Subject: MYSTARA-L Digest - 28 Mar 2003 to 29 Mar 2003 (#2003-88) From: Automatic digest processor Date: 30/03/2003, 19:00 To: Recipients of MYSTARA-L digests Reply-to: Mystara RPG Discussion There are 9 messages totalling 426 lines in this issue. Topics of the day: 1. Sylvan Realm as M-Palestine? (2) 2. High or Low magic ? (4) 3. d20 Blackmoor Yahoo Group 4. Mapping programs 5. Karameikan Social Status ******************************************************************** The Other Worlds Homepage: http://www.wizards.com/dnd/OtherWorlds.asp The Mystara Homepage: http://www.dnd.starflung.com/ To unsubscribe, send email to LISTSERV@ORACLE.WIZARDS.COM with UNSUB MYSTARA-L in the body of the message. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Sat, 29 Mar 2003 03:43:38 -0800 From: "Ohad Shaham (Morphail)" Subject: Re: Sylvan Realm as M-Palestine? Just a quick remark. I think M-Palastine is not a good term, because it does not refer exactly to what you were saying. M-Cna'an (that is the pronounciation) as Kevin suggested is a more apropriate name for the topic, if only for the bagage "Palestine" carries. Palastine (in the old testiment Pleshset) was the home of the Philistins (Plishtim) in what is now the Gaza Strip and the southern coastline of Israel. The rest of what is now Israel+Jordan was known in biblical times (before the kingdoms of Israel and Judea arose) as the land of Cna'an after one of the peoples who lived there prior to the arrivel of the Israelites. Under the roman occupation (and up until modern times) the entire region was named Palestine (Palestina) even though there were no more Philistins and almost no more Jews (modern name for Hebrews). Nowdays Palestinian refers to arab denizens of the occupied territories or a more broader definition -any arab who traces his family to what is now Israel+ Ocupied Territories. Also, it is the most obvious name that would be given once the Palestinian state wil be installed. So Palestine is new name, and if you want to refer to something really old, Cna'an is better. I also remember the discussion a few years back on SE as M-Hebrews. Being a jew myself I find it a bit strange but very exciting.But IMC the M-Jew position is already taken (by gnomes...). Morphail Kevin Powers wrote:Dan wrote: >> An interesting idea. Are you then positing Alfheim as the center of diaspora elvenkind? Kind of like a Mystaran NYC? :) -Dan >> I don't want to offend, so I will be as terse and simplistic in this as possible. GOD FORBID. My remarks were ENTIRELY directed toward what is found in the Bible, or other related records. In fact, there is probably no historical paradigm (with which I am at all familiar) for Alfheim. There was obviously no "Judea Really-North" over on the Greek or Italian peninsulas during EITHER the Roman, late-Byzantine, or Renaissance eras, so the existance of a kingdom occupying territory (nyuck, nyuck, nyuck) a few miles out of Genoa is without RW counterpart. Here's the other possibility: Treat the Kingdom Of Alfheim as a sort of M-Tibet strictly for the purposes of Elven theology as a geographical counterpart to RW-Buddhism. Alfheim and the rest of the surface elves would therefore be practicing M-Mahayana Buddhism, the latter form which was a product of contact with Islamic and Hindu clerics. The SE would therefore be practicing M-Hinayana Buddhism, the last vestige of the "real deal" as originally conceived. However, this doesn't work within the theology because the SE are so clearly the M-Old Testament Hebrews. Anyone who broke out laughing when he read the "Fourteen Verses Of The Refuge Of Stone" recognizes it. The other similarities are similarly scathing. The only question left is whether the Sylvan Realm should or should not therefore serve as the last remnant of M-Cannan. (A real stretch would be Alfheim itself as M-Uganda, but that's just ridiculous.) Kevin ******************************************************************** The Other Worlds Homepage: http://www.wizards.com/dnd/OtherWorlds.asp The Mystara Homepage: http://www.dnd.starflung.com/ To unsubscribe, send email to LISTSERV@ORACLE.WIZARDS.COM with UNSUB MYSTARA-L in the body of the message. --------------------------------- Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Platinum - Watch CBS' NCAA March Madness, live on your desktop! ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 29 Mar 2003 13:35:43 +0100 From: Francesco Defferrari Subject: High or Low magic ? Hello, I believe it's possible to play in a low magic-medieval Mystara (as in = the adventures or in the Karameikos first gazeteer) or in a high magic = rinascimental Mystara (as in Glantri, Alphatia or the Almanacs) and both = ways just follow canon sources.... My campaign is very High Magic (every nation has at least a little = aerial fleet, and there is a 36 level person every 10.000 inhabitants, = like in Alphatia, and even little merchants' houses are protected from = magic) Now i would like to launch a little pool... How is your Mystara ? High = magic ? Low Magic ? a middle way ? bye=20 Francesco ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 29 Mar 2003 15:20:21 +0100 From: Giampaolo Agosta Subject: Re: High or Low magic ? Francesco Defferrari wrote: > Hello, > I believe it's possible to play in a low magic-medieval Mystara (as in the adventures or in the Karameikos first gazeteer) or in a high magic rinascimental Mystara (as in Glantri, Alphatia or the Almanacs) and both ways just follow canon sources.... > My campaign is very High Magic (every nation has at least a little aerial fleet, and there is a 36 level person every 10.000 inhabitants, like in Alphatia, and even little merchants' houses are protected from magic) > Now i would like to launch a little pool... How is your Mystara ? High magic ? Low Magic ? a middle way ? Hi, My Mystara is mid-magic: I don't assume one 36th level NPC every 10.000 people, e.g., as I prefer to follow the population breakup suggested in the High-level Campaigns book (AD&D), which means one or two 20th level characters in Thyatis, thrice that number in Alphatia, and so on. This is pretty consistent with the NPC levels in Karameikos or Rockhome gazetteers, while lower powered than canon Alphatia or Glantri. As for the magic level, I don't use tons of skyships. Only Alphatia, the HK, and Thyatis have a sizeable air fleet (save for those nations where flying creatures are common, like the Ee'ar and Enduks), while a few nations have token or ceremonial fleets--a single barge, for example, for Hule or Sind. While magic is not overly powerful--especially on the battlefield--it is still common. Low-level spellcasters for hire are employed in several activities. -- Giampaolo Agosta http://digilander.iol.it/agathokles ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 29 Mar 2003 15:39:40 +0100 From: =?iso-8859-1?q?Havard=20Faanes?= Subject: Re: High or Low magic ? Good question Francesco! My campaign is definately high magic. But not in the sence you describe below. My campaign is set in Karameikos, and according to the gazetteer they have weaker mages, less knowledge of spells etc than most other countries. Air ships are also not found anywhere near Karameikos. They tend to change a campaign dramatically anyways. However, my Karameikos campaign is filled with other forms of magic. Faerie creatures, werewolves and Vampires stalk the forest. Ancient Witches and druids protect the land or seek to destroy it. Conflicts betwen the immortals cause ripples through the fabric of the mulitiverse that affect mortals aswell as the land itself. Ancient magical lairs of the Hutaakans can be found lost in the wilderness, filled with treasures, traps and curses... Havard --- Francesco Defferrari skrev: > Hello, > I believe it's possible to play in a low > magic-medieval Mystara (as in the adventures or in > the Karameikos first gazeteer) or in a high magic > rinascimental Mystara (as in Glantri, Alphatia or > the Almanacs) and both ways just follow canon > sources.... > My campaign is very High Magic (every nation has at > least a little aerial fleet, and there is a 36 level > person every 10.000 inhabitants, like in Alphatia, > and even little merchants' houses are protected from > magic) > Now i would like to launch a little pool... How is > your Mystara ? High magic ? Low Magic ? a middle way > ? > bye > Francesco > > ******************************************************************** > The Other Worlds Homepage: > http://www.wizards.com/dnd/OtherWorlds.asp > The Mystara Homepage: http://www.dnd.starflung.com/ > To unsubscribe, send email to > LISTSERV@ORACLE.WIZARDS.COM > with UNSUB MYSTARA-L in the body of the message. > ______________________________________________________ Få den nye Yahoo! Messenger på http://no.messenger.yahoo.com/ Nye ikoner og bakgrunner, webkamera med superkvalitet og dobbelt så morsom ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 29 Mar 2003 15:46:05 +0100 From: =?iso-8859-1?q?Havard=20Faanes?