Subject: MYSTARA-L Digest - 30 Apr 2008 to 1 May 2008 (#2008-18) From: MYSTARA-L automatic digest system Date: 02/05/2008, 17:00 To: MYSTARA-L@ORACLE.WIZARDS.COM Reply-to: Mystara RPG Discussion There are 3 messages totalling 271 lines in this issue. Topics of the day: 1. Mystaran Dwarves in 3e - movement (3) ******************************************************************** The Other Worlds Homepage: http://www.wizards.com/dnd/OtherWorlds.asp The Mystara Homepage: http://www.pandius.com To unsubscribe, send email to LISTSERV@ORACLE.WIZARDS.COM with UNSUB MYSTARA-L in the body of the message. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Fri, 2 May 2008 08:07:08 +1200 From: Chris Furneaux Subject: Re: Mystaran Dwarves in 3e - movement Well there are several very good reasons that Dwarves could have a number of advantages in wearing heavy armour then humans and elves. I can't comment on the actual rules as I haven't read them but I would postulate that Dwarves could have the following advantages to explain such a rule: 1st - Armour Weight - they are smaller while generally having similar or greater strength then a human so the armour is generally smaller therefore lighter then man sized armour. This means that they could use heavier armour then a human can because of the decreased weight from reduced size. 2nd - Natural range of motion - being naturally more bulky then an average man they probably have a reduced range of movement in comparison, but as they are born this way they more capable of working with their natural range of movement and so it does not pose a hindrance to them. This may actually be beneficial to them as the range of movement that would be lost by wearing heavy armour never existed and so it poses no hindrance to them. 3rd - Armoured Culture - Dwarven society tends to be well armoured in comparison to other cultures and armour is worn more frequently throughout their lives. Dwarves are more used to wearing armour then other races tend to be and so they know how to fit it so it doesn't hinder them and are used to wearing it in more situations such that it doesn't get in the way. Their muscles also do not tire because they are so used to wearing armour. 4th - Natural Endurance - Dwarven muscles may grow and age differently from other races and cope with weight and work over long periods better then those of other races. Where human muscles tire and get sore from extended use dwarven muscle may be designed to cope with continuous use and so having heavy weight of heavy armour over long periods does not detriment them as it would a human or similar. Is this of any help? > It is thought that the muscle mass of a dwarf is > "stronger" and more "dense" then the taller races. In > 2end edition dwarves of all types still hade to deal > with encumberance (if used) from armor. The same for > 1st edition. In 3.0/3.5 dwarves dont have a problem > using the heavy armors when it comes to encumberance > (i belive anayway). > > --- Greg Weatherup wrote: > >> Greetings all! >> An interesting and specific question came up in >> my pbem game that I >> am unsure about and I wondered what others thought. >> In standard 3.5e rules, Dwarves do not suffer from >> encumebrance >> penalties from neither armor nor gear weight. But >> every Mystara 3e >> conversion/adaptation I have seen (except for one >> tangential one) >> directly or indirectly seems to omit this. I don't >> know much about >> Dwarves nor about Mystaran Dwarves, but I don't >> recall any such >> thing in previous versions of D&D. Since I don't >> know much about them so I have been relying solely >> on the conversions of others for dwarves. Is there >> anything about >> classic-dwarves or about Mystaran-Dwarves whereby >> they ought to >> have such a racial ability? Your opinions/thoughts >> please. >> Thank you, >> (I hope this doesn't provoke another flame war about >> fitting a >> rules to the setting vs. fitting a setting to a >> ruleset, as I am >> only looking at this one very specific thing) >> Greg W. >> -- >> Want an e-mail address like mine? >> Get a free e-mail account today at www.mail.com! > ******************************************************************** >> The Other Worlds Homepage: >> http://www.wizards.com/dnd/OtherWorlds.asp >> The Mystara Homepage: http://www.pandius.com >> To unsubscribe, send email to >> LISTSERV@ORACLE.WIZARDS.COM >> with UNSUB MYSTARA-L in the body of the message. > > > "Happy Hunting!" > > > ____________________________________________________________________________________ > Be a better friend, newshound, and > know-it-all with Yahoo! Mobile. Try it now. > http://mobile.yahoo.com/;_ylt=Ahu06i62sR8HDtDypao8Wcj9tAcJ > > ******************************************************************** The Other Worlds Homepage: http://www.wizards.com/dnd/OtherWorlds.asp The Mystara Homepage: http://www.pandius.com > To unsubscribe, send email to LISTSERV@ORACLE.WIZARDS.COM > with UNSUB MYSTARA-L in the body of the message. > ******************************************************************** The Other Worlds Homepage: http://www.wizards.com/dnd/OtherWorlds.asp The Mystara Homepage: http://www.pandius.com To unsubscribe, send email to LISTSERV@ORACLE.WIZARDS.COM with UNSUB MYSTARA-L in the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 1 May 2008 19:08:27 -0700 