Subject: MYSTARA-L Digest - 14 Aug 2004 to 15 Aug 2004 (#2004-167) From: Automatic digest processor Date: 16/08/2004, 17:00 To: Recipients of MYSTARA-L digests Reply-to: Mystara RPG Discussion There are 15 messages totalling 764 lines in this issue. Topics of the day: 1. Example Wiki (3) 2. Christopher Columbus did not discover anything...(or, ... (2) 3. Mystaras Legendary Wizards (2) 4. Hurricane (3) 5. Modern Mystara 6. Christopher Columbus did not discover anything...(or, ... 7. Isle of Dread thing (2) 8. Blackmoor Preview on Silven Crossroads ******************************************************************** The Other Worlds Homepage: http://www.wizards.com/dnd/OtherWorlds.asp The Mystara Homepage: http://www.dnd.starflung.com/ To unsubscribe, send email to LISTSERV@ORACLE.WIZARDS.COM with UNSUB MYSTARA-L in the body of the message. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Sun, 15 Aug 2004 17:34:11 +1000 From: shawn stanley Subject: Re: Example Wiki At 03:28 PM 12/08/2004 -0700, you wrote: > Risking exposure as a huge nerd, I put forth these two > urls as an example of what a wiki is. > First the wikipedia: > http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Main_Page > One of my favorite web resources and a great example > of a successful and useful wiki iimplementation. > Second an sample wiki I created on a free wiki > service. > http://www.seedwiki.com/page.cfm?wikiid=5901&doc=Mystara > Feel free to play around with it, it is intended as an > example. > > I submit these examples to the group in the hopes that > perhaps that the webmaster for the Offical Mystara > site is on this list and might consider adding a wiki > there. > Allowing the creation of a great cross-reference to > all of the awesome content hosted there, and also > allowing all of the talented authors to weave a tale > of mystara together. nah I'm not on this list. Whilst I maintain the site, you'll notice a lack of fancy flim-flamery with the whole thing. A lot of this you can put down to lack of in depth webmastering skills on my part. shawn stanley what have you done for me lately ... more to the point what have i done for me - mightyfew, "i can't wait" ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 15 Aug 2004 11:10:34 +0200 From: Bertrand Lhoyez Subject: Re: Christopher Columbus did not discover anything...(or, ... Pertinent all this. i'm not sure to understand " at the drop of the proverbial hat. " As a sidenote, you should try to see the documentary "The world according to Bush" (http://www.flachfilm.com/film.php?id_film=79&lang=en) I've just seen the documentary "Uncovered The Whole Truth About The Iraq War" (http://www.truthuncovered.com/), but this one lacks geopolitical perspective. (N.B. i still have to see Farenheit 911) -----Original Message----- From: Mystara RPG Discussion [mailto:MYSTARA-L@ORACLE.WIZARDS.COM]On Behalf Of Alex Benson Sent: samedi 14 aout 2004 15:42 To: MYSTARA-L@ORACLE.WIZARDS.COM Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] Christopher Columbus did not discover anything...(or, ... While the "victors" do indeed write the history, alot of current history is based upon the accepted historical timelines. The premise that there were pre-Columbian explorers on the North/South/Central American landmasses was an ongoing controversy for years. Even now, credit is mixed and often accompanied with an asterix to note Norse involvement. I will admit that the indigenous peoples of Americas do not share the admiration for Columbus, seeing him instead as a means to bring disease and occupation from Europe, as well as the death to their cultures and traditions. However, the world's history is full of change, cultural migration, and destruction. European history is rife with it...Rome and the Roman-ification of the barbarians being a perfect example. Afterall, the Dark Ages' key "darkness" is the chaos and transition caused by the lack of Roman authority. One could also factor in the rise of "modern man" past other humanboids such as Neanderthals, who themselves progressed through other races. Conflict was inevitable. For the record, warfare is always about resources either defending them or gaining them. It's only when you introduce theology and political ideals that the simplicity of warfare becomes complicated. Likewise, the indigenous peoples were themselves migrants. Current history dictates that the North/South/Central American landmasses were empty. However, the expanse