Subject: MYSTARA-L Digest - 9 Mar 2003 to 10 Mar 2003 (#2003-70) From: Automatic digest processor Date: 11/03/2003, 19:00 To: Recipients of MYSTARA-L digests Reply-to: Mystara RPG Discussion There are 8 messages totalling 769 lines in this issue. Topics of the day: 1. Viper/Tiger Clan Temple Map 2. Global Interaction (2) 3. Need help to find article 4. Some Romanian Names 5. Byzantium Names Mega-List 6. Betrayal of Innocence: Adv for PCs that kill everything on site 7. Holier than Thou (Adv for Karameikos) ******************************************************************** The Other Worlds Homepage: http://www.wizards.com/dnd/OtherWorlds.asp The Mystara Homepage: http://www.dnd.starflung.com/ To unsubscribe, send email to LISTSERV@ORACLE.WIZARDS.COM with UNSUB MYSTARA-L in the body of the message. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Sun, 9 Mar 2003 23:57:58 -0800 From: Joaquin Menchaca Subject: Viper/Tiger Clan Temple Map http://www.wizards.com/dnd/images/mapofweek/templesurroundings_72dpi.jpg __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Tax Center - forms, calculators, tips, more http://taxes.yahoo.com/ ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 10 Mar 2003 03:25:44 -0800 From: Andrew Theisen Subject: Re: Global Interaction DM wrote: I'm basically asking these questions because they've always been there lingering in my mind ever since I had a full view of the Mystaran geopolitics. Such a big and powerful (or portrayed such) empire cannot lie there for CENTURIES without doing ANYTHING, content with its status quo, if it can gain more. It's called imperialism, and normally a nation labeled "empire of" should be following this philosophy. ;) RW China did this very thing for centuries. There was a period of time in the middle ages (can't remember my dates exactly now, though I did some research on it almost a year or so ago- I want to say around 1400-1600 or thereabouts? I'll have to check my notes) when the ruling class of China effectively cut off all exploration of the outside world (the last great explorer was a famous eunuch) and kept from expanding beyond its mainland holdings. During this time, of course, European explorers set out from the continent and discovered most of the rest of the world, leading to an age of exploration and expansionism that left China behind. Had the explorations of the outside world not stopped, who knows but that the Chinese Empire might not have expanded and imposed its culture on much more of the world than it did. To extrapolate, then, I can certainly see something similar happening with Alphatia. Even if not explaining it away by some means like this, though, the sheer economic and logistic improbability of imperialistic expansion of the scale you are suggesting is enough to keep Alphatia from actually going through with it, I should think. The more they send their military out into the world, the more they will have to draw support and taxes from their subjects, and the fewer resources they would have in place locally to fend off the civil unrest that arises as a result. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 10 Mar 2003 09:39:35 -0800 From: Joaquin Menchaca Subject: Re: Need help to find article > From: Jacob Skytte > Subject: Re: Need help to find article > > Joaquin Menchaca wrote: > > > > Hi, > > > > I wrote this adventure idea that I cannot find in > the > > vaults. I was wondering if perhaps if someone > might > > know where it is. > > Try running a search at the MML archives > http://oracle.wizards.com/archives/mystara-l.html > > You know better than me what search criteria to use. > > Jacob Skytte > scythe@wanadoo.dk > Jacob, Thanks!!! I found the article when I went under the macnerd@realmspace.com address. Yeah!!! Thanks. I hope to develop this into a free online Mystara adventure. Now, I am converting some classics, which is getting me a lot of experience with D&D3e. :-) __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! News - Today's headlines http://news.yahoo.com ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 10 Mar 2003 09:48:31 -0800 From: Joaquin Menchaca Subject: Some Romanian Names Hi. As I was web searching insteading of focusing on these modules conversions, I came across a web site with some contemporary Romanian names. I copied them down and I thought I would pass them along in case someone wants some Traladaran names (explanations of names in Romanian): PRENUME FEMININE Alma (l.lat.) = Cea care alapteaza. Ana (l.ebr. Anna) = Cea din gratia Domnului. Augusta = Forma feminina a prenumelui latin Augustus ( Distinsul). Cecilia (l.lat. Caecilie; caecus = orb) = Cea fara vedere. Camelia (l.lat. Camilla, camillus = sarbatoresc-festiv) = Cea festiva. Carmen (l.span. Carmen) = Calugarita de pe Muntele Carmel ( Haifa - Israel). Claudia = Forma feminina a prenumelui latin Claudius ( Schiopul). Cristina (l.gr. si l.lat.) = Crestina. Delia (l.gr.) = Cea de pe insula Delos-Grecia. Ecaterina (l.gr. Aikatherina) = Curata. Elisabeta (l.ebr.) = Cea ce-l cinsteste pe Jahwe. Elvira (l.span.) = Cea mareata sau Cea care pastreaza (?). Eufrosina (l.gr. Euphrosyne) = Cea senina. Felicia = forma feminina a prenumelui latin masculin Felix ( Norocosul). Gabriela = corespondent al prenumelui masculin Gabriel ( Dumnezeu e puterea mea). Georgina = forma feminina a prenumelui grec Georgios (Taranul ). Graziela (l.lat. Gratia) = Cea gratioasa. Elena-Ileana (l.gr. Helena) = Cea luminata de soare (?). Hortenzia = Gradinareasa (lat. Hortensia; hortus = gradina). Irina (l.gr. Irene) = Pasnica. Marcela (l.lat. Marcella) = Fiica zeului Mars. Margareta (l.iraniana) = Perla. Maria (l.ebr. Mirjam) = Indaratnica sau Mahnita (?). Mariana = Prenume compus din Maria si Ana. Mariela (l.ital. Mariella) = Diminutiv de la Maria. Monica = Cea care admonesteaza (Provenienta nesigura). Nadia = Derivatie de la prenumele slav Nadejda (Speranta). Natalia (l.lat.) = Cea nascuta de Craciun. Olivia (l.lat. Olivia) = Fiica maslinului. Reghina (l.lat. Regina) = Cea ce domneste. Rodica = De la prenumele englez Roda ? (Rhode = Trandafir). Sabina (l.lat.) = Descendenta din neamul Sabinilor. Sidonia (l.lat.) = Cea din orasul Sidon (azi: Saida in Liban). Susana (l.ebr.) = Crin. Victoria (l.lat.) = Invingatoarea. Viorica-Letitia (l.lat. Violetta) = Viorea. Zina = Prescurtarea prenumelui german Gesina-Josina. Zoe (l.gr. Zoi) = Cea vitala. PRENUME MASCULINE Adrian (l.lat. Hadrian) = Locuitor al arhaicului port Adria. Alexandru (l.gr.) = Aparatorul/Protectorul Barbatilor. Andrei (l.gr. Andreas) = Barbatul. Anton = Probabil de la cuvantul latin Antius (Avangardistul). Atanasie (l.gr. Athanasius) = Nemuritorul. Aurel = de la prenumele latin Aurelius (Aureus = Auritul). Constantin (l.lat.) = Neclintitul. Dan = Prescurtarea prenumelui ebraic Daniel (Judecatorul meu e Jahwe). Dumitru (l.gr. Demetrius) = Fiul zeitei Demeter. Dionisie (l.gr. Dionysius) = Fiul zeului Dionysos. Dorin (prenume de origina greaca) = apartenenta la grupul etnic al Dorilor. Emil (l.lat. Aemilius) (Aemulus = Zelosul). Eugen (l.gr.) = Cuvant greu traductibil (Domnia-Sa Domnul ?). Florin (l.lat. Florian) (Florere = A inflori) = Infloritorul. Gabriel (l.ebr. Gowriel) = Dumnezeu e puterea mea. Grigore (l.gr. Gregor) = Vigilentul. Horia = Derivatie probabila de la prenumele latin Horatius ( Frumosul ?). Izidor (l.gr. Isidor) = Darul Zeitei Isis. Iacob = De la vechiul prenume ebraic Jakob (semnificatie necunoscuta). Ion (l.ebraica Jochanan) = Jahwe-Iehova milosul. Iuliu (l.lat. Julius) = Fiul zeului Jupiter. Laurean (l.lat.) = Cel originar din Laurentum (localitate veche langa Roma). Liviu (l.lat. Livius) = Din grupul etnic roman al Livierilor. Lucian = Prenume de origina greaca cu semnificatie necunoscuta. Marin (l.lat. Marinus) = Marinarul. Marius = Prenume latin cu semnificatie nesigura (Omul Marii ? ). Mihail = Prenume de origina ebraica (Cine e ca Jahwe-Iehova ?) Mircea = Probabil de la prenumele slav Miroslav-Mirco (Slava Pacii). Quintiliu (l.lat. Quintus) = Al Cincelea. Radu (l.slavone Rad) = Veselul. Remus (l.lat. Remus) = Vaslasul (?). Sergiu (l.lat. Sergius) (Servare = A salva, Servus = Servitor ). Silviu (l.lat. Silvanus) = Padurarul. Simion (l.ebraica