From: Boonedale Subject: Re: Mystaran Dwarves in 3e - movement --- Chris Furneaux wrote: > Well there are several very good reasons that > Dwarves could have a number > of advantages in wearing heavy armour then humans > and elves. > > I can't comment on the actual rules as I haven't > read them but I would > postulate that Dwarves could have the following > advantages to explain such > a rule: > > 1st - Armour Weight - they are smaller while > generally having similar or > greater strength then a human so the armour is > generally smaller therefore > lighter then man sized armour. > This means that they could use heavier armour then a > human can because of > the decreased weight from reduced size. In 1st edition armor thickness was not something that was talked about, however in 2end edition there is a set of Dwarvish Platemail that has the same basic non-magical stats as human plate mail +1 for a total AC of -1. The reason for the AC is that the pieces that make up the armor is twice as thick as a human sized set of platemail armor. Now in 3.0/3.5 the Races of Stone has dwarf racial armors that are of the same mindset, thick armor plates that the dwarf can don do to thicker and more dense muscle mass. > > 2nd - Natural range of motion - being naturally more > bulky then an average > man they probably have a reduced range of movement > in comparison, but as > they are born this way they more capable of working > with their natural > range of movement and so it does not pose a > hindrance to them. This may > actually be beneficial to them as the range of > movement that would be lost > by wearing heavy armour never existed and so it > poses no hindrance to > them. This is used in 2end edition as a excuse for the dwarves using heavy armor. Im not sure if its used in 3.0/3.5 or not. > > 3rd - Armoured Culture - Dwarven society tends to be > well armoured in > comparison to other cultures and armour is worn more > frequently throughout > their lives. Dwarves are more used to wearing armour > then other races tend > to be and so they know how to fit it so it doesn't > hinder them and are > used to wearing it in more situations such that it > doesn't get in the way. > Their muscles also do not tire because they are so > used to wearing armour. I dont know if this is used in the game but it makes sence because dwarves are almost always being attacked from other races that want the same living space in the hills, mountains and underdark (in some cases). > > 4th - Natural Endurance - Dwarven muscles may grow > and age differently > from other races and cope with weight and work over > long periods better > then those of other races. Where human muscles tire > and get sore from > extended use dwarven muscle may be designed to cope > with continuous use > and so having heavy weight of heavy armour over long > periods does not > detriment them as it would a human or similar. This works prity well with 2end edition and 3.0/3.5 edition to explane why /how the dwarves have "thicker" and more "dense" muscle mass. "Happy Hunting!" ____________________________________________________________________________________ Be a better friend, newshound, and know-it-all with Yahoo! Mobile. Try it now. http://mobile.yahoo.com/;_ylt=Ahu06i62sR8HDtDypao8Wcj9tAcJ ******************************************************************** The Other Worlds Homepage: http://www.wizards.com/dnd/OtherWorlds.asp The Mystara Homepage: http://www.pandius.com To unsubscribe, send email to LISTSERV@ORACLE.WIZARDS.COM with UNSUB MYSTARA-L in the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 1 May 2008 19:18:08 -0700 From: Dave Keyser Subject: Re: Mystaran Dwarves in 3e - movement In Mystara, under Rules Cyclopedia, dwarves did not have a slower movement rate than other characters. They had a walking speed of 12 like everyone else. On 4/30/08, Andrew Theisen wrote: > > Nothing that I can recall in any previous editions really hints to this > encumbrance ignoring ability of dwarves- it's really just something that 3.5 > threw in to account for the slower speed of dwarves and not wanting to > hinder them unduly with additional encumbrance effects of heavy armor. > > It's something that sort of goes with the notion that dwarves are stocky, > sturdy and determined creatures, so thematically it kind of fits. > > As to extant Mystara dwarf conversions that omit this bit, I'd assume it > has to do more with the majority of said conversions having not been updated > since 3.5 came out than anything else. The encumbrance thing wasn't a part > of the original 3.0 rules either. > > > > ******************************************************************** > The Other Worlds Homepage: http://www.wizards.com/dnd/OtherWorlds.asp > The Mystara Homepage: http://www.pandius.com > To unsubscribe, send email to LISTSERV@ORACLE.WIZARDS.COM > with UNSUB MYSTARA-L in the body of the message. > ******************************************************************** The Other Worlds Homepage: http://www.wizards.com/dnd/OtherWorlds.asp The Mystara Homepage: http://www.pandius.com To unsubscribe, send email to LISTSERV@ORACLE.WIZARDS.COM with UNSUB MYSTARA-L in the body of the message. ------------------------------ End of MYSTARA-L Digest - 30 Apr 2008 to 1 May 2008 (#2008-18) **************************************************************