of time is unknown. However, there are theories that these Asiatic migrants themselves removed and/or integrated peoples already living on the Americas. But you know how theories go....dime a dozen. In spite of our "enlightened" status, there is much about our own pasts that is simply not known. As far as Franco-phobia/resentment, I find that humorous and silly. Myself, I have nothing but respect for France and the French. France has a storied history and culture. France stood by the US and was focal to its breaking away from the English Empire. While Franco/American relations have been stressed, which all relations are at some point, it is fleeting. Any resentment is fading, at least in my opinion, except for the typical assortment of rednecks that love to wave the flag at the drop of the proverbial hat. As far as the current dissent regarding Iraq. It is a trivial matter with discrepancies and misunderstandings on both sides. These stem not from "hate" but from differing political and financial views. These views being compounded by the transition from the Cold War by the entire world, including the US. While war is wasteful, sometimes it is a requirement. The world is a different place than it was fifty, one hundred, or even two hundred twenty-eight years ago. Today, the sides of "us" and "them" are blurred with global economics and a surprisingly resurgent sense of nationalism. For Iraq, the more important dissent is the one between Western and Middle Eastern cultures, which has boiled down to Islam vs. non-Islam. Any riffs between the US and Europe can be overcome in time, we do have the common bonds and cultures to ease in understanding. Islam is another matter as it is a minor religion in the West. To Islam, many of the aspects of the Western cultures are alien, even heretical. Islamic adversity is fueled by religious fanatiscm (Islam not being exclusive in this). ******************************************************************** The Other Worlds Homepage: http://www.wizards.com/dnd/OtherWorlds.asp The Mystara Homepage: http://www.dnd.starflung.com/ To unsubscribe, send email to LISTSERV@ORACLE.WIZARDS.COM with UNSUB MYSTARA-L in the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 15 Aug 2004 14:17:01 +0200 From: =?iso-8859-1?q?Havard=20Faanes?= Subject: Re: Example Wiki --- shawn stanley wrote: > nah I'm not on this list. Whilst I maintain the > site, you'll notice a lack > of fancy flim-flamery with the whole thing. A lot > of this you can put down > to lack of in depth webmastering skills on my part. Well, the site may be simple, but it is well organized and loaded with contents, so I say you're doing a great job, webmastering skills or not :) I checked out the wiki yesterday, but didn't really figure out how to use it. I guess I'll just have to try a little more. That said, I think the whole point with a wiki is that people can edit it themselves, so it should require a minimum amount of work for the webmaster OTOH, it might get hard disk consuming pretty fast, so it might not be worth it. Then again, if Shawns final word is no, why don't the people on this list who know how it works set up a separate site for the Mystara Wiki? With websites as with all other things, the more the merrier, right? :) Havard ===== *** Håvard R. Faanes www.stud.ntnu.no/~havardfa ______________________________________________________ Få den nye Yahoo! Messenger på http://no.messenger.yahoo.com/ Nye ikoner og bakgrunner, webkamera med superkvalitet og dobbelt så morsom ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 15 Aug 2004 14:21:43 +0200 From: =?iso-8859-1?q?Havard=20Faanes?= Subject: Re: Mystaras Legendary Wizards --- Alex Benson skrev: > Would the List be interested in submissions for > created legendary mage NPCs? > And by that I mean legendary for good deeds, ill > reputations, as well as > achievements in magical researches. Definately! Things that _could_ be included in Legendary Mage writeups: Name (duh) Stats (in case the PCs want to travel back in time and kill them) Culture/Era (When did this particular wizard live) Magic (What kind of spells, specific or type did the wizard use, or was known for) Artifacts (Magical Items created by the Wizard) The above is just an idea though, feel free to use or ignore as you see fit :) Havard ===== *** Håvard R. Faanes www.stud.ntnu.no/~havardfa ______________________________________________________ Få den nye Yahoo! Messenger på http://no.messenger.yahoo.com/ Nye ikoner og bakgrunner, webkamera med superkvalitet og dobbelt så morsom ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 15 Aug 2004 14:26:58 +0200 From: =?iso-8859-1?q?Havard=20Faanes?