Simon) = Ascultatorul. Stefan (l.gr.) = Purtatorul cununei invingatorului. Teodor (l.gr. Theodor) = Darul Domnului. Tiberiu (l.lat. Tiberius) = Fiul zeului raului Tibru din Roma. Titus (l.lat) = Turturica (?). Valer (l.lat. Valerius) = Sanatosul. Vasile (l.gr. Basilius) = Domnitorul. Virgil (semnificatie necunoscuta, probabil de origine etrusca ). RENUME MASCULINE Adrian (l.lat. Hadrian) = Locuitor al arhaicului port Adria. Alexandru (l.gr.) = Aparatorul/Protectorul Barbatilor. Andrei (l.gr. Andreas) = Barbatul. Anton = Probabil de la cuvantul latin Antius (Avangardistul). Atanasie (l.gr. Athanasius) = Nemuritorul. Aurel = de la prenumele latin Aurelius (Aureus = Auritul). Constantin (l.lat.) = Neclintitul. Dan = Prescurtarea prenumelui ebraic Daniel (Judecatorul meu e Jahwe). Dumitru (l.gr. Demetrius) = Fiul zeitei Demeter. Dionisie (l.gr. Dionysius) = Fiul zeului Dionysos. Dorin (prenume de origina greaca) = apartenenta la grupul etnic al Dorilor. Emil (l.lat. Aemilius) (Aemulus = Zelosul). Eugen (l.gr.) = Cuvant greu traductibil (Domnia-Sa Domnul ?). Florin (l.lat. Florian) (Florere = A inflori) = Infloritorul. Gabriel (l.ebr. Gowriel) = Dumnezeu e puterea mea. Grigore (l.gr. Gregor) = Vigilentul. Horia = Derivatie probabila de la prenumele latin Horatius ( Frumosul ?). Izidor (l.gr. Isidor) = Darul Zeitei Isis. Iacob = De la vechiul prenume ebraic Jakob (semnificatie necunoscuta). Ion (l.ebraica Jochanan) = Jahwe-Iehova milosul. Iuliu (l.lat. Julius) = Fiul zeului Jupiter. Laurean (l.lat.) = Cel originar din Laurentum (localitate veche langa Roma). Liviu (l.lat. Livius) = Din grupul etnic roman al Livierilor. Lucian = Prenume de origina greaca cu semnificatie necunoscuta. Marin (l.lat. Marinus) = Marinarul. Marius = Prenume latin cu semnificatie nesigura (Omul Marii ? ). Mihail = Prenume de origina ebraica (Cine e ca Jahwe-Iehova ?) Mircea = Probabil de la prenumele slav Miroslav-Mirco (Slava Pacii). Quintiliu (l.lat. Quintus) = Al Cincelea. Radu (l.slavone Rad) = Veselul. Remus (l.lat. Remus) = Vaslasul (?). Sergiu (l.lat. Sergius) (Servare = A salva, Servus = Servitor ). Silviu (l.lat. Silvanus) = Padurarul. Simion (l.ebraica Simon) = Ascultatorul. Stefan (l.gr.) = Purtatorul cununei invingatorului. Teodor (l.gr. Theodor) = Darul Domnului. Tiberiu (l.lat. Tiberius) = Fiul zeului raului Tibru din Roma. Titus (l.lat) = Turturica (?). Valer (l.lat. Valerius) = Sanatosul. Vasile (l.gr. Basilius) __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Tax Center - forms, calculators, tips, more http://taxes.yahoo.com/ ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 10 Mar 2003 09:51:27 -0800 From: Joaquin Menchaca Subject: Byzantium Names Mega-List Hi. I came across this URL that my roomate found when I told him that his character IMC must have a Byzantine name. Well, he used his Knowledge(Internet) skills, that he gleamed from watching one to many episodes of Smallville, and came up with this rather incredible site with Byzantine names: http://www.oz.net/~nataraja/ars/characters/names/byzantinenames.html Eventually I will get around to copying the stuff and integrating it into my name list, as I am worried that this resource might disappear. (So many others have in the past...) - Joaquin __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Tax Center - forms, calculators, tips, more http://taxes.yahoo.com/ ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 10 Mar 2003 13:46:22 -0800 From: Joaquin Menchaca Subject: Betrayal of Innocence: Adv for PCs that kill everything on site Hi, I am having this problem where the PCs kill everything on-site that is considered "evil". I guess this is much the same way pioneers saw Indians, shoot first, ask questions later. Anyhow, I thought of a cool idea. Let's say the opposing force like the Veiled Society has a high level wizard under their employ. A crafty mastermind would use this diabolical plan to get the PCs to commit murder and become criminals, thus removing them from the true adventure, ridding the mastermind's forces. Here's the plot: (1) The wizard takes some unwilling peasants and casts