= Subject: Re: d20 Blackmoor Yahoo Group Hi Jeffrey, thanks for posing this. I joined the list right away. I hope that wont draw every Blackmoor discussion away from this list though.. Havard --- Jeffrey Quinn skrev: > Hey everyone, > > It appears that Blackmoor fans are beginning to line > up already. One has > even started a Yahoo email group devoted to the d20 > version of Dave > Arneson's Blackmoor. If you want to subscribe to it, > check it out here > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/d20blackmoor/ > > Jeffrey Quinn > Freelance Writer/Game Designer > http://jpquinn.mortality.net/ > > ******************************************************************** > The Other Worlds Homepage: > http://www.wizards.com/dnd/OtherWorlds.asp > The Mystara Homepage: http://www.dnd.starflung.com/ > To unsubscribe, send email to > LISTSERV@ORACLE.WIZARDS.COM > with UNSUB MYSTARA-L in the body of the message. > ______________________________________________________ Få den nye Yahoo! Messenger på http://no.messenger.yahoo.com/ Nye ikoner og bakgrunner, webkamera med superkvalitet og dobbelt så morsom ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 29 Mar 2003 18:03:04 +0100 From: =?us-ascii?Q?Andres_Piquer_Otero?= Subject: Re: Sylvan Realm as M-Palestine? Ohad Shaham wrote: Subject: Re: Mapping programs > > Does anyone know of a program for windows that > will do Trail Map-style > > cartography better than Grid (for DOS), Digital > Apprentice Wilderness > > Mapper, or Arr-Kelaan Hex Mapper? > > > > Arr-Kelaan almost worked for me, but it's tough to > do more than a tiny > > area with the restrictive windows. > > > > I seem to recall that Thibault used Grid for DOS, > but I'm really > > looking > > for something for Windows- something that centers > the hexes in > > Gazetteer-style, with flat rather than pointed > bottoms. > > > > Thanks, > > Kevin > > > Have you tried Campaign Cartographer Pro from > ProFantasy Software > (www.profantasy.com I think). I find it very > useful. It is WIndows > only (I have to use my Virtual PC) and can create > some strikingly > beautiful maps with some practice and time. Of > course it does cost > between $70-$80. I am familiar with that program. And there at least two major problems with it. One, it's a proprietary program with it's own proprietary formats. Programs like Illustrator and Photoshop are very popular, and their file formats are supported by a variety of programs across different operating systems including Mac OS. Two, the interface is really un-intuitive, and inconsistent with many of the graphic bitmap/vector programs out there and violates human interface guidelines that are well established on both Macintosh and Windows platforms; it seems to be a left-over from the DOS days. I know people that put hours into this, and do not have impressive results. But then those that put hours into photoshop/illustrator or other popular packages can re-use those skills for non-gaming purposes or even for getting a job. Lastly, it seems that Wizards and the staff behind Polyhedron/Dungeon/Dragon also use Illustrator/Photoshop. The effects and layering used in PhotoShop are obvious in the maps, and when I questioned them about it they confirmed that Photoshop was one of the main tools. The maps they have are just spetactular. However, I don't often see as impressive maps from CC. Here's some examples: http://www.paizopublishing.com/image/dungeon/97/Cauldron72dpi.jpg http://www.paizopublishing.com/image/dungeon/97/GhelvesLocks72dpi.jpg http://www.paizopublishing.com/image/dungeon/97/JzadiruneDM72dpi.jpg http://www.paizopublishing.com/image/dungeon/97/JzadirunePlayer72dpi.jpg http://www.paizopublishing.com/image/dungeon/97/MalachiteFortress72dpi.jpg If though people pulled their resources together and made a repository of Illustrator/PhotoShop pictures, like tables, chairs, geograph hexes, floor tiles, etc., we can share these and make spetactular maps. I asked those of the Dungeon staff, and they don't want to give out the files as they don't want "copycat maps". > Sincerely, Orville [snip .sig comment] __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Platinum - Watch CBS' NCAA March Madness, live on your desktop! http://platinum.yahoo.com ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 29 Mar 2003 20:33:01 -0000 From: jason o'brien Subject: Re: High or Low magic ? Hi, My Campaigns tend to be High magic. Mortus. ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 29 Mar 2003 21:25:30 -0800 From: Joaquin Menchaca Subject: Karameikan Social Status Karameikan Social Status: Hi. I was pulling together some notes off of various web pages, and I put them together in this web book: Karameikan Social Status. Let me know what you think: http://www.angelfire.com/ca4/ShadowTriad/books/kss.pdf __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Platinum - Watch CBS' NCAA March Madness, live on your desktop! http://platinum.yahoo.com ------------------------------ End of MYSTARA-L Digest - 28 Mar 2003 to 29 Mar 2003 (#2003-88) ***************************************************************