= Subject: Re: Hurricane --- Chris Cherrington skrev: > See you guys next week, just got my orders to > evacuate, due to hurricane Charlie. Wow, the real world just made an appearance didn't it? Take care Chris, and see you after. :) Havard ===== *** Håvard R. Faanes www.stud.ntnu.no/~havardfa ______________________________________________________ Få den nye Yahoo! Messenger på http://no.messenger.yahoo.com/ Nye ikoner og bakgrunner, webkamera med superkvalitet og dobbelt så morsom ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 15 Aug 2004 14:32:03 +0200 From: =?iso-8859-1?q?Havard=20Faanes?= Subject: Re: Modern Mystara --- Web Warlock wrote: > I don't know about the rest of you, but my Modern > Mystara would have flying > cars. Imagine a world where magic and tech could > grow together (but maybe > not always work together) and let in simmer for a > 1000 years. Well, one question is, would the geographical borders/cultures remain the same? Although probably not logical, I think we should assume that the countries in general exist (or at least that the cultures do) to maintain the flavor of Mystara. Flying cars, eh? Well, after seeing Harry Potter I have sort of warmed up to that idea myself, so yeah, why not? I's see the Heldanners producing the Volks Fliegen Wagen (VFW) for instance. GURPS Technomancy is an interesting sourcebook for developing a world where magic and technology exists also. What do other people think? Havard ===== *** Håvard R. Faanes www.stud.ntnu.no/~havardfa ______________________________________________________ Få den nye Yahoo! Messenger på http://no.messenger.yahoo.com/ Nye ikoner og bakgrunner, webkamera med superkvalitet og dobbelt så morsom ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 15 Aug 2004 09:32:32 EDT From: Alex Benson Subject: Re: Christopher Columbus did not discover anything...(or, ... My appologies. The reference..."drop of the proverbial hat" is a play on the saying "at the drop of a hat"...which means something that is said or done rapidly and without hesitation, usually being overdone. The addition of the word "proverbial" is just to highlight the use of the term as a saying. There's no intended malice, at least towards the French, in that partial sentence. In the intended context of my post it was meant to typify the custom of certain individuals who leap upon any current trend of berating any nation or people, based upon misconceptions. As far as the submitted web sites, I'll admit to not looking at either. I tend to stay away from political based sites, especially during a presidential race. A tried and true lesson I follow on the internet is to never put alot of faith in anything you read. Afterall, the information is only as good as the person or persons that wrote them. Likewise, liable laws are difficult to enforce on many of these fly by night sites. There's alot of "spin", half truths, and outright lies used in political sites to sensationalize matters and exploit fear tactics. Arthur Kent and Michael Moore have made careers out of this. Though I am far from an expert, I do have a great interest in history and military history, based mainly upon my own family's history within the military. I doubt that there is any real information that I do not know about Iraq and either of the Iraqi Wars. Likewise, I never said that I was a Bush supporter nor did I say that I supported the official cause for the US invasion. ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 15 Aug 2004 15:04:12 +0100 From: =?iso-8859-1?q?Neil=20Marsden?= Subject: Re: Isle of Dread thing I couldn't resist either! I thought article in Dungeon was pretty good too. It did make me ponder over whether it'd be worth re-releasing Mystara though. Please, don't kill me! ;) But does anyone else think that the setting of Mystara would have to be significantly revised to make it truly unique as an official D&D setting? The problem is that FR, Greyhawk and now Eberron, have all borrowed ideas from Mystara, so that now there's little to recommend it. To the fans, of course, it is the cohesive whole that keeps us interested (combined with more than a little nostalgia and stubborness). But if you were to re-release Mystara, what angle could you possibly take in marketing