Subject: MYSTARA-L Digest - 14 Oct 2005 to 18 Oct 2005 (#2005-195) From: MYSTARA-L automatic digest system Date: 19/10/2005, 18:00 To: MYSTARA-L@ORACLE.WIZARDS.COM Reply-to: Mystara RPG Discussion There are 7 messages totalling 508 lines in this issue. Topics of the day: 1. Real death in campaign. Help me (6) 2. Real death in campaign. Help me - For Neil ******************************************************************** The Other Worlds Homepage: http://www.wizards.com/dnd/OtherWorlds.asp The Mystara Homepage: http://www.pandius.com To unsubscribe, send email to LISTSERV@ORACLE.WIZARDS.COM with UNSUB MYSTARA-L in the body of the message. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Tue, 18 Oct 2005 22:52:03 +0100 From: Neil Marsden Subject: Real death in campaign. Help me Well, although I get the daily digest and sometimes post on the Wizards.COMmunity Mystara Board, none of you know me, but I'm hoping you can help me nonetheless. An old friend of mine, a player in my gaming group, died yesterday. It wasn't entirely unexpected, but it's still affected me profoundly. There are a lot of thoughts and feelings I wish I could share with someone/anyone right now, but I'll spare you. ;) So getting straight to the point, I'm an experienced GM, almost two decades, I've dealt with all kinds of problems in my gaming groups, dealt with players leaving for all kinds of reasons. None of them have ever died on me though. I've got a gaming session this Saturday, and to be perfectly honest I just don't know what to do. I'm going to sit down at the head of the table, look left, this player isn't going to be there, and that will overshadow everything. Alright, not making myself too clear. Put it this way. I know for a fact that my old friend would *want* us to continue playing, and especially want me to continue running the campaign. And I wish I could, I just don't know how. What can I do with his character, for instance? All I know is what I can't do. I can't just run him as an NPC. I can't just kill him off behind the scenes. I should really give more details of the campaign, but the details aren't the problem. I can work out the details. I guess all I'm asking is what would you do in my situation, if it were your campaign? Regardless, Mystara has lost a great player this week, me and my gaming group, the worlds we created together, we'll all miss him. And I'll certainly be missing an old friend too. Anyway, there you have it. Sorry for burdening the mailing list with this one, but I hope you can help. Cheers, Neil (aka nemarsde) ******************************************************************** The Other Worlds Homepage: http://www.wizards.com/dnd/OtherWorlds.asp The Mystara Homepage: http://www.pandius.com To unsubscribe, send email to LISTSERV@ORACLE.WIZARDS.COM with UNSUB MYSTARA-L in the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 18 Oct 2005 18:04:22 -0400 From: John Hofmann Subject: Re: Real death in campaign. Help me I guess I would probably talk to the other players and see what their feelings would be. You know your gaming group the best and you guys would best be able to come up with a way to respect the memory of your friend. Since you asked what we would do ... my group would probably meet at a bar near where we usually meet (which is easy for us since we meet in downtown Manhattan) and we'd hang out and those of us that drink would probably have a few drinks. Taking a week off from gaming to spend time with the members of your group that are left isn't a bad thing, and no one would expect you to jump right back into a campaign. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Neil Marsden" To: Sent: Tuesday, October 18, 2005 5:52 PM Subject: [MYSTARA] Real death in campaign. Help me > Well, although I get the daily digest and sometimes post on the > Wizards.COMmunity Mystara Board, none of you know me, but I'm hoping you > can help me nonetheless. > > An old friend of mine, a player in my gaming group, died yesterday. It > wasn't entirely unexpected, but it's still affected me profoundly. > > There are a lot of thoughts and feelings I wish I could share with > someone/anyone right now, but I'll spare you. ;) > > So getting straight to the point, I'm an experienced GM, almost two > decades, I've dealt with all kinds of problems in my gaming groups, > dealt with players leaving for all kinds of reasons. None of them have > ever died on me though. > > I've got a gaming session this Saturday, and to be perfectly honest I > just don't know what to do. I'm going to sit down at the head of the > table, look left, this player isn't going to be there, and that will > overshadow everything. > > Alright, not making myself too clear. Put it this way. I know for a fact > that my old friend would *want* us to continue playing, and especially > want me to continue running the campaign. And I wish I could, I just > don't know how. > > What can I do with his character, for instance? All I know is what I > can't do. I can't just run him as an NPC. I can't just kill him off > behind the scenes. > > I should really give more details of the campaign, but the details > aren't the problem. I can work out the details. > > I guess all I'm asking is what would you do in my situation, if it were > your campaign? > > Regardless, Mystara has lost a great player this week, me and my gaming > group, the worlds we created together, we'll all miss him. And I'll > certainly be missing an old friend too. > > Anyway, there you have it. Sorry for burdening the mailing list with > this one, but I hope you can help. > > Cheers, > > Neil (aka nemarsde) > > ******************************************************************** > The Other Worlds Homepage: http://www.wizards.com/dnd/OtherWorlds.asp > The Mystara Homepage: http://www.pandius.com > To unsubscribe, send email to LISTSERV@ORACLE.WIZARDS.COM > with UNSUB MYSTARA-L in the body of the message. ******************************************************************** The Other Worlds Homepage: http://www.wizards.com/dnd/OtherWorlds.asp The Mystara Homepage: http://www.pandius.com To unsubscribe, send email to LISTSERV@ORACLE.WIZARDS.COM with UNSUB MYSTARA-L in the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 18 Oct 2005 17:41:57 -0500 From: George Hrabovsky Subject: Re: Real death in campaign. Help me Neil, I can sympathize with you. Towards the end of 2000 my wife and partner of thirteen years lost her fight with breast cancer. It had a profound effect on my game from that moment on. All I can tell you is that you need to do what you feel is right. There is nothing wrong with continuing a game; in fact I did so with the full statement that it was what Heather wanted. I am married again, to another gamer, and things have been going strong. Give yourself time and space to grieve the loss. If you can, make it a part of your game; if you feel that is appropriate. You have my condolances, George ----- Original Message ----- From: "Neil Marsden" To: Sent: Tuesday, October 18, 2005 4:52 PM Subject: [MYSTARA] Real death in campaign. Help me > Well, although I get the daily digest and sometimes post on the Wizards.COMmunity Mystara Board, none of you know me, but I'm hoping you can help me nonetheless. > > An old friend of mine, a player in my gaming group, died yesterday. It wasn't entirely unexpected, but it's still affected me profoundly. > > There are a lot of thoughts and feelings I wish I could share with someone/anyone right now, but I'll spare you. ;) > > So getting straight to the point, I'm an experienced GM, almost two decades, I've dealt with all kinds of problems in my gaming groups, dealt with players leaving for all kinds of reasons. None of them have ever died on me though. > > I've got a gaming session this Saturday, and to be perfectly honest I just don't know what to do. I'm going to sit down at the head of the table, look left, this player isn't going to be there, and that will overshadow everything. > > Alright, not making myself too clear. Put it this way. I know for a fact that my old friend would *want* us to continue playing, and especially want me to continue running the campaign. And I wish I could, I just don't know how. > > What can I do with his character, for instance? All I know is what I can't do. I can't just run him as an NPC. I can't just kill him off behind the scenes. > > I should really give more details of the campaign, but the details aren't the problem. I can work out the details. > > I guess all I'm asking is what would you do in my situation, if it were your campaign? > > Regardless, Mystara has lost a great player this week, me and my gaming group, the worlds we created together, we'll all miss him. And I'll certainly be missing an old friend too. > > Anyway, there you have it. Sorry for burdening the mailing list with this one, but I hope you can help. > > Cheers, > > Neil (aka nemarsde) > > ******************************************************************** > The Other Worlds Homepage: http://www.wizards.com/dnd/OtherWorlds.asp > The Mystara Homepage: http://www.pandius.com > To unsubscribe, send email to LISTSERV@ORACLE.WIZARDS.COM > with UNSUB MYSTARA-L in the body of the message. > > > -- > No virus found in this incoming message. > Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. > Version: 7.0.344 / Virus Database: 267.12.3/141 - Release Date: 10/18/2005 > > ******************************************************************** The Other Worlds Homepage: http://www.wizards.com/dnd/OtherWorlds.asp The Mystara Homepage: http://www.pandius.com To unsubscribe, send email to LISTSERV@ORACLE.WIZARDS.COM with UNSUB MYSTARA-L in the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 18 Oct 2005 20:49:33 -0300 From: "Vinicius R. de Moraes - USP Solar" Subject: Re: Real death in campaign. Help me Dear Neil, first of all receive my deepest feelings. John comes with a good idea and here goes mine. I'd do what the friend would like me to do: keep the campaign. Even more: I'd run his character as he would have. Another idea is to leave this task to one player at a time: Bob runs the character in one session, Zack in the next etc. Hope it helps (more than ever). Vini At 19:04 18/10/2005, you wrote: > I guess I would probably talk to the other players and see what their > feelings would be. You know your gaming group the best and you guys would > best be able to come up with a way to respect the memory of your friend. > > Since you asked what we would do ... my group would probably meet at a bar > near where we usually meet (which is easy for us since we meet in downtown > Manhattan) and we'd hang out and those of us that drink would probably have > a few drinks. Taking a week off from gaming to spend time with the members > of your group that are left isn't a bad thing, and no one would expect you > to jump right back into a campaign. > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Neil Marsden" > To: > Sent: Tuesday, October 18, 2005 5:52 PM > Subject: [MYSTARA] Real death in campaign. Help me > > > > Well, although I get the daily digest and sometimes post on the > > Wizards.COMmunity Mystara Board, none of you know me, but I'm hoping you > > can help me nonetheless. > > > > An old friend of mine, a player in my gaming group, died yesterday. It > > wasn't entirely unexpected, but it's still affected me profoundly. > > > > There are a lot of thoughts and feelings I wish I could share with > > someone/anyone right now, but I'll spare you. ;) > > > > So getting straight to the point, I'm an experienced GM, almost two > > decades, I've dealt with all kinds of problems in my gaming groups, > > dealt with players leaving for all kinds of reasons. None of them have > > ever died on me though. > > > > I've got a gaming session this Saturday, and to be perfectly honest I > > just don't know what to do. I'm going to sit down at the head of the > > table, look left, this player isn't going to be there, and that will > > overshadow everything. > > > > Alright, not making myself too clear. Put it this way. I know for a fact > > that my old friend would *want* us to continue playing, and especially > > want me to continue running the campaign. And I wish I could, I just > > don't know how. > > > > What can I do with his character, for instance? All I know is what I > > can't do. I can't just run him as an NPC. I can't just kill him off > > behind the scenes. > > > > I should really give more details of the campaign, but the details > > aren't the problem. I can work out the details. > > > > I guess all I'm asking is what would you do in my situation, if it were > > your campaign? > > > > Regardless, Mystara has lost a great player this week, me and my gaming > > group, the worlds we created together, we'll all miss him. And I'll > > certainly be missing an old friend too. > > > > Anyway, there you have it. Sorry for burdening the mailing list with > > this one, but I hope you can help. > > > > Cheers, > > > > Neil (aka nemarsde) > > > > ******************************************************************** > > The Other Worlds Homepage: http://www.wizards.com/dnd/OtherWorlds.asp > > The Mystara Homepage: http://www.pandius.com > > To unsubscribe, send email to LISTSERV@ORACLE.WIZARDS.COM > > with UNSUB MYSTARA-L in the body of the message. > > ******************************************************************** > The Other Worlds Homepage: http://www.wizards.com/dnd/OtherWorlds.asp > The Mystara Homepage: http://www.pandius.com > To unsubscribe, send email to LISTSERV@ORACLE.WIZARDS.COM > with UNSUB MYSTARA-L in the body of the message. ******************************************************************** The Other Worlds Homepage: http://www.wizards.com/dnd/OtherWorlds.asp The Mystara Homepage: http://www.pandius.com To unsubscribe, send email to LISTSERV@ORACLE.WIZARDS.COM with UNSUB MYSTARA-L in the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 18 Oct 2005 16:04:54 -0700 From: Joe Kelly Subject: Re: Real death in campaign. Help me My sincerest sympathies Neil.=20 My suggestion is do what your heart tells you. Consult with your group and = see how they feel about it. You could even just get together at the gaming = table for the night and have a night of D&D reminiscing.=20 What happened to me was different. I use to be into wargames. We were at = my friends, and heard a loud bang hit the house. Damn kids hit the house = with a ball. The truth was his dad upstairs had just shot himself. It was = a nightmare from hell that evening. I vividly remember eating pizza and = about to take my turn.=20 A few weeks later when we went over to the house, I looked at the map and = said to my friends, "I don't want to play this game. We can start another, = but I don't want to continue this game." So all we did was pack up the = map, and re set up new forces. I know it sounds weird, but that is what I = had to do to get over it.=20 Well I hope this helps. Take care. JKWolf=20 This e-mail and any attachment(s) are confidential and may be privileged. If you are not the intended recipient please notify me immediately by return e-mail, delete this e-mail and do not copy, use or disclose it. Please advise us if you do not want to receive unencrypted e-mails. ******************************************************************** The Other Worlds Homepage: http://www.wizards.com/dnd/OtherWorlds.asp The Mystara Homepage: http://www.pandius.com To unsubscribe, send email to LISTSERV@ORACLE.WIZARDS.COM with UNSUB MYSTARA-L in the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 18 Oct 2005 19:31:39 -0400 From: Joe Mason Subject: Re: Real death in campaign. Help me Neil Marsden wrote: > An old friend of mine, a player in my gaming group, died yesterday. It > wasn't entirely unexpected, but it's still affected me profoundly. That's pretty rough. A friend of everyone in my group died last year, of a pulmonary embolism, and I got notified while we were actually playing. It was very sudden - I was the only one who suspected anything was up beforehand, since someone I was with had gotten an emergency phone call the night before and rushed off. So when the phone rang the next day and I saw it was them I was expecting bad news of some sort. When I got back to the table I had to cut the DM off to break the news to everyone, which killed that session, needless to say. We spent the rest of the afternoon reminiscing. I hadn't actually realized everyone there knew her, so I got to hear a lot of stories from people that knew her in different perspectives. If I were you, I would skip D&D for the next session, but make sure everyone comes anyway, and hold a wake. Bring board games or something, or roll up throwaway characters and play a one-shot campaign. (GAZ10 is great for that if you have it.) That way everybody'll be together and still hopefully having fun, but you don't have to deal with the effects on your long-term game for a week. Play something light, where it doesn't matter if people lose concentration. Don't shy away from discussing your friend's absence and sharing memories. Then in the following week, you can get back to the regular game, hopefully with a bit more perspective. Of course, your situation's a little different from mine, since you're going into a game after people have already had some time to deal with it, and we were pretty much blindsided. (And the person involved wasn't involved in the game anyway, so there was no question about how to continue the next week.) It's possible your players would prefer to forge ahead, especially if you've already had memorial services and everything. As for how to continue - I'd say let the other player's NPC him for a while, each one playing him for one session, and try to cap it off with a noble death. Or, if you prefer to write the character out earlier, you NPC him for the next session and have him die to save the party. Just be sure the death comes off as a noble sacrifice, and not crass. If you can't work that in well, maybe he could be given a separate mission or decide to go off on his own, and you could occasionally bring the character back for guest appearances. The important thing is to NPC him for one session at least so it's not handled behind-the-scenes - it'll feel more like part of the story that way. I took over for a player who was dropping out once, and the DM decided halfway through the session that he wanted everyone to have their own character instead of playing hand-me-downs, so he had my character killed off in a surprising but very satisfying way (he was a strongman, and got crushed holding walls apart so the rest of the party could escape a trap, which gave me a great opportunity to emote the death). Obviously it's not the same situation again, I'm just mentioning it because I actually remember that bit much better than the replacement character I made, so I don't think anyone would object to a dramatic death scene, even if they're playing the character at the time. Joe ******************************************************************** The Other Worlds Homepage: http://www.wizards.com/dnd/OtherWorlds.asp The Mystara Homepage: http://www.pandius.com To unsubscribe, send email to LISTSERV@ORACLE.WIZARDS.COM with UNSUB MYSTARA-L in the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 19 Oct 2005 09:00:10 +0200 From: Altair IV Subject: Re: Real death in campaign. Help me - For Neil I didn't read the others' answers. I just want to react to your need for help from heart to heart, to imagine myself in your situation and try to understand what I would do. First, I can't do anything to deny I've lost a friend. The emptyness I'm feeling inside goes far beyond the emptyness of a chair in a gaming session... I don't think I can suggest anything against this, and I don't think you're expecting me, or anybody else, to do it... But I have a suggestion on what to do about your Campaign, and his PC... and is very simple: make him an Immortal. Explain to the other palyers, and to the PCs, that he WAS an Immortal from the beginning and that, for some reason, He chose to live a human life again. But now He decided to have it over, to go back where he belongs to... I'm sure you know perfectly what kind of an Immortal you can make him of... You and the others won't have a friend back, that's impossible, and the party has definitely lost an Hero... but your Pantheon will gain a new Individual to last forever... and He would never leave your Campaign That's my feeling Pierluigi alias Altair IV, the Darkstar ******************************************************************** The Other Worlds Homepage: http://www.wizards.com/dnd/OtherWorlds.asp The Mystara Homepage: http://www.pandius.com To unsubscribe, send email to LISTSERV@ORACLE.WIZARDS.COM with UNSUB MYSTARA-L in the body of the message. ------------------------------ End of MYSTARA-L Digest - 14 Oct 2005 to 18 Oct 2005 (#2005-195) ****************************************************************