mystara-digest Thursday, June 4 1998 Volume 1997 : Number 386 Mystara is a trademark of TSR Inc. All Rights Reserved. The following topics are covered in this digest: [MYSTARA] - Copyright matters Re: [MYSTARA] - Almanac/Glantri Re: [MYSTARA] - Gender in Gaming Re: [MYSTARA] - Gazetteers vs. boxed sets [MYSTARA] - Writer's Workshop? [MYSTARA] - Re: Sylvan Realm Re: [MYSTARA] - Almanac/Glantri Re: [MYSTARA] - Almanac/Glantri Re: [MYSTARA] - Almanac/Glantri Re: [MYSTARA] - Thermodynamic Universe? Re: [MYSTARA] - Almanac/Glantri [MYSTARA] - Mystaran Birthright PBEM Re: [MYSTARA] - Re: Sylvan Realm Re: [MYSTARA] - Almanac/Glantri Re: [MYSTARA] - Almanac/Glantri Re: [MYSTARA] - Almanac/Glantri Re: [MYSTARA] - AD&D Gods and Immortals Re: [MYSTARA] - Why the Council of Alphatia is reasonable Re: [MYSTARA] - Sylvan Realm Re: [MYSTARA] - [MYSTARA] Those Immortal Servants (Was: The Alphatian Council) Re: [MYSTARA] - The Alphatian Council and FR Re: [MYSTARA] - Almanac/Glantri Re: [MYSTARA] - Almanac/Glantri ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Thu, 4 Jun 1998 03:45:37 -0400 (EDT) From: Pierre Savoie Subject: [MYSTARA] - Copyright matters >Date: Wed, 03 Jun 1998 14:04:43 -0700 >From: "Jenni A. M. Merrifield" Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Strictness of Copyright >Also, do you know when Five Rings become a subsidiary of WotC? I have no idea if they even did become a subsidiary. >This also makes me wonder about how far the concept of 'derivative works' actually go. I've been told that the author of new work retains some copyright, but perhaps not... I've sent some email off to someone who I am generally of the camp that we must exercise caution. This crowd obviously looks like it wants to get creative, with a massive flow of ideas concerning Mystara. But a lot of unsubstantiated legal opinions are floating around too. Law is a deliberately convoluted field, because lawyers want to self-promote their field and make themselves indispensable. But we reach the point where the ordinary person no longer has a handle on what is legally expected of him, so the whole enterprise is defeated. I'd want to see real legal opinions by real lawyers here. Maybe what we need is a union of creative gamers to pass the hat and collect the funds and actually test TSR's claims over derived works. They could make anything they post to a newsgroup (c) The Union of Creative Gamers, which would be a properly incorporated entity yet have the express intent of returning copyright back to the author (as the SHADIS magazine does, six months after publication). Individuals can be picked off at TSR's leisure, but a collective, even a corporate entity supported by donations and having at least a million dollars for a war-chest, can then pick a good test- case and run with it. >TSR does have a legal right to do that of course. The D&D and AD&D worlds are, after all, under their copyright. Of course, as you point out, their requirement made SHADIS more varied and interesting, and perhaps hurt TSR to some degree? On the other hand, TSR may be correct in feeling that restricting TSR related articles only to TSR published magazines will be more profitable for them in the long run. (And, as has been mentioned before, they ARE a corporation so making money is always going to be an important objective) I used to belong to the RPGA, and over the years I am amused at their ads. Years ago it used to be "join over 10,000 gamers". Then it was "join over 8,000 gamers", and now an RPGA ad in SHADIS (for TSR will do ads in SHADIS) says "over 5,000 gamers". I *cannot say* what reasons exactly caused the steady drop in RPGA membership, but Princess Leia's line comes up, something about, "The more you tighten your grip, Darth Vader, the more worlds will slip between your fingers." Also, gamers like organizations which are actually gamers, not increasingly corporate entities with heads who have never even gamed. I went to Gen Con '89 (the only time I sprang for the trip), and it was the fun of meeting the Chaosium Inc. people and dipping your hand in their vat of "Cthulhoid slime" to get a prize. Boy they had fun with our heads on that one, for the goop did not stick to your hand -- except on Sunday the last day, to surprise us (they said "sorry, it mutated.") Or meeting up with a certain ex-TSR employee who had converted to the Light Side of the Force in the upstairs bar, or meeting a Steve Jackson Games employee who spoke the same rare language I do (Esperanto). By comparison, the big TSR castle in the middle was nothing but a shop, with clerks but that's it, but that could just be at the hour I checked it out. This year, Steve Jackson Games is not going, and R.Talsorian is not going either. Chaosium will swallow the doubled table fees and go. - ---Pierre Savoie (ab966@torfree.net) *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 4 Jun 1998 08:43:49 +0100 From: "Rob" Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Almanac/Glantri >>I presume that this concerns a net almanac that i havent got, but Ill aaadd my tuppence anyway. Why wouldnt any mage at this power level have a Wish on a scroll for just such an occasion? If a pc canhave such then its mandatory for any 3D NPC ! >That assumes that the caster knows the spell. In D&D rules Jaggar is of insufficient level to learn the spell -- in AD&D rules it appears to be absent from his spell book. AD+D Jaggar is an Invoker. Wish is Conjuration, and Invokers cant cast Conjuration spells. So thats why he hasnt got Wish in his spellbook... Cheerz ROB *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 4 Jun 1998 08:49:46 +0100 From: "Rob" Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Gender in Gaming >That's because women don't understand the pressing need to drive a sharp sword through an orc as fast as you can. Kill him, QUICK! Or he might...negotiate and reason with you. Who wants to bog down the game with a lot of fool role-playing and "first contact" crap? Pointspointspoints... :-) >"You are here to kill! You were BORN to kill! But if you don't have the fighting spirit, you will HESITATE. You will NOT kill. And that is dumb, because the enemy will kill YOU! AAnd then, you will be in a WORLD of sh**. Because, in the Army, you are not...allowed...to die...without...PERMISSION!" ---the Sarge, FULL METAL JACKET (more or less) LOL. Ahh, the Sarge. I dont know though... In our group we have a single female player (and normally three or four males). And she is far more ruthless and merciless than the males... Hell Hath No Fury "I will shoot straighter than my enemy who is trying to kill me I will shoot until there is no enemy But Peace!" Cheerz ROB *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 4 Jun 1998 08:40:22 +0100 From: "Rob" Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Gazetteers vs. boxed sets >I would think that if TSR/WotC insists on selling boxed sets, they should try to provide more "bang for the buck" in the boxed set. Red Steel showed some promise in that direction -- it described a region comparable in size and cultural variety to the Known World and was almost worth its price. If the first boxed set had described the entire Known World region, it might >have been worthwhile -- but anyone could see that publishing gazetteer replacements for $30 each was a losing proposition. If you want to charge three times as much, you should try to provide three times the value -- then >the product will sell and the customers will be happy. The big problem I had with Red Steel was the lack of detail on some of the nations of the Savage Coast. The actual RED STEEL book contains many, many new rules, classes, background of the Curse, kits etc. (all good stuff!) but the LANDS OF THE SAVAGE COAST book was pretty naff. The Savage Baronies box is ace - so thats the Savage Baronies well described... And the Orcs Head covers Eshu, Jibaru annd the far western nations... but what about everything else? Bellayne/Herath/Renardy/Eusdria/Robrenn all get a couple of very generalised pages each. Not that I don't mind making it up myself, but I would have liked more of an overview on the nations. I would have been prepared to accept a slimming of the rules book in order to get this as well. If you had five pages per nation instead of two that would have been a big improvement! Concerning price - I dont know about the USA, but in the UK there isnt a huge difference between boxes and books anymore. Red Steel was £21.50, I know that much. But a Players Handbook is about £17... (I remember when I were a lad and it used to be £10). The boxes arent substantially more than a hardback, really... Cheerz ROB *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 4 Jun 1998 05:33:00 EDT From: Ambreville@aol.com Subject: [MYSTARA] - Writer's Workshop? >>Date: Wed, 03 Jun 1998 13:55:27 PDT From: "George Valencia" Subject: [MYSTARA] - MYSTARA RISING PROJECT Would anyone on the List, wish to Attend Next Year's TSR's Writers Workshop. so as to work together on, not only the Net Almanac, but maybe some net modules as well? Hey, Bruce, Could you Please grace your Presence there as well for 1999, so as to ask TSR to let us work as part of the Mystara design team, please?<< Are you talking about GenCon -- if so why wait until '99? GenCon is coming this August. I understand your request, however I doubt this will have any effect whatsoever on the way TSR would design Mystara. They need to *have* a in-house design team to begin with. Trying to become vocal about *allowing* the net group to become part of the creative team is not going to be perceived well by the editorial staff there. What I suggest is a more subtle approach which consists in offering help such as proofing for consistency which *will* be a problem with whoever attempts to handle Mystara at TSR. They will have nobody who's experienced with this setting. Offering to design material for them will strike the wrong chords, especially in the ego department. First get your foot in the door by allowing them to rely on the MML's expertise in Mystaran matters. Then, when they are confortable with this association, push the idea of the Net-Almanac as a free contribution. Don't assume it will go through untouched either. That's just the nature of the beast. Am I answering your questions? Bruce Heard *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 4 Jun 1998 19:35:01 +1000 From: shawn@leme.anu.edu.au (stan) Subject: [MYSTARA] - Re: Sylvan Realm >Date: Thu, 4 Jun 1998 00:18:46 EDT >From: Kaviyd@aol.com >In a message dated 98-06-03 15:24:43 EDT, eand@WPI.EDU writes: >>Except for the obvious names, Thyatis, and Alphatia, Jen, Esterhold, etc. AAAll the countries that were named are the dreams of a Thyatian cartographer who stubled upon an ancient Nithian map. Most of the names are retained, because of tradition, and because you need someting to call those places! (Vulcania, Pelatin, Izonda, Zyxl, Tangor, etc.) But the Empires, and Matriarchies, and whatever, don't exist at all. >At the >other extreme is the Empire of Dorfin IV -- that one is clearly fictional. I suspect that most of the other nations are somewhere in between. The Empire of Dorfin IV is fictional insofar as no one has bothered to describe such a realm. And although such a realm might not be as big as mapped in the Masters set it doesn't mean that it ain't there. Haldemar, as you pointed out, got it wrong for Tangor - he isn't infallable. stan http://www.geocities.com/TimesSquare/5304 *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 04 Jun 1998 11:40:11 CEST From: "Herve Musseau" Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Almanac/Glantri From: =?iso-8859-1?Q?H=E5vard_R=F8nne_Faanes?= >I think Rad would be very interested in this since, without this change, the brotherhood of the Radience will be furthering the cause of Entropy, and will possibly eventually cause the destruction >of Glantri. I'm wondering: How could using the NoS be furthering the cause of Entropy, if Hel suffered a major stroke at the end of WotI when the NoS was made into becoming Entropy-powered? Using it should hurt Entropy, shouldn't it? Also, what did people think about the theory on the sphere of Principium that I introduced in the post #5 about Gareth? (hint) ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 4 Jun 1998 07:14:14 EDT From: Inconu@aol.com Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Almanac/Glantri << Why wouldnt any mage at this power level have a Wish on a scroll for just such an occasion? If a pc canhave such then its mandatory for any 3D NPC ! >> Wish is the most rare of spells on Mystara (thank the Immortals). Very few have obtained this spell. Ettienne and Genevive have it, and that's all to the best of my knowledge. Plus, giving this spell to the pcs is directly a DM's move. The closest I've done with this is giving the PCs one or two wishes from an item. Giving the spell to one is a large step to take in a campaign. - -Inconu *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 4 Jun 1998 07:35:02 EDT From: Inconu@aol.com Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Almanac/Glantri >Can Jaggar cast spells using only his voice? yes, if it needs only verbal components. >What about a wizard held in chains or tied up by a rope, he cannot move his hand, but can he cast spells? It all depends on the spell. The ones which do not require hands would be able to be cast. >I don't think a mage always needs to dance, wave his hands or make strange gestures when casting spells. On the other hand we know that a mage cannot cast spells if he has been silenced. Unless the spell needs only somatic components. - -Inconu *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 4 Jun 1998 10:04:11 -0400 (EDT) From: SteelAngel Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Thermodynamic Universe? On Thu, 4 Jun 1998, Pierre Savoie wrote: >>thermodynamically support life, but there would be a few that are in the same range as our universe. >Huh? What do you mean by this thermodynamics theory, Max? I've studied thermodynamics and it makes no assumption of scale. I would imagine a universe as small as one sun and one planet can easily support life. The sun Well, Thermodynamically unfit for life simply means that the the universe expanded too quickly, and suffered heat death before anything could develop, or its "big bang" wasn't strong enough, and the universe is in a semi-plasma state. Either way, toss a person in there, and they die. Max IV *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 3 Jun 1998 23:32:45 +0300 From: "Aleksei Andrievski" Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Almanac/Glantri >It could be a borderline case though. Maybe people like Synn could use it against Jaggar unless Jaggar got himself a really good lawyer. That would help explain the Almanac storyline. And, fortunately for Jaggar, the former lawyer, Jherek Virayana, just got killed (he was Jaggar's enemy). So now Jaggar needs to get someone who likes him into the position of the Supreme Judge... ****************** Aleksei Andrievski aka Solmyr, Archmage of the Azure Star Visit the Archmage's Tower at http://www.geocities.com/TimesSquare/Fortress/2198/index.html *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line Date: Thu, 4 Jun 1998 11:35:49 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: phaser.Showcase.MPGN.COM: majordom set sender to owner-mystara-l@ using -f From: (mystara-digest) To: mystara-digest@Phaser.ShowCase.MPGN.COM Subject: mystara-digest V1997 #386 Reply-To: mystara@mpgn.com X-UIDL: ad2bfa8a51f9ebb6500d8676684df01a 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 4 Jun 1998 13:47:03 +0300 From: "Aleksei Andrievski" Subject: [MYSTARA] - Mystaran Birthright PBEM Want to experience warfare and intrigue to the fullest? Then join the Mystaran Birthright PBEM, the most unique Birthright PBEM on the Web. Check it out at http://www.geocities.com/TimesSquare/Fortress/2198/mystbr.html Note: Familiarity with the world of Mystara is not required. ****************** Aleksei Andrievski aka Solmyr, Archmage of the Azure Star Visit the Archmage's Tower at http://www.geocities.com/TimesSquare/Fortress/2198/index.html *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 4 Jun 1998 10:10:13 -0400 (EDT) From: SteelAngel Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Re: Sylvan Realm On Thu, 4 Jun 1998, stan wrote: >The Empire of Dorfin IV is fictional insofar as no one has bothered to describe such a realm. And although such a realm might not be as big as mapped in the Masters set it doesn't mean that it ain't there. Haldemar, as you pointed out, got it wrong for Tangor - he isn't infallable. Ahh, but it was described in the same Dragon Article, when Haldemar said that the map was wrong. He said it was the Joke of a Gnomish King living in Karameikos, who sent emmisarries to Thyatis as a Joke. (I beleive that there is a mention of a King Dorfin In the Book of Wondrous Inventions. From this reference I get that he is In Karameikos.) Max IV *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 4 Jun 1998 10:11:29 -0400 (EDT) From: SteelAngel Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Almanac/Glantri On Thu, 4 Jun 1998, Herve Musseau wrote: >was made into becoming Entropy-powered? Using it should hurt Entropy, shouldn't it? It did.. Hel Suffered a MAJOR Stroke (Loss of face, followers, and you can't sleep well at night cause they're all laughing at you!!) Max IV *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 04 Jun 1998 16:47:51 CEST From: "Herve Musseau" Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Almanac/Glantri From: SteelAngel >On Thu, 4 Jun 1998, Herve Musseau wrote: wwwas made into becoming Entropy-powered? Using it should hurt Entropy, shouldn't it? >It did.. Hel Suffered a MAJOR Stroke (Loss of face, followers, and you can't sleep well at night cause they're all laughing at you!!) I know, but why? I mean, if the new NoS is helpful to Entropy, Hel should have gained a major "unstroke" (how's that called), and not suffered from a stroke. And there wouldn't have been a reason to remove her from Reigning Hierarch status if she gave Entropy such a great boost (and new tool). ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 4 Jun 1998 11:07:34 -0400 (EDT) From: SteelAngel Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Almanac/Glantri On Thu, 4 Jun 1998, Herve Musseau wrote: >I mean, if the new NoS is helpful to Entropy, Hel should have gained a It isn't though. The New NoS DRAINS energy from Entropy. Max IV *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 03 Jun 1998 18:45:36 -0500 From: Galwylin Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - AD&D Gods and Immortals Andrés Piquer Otero wrote: >I will develop further, if you are interested, especially the connection of Mystara Planes to the similar PS planes, the possible reasons of the powers "withdrawing" from Mystara and the relationship between powers and Old Ones. Please do! I find this a much better way of relating the two without having to throw one completely out. - -- This has been a Galwylin© Production galwylin@airnet.net (ICQ #6755972) http://www.airnet.net/galwylin/ The Karameikan School of Magecraft http://www.geocities.com/TimesSquare/Realm/2336/ *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 03 Jun 1998 14:19:10 -0500 From: Galwylin Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Why the Council of Alphatia is reasonable Alex295@aol.com wrote: >Well, DotE says that the reverses Tylion experienced were the the loss of the colonies in Ylaruam, had failed to take Glantri (then Braejr), andhad failed to keep the Thyatians out of Norwold. The reverse experienced in Thyatis was the final straw. I had forgotten about Ylaruam (and must have really forgotten about Glantri. I have to loook that up again). But I took the Thyatians in Norworld and breaking the treaty as the events that lead up to Tylion's attack. I also think that Alphatia would have a treaty with Thyatis at all shows that Alphatia did seek diplomatic avenues even when dealing with a long time enemy. So their political use must be what kept them from conquering everything within reach. That Tylion could have been forced into a duel to remain in power might also suggest that military advancement didn't rest on ability or knowledge as much as strength. In a land where knowledge is everything, how much attention is paid to wisdom? - -- This has been a Galwylin© Production galwylin@airnet.net (ICQ #6755972) http://www.airnet.net/galwylin/ The Karameikan School of Magecraft http://www.geocities.com/TimesSquare/Realm/2336/ *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 03 Jun 1998 23:57:27 -0500 From: Galwylin Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Sylvan Realm Kaviyd@aol.com wrote: >Tangor is an example of a nation that Haldemar may have dismissed too quickly. From the article you would think that the name of Tangor was completely fictitious and had nothing to do with that region at all -- but we learn later that a real people called the Tanagoro live in the region and are the ancestors of the Nuari, the people of Yavdlom, the demi-ogres of the Arm of the Immortals, and the Tanagoro of the Hollow World. At the other extreme is the Empire of Dorfin IV -- that one is clearly fictional. I suspect that most of the other nations are somewhere in between. I've been think about the Empire of Dorfin IV. Couldn't that be the claim of someone without there actually be an empire? It is a large area that nothing is known about with lots of woodland. Dorfin could have been an woodland creature or goblin that just boasted a little too much and people took at his word when making the map. In essence, the Empire of Dorfin IV is a forest that no one controls. - -- This has been a Galwylin© Production galwylin@airnet.net (ICQ #6755972) http://www.airnet.net/galwylin/ The Karameikan School of Magecraft http://www.geocities.com/TimesSquare/Realm/2336/ *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 03 Jun 1998 17:46:05 -0500 From: Galwylin Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - [MYSTARA] Those Immortal Servants (Was: The Alphatian Council) Håvard Rųnne Faanes wrote: >PS: I got a lot of nice feedback on the elves, does anyone have any comments on those other guys? Well so far, the Valkyre are my favorite other than the black and white elves. I'd like more details on them concerning their interactions with the mortal plane. I'm a little confused on what the Einherjar have that separates them from the ones the Valkyre choose from the battlefield. I think the Shadowknights would work better as cursed knights that Thanatos has gathered as servants. Perhaps dying in a moment of weakness or betraying their lord? From the description, their origins aren't clear. Over all, I like them but would like stronger ties to the mortal plane than immortal. The valkyre and einherjar would certainly make the Northern Reaches (where I assume Odin's powerbase is) much powerful than they've been protrayed. I'm going to have to look up what an exalted status is exactly though. Just curious but have you ever heard of an elf that is beautiful to look at but when seen from behind is just a hollow shell? I can't remember which myth it belongs to though. - -- This has been a Galwylin© Production galwylin@airnet.net (ICQ #6755972) http://www.airnet.net/galwylin/ The Karameikan School of Magecraft http://www.geocities.com/TimesSquare/Realm/2336/ *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 03 Jun 1998 23:52:50 -0500 From: Galwylin Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - The Alphatian Council and FR Kaviyd@aol.com wrote: >But assuming that the Alphatian invaders are smart -- maybe they can work out some sort of deal with Mystra? What would she require of them to let them settle some part of Toril? And would it be something that would prevent them from trying to conquer part of Toril? Mystra shouldn't prevent any mortals from conquering a part of Toril provided they promote magic. I think she would be rather pleased to have even more to add to her already large number of followers. The promotion and maintaining of the Weave of magic on Toril is really all she concerns herself with (and has gotten slapped down when she forgot that). - -- This has been a Galwylin© Production galwylin@airnet.net (ICQ #6755972) http://www.airnet.net/galwylin/ The Karameikan School of Magecraft http://www.geocities.com/TimesSquare/Realm/2336/ *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 4 Jun 1998 11:25:08 EDT From: Alex295@aol.com Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Almanac/Glantri In a message dated 98-06-03 17:27:26 EDT, Fabrizio writes: << At 07.42 03/06/98 EDT, Inconu@aol.com wrote: <<< Good point -- and it suggests yet another likely solution to Jaggar's problem. >He is unable to cast spells until he learns one-handed casting, either from Harald or on his own. >> >He would still be able to cast spells that require only verbal, only somatic, >or a combo of the two for components. Yes, but this is AD&D. Is there something in OD&D that prevents a mage from casting if he lacks a one hand? Can Jaggar cast spells using only his voice? What about a wizard held in chains or tied up by a rope, he cannot move his hand, but can he cast spells? I don't think a mage always needs to dance, wave his hands or make strange gestures when casting spells. On the other hand we know that a mage cannot cast spells if he has been silenced. >> Well...in DotE there is an adventure set in Alphatia that entails a mage under the charms of a vampiress. The PCs are to rescue this guy and ferry him away. Due to his being charmed, precautions are needed to keep him from acting against the PCs. This being done by binding his hands and gagging his mouth. I think there are other instances but that one comes to mind. So I would say that a mage whether AD&D or D&D needs to be able to speak and have freedom with his hands. AD&D spells that do not require verbal or somatic tones need not apply. But that is a bother for D&D spells as there is no destinction as to whether these are needed. Offhand, I'd say they are needed. Most AD&D spells require at least verbal and somatic to cast them. So that is an easy safeguard to say that the D&D spells unilaterally need them. Since spell components are not really used in D&D and optional even in AD&D, you could work out a spell that uses a spell component instead of either the verbal or somatic part, but never both. To do this would require research time and a notion that the mage has a direct need to alter his spells. So essentially, that mage would have to have a preexisting condition of limb loss or being a mute. Alex *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 04 Jun 1998 08:34:53 PDT From: "paul dooley" Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Almanac/Glantri Isnt Jagger still owed a favour from stepping down as dragon ruler time to cash it in ? >From owner-mystara-l@phaser.showcase.mpgn.com Wed Jun 3 10:39:30 1998 Received: from localhost (daemon@localhost) bby phaser.Showcase.MPGN.COM (8.8.8/8.8.8) with SMTP id NAA04541; Wed, 3 Jun 1998 13:27:03 -0400 >Received: by lists.MPGN.COM (bulk_mailer v1.5); Wed, 3 Jun 1998 13:27:02 -0400 >Received: (from majordom@localhost) >by phaser.Showcase.MPGN.COM (8.8.8/8.8.8) id NAA04518 for mystara-l-outgoing; Wed, 3 Jun 1998 13:26:49 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: phaser.Showcase.MPGN.COM: majordom set sender to owner-mystara-l@lists.MPGN.COM using -f RReceived: from Mithril.MPGN.COM (Mithril.MPGN.COM [206.66.87.8]) bby phaser.Showcase.MPGN.COM (8.8.8/8.8.8) with SMTP id NAA04466 for ; Wed, 3 Jun 1998 13:26:16 - -0400 >Received: from sabre-wulf.nvg.ntnu.no (sabre-wulf.nvg.ntnu.no [129.241.210.67]) by Mithril.MPGN.COM (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id NAA26774 for ; Wed, 3 Jun 1998 13:26:14 -0400 RReceived: from hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no ([129.241.210.68] EHLO hagbart.nvg.ntnu.no ident: hoc [port 5914]) by sabre-wulf.nvg.ntnu.no with ESMTP id <49271-29866> convert rfc822-to-quoted-printable; Wed, 3 Jun 1998 19:26:11 +0200 >Date: Wed, 3 Jun 1998 19:26:04 +0200 (MET DST) From: =?iso-8859-1?Q?H=E5vard_R=F8nne_Faanes?