it? "Mystara, contains lots of bits and pieces from all your other favourite D&D settings!" Neil ===== N. M. n.e.marsden@btinternet.com Backup 101563.52@talk21.com ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 15 Aug 2004 08:18:46 -0700 From: Herve Musseau Subject: Re: Mystaras Legendary Wizards > From: André_Martins > And, since recovering lost information about the past will play a very > central role in my plot, I would really like to see what past events each of > you have created for your own campaigns. If it would be up to me, I would > even suggest that the people of the MA should, at least once, create a > historical almanac. Instead of advancing one year, they could create events > and NPCs for one gone year, be it 900 AC, 500 AC or earlier. Of course, we > could do that simply in the list, sending suggestions, but it would be great > to see it in the beautiful format of the MA. I realize that would be a > nightmare to create stories that are compatible with the gazeteers and with > the future events, but it could also be a wonderful thing to see. It's an interesting idea, but it would require a lot of work, and it is not so easy to compile a normal almanac as it is. However, if you can bring such a project to its conclusion, and would like it to be edited into the almanac format, I'd be glad to do that. In fact, any project that wants editing and formatting can ask me, and if I have the time I'll help; for example, Thibault got me into his Heldanner Gaz mostly for that purpose. ===== ___________________________________________________________ Herve Musseau http://www.geocities.com/hmusseau/ __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? New and Improved Yahoo! Mail - 100MB free storage! http://promotions.yahoo.com/new_mail ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 15 Aug 2004 11:51:34 -0400 From: Donald Eric Kesler Subject: Re: Isle of Dread thing Hello All, I just stumbled upon something that is marginally related to the subject at hand. B1 In Search of the Unknown features a henchman/hireling that is clearly from Greyhawk. The stats for Tassit, Servant of Saint Cuthbert, may be found on page 28. I was reminded of the d'Ambreville that snuck into the Return to Keep on the Borderlands. Regards and Best Wishes, Donald Eric Kesler http://www.geocities.com/heroclixleagueofathens/ > From: Neil Marsden > Reply-To: Mystara RPG Discussion > To: MYSTARA-L@ORACLE.WIZARDS.COM > Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] Isle of Dread thing > Date: Sun, 15 Aug 2004 15:04:12 +0100 > MIME-Version: 1.0 > Received: from mc8-f26.hotmail.com ([65.54.253.162]) by mc8-s1.hotmail.com > with Microsoft SMTPSVC(5.0.2195.6713); Sun, 15 Aug 2004 07:22:09 -0700 > Received: from oracle.wizards.com ([209.221.142.150]) by > mc8-f26.hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(5.0.2195.6824); Sun, 15 Aug 2004 > 07:21:32 -0700 > Received: from lotus (10.12.8.13) by oracle.wizards.com (LSMTP for Windows > NT v1.1b) with SMTP id <0.012F6697@oracle.wizards.com>; 15 Aug 2004 7:20:18 > -0700 > Received: from ORACLE.WIZARDS.COM by ORACLE.WIZARDS.COM (LISTSERV-TCP/IP > release 1.8d) with spool id 39724367 for > MYSTARA-L@ORACLE.WIZARDS.COM; Sun, 15 Aug 2004 07:04:14 -0700 > Received: from web86710.mail.ukl.yahoo.com (217.12.13.42) by > oracle.wizards.com (LSMTP for Windows NT v1.1b) with SMTP id > <0.012F667D@oracle.wizards.com>; 15 Aug 2004 7:04:14 -0700 > Received: from [81.156.107.34] by web86710.mail.ukl.yahoo.com via HTTP; > Sun, 15 Aug 2004 15:04:12 BST > X-Message-Info: 820stLNiepT6zZ5dwwkUp6FZmuU7JfMmnrtD2EYsUgk= > Message-ID: <20040815140412.57466.qmail@web86710.mail.ukl.yahoo.com> > Return-Path: owner-mystara-l@ORACLE.WIZARDS.COM > X-OriginalArrivalTime: 15 Aug 2004 14:21:33.0061 (UTC) > FILETIME=[2A2E6350:01C482D3] > > I couldn't resist either! > > I thought article in Dungeon was pretty good too. > > It did make me ponder over whether it'd be worth > re-releasing Mystara though. > > Please, don't kill me! ;) But does anyone else think > that the setting of Mystara would have to be > significantly revised to make it truly unique as an > official D&D setting? > > The problem is that FR, Greyhawk and now Eberron, have > all borrowed ideas from Mystara, so that now there's > little to recommend it. To the fans, of course, it is > the cohesive whole that keeps us interested (combined > with more than a little nostalgia and stubborness). > > But if you were to re-release Mystara, what