seeming to make them appear as some humanoid, like goblins. This same wizard casts seeming on some thugs. (2) Spies on the streets find the whereabouts of the PCs. The PCs will either go down one street, or be somehow lead down the street. Perhaps, flinging a few arrows in their direction and then running. (3) As the PCs go down the streets they see a group of goblins attacking peasants. The goblins are actually thugs (Veiled Society members) with the seeming spell. The thugs are further disguised as peasants, so if they die, they seem like commoners. Other goblins, are peasants, and they'll attempt to bolt, at the first opportunity. However, they are held at bay by armed men. The PCs can get notable clues. A simple observation or Spot (DC 10) check will reveal that only some goblins are wielding weapons, while others are not. Further observation, or a Sense Motive (DC 15) check will reveal, that some goblins are attacking peasants, while others are not. Further, observation will through either Spot or Sense Motive (DC 20) will note that those that are not attacking are held at bay by one to three goblin guards. When the PCs attack, the thug goblins will attack the PCs, while the peasant goblins will only defend themselves (total defense, +4 AC bonus) and not attack. To confuse matters worse, the Veiled Society could even place a few non-goblin-disguised agents in the crowd of the peasants. They could backstab the PCs, or perhaps even assist in killing the peasants (disguised as goblins or otherwise). But this latter, shouldn't be used unless the player's are paticularly smart and attentive. (4) As the battle ensues, the guard goblins will start slaughtering the peasant goblins, and then attack the PCs. The goblin thugs will try to kill all witnesses to the scene, and then attack the PCs. There should only be the thug goblins remaining. (5) Once the battle is over (all peasants and thugs should be dead), the town guard will arrive in the form of 6 armed horsemen. As they arrive, one horseman will be sent for re-enforcement. They will see the PCs with blood on their swords, and attempt to arrest them. Those resisting arrest will collaborate their crime and be branded as criminals. A bounty will be put out for the PCs. Those brought to court will be guilty until proven innocent, and here-say is admissible evidence. (6) The party can be tempted by another criminal organization that they'll be set free if they do a favor for the criminal organization. If the party accepts, they the criminal organization will grease the judge, and voila - the party is set free. (7) If the party has done a favor for an aristocrat or for the church, they can then pull in that favor. The aristorcrat or cleric will have the party be under his/her custody, until the innocence can be proven. There was one witness that survived the scene. If his presence, his life will become undoubtedly in jeopardy. Further followup, will reveal that the spell Seeming is unknown within Karameikos. However, the ambassador of Glantri knows and actually possesses such a spell. If the player's can her favor, perhaps performing some mission within the city, then she'll help them, acting as a witness by demonstrating the spell's ability in court, and perhaps even selling magic/spells, or casting spells in the party's favor. If the one lone witness is killed, then the party's only recourse is to capture members of the Veiled Society who know about this plan, and somehow convince them to testify. (Conclusion) The situation about this adventure, is that there are a lot of moral (good vs evil) and ethnical (law vs chaos) dilemmas thrusted upon the player characters. The player's at any moment can break the law, by escaping from prison, refusing to go to prison, accepting the criminal organizations offer to grease the judge, etc. In the initial scene, when the player's kill the goblins, they did not realize that they are comitting an knowingly evil act, and as such should not suffer any consequence at first. However, they should be horrified by this. If anyone has the Ravenloft book, consider having