Subject: MYSTARA-L Digest - 6 Apr 2004 to 7 Apr 2004 (#2004-80) From: Automatic digest processor Date: 08/04/2004, 17:00 To: Recipients of MYSTARA-L digests Reply-to: Mystara RPG Discussion There are 5 messages totalling 255 lines in this issue. Topics of the day: 1. Sorcerers in the Known World (5) ******************************************************************** The Other Worlds Homepage: http://www.wizards.com/dnd/OtherWorlds.asp The Mystara Homepage: http://www.dnd.starflung.com/ To unsubscribe, send email to LISTSERV@ORACLE.WIZARDS.COM with UNSUB MYSTARA-L in the body of the message. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Wed, 7 Apr 2004 14:21:19 +0200 From: =?iso-8859-1?q?Havard=20Faanes?= Subject: Re: Sorcerers in the Known World --- Andrew wrote: > >Glantri > >Surprisingly, there are very few known sorcerers in > >the Kingdom of Magic. Sorcerers are hunted down in > >Glantri for research purposes, similarly to dwarves > >and halflings. The Wizards of Glantri seek to find > the > >truth behind the origin of sorcerers and find ways > to > >use this to their advantage. This has caused most > >sorcers to stay away from the Principalities. > > The only problem I have with this theory is that > Glantri was founded by the Flaems (primarily) who > are of Alphatian origin, and would likely (IMO) have > been largely sorcerers themselves. Not to mention > the Blackhill Alphatians and the Aalbanese of > Alphatian descent. Point. It seemed like a good idea at the time, but on second thought Sorcerers should be accepted on the same level as Wizards in Glantri. Originally I thought this would be a good idea to distinguish between Alphatia and Glantri, but given the Alphatian-descended population this would be tricky. Suggested replacement: "Glantri is known as the land of arcane magic. Sorcerers and wizards are the rulers of this land, and no distincion is made between the two. Many of the Sorcerers in Glantri are of Flaem descent, thus strengthening the theory that Sorcery may be linked to Alphatian blood." > >Darokin > >In Darokin, Sorcerers are viewed with distrust. It > is > >believed that the magic which flows naturally > through > >a sorcerers veins is a result of Demon blood. > >Sorcerers are rare in Darokin, but if detected they > >are often burned at the stakes. > > That's pretty harsh, especially for Darokin, which > is usually a pretty tolerant nation. I could see > this sort of behavior more in Karameikos, or maybe > the borderland dominions of Darokin, but not quite > so much in the Heartlands. Yeah, I expected some criticism on this one. What I wanted to to was introduce a more dark side to Darokin, reminiscent of the Puritan's treatment of "Witches" in the US. OTOH, your suggestion is a good way to include both sides, limiting this fear of Sorcerers to remote parts of the country, where superstition and fear still dominates even in the land of trade and tolerance. Also Heldann which was left out of the original writeup may take on the Witchburning attribute... > >Northern Reaches > >In the north, magic is distrusted. But as with > >Wizards, should the Sorcerer prove himself or > herself > >worthy of respect and show that he will not use > magic > >for deception, the Sorcerer may be respected. The > >so-called Wise Women of the Northern Reaches are > >believed to be Sorcerers. > > I like this, in fact, I might even suggest that > Sorcerers are more common than Wizards in the > Northern Reaches (outside of Norrvik, anyway, with > its magic school). Perhaps there is some vestige of > elvish blood in the Northerners that accounts for > sorcery? (There is one dominion in Vestland > especially that is linked closely with elves in the > past, and allusions to half-elves are made. Can't > recall which one offhand, though.) Makes sense to me. The elven-blood theory is an interesting connection aswell. Also, I am thinking about making the Wise Women a variant class of Sorcerer with the Familar ability replaced by a paladins healing touch.... > >Alfheim, Wendar and the Shadow Elf Realms > >Magic is natural to the elves. When a Sorcerer is > >born, it is met with delight and joy, as it is > >understood that the child will have a natural > affinity > >for the magic that makes up a part of any elf's > life. > >Sorcerers are common among the elves so it is not > seen > >as so extraordinary as in many other countries. > > Frankly, I think all elves should have sorcerer as > the preferred class. The description of the elves > and the sorcerer description seem more suited to > each other than wizard. That is not such a bad idea. Sorcerer certainly fits better than Wizard IMO, although I have also considered having Druid or Ranger as favored classes for the elves. Perhaps this could be different for each clan though, but Sorcerer could be made the default favored class. > >Athruagin > >Sorcerers are rare in Athruagin, but when one of > the > >Clansmen discovers he has sorcerous abilities, it > is > >seen as a gift from the Spirits. > > I'm almost inclined to view the Shamans as > Sorcerers, except that the way the description of > the class is in the Gaz, it seems almost more like a > druid or a cleric of Atruaghin... I think the Shamani of Athruagin and the Shamans of Ethengar could be best dealt with as a Druid Variant class. Such a Shaman class was introduced in the Kingdoms of Kalamar Players Guide. A similar approach can be found at: http://www.angelfire.com/games4/mystara Havard ===== *** Håvard R. Faanes www.stud.ntnu.no/~havardfa ______________________________________________________ Få den nye Yahoo! Messenger på http://no.messenger.yahoo.com/ Nye ikoner og bakgrunner, webkamera med superkvalitet og dobbelt så morsom ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 7 Apr 2004 12:27:05 -0400 From: Chris Cherrington Subject: Re: Sorcerers in the Known World I was going to introduce the Sorcerer as a new class available after the NOS was changed to suck Entropy. Think of the consequences on that one, all of a sudden millions of mundaners around the world can all of a sudden utilize magic, and without previous knowledge or training? ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 7 Apr 2004 12:37:03 -0400 From: Chris Cherrington Subject: Re: Sorcerers in the Known World With Sorcerers appearing after the NOS is changed during the WoTI, another chaotic side effect could be all Sorcerers casting spells the day before the Day of Dread, double the effects. Sort of giving the Day of Dread as a day the circuit breaker is reset. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 7 Apr 2004 11:53:21 -0700 From: Andrew Theisen Subject: Re: Sorcerers in the Known World Havard Faanes wrote: >> The only problem I have with this theory is that >> Glantri was founded by the Flaems (primarily) who >> are of Alphatian origin, and would likely (IMO) have >> been largely sorcerers themselves. Not to mention >> the Blackhill Alphatians and the Aalbanese of >> Alphatian descent. > > Point. It seemed like a good idea at the time, but on > second thought Sorcerers should be accepted on the > same level as Wizards in Glantri. Originally I thought > this would be a good idea to distinguish between > Alphatia and Glantri, but given the > Alphatian-descended population this would be tricky. Understand the principle, but yeah, the Alphatian angle makes it tricky. Perhaps a suitable replacement theory would be to have the Sorcerers and Wizards feel a distinct gap between them, a rivalry and disappointment in the others' not being the "true art"; whereas in Alphatia both are so throughly enmeshed in society that they are rarely distinguished? (except maybe among the "true Alphatians" who would probably sneer at anyone without sorcerous ability, just as they sneer at anyone in general). >> That's pretty harsh, especially for Darokin, which >> is usually a pretty tolerant nation. I could see >> this sort of behavior more in Karameikos, or maybe >> the borderland dominions of Darokin, but not quite >> so much in the Heartlands. > > Yeah, I expected some criticism on this one. What I > wanted to to was introduce a more dark side to > Darokin, reminiscent of the Puritan's treatment of > "Witches" in the US. OTOH, your suggestion is a good > way to include both sides, limiting this fear of > Sorcerers to remote parts of the country, where > superstition and fear still dominates even in the land > of trade and tolerance. I gotcha. Didn't mean to sound too critical, but it seemed a bit out of character for the majority of the Darokinians. On the other hand, looking at the treatment of some of the Borderlands (for reference, see the adventure in accessory PC1: Tall Tales of the Wee Folk, in which there is a pronounced sort of antagonism between the fey- arguably of "sorcerous" nature- and the more opportunistic sorts that rule over the Borderlands). The ill-treatment and "barbarous" practices of the Borderlands regions are likely a source of constant embarrassment to the ruling council of Darokin, and they probably seek to reclaim/purchase/administrate those territories with all due haste (like the adventure CM8: Legacy of Blood, where the PCs have a limited time to demonstrate ruling ability in a Borderlands dominion). > Also Heldann which was left > out of the original writeup may take on the > Witchburning attribute... Now there's definitely a place where I can see witchburnings taking place, certainly post-Hattian takeover. There are probably sorcerers working with the original Heldannic noble and peasant population as rebels against the Heldannic Order. Which brings up a point I just thought of- when the Heldannic Knights passed through into Glantri back during the Great War, maybe some of their number stayed on in the northern Darokin regions- particularly the Borderlands- where they may have stirred up some pro-Heldannic sentiments among some of the Borderlands territories, especially amongst the more militant northern domains. Maybe there's a rising Heldannic influence in Darokin as we speak? >> Frankly, I think all elves should have sorcerer as >> the preferred class. The description of the elves >> and the sorcerer description seem more suited to >> each other than wizard. > > That is not such a bad idea. Sorcerer certainly fits > better than Wizard IMO, although I have also > considered having Druid or Ranger as favored classes > for the elves. Perhaps this could be different for > each clan though, but Sorcerer could be made the > default favored class. The way I have it, there are different preferred classses for many of the clans (Grunalfs as Rangers and Feadiels as druids, and Mealidils as bards and Longrunners as wizards come immediately to mind) but I have sorcerer as the default for any non-developed clans or "generic" elves. > I think the Shamani of Athruagin and the Shamans of > Ethengar could be best dealt with as a Druid Variant > class. Such a Shaman class was introduced in the > Kingdoms of Kalamar Players Guide. A similar approach > can be found at: > http://www.angelfire.com/games4/mystara I'll check that out. A druid variant is probably the best approach. I wish some more effort had been made to make the Ethengar and Atruaghin shamans similar in the gazzes (rather than two different classes altogether), but you're probably right on the mark with this one. I do agree that the Hakomons are Sorcerers, though. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 7 Apr 2004 11:55:28 -0700 From: Andrew Theisen Subject: Re: Sorcerers in the Known World Just thought of something- you left out Ylaruam in your original description of Sorcerers. I'd say that Ylari sorcerers are likely of Efreeti (or otherplanar) descent, and as such tend towards using the outlawed fire magics and such. As a result, they would be shunned and treated as criminals in the land. There would likely be a high number of them among the Nithians, but they would still be outlaws. ------------------------------ End of MYSTARA-L Digest - 6 Apr 2004 to 7 Apr 2004 (#2004-80) *************************************************************