= To: mystara-l@MPGN.COM >Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Almanac/Glantri In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MMIME-Version: 1.0 >Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=iso-8859-1 X-MIME-Autoconverted: from QUOTED-PRINTABLE to 8bit by phaser.Showcase.MPGN.COM id NAA04467 >Sender: owner-mystara-l@lists.MPGN.COM >Reply-To: mystara-l@MPGN.COM >Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-MIME-Autoconverted: from 8bit to quoted-printable by phaser.Showcase.MPGN.COM id NAA04541 >On Wed, 3 Jun 1998 Kaviyd@aol.com wrote: >>In a message dated 98-06-01 11:41:47 EDT, hoc@nvg.ntnu.no writes: =20 >>>I didnt really like that stuff about Jaggar losing his title becuase = >he >>>lost his arm. To me that sounds a bit..game mechanical.. I mean sinc= >e you >>>can't cast spells you are no longer a magic user? well maybe. Doesn'= >t >>>Harald of Haaskins have a crippled arm? >>Good point -- and it suggests yet another likely solution to Jaggar's p= >roblem. >>He is unable to cast spells until he learns one-handed casting, either = >from >>Harald or on his own. But since he has not lost his talent, his noble = >titles >>and charges are in no legal danger. >It could be a borderline case though. Maybe people like Synn could use it >against Jaggar unless Jaggar got himself a really good lawyer. That would >help explain the Almanac storyline. >>Even if he gets that artificial arm, he will still need a period of tim= >e for=20 >>recuperation and spellcasting therapy. >H=E5vard >*** >Haavard R. Faanes (hoc@nvg.ntnu.no) >http://www.nvg.ntnu.no/~hoc >"Every turkey dies. Not all turkeys truly live." -Chef, South Park >*************************************************************************= ** >To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the li= >ne >'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ End of mystara-digest V1997 #386 ******************************** *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara' as the body of the message. Date: Thu, 4 Jun 1998 15:34:32 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: phaser.Showcase.MPGN.COM: majordom set sender to owner-mystara-l@ using -f From: (mystara-digest) To: mystara-digest@Phaser.ShowCase.MPGN.COM Subject: mystara-digest V1997 #387 Reply-To: mystara@mpgn.com X-UIDL: e4f69c926edcbd5e44034c83ebef7c8b mystara-digest Thursday, June 4 1998 Volume 1997 : Number 387 Mystara is a trademark of TSR Inc. All Rights Reserved. The following topics are covered in this digest: Re: [MYSTARA] - Jenni's Monumental Memo of Mystara Re: [MYSTARA] - Strictness of Copyright Re: [MYSTARA] - Jenni's Monumental Memo of Mystara Re: [MYSTARA] - Almanac/Glantri Re: [MYSTARA] -Alphatian Council Re: [MYSTARA] - Sylvan Realm [MYSTARA] - The NoS and Entropy [MYSTARA] - Start of lumbered with a kit? Maybe - maybe not... [MYSTARA] - Some new Enchantment spells... [MYSTARA] - Ethengar's invasion Re: [MYSTARA] - Almanac/Glantri Re: [MYSTARA] - Genders in Mystara [MYSTARA] - Spelljammer and Mystara (was: Why Mystara?) [MYSTARA] - Almanac-Sind/WDL Re: [MYSTARA] - Politicized analogies Re: [MYSTARA] - Why Mystara? ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Thu, 4 Jun 1998 11:36:16 EDT From: Kaviyd@aol.com Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Jenni's Monumental Memo of Mystara In a message dated 98-06-03 21:50:46 EDT, Ambreville@aol.com writes: >Sure, but let's not go overboard with this. Other than Immortals and possibly alignments, what were you suggesting? Class adaptations that reflect the old OD&D races/classes? I'm not sure this is really worth the trouble, is it? It just might be. In AD&D, you decide from the outset what sort of character you want your PC to be. But in D&D, you can make some decisions right away and defer others until the character has gained some experience. That flexibility could make a big difference. Consider, for example, the differences between a D&D Paladin and an AD&D Defender (from the Red Steel boxed set): - -- A D&D fighter of lawful alignment may become a Paladin any time after reaching 9th level. Once he does so, he can gain a new status that confers upon him additional powers as well as additional duties. - -- An AD&D Defender must choose that kit from the start of his adventuring career. While he may later abandon that kit, there is no way for a character who begins play with a different kit or with no kit at all to decide to become a Defender later on. The ability of D&D characters to "change lanes" so to speak is not something to be dismissed lightly, I would think. *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 03 Jun 1998 15:09:20 -0500 From: Galwylin Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Strictness of Copyright Pierre Savoie wrote: >TSR wants as much control as it can. You asked for an example of "stolen" work; here's a possible example: I noticed that the DMG 2nd ed. p. 22-23 had a section on "Creating a New Character Class", a way to mix and match class abilities to create new classes. But the credit should really go to Paul M. Crabaugh's article in DRAGON, May 1986, entitled "Customized Classes: How to put together one-of-a-kind characters", doing that sort of thing but for OD&D! It seems that he published his article in DRAGON, but lost control of its ideas and was not credited in any way with the appearance of a similar system in the pages of the DMG. **UNLESS* there is evidence of any TSR publication or article doing mix- and-match character classes prior to the 1986 date, or they gave him some kind of royalty for second-use of the idea for the DMG, TSR stole the ideas in his excellent article. I think you've gotten some things mixed up. If you sell an article (non-fiction) to DRAGON it does belong to them. They've bought it. So far, it's only the fiction area that suggests that TSR is buying rights to publish it. The story still belongs to the author. An article based on AD&D doesn't to the author mainly because that author is borrowing from TSR to start with. He probably should have got a credit (but I don't know if that's part of the contract you sign when handing over articles). It's just like the Margaret Weis and Tracy Hickman mess. They believe that Dragonlance is theirs. But they seem to have forgotten they sold their ideas to TSR. So, an article is yours until you sell it to someone else. A story (not based on TSR properties) is yours no matter who buys it. They are only buying the rights to publish. This is my impression from reading the DRAGON submission guidelines. As to TSR owning what's on this lists, as far as I know, they hardly even know about it and any new idea is the authors until he sells it. - -- This has been a Galwylin© Production galwylin@airnet.net (ICQ #6755972) http://www.airnet.net/galwylin/ The Karameikan School of Magecraft http://www.geocities.com/TimesSquare/Realm/2336/ *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 03 Jun 1998 21:17:59 -0500 From: Galwylin Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Jenni's Monumental Memo of Mystara Ambreville@aol.com wrote: >The same could have been said of the original Mystara. Sales had suffered there as well precisely because of the number of customers "snubbing" anything connected with OD&D. RC did well, but was unable to break the trend. A further effect appeared later on, when we saw distributors deliberately cutting orders down on the later Gazetteer issues because of their higher serial number -- following the logic that GAZ1 sells best because it's the first one, GAZ2, 3, and 4 perhaps reasonably well, and beyond these, distributors weren't convinced sales would be significant. So, as we reached GAZ 10, 11, 12, distributors were actually ordering half or less what the earlier Gazetteers were selling, regardless of whether people might be interested out there (note that back-orders on Gazetteers were unusually stable for TSR products). As a result, TSR's management was getting increasingly hostile to any further Gazetteers or parallel developments of Mystara. So much for market dynamics. That's a trend that not only game distributors have taken. If anyone pays attention to the comic industry, you'll see many of the same titles cancelled only to reemerge at #1 again a few months later. The same thing happened with the Realms's FR and FOR series. They still release books in the same format but they rarely go beyond five in the series now. >I would also prefer something that comes close to the original Gazetteer format, including the gosh-darn, 8 mile scale hex maps. That's a tough sale to TSR design staff because they have a gut-level hatred of these sorts of maps. And unfortunately, these maps are tricky to produce and work-intensive. They demand an iron hand to manage their consistency and some hands-on experience (trust me, I know!) Fortunately, Dennis Kauth who was one the main mappers for Mystara products is in Seattle with TSR (last I heard, anyway). I think a complete Mystara Known World setting could be released in the same format as the Faiths & Avatars format. 192 pages in small type could do justice to a large area. Extreme detail wouldn't be possible but an overview would work. Much of it could come from the Gazetteers with just a few pages of an updated timeline. The Savage Coast could get the same treatment. If sales are good, perhaps the 96 page Gazetteers could make a come back to add the higher detail. Maybe more 192 books that instead of concentrating on each individual country but groups: the Western Defense League nations, the Northern Reaches nations, the Elven lands, the Empire of Thyatis. Throw it under the Odyssey line if necessary. - -- This has been a Galwylin© Production galwylin@airnet.net (ICQ #6755972) http://www.airnet.net/galwylin/ The Karameikan School of Magecraft http://www.geocities.com/TimesSquare/Realm/2336/ *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 04 Jun 1998 19:01:16 +0200 From: DM Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Almanac/Glantri At 22.54 03/06/98 +0200, Fabrizio Paoli wrote: IIs there something in OD&D that prevents a mage from casting if he lacks a one hand? >Can Jaggar cast spells using only his voice? What about a wizard held in chains or tied up by a rope, he cannot move his hand, but can he cast spells? Well, i remember from Basic rules that in D&D a mage MUST have his hands free and his speech not impaired in order to cast a spell properly. Clerics OTOH need only one hand free and the holy symbol on the other one. Elves... well, i don't remember exactly, but it's either one hand free or both hands.. Wizards CANNOT cast spells using only their voice: they must make gestures in D&D (that's what make Immortals -who need not even utter words- and dragons that powerful). >I don't think a mage always needs to dance, wave his hands or make strange gestures when casting spells. On the other hand we know that a mage cannot cast spells if he has been silenced. As i said above, he needs both gestures and voice. Think of it this way: gestures are required to summon and channel the magical energies into the mage's body and words are needed to shape those energies into spells and unleash them in the outside world (that's how it works IMHO). Normally i rule that if you have only 1 hand free you have 50% of possibilities of failing, and if you are somehow impaired to speak (or think -stunned-), then you cannot cast anything at all. Hope this clarifies a bit more.. DM *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 4 Jun 1998 13:11:23 EDT From: JamugaKhan@aol.com Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] -Alphatian Council << I do agree that much of the mages of Alphatia would probably fall into the studious mage category instead of the adventuring mage category. Why would an Alphatian mage, the ruling class with the resources of the Empire at his call, endanger his life for a handful of GPs? More ambitious mages may go that rout to advance their own spell research but not your average mage. >> If you say, that a person earns 1 XP per 1 GP earned than we have an interesting effect: The typical wages of Alphatian spellcasters are so incredible high, that for instance a level 1 magic-user entering the army would be on level 36 after a few years of regularly payment. Using this rule is there anybody out there who wonders about the many high-level wizards in Alphatia? Jamuga Khan "Hear and obey, because the Mighty Khan's word is law." *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 04 Jun 1998 19:16:44 +0200 From: DM Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Sylvan Realm At 00.18 04/06/98 EDT, Kaviyd wrote: >In a message dated 98-06-03 13:07:40 EDT, hoc@nvg.ntnu.no writes: III prefer it to be set before WotI. Maybe in Ac1002 or something. It could bbbe set much earlier too though. It is possible to set it after WotI, but setting it before AC1000 makes detailing it a lot easier. >Another advantage to setting _Tree of Life_ prior to WotI is that you can get one whole clan of Elves out of the way of the Shadow Elf invasion of Alfheim.... I already replied to this one, but it seems my mail didn't get thru.. Anyway, i'll repeat my answer. First of all, SR location: i've always thought it was located on the west coast, south of Hyborea and north of Arm of the Immortals, and this is mainly because of CM7 map (which shows a body of water west of the SR -i thought it was the western unnamed ocean) and of GAZ5 map, which shows clearly where Ilsundal's migration stopped (on the west coast of Brun). However, since CM7 says that the SR was surrounded by many humans who threatened their woods (and Moorkroft is their self-styled king/tyrant), how do you explain that nobody in the Savage Coast 8not even the Sea Powers) knows of this place and Moorkroft's kingdom? Second thing: CM7 timeframe. GAZ5 specifically states that IF Cm7 has been accomplished, the Feadiels will have other main goals to fulfill. This means that officially CM7 has not been played out before AC 1000: this is left entirely to the DM. I suggest you play it during WotI. Picture this: Feadiels' Tree of Life is dying and no external cause can be found: it must be a problem tied to its origins.. Good Ilsundal! This means the Mother Tree is dying in the Sylvan Realm! A party is immediately sent to discover and solve the problem and they disappear in the Rainbow Path... But wait! The Red Arrow's ToL is sick as well, and so it is the Mealidil's and Grunalf's.. and the Longrunner is giving off bad signs of sickness... uh-oh... what's happening underground? ;) DM *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 4 Jun 1998 18:30:38 +0100 From: "Rob" Subject: [MYSTARA] - The NoS and Entropy What effect do u think the drain on Entropy will be on the world? (It should be bad in the long run, I suppose, as Entropy is supposed to be the balancing force that keeps the positive Spheres in check). When the NoS was draining Energy, it affected magic, causing the DoD. What if its draining Entropy? Will people start living longer or something? put a strain on the worlds ecosystem? ??? suggestions anyone? Cheerz ROB *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 4 Jun 1998 18:37:51 +0100 From: "Rob" Subject: [MYSTARA] - Start of lumbered with a kit? Maybe - maybe not... >-- A D&D fighter of lawful alignment may become a Paladin any time after reaching 9th level. Once he does so, he can gain a new status that confers upon him additional powers as well as additional duties. >-- An AD&D Defender must choose that kit from the start of his adventuring career. While he may later abandon that kit, there is no way for a character who begins play with a different kit or with no kit at all to decide to become a Defender later on. >The ability of D&D characters to "change lanes" so to speak is not something to be dismissed lightly, I would think. You dont necessarily have to choose a kit initially. You can start without a kit, then choose one later on if you want (I think it actually sez this is Canon somewhere...). Which, if u think about it, is even better than the Knight/Paladin/Avenger analogy, because there are many (too many?) kits to choose from. Personally I'm fairly liberal with things like knowledge of weapons, non weapon proficiencies and so on. After all, in D+D, you didnt need weapon proficiencies - you could use all weapons just fine (this changed in the Master set, as i recall). I'm more wary about kits with special advantages - you have to judge such things on a case by case basis. (I had the PCs drafted in a skirmish between Almarron and Cimarron when they were low level, and all the warriors I gave weapon proficiency in pike for free. Hardly a wrecker of game balance...) A bit like Warhammer FRP (anyone in USA heard of that?) where u have careers, and Career Exits (so, for example, a Gamekeeper (starting career) could become an Targeteer (master bowman), then a Highwayman (Stand and Deliver!), then an Outlaw Leader etc. etc., picking up skills as u go along. A good system, bar the potential for powergaming (I cant remember the ultimate combo, but its something like Witchfinder-Targeteer-Highwayman-Assassin...). Like I said, case by case. Cheerz ROB *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 4 Jun 1998 18:57:35 +0100 From: "Rob" Subject: [MYSTARA] - Some new Enchantment spells... Heres some new spells, invented by the mistress of the mind, Missa... (and recurring evil NPC villain!) (and I apologise for the AD+D format...) Missa's Seductive Slumberkiss (Alteration) Level 2 Range : touch Components : V,S Duration : Until used Cast Time : 1 turn Area : One venemous creatures poison sacs Save : Special This spell is designed to enhance a poisonous creatures natural venom. Although usable on any venemous creature, the spell was specifically designed with aranea in mind. The poison sacs so affected are enchanted so that they may deliver a variety of poisons for the next three doses. The spell can produce a) Dreambliss poison. A powerful narcotic that can sedate even the largest of opponents. Victims so injected must save vs poison or fall into a deep, euphoric "Sleep of Bliss" lasting 2d4 hours. The onset time depends on the victims size (S=1 round, M=2 rounds, >M d4+1 rounds). Upon awaking from the poison induced slumber, most victims remember happy, dreamlike images that they hope to one day experience again. This addictive poison permanently robs a victim of one Wisdom point per month of use. After two doses of poison the victim must make a Wisdom adjusted save vs poison or become a dreambliss addict. Addicts will do anything to obtain doses of dreambliss, and will not manage to shake the addiction Date: Thu, 4 Jun 1998 15:34:32 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: phaser.Showcase.MPGN.COM: majordom set sender to owner-mystara-l@ using -f From: (mystara-digest) To: mystara-digest@Phaser.ShowCase.MPGN.COM Subject: mystara-digest V1997 #387 Reply-To: mystara@mpgn.com X-UIDL: e4f69c926edcbd5e44034c83ebef7c8b themselves. A cure insanity spell or suchlike will remove addiction. b) Mindshadow. When introduced into a humans bloodstream mindshadow causes extreme disorientation and both visual and auditory hallucinations in the victim, who must make a save vs poison to avoid the effects (onset time 1d3 rounds). Victims failing a save become confused for 5d4 rounds. During that time the victim becomes extremely susceptible to suggestion (as the spell, save at -6 to refuse a specific request) by anyone conversing with or questioning the victim. Since the poison leaves the victim almost totally at the mercy of frightening illusions and suggestions, this poison is not addictive. Mindshadow only works effectively on humans. Other races gain a +1 to +4 bonus on their saving throw, onset time 2d6 rounds. Failed saves incur a slow effect for 2d6 turns instead of suggestion and confusion. Dwarves are totally immune to mindshadow. c) Type D injected venom (onset time 1-2 rounds, 30 damage on a failed save, 2d6 otherwise. Poison enhanced by a Missa's seductive slumberkiss becomes inactive if exposed to air for a duration of one turn or more. Missa's Charm of Deceiving Innocence (Enchantment/Metamagic) Level 3 Range : 0 Components : V Duration : 1 round Cast Time : 3 Area : The caster Save : Special This metamagic spell can be used to enhance any one charm spell. The follow up spell must be cast on the round subsequent to casting Missa's charm of obliviousness, or the spell is wasted. The spells effect is to enhance the enchantment's effect by deluding the victim upon that spell's expiry into believing that nothing amiss ever took place. Thus, a charmed victim will no longer be subject to the charm effects, but will not ever think that he was ensorcelled. If the caster does not antagonise a creature so affected a nonmagical friendship may develop as a follow-on to the magic. The spell functions only on charms, not direct attacks, such as hold person or ray of enfeeblement. A few examples of spells that this metamagic will enhance follows. This insidious spell actually nonmagically alters the victims mind, making it impossible for the creature to accept that it was charmed. Thus detect magic, detect charm and so on will come up blank. Any spell that heals insanity or other mental illness will reverse the effect, however. Charm person, friends, hypnotism, scare, suggestion, charm monster, emotion, fire charm, domination, Leomunds lamentable belaborment, mass suggestion, charm plants, antipathy-sympathy, mass charm. If the charm was not particularly subtle (using domination to attempt to force a victim to do an act totally against it's alignment etc.) a save may be granted, with a bonus of up to +6. Missa's Robes of Immunity (Enchantment/Abjuration) Level 4 Range : 0 Components : V,S,M Duration : l hour per level or Special Cast Time : 2 rounds Area : The casters clothing Save : None This spell creates a field of enchantment around the casters body, which serves to magically toughen any articles of clothing upon the wizards person. The field exists in a dormant state until the wizard is either struck by a piercing or slashing attack, or until it is activated manually by an act of concentration. The spell then has a duration of one round per five caster levels, round up. During this time the wizard is completely unaffected by physical attacks, as a stoneskin spell. Note that if the spell is activated by the wizard taking damage, the spell kicks in after that damage has been sustained. Also note that the activation round counts as a round for the purposes of the spells duration. Thus 12th level caster activating the spell is immune to the stated attacks for that round, and two following rounds. The material component is a small sheet of steel wrapped in fabric of the same colour as the wizards clothing. Missa's Charm of Magical Obliviousness (Enchantment/Metamagic) (Note: this spell assumes that the DM rules that a victim passing a saving throw against a magical attack feels some effect, which warns the victim that he has been assaulted) Level 4 Range : 0 Components : V Duration : 1 round/ level Cast Time : 4 Area : The caster Save : Special This devious spell causes the victims of spells cast with no visible effect in the duration of Missa's charm of magical obliviousness to experience no untoward effects from said magic - even if the save is successful. Spells which have an obvious effect will (obviously) not be effective with this spell (the spell will only enhance magic which has no visible effect - charms and suchlike). However, there may be grey areas, so a creature targeted by a polymorph other spell enhanced by this metamagic who fails his save will certainly realise that he has been polymorphed - but if he successfully saves he will experience nothing, so the enchanter may not be noticed. Note that the spell does not negate the need for verbal, physical and material components for spells cast in the duration of the charm, so a wizard in clear view will most likely be detected anyway. Missa's Spellgifting (Enchantment/Metamagic) Level 5 Range : 10 yards Components : V,S,M Duration : l round/level Cast Time : 5 Area : Special Save : None Bestow Enchantment allows the enchanter to cast caster only spells upon others. Thus, he could grant a fire shield spell to a comrade, or give him the benefits of a blink spell. Caster only spells are granted a range of 10 yards, and must be cast within the bestow enchantments area of effect for the magic to be effective. (note this spell is a plagiarised from an old Dragon magazine spell. Apologies if the person that wrote it is on this list!) LEVEL 6 Missa's Siren Song of Summons (Enchantment) Range : 1 mile Components : V,S,M Duration : Special Cast Time : 1 turn Area : Special Save : Negates This spell is only effective if the wizard possesses the Singing proficiency. The enchantress must sing a haunting song for one full turn for the spell to be effective. The spells magic can target all sleeping creatures within one mile of the caster. Sleepers of upto 2 HD get no save against the spell. Creatures of >2 HD but less than 5HD are entitled to a save at -2. The save of those of higher HD is unaffected. Those of a level higher than the caster are unaffected. Sleepers affected by the spells magic will sleepwalk to the source of the song. Sleepwalkers move at a slow walking speed, and will take the most expedient route to the source of the song. A sleepwalker is capable of opening windows, unlocking doors etc. in his attempt to reach the source. If possible a sleepwalker will attempt to avoid those who are awake (eg a sleepwalker in his bedroom would exit through a window if the room beyond the bedroom contained conscious people). To sleepers the casters singing is easily heard. To those who are awake the singing is not magically enhanced - thus if the caster is a long way away(upto the range of 1 mile) the sound may be inaudible. Sleepwalkers walk to the casters location and stand passively until they awaken normally. They may be awoken by a physical attack, but not by other stimuli (sounds, bright lights etc. have no effect). While asleep the caster may implant each with a suggestion (as the spell) of upto twenty words length. If required the caster may choose a specific type of target for the spell - children, wizards, humans and women are all appropriate selections. More esoteric selections - cryptomancers, members of the Unseen Hand, those with intelligence greater than 15 - are unacceptable. The spell requires the tongue of a siren. Spells no enchantress should be without... Cheerz ROB *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 4 Jun 1998 18:28:20 +0300 From: "Aleksei Andrievski" Subject: [MYSTARA] - Ethengar's invasion I was just looking at the map of Glantri, and I am wondering why Moglai chose to go through the hilly Boldavia and Klantyre, when there is another, shorter, and much flatter route: through Belcadiz, directly to Glantri City! That way, Moglai would have had to fight only the forces in Belcadiz, as opposed to all those others. See my point? ****************** Aleksei Andrievski aka Solmyr, Archmage of the Azure Star Visit the Archmage's Tower at http://www.geocities.com/TimesSquare/Fortress/2198/index.html *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 4 Jun 1998 18:29:53 +0300 From: "Aleksei Andrievski" Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Almanac/Glantri >Yes, but this is AD&D. >Is there something in OD&D that prevents a mage from casting if he lacks a one hand? I think the RC flatly states that a mage must be free to speak and move his hands to cast any spell. ****************** Aleksei Andrievski aka Solmyr, Archmage of the Azure Star Visit the Archmage's Tower at http://www.geocities.com/TimesSquare/Fortress/2198/index.html *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 04 Jun 1998 19:11:21 +0000 (GMT) From: Gordon McCormick Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Genders in Mystara >Despite this, though, we've got a good balance - 2 men, two women, and everyone has fun. Actually, come to think of it, I've only ever met two people who were willing to play a character of the opposite gender. How is it for everyone else? In my Glantrian Campaign I've got 2 male players playing 2 male PC's, one female player playing female PC. In my "Posse rides around the world killing things and fighting for Justice (and gold)" campaign, umn, 2 males playing males, 2 males playing females, one female playing female, one female playing male, phew :) And yup, we too have the Male(female) chatting up the Female(Male) which causes much fun :) gordon "In war there is no Justice. No Hope. There is only Death. Oh, and six $#!T mad PC's killing everything." (Poem from several years ago by one of my players...just sprung into my head there :) ) *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 04 Jun 1998 20:12:18 +0200 From: DM Subject: [MYSTARA] - Spelljammer and Mystara (was: Why Mystara?) At 19.58 03/06/98 +0200, Haavard wrote: >I think Spelljammers still work in Mystara Space. However, people on Mystara do not know how to make such ships. Rather they have Voidships. Its a unique feature about Mystara. Krynn has (had) Gnomish sidewheelers, we have Voidships. Right Haavard! that's the way it works. Spelljammers are different from Mystaran Voidships and from gnomish sidewheelers however. In fact, Gnomish Sidewheelers are said to be powered by spelljamming engines that the gnomes built without knowing it, whereas Mystaran Skyships are crafted in a totally different way from Spelljammers. They are much more expensive, time consuming and difficult to build in comparison to Spelljamming ships, and they're also much slower (both inside atmosphere and in Voidspace) speaking of Impulse (Tactical) speed. When it comes to Warp (Spelljamming) speed, they work the same. we can say that Mystaran skyships are to Spelljammers the same thing the old Fokkers were to modern days Tornado or F-15 >I suggest that there is a gate to one of the Crystal spheres somewhere in Mystaras Solar system. It is large enough for any ship to pass through it, though it has not been found yet. IMO that is the best way of linking Mystara with Spelljammer. I really liked Robert Fry's theory about Mystaraspace: a big energetic field surrounds Mystaraspace and it acts in a strange way, making (as i suggested) spelljamming engines who punch thru it appear outside the Mystaran Crystal Sphere, in the Phlogiston, while any other engine powered ship appears outside the mystaran solar system in the Milky way... Also, Dark Sun is not outside Spelljammer's universe: the fact is you can enter its sphere only using psionic helms or any other psionic powered engine. >You mentioned Athas as a comparison in several of your mails. I think Dark Sun in an amazing example of how flexible the AD&D system can be if one really wants it to be. I think it may be a good idea to borrow some optional rules from Dark Sun to describe Mystara. How about having D&D 36th level characters equal 30th level AD&D characters, using a few rules from DS to flesh them out? >From what i know of AD&D, i'd say a AD&D 20th level guy is pretty much similar to a D&D 36th level guy. Simply imagine that any AD&D level from 13th is equal 3 D&D levels (so AD&D 13th = D&D 13th/14th/15th, AD&D 14th = D&D 16th/17th/18th, etc.). DS players are another matter: they surpass even the more powerful average Joe of FR, and that's because of the nature of their land (which has been designed to be toughguyland or munchkinia ;)). I don't think a Mystaran 36th level biclassed PC could be a match for an Athasian 30th level character (maybe an Eternal could prove tough enough...) :=) DM *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 04 Jun 1998 11:36:49 PDT From: "George Valencia" Subject: [MYSTARA] - Almanac-Sind/WDL After Reading the Almanac, i'm Surprised that the WDL didn't get news of The Liberation of Nagpuri, and moved in to defend it. I thought they would have move into Mahasabad in Three weeks on Nagpuri being liberated, to set the Free Kingdom of Sind. This is George Valencia, writing on his last day as a regular on the MML I take life with a grain of salt...a slice of lemon, and a shot tequila. ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 4 Jun 1998 14:51:59 -0400 (EDT) From: Mischa E Gelman Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Politicized analogies >Admittedly this is off-topic; I'll stay off it if you likewise avoid partisan political examples in your analogies that not everyone can agree to. I took most of the discussion to private email. I think Pierre was right in replying to the list, as he feels I am using bad examples to make my argument. I am arguing off-list with him on these topics but would like to say I will not avoid an example just because it may be perceived as partisan or because not everyone agrees. Everyone on the list is freely capable of thinking for themselves on such matters and if they wish to disagree please do so. I don't mind seeing such replies on the list when they stray off-topic except when they turn into long back-and-forth arguments irrelevant to the list and better handled off-list. So, there is no need to stay away from these topics. Let's just handle them in private once they veer into non-Mystara debates and let's feel free to argue any time we see someone use an example, argument or analogy we don't feel comfortable with. A little discussion never hurts, even in ideological matters. Sorry about that off-topic post...just felt a little clarification at how I look at matters on the list would help (especially if many others do not feel the same way - please let me now). - -Mischa Gelman School of Social Work University of Pittsburgh *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 04 Jun 1998 15:34:32 -0400 From: "Joseph T. Curtin" Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Why Mystara? SteelAngel wrote: >On Tue, 2 Jun 1998, Jesse LaBranche wrote: >>I'm not exactly sure what the comment was meant to imply either. Are you saying that you do think something in Mystara should separate it from the Planescape/Spelljammer systems ? >No, I'm referring to a previous post by me that says that the AD&D Gods are relatively weak immortals (i.e, Immortals are immune to less than +5 weapons, all magics except if cast by another immortal, and cannot die unless killed on their home plane.) From What I know of AD&D gods, they can be destroyed by *MORTALS* and if you read the Great Net Spellbook, ressurected by them too. In First Edition AD&D, they were like this. In 2nd Edition, this was changed; those statistics from 1st Ed. are the stats for the gods' avatars, and the gods themselves were made to be so that they only have these physical forms when they want to (i.e. in avatar form), and the gods are so powerful they don't have statistics. Sean Curtin *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ End of mystara-digest V1997 #387 ******************************** *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara' as the body of the message. mystara-digest Friday, June 5 1998 Volume 1997 : Number 388 Mystara is a trademark of TSR Inc. All Rights Reserved. The following topics are covered in this digest: Re: [MYSTARA] -Alphatian Council Re: [MYSTARA] - Almanac/Glantri Re: [MYSTARA] - MYSTARA RISING PROJECT Re: [MYSTARA] - MYSTARA RISING PROJECT Re: [MYSTARA] - Some new Enchantment spells... Re: [MYSTARA] - Genders in Mystara [MYSTARA] - A few thoughts [MYSTARA] - Bye George! [MYSTARA] - ? Re: [MYSTARA] - The NoS and Entropy Re: [MYSTARA] -Alphatian Council [MYSTARA] - Sylvan Realm ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Thu, 4 Jun 1998 16:16:51 EDT From: Inconu@aol.com Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] -Alphatian Council << If you say, that a person earns 1 XP per 1 GP earned than we have an interesting effect: >> I didn't think anyone actually employed that rule to thier campaigns..... - -Inconu *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 4 Jun 1998 16:59:40 -0400 (EDT) From: Glen Sprigg Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Almanac/Glantri At 04:47 PM 6/4/98 CEST, you wrote: >>It did.. Hel Suffered a MAJOR Stroke (Loss of face, followers, and you can't sleep well at night cause they're all laughing at you!!) >I know, but why? >I mean, if the new NoS is helpful to Entropy, Hel should have gained a major "unstroke" (how's that called), and not suffered from a stroke. And there wouldn't have been a reason to remove her from Reigning Hierarch status if she gave Entropy such a great boost (and new tool). The new Nucleus of the Spheres is NOT helpful to Entropy; originally, it drew power off from the Sphere of Energy, slowly draining the magic from Mystara. That's what started the Wrath War in the first place; Ixion told Rad to 'STOP SCREWING WITH MYSTARA!!!' Rad told him what to go do with himself, and things got a bit out of hand. Kind of like a Tyson boxing match, only moreso. When the Doomsday Weapon was destroyed, it changed the NoS. Quote from WotI, Book II, pg. 70: "The creature's return into the Nucleus alters it permanently to draw negative energy, the source of Entropy's power." And later, "Now that the Nucleus of the Spheres is drawing its power from the Sphere of Entropy..." Therefore, the Sphere is now doing to Entropy what it used to do to Energy; weaken it. This is why Hel and company suffered a major stroke, and why Thanatos is now the big guy in the Sphere of Entropy, which is being slowly weakened by the altered NoS. Glen *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 04 Jun 1998 14:20:31 PDT From: "George Valencia" Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - MYSTARA RISING PROJECT >What is the TSR's Writers Workshop? Something on GenCon? How about providing some information? Please? :) >Sincerely, >Haavard Well, Haavard, the TSR Writers Workshop, is where people go to learn how to write module and develope a setting, sometime they might have you work and a project in an official TSR setting. It's set in Seattle during the last week of May, and it's a the site of Magic World's Championship. That all the info i have ATM. Mystara Online Final Update on the Html version of the Almanac. - ---------------------------------------------------------------- The Entire almanac is now complete, all the files send to us on the MML have successfully transfered from my E-mail account to my web site. BTW this is my last post as an official member of the mailing list until i return from my assignment. Those who wish to e-mail me, any new Ideas or wish to contribute to my own Mystara Module: Attack of the Radiance Dragon, please E-mail me at mktriton@hotmail.com So long, and i Shall return. I take life with a grain of salt...a slice of lemon, and a shot tequila. Bartender, i want you to pass 225 shots of tequila, one for me, and all my friends on the MML! Bartender: You got it, Boss. Bye-Bye ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 04 Jun 1998 14:23:32 PDT From: "George Valencia" Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - MYSTARA RISING PROJECT Please ignore the earlier, incomplete post, my son grabbed the mouse and push send earlier today. (me: It's the Tomb of Horrors for your character. Jordi: no, dad please i'm ready it, noooooooooo me: tough) >What is the TSR's Writers Workshop? Something on GenCon? How about providing some information? Please? :) >Sincerely, >Haavard Well, Haavard, the TSR Writers Workshop, is where people go to learn how to write module and develope a setting, sometime they might have you work and a project in an official TSR setting. It's set in Seattle during the last week of May, and it's a the site of Magic World's Championship. That all the info i have ATM. Mystara Online Final Update on the Html version of the Almanac. - ---------------------------------------------------------------- The Entire almanac is now complete, all the files send to us on the MML have successfully transfered from my E-mail account to my web site. BTW this is my last post as an official member of the mailing list until i return from my assignment. Those who wish to e-mail me, any new Ideas or wish to contribute to my own Mystara Module: Attack of the Radiance Dragon, please E-mail me at mktriton@hotmail.com So long, and i Shall return. I take life with a grain of salt...a slice of lemon, and a shot tequila. Bartender, i want you to pass 225 shots of tequila, one for me, and all my friends on the MML! Bartender: You got it, Boss. Bye-Bye, This is George Valencia Signing Off ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 4 Jun 1998 17:17:34 -0400 (EDT) From: Glen Sprigg Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Some new Enchantment spells... At 06:57 PM 6/4/98 +0100, you wrote: >Heres some new spells, invented by the mistress of the mind, Missa... (and recurring evil NPC villain!) (and I apologise for the AD+D format...) Oh, God...more spells. Well, I suppose I can find a use for them... Just kidding; nice work, especially on the theme. These are a nice change from the old 'fireball-lightning bolt-ice storm-cloudkill' kill-everything-in-sight spells that are so popular. Enchantment has not been as neglected as Divination and Abjuration, but it isn't the most complete school, either. These add a nice touch for any evil, seductive enchantress in the campaign (and even give a reason to put one in :-) ) Glen *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 4 Jun 1998 17:20:44 -0400 (EDT) From: Glen Sprigg Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Genders in Mystara At 07:11 PM 6/4/98 +0000, you wrote: >>Despite this, though, we've got a good balance - 2 men, two women, and everyone has fun. Actually, come to think of it, I've only ever met two people who were willing to play a character of the opposite gender. How is it for everyone else? It's been a while since I gamed, but I have played a female character on three occasions. The first was a half-dryad ranger, who had a really bad day with the dice and was killed by poison spiders. The second was a tournament character, because there were six male players and one female character in the tournament. I was one of two good PCs; not a lot of fun, really. The third was in the second round of the same tournament, and the less said about that the better. Suffice to say that the writer decided that 'scoring' would have a double meaning, and made the elves bisexual. I wasn't unhappy that we didn't win that one. Glen *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 4 Jun 1998 18:54:48 -0700 From: "Jesse LaBranche" Subject: [MYSTARA] - A few thoughts I'm interested in getting into the workshop- can someone give more information on this please ? I was just noticing, from one of the posts, that there are about 250 people on this list. That's about how many the RL list has. I think that this goes to show something about the number of people interested. On that note, FR only has about 750 members. Later. Jesse. *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 05 Jun 1998 17:46:02 +0200 From: DM Subject: [MYSTARA] - Bye George! At 14.20 04/06/98 PDT, George Valencia wrote: SSo long, and i Shall return. I never doubted it.. :) >I take life with a grain of salt...a slice of lemon, and a shot tequila. >Bartender, i want you to pass 225 shots of tequila, one for me, and all my friends on the MML! I'll take the other 225 if nobody minds... ;p >Bye-Bye Seeya George! Have a good time and enjoy your holidays (or whatever/whoever is keeping you out of the MML..) :) DM *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 5 Jun 1998 13:40:06 -0400 (EDT) From: SteelAngel Subject: [MYSTARA] - ? Did the listserv go down last night? All my messages got bounced back to me. Max IV *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 5 Jun 1998 13:41:26 -0400 (EDT) From: SteelAngel Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - The NoS and Entropy On Thu, 4 Jun 1998, Rob wrote: >When the NoS was draining Energy, it affected magic, causing the DoD. Nope. the DoD happened because the Radience went into Magical overload, causing a week without magic. The later days of Dread are remnants of Immortals trying to salvage as much as they could of Mystaran Magic. >What if its draining Entropy? Will people start living longer or something? put a strain on the worlds ecosystem? ??? suggestions anyone? The Radience Runs on Entropy because there is too much of it. The Entropic Immortals were becoming too strong, and I think that the Old One knew that, and modified accordingly. Also, looking at the wild changes that the KW has gone through since WotI, Entropy is ever increasing, balanced only by the NoS's drain on the sphere. Max IV *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 5 Jun 1998 13:41:46 -0400 (EDT) From: SteelAngel Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] -Alphatian Council On Thu, 4 Jun 1998 Inconu@aol.com wrote: >I didn't think anyone actually employed that rule to thier campaigns..... I did, to an extent. If a theif pickpocketed a whole bagful of loot from a completely unsuspecting higher level character, and walked away, I'd give him a bonus of 1XP/GP, or PP if it was a lot of loot. But for treasure found in dungeons? Or Salaries? That's about as dumb as the "Levelmaker" From the Book of Wondrous Inventions. Max IV *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 5 Jun 1998 17:36:12 -0400 (EDT) From: au998@freenet.carleton.ca (Geoff Gander) Subject: [MYSTARA] - Sylvan Realm Steel Angel wrote: >Ahh, but it was described in the same Dragon Article, when Haldemar said that the map was wrong. He said it was the Joke of a Gnomish King living in Karameikos, who sent emmisarries to Thyatis as a Joke. >(I beleive that there is a mention of a King Dorfin In the Book of Wondrous Inventions. From this reference I get that he is In Karameikos.) This is correct. I was reading through AC11 last night for my own nefarious purposes (which will become clear next year MWAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!!!), and, indeed, he is in Karameikos, by all appearances. Geoff - -- Geoff Gander, BA 97 Cartographer/Game Designer/Government Peon au998@freenet.carleton.ca *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ End of mystara-digest V1997 #388 ******************************** *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara' as the body of the message. mystara-digest Saturday, June 6 1998 Volume 1997 : Number 389 Mystara is a trademark of TSR Inc. All Rights Reserved. The following topics are covered in this digest: [MYSTARA] - More Sylvan Realm [MYSTARA] - Oops! [MYSTARA] - Sylvan Realm [MYSTARA] - [ADMIN] Interrupted Service at MPGN Re: [MYSTARA] - Almanac-Sind/WDL [none] [MYSTARA] - [Mystara] Re: Other places on Mystara [MYSTARA] - [Mystara] Re: Sylvan Realm [MYSTARA] - [Mystara] Re: Almanac Re: [MYSTARA] - The NoS and Entropy Re: [MYSTARA] - [Mystara] Re: Other places on Mystara Re: [MYSTARA] - [Mystara] Re: Sylvan Realm Re: [MYSTARA] - [Mystara] Re: Almanac [MYSTARA] - Midland Forest Re: [MYSTARA] - The NoS and Entropy [MYSTARA] - MYSTARA - Almanac/Glantri [MYSTARA] - MYSTARA - Immortals,Planes, etal. [MYSTARA] - Rangers Re: [MYSTARA] - The NoS and Entropy [MYSTARA] - The Circle of Alchemy [MYSTARA] - MYSTARA - Immortals Re: [MYSTARA] - The Circle of Alchemy [none] Re: [MYSTARA] - The Circle of Alchemy [MYSTARA] - Greetings from Northern Europe Re: [MYSTARA] - The NoS and Entropy ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Fri, 5 Jun 1998 17:37:27 -0400 (EDT) From: au998@freenet.carleton.ca (Geoff Gander) Subject: [MYSTARA] - More Sylvan Realm - -- Geoff Gander, BA 97 Cartographer/Game Designer/Government Peon au998@freenet.carleton.ca *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 5 Jun 1998 17:46:13 -0400 (EDT) From: au998@freenet.carleton.ca (Geoff Gander) Subject: [MYSTARA] - Oops! Please ignore the empty post - my mistake :-( Sorry 'bout that! Geoff - -- Geoff Gander, BA 97 Cartographer/Game Designer/Government Peon au998@freenet.carleton.ca *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 5 Jun 1998 17:47:38 -0400 (EDT) From: au998@freenet.carleton.ca (Geoff Gander) Subject: [MYSTARA] - Sylvan Realm Marco of DM said: >First of all, SR location: i've always thought it was located on the west coast, south of Hyborea and north of Arm of the Immortals, and this is mainly because of CM7 map (which shows a body of water west of the SR -i thought it was the western unnamed ocean) and of GAZ5 map, which shows clearly where Ilsundal's migration stopped (on the west coast of Brun). However, since CM7 says that the SR was surrounded by many humans who threatened their woods (and Moorkroft is their self-styled king/tyrant), how do you explain that nobody in the Savage Coast 8not even the