole = bunch of others, visiting the port city. > You wouldn't happen to be a BattleTech player too? Mike ******************************************************************** The Other Worlds Homepage: http://www.wizards.com/dnd/OtherWorlds.asp=20 The Mystara Homepage: http://www.dnd.starflung.com/=20 To unsubscribe, send email to LISTSERV@ORACLE.WIZARDS.COM=20 with UNSUB MYSTARA-L in the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 16 May 2003 02:37:43 +0000 From: adrian mattias Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] Questions, Porto Maldiçao and Porto Escorpiao Some very interesting thoughts. I think you may well be right about a number of those things! > From: Asgor Ironfist > Reply-To: Mystara RPG Discussion > To: MYSTARA-L@ORACLE.WIZARDS.COM > Subject: [MYSTARA] Re: [MYSTARA] Questions, Porto Maldiçao and > Porto Escorpiao > Date: Wed, 14 May 2003 10:58:50 -0300 > > Hi > Yes, you're right, both Zuyevo and LB Trade Company would be involved in > this battle. I didn't included Zuyevo because this nation don't have an > shared border with Baronato de Portos (Porto Maldição and Porto Escorpião) > and don't have an powerful fleet. So, Zuyevo would need renardian ships to > move it's troops across the bay (to protect Preuve and to try to attack > Portos). So, even Zuyevo being an very powerful nation, it's help on this > battle would mean little in the end. Well, i think. > And i included LB Trade Company as an neutral force in this war because it > dislikes both sides, Zuyevo/Renardy (that conquered Richland) and > Texeira/Vilaverde (LB TC surely don't like to share it's profit with the > verdan baronies), and it would rather let both sides destroy eath other > than > envonve itself on this war. At leats, that's what i think. > But indeed the LB TC would start another war, agains Vilaverde or Texeiras > after the conflit at the Yalu Bay, trying to weak it's trade rivals. But LB > TC (and Cimarron) knows that it's fleet is still smaller and less powerful > than the verdan fleet, so it might seek aliances with Torreón (that wants > to > conquer the Red Lands, Texeiras and, why not, Vilaverde) and the > City-States > Hojah and Zvornik (and some Slagich mercenaries too =). But Slagovich > probably would try to not be involved in this battle, i think). Texeiras > and > Vilaverde might would try to find some allies too, like Slagovich (that > probably would refuse to be involved, or send just secret help to the > verdans, to weak Hojah and Zvornik) and Narvaez (that probably would accept > to join the war and try to expand the influence of the Church of Narvaez). > Wow, an large-sacle war! This would lead to interesting events on the near > (and far) future, like Vilaverde taking the control of some os the naval > City-States trade routes, eventually reaching Sind, attacking Jahore and > then come back to Vilaverde with a lot of spices and other things to sell > (based on the RW Vasco da Gama's journey to India in 1498); an sucessory > war > at Vilaverde, with the new barão of Portos against one of his brothers > (something like Don Pedro I of Brazil and his brother [Miguel I, i think]); > and, pehaps, the unification of the City-States, with the help of an high > level kerendan revolucionary adventure (based on RW Giuseppe Garibaldi), > who > might try to help some verdan colonies to become indepedent. > Ok, it was a little too far, hehehehe > Well, that's another reason that i didn't included the LB Trade Company in > that battle, because it's hard to fit it in that war without the war became > an large-scale one ^^'' > Bye > > _________________________________________________________________ > MSN Messenger: converse com os seus amigos online. > http://messenger.msn.com.br > > ******************************************************************** > The Other Worlds Homepage: http://www.wizards.com/dnd/OtherWorlds.asp > The Mystara Homepage: http://www.dnd.starflung.com/ > To unsubscribe, send email to LISTSERV@ORACLE.WIZARDS.COM > with UNSUB MYSTARA-L in the body of the message. > _________________________________________________________________ ninemsn Extra Storage is now available. Get five times more storage - 10MB in your Hotmail account. Go to http://join.msn.com/?page=dept/home&pgmarket=en-au ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 16 May 2003 02:49:08 +0000 From: adrian mattias Subject: Re: Mercs > From: Chris Furneaux >> You just reminded me of something. IIRC historical mercenary armies were > dangerous to have around. On several occations when they were no longer > needed > in the employ of a nation they banded togeather and continued marudeing the > countryside to support and continue their lifestyle. Absolutely. Though mercenary companies did have significant value it is effectively like outsourcing your defence spending. Anyone who has had any experience with outsourcing IT requirements will probably have a fairly good idea of what happens - first price starts off low, and then when they are firmly entrenched the prices of their services rises and rises and then the managers realise how much easier it would have been to have the whole thing in-house. THe best ever exposition of the mercenaries vs local troops argument is the subject of Macchiavelli's book (I forget the name of it now). For those who don't know the book, Macchiavelli was a political adviser in 14th Century (?) Italy - which was at the time divided amongst numerous feuding city states. OTOH I don't recall his full conclusions, but I think the general gist was that if you employ mercenaries you are stupid. Of course, the one great advantage of having them, is that you need not incur any defence expenditure until such time as you actually have to fight somebody. That leaves more money for important things like wine etc ... > Found it I think: > ----------------- > Hawkwood, John > 1320?-1394?, English Soldier of Fortune > The second son of a tanner in Essex, Sir John Hawkwood became the most > famous > mercenary captain of his day. His military career began in France in the > Hundred Years' War, but it was in Italy that he made his reputation. > Hawkwood > fought at the head of numerous mercenary companies ("free companies"), > serving > such masters as Milan, the Pope, and Florence. Using military tactics > developed > by the English in the Hundred Years' War (lance, longbow, infantry), > Hawkwood > gained impressive military victories (Castagnaro, 1389); > > between wars, he led companies on raids, extorting large sums of money from > communities. (!!!see!!!) > > His enduring fame rests as much on his military success as on his > reputation as > the one honest, reliable soldier among a treacherous lot—a reputation > gained by > his refusal to accept a Florentine bribe while employed by rival Pisa. > Indeed, > when Hawkwood died, the Florentines granted him burial in the cathedral, an > honor denied their greatest poet, Dante Alighieri, a generation earlier. > ------------------ > > It's easy then to understand why someone would be uncomfortable with large > numbers of foreigners within their walls. > > Chris. > > ******************************************************************** > The Other Worlds Homepage: http://www.wizards.com/dnd/OtherWorlds.asp > The Mystara Homepage: http://www.dnd.starflung.com/ > To unsubscribe, send email to LISTSERV@ORACLE.WIZARDS.COM > with UNSUB MYSTARA-L in the body of the message. > _________________________________________________________________ ninemsn Extra Storage is now available. Get larger attachments - send/receive up to 2MB attachments (up to 100 percent more per e-mail). Go to http://join.msn.com/?page=dept/home&pgmarket=en-au ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 15 May 2003 22:59:58 -0400 From: Dustin Clingman Subject: Blackmoor Preview Some of you guys might have seen this if you are on the Blackmoor d20 list. I wanted to show you guys some of the interior art we are using in the book. The artists featured in this page are Allan Allegado and John Hood. Both of them are very talented. Check it out! http://www.zeitgeistgames.com/sneakPreview.html I look forward to your comments. Dustin -- Dustin Clingman Zeitgeist Games, Inc. www.zeitgeistgames.com ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 16 May 2003 00:24:56 -0600 From: John Hare Subject: Re: Mercs The book is The Prince. And the conclusion is that you can not trust mercenaries, because one they work for coin so who ever pays them the most gains their loyalty. Plus they will never fight when the odds are truly against them. When ever possible money should be invested in training and arming local troops, because they fight not for coin, but for loyalty, which means they will keep fighting with mercenaries might have surrendered. Additionally local troops are unlikely to plunder the countryside, because that is where their homes are. Mercenaries should only be used as a short term solution, preferably to train up your local forces. John Hare > THe best ever exposition of the mercenaries vs local troops argument is the > subject of Macchiavelli's book (I forget the name of it now). For those who > don't know the book, Macchiavelli was a political adviser in 14th Century > (?) Italy - which was at the time divided amongst numerous feuding city > states. OTOH I don't recall his full conclusions, but I think the general > gist was that if you employ mercenaries you are stupid. "My good fortune is your good fortune." - Q ------------------------------ End of MYSTARA-L Digest - 14 May 2003 to 15 May 2003 (#2003-128) ****************************************************************