Subject: MYSTARA-L Digest - 4 May 2006 to 5 May 2006 (#2006-87) From: MYSTARA-L automatic digest system Date: 06/05/2006, 17:00 To: MYSTARA-L@ORACLE.WIZARDS.COM Reply-to: Mystara RPG Discussion There are 18 messages totalling 972 lines in this issue. Topics of the day: 1. Claw (Was: Re: [MYSTARA] Anyone do Red Steel?) (7) 2. Kara-Kara (10) 3. Denagoth Gaz ******************************************************************** The Other Worlds Homepage: http://www.wizards.com/dnd/OtherWorlds.asp The Mystara Homepage: http://www.pandius.com To unsubscribe, send email to LISTSERV@ORACLE.WIZARDS.COM with UNSUB MYSTARA-L in the body of the message. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Fri, 5 May 2006 11:52:01 +0200 From: Giampaolo Agosta Subject: Re: Claw (Was: Re: [MYSTARA] Anyone do Red Steel?) Átila Pires dos Santos ha scritto: > > Interesting. He is an Simbasta Inheritor pirate then =) > Indeed, apparently he don't have an tail (not even an red one, hehe) and > this seen to be very likely. Again, this can't be just coincidence =) > Curiously, Simba means lion in Swahili (Yavdlom major source of names) Simbasta culture, OTOH, is directly based on the Masai. Masai speak a Nilo-Saharian tongue (i.e., of a linguistic group completely unrelated to Swahili or Yoruba, for example). This is quite convenient, since it allows us to consider Nilo-Saharian tongues as originally derived from the language of the Rakastodon Fatalis (the ancestor of Simbasta and other derived Rakasta), and Niger-Kordofanian languages as originally Tanagoro. The third african linguistic group could be reserved for the Karimari (though the words given for their language are also Swahili). > I vote for Kastelios, but this is only personal taste. By the way, Kastelios > and Kastéllion (Crete) under Venice rule, does both have any connection? Uhm, no idea. > I guess the original idea was the association between swashbucklers and > seafarers (both don't use heavy armor, for example). But considering > Vilaverde and Texeiras focus on seafaring, they should have an more > aproprieated Immortal to auxiliate their feats, like Iara/Calithia Starbrow > =) Agreed. > Hope this site help you better > http://www.umbandaracional.com.br/pesqorixas.html > =) Thanks, quite useful. > Again, i'm quite impressed ;) Thanks :) > But i guess Ifá > could easly derivates from Yav, That's exactly what I thought when I saw the "Ifa'" orixa. > I guess Halav is, indeed, the best option, especially considering that the > traladarans are so close. But Ogum is normally seen as an more agressive, > warrior deity, more than the "paladin-like" view traladarans have of Halav. > Something more like Vanya. But this details tends to change in different > cultures, anyway (Mealiden/Milen being an good example) Yes, but Ogum is also synchretized with Saint George, the paladin model! > Other possibilities are Oçanhe = Zirchev, Oxóssi = Faunus and Obaluaê = > Chardastes =) Indeed. Zirchev especially fits quite well. Chardastes OTOH may be a bit far from Obaluae -- who seems more a power of disease than one of healing. Nyx or Hel could also fit as Nana^, perhaps. Bye, GP ******************************************************************** The Other Worlds Homepage: http://www.wizards.com/dnd/OtherWorlds.asp The Mystara Homepage: http://www.pandius.com To unsubscribe, send email to LISTSERV@ORACLE.WIZARDS.COM with UNSUB MYSTARA-L in the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 5 May 2006 11:58:17 +0200 From: Giampaolo Agosta Subject: Re: Claw (Was: Re: [MYSTARA] Anyone do Red Steel?) Joe Kelly ha scritto: > What about Gods from other worlds? Is it possible? Are Immortals just the same as Gods? That's up to the DM. Clearly there are many immortals who share name and portfolio with gods of other worlds. Whether other worlds exist in the same universe/multiverse or not, and if so whether immortals and gods are the same thing is not entirely clarified -- canon source support one or the other choice depending on "local" reasons (i.e., what fits the specific case): AD&D books that refer to Mystaran Immortals treat them as the other powers, and the Northern Reaches gazetteer seems to imply that there is a single norse pantheon in all the *D&D worlds. OTOH, other sources underline a difference between powers and immortals. K:KoA, to make things more complicated, acknowledges the existance of gods from other settings, says that immortals are different, but