Sea Powers) knows of this place and Moorkroft's kingdom? Perhaps the Endworld Line (I think that's what the western mountains are called) is an effective barrier between west and east. If Gombar and Suma'a have not contacted the Savage Coast nations yet because of the high mountains and rough seas, and they're closer together, then I can't see how Mookroft's land would contact the eastern realms. IMO, his nation would be long and thin - sort of like Chile. Geoff - -- Geoff Gander, BA 97 Cartographer/Game Designer/Government Peon au998@freenet.carleton.ca *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 5 Jun 1998 18:48:18 -0600 From: "Leroy Van Camp III" Subject: [MYSTARA] - [ADMIN] Interrupted Service at MPGN SteelAngel meandered fecklessly... >Did the listserv go down last night? All my messages got bounced back to me. Yes, all lists at MPGN went down for some reason. Chances are anything posted at that time was rejected. Everything seems fine now. Leroy Van Camp III malacoda@lesbois.com owner-mystara-l@mpgn.com ICQ #4253672 "You know, not kneeing you in the groin is a constant struggle." MST3K *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 06 Jun 1998 00:44:42 -0700 (MST) From: "Cthulhudrew, The Great Old One" Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Almanac-Sind/WDL On Thu, 4 Jun 1998, George Valencia wrote: >After Reading the Almanac, i'm Surprised that the WDL didn't get news of The Liberation of Nagpuri, and moved in to defend it. I thought they would have move into Mahasabad in Three weeks on Nagpuri being liberated, to set the Free Kingdom of Sind. Darokin is a bit tied up this year (the Lich events and the Atruaghin events), and the only other WDL nations close enough at present, the Shires and Karameikos (the only ones left, too) are too far away to be viable sources of help. You can either a) assume the border situation between Darokin and Sind was too chaotic for them to send any aid yet, or b) assume that Darokin has agents working on the inside and may also have sent support troops to Nagpuri. For the record, I did mean to give some more Darokin involvment this year, but but didn't get around to it. As it stands, the events given end early enough in the year that you can feel free to add a lot of other stuff. Look for a lot more involvement by Darokin and the WDL in Sind next year, though. - ------------------------ Cthuludrew, the Great Old One (aka Andrew Theisen, mild mannered *former* college student) "Actions have consequences." URL- http://www.public.asu.edu/~jsmill *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 6 Jun 1998 05:04:44 -0400 (EDT) From: Pierre Savoie Subject: [none] I had some difficulty mailing an item on Thursday to this list; it came back as follows >|------------------------- Failed addresses follow:---------------------| mystara-l@mpgn.com ... transport smtp: 554 Switch map aliases: unknown member map aliases.dns >|------------------------- Message text follows: ------------------------| Date: Thu, 4 Jun 1998 21:32:06 -0400 (EDT) From: Pierre Savoie Subject: TSR Module Survey >To: Mystara-L >Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 >Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Why would this happen? Anyway, the text is as follows for your consideration: >Boy, I get behind in my reading of RPG magazines, and I miss important stuff. TSR is including mail-in surveys where you choose four of your favorite classic modules, and they'll reprint the most popular ones. II'm selecting four D&D ones only, and urging them to reissue the original D&D game as well in a special Silver Anniversary book. The mail-in ballot is available in several magazines (such as SHADIS #46), and the deadline is July 31. - ---Pierre Savoie (ab966@torfree.net) *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 6 Jun 1998 12:42:23 +0200 (MET DST) From: =?iso-8859-1?Q?H=E5vard_R=F8nne_Faanes?= Subject: [MYSTARA] - [Mystara] Re: Other places on Mystara >Håvard Rųnne Faanes wrote: >>Ofcourse some areas have already been developed in more recent products. I >>agree that the Midland forest is interesting. I suggest that it is not populated by elves, but rather that it is a kingdom of Treants. (and Gr-hmm..what are they called again, those Treant look-alikes from the Creature Catalogue.) Also, there are probably quite a few other sylvan races in that area. I think it might be a good idea if Oberon moved there >>after WotI. >Gakarak? The forest brooders I think are the ones you mean. How about centaurs? They don't seem to have a land and have been a part of fantasy as long as the elf. Perhaps a large population of races from the Creature Crucible 1. Yes those are the ones. As for Centaurs I am developing(well, havent done much more than pondering yet) a nation of Centaurs in the area just west of Glantri. There seems to be some plains or hills there. Any ideas for those? Håvard *** Haavard R. Faanes (hoc@nvg.ntnu.no) http://www.nvg.ntnu.no/~hoc "Every turkey dies. Not all turkeys truly live." -Chef, South Park *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 6 Jun 1998 12:44:30 +0200 (MET DST) From: =?iso-8859-1?Q?H=E5vard_R=F8nne_Faanes?= Subject: [MYSTARA] - [Mystara] Re: Sylvan Realm On Wed, 3 Jun 1998, Galwylin wrote: >Håvard Rųnne Faanes wrote: >>There is a map in The Elves Of Alfheim (the Gaz) which shows elven migration. On this map, the location of the Sylvan realm is marked. If you >>have the Gaz, you find the map on page 6. It is quite far north on the western side of the mountain range, probably quite close to the coast. Looks like its by the coast, but the maps is not that detailed. >Man, I need an index. The CM7 map does show the Realm next to a body of water so its apparently on the coast. Looking at the GAZ5 map of the elven migration, I see the elves did pass through that large forest and beside the large lake. I wonder if any decided to remain there. It looked perfect for woodland elves to me from the RC map. Remember though, that they travelled using the Rainbow. So, unless they decided to jump off, they probably werent in that forest. Still, if you want to put elves there, I guess that would be a good reason. Håvard *** Haavard R. Faanes (hoc@nvg.ntnu.no) http://www.nvg.ntnu.no/~hoc "Every turkey dies. Not all turkeys truly live." -Chef, South Park *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 6 Jun 1998 12:46:42 +0200 (MET DST) From: =?iso-8859-1?Q?H=E5vard_R=F8nne_Faanes?= Subject: [MYSTARA] - [Mystara] Re: Almanac On Thu, 4 Jun 1998, Herve Musseau wrote: >From: > >>I think Rad would be very interested in this since, without this change, the brotherhood of the Radience will be furthering the cause of Entropy, and will possibly eventually cause the ddestruction >>of Glantri. >I'm wondering: How could using the NoS be furthering the cause of Entropy, if Hel suffered a major stroke at the end of WotI when the NoS was made into becoming Entropy-powered? Using it should hurt Entropy, shouldn't it? Well, this is from a theory by Bruce. Draining entropy doesn't work since draining is what Entropy is all about. In the short run, the NoS will be a blow against entropy, but in the long run, it will actually change and reverse its effect, thus strenghtening Entropy. I dont know if I accept, this, but it seems like most people do. (and since I dont have any better ideas..:) >Also, what did people think about the theory on the sphere of Principium that I introduced in the post #5 about Gareth? (hint) I think it is interesting. Wouldn't that make him a hierarch? I mean every Sphere must have a Hierarch... Håvard, *** Haavard R. Faanes (hoc@nvg.ntnu.no) http://www.nvg.ntnu.no/~hoc "Every turkey dies. Not all turkeys truly live." -Chef, South Park *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 06 Jun 1998 04:22:21 PDT From: "paul dooley" Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - The NoS and Entropy By the way where does it say anything about NoS allowing new Entropic immortals? I`ve no recollection of such. Isn`t it enough that they now have Rafiels reactor due to the changing face of Aengmor/Alfheim ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 06 Jun 1998 06:27:32 -0500 From: Galwylin Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - [Mystara] Re: Other places on Mystara Håvard Rųnne Faanes wrote: >Yes those are the ones. As for Centaurs I am developing(well, havent done much more than pondering yet) a nation of Centaurs in the area just west of Glantri. There seems to be some plains or hills there. Any ideas for those? I've looked at every map I had and still couldn't get a good idea exactly what's to the west of Glantri. I did see a few hills from one of the maps in the Champions of Mystara set. What kind of culture are you thinking of for centaurs. I've always pictured them Native American types (of course they lived in many different climates so that might not help). I just think of them as tribal. A nation of centaurs sounds interesting anywhere really (I still vote we move Ethengar or curse them with centaur forms. Doesn't that have a nice sound to it? The Ethengar Centaurs ;) BTW, I love the overview of the whole planet from the Rules Cyclopedia but it really lacks in providing much more than shape of the coastlines. What I wouldn't give for a flat map of Brun. - -- This has been a Galwylin© Production galwylin@airnet.net (ICQ #6755972) http://www.airnet.net/galwylin/ The Karameikan School of Magecraft http://www.geocities.com/TimesSquare/Realm/2336/ *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 06 Jun 1998 06:30:03 -0500 From: Galwylin Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - [Mystara] Re: Sylvan Realm Håvard Rųnne Faanes wrote: >Remember though, that they travelled using the Rainbow. So, unless they decided to jump off, they probably werent in that forest. Still, if you want to put elves there, I guess that would be a good reason. I see a tree, I put an elf there ;) I wonder why the lands of the elves are really so small. The Sylvan Realm seems especially small for a realm and Alfheim stuck in the middle of the Known World doesn't make me think of a large elven population. It must be that blasted Rules Cyclopedia map ;> - -- This has been a Galwylin© Production galwylin@airnet.net (ICQ #6755972) http://www.airnet.net/galwylin/ The Karameikan School of Magecraft http://www.geocities.com/TimesSquare/Realm/2336/ *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 06 Jun 1998 04:31:55 PDT From: "paul dooley" Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - [Mystara] Re: Almanac More details on this please for us newbies! <;-P >>Also, what did people think about the theory on the sphere of Date: Sat, 6 Jun 1998 09:40:11 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: phaser.Showcase.MPGN.COM: majordom set sender to owner-mystara-l@ using -f From: (mystara-digest) To: mystara-digest@Phaser.ShowCase.MPGN.COM Subject: mystara-digest V1997 #389 Reply-To: mystara@mpgn.com X-UIDL: 4ed4aa86b0b80342db6003e59b64d0d3 Principium that I introduced in the post #5 about Gareth? ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 06 Jun 1998 06:39:52 -0500 From: Galwylin Subject: [MYSTARA] - Midland Forest Well, this forest has caught the gleam of my eye lately. I think if I was developing it, I'd have a lot of the woodland races (including elves, of course) make their homes there but I don't think I'd be setting up nations. Just lots of claimed territory with most of it unclaimed. I'm wondering what some ideas the list have for such a large area. Maybe the only true human rangers found in Mystara make their home there? BTW, is the forester that different from the ranger class? I think they seem to be the same from what I remember of AD&D 1st edition. Or would a Mystaran ranger lack any type of spell (essentually a fighter with forest survival skills and knowledge). Just supposing... - -- This has been a Galwylin© Production galwylin@airnet.net (ICQ #6755972) http://www.airnet.net/galwylin/ The Karameikan School of Magecraft http://www.geocities.com/TimesSquare/Realm/2336/ *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 06 Jun 1998 06:47:17 -0500 From: Galwylin Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - The NoS and Entropy paul dooley wrote: >By the way where does it say anything about NoS allowing new Entropic immortals? I`ve no recollection of such. Isn`t it enough that they now have Rafiels reactor due to the changing face of Aengmor/Alfheim I don't remember that either. Really the only thing I did like about the whole NoS draining Entropy was that it would add to the touch of evil Glantri fits so well with in my view. I'd just would like it to exist without draining anything. I've never cared for the idea that a magical world has to lose its magic in the future. I've yet to hear of a world that gains magic in its future but there seem to be plenty that lose it. As soon as much of the magic is gone, Mystara will be destroyed. Its got a sun in the middle of it and hollow. It can't sustain itself without magic. And if the NoS is draining magic, then the Immortals will never rest until its gone IMO. Entropics are going to be too please that its feeding on them either. Maybe its time a chonomancer returns to the past and prevents the destruction of Blackmoor and the Beagle ever reaching Mystara. - -- This has been a Galwylin© Production galwylin@airnet.net (ICQ #6755972) http://www.airnet.net/galwylin/ The Karameikan School of Magecraft http://www.geocities.com/TimesSquare/Realm/2336/ *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 06 Jun 1998 04:52:12 PDT From: "paul dooley" Subject: [MYSTARA] - MYSTARA - Almanac/Glantri In my posting I did say a scroll people. Im well aware Jagger is an invoker and its his stats (Int for black box, Wis for cyclo.) that let him down not his level. All Im getting at is that a70ish mage prince for 30ish years expert dragon hunter could have an item with either form. As G:Kom says p24 `Additionally, some (but not necessarily all) of a characters favourite spells, languages, proficiencies, and equipment (including Magic items). If you have a scroll, ring, sword etc with a wish or ltd wish would you boast about it in Glantri? Another way is to give his mother access to one in KoM shes listed as mage 20, and the politicing going on about who gets Jaggers positions etc would force her hand to keep the families position. Then theres Herr Doktor Rolf, Jaggers oldest friend, would a 4th circle alchemist not know how to make a balm of regeneration etc.If not it wouldnt take him long to learn (assuming you lot havent already killed him off), and Since Jagger is Known to do all his busness from home (its in his dracology stuff) he could be ok again before he has to go to meet the other princes. Ive already posted my dragon idea havent I? Problem with this though is it doesnt scope with Diamonds writeup in WotI. ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 06 Jun 1998 05:07:27 PDT From: "paul dooley" Subject: [MYSTARA] - MYSTARA - Immortals,Planes, etal. Heres a thought which can`t be new but I`d like some response anyway. What if ALL Immortal special abilities are just natural characteristics of Mystara multiverse planes? The rules in WotI bk1 p66-7 allow ` no mortal or immortal magic` so this sort of holds water. Imagine your on a plane where you can be hit by mortal weapons and magic, its the entryway to where your enemy actuall resides and youve got to run the gauntlet of it as though you were a mere mortal! SCARY!!!! This also explains why immortals dont just take over FR, DL etc. Theyre only mortals there powerfulyes but still MORTAL. Going the otherway so a gods avatar appears in Mystaraverse, Council of intrusion (5 heirarchs) shows them the way home firmly ! ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 6 Jun 1998 13:12:45 +0100 From: "Rob" Subject: [MYSTARA] - Rangers >BTW, is the forester that different from the ranger class? I think they seem to be the same from what I remember of AD&D 1st edition. Or would a Mystaran ranger lack any type of spell (essentually a fighter with forest survival skills and knowledge). Just supposing... Well, i think rangers are accepted part of AD+D Mystara, at least on the Savage Coast. Lupin rangers are supposed to be quite common. Cheerz ROB *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 6 Jun 1998 13:14:43 +0100 From: "Rob" Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - The NoS and Entropy >chonomancer returns to the past and prevents the destruction of Blackmoor and the Beagle ever reaching Mystara. Now heres a thought... a chronomancer went back in time to stop the Beagle from landing on Mystara by sabotaging it before it got near Mystara. Sadly, it was this act of sabotage that made it crash on Mystara in the first place. Cue the PCs to persuade the chronomancer not to do it... Cheerz ROB *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 6 Jun 1998 13:21:50 +0100 From: "Rob" Subject: [MYSTARA] - The Circle of Alchemy - --- >Then theres Herr Doktor Rolf, Jaggers oldest friend, would a 4th circle alchemist not know how to make a balm of regeneration etc. A point Id like to ask - whats everybodies opinion of what Alchemy can do? Its very much up to the individual DM, i know, but would a regeneration be beyond its power? IMC the resident party alchemist can make this sort of stuff... 1st circle 2nd circle Gunpowder (3d6 charges per use, nonmagical) Fly potion Neutralise poison Polymorph self Sleep gas (as sleep spell) Clairvoyance Flash powder Stink bomb (as stinking cloud) the 3rd circle changes any mineral into any other mineral, basically the 4th circle is also quite broad. Is its raising the dead ability a raise dead or a resurrection do you think? Is it possible to regenerate limbs with it (this ability is probably the most powerful of all the 4th circle abilities) or would you need the 5th circle to regenerate a limb (as the 5th circle deals with living matter) Any thoughts? Cheerz ROB *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 06 Jun 1998 05:24:51 PDT From: "paul dooley" Subject: [MYSTARA] - MYSTARA - Immortals IMC Rad made it all the way back, so what happened to his old job, did he become head of school again? I was under the opinion that Hel lost face due to her appearance in WotI to save her Balthac scam. Rheddrian was the one who scored the stroke against her. What punishment did Alphaks recieve for his rockthrowing? Didnt Vanya break the rules when she Immortal level cursed Thincol (WotI bk1 p5-6)? There are plenty of other Immortals who would just love to expose this arent there eg `why will you not heal our mighty emperor o mighty (insert name here)?` . answer `because another immortal has cursed him` the rest is, as they say, history. ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 06 Jun 1998 05:47:27 PDT From: "paul dooley" Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - The Circle of Alchemy Rob said >A point Id like to ask - whats everybodies opinion of what Alchemy can do? Well according to KoM the second circle power `Magical Preperation` the alchemist doesnt even need to know the spell hes researching. I mentions cure serious I think and thats clerical!! ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 06 Jun 1998 05:56:25 PDT From: "paul dooley" Subject: [none] SORRY ALL!! I think i just ballsed up again. the comp locked up as i was trying to repond to rob posting about alchemy and ive got a feeling that it may have multiposted all of robs message without even adding my reply <;-P ttfn, Paul ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 06 Jun 1998 05:59:22 PDT From: "paul dooley" Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - The Circle of Alchemy Rob said >A point Id like to ask - whats everybodies opinion of what Alchemy can do? according to KoM 2nd circle powercan be used to make anything even clerical to my recollection ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 6 Jun 1998 14:28:09 +0100 From: elrond@post.olivant.fo (Jakup Michaelsen) Subject: [MYSTARA] - Greetings from Northern Europe Hi. I'm new to this list and to RPGs as well. My name is Jakup Michaelsen, I'm from the Faroe Islands - 18 islands in the North Atlantic - and I'm 18 years old. I've alwasy been fasinated by RPGs. Back in my early teens I started hearing rumours of the "satanic game". Of course I grew *very* curious. After reading a bit about it I really wanted to play. But everyone here was "satanic panicked", so I didn't dare. A few years went by and I finnaly had the guts to buy it - only to find it's out of print!!! I downloaded a christian rpg after getting Internet access - it wasn't really what I wanted, so I searched around for used games retailers on the Web. And yesterday I became the proud owner of Dungeons & Dragons! Anyway. Mystara sounds like a very interesting world. Which books should I buy to get started? Jakup the Ever-Nu-B *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 6 Jun 1998 09:39:49 EDT From: Magesmiley@aol.com Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - The NoS and Entropy In a message dated 98-06-06 08:23:27 EDT, you write: << >chonomancer returns to the past and prevents the destruction of Blackmoor and the Beagle ever reaching Mystara. Now heres a thought... a chronomancer went back in time to stop the Beagle from landing on Mystara by sabotaging it before it got near Mystara. Sadly, it was this act of sabotage that made it crash on Mystara in the first place. Cue the PCs to persuade the chronomancer not to do it... >> After dealing with the headaches of time travel several times I've found it easier (usually) to go with the theory that history's general course can not be changed, although specific events within can be modified. As an example suppose the PCs arrive on the Beagle to stop the chronomancer and succeed. Their first problem is that they are one step behind him all the way up to the time he ends up on the Beagle. The PCs do stop him, but unfortunately they are discovered by the Beagle's crew who promptly sound an intruder alert to deal with the PCs. This distracts the engineering crew who fail to notice an engine problem... Its even easier to follow this theory if the PCs don't realize exactly what part of history they're mucking around with at the time. If they don't understand or know what pivotal point in history they're at it is very easy for history to take its "pre-ordained" course. One other thing to think about is do you want history changed? If you're willing to see the entire world wiped out or drastically altered in the blink of an eye go for it. Typically though the easiest way to get such a "changed" world back to its original history is to make the world's changes for the worse. If the world is much worse off than the previous version of history the PCs will usually try and go undo the changes they made. Enough said - -Mage *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ End of mystara-digest V1997 #389 ******************************** *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara' as the body of the message. mystara-digest Saturday, June 6 1998 Volume 1997 : Number 390 Mystara is a trademark of TSR Inc. All Rights Reserved. The following topics are covered in this digest: Re: [MYSTARA] - The NoS and Entropy Re: [MYSTARA] - The NoS and Entropy [MYSTARA] - MYSTARA - NoS etc Re: [MYSTARA] - Greetings from Northern Europe Re: [MYSTARA] - The NoS and Entropy Re: [MYSTARA] - The NoS and Entropy Re: [MYSTARA] - Greetings from Northern Europe Re: [MYSTARA] - The NoS and Entropy Re: [MYSTARA] - [Mystara] Re: Other places on Mystara Re: [MYSTARA] - Almanac/Glantri [MYSTARA] - Celts on Mystara Re: [MYSTARA] - Why the Council of Alphatia is reasonable Re: [MYSTARA] - Midland Forest Re: [MYSTARA] - Almanac/Glantri [MYSTARA] - Genders in Mystara Re: [MYSTARA] - Greetings from Northern Europe Re: [MYSTARA] - The NoS and Entropy Re: [MYSTARA] - The NoS and Entropy Re: [MYSTARA] - The NoS and Entropy Re: [MYSTARA] - The NoS and Entropy Re: [MYSTARA] - [Mystara] Re: Other places on Mystara Re: [MYSTARA] - The NoS and Entropy Re: [MYSTARA] - The NoS and Entropy ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Sat, 6 Jun 1998 09:55:56 EDT From: Magesmiley@aol.com Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - The NoS and Entropy In a message dated 98-06-06 08:05:42 EDT, you write: << I don't remember that either. Really the only thing I did like about the whole NoS draining Entropy was that it would add to the touch of evil Glantri fits so well with in my view. I'd just would like it to exist without draining anything. I've never cared for the idea that a magical world has to lose its magic in the future. I've yet to hear of a world that gains magic in its future but there seem to be plenty that lose it. As soon as much of the magic is gone, Mystara will be destroyed. Its got a sun in the middle of it and hollow. It can't sustain itself without magic. And if the NoS is draining magic, then the Immortals will never rest until its gone IMO. Entropics are going to be too please that its feeding on them either. Maybe its time a chonomancer returns to the past and prevents the destruction of Blackmoor and the Beagle ever reaching Mystara. >> I'm going to throw a new theory into the fire on the draining effect. First off if the nucleus is draining magic shouldn't it be drawing power from the whole prime plane? But its not, its just draining magic from Mystara. My theory is that it isn't actually draining the magic, but doing something which has a very similar effect, specifically strengthening the anti-magical properties of the world shield. Think of it this way: the nucleus is slowly but surely drawing the extra magical power the extra power the wizards use from the world shield making it more and more anti-magical. Eventually this hits critical mass (annually) and all of the world's magic is sucked into world shield to counteract the magical deficit accumulated over the previous year. The increasing effects of the energy drain are explainable this way too. This would also explain why the engines failed on the Beagle. They overloaded when they received a massive surge of energy from the world shield. Pick the idea apart and have some fun with it. *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 6 Jun 1998 10:07:15 EDT From: Inconu@aol.com Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - The NoS and Entropy << Maybe its time a chonomancer returns to the past and prevents the destruction of Blackmoor and the Beagle ever reaching Mystara >> Chronomancers aren't allowed to travel to places in time like this. The Immortals must force them to a seprate place in time if this is attempted. - -Inconu *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 06 Jun 1998 07:14:37 PDT From: "paul dooley" Subject: [MYSTARA] - MYSTARA - NoS etc Another idea about all of this could be that Nos is affecting Mystaras megalith which makes it imperative that something is done. ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 6 Jun 1998 15:28:41 +0100 From: "Rob" Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Greetings from Northern Europe >Hi. >I'm new to this list and to RPGs as well. My name is Jakup Michaelsen, I'm from the Faroe Islands - 18 islands in the North Atlantic - and I'm 18 years old. >I've alwasy been fasinated by RPGs. Back in my early teens I started hearing rumours of the "satanic game". Of course I grew *very* curious. After reading a bit about it I really wanted to play. But everyone here was "satanic panicked", so I didn't dare. >A few years went by and I finnaly had the guts to buy it - only to find it's out of print!!! >I downloaded a christian rpg after getting Internet access - it wasn't really what I wanted, so I searched around for used games retailers on the Web. And yesterday I became the proud owner of Dungeons & Dragons! >Anyway. Mystara sounds like a very interesting world. Which books should I buy to get started? >Jakup the Ever-Nu-B Hi Ever Nu B... I'm surprised there is satan panic in the Faroe islands as well - I thought that was a USA thing. Anyway. Which books should i buy to get started... Sadly, Mystara is Out of Print, defunct, kaput... :( However, there is some stuff still about in the shops. I've seen the Red Steel box around quite a bit in the shops around here still, thats good stuff. The same goes for Karameikos, Kingdom of Adventure and Glantri, Kingdom of Magic. Sadly all these boxes are expensive (£21.50). Fortunately, a fair number of them are available free over the Internet at mpgn.com. !!! Get downloading, thats what I say! As I'm sure you have noticed, there are many web sites that are Mystara related (I was surprised just how many. I did a search on "TSR" to find the TSR home page, and had to sift through reams of Mystara sites... Anyway, pleased to greet the New Member... Cheerz ROB *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 6 Jun 1998 16:27:12 +0200 (MET DST) From: =?iso-8859-1?Q?H=E5vard_R=F8nne_Faanes?= Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - The NoS and Entropy On Sat, 6 Jun 1998 Inconu@aol.com wrote: ><< Maybe its time a >chonomancer returns to the past and prevents the destruction of Blackmoor and the Beagle ever reaching Mystara >> >Chronomancers aren't allowed to travel to places in time like this. The Immortals must force them to a seprate place in time if this is attempted. Well. Not if the Immortals arent watching. Or if Khoronus is in on it. Remember that the Glantri Gaz included a scenario for destroying the Nucleus of the Spheres, which involved destroying the reactor at the time of Blackmoor. Ofcourse, either of these attemptw would make the Known World a rather boring place. At the very best, very different. Håvard ** Haavard R. Faanes (hoc@nvg.ntnu.no) http://www.nvg.ntnu.no/~hoc "Every turkey dies. Not all turkeys truly live." -Chef, South Park *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 6 Jun 1998 15:34:00 +0100 From: "Rob" Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - The NoS and Entropy >After dealing with the headaches of time travel several times I've found it >easier (usually) to go with the theory that history's general course can not >be changed, although specific events within can be modified. As an example suppose the PCs arrive on the Beagle to stop the chronomancer and succeed. Their first problem is that they are one step behind him all the way up to the >time he ends up on the Beagle. The PCs do stop him, but unfortunately they are discovered by the Beagle's crew who promptly sound an intruder alert to deal with the PCs. This distracts the engineering crew who fail to notice an >engine problem... Oh, I 100% agree. Ive dabbled in a bit a chronomancy... Its this "momentum of history" thing. >Its even easier to follow this theory if the PCs don't realize exactly what >part of history they're mucking around with at the time. If they don't understand or know what pivotal point in history they're at it is very easy for history to take its "pre-ordained" course. OOne other thing to think about is do you want history changed? If you're willing to see the entire world wiped out or drastically altered in the blink >of an eye go for it. Typically though the easiest way to get such a "changed" >world back to its original history is to make the world's changes for the worse. If the world is much worse off than the previous version of history the PCs will usually try and go undo the changes they made. A side effect of this momentum of history thing is that basically, anything the DM says goes. If the DM wants to set up a change of history (or have the PCs try to prevent a change of history by an evil chronomancer) than the momentum of time will be helping them - thus giving the PCs every chance of completing the adventure successfully. If, on the other hand, they stray, they will soon find themselves running into difficulty. Its all very heavy handed, but in my experience the players still enjoy themselves, merely because they are able to time travel (which, lets face it, is pretty damn cool) and even quote Dr Who and Star Trek (see how many times you can say "time" in one sentence...) And thats it, for this time... ROB *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 6 Jun 1998 16:36:40 +0200 (MET DST) From: =?iso-8859-1?Q?H=E5vard_R=F8nne_Faanes?= Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Greetings from Northern Europe Hi Jakup! I though that stuff about roleplaying and Satamisn was mainly an american phenomenon. At least there wasn't too much fuzz about that in Norway. The problem with Mystara is that the books are really hard to find. So the best advice is, buy everything you can get your hands on. There were two boxes made for the AD&D game which shouldn't be too hard to find: Glantri: Kingdom of Magic and Karameikos: Kingdom of Adventure. Both are based on older D&D products which are far superior in quality, but they are probably hard to find. In the 80s TSR published a series of D&D Gazetteers. All of these describe various countries in Mystara. The best one are in my opinion: _The Principalities of Glantri_ , _The Elves of Alfheim_ and _The golden Khan of Ethengar_. You may also find _The Nortern Reaches_ interesting if you like the idea of playing a viking. (I do :) But as I said, many of these books are hard to find, so the best advice would be to get what you can. Håvard *** Haavard R. Faanes (hoc@nvg.ntnu.no) http://www.nvg.ntnu.no/~hoc "Every turkey dies. Not all turkeys truly live." -Chef, South Park *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 6 Jun 1998 16:45:50 +0200 (MET DST) From: =?iso-8859-1?Q?H=E5vard_R=F8nne_Faanes?= Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - The NoS and Entropy On Sat, 6 Jun 1998, paul dooley wrote: >By the way where does it say anything about NoS allowing new Entropic immortals? I`ve no recollection of such. WotI says that the NoS is draining Entropy. Bruce Heard explained the implications of this on the list a year ago or so. Basically the Nucleus of the Spheres(NoS) is now aligned with the Sphere of Entropy in all the ways it earlier was connected with the Sphere of Energy. (Draining energy from that Sphere, producing new Immortals into that Sphere etc..) Ofcourse Draining from Entropy only strengthens Entropy. Strange, but thats the way it is.. >Isn`t it enough that they now have Rafiels reactor due to the changing face of Aengmor/Alfheim I'm not sure if I understand this question. Rafiel's Chamber of the Stars has nothing to do with the changing of Alfheim or Entropy as far as I know..? Håvard *** Haavard R. Faanes (hoc@nvg.ntnu.no) http://www.nvg.ntnu.no/~hoc "Every turkey dies. Not all turkeys truly live." -Chef, South Park *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 6 Jun 1998 16:57:22 +0200 (MET DST) From: =?iso-8859-1?Q?H=E5vard_R=F8nne_Faanes?= Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - [Mystara] Re: Other places on Mystara On Sat, 6 Jun 1998, Galwylin wrote: >Håvard Rųnne Faanes wrote: >>Yes those are the ones. As for Centaurs I am developing(well, havent done much more than pondering yet) a nation of Centaurs in the area just west of Glantri. There seems to be some plains or hills there. Any ideas for those? >I've looked at every map I had and still couldn't get a good idea exactly what's to the west of Glantri. I did see a few hills from one of the maps in the Champions of Mystara set. What kind of culture are you thinking of for centaurs. I've always pictured them Native American types (of course they lived in many different climates so that might not help). I just think of them as tribal. A nation of centaurs sounds interesting anywhere really (I still vote we move Ethengar or curse them with centaur forms. Doesn't that have a nice sound to it? The Ethengar Centaurs ;) I was thinking that they might be tribal, or something similar. Though I have also been toying with the idea of a culture similar to the greek city states. I see them as a Bronze Age cultue, thus considered barbarians, but with deep knowledge in phisophy, music and poetry. Central in Centaur culture is the Sage. Centaur Sages have a function similar to druids in Celtic myth. They are not part of any tribe/clan and act as judges and councillors, respected by all. I've also been toying with the idea of Oracles, possibly connected with the seers of yavldon? As for the idea of the cursed ethengars, I was thinking about something similar. I though that these people whom I call Kantahri(from which Centaur is derived) are the descendants of theAfridhi, a nomadic people at the time of blackmoor. These people became so attached to their mounts that they went through a ceremony which merged them completely. Unfortunately, I don't know enough about Mystaras history to flesh this out any further. Any help is appreaciated. (BTW: David Mischa: thanks for the info on the Afridhi that you sent me some time ago :) >BTW, I love the overview of the whole planet from the Rules Cyclopedia but it really lacks in providing much more than shape of the coastlines. What I wouldn't give for a flat map of Brun. The old black Mastr Rules had one.. Anyway, I've been using the maps from the cyclopedia and HW boxed set and from what I see there it looks like the area west of glantri is one of plains, hills or light forest. It is big enough for a small KW-size nation. Date: Sat, 6 Jun 1998 16:34:05 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: phaser.Showcase.MPGN.COM: majordom set sender to owner-mystara-l@ using -f From: (mystara-digest) To: mystara-digest@Phaser.ShowCase.MPGN.COM Subject: mystara-digest V1997 #390 Reply-To: mystara@mpgn.com X-UIDL: b160fc3ad2d17fc38065c06a7b17ef43 Håvard *** Haavard R. Faanes (hoc@nvg.ntnu.no) http://www.nvg.ntnu.no/~hoc "Every turkey dies. Not all turkeys truly live." -Chef, South Park *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 6 Jun 1998 11:00:23 EDT From: JamugaKhan@aol.com Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Almanac/Glantri << > >I don't know what you're thinking about as the obvious way, but how about >>getting some Alchemists to make an artificial arm for him? Golem-tech. Cyberwear anyone? >Eh eh... seems we're thinking along the same lines after all... BUT... it wouldn't really be Glantri if it was so simple, now wouldn't it?... *no more hints mode*... Marco, this is getting annoying :) I can't wait for the next almanac! "but thats a whole other year!" -Luke Skywalker to Owen Lars Bizarre SW-quotes just pop in my head all the time.. >> Er, do you mean to convert Jaggar in something like Darth Vader? Jamuga Khan "Hear and obey, because the Mighty Khan's word is law." *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 6 Jun 1998 11:00:28 EDT From: JamugaKhan@aol.com Subject: [MYSTARA] - Celts on Mystara << You've also got Scottish/Celtic-type place names in the Grand Duchy of Westrourke on the IoD. I think you were wrong, Geoff, as there were Celtic names in the County of Redstone. Jamuga Khan "Hear and obey, because the Mighty Khan's word is law." *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 6 Jun 1998 11:00:26 EDT From: JamugaKhan@aol.com Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Why the Council of Alphatia is reasonable << I know how big Alphatia is. I tried to use this to justify the number of mages there. Translating it over, Specularum would have 10 36th level wizards there. I assume that Spec. is a fairly standard fantasy city - that seems like many wizards per person tho... (Admittedly I ignored the Alphatian colonies - but they only account for another third, roughly. So 7 wizards in Spec.). >> O.k. with this! I always thought that the number of high-level NPCs was to small in all countries besides Thyatia and Alphatia. Jamuga Khan "Hear and obey, because the Mighty Khan's word is law." *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 6 Jun 1998 17:04:37 +0200 (MET DST) From: =?iso-8859-1?Q?H=E5vard_R=F8nne_Faanes?= Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Midland Forest On Sat, 6 Jun 1998, Galwylin wrote: >Well, this forest has caught the gleam of my eye lately. I think if I was developing it, I'd have a lot of the woodland races (including elves, of course) make their homes there but I don't think I'd be setting up nations. Just lots of claimed territory with most of it unclaimed. I'm wondering what some ideas the list have for such a large area. Maybe the only true human rangers found in Mystara make their home there? Actually, I suggest that you leave the elves out of it. We already have quite a few elven nations (Wendar amd hopefully Alfheim in a few years). I think the midland forest is a good oportunity to develope some other sylvan races, and perhaps more away from the classic elven traits. I agree that it might be a good idea to throw out the concept of races. Rather we can have cultures with few concepts of borders. I was suggesting a land of Treants and Garakar (was that it?), maybe Oberons Golden Castle is hidden somehwere deep within this forest too? There are some other races we could put in here, the shagurgh for example. And maybe a race of forest loving orcs? >BTW, is the forester that different from the ranger class? I think they seem to be the same from what I remember of AD&D 1st edition. Or would a Mystaran ranger lack any type of spell (essentually a fighter with forest survival skills and knowledge). Just supposing... A forrester is basically a human who lives by the ways of the elves and has been initiated into their secrets. I think its a good idea to say that Rangers=Foresters. Keep the name Forester ofcourse as that is what they are known as on Mystara. Håvard *** Haavard R. Faanes (hoc@nvg.ntnu.no) http://www.nvg.ntnu.no/~hoc "Every turkey dies. Not all turkeys truly live." -Chef, South Park *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 6 Jun 1998 18:04:45 +0100 From: "Rob" Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Almanac/Glantri >Er, do you mean to convert Jaggar in something like Darth Vader? Cool, you could have Jaggar as Anakin Skywalker/Vader and Harald as Senator Palpatine (I still think thats cool. Pity hes listed as "neutral good"...) SW Rob *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 07 Jun 1998 10:46:28 GMT From: lyndon@pobox.com (Lyndon Baugh) Subject: [MYSTARA] - Genders in Mystara Most of the groups I've gamed with have assumed that players would run characters who were not necessarily the same gender, species, profession as the player. Playing a character Different than yourself was part of the point. For that matter it was assumed that the players would often run more than one character. After all the GM ran more than one character, and the players are the same species as the GM ... Often a players various characters would be at cross-purposes ... Lyndon *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 06 Jun 1998 13:07:59 -0400 From: Dan Groves Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Greetings from Northern Europe Jakup wrote: >really what I wanted, so I searched around for used games retailers on the Web. And yesterday I became the proud owner of Dungeons & Dragons! >Anyway. Mystara sounds like a very interesting world. Which books should I buy to get started? Hey, If you haven't found it yet, misc.games.frp.marketplace (is that the right newsgroup name everyone? Been a while since I've stopped in there) is good place to look for stuff. Just put a message saying what you want to buy, and you should hear from people. I've always gotten responses from there.. some of them took a while (I think the longest was three months and that was for a request for the Space:1889 rulebook). I'll also admit I'm a bit biased since most of the expansion of my roleplaying collection came from that group. Things to buy, I've seen mention of the _Principalities of Glantri_, _Elves of Alfheim_, and a few others. I'd recommend also looking for _Dwarves of Rockhome_ and _Emirates of Ylaruam_. Other good ones are X1: The Isle of Dread, X2: Castle Amber (an all-time classic in my opinion), B2: The Keep on the Borderlands has alot of potential I think in the hands of a creative DM. Enjoy, and hope this helps, Dan *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 6 Jun 1998 17:37:47 +0300 From: "Aleksei Andrievski" Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - The NoS and Entropy >Now heres a thought... a chronomancer went back in time to stop the Beagle from landing on Mystara by sabotaging it before it got near Mystara. Sadly, >it was this act of sabotage that made it crash on Mystara in the first place. Cue the PCs to persuade the chronomancer not to do it... Of course, tampering with the history of NoS (especially making it never appear) will mean that our beloved Glantri never existed, which is why I wouldn't recommend this turn of events for the Almanac... ****************** Aleksei Andrievski aka Solmyr, Archmage of the Azure Star Visit the Archmage's Tower at http://www.geocities.com/TimesSquare/Fortress/2198/index.html *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 6 Jun 1998 15:16:44 EDT From: Inconu@aol.com Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - The NoS and Entropy << Ofcourse Draining from Entropy only strengthens Entropy. Strange, but thats the way it is.. >> Could you elaborate on this point? - -Inconu *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 06 Jun 1998 14:34:06 -0500 From: Galwylin Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - The NoS and Entropy Magesmiley@aol.com wrote: >I'm going to throw a new theory into the fire on the draining effect. First off if the nucleus is draining magic shouldn't it be drawing power from the whole prime plane? But its not, its just draining magic from Mystara. My theory is that it isn't actually draining the magic, but doing something which has a very similar effect, specifically strengthening the anti-magical properties of the world shield. This theory works for me though and, like you said, its still draining magic away from Mystara. What if the worldshield is tied to the Immortals' power in some way? - -- This has been a Galwylin© Production galwylin@airnet.net (ICQ #6755972) http://www.airnet.net/galwylin/ The Karameikan School of Magecraft http://www.geocities.com/TimesSquare/Realm/2336/ *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 06 Jun 1998 14:37:02 -0500 From: Galwylin Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - The NoS and Entropy Håvard Rųnne Faanes wrote: >WotI says that the NoS is draining Entropy. Bruce Heard explained the implications of this on the list a year ago or so. Basically the Nucleus of the Spheres(NoS) is now aligned with the Sphere of Entropy in all the ways it earlier was connected with the Sphere of Energy. (Draining energy from that Sphere, producing new Immortals into that Sphere etc..) Ofcourse Draining from Entropy only strengthens Entropy. Strange, but thats the way it is.. Oi! This is worst than trying to figure out time travel and its affects! So the drain on Entropy is really not a drain but an addition of power? - -- This has been a Galwylin© Production galwylin@airnet.net (ICQ #6755972) http://www.airnet.net/galwylin/ The Karameikan School of Magecraft http://www.geocities.com/TimesSquare/Realm/2336/ *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 06 Jun 1998 14:49:13 -0500 From: Galwylin Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - [Mystara] Re: Other places on Mystara Håvard Rųnne Faanes wrote: >I was thinking that they might be tribal, or something similar. Though I have also been toying with the idea of a culture similar to the greek city states. I see them as a Bronze Age cultue, thus considered barbarians, but with deep knowledge in phisophy, music and poetry. Central in Centaur culture is the Sage. Centaur Sages have a function similar to druids in Celtic myth. They are not part of any tribe/clan and act as judges and councillors, respected by all. I've also been toying with the idea of Oracles, possibly connected with the seers of yavldon? Sounds good. To follow the mythological history of centaurs, they are sought as teachers? >As for the idea of the cursed ethengars, I was thinking about something similar. I though that these people whom I call Kantahri(from which Centaur is derived) are the descendants of theAfridhi, a nomadic people at the time of blackmoor. These people became so attached to their mounts that they went through a ceremony which merged them completely. Unfortunately, I don't know enough about Mystaras history to flesh this out any further. Any help is appreaciated. Well, that would take care of where they came from on the evolution standpoint. Have you given any thought to what their magical origins have on them today? When you say druids like Celtic, are you also given the D&D druidic abilities? I think it would be good to get the history of centaurs fleshed out and will see what I can find and help with. - -- This has been a Galwylin© Production galwylin@airnet.net (ICQ #6755972) http://www.airnet.net/galwylin/ The Karameikan School of Magecraft http://www.geocities.com/TimesSquare/Realm/2336/ *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 06 Jun 1998 15:10:14 -0500 From: Galwylin Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - The NoS and Entropy Aleksei Andrievski wrote: >Of course, tampering with the history of NoS (especially making it never appear) will mean that our beloved Glantri never existed, which is why I wouldn't recommend this turn of events for the Almanac... Ah! A possible Alphatian plot? Alphatia... destroyed in a great war reaches beyond the grave to extract vengence on the world that allowed their destruction. ;> - -- This has been a Galwylin© Production galwylin@airnet.net (ICQ #6755972) http://www.airnet.net/galwylin/ The Karameikan School of Magecraft http://www.geocities.com/TimesSquare/Realm/2336/ *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 6 Jun 1998 21:37:00 +0100 From: "Rob" Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - The NoS and Entropy ><< Ofcourse Draining from Entropy only strengthens Entropy. Strange, but tthats the way it is.. >> >Could you elaborate on this point? I suppose if you consider Entropy to be a negative force, subtracting from that force is going to give - a bigger negative! Cheerz ROB *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ End of mystara-digest V1997 #390 ******************************** *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara' as the body of the message. Date: Sun, 7 Jun 1998 05:40:06 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: phaser.Showcase.MPGN.COM: majordom set sender to owner-mystara-l@ using -f From: (mystara-digest) To: mystara-digest@Phaser.ShowCase.MPGN.COM Subject: mystara-digest V1997 #391 Reply-To: mystara@mpgn.com X-UIDL: 47f6502787b15058ba0d2757c78e7298 mystara-digest Sunday, June 7 1998 Volume 1997 : Number 391 Mystara is a trademark of TSR Inc. All Rights Reserved. The following topics are covered in this digest: Re: [MYSTARA] - [Mystara] Re: Other places on Mystara Re: [MYSTARA] - Greetings from Northern Europe [MYSTARA] - Re: [MYSTARA] Nashville, TN USA. [MYSTARA] - Star Wars on Mystara? Re: [MYSTARA] - The NoS and Entropy [MYSTARA] - Oops, I owe somebody Re: [MYSTARA] - Midland Forest Re: [MYSTARA] - The NoS and Entropy [MYSTARA] - Re: The NoS and Entropy