angle > could you possibly take in marketing it? > > "Mystara, contains lots of bits and pieces from all > your other favourite D&D settings!" > > Neil > > ===== > N. M. > n.e.marsden@btinternet.com > Backup 101563.52@talk21.com > > ******************************************************************** > The Other Worlds Homepage: http://www.wizards.com/dnd/OtherWorlds.asp > The Mystara Homepage: http://www.dnd.starflung.com/ > To unsubscribe, send email to LISTSERV@ORACLE.WIZARDS.COM > with UNSUB MYSTARA-L in the body of the message. > _________________________________________________________________ Is your PC infected? Get a FREE online computer virus scan from McAfee® Security. http://clinic.mcafee.com/clinic/ibuy/campaign.asp?cid=3963 ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 15 Aug 2004 20:23:05 +0200 From: Bertrand Lhoyez Subject: Re: Christopher Columbus did not discover anything...(or, ... Hi No need to apology. I was just not understanding clearly the saying with the word "proverbial" included. The submitted website are for the curiosity of people. are you american (as it seems to me) ? (grosso modo, how various nationality is there on this list ?) The documentary which those website are talking about (i should say selling :-) are rather interesting in my opinion, not because they talk of a present subject (opposed to past history), but because they show part of the intricacies of human manipulation. Personnaly i see it also as one source of inspiration for gaming. For information, in fact the basic rules is to confront various media and people opinions; in this perspective, Internet is just another form of media. -----Original Message----- From: Mystara RPG Discussion [mailto:MYSTARA-L@ORACLE.WIZARDS.COM]On Behalf Of Alex Benson Sent: dimanche 15 aout 2004 15:33 To: MYSTARA-L@ORACLE.WIZARDS.COM Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] Christopher Columbus did not discover anything...(or, ... My appologies. The reference..."drop of the proverbial hat" is a play on the saying "at the drop of a hat"...which means something that is said or done rapidly and without hesitation, usually being overdone. The addition of the word "proverbial" is just to highlight the use of the term as a saying. There's no intended malice, at least towards the French, in that partial sentence. In the intended context of my post it was meant to typify the custom of certain individuals who leap upon any current trend of berating any nation or people, based upon misconceptions. As far as the submitted web sites, I'll admit to not looking at either. I tend to stay away from political based sites, especially during a presidential race. A tried and true lesson I follow on the internet is to never put alot of faith in anything you read. Afterall, the information is only as good as the person or persons that wrote them. Likewise, liable laws are difficult to enforce on many of these fly by night sites. There's alot of "spin", half truths, and outright lies used in political sites to sensationalize matters and exploit fear tactics. Arthur Kent and Michael Moore have made careers out of this. Though I am far from an expert, I do have a great interest in history and military history, based mainly upon my own family's history within the military. I doubt that there is any real information that I do not know about Iraq and either of the Iraqi Wars. Likewise, I never said that I was a Bush supporter nor did I say that I supported the official cause for the US invasion. ******************************************************************** The Other Worlds Homepage: http://www.wizards.com/dnd/OtherWorlds.asp The Mystara Homepage: http://www.dnd.starflung.com/ To unsubscribe, send email to LISTSERV@ORACLE.WIZARDS.COM with UNSUB MYSTARA-L in the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 15 Aug 2004 20:22:42 +0200 From: =?iso-8859-1?q?la=20Volpe?= Subject: Re: Hurricane Let us know how things go out there. I hope everything will be allright. Here in Italy we don't have such things, we are scared already when the wind gets over 120 km/hour...so I really don't have any idea how it feels and what type of problems that can create. So let us know how it goes, we're close to you and your family (and obviously to all the others on the list that live in those areas and that we're not aware of). Giulio ____________________________________________________________ Yahoo! Companion - Scarica gratis la toolbar di Ricerca di Yahoo! http://companion.yahoo.it ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 15 Aug 2004 15:20:29 -0400 From: Dan Eustace Subject: Re: Hurricane Fortunately for Chris, Charley hit on the Gulf Coast - West Palm Beach is on the Atlantic side. I guess power is out all over the place, though, and the damage to the gulf side looks pretty bad. The storm picked up a lot of intensity and took alot of people off guard, when it looked like it might be winding down. 145 mph winds! I don't ever want to experience that either. So, Chris, please let us know when you are up and running again. Obviously there may be far more important things to take of care of first before checking in with a D&D list. Hope you weathered the storm OK. Dan ----- Original Message ----- From: "la Volpe" To: Sent: Sunday, August 15, 2004 2:22 PM Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] Hurricane > Let us know how things go out there. > I hope everything will be allright. Here in Italy we > don't have such things, we are scared already when the > wind gets over 120 km/hour...so I really don't have > any idea how it feels and what type of problems that > can create. So let us know how it goes, we're close to > you and your family (and obviously to all the others > on the list that live in those areas and that we're > not aware of). > > Giulio > > > > > > > ____________________________________________________________ > Yahoo! Companion - Scarica gratis la toolbar di Ricerca di Yahoo! > http://companion.yahoo.it > > ******************************************************************** > The Other Worlds Homepage: http://www.wizards.com/dnd/OtherWorlds.asp > The Mystara Homepage: http://www.dnd.starflung.com/ > To unsubscribe, send email to LISTSERV@ORACLE.WIZARDS.COM > with UNSUB MYSTARA-L in the body of the message. > ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 16 Aug 2004 06:52:58 +1000 From: shawn stanley Subject: Re: Example Wiki At 02:17 PM 15/08/2004 +0200, you wrote: > --- shawn stanley wrote: > >> nah I'm not on this list. Whilst I maintain the >> site, you'll notice a lack >> of fancy flim-flamery with the whole thing. A lot >> of this you can put down >> to lack of in depth webmastering skills on my part. > > Well, the site may be simple, but it is well organized > and loaded with contents, so I say you're doing a > great job, webmastering skills or not :) > > I checked out the wiki yesterday, but didn't really > figure out how to use it. I guess I'll just have to > try a little more. That said, I think the whole point > with a wiki is that people can edit it themselves, so > it should require a minimum amount of work for the > webmaster OTOH, it might get hard disk consuming > pretty fast, so it might not be worth it. > > Then again, if Shawns final word is no, why don't the > people on this list who know how it works set up a > separate site for the Mystara Wiki? With websites as > with all other things, the more the merrier, right? :) well there's other website issues at the moment, so those have me more concerned at the moment rather than wiki's and suchlike shawn stanley what have you done for me lately ... more to the point what have i done for me - mightyfew, "i can't wait" ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 15 Aug 2004 19:02:44 -0400 From: Dustin Clingman Subject: Re: Blackmoor Preview on Silven Crossroads Most certainly! Just drop over to the Goodman Games site and put in your order. Here's the link: http://www.goodman-games.com/store.php#GMG4500 Dustin -----Original Message----- From: Mystara RPG Discussion [mailto:MYSTARA-L@ORACLE.WIZARDS.COM] On Behalf Of la Volpe Sent: Saturday, August 14, 2004 6:58 AM To: MYSTARA-L@ORACLE.WIZARDS.COM Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] Blackmoor Preview on Silven Crossroads Can I order it from Italy? Giulio ____________________________________________________________ Yahoo! Companion - Scarica gratis la toolbar di Ricerca di Yahoo! http://companion.yahoo.it ******************************************************************** The Other Worlds Homepage: http://www.wizards.com/dnd/OtherWorlds.asp The Mystara Homepage: http://www.dnd.starflung.com/ To unsubscribe, send email to LISTSERV@ORACLE.WIZARDS.COM with UNSUB MYSTARA-L in the body of the message. ------------------------------ End of MYSTARA-L Digest - 14 Aug 2004 to 15 Aug 2004 (#2004-167) ****************************************************************