also that the difference is that immortals do not require worship -- which is not quite true IMO. Bye, GP ******************************************************************** The Other Worlds Homepage: http://www.wizards.com/dnd/OtherWorlds.asp The Mystara Homepage: http://www.pandius.com To unsubscribe, send email to LISTSERV@ORACLE.WIZARDS.COM with UNSUB MYSTARA-L in the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 5 May 2006 13:23:37 +0200 From: Havard Faanes Subject: Kara-Kara Just noticed a post on the MMB saying the Kara-Kara is a racist monster. Do you agree? Any thoughts on these jungle Orcs? Håvard ******************************************************************** The Other Worlds Homepage: http://www.wizards.com/dnd/OtherWorlds.asp The Mystara Homepage: http://www.pandius.com To unsubscribe, send email to LISTSERV@ORACLE.WIZARDS.COM with UNSUB MYSTARA-L in the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 5 May 2006 08:45:11 -0300 From: =?ISO-8859-1?Q?=C1tila_Pires_dos_Santos?= Subject: Re: Claw (Was: Re: [MYSTARA] Anyone do Red Steel?) On 5/5/06, Giampaolo Agosta wrote: > > > Simbasta culture, OTOH, is directly based on the Masai. Masai speak a > Nilo-Saharian tongue (i.e., of a linguistic group completely unrelated > to Swahili or Yoruba, for example). > This is quite convenient, since it allows us to consider Nilo-Saharian > tongues as originally derived from the language of the Rakastodon > Fatalis (the ancestor of Simbasta and other derived Rakasta), and > Niger-Kordofanian languages as originally Tanagoro. Indeed, that makes everything easier =3D) Pehaps the Yavi/Swahili word Simba derivates from Simbasta in Mystara =3D) The third african linguistic group could be reserved for the Karimari > (though the words given for their language are also Swahili). And iorub=E1 as well, like Abeni. Pehaps this names make their way into Ulimwengu through Sheyallia elves? > Yes, but Ogum is also synchretized with Saint George, the paladin model! Hehe, indeed. Considering that Halav cult came with the traladaran influence, thus Ogum/Halav correspondence is known, making his situation very similar to Saint George/Ogum situation =3D) By the way, the Cit-States traladaran worships Petra and Zirchev too? Or just Halav? > Indeed. Zirchev especially fits quite well. Chardastes OTOH may be a bit > far from Obaluae -- who seems more a power of disease than one of healing= . Yes, i was considering only the healing aspect. Then he might be an entropi= c immortal... hm, Thanatos, pehaps? Or pehaps Obalua=EA is indeed Chardastes but, for any reason, Oiob=E1 peopl= e believe that someone that displeases him contracts diseases (on prupose or pehaps because Obalua=EA simply stoped protecting him). This peculiarity mi= ght fall in the same case of Ogum/Halav. By the way, I just noticed that Obalua= =EA "straw hat" resembles an bell... =3D) > Nyx or Hel could also fit as Nana^, perhaps. Good idea. I guess Hell fit better By the way, I just realised i forgot commenting you Korotiku idea. Pehaps Ibeji, god(s) of the beginning/youth (and, pehaps, an creator deity too) an= d things related to children, like jokes and mischiefs. So far: Iemanj=E1 - Calithia Starbrow Ians=E3 - Vanya Oxum - Valerias Xang=F4 - Thor Orunmil=E1-If=E1 - Yav Exu - Masauwu Ogum - Halav O=E7anhe - Zirchev Ox=F3ssi - Faunus Nan=E3 - Hel Ibeji - Korotiku? Obalua=EA -Chardastes/Entropic Immortal? By the way, while trying to translate some Jibar names, I had the idea of make the same we are doing with the iorub=E1 deities (especially considerin= g the name i chose for Calithia among the Verdan: Iara) Iara - Calithia Starbrow (means Mermaid) Tup=E3 - Thor (means Thunder) Jaci - Valerias (means Moon and is the love/passion deity) Guaraci - Ixion (means Sun; another name for U=ED) Jurupari, Abaca=ED and Anhang=E1 - Entropic evil Immortals I posted the other Jibar translations at the WotC Boards =3D) ******************************************************************** The Other Worlds Homepage: http://www.wizards.com/dnd/OtherWorlds.asp The Mystara Homepage: http://www.pandius.com To unsubscribe, send email to LISTSERV@ORACLE.WIZARDS.COM with UNSUB MYSTARA-L in the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 5 May 2006 09:13:36 -0300 From: =?ISO-8859-1?Q?=C1tila_Pires_dos_Santos?= Subject: Re: Kara-Kara On 5/5/06, Havard Faanes wrote: > > Just noticed a post on the MMB saying the Kara-Kara is > a racist monster. > > Do you agree? > Any thoughts on these jungle Orcs? I don't think this as racism, especially because many other cultures have their "humanoid versions" (like the broken lands and savage coast goblinoids). For example, i don't think someone intended to call the french people as "dogs" just because lupin are the majority race in Renardy, or tupi as "monkeys" (pahantons). Pehaps karakara isn't the best comparison, but is not the only one as well... Well, I never thought this as racism, anyway. Just my opinion =3D) ******************************************************************** The Other Worlds Homepage: http://www.wizards.com/dnd/OtherWorlds.asp The Mystara Homepage: http://www.pandius.com To unsubscribe, send email to LISTSERV@ORACLE.WIZARDS.COM with UNSUB MYSTARA-L in the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 5 May 2006 09:53:32 -0300 From: Steven Carter Subject: Re: Kara-Kara Sure it is. But so are most fantasy monsters and creatures. How often doe= s a villain have a British accent? Does _that_ particular characterization o= f a villain mean the British are evil? Are eastern Europeans blood suckers because the stereo-typical vampire is of eastern European origin? I could go on, but one must work to eat. Darnit. On 05/05/06, Havard Faanes wrote: > > Just noticed a post on the MMB saying the Kara-Kara is > a racist monster. > > Do you agree? > Any thoughts on these jungle Orcs? > > H=E5vard > > ******************************************************************** > The Other Worlds Homepage: http://www.wizards.com/dnd/OtherWorlds.asp > The Mystara Homepage: http://www.pandius.com > To unsubscribe, send email to LISTSERV@ORACLE.WIZARDS.COM > with UNSUB MYSTARA-L in the body of the message. > ******************************************************************** The Other Worlds Homepage: http://www.wizards.com/dnd/OtherWorlds.asp The Mystara Homepage: http://www.pandius.com To unsubscribe, send email to LISTSERV@ORACLE.WIZARDS.COM with UNSUB MYSTARA-L in the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 5 May 2006 10:22:48 -0300 From: Steven Carter Subject: Re: Kara-Kara =C1tila said it a lot better than I did. On 05/05/06, =C1tila Pires dos Santos wrote: > I don't think this as racism, especially because many other cultures have > their "humanoid versions" (like the broken lands and savage coast > goblinoids). For example, i don't think someone intended to call the fren= ch > people as "dogs" just because lupin are the majority race in Renardy, or > tupi as "monkeys" (pahantons). Pehaps karakara isn't the best comparison, > but is not the only one as well... Well, I never thought this as racism, > anyway. Just my opinion =3D) ******************************************************************** The Other Worlds Homepage: http://www.wizards.com/dnd/OtherWorlds.asp The Mystara Homepage: http://www.pandius.com To unsubscribe, send email to LISTSERV@ORACLE.WIZARDS.COM with UNSUB MYSTARA-L in the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 5 May 2006 18:11:40 +0200 From: Giampaolo Agosta Subject: Re: Claw (Was: Re: [MYSTARA] Anyone do Red Steel?) Átila Pires dos Santos ha scritto: > > And iorubá as well, like Abeni. Pehaps this names make their way into > Ulimwengu through Sheyallia elves? Possible. Or even through simple interaction with their Yavi neighbours. > Hehe, indeed. Considering that Halav cult came with the traladaran > influence, thus Ogum/Halav correspondence is known, making his situation > very similar to Saint George/Ogum situation =) Fine :) > By the way, the Cit-States traladaran worships Petra and Zirchev too? Or > just Halav? Only Halav is mentioned. I suppose these people left Traladara due to religious differences over the relative importance of Halav w.r.t. Zirchev and Petra. Probably they acknowledge the two, but in a lesser position. > Yes, i was considering only the healing aspect. Then he might be an entropic > immortal... hm, Thanatos, pehaps? > Or pehaps Obaluaê is indeed Chardastes but, for any reason, Oiobá people > believe that someone that displeases him contracts diseases (on prupose or > pehaps because Obaluaê simply stoped protecting him). This peculiarity might > fall in the same case of Ogum/Halav. By the way, I just noticed that Obaluaê > "straw hat" resembles an bell... =) Or, he could be a pair of opposed immortals -- probably Chardastes and a minor entropic (Leptar, Jammudaru or Yagrai). > By the way, I just realised i forgot commenting you Korotiku idea. Pehaps > Ibeji, god(s) of the beginning/youth (and, pehaps, an creator deity too) and > things related to children, like jokes and mischiefs. Also, being two gods makes for a total of eight limbs ;) > By the way, while trying to translate some Jibar names, I had the idea of > make the same we are doing with the iorubá deities (especially considering > the name i chose for Calithia among the Verdan: Iara) > > Iara - Calithia Starbrow (means Mermaid) > Tupã - Thor (means Thunder) > Jaci - Valerias (means Moon and is the love/passion deity) > Guaraci - Ixion (means Sun; another name for Uí) > Jurupari, Abacaí and Anhangá - Entropic evil Immortals These can be useful as well, especially for phanaton communities that have been in contact with other ciilizations. Bye, GP ******************************************************************** The Other Worlds Homepage: http://www.wizards.com/dnd/OtherWorlds.asp The Mystara Homepage: http://www.pandius.com To unsubscribe, send email to LISTSERV@ORACLE.WIZARDS.COM with UNSUB MYSTARA-L in the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 6 May 2006 02:06:25 +0900 From: Thorfinn Tait Subject: Re: Kara-Kara > I don't think this as racism, especially because many other cultures have their "humanoid versions" (like the broken lands and savage coast goblinoids). For example, i don't think someone intended to call the french people as "dogs" just because lupin are the majority race in Renardy, or tupi as "monkeys" (pahantons). Pehaps karakara isn't the best comparison, but is not the only one as well... Well, I never thought this as racism, anyway. Just my opinion =) I wondered about that post too. It never occurred to me that there was anything offensive about the kara-kara - other than the fact that they are orcish, and thus offensive by nature. I don't think people should go looking for prejudice and racism in old supplements. It seems to me that the authors of most of Mystara's books were rather open-minded people, and I don't believe they would deliberately have made anything racist or offensive. The kara-kara in particular come from a British-made module, and it does not necessarily make sense to apply North American racial stereotypes to it. On the other hand, if someone was actually offended by the design of the kara-kara, that would be a slightly different issue. But as Atila said above, I don't see why the kara-kara should be singled out. Mystara has the potential to offend a great many different cultures, due to the historical/real world sources for so much of the setting. Should I be offended at the not-especially-flattering portrayal of the Scots in Glantri's Principality of Klantyre? I can certainly see how a strong argument could be made linking the stereotypical miserly nature of Scottish people with the fact that the leader of the Scots is a power-hungry lich... But I'm not offended, because it's just a game. I don't read meanings - which may or may not have been intended by the authors - into all the little details. In the end, it's how the players read things that matters. If your group is offended by something, change it or delete it entirely from your campaign. But in our international community, no one should expect others to do the same. When it comes down to it, things are not inherently racist, because racism requires cultural context, and that is something that we do not all share. I'm interested to hear what everyone else thinks about this. Thorf ******************************************************************** The Other Worlds Homepage: http://www.wizards.com/dnd/OtherWorlds.asp The Mystara Homepage: http://www.pandius.com To unsubscribe, send email to LISTSERV@ORACLE.WIZARDS.COM with UNSUB MYSTARA-L in the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 5 May 2006 10:18:00 -0700 From: Joe Kelly Subject: Re: Kara-Kara I totally agree with you Thorf. We are talking about another fantasy after = all. Which has none of the (multiple) injustices our world has. Which in = turn evoked alot of those issues. But this is fantasy, and lets address it = as such. The Key to this list is how to mash the fantasy societies = together and make them coexist. =20 Joe Kelly Office Services Clerk DAVIS & COMPANY LLP Suite 2800, Park Place 666 Burrard Street, Vancouver, B.C. V6C 2Z7 Phone 604.643.6365 >>> thorf@CHOKAI.NE.JP 05/05/06 10:06am >>> > I don't think this as racism, especially because many other=20 > cultures have their "humanoid versions" (like the broken=20 > lands and savage coast goblinoids). For example, i don't=20 > think someone intended to call the french people as "dogs"=20 > just because lupin are the majority race in Renardy, or tupi=20 > as "monkeys" (pahantons). Pehaps karakara isn't the best=20 > comparison, but is not the only one as well... Well, I never=20 > thought this as racism, anyway. Just my opinion =3D) I wondered about that post too. It never occurred to me that there was anything offensive about the kara-kara - other than the fact that they are orcish, and thus offensive by nature. I don't think people should go looking for prejudice and racism in old supplements. It seems to me that the authors of most of Mystara's books were rather open-minded people, and I don't believe they would deliberately= have made anything racist or offensive. The kara-kara in particular come from a British-made module, and it does not necessarily make sense to = apply North American racial stereotypes to it. On the other hand, if someone was actually offended by the design of the kara-kara, that would be a slightly different issue. But as Atila said above, I don't see why the kara-kara should be singled out. Mystara has = the potential to offend a great many different cultures, due to the historical/real world sources for so much of the setting. Should I be offended at the not-especially-flattering portrayal of the Scots in Glantri's Principality of Klantyre? I can certainly see how a strong argument could be made linking the stereotypical miserly nature of = Scottish people with the fact that the leader of the Scots is a power-hungry = lich... But I'm not offended, because it's just a game. I don't read meanings - which may or may not have been intended by the authors - into all the = little details. In the end, it's how the players read things that matters. If your group = is offended by something, change it or delete it entirely from your campaign. But in our international community, no one should expect others to do the same. When it comes down to it, things are not inherently racist, because racism requires cultural context, and that is something that we do not all share. I'm interested to hear what everyone else thinks about this. Thorf ******************************************************************** The Other Worlds Homepage: http://www.wizards.com/dnd/OtherWorlds.asp=20 The Mystara Homepage: http://www.pandius.com=20 To unsubscribe, send email to LISTSERV@ORACLE.WIZARDS.COM=20 with UNSUB MYSTARA-L in the body of the message. This e-mail and any attachment(s) are confidential and may be privileged. If you are not the intended recipient please notify me immediately by return e-mail, delete this e-mail and do not copy, use or disclose it. Please advise us if you do not want to receive unencrypted e-mails. ******************************************************************** The Other Worlds Homepage: http://www.wizards.com/dnd/OtherWorlds.asp The Mystara Homepage: http://www.pandius.com To unsubscribe, send email to LISTSERV@ORACLE.WIZARDS.COM with UNSUB MYSTARA-L in the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 6 May 2006 02:29:13 +0900 From: Thorfinn Tait Subject: Re: Kara-Kara > I totally agree with you Thorf. We are talking about another fantasy after all. Which has none of the (multiple) injustices our world has. Which in turn evoked alot of those issues. But this is fantasy, and lets address it as such. The Key to this list is how to mash the fantasy societies together and make them coexist. Actually, something I have been thinking about recently is the nature of orcs and other humanoids in our games. Monsters are quite easy to explain, because they are like dangerous animals, and so most encounters become simple battles for survival. But if you think about the humanoids, often it's a far muddier situation. Human and demihuman societies don't just condone but in fact outright encourage mass slaughter of humanoids. This is explained away by saying that the humanoids are inherently evil. But at the same time, the good-hearted orc is also quite a strong stereotype as a surprising NPC. I can see now quite clearly why Bruce Heard may have decided to treat the humanoid nations with a healthy dose of humour. Really, any criticism of the kara-kara as a racist depiction should backtrack and examine the extreme prejudices inherent in almost all fantasy worlds. My conclusion? The same as before: it's just a game. IMC orcs and other humanoids are savage, murderous, and yes, intrinsically evil. The occasional "good orc" is an aberration of nature, and he will either be persecuted, killed, or driven away by his fellow humanoids. Any potential sympathy with the humanoid plight will be quickly dispelled when they next come raiding. Still, it's interesting to think about, because it took me many years to even notice the strangeness of our fantasy worlds. ^^;> I guess my suspension of disbelief is just too good - kinda the exact opposite of the bad reputation D&D used to have, wherein people would "lose touch with reality" and other such nonsense. Thorf ******************************************************************** The Other Worlds Homepage: http://www.wizards.com/dnd/OtherWorlds.asp The Mystara Homepage: http://www.pandius.com To unsubscribe, send email to LISTSERV@ORACLE.WIZARDS.COM with UNSUB MYSTARA-L in the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 5 May 2006 10:33:27 -0700 From: Joe Kelly Subject: Re: Claw (Was: Re: [MYSTARA] Anyone do Red Steel?) For those who are not familiar with the Diomin: State of the Nations book. = The Gadianti (an evil race of Rakasta) here is a few details.. "The High Priestess rules with her advisors. She is the Voice of Akish. The Gadianti may worship who they like but ALL must pay lip service to The = Mother. The Voice of the Akish, Ahnihtaaz, is the heart of vengeance and the hand = of pain. She is the supreme rule of law, delegating all that she sees fit = in accordance with the will of Akish. The Bel Merodach The Bel Merodach commonly known to outsiders as the Gadianti Robbers, are = a close-kept, nefarious and fiercely devout sect of killers, spies, and = thieves. They are the secret police of the Gadianti. Their goal is the = furthering of the will of Akish, by any means. Many think the Bel Merodach = are the true power of the Gadianti, but no one would say as much aloud = without incurring their wrath. a Robber who hears someone say anything in = that vein would kill them in an instant. While the Bel Merodach do in fact have much influence in Gadianti = leadership, they know that the will of the Voice is the will of the = Mother, and rarely, if ever, question it. They work to serve her ends as = much as they serve their own, if not more so. But mostly and above all = they serve the will of Akish.=20 So now my in game question is this: How would the Monarch of Bellayne deal with such a church? Namely Queen = Catherine? Would she tolerate it? Encourage it? or destroy it? Not enough = info about Bellayne to really come to a conclusion. Any help would be = appreciated.=20 Joe Joe Kelly Office Services Clerk DAVIS & COMPANY LLP Suite 2800, Park Place 666 Burrard Street, Vancouver, B.C. V6C 2Z7 Phone 604.643.6365 This e-mail and any attachment(s) are confidential and may be privileged. If you are not the intended recipient please notify me immediately by return e-mail, delete this e-mail and do not copy, use or disclose it. Please advise us if you do not want to receive unencrypted e-mails. ******************************************************************** The Other Worlds Homepage: http://www.wizards.com/dnd/OtherWorlds.asp The Mystara Homepage: http://www.pandius.com To unsubscribe, send email to LISTSERV@ORACLE.WIZARDS.COM with UNSUB MYSTARA-L in the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 5 May 2006 16:17:24 -0400 From: Angelo Bertolli Subject: Re: Kara-Kara Havard Faanes wrote: > Just noticed a post on the MMB saying the Kara-Kara is > a racist monster. > > Do you agree? > Any thoughts on these jungle Orcs? > > No, I don't agree. All I can do is roll my eyes when I hear this. This is why they had to waste one paragraph in the Rules Cyclopedia about using the pronoun "he" and how they didn't mean it to be sexist. (Oh, and of course then they proceed to use "she" anyway.) ******************************************************************** The Other Worlds Homepage: http://www.wizards.com/dnd/OtherWorlds.asp The Mystara Homepage: http://www.pandius.com To unsubscribe, send email to LISTSERV@ORACLE.WIZARDS.COM with UNSUB MYSTARA-L in the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 5 May 2006 17:58:29 -0300 From: =?ISO-8859-1?Q?=C1tila_Pires_dos_Santos?= Subject: Re: Kara-Kara Should I fell offended because my name is =C1tila and Yagrai mortal name wa= s Akilla? =3D) ******************************************************************** The Other Worlds Homepage: http://www.wizards.com/dnd/OtherWorlds.asp The Mystara Homepage: http://www.pandius.com To unsubscribe, send email to LISTSERV@ORACLE.WIZARDS.COM with UNSUB MYSTARA-L in the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 5 May 2006 18:27:52 -0300 From: =?ISO-8859-1?Q?=C1tila_Pires_dos_Santos?= Subject: Re: Claw (Was: Re: [MYSTARA] Anyone do Red Steel?) On 5/5/06, Giampaolo Agosta wrote: > > > Possible. Or even through simple interaction with their Yavi neighbours. Unfortunally, they are not very fond of interactions > Only Halav is mentioned. I suppose these people left Traladara due to > religious differences over the relative importance of Halav w.r.t. > Zirchev and Petra. Probably they acknowledge the two, but in a lesser > position. In my campaign, that's exactly the case. Another possibility is that used in Betrayal in Antara (another game that makes m remind of Mystara: renaissance culture, no gunpowder, and lupins ar= e there!), they think Halav, Petra and Zirchev are the "three faces" of one same Immortal (in Antara, the names are Kor, Senadrim and Henne; Kor and Senadrim are algost exactly like Halav and Petra, while Henne is more a child-like deity) Or this traladarans worshipped the same Immortals that are now worshipped i= n Bellayne (pehaps an early thyatian influence in Traladara?) but, for some reason, they forgot this new Immortals and now worships their original patrons. Or they never stopped worshipping Vanya, Tarastia, Calithia... > Or, he could be a pair of opposed immortals -- probably Chardastes and a > minor entropic (Leptar, Jammudaru or Yagrai). Pehaps Obalua=EA is Chardastes and Omolu (the "old version" of Obalua=EA) i= s one of this sadistic Immortals =3D) Which one do you prefer? =3D) > Also, being two gods makes for a total of eight limbs ;) Hehe, indeed =3D) > These can be useful as well, especially for phanaton communities that > have been in contact with other ciilizations. Contact with the verdans (through Sumar=E1, pehaps) could answer Calithia, Thor and Valerias =3D) By the way, I guess verdans probably would worship Calithia even before having contact with the phanatons or the oiob=E1 people. Then she should ha= ve an verdan name... Following the names that other Guardianos Immortals have, she could be called The Mairmaid/A Sereia. Funny, I just realised the entropic immortals you mentioned above sound lik= e this tupi deities. Pehaps Jurupari is Jammudaru, Yagrai is Abaca=ED and Anhang=E1 is Leptar? =3D) ******************************************************************** The Other Worlds Homepage: http://www.wizards.com/dnd/OtherWorlds.asp The Mystara Homepage: http://www.pandius.com To unsubscribe, send email to LISTSERV@ORACLE.WIZARDS.COM with UNSUB MYSTARA-L in the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 5 May 2006 17:36:05 -0400 From: Angelo Bertolli Subject: Re: Kara-Kara Átila Pires dos Santos wrote: > Should I fell offended because my name is Átila and Yagrai mortal name was > Akilla? =) Only if you can make money or stir up trouble with it ;) ******************************************************************** The Other Worlds Homepage: http://www.wizards.com/dnd/OtherWorlds.asp The Mystara Homepage: http://www.pandius.com To unsubscribe, send email to LISTSERV@ORACLE.WIZARDS.COM with UNSUB MYSTARA-L in the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 5 May 2006 18:40:26 -0300 From: =?ISO-8859-1?Q?=C1tila_Pires_dos_Santos?= Subject: Re: Claw (Was: Re: [MYSTARA] Anyone do Red Steel?) On 5/5/06, Joe Kelly wrote: > > For those who are not familiar with the Diomin: State of the Nations book= . > The Gadianti (an evil race of Rakasta) here is a few details.. > > "The High Priestess rules with her advisors. She is the Voice of Akish. > The Gadianti may worship who they like but ALL must pay lip service to Th= e > Mother. > The Voice of the Akish, Ahnihtaaz, is the heart of vengeance and the hand > of pain. She is the supreme rule of law, delegating all that she sees fit= in > accordance with the will of Akish. > > The Bel Merodach > > The Bel Merodach commonly known to outsiders as the Gadianti Robbers, are > a close-kept, nefarious and fiercely devout sect of killers, spies, and > thieves. They are the secret police of the Gadianti. Their goal is the > furthering of the will of Akish, by any means. Many think the Bel Merodac= h > are the true power of the Gadianti, but no one would say as much aloud > without incurring their wrath. a Robber who hears someone say anything in > that vein would kill them in an instant. > > While the Bel Merodach do in fact have much influence in Gadianti > leadership, they know that the will of the Voice is the will of the Moth= er, > and rarely, if ever, question it. They work to serve her ends as much as > they serve their own, if not more so. But mostly and above all they serve > the will of Akish. > > So now my in game question is this: > > How would the Monarch of Bellayne deal with such a church? Namely Queen > Catherine? Would she tolerate it? Encourage it? or destroy it? Not enough > info about Bellayne to really come to a conclusion. Any help would be > appreciated. I guess it depends how influent is The Mother church. If a minor sect, it could be outlawed and persecuted. If an major church, this could even lead to an "30 Years War" with the already established cults/Bellayne Church. If the Bellayne offitial church, Catherine would have to deal carefully with it, or trying to rule "together" with the church, or plotting against it in order to become the absolutist monarch of Bellayne. Just some ideas =3D) ******************************************************************** The Other Worlds Homepage: http://www.wizards.com/dnd/OtherWorlds.asp The Mystara Homepage: http://www.pandius.com To unsubscribe, send email to LISTSERV@ORACLE.WIZARDS.COM with UNSUB MYSTARA-L in the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 5 May 2006 22:14:44 -0400 From: shawn stanley Subject: Re: Denagoth Gaz If the editor wants me to host it then I'll be more than happy to definitely, but I don't put things like this - ie things that aren't put out onto open areas like this list or the Message Board without permission from the creator. Space however isn't an issue for me. At 03:42 PM 3/05/2006, you wrote: > Has anyone else confirmed that they will host it after that (like Shawn). I > could do for a bit, but I'm not sure about bandwidth (space isn't a problem > atm). > > -----Original Message----- > From: Mystara RPG Discussion [mailto:MYSTARA-L@ORACLE.WIZARDS.COM] On Behalf > Of Gary Davies > Sent: 03 May 2006 09:38 > To: MYSTARA-L@ORACLE.WIZARDS.COM > Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] Denagoth Gaz > > The direct link is http://home.ec.rr.com/drjpostings/Wendar.zip, but Old > Dawg doesn't have much space so it will be taken down when the next Gaz is > released - end of June hopefully. > > Regards > Gary > > ---------------------------------------- > > Date: Wed, 3 May 2006 00:49:12 -0400 > > From: WIKANWAY@JETBROADBAND.COM > > Subject: [MYSTARA] Denagoth Gaz > > To: MYSTARA-L@ORACLE.WIZARDS.COM > > > > I was looking thru the Denagoth Gaz and it mentioned something about the > Realms of Wendar Gaz does someone have the link I could get this from? > > > > ******************************************************************** > > The Other Worlds Homepage: http://www.wizards.com/dnd/OtherWorlds.asp > > The Mystara Homepage: http://www.pandius.com To unsubscribe, send > > email to LISTSERV@ORACLE.WIZARDS.COM with UNSUB MYSTARA-L in the body > > of the message. > > _________________________________________________________________ > Express yourself instantly with MSN Messenger! Download today it's FREE! > http://messenger.msn.click-url.com/go/onm00200471ave/direct/01/ > ******************************************************************** > The Other Worlds Homepage: http://www.wizards.com/dnd/OtherWorlds.asp > The Mystara Homepage: http://www.pandius.com To unsubscribe, send email to > LISTSERV@ORACLE.WIZARDS.COM with UNSUB MYSTARA-L in the body of the message. > > ******************************************************************** > The Other Worlds Homepage: http://www.wizards.com/dnd/OtherWorlds.asp > The Mystara Homepage: http://www.pandius.com > To unsubscribe, send email to LISTSERV@ORACLE.WIZARDS.COM > with UNSUB MYSTARA-L in the body of the message. ******************************************************************** The Other Worlds Homepage: http://www.wizards.com/dnd/OtherWorlds.asp The Mystara Homepage: http://www.pandius.com To unsubscribe, send email to LISTSERV@ORACLE.WIZARDS.COM with UNSUB MYSTARA-L in the body of the message. ------------------------------ End of MYSTARA-L Digest - 4 May 2006 to 5 May 2006 (#2006-87) *************************************************************