the PCs make a Saving Throw (Will Save) or be inflicted by some sort of insanity, or voluntarily slip towards evil. In the course of the adventure, if the PCs comit acts of violence, they might be embracing evil. Torturing Veiled Society members would count, as well as murdering them (except in self-defense). __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Tax Center - forms, calculators, tips, more http://taxes.yahoo.com/ ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 10 Mar 2003 14:11:05 -0800 From: Joaquin Menchaca Subject: Holier than Thou (Adv for Karameikos) Holier than Thou (Adv for Karameikos) ------------------------------------- Here's a reprint of an adventure I posted earlier. This is about hobgoblins (or insert your favorite humanoid) that were converted to the light. I will probably insert my humanoid favorite of ogres. The selected Church will be the Church of Traladara. The Church of Karameikos has too much political pull, and can exert their influence amongst the Thyatian elite. However, Traladarans in general don't have the same influence amongst the elite, and are often victims of Thyatians. Also, the reasoning is that most of the party is Traladaran, and their are sick of the Thyatian bigotry, so this might be a change. One PC is a cleric of Halav, but he is always the background sort of PC. Here's the reprint: ------------------------------------------------------- On the Hobgoblin issue, I have an idea... Have some religious order, convert a band of hobgoblins to their benevolent religion. The Hobgoblins see the light, and are truly sincere, humble, and compassionate. Though, the villagers always wrongly suspect the true nature of the Hobgoblins. Some incident happens where some villagers are killed, and some of the hobgoblins were on the scene. The only survivors, were a/some Hobgoblin(s) and one boy's pet. The villagers demand the death of the hobgoblins. The PCs are sent into investigate and bring the hobgoblins to justice. The town will want the hobgoblins captured, brought to trial, and then publicly executed. Though the PCs have full discretion and can smite them if they encounter resistance. However, in actuality, the hobgoblins are really innocent, and they are indeed kind. They may have been framed by a diabolical Baron that scapegoats the gentle hobgoblins for his own nefarious and ambitious plans. If the PCs attack the Hobgoblins and kill them outright, they will undoubtedly make enemies of the church. The Church has a lot of credibility, and have managed to keep the hobgoblins from being slayed out right. The knights (and/or paladins) will defend them, but upon a signed/stamped writ from the Baron (naturally :), will have to release the Hobgoblins into the hands of the PCs. The PCs can do as they wish. They could arrange an accident during transportation of the Hobgoblins. However, in any event, the Hobgoblins will refuse to defend themselves, as they are complete pacifists. They will always be humble and perhaps even grovel and pray for penance. If a crafty GM role-plays the Hobgoblins out well, the PCs might even feel guilty. The PCs at their discretion can do a thorough investigation, or not do one at all. The villagers will be all to happy and entertained to see the Hobgoblins executed. If the Hobgoblins are imprisoned, awaiting their quick trial and execution, many villagers visit the Hobgoblins, curse at them, throw food at them. The guards might even let some villagers in to beat the crap out of the Hobgoblins. At some point, a loan boy somehow gets in the cell, and the Hobgoblin does nothing to harm the boy, and actually plays with the boy and bounces him in the air. The dog that was at the scene is totally peaceful around the Hobgoblin. When the Baron visits the Hobgoblin, the dog barks viciously at the Baron, and his guards. The dog has to be subdued, and taken outside when the Baron comes around. The villagers don't bother to notice, but the PCs should almost certainly will. This can be a whole contest of good/evil. Though, the alignment does not need to be specified. The Baron is obviously evil, while the Hobgoblins are good. The villagers, well, just do what simple villagers do best. :-) When the villagers think about the Hobgoblin, they have "evil" thoughts, detectable by a Paladin. Otherwise, they do not have evil thoughts. The Baron always has "evil" thoughts, and when the Hobgoblins see the Baron, they might also have "evil" thoughts; though they won't act upon it, for they have been well tutored by the priests. Conclusions: If the Hobgoblins are eliminated, and the Baron goes unchecked, he'll will become ruthless. He'll try to arrange for accidents for the paladins, knights, and priests. The PCs could be asked to stick around, as other hobgoblins could be nearby. The player's will notice the absurd accidents befall on noble priests and knights. Later the Baron will try to abduct various virgin girls that are coming of age for his own pleasures. He will over tax the peasants, and commit daily atrocities. If the Hobgoblins are still alive, they will not participate in any violence, unless under extreme duress where the life of an innocent is jeopardized. If the PCs become too meddlesome, some accidents can be arranged for the party. The party should have a good chance to escape or survive ambushes and planned accidents. Some traps can be triggered before PC may trigger it. A villager swipes the PCs drink, drinks down in a gulp, and soon collapses as the drink was poisoned. The PCs can get the point (pun intended) that someone is after them. Though they can go against the Baron without proof, or they'll be branded as criminals. -------------------------------------------------------- Further thought.... I was comtemplating about the first incident. Why did the Baron attack that family? Reason, that peasant saw the Baron commiting wrongful acts and was noticed (perhaps selling some peasants to the Iron Ring, or having his way with a peasant woman). He ran, but the Baron's men saw him. This time, the Baron paid this person a visit, murdered the family, and set the house ablaze. Fortunately for him, the orgres (or insert your favorite humanoid) were present. One of the orgres tried to go into the house as save anyone there, but there was only a trapped dog. The Baron's men returned to check up on their handy work, and saw the ogres. The sergeant seeing an opportunity, attacked the ogres, and used the incident to cast blame on the ogres, as the one's starting the fire and murdering the peasants. They attacked. One ogre whimpered, screamed and cried as he was being killed, while the other ogres taking the hint, bolted. The player characters arrive at the scene, and seeing ogres running past them. If the party attempts to catch them, have them be successful in capturing one of them. This ogre should appear totally harmless, and in fact will let out a pathetic scream and cry as the PCs attack or hit him in any fashion (even for sub-dual damage). In any event, the ogre will not attack, despite it's massive strength. When the PCs enter the village, a mob is gathering around the house. Many are trying to put out a fire, where the others are wanting to hunt down the ogres. During this event, a lone dog will approach a PC (especially if one is a ranger or druid). The baron arrives shortly, and calms the crowd. His guards surround the crowd. He wants them to know whose in control. He will invite the PCs to his manor for the evening. The dog will dark madly at the Baron, and can only be quieted by the PC the dog befriended. If the Baron approaches, the dog will hide behind the PCs legs. At the manor, the Baron will try to impress the PCs with his wealth, showing him his prized possessions and trophies. He'll hint that he is generous and that the PCs could enjoy this wealth, should they join him. He wants to hire the PCs to hunt down these vile ogres. He at least invite the PCs for a feast and drink, and do so in their honor if one PC slayed a captured ogre. During the feast, the baron will display obvious malice toward the Traladaran peasant workers, perhaps even slapping one across the face, or kicking one, for any little mistake. The peasants have an obvious look of fear across their face. The baron will notice the dogs reaction, and will want this mutt dealt with. The baron will insist that the dog be taking care of by some servants, and will not allow any animals inside. He'll arrange for an accident to happen to the animal, and later dispose of the body. The animal is rather crafty, and feigned death, and will get up and sprint away as servants are digging its grave. - Joaquin __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Tax Center - forms, calculators, tips, more http://taxes.yahoo.com/ ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 11 Mar 2003 05:25:56 +0000 From: adrian mattias Subject: Re: Global Interaction > From: Andrew Theisen > RW China did this very thing for centuries. There was a period of time in > the middle ages (can't remember my dates exactly now, though I did some > research on it almost a year or so ago- I want to say around 1400-1600 or > thereabouts? I'll have to check my notes) when the ruling class of China > effectively cut off all exploration of the outside world (the last great > explorer was a famous eunuch) and kept from expanding beyond its mainland > holdings. During this time, of course, European explorers set out from the > continent and discovered most of the rest of the world, leading to an age > of exploration and expansionism that left China behind. Had the > explorations of the outside world not stopped, who knows but that the > Chinese Empire might not have expanded and imposed its culture on much more > of the world than it did. The reason it did not however, was that China was following a strategy of internal growth (China is a very big place) much like the USA did in the 18th and 19th Centuries. There was no competition for China in its sphere of influence, and so its energies were better rewarded through internal expansion rather than external expansion. This was conclusively proved by the eunuch you speak of (by the name of Zhang I think?) when he led a massive fleet of 500 ships as far as Australia, India, and Africa - but found nothing of interest to the Chinese strategy (and no incentive to switch to a trading or conquest strategy) and so the fleet of ships was left to rot on the Chinese coast. > To extrapolate, then, I can certainly see something similar happening with > Alphatia. Even if not explaining it away by some means like this, though, > the sheer economic and logistic improbability of imperialistic expansion of > the scale you are suggesting is enough to keep Alphatia from actually going > through with it, I should think. The more they send their military out into > the world, the more they will have to draw support and taxes from their > subjects, and the fewer resources they would have in place locally to fend > off the civil unrest that arises as a result. Well, only if Alphatia can be considered to be as isolated as China. I don't think given all the magic they possess, that this is a realistic position to hold. The point of conquest is that if your conquest returns more cash than it costs you to mount, then it is worth undertaking. It is when the next available conquest costs more than it is worth, that your conquest empire runs into trouble and begins to collapse (as did the Roman Empire from the 2nd Century AD). Perhaps that is the case for Alphatia. But I am willing to bet that Thyatis would be rich pickings (which is probably why Alphatia invaded during Woti). ******************************************************************** > The Other Worlds Homepage: http://www.wizards.com/dnd/OtherWorlds.asp > The Mystara Homepage: http://www.dnd.starflung.com/ > To unsubscribe, send email to LISTSERV@ORACLE.WIZARDS.COM > with UNSUB MYSTARA-L in the body of the message. _________________________________________________________________ Hotmail now available on Australian mobile phones. Go to http://ninemsn.com.au/mobilecentral/hotmail_mobile.asp ------------------------------ End of MYSTARA-L Digest - 9 Mar 2003 to 10 Mar 2003 (#2003-70) **************************************************************