Re: [MYSTARA] - Midland Forest Re: [MYSTARA] - Rangers Re: Re: [MYSTARA] - The NoS and Entropy [MYSTARA] - Class Kits for the Known World Re: [MYSTARA] - The NoS and Entropy Re: [MYSTARA] - Midland Forest Re: [MYSTARA] - Rangers [MYSTARA] - Adri Varma Plateau [MYSTARA] - Spelljammer: Helm or headset? Re: [MYSTARA] - Almanac/Glantri Re: [MYSTARA] - The Alphatian Council Re: [MYSTARA] - [MYSTARA] Almanac Re: [MYSTARA] - Why the Council of Alphatia is reasonable ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Sat, 06 Jun 1998 16:02:12 +0000 From: Mike Miller Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - [Mystara] Re: Other places on Mystara Galwylin wrote: >Håvard Rųnne Faanes wrote: >>Yes those are the ones. As for Centaurs I am developing(well, havent done much more than pondering yet) a nation of Centaurs in the area just west of Glantri. There seems to be some plains or hills there. Any ideas for those? >I've looked at every map I had and still couldn't get a good idea exactly what's to the west of Glantri. I did see a few hills from one of the maps in the Champions of Mystara set. What kind of culture are you thinking of for centaurs. I've always pictured them Native American types (of course they lived in many different climates so that might not help). I just think of them as tribal. A nation of centaurs sounds interesting anywhere really (I still vote we move Ethengar or curse them with centaur forms. Doesn't that have a nice sound to it? The Ethengar Centaurs ;) >BTW, I love the overview of the whole planet from the Rules Cyclopedia but it really lacks in providing much more than shape of the coastlines. What I wouldn't give for a flat map of Brun. >-- >This has been a Galwylin© Production >galwylin@airnet.net (ICQ #6755972) >http://www.airnet.net/galwylin/ >The Karameikan School of Magecraft >http://www.geocities.com/TimesSquare/Realm/2336/ Tell me about it! :P That is about the only thing I do not like about mystara. It is not mapped very well. I have taken to planting most of what I do know about mystara into my own mystara type world. The ethenegar centaurs? Hmmmm good idea... I might do that. Sounds good and makes for interesting gaming. Mike Miller darkone1@swbell.net *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 06 Jun 1998 16:06:19 +0000 From: Mike Miller Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Greetings from Northern Europe Jakup Michaelsen wrote: >Hi. >I'm new to this list and to RPGs as well. My name is Jakup Michaelsen, I'm from the Faroe Islands - 18 islands in the North Atlantic - and I'm 18 years old. >I've alwasy been fasinated by RPGs. Back in my early teens I started hearing rumours of the "satanic game". Of course I grew *very* curious. After reading a bit about it I really wanted to play. But everyone here was "satanic panicked", so I didn't dare. >A few years went by and I finnaly had the guts to buy it - only to find it's out of print!!! >I downloaded a christian rpg after getting Internet access - it wasn't really what I wanted, so I searched around for used games retailers on the Web. And yesterday I became the proud owner of Dungeons & Dragons! >Anyway. Mystara sounds like a very interesting world. Which books should I buy to get started? >Jakup the Ever-Nu-B To my knowledge there are no books for mystara. However, you can buy the Dungeon Master's Guide, and the Players Handbook and you will be pretty much set for any adventure you decide to embark upon Mike Miller darkone1@swbell.net *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 06 Jun 1998 16:50:41 -0400 From: adam@polyex.com (Polyex Software - Adam Hall) Subject: [MYSTARA] - Re: [MYSTARA] Nashville, TN USA. Have not played D&D since I was 14, getting back into it at 28 ;-) Anyone in Nashville, TN area care to start a group. Love Keep on the Boderlands... - -Adam Hall adam@polyex.com *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 06 Jun 1998 18:55:55 -0400 From: David Brian Olsen Subject: [MYSTARA] - Star Wars on Mystara? >>Er, do you mean to convert Jaggar in something like Darth Vader? >Cool, you could have Jaggar as Anakin Skywalker/Vader and Harald as Senator Palpatine (I still think thats cool. Pity hes listed as "neutral good"...) OH NO! I thought that Jaggar and Harald were the supposed "good guys" of Glantri. If they become the equivalent of Palpatine/Vader what about the truly evil princes like Dolores and Morphail? Interesting concept though. - -David *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 7 Jun 1998 01:19:02 +0200 (MET DST) From: =?iso-8859-1?Q?H=E5vard_R=F8nne_Faanes?= Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - The NoS and Entropy On Sat, 6 Jun 1998 Inconu@aol.com wrote: ><< Ofcourse Draining from Entropy only strengthens Entropy. Strange, but tthats the way it is.. >> >Could you elaborate on this point? I think Rob explained it pretty clearly when he said that it was like adding a negative value to another negative one. Draining is the nature of Entropy. Of this reason Entropy will develope a sort of immunity to the draining effects of the radience, and eventually the Nucleus of the Spheres will help strenghten Entropy. (Providing more Immortals etc..) PS: Bruce, if I got this wrong feel free to correct me, this was your idea in the first place, right? :) Håvard *** Haavard R. Faanes (hoc@nvg.ntnu.no) http://www.nvg.ntnu.no/~hoc "Every turkey dies. Not all turkeys truly live." -Chef, South Park *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 01 Jan 1980 10:32:30 GMT From: lyndon@pobox.com (Lyndon Baugh) Subject: [MYSTARA] - Oops, I owe somebody I had a (mostly recoverable) accident when doing some home computer surgery, and lost an email from someone I owe money to ... change from a Mystara box they bought from me. If whoever sent me email a day or two ago will send it again to lyndon@pobox.com I will reanimate and get on with it. Sorry about that! Lyndon *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 06 Jun 1998 20:42:55 -0500 From: Galwylin Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Midland Forest Oh, one other thought about this forest. What about it being the home of Brun's grand druid? Perhaps the whole council. - -- This has been a Galwylin© Production galwylin@airnet.net (ICQ #6755972) http://www.airnet.net/galwylin/ The Karameikan School of Magecraft http://www.geocities.com/TimesSquare/Realm/2336/ *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 6 Jun 1998 23:18:16 EDT From: Kaviyd@aol.com Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - The NoS and Entropy In a message dated 98-06-06 14:14:07 EDT, solmyr@kolumbus.fi writes: >Of course, tampering with the history of NoS (especially making it never aappear) will mean that our beloved Glantri never existed, which is why I wouldn't recommend this turn of events for the Almanac... Or what you could do is have them change history, see the (disastrous) outcome, and change it back. But of course the net effect from the point of view of the almanac would be that absolutely nothing was changed. By the way -- does anyone have any theories as to who could have been reporting events from the Hollow World in the PWAs? While Joshuan was obviously wrong in denying its existence, there certainly was not enough solid information about it available in the outer world to say much at all about it. *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 7 Jun 1998 01:33:11 EDT From: Kaviyd@aol.com Subject: [MYSTARA] - Re: The NoS and Entropy In a message dated 98-06-04 13:41:01 EDT, rmunch@easynet.co.uk writes: >What if its draining Entropy? Will people start living longer or something? pput a strain on the worlds ecosystem? ??? suggestions anyone? Ask Tithonus. He fell in love with a goddess who was able to give him immortality -- but not eternal youth. The end result was not pleasant. But an idea that would be more to the point would be to posit (in AD&D terms) an invasion from the Positive Material Plane. New forms of life would spontaneously proliferate on Mystara. Cancer (a disease caused by cells multiplying out of control) would become a common health problem. Maybe the Monolith reawakens in its most unpleasant phase? Too much life can be as bad a problem as too much death.... *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 7 Jun 1998 02:00:45 EDT From: Kaviyd@aol.com Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Midland Forest In a message dated 98-06-06 07:53:25 EDT, galwylin@airnet.net writes: >BTW, is the forester that different from the ranger class? I think they sseem to be the same from what I remember of AD&D 1st edition. Or would a Mystaran ranger lack any type of spell (essentually a fighter with forest survival skills and knowledge). Just supposing... There is a considerable difference between a Forester and a Ranger. A Forester is basically a Fighter/Mage who is able to cast spells from the time he starts play. An AD&D Ranger (either edition) has no spells until he reaches level 8. As for that "Midland Forest" -- isn't most of it either in Hule or claimed by Hule? If so, that would definitely affect the atmosphere of the place. *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 7 Jun 1998 02:07:28 EDT From: BoBoII@aol.com Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Rangers Is it just me, or do rangers start to resemble a REALLY fleshed out kit as more time goes by? Before I'm baraged with arguement on this point, had anyone out there got suggestions for kit types in Eastern Brun? (non-SC) Specificity to Nations would be helpful. I know several people have mentioned the application of Al- Quadim to the Emirates . . . any others? *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 7 Jun 1998 02:15:21 EDT From: BoBoII@aol.com Subject: Re: Re: [MYSTARA] - The NoS and Entropy In a message dated 6/6/98 10:09:29 AM, Magesmiley wrote: << Eventually this hits critical mass (annually) and all of the world's magic is sucked into world shield to counteract the magical deficit accumulated over the previous year.>> I like the cyclical nature of this. You could tweak it to involve side effects like, the time for really powerful magic work to be done is right after the dry spell, as there is a little extra "mana" in the air , if you will. Or maybe the best time to try a quick shot through the polar openings it right after the blackout. *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 7 Jun 1998 02:10:55 -0500 From: "Galwylin" Subject: [MYSTARA] - Class Kits for the Known World Here's a short list from the AD&D series of Complete Handbooks that I think would work in eastern Brun (and where). What I really like about these books is that they give you a different interpretation of classes. The NWPs and bonus aren't the best part as much as the ideas a kit can give you. Fighter: Barbarian (Ethengar, Northern Reaches) Beast-Rider (Atruaghin, Ethengar) Berserker (Ethengar, Northern Reaches) Cavalier Gladiator (Thyatis) Myrmidon Noble Warrior Peasant Hero Pirate/Outlaw (Sea of Dread) Samurai (Ochalea) Savage (Atruaghin) Swashbuckler (Darokin) Wilderness Warrior Thief: Acrobat Adventurer Assassin Bandit Beggar Bounty Hunter Buccaneer (Sea of Dread) Burgler Cutpurse Fence Investigator Scout Smuggler Spy Swashbuckler (Darokin) Swindler Thug Troubleshooter Priest: Date: Sun, 7 Jun 1998 05:40:06 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: phaser.Showcase.MPGN.COM: majordom set sender to owner-mystara-l@ using -f From: (mystara-digest) To: mystara-digest@Phaser.ShowCase.MPGN.COM Subject: mystara-digest V1997 #391 Reply-To: mystara@mpgn.com X-UIDL: 47f6502787b15058ba0d2757c78e7298 Barbarian/Berserker Priest (Northern Reaches) Fighting-Monk (Ochalea) Nobleman Priest Outlaw Priest Pacifist Priest Peasant Priest Prophet Priest Savage Priest Scholar Priest Wizards: Academician Anagakok Militant Wizard (Thyatis) Mystic Patrician Peasant Wizard Savage Wizard Witch Wu Jen (Ochalea) Dwarves: Animal Master Axe for Hire Battlerager Champion Clansdwarf Crafts Priest Diplomat Entertainer Ghetto Fighter Hearth Guard Highborn Locksmith Outcast Pariah Patrician Pest Controller Rapid Response Rider Ritual Priest Sharpshooter Temple Guard Trader Vermin Slayer Vindicator Wayfinder Elves: Archer Bladesinger Collector Elven Minstrel Herbalist Huntsman Spellfilcher Undead Slayer War Wizard Wilderness Runner Windrider Halflings: Archer Bandit Bilker Burglar Cartographer Forestwalker Healer Homesteader Leaftender Mercenary Oracle Sheriff Smuggler Squire Trader Traveler Tunnelrats Urchin - -- This has been a Galwylin© Production The Tome of Galwylin (http://www.airnet.net/galwylin) galwylin@airnet.net | ICQ #6755972 | AIM: Galwylin - ---------- >From: BoBoII@aol.com >To: mystara-l@MPGN.COM >Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Rangers >Date: Sunday, June 07, 1998 1:07 AM >Is it just me, or do rangers start to resemble a REALLY fleshed out kit as >more time goes by? >Before I'm baraged with arguement on this point, had anyone out there got suggestions for kit types in Eastern Brun? (non-SC) Specificity to Nations >would be helpful. I know several people have mentioned the application of Al- >Quadim to the Emirates . . . any others? *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 7 Jun 1998 00:31:30 -0700 (PDT) From: Dominique Rivard Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - The NoS and Entropy These are (I hopre!) new thoughts about the new powers given to mortals. Before WoiT the NoS was affecting the energy sphere, so while it was giving new spells to MU (the class for energy), it was also draining it. Following this reflection, acting on time it would favor clerics, maybe giving them more spell too. For matter, it would help monsters (this is how IMC I class this one, don't want to reinclude another sphere) and for thought, warrior and other warrior-like characters. So for entropy, who would be affected, undead? Those who control/create them? Or something more suble? Like generation of confusion and disorder (anyway something that would go against anyone of the other spheres). == _________________________________________________________ Tharquil's French D&D Homepage at http://www.geocities.com/Area51/Rampart/5201 _________________________________________________________ DO YOU YAHOO!? Get your free @yahoo.com address at http://mail.yahoo.com *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 7 Jun 1998 02:32:37 -0500 From: "Galwylin" Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Midland Forest Hule encompasses half of the Dark Wood. I'm not sure if this wood is the Midland forest. Maybe that's the name of the forest and Midland is just an area name? - -- This has been a Galwylin© Production The Tome of Galwylin (http://www.airnet.net/galwylin) galwylin@airnet.net | ICQ #6755972 | AIM: Galwylin - ---------- >From: Kaviyd@aol.com >To: mystara-l@MPGN.COM >Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Midland Forest Date: Sunday, June 07, 1998 1:00 AM >As for that "Midland Forest" -- isn't most of it either in Hule or claimed >by Hule? If so, that would definitely affect the atmosphere of the place. *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 7 Jun 1998 10:03:03 +0100 From: "Rob" Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Rangers >Is it just me, or do rangers start to resemble a REALLY fleshed out kit as more time goes by? >Before I'm baraged with arguement on this point, had anyone out there got suggestions for kit types in Eastern Brun? (non-SC) Specificity to Nations would be helpful. I know several people have mentioned the application of Al- >Quadim to the Emirates . . . any others? Swashbucklers could be found in Darokin and the Principality of Belcadiz (check out AD+D Dona Belcadiz - definite swashbuckler material!). Myrmidons could represent all sorts of soldiers - from Thyatian legionaries to the Glantrian Grand Army... Cavaliers could represent any of the various knightly orders lying about. Defenders would be better suited to pious knights (The Order of the Griffon, for a start, and perhaps Heldannic Knights). Or even Votaries and Wyrmslayers (Complete Book of Paladins), or Monks. The Norse countries could have Pirates, Barbarians and Wilderness Warriors... Nobles could be found almost anywhere. I suppose the Ethengars could be Beast Riders or even Gauchos (after the kits been tweaked a bit), but I would personally make "Ethengar Warrior" a kit of its own, cause Ethies already get some nifty tack ons, not dissimilar to what a kit would give you. Rockhome would, obviously, be fertile ground for the dwarven kits out of the Complete Book of Dwarves... The various elven kingdoms would likewise have Complete Book of Elves kits... Wizards in the Glantrian Grand Army could be militant wizards (or even the Glantrian Military Wizard kit!). Graduates from the GSoM would have the Glantrian Wizard kit (note: this kit is bloody powerful! Fitting for a nation which is supposed to be the Ultimate Power, magically, but watch out...). Ethengarian hakomons could be Mystics or Savage Wizards or even Anagokoks or Wokani. I would bias Thyatian wizards towards Academicians or Nobles. Alphatian wizards I have given their own kit... As far as thieves are concerned... Ethie thieves would most likely be Scouts , or Bandits perhaps? Otherwise the various nations would probably have the majority of thief kits represented, from Assassin right through to Fence... The Darokinian Merchant would make a good thief kit (and, in fact, someones beaten me to that one, because there is a web page somewhere with the Merchant as a kit...). Priests... Well I consider specialty priests to be a kit unto themselves. I have Monks in Karameikos. Heldannic Knights could be Crusaders (quite appropriate I think). Ethengar and Ierendi both have Shamans... All together, there are far too many kits in AD+D... Cheerz ROB *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 7 Jun 1998 05:38:05 EDT From: JamugaKhan@aol.com Subject: [MYSTARA] - Adri Varma Plateau I remember vaguely that I've read once that there are "cactus-like treants" living on the Adri Varma Plateau. Can anybody remember that too? If yes, from what source it has originated? Jamuga Khan "Hear and obey, because the Mighty Khan's word is law." *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 7 Jun 1998 05:38:04 EDT From: JamugaKhan@aol.com Subject: [MYSTARA] - Spelljammer: Helm or headset? << Nah. Alphatian airships are like flying square rigger boats. But that's just the basic kind. They can be literally of any shape imaginable. But they aren't powered by a headset. They are usually powered by some magic dynamo, or other engine type. (Or in the case of the Heldanners' Warbirds, an Immortal Artifact.) >> Only to clarify the matter: The spelljammer's "helm" is nothing to wear on the head. Instead it's a kind of throne which converts the magical energy of a cleric, magic-user or druid into energy for the ship. When I've read it first I made the same mistake until I noticed that a "helmsman" is somebody who steers the ship. Jamuga Khan "Hear and obey, because the Mighty Khan's word is law." *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 7 Jun 1998 05:38:09 EDT From: JamugaKhan@aol.com Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Almanac/Glantri << Some prefer dancing about and waving their hands in dramatic manners while others, like Etienne IRC, prefer just moving their index finger in a threatening manner in their targets general direction. (I cant remember the reference, but I believe I have read this.) >> It's GAZ 3-Principalities of Glantri, in the scene describing the parliament. Jamuga Khan "Hear and obey, because the Mighty Khan's word is law." *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 7 Jun 1998 05:38:03 EDT From: JamugaKhan@aol.com Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - The Alphatian Council << Anyway, I've enjoyed the discussion on the Alphatian Ruling Council. I'm truly wondering how much political power they have. Obviously they can have an emperor abdicate the throne, but are they just an "old boys club" or a real legislative body? If they do have considerable political power, imagine the machinations involved in the Alphatian court. We're always so concerned with Glantri and it's handful of mages on the ruling council and the massive political wheelings and dealings they have there. Now multiply that by a hundred times and you have a picture of the Alphatian Grand Council! I see a huge place of political intrigue that's generally ignored. If those wizards are only half as paranoid as there Glantrian counterparts, there must be a treasure trove of adventures springing from this organization. >> Besides, the Great Council is to big for day-to-day work, although it has less than twice the number of the German parliament. Probably most work is done by committees, for defense, finance, inner politic, outer politic, education, and so on. Don't forget, that we mostly use Alphatia as the "most modern" country of Mystara. Most MGC (Member of Great Council) will be absent most time but some will do the real politic, especially the leaders of the real important and powerful committees. Anybody should work something out. If nobody do the work, I might do (if I will find the time :-( ) Jamuga Khan "Hear and obey, because the Mighty Khan's word is law." *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 7 Jun 1998 05:38:07 EDT From: JamugaKhan@aol.com Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - [MYSTARA] Almanac << Haha, Khan, you have a weakness! If I kidnapp your character, I can force you to agree on any of my insane world shattering ideas... :D Håvard >> Sorry Håvard, he's not on Mystara or in the Prime plane any more. Instead he is adventuring on a plane in the center of the Creation where the kings of the dwarves or the elves are the kings of ALL dwarves and elves respectively in all multiverses and dimensions. It's a plane, where a good dwarven-made plate armour +5 is just a simple toy, where dwarven bards can sing (magical) dwarven runes, where elves do not die even after ten thousand of years. It's a plane where immortals don't have much power and clerics are unknown. It's a plane I wish to leave as soon as possible. It's a DM who has only the faintest idea about Mystara and who LIKES AD&D. I don't like his DMing style, but unfortunately I'm the minority in all these matters. Jamuga Khan "Hear and obey, because the Mighty Khan's word is law." *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 7 Jun 1998 05:38:02 EDT From: JamugaKhan@aol.com Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Why the Council of Alphatia is reasonable << IMO the Imperial Court also has a standing Imperial Army, Navy, and Air Fleet. These are composed of troops from all over the Empire. The individual kingdom armies are intended to suppliment this force in times of war. >> As far as I've understood it there's no "Air Fleet". Instead swimming and flying units are part of the Imperial Navy. Look at CoM. Jamuga Khan "Hear and obey, because the Mighty Khan's word is law." *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ End of mystara-digest V1997 #391 ******************************** *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara' as the body of the message. mystara-digest Sunday, June 7 1998 Volume 1997 : Number 392 Mystara is a trademark of TSR Inc. All Rights Reserved. The following topics are covered in this digest: Re: [MYSTARA] - Midland Forest Re: [MYSTARA] - The NoS and Entropy Re: [MYSTARA] - The NoS and Entropy [MYSTARA] - Re: Greetins from Northern Europe Re: [MYSTARA] - Jenni's Monumental Memo of Mystara Re: [MYSTARA] -Alphatian Council [MYSTARA] - Mystara without Ethengar? Re: [MYSTARA] - Midland Forest Re: [MYSTARA] - The NoS and Entropy Re: [MYSTARA] - Spelljammer and Mystara (was: Why Mystara?) Re: [MYSTARA] - Midland Forest [MYSTARA] - Greetings to Newbie Re: [MYSTARA] - Jenni's Monumental Memo of Mystara Re: [MYSTARA] - Mystara without Ethengar? Re: [MYSTARA] - Almanac/Glantri Re: [MYSTARA] - Midland Forest Re: [MYSTARA] - Midland Forest Re: [MYSTARA] - Class Kits for the Known World Re: [MYSTARA] - The NoS and Entropy Re: [MYSTARA] -Alphatian Council ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Sun, 7 Jun 1998 13:09:35 +0200 (MET DST) From: =?iso-8859-1?Q?H=E5vard_R=F8nne_Faanes?= Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Midland Forest On Sun, 7 Jun 1998, Galwylin wrote: >Hule encompasses half of the Dark Wood. I'm not sure if this wood is the Midland forest. Maybe that's the name of the forest and Midland is just an area name? The Midland forest is HUGE. I seriously doubt that Hule has claimed the entire forest. I dont have any maps here, so the Dark Wood may very well, be part of the Midland forest. If Hule has claimed the forest as theirs, I still doubt that they are able to controll it or defend it. So, there still could be a lot of independent realms or tribes there. Håvard *** Haavard R. Faanes (hoc@nvg.ntnu.no) http://www.nvg.ntnu.no/~hoc "Every turkey dies. Not all turkeys truly live." -Chef, South Park *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 7 Jun 1998 09:45:22 EDT From: Inconu@aol.com Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - The NoS and Entropy << I suppose if you consider Entropy to be a negative force, subtracting from that force is going to give - a bigger negative! >> I'd consider a bigger negative to occur if more Entropy was added. a negative plus a negative equals a larger negative. However, i beleive the nucleus of spheres isn't like adding a negative. It's a draining effect instead. You have X amount of Entropy, and after some is drained, the X amount isn't as much as it was before the drain. For a more clear example, if you took an apple out of a basket of apples there is a less total amount. - -Inconu *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 7 Jun 1998 09:51:44 EDT From: Inconu@aol.com Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - The NoS and Entropy In a message dated 98-06-06 19:30:28 EDT, you write: << Draining is the nature of Entropy. Of this reason Entropy will develope a sort of immunity to the draining effects of the radience, and eventually the Nucleus of the Spheres will help strenghten Entropy. (Providing more Immortals etc..)>> I believe Entropy focuses on terminating, destroying, and injuring rather than draining. Either way, however, I don't see how/why Entropy gets an immunity built up over time from the NOS. <> Oh, I thought this was your idea Harvard..... Okay, well I would aprreciate it if the original poster could explain this idea. It sounds good, but i still haven't grasped it yet. - -Inconu *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 7 Jun 1998 14:55:00 +0100 From: elrond@post.olivant.fo (Jakup Michaelsen) Subject: [MYSTARA] - Re: Greetins from Northern Europe Hi. Thanks for the feedback everyone. And yes satanic panic is very common here. Ones there was this band in tv, they were iterwieved at their home, and they showed of D&D. A week later they were supposed to play in a small town, and everybody was like "those satanists" - "how dare they let them plat" etc. And once a brother of one of the players in our group confronted my like "is it true your going to buy Dungeons & Dragons!?!" and he really urged us not to do so. And I think his parents don't like me for it... Sad isn't it..? Anyway, abour those books. Was there ever a like a boxed set about Mystara? - - And does Gazettere (or however it's spelled :-) deal solely with Mystara? - - How many books were there in that series btw.? It's great to have found this mailing list! Jakup *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 7 Jun 1998 17:16:54 +0200 (MET DST) From: =?iso-8859-1?Q?H=E5vard_R=F8nne_Faanes?= Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Jenni's Monumental Memo of Mystara On Wed, 3 Jun 1998 Ambreville@aol.com wrote: Jenni: >>>I think that Mystara could be a bright gem in the diadem of TSR RPG worlds, aand it can even be this within the context of AD&D. But it has to be marketed properly and it has to be developed properly.<< Bruce: >Difficult trick to master. Mystara, as colorful and neat as it is, remains a generic fantasy world, very much in the same sphere as FR and GH. It will be very difficult to make distributors (and new gamers) feel it is different enough to warrant the purchase. And it looks like a late-comer. Mystara is a great world, and I think one that is more attractive than others, but you are running into the problems I just mentioned above, Mystara is likely to be considered a direct competitor to FR (another sacred cow -- and I don't think we'll see a stampede here). So, for Mystara to have any chance at all, differences have to be cultivated as precious assets. I agree that cultivatin the differences is what we must do. Even if this means changing Mystara slightly. One thing that Makes Mystara unique in my opinion is that the Known World has quite a few _interesting_ cultures. The countries are not standard fantasy countries like we find in Krynn, on the Sword Coast of FR (Moo), and probably in Greyhawk. We have byzantine style Empires, Italian Renessance Magocracies, Norse Barbarians, and native american style tribes. I think that developing these traits could be what is needed to make Mystara different. No more thyatians called "Dexter the Warrior", No more Darokinians with Longswords, no more Northern Reaches Warriors with longswords, and so on. Make sure that every NPC has a name and uses weapons that are appropriate in his/her culture. >>>My first suggestion would be for WotC/TSR to release source material for MMystara as a whole -- much like they have done for their other fantasy worlds.<< >You mean a boxed set with an outline of the Known World-Bellissarian-Savage Coast-Hollow World regions, plus generalities on the planet itself? Sure, this would be useful as an intro to Mystara. Helps people place all these neat settings. Let's not make the mistake of trying to design/fill-out all the other regions, however. I've seen this happen too many times in other settings, and the result were always BAD. The problem with such a product is that it probably will lack a focus. I think the product should include some info in the planet as a whole (history and geography etc) something on the Savage coast, and a little on the HW, and a litle on the Known World in General. This should not amount to more than one or two chapters though. The rest of the product should be devoted to one specific area. I think Thyatis would be a nice place to set it. Provide details of the average Thyatians life. What is it like to grow up in thyatis, among nobles, farmers, poor people and Gladiators. What is the life of a soldier like? Doing some extensive research on Byzantium and other cultures you want to borrow from is a good idea. Then Provide ideas for adventures and campaigns. Do not make the mistake of marketing Mystara as the best place to set your dungeons in. Dungeons can be set anywhere. Focus on campaigns like "Life in the Imperial Legion", "High Society in Thyatis", "Mercheants of Biazzan" etc. Finally: Art. This is very Important. TSR owns a lot of great art, but All Mystara art should be designed especially for Mystara. Every pricture or illustration must show exactly what Mystaran people look like. Any standard fantasy art should be thrown away. One should be able to look at a picture and see which country this picture is from by looking at the people and buildings and landscape. In the example of Thyatis, show Legions, gladiators, senators, commoners in Byzantain clothes, not "adventurers gear". >>>This material should include Special rules that differentiate the world of AAD&D Mystara from the other AD&D TSR worlds.<< >Sure, but let's not go overboard with this. Other than Immortals and possibly alignments, what were you suggesting? Class adaptations that reflect the old OD&D races/classes? I'm not sure this is really worth the trouble, is it? I don't really see the need to modify AD&D into resembling oD&D. However, Dark Sun is a good example of how a few optional rules can make AD&D much more exciting. I don't have any specific suggestions here, however. I dont think too specific rules on Immortals are neccesary, at least not in the first products. Not many people play Immortal Campaigns, and I don't really think the XD&D system is ideal for this anyway. However, religion is a part of peoples every day life, so extensive descriptions of immortals and churches should be included. >One other thing -- you're hoping for a big pile of releases fairly quickly. Although this is a dream for old time fans of Mystara, it's also a sales liability. This mistake was made with Birthright (I think more than one release per month in the first 12 months of the launch), which almost killed the line. There is unfortunately such a thing as too many Mystara products. There needs to be a balance between the release of revisited Gazetteers, and further development of the world. This is a very tricky issue, considering how much has already been published for Mystara. In order to maintain quality, I'd almost be willing to say: no more than 4-5 titles per year, total, not including possible novels. This allows everyone enough time to buy, use, and *afford* all the titles every year, it also allows editorial staff to concentrate on their products and do a better job. The trick here seems to be finding a balance. The buyers (us) need to feel that the line is getting support from TSR/WotC, yet there is no reason to produce more than people can buy. I wont comment on the numbers here, you probably know much more about that than me. >>>[...] 1) On the one hand, the current net-almanac editors have copyright on tthe existing material because they creating it, while WotC/TSR has trademark on the world it is based in. As a result, neither party can use this material for profit without the other's permission. [...]<< >I zipped through this dicussion on the MML last night about TSR stealing stuff from net-writers. I don't recall TSR ever using material created on the internet without adequate sign-off. Where did this notion come from? Pierre Savoie (spl?) posted the FAQ from the L5R Card Game Mailing list. It said that WOTI owns everything posted on that list. Did not sound friendly at all to me :( BTW: are anyone saving these messages? Håvard *** Haavard R. Faanes (hoc@nvg.ntnu.no) http://www.nvg.ntnu.no/~hoc "Every turkey dies. Not all turkeys truly live." -Chef, South Park *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 7 Jun 1998 11:50:07 EDT From: JamugaKhan@aol.com Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] -Alphatian Council << << If you say, that a person earns 1 XP per 1 GP earned than we have an interesting effect: >> I didn't think anyone actually employed that rule to thier campaigns..... -Inconu >> I'm not sure what you wanted to say, but if you mean that nobody uses this rule, I have to say you that you're not correct. We use this rule. A level 4 magic-user entered the Imperial Navy, went through some month of naval academy and was already level 8 when he started to serve aboard a Imperial Navy ship. Jamuga Khan "Hear and obey, because the Mighty Khan's word is law." *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 7 Jun 1998 11:50:10 EDT From: JamugaKhan@aol.com Subject: [MYSTARA] - Mystara without Ethengar? << (I still vote we move Ethengar or curse them with centaur forms. Doesn't that have a nice sound to it? The Ethengar Centaurs ;) >> DEFINITELY NOT!!! Can anybody explain to me why Glantri has so many fans and supporters while Ethengar is disqualified by all and gets the worse end always? Jamuga Khan "The Mighty Khan is not amused." *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 7 Jun 1998 11:50:11 EDT From: JamugaKhan@aol.com Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Midland Forest << Well, this forest has caught the gleam of my eye lately. I think if I was developing it, I'd have a lot of the woodland races (including elves, of course) make their homes there but I don't think I'd be setting up nations. >> According to the Dragonlord trilogy, there's no civilization in this area, and the only elves out there are Wild Elves. So I would say go ahead with your ideas. BTW, when I say "out there", I remember the "Orcwars" map from "Orcs of Thar". One end of the caravan routes was "Out there" on the Adri Varma plateau. Do anybody know what TSR had in mind when creating this map? (And, as always, a cry for help to Bruce: Do you know anything about it?) Jamuga Khan "Hear and obey, because the Mighty Khan's word is law." *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 7 Jun 1998 11:50:12 EDT From: JamugaKhan@aol.com Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - The NoS and Entropy << I think Rob explained it pretty clearly when he said that it was like adding a negative value to another negative one. Draining is the nature of Entropy. Of this reason Entropy will develope a sort of immunity to the draining effects of the radience, and eventually the Nucleus of the Spheres will help strenghten Entropy. (Providing more Immortals etc..) PS: Bruce, if I got this wrong feel free to correct me, this was your idea in the first place, right? :) >> I think it depends whether Bruce Heard is a physicist or not... :-) Anyhow, as I perceived it, "draining from the Sphere of Entropy" means a weakening of this sphere, as the Brotherhood of Shadow got a major stroke for that. Jamuga Khan "Hear and obey, because the Mighty Khan's word is law." *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 7 Jun 1998 11:50:06 EDT From: JamugaKhan@aol.com Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Spelljammer and Mystara (was: Why Mystara?) << When it comes to Warp (Spelljamming) speed, they work the same. we can say that Mystaran skyships are to Spelljammers the same thing the old Fokkers were to modern days Tornado or F-15 >> Do you really think that? A spelljammer has constantly to be powered by the magical energy of spellcaster, a good voidship not unless it is powered by a dynamo of flying. Besides spelljammers are normal ships with this "helm" added to, while Mystaran voidships are magical from the beginning of construction. I think a spelljammer is no match for a good voidship. Yeah, those whimpy groundlings know some good tricks too! Jamuga Khan Date: Sun, 7 Jun 1998 14:19:12 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: phaser.Showcase.MPGN.COM: majordom set sender to owner-mystara-l@ using -f From: (mystara-digest) To: mystara-digest@Phaser.ShowCase.MPGN.COM Subject: mystara-digest V1997 #392 Reply-To: mystara@mpgn.com X-UIDL: d1c4bfff4efea08c6d63e1ad62b24c7b "Hear and obey, because the Mighty Khan's word is law." *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 7 Jun 1998 11:50:13 EDT From: JamugaKhan@aol.com Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Midland Forest << Hule encompasses half of the Dark Wood. I'm not sure if this wood is the Midland forest. Maybe that's the name of the forest and Midland is just an area name? >> I doubt it. The Midland Forest must be farther north and it must be greater than Dark Wood. Jamuga Khan "Hear and obey, because the Mighty Khan's word is law." *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 7 Jun 1998 12:33:35 -0400 (EDT) From: Pierre Savoie Subject: [MYSTARA] - Greetings to Newbie >Date: Sat, 6 Jun 1998 14:28:09 +0100 >From: elrond@post.olivant.fo (Jakup Michaelsen) Subject: [MYSTARA] - Greetings from Northern Europe >My name is Jakup Michaelsen, I'm from the Faroe Islands - 18 islands in the North Atlantic - and I'm 18 years old. Fantastic! We spell it "Faeroe". But the Faeroes are not an independent country; why do they have their own domain .fo? >I've alwasy been fasinated by RPGs. Back in my early teens I started hearing rumours of the "satanic game". Of course I grew *very* curious. After reading a bit about it I really wanted to play. But everyone here was "satanic panicked", so I didn't dare. I have made it one of my personal missions in life to dispel such "satanic" rumours, and to give game-fans many facts about the history of this false "controversy" which are effective weapons instead of a mere shield. And there are many other Web-pages on the topic scattered around the world. If you have access to Web-pages, check out either the Yahoo search-engine under the topic Recreation and Sport / Games / Role-Playing / Satanism and D&D (a sub-area which they started at my instigation, but with an unfortunate choice of title), or my Web-page http://people.unt.edu/~jl0007/draco.htm [although many links need to be repaired] Of course, if you DO have access to Web-pages you will come into contact with many TRULY satanic things, but that is the risk you take when you project your mind into the Web. :-) We may have trouble in 2000 if Al Gore becomes the president of the United States -- his wife Tipper Gore wrote a book which included making a swipe against the "evils" of D&D. She has never been "re-educated"... >A few years went by and I finnaly had the guts to buy it - only to find it's out of print!!! I downloaded a christian rpg after getting Internet access - it wasn't really what I wanted, so I searched around for used games retailers on the Web. And yesterday I became the proud owner of Dungeons & Dragons! That took you a long time! Tibetan monks got their copy before you did. There must be over 300 role-playing games in the English-speaking world alone. There is no problem with availability of the "Advanced" Dungeons & Dragons hardcover book version of the game. And there is plenty of computer game software that is "role- playing" in nature; in my opinion, this is one of the noblest uses of an advanced model of computer with awesome graphics and sound. There was even a DUNGEONS & DRAGONS: HOLLOW WORLD game for the Sega Genesis if I remember correctly (IIRC). Does anybody know what that was like? >Anyway. Mystara sounds like a very interesting world. Which books should I buy to get started? The trouble with role-playing games is that any book about a setting will probably give you game enjoyment for years. The potential entertainment offered is often beyond human capacity to really use it. In the original Gazetteer publications, if you can find them, you will probably want GAZ1 -- THE GRAND DUCHY OF KARAMEIKOS, the first gazetteer. You would also love the one called THE NORTHERN REACHES, which covers Ostland, Vestland and the Soderfjord Jarldoms. It deals with Viking cultures. The trouble is, some people here own EVERYTHING published on Mystara (I do not). They will be discussing things that are unknown and mysterious to the rest of us. The hobby in North America means no one can own everything. - ---Pierre Savoie (ab966@torfree.net) *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 07 Jun 1998 11:48:39 -0500 From: Galwylin Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Jenni's Monumental Memo of Mystara I want ot jump in! ;> Håvard Rųnne Faanes wrote: >I agree that cultivatin the differences is what we must do. Even if this means changing Mystara slightly. One thing that Makes Mystara unique in my opinion is that the Known World has quite a few _interesting_ cultures. The countries are not standard fantasy countries like we find in Krynn, on the Sword Coast of FR (Moo), and probably in Greyhawk. We have byzantine style Empires, Italian Renessance Magocracies, Norse Barbarians, and native american style tribes. I think that developing these traits could be what is needed to make Mystara different. No more thyatians called "Dexter the Warrior", No more Darokinians with Longswords, no more Northern Reaches Warriors with longswords, and so on. Make sure that every NPC has a name and uses weapons that are appropriate in his/her culture. You make some good points here. Though Mystara does have all those different cultures, I think its important that they are 'Mystarized'. Glantri is a good example of the use of a culture but giving it a slight twist. The other nations haven't been that lucky though. And I still think people are confused by Thyatis (which should be Byzantium not Roman). >The problem with such a product is that it probably will lack a focus. I think the product should include some info in the planet as a whole (history and geography etc) something on the Savage coast, and a little on the HW, and a litle on the Known World in General. This should not amount to more than one or two chapters though. The rest of the product should be devoted to one specific area. I think Thyatis would be a nice place to set it. Provide details of the average Thyatians life. What is it like to grow up in thyatis, among nobles, farmers, poor people and Gladiators. What is the life of a soldier like? Doing some extensive research on Byzantium and other cultures you want to borrow from is a good idea. Focus seems to mean what you're hoping to emphasize, what the setting is heading toward. Thyatis is a good choice but I don't think its current state is really that interesting. It's going to need some work. >Finally: Art. This is very Important. TSR owns a lot of great art, but All Mystara art should be designed especially for Mystara. Every pricture or illustration must show exactly what Mystaran people look like. Any standard fantasy art should be thrown away. One should be able to look at a picture and see which country this picture is from by looking at the people and buildings and landscape. In the example of Thyatis, show Legions, gladiators, senators, commoners in Byzantain clothes, not "adventurers gear". I think art helps too but the whole setting needs something more and that's style. Trouble is you have such different settings that style can't easily be assigned to to the whole. One thing I think the Karameikos set did well was the art and style. Not reading anything of the material, you still get the feeling of old world meets new. I have no idea what the Glantri set's art was meant to convey. It gave me the feeling that TSR gave up on the setting before Glantri went to press. A few pictures were good but so many weren't. Art and style should give you a feeling of the people and the country. >I don't really see the need to modify AD&D into resembling oD&D. However, Dark Sun is a good example of how a few optional rules can make AD&D much more exciting. I don't have any specific suggestions here, however. I certainly wouldn't want AD&D to resemble oD&D. A new Mystara should play with AD&D's strengths not try to capture something that so many have moved past. And it would be a mistake to drop Mystara into the AD&D system without modifications of that system. That's what we had before. >I dont think too specific rules on Immortals are neccesary, at least not in the first products. Not many people play Immortal Campaigns, and I don't really think the XD&D system is ideal for this anyway. However, religion is a part of peoples every day life, so extensive descriptions of immortals and churches should be included. Very good point. Becoming Immortal shouldn't be what the set would touch on. What Immortals that exist mean to the everyday man should. We've gotten very little on religion as a part of Mystarans' lives. >Pierre Savoie (spl?) posted the FAQ from the L5R Card Game Mailing list. It said that WOTI owns everything posted on that list. Did not sound friendly at all to me :( Didn't sound friendly and with him mentioning not to post ideas to the list made me think he wasn't too sure if his interpretation of copyright laws would hold up in court. He certainly wasn't confident enough to let it happen and risk a lawsuit. Sounded more like someone needs a course in PR. I wonder if anyone sent that to the head honcho if that is completely the way they see mailing lists? - -- This has been a Galwylin© Production http://www.airnet.net/galwylin/ galwylin@airnet.net | ICQ #6755972 | AIM: Galwylin *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 07 Jun 1998 11:55:50 -0500 From: Galwylin Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Mystara without Ethengar? JamugaKhan@aol.com wrote: >Can anybody explain to me why Glantri has so many fans and supporters while Ethengar is disqualified by all and gets the worse end always? The only reason I can give you is that Ethengar doesn't seem to captured too many peoples' imagination. Even the designers of Mystara have stepped around it or forgot it. It just gets treated like its out of place so maybe it is ;) - -- This has been a Galwylin© Production http://www.airnet.net/galwylin/ galwylin@airnet.net | ICQ #6755972 | AIM: Galwylin *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 7 Jun 1998 13:02:01 EDT From: Kaviyd@aol.com Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Almanac/Glantri In a message dated 98-06-04 11:49:43 EDT, ezaqwazy@hotmail.com writes: >Isnt Jagger still owed a favour from stepping down as dragon ruler time tto cash it in ? Okay -- how could any dragon help him? *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 07 Jun 1998 12:05:22 -0500 From: Galwylin Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Midland Forest JamugaKhan@aol.com wrote: >According to the Dragonlord trilogy, there's no civilization in this area, and the only elves out there are Wild Elves. So I would say go ahead with your ideas. Wild elves work for me ;) >BTW, when I say "out there", I remember the "Orcwars" map from "Orcs of Thar". One end of the caravan routes was "Out there" on the Adri Varma plateau. Do anybody know what TSR had in mind when creating this map? (And, as always, a cry for help to Bruce: Do you know anything about it?) "Out There" from that map has an interesting item just above it... New Elven Homeland (suggested). Also, it looks like on the other side of that map (migrations) that the middle of Midland Forest has been visited by humanoids and that large lake is called the Cradle. More mysteries to solve :) - -- This has been a Galwylin© Production http://www.airnet.net/galwylin/ galwylin@airnet.net | ICQ #6755972 | AIM: Galwylin *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 7 Jun 1998 13:47:13 EDT From: Magesmiley@aol.com Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Midland Forest In a message dated 98-06-07 02:10:54 EDT, you write: << no spells until he reaches level 8. As for that "Midland Forest" -- isn't most of it either in Hule or claimed by Hule? If so, that would definitely affect the atmosphere of the place >> If I recall correctly that was said to be an error ont he map, the forest wasn't supposed to extend all the way down into Hule. - -Mage *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 7 Jun 1998 13:56:54 EDT From: Magesmiley@aol.com Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Class Kits for the Known World In a message dated 98-06-07 03:22:44 EDT, you write: << Here's a short list from the AD&D series of Complete Handbooks that I think would work in eastern Brun (and where). What I really like about these books is that they give you a different interpretation of classes. The NWPs and bonus aren't the best part as much as the ideas a kit can give you. >> Hate to say it but kits are one point of AD&D I haven't liked ever. The background and ideas are good, but the extra abilities aren't. IJust my point of view, but kits are one thing I do not want to see on Mystara. - -Mage *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 7 Jun 1998 14:13:35 EDT From: Inconu@aol.com Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - The NoS and Entropy << Well. Not if the Immortals arent watching. Or if Khoronus is in on it. Remember that the Glantri Gaz included a scenario for destroying the Nucleus of the Spheres, which involved destroying the reactor at the time of Blackmoor. Ofcourse, either of these attemptw would make the Known World a rather boring place. At the very best, very different. >> Khoronus would have to be in on it, and they would also have to somehow avoid the guardians (Protectors of the Time Realm). Also, a few other Immortals can time travel as well (including Thanatos), so it would be a good adventure for a very high-level campaign I would suppose. - -Inconu *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 7 Jun 1998 14:18:40 EDT From: Inconu@aol.com Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] -Alphatian Council In a message dated 98-06-07 12:05:18 EDT, you write: << << << If you say, that a person earns 1 XP per 1 GP earned than we have an interesting effect: >> I didn't think anyone actually employed that rule to thier campaigns..... -Inconu >> I'm not sure what you wanted to say, but if you mean that nobody uses this rule, I have to say you that you're not correct. We use this rule. A level 4 magic-user entered the Imperial Navy, went through some month of naval academy and was already level 8 when he started to serve aboard a Imperial Navy ship. Jamuga Khan >> I don't see what your statement had to do with mine. I stated that i didn't think anyone employed the rule of finding 1gp = 1 xp. You replied with : "A level 4 magic-user entered the Imperial Navy, went through some month of naval academy and was already level 8 when he started to serve aboard a Imperial Navy ship. " Can you explain your point a little more clearer? - -Inconu *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ End of mystara-digest V1997 #392 ******************************** *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara' as the body of the message. mystara-digest Sunday, June 7 1998 Volume 1997 : Number 393 Mystara is a trademark of TSR Inc. All Rights Reserved. The following topics are covered in this digest: Re: [MYSTARA] - Re: Greetins from Northern Europe Re: [MYSTARA] -Alphatian Council [MYSTARA] - Alphatian Council Re: [MYSTARA] -Alphatian Council Re: [MYSTARA] -Alphatian Council Re: [MYSTARA] - Greetings to Newbie Re: [MYSTARA] - Almanac/Glantri [MYSTARA] - Re: Ethengar's Invasion [MYSTARA] - XPs for treasure (was Re: Alphatian Council ) Re: [MYSTARA] - The Circle of Alchemy Re: [MYSTARA] - Class Kits for the Known World [MYSTARA] - Dwarf classes (was Re: Jenni's Monumental Memo of Mystara) Re: [MYSTARA] - The NoS and Entropy Re: [MYSTARA] - MYSTARA - Immortals [MYSTARA] - Re: Immortals Re: [MYSTARA] - Re: Greetins from Northern Europe Re: [MYSTARA] - The NoS and Entropy Re: [MYSTARA] - Class Kits for the Known World Re: [MYSTARA] - Spelljammer and Mystara (was: Why Mystara?) Re: [MYSTARA] - Mystara without Ethengar? [MYSTARA] - The Rise of Entropy Re: [MYSTARA] - Midland Forest Re: [MYSTARA] - [MYSTARA] Almanac Re: [MYSTARA] - The Alphatian Council Re: [MYSTARA] - Greetings to Newbie ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Sun, 07 Jun 1998 14:17:43 -0400 From: Dan Groves Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Re: Greetins from Northern Europe At 02:55 PM 6/7/98 +0100, you wrote: >Anyway, abour those books. Was there ever a like a boxed set about Mystara? Sortof. There was the Dawn of the Emporers detailing Alphatia and Thyatis. Champions of Mystara which combined some of the Princess Ark series which appeared in Dragon Magazine. The Hollow World, which details the inside of Mystara. But I don't think there was any single boxed set which summed up all of Mystara. >- And does Gazettere (or however it's spelled :-) deal solely with Mystara? I would say that they do. If I remember correctly, a few have converstion notes for AD&D, and stuck in with the conversion notes are information on sticking the Gazateers into the AD&D worlds (like Greyhawk and the Forgotten Realms) >- How many books were there in that series btw.? I recall 14 of them. 15 if you include Dawn of the Emporers. Also, there were three Gazateer-like supplements for Hollow World. Dan *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 07 Jun 1998 13:49:05 +0000 From: Mike Miller Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] -Alphatian Council JamugaKhan@aol.com wrote: ><< << If you say, that a person earns 1 XP per 1 GP earned than we have an iinteresting effect: >> >I didn't think anyone actually employed that rule to thier campaigns..... >-Inconu >> >I'm not sure what you wanted to say, but if you mean that nobody uses this rule, I have to say you that you're not correct. We use this rule. A level 4 magic-user entered the Imperial Navy, went through some month of naval academy and was already level 8 when he started to serve aboard a Imperial Navy ship. >Jamuga Khan >"Hear and obey, because the Mighty Khan's word is law." *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. I've found this rule to be generally bad. After all in the above case, a wizard gets to be 8th level just by collecting a paycheck? I don't think so. I generally give xp's for special treasure such as valuable paintings and such and give wizards xp's for spellcasting & double xp's for spell research and magical item creation. Fighters get xp's by training with a mentor or fighting for hire and such. Rogues get xps by stealing, clerics get xp's for healing and founding a church and spreading the word of thier deity. just giving xp's for earning money is not a good rule. If however they earn the gold by slaying the dragon guarding it that's a different story! Mike Miller Darkone1@swbell.net *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 07 Jun 1998 15:03:29 -0400 From: David Brian Olsen Subject: [MYSTARA] - Alphatian Council >Besides, the Great Council is to big for day-to-day work, although it has less than twice the number of the German parliament. Probably most work is done by committees, for defense, finance, inner politic, outer politic, education, and so on. Don't forget, that we mostly use Alphatia as the "most modern" country of Mystara. Most MGC (Member of Great Council) will be absent most time but some will do the real politic, especially the leaders of the real important and powerful committees. Anybody should work something out. If nobody do the work, I might do (if I will find the time :-( ) >Jamuga Khan I don't know anything about the German parliament, so I can't comment on that, but that would seem to be a good model for the Grand Council if it's as large as you say it is. Knowing a little bit about the U.S. Congress, I'd say that is also comparable. A project elaborating on the Alphatian system of government does sound interesting though. I wouldn't mind collarborating with someone on it (glances at Khan). - -David "The Imperial Senate will no longer be of any concern to us. The Emperor has permanently dissolved that misguided body. The last remnants of the Old Republic have now been swept away. Senatorial representation has not been formally abolished, you must understand. It has merely been superseded for the duration of the emergency. If that duration remains a permanent fixture, so be it. The Regional governors, will now have direct control and a free hand in administering the territories." - -Grand Moff Tarkin (Just had to continue with the Star Wars theme :-) ) *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 7 Jun 1998 16:02:46 EDT From: JamugaKhan@aol.com Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] -Alphatian Council << I've found this rule to be generally bad. After all in the above case, a wizard gets to be 8th level just by collecting a paycheck? I don't think so. I generally give xp's for special treasure such as valuable paintings and such and give wizards xp's for spellcasting & double xp's for spell research and magical item creation. Fighters get xp's by training with a mentor or fighting for hire and such. Rogues get xps by stealing, clerics get xp's for healing and founding a church and spreading the word of thier deity. just giving xp's for earning money is not a good rule. If however they earn the gold by slaying the dragon guarding it that's a different story! >> Sounds like a really interesting and realistic solution! Sounds like a too difficult and complicated solution too. Jamuga Khan "Hear and obey, because the Mighty Khan's word is law." *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 7 Jun 1998 16:02:44 EDT From: JamugaKhan@aol.com Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] -Alphatian Council << I don't see what your statement had to do with mine. I stated that i didn't think anyone employed the rule of finding 1gp = 1 xp. You replied with : ... Can you explain your point a little more clearer? >> Finally I got you! But indeed, yes, we use that rule that every earned, found or stolen gp earns one xp. Jamuga Khan "Hear and obey, because the Mighty Khan's word is law." *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 7 Jun 1998 16:02:43 EDT From: JamugaKhan@aol.com Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Greetings to Newbie << We may have trouble in 2000 if Al Gore becomes the president of the United States -- his wife Tipper Gore wrote a book which included making a swipe against the "evils" of D&D. She has never been "re-educated"... >> As long as he will not send the US Army, US Navy, US Air Force or US Marines against us, I will not care about the US president. Jamuga Khan "Hear and obey, because the Mighty Khan's word is law." *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 7 Jun 1998 16:26:18 EDT From: Kaviyd@aol.com Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Almanac/Glantri In a message dated 98-06-04 17:20:47 EDT, borealis@cois.on.ca writes: >Therefore, the Sphere is now doing to Entropy what it used to do to Energy; wweaken it. This is why Hel and company suffered a major stroke, and why Thanatos is now the big guy in the Sphere of Entropy, which is being slowly weakened by the altered NoS. Then I suppose that the apparent strengthening of Entropy in Glantri could be the result of the fact that Glantri is the drain -- whatever is being drained becomes more concentrated in the area where the drain occurs. Remember that before WotI it was the Sphere of Energy that was being drained, and at that time wizards (i.e., followers of Energy) were strengthened in Glantri. But that would suggest that in locations very distant from Glantri such as Skothar, Davania, the Savage Coast, the Sylvan Realm, and the Hollow World, there must be some areas that used to show the effects of loss of Energy and are now showing the effects of loss of Entropy. Does anyone have any ideas about such areas? *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 7 Jun 1998 16:26:36 EDT From: Kaviyd@aol.com Subject: [MYSTARA] - Re: Ethengar's Invasion In a message dated 98-06-04 14:08:38 EDT, solmyr@kolumbus.fi writes: >I was just looking at the map of Glantri, and I am wondering why Moglai chose to go through the hilly Boldavia and Klantyre, when there is another, shorter, and much flatter route: through Belcadiz, directly to Glantri City! >That way, Moglai would have had to fight only the forces in Belcadiz, as opposed to all those others. See my point? To begin with, Belcadiz is also hilly -- and also much closer to the Broken Lands, whose inhabitants are no friendlier to the Ethengarians than they are to the Glantrians. And once they have conquered Belcadiz, they would really have no place to go but Glantri City itself -- the best defended part of Glantri. Given the devastation in the southern part of Glantri, attacking Glantri City from the south seems to be a dicy proposition. *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 7 Jun 1998 16:26:44 EDT From: Kaviyd@aol.com Subject: [MYSTARA] - XPs for treasure (was Re: Alphatian Council ) In a message dated 98-06-05 13:56:18 EDT, eand@WPI.EDU writes: >I did, to an extent. If a theif pickpocketed a whole bagful of loot from a ccompletely unsuspecting higher level character, and walked away, I'd give him a bonus of 1XP/GP, or PP if it was a lot of loot. >But for treasure found in dungeons? Or Salaries? That's about as dumb as the "Levelmaker" From the Book of Wondrous Inventions. I think that the idea behind the 1 XP/GP rule is the assumption that the character has undergone a degree of risk proportional to the value of the treasure obtained -- what he is actually getting the XPs for is dealing with all of the tricks and traps between the party and the treasure, or for the extra cunning used by the monster defending it. I certainly would not give XPs for salaries unless the job was exceptionally hazardous. On the other hand, one approach that I did use at one time allowed player characters to pay for training -- not to advance in levels but to gain XPs. With this approach the characters would receive no XPs for acquiring the treasure but would get full value when they spent it - -- thereby ridding them of much of their excess money. The amount of experience that could be gained in this way was limited (you could only be trained for so many XPs per week), and each level gained required a combination of "adventuring" and "training" experience -- there was no way to gain multiple levels by just one method or the other. *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 7 Jun 1998 16:26:53 EDT From: Kaviyd@aol.com Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - The Circle of Alchemy In a message dated 98-06-06 08:31:01 EDT, rmunch@easynet.co.uk writes: >the 4th circle is also quite broad. Is its raising the dead ability a raise ddead or a resurrection do you think? Is it possible to regenerate limbs with it (this ability is probably the most powerful of all the 4th circle abilities) The 4th circle ability to transcend energy is capable of raising the dead and reversing aging, so it might very well be able to regenerate a limb -- at the very least it should be possible to reattach a severed limb or to graft on somebody else's limb in place of the lost limb. *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 7 Jun 1998 16:26:52 EDT From: Kaviyd@aol.com Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Class Kits for the Known World A few "tweaks" I would add: - -- Barbarians and Berserkers do not seem particularly appropriate to Ethengar -- nearly all of their warriors should be Beastriders with horses as their preferred mount. - -- On the other hand, the Wu Jen kit is an excellent approximation of the Ethengarian Hakomon. - -- Finally, if the Belcadiz clan is considered, Glantri becomes an excellent place for the Swashbuckler kits. *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 7 Jun 1998 16:26:58 EDT From: Kaviyd@aol.com Subject: [MYSTARA] - Dwarf classes (was Re: Jenni's Monumental Memo of Mystara) One difference between Mystara and other worlds that we could highlight is the ability of even the lowliest character to gain great power and flexibility. I am not referring to the ability of characters to become Immortal and then advance further as Immortals -- that is just the ultimate logical extension of this ability. What I am referring to is the increased flexibility of a character to change the direction of his character's development at nearly any point -- something that is next to impossible in most AD&D campaigns. For example, I could start with my interpretation of a Rockhome Dwarf. He would have slightly different starting abilities from an AD&D Hill Dwarf -- but the difference of most significance would be his class selection. In AD&D terms, every Dwarf would start play as a Fighter advance on the Paladin/Ranger XP table up to level 12, and gain 400,000 XP per level thereafter. While remaining a single-classed Fighter would be the most common and most efficient option for a Dwarf character, a Dwarf is not excluded from other classes. At any point immediately after gaining a level (including first level, for characters who already know what they want to do), a player can announce that his character is acquiring a new class. Then, upon gaining enough XPs to reach the next level, he gains level one in his new class instead of the next level as a Fighter. For subsequent levels the character would gain levels in both classes, receiving two levels in the new class per level in the old class until he "catches up" with the new class. Eventually all advancement in the new class ceases as he reaches his level limit -- it is only in the Fighter class that a Dwarf would have unlimited advancement (although other races using a similar approach may have other options). Regardless of level reached in other classes, it is the Fighter class alone that would control the hit points gained by the character. Date: Sun, 7 Jun 1998 19:53:13 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: phaser.Showcase.MPGN.COM: majordom set sender to owner-mystara-l@ using -f From: (mystara-digest) To: mystara-digest@Phaser.ShowCase.MPGN.COM Subject: mystara-digest V1997 #393 Reply-To: mystara@mpgn.com X-UIDL: 2ac42ab93e4a86cad7310f2c508fe73d Possible secondary classes and their level limits would include the following: Cleric: This option is commonly selected by starting characters, especially those from Rockhome itself. Level limit is 12. Thief: This is the second most popular option and is selected mainly by outcasts. Again, level limit is 12. Bard: This option opens up a variety of interesting possibilities. In Rockhome itself a Dwarf may become a Chanter and advance to level 15 -- or he could acquire another Bard kit by training with non-Dwarf bards elsewhere. Mage: While Dwarves cannot be standard wizards, there are some exotic possibilities for them to learn magic. If they can persuade an Ethengarian Hakomon or an Ylari Sha'ir to train them, they may reach level 10 as wizards of the appropriate kit. Psionicist: If Mystics are interpreted as being Psionicists of some sort, then a Dwarf could conceivably join a Mystic order and train as a Psionicist. Alternatively, a Dwarf on the Savage Coast may let the Red Curse unlock his psychic ability and become a Psionicist once he is affected by the Curse. In either case, he is limited to 8th level. Warrior Options: At any point after reaching level 9 a Dwarf Fighter (or for that matter a Fighter of nearly any race) may become a "Holy Warrior" and gain the abilities of a D&D Paladin or Avenger as appropriate. Since Dwarves tend to favor the Lawful alignment, Paladins would be more common and Avengers would be outcasts from Dwarven society. I do see a great deal of potential for this system -- given how it could liven up the "dull" Dwarf, it is easy to see that it could create even more interesting possibilities for other races. *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 7 Jun 1998 16:27:04 EDT From: Kaviyd@aol.com Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - The NoS and Entropy In a message dated 98-06-06 10:09:30 EDT, Magesmiley@aol.com writes: >Think of it this way: the nucleus is slowly but surely drawing the extra magical power the extra power the wizards use from the world shield making it more and more anti-magical. Eventually this hits critical mass (annually) >and all of the world's magic is sucked into world shield to counteract the magical deficit accumulated over the previous year. The increasing effects of the >energy drain are explainable this way too. TThis would also explain why the engines failed on the Beagle. They overloaded when they received a massive surge of energy from the world shield. >Pick the idea apart and have some fun with it. If the Nucleus has been altered to affect Entropy rather than Energy, then the implications could be rather frightening. If that Entropic energy is being stored in the World Shield, the overall effect would be to weaken the World Shield. The first symptom we have seen of this effect is the weakening of the Spell or Preservation in the Hollow World. If the Entropy effect is not created, I suspect that the final result would be that the World Shield itself collapses and the world is destroyed. Of course, there would be numerous natural catastrophes of inexplicable origin before that happens, and preventing this catastrophe could make a great far future adventure. *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 7 Jun 1998 16:27:06 EDT From: Kaviyd@aol.com Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - MYSTARA - Immortals In a message dated 98-06-06 08:37:06 EDT, ezaqwazy@hotmail.com writes: >IMC Rad made it all the way back, so what happened to his old job, did hhe become head of school again? That depends on how he feels about Harald. In my own campaign he refused to accept any charge -- he let Harald keep his post and let a new Chamberlain be elected without a qualm. *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 7 Jun 1998 16:27:08 EDT From: Kaviyd@aol.com Subject: [MYSTARA] - Re: Immortals In a message dated 98-06-06 08:37:06 EDT, ezaqwazy@hotmail.com writes: >What punishment did Alphaks recieve for his rockthrowing? Was he ever caught, or was he just suspected? >Didnt Vanya break the rules when she Immortal level cursed Thincol (WotI bk1 p5-6)? There are plenty of other Immortals who would just love to expose this arent there eg `why will you not heal our mighty emperor o mighty (insert name here)?` . answer `because another immortal has cursed him` the rest is, as they say, history. The only way she would not be regarded as breaking the rules would be if he is so closely associated with Vanya that the other Immortals regard Thincol as her property. Alternatively, if the first Immortal approached in this way was Vanya (a quite likely possibility), she could have given an answer that would have closed the issue -- something along the lines of "The emperor has displeased the Immortals, so none will let him be healed." *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 08 Jun 1998 00:20:26 +0200 From: Fabrizio Paoli Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Re: Greetins from Northern Europe At 14.55 07/06/98 +0100, Jakup Michaelsen wrote: Hi Jakup, >Anyway, abour those books. Was there ever a like a boxed set about Mystara? No. >- And does Gazettere (or however it's spelled :-) deal solely with Mystara? Yes, each Gazetter describes one nation of Mystara (except the Northern Reaches GAZ that describes 3 nations). >- How many books were there in that series btw.? 14 Gazetters and a Boxed Set about the Empires of Thyatis and Alphatia. BTW: GAZ 13, The Shadow Elves (one of the best GAZ), is available for FREE download at TSR site http://www.tsr.com ************** Fabrizio Paoli brizio@lunet.it rafiel@geocities.com DM in City Of The Stars - Mystaran Almanac Assistant Leader of Privateers - Student of Aerospace Enginnering Home Page: http://www.geocities.com/TimesSquare/Dungeon/4560 *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 08 Jun 1998 00:23:48 +0200 From: Fabrizio Paoli Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - The NoS and Entropy At 23.18 06/06/98 EDT, Kaviyd@aol.com wrote: >By the way -- does anyone have any theories as to who could have been reporting events from the Hollow World in the PWAs? No idea, anyway if you find this mysterious reporter drop us (i.e. the Almanac Team) a line. Maybe he has a faster way of reaching the HW than our current correspondent :-) *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 07 Jun 1998 17:59:00 -0500 From: Galwylin Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Class Kits for the Known World Magesmiley@aol.com wrote: >Hate to say it but kits are one point of AD&D I haven't liked ever. The background and ideas are good, but the extra abilities aren't. IJust my point of view, but kits are one thing I do not want to see on Mystara. I think others feel that way but I hope we get many Mystaran kits. I play a bladesinger in a game because I like the background (and the name's pretty cool). Just because a kit has extra abilities doesn't mean they have to be used. Or that you can't pick and choose which abilities you do use (just be sure to also pick a disability to balance it out). - -- This has been a Galwylin© Production http://www.airnet.net/galwylin/ galwylin@airnet.net | ICQ #6755972 | AIM: Galwylin *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 7 Jun 1998 16:02:00 -0700 From: "Jesse LaBranche" Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Spelljammer and Mystara (was: Why Mystara?) ><< When it comes to Warp (Spelljamming) speed, tthey work the same. we can say that Mystaran skyships are to Spelljammers the same thing the old Fokkers were to modern days Tornado or F-15 >> Do you really think that? A spelljammer has constantly to be powered by the magical energy of spellcaster, a good voidship not unless it is powered by a dynamo of flying. Besides spelljammers are normal ships with this "helm" added to, while Mystaran voidships are magical from the beginning of construction. I think a spelljammer is no match for a good voidship. Yeah, those whimpy groundlings know some good tricks too! >Jamuga Khan Just a thought here. Couldn't a helm be added to Voidships ? I mean if Mystara were to be converted to AD&D, wouldn't the Voidship still be as it is adding a helm ? Jesse. *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 7 Jun 1998 19:37:40 -0400 (EDT) From: Glen Sprigg Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Mystara without Ethengar? At 11:50 AM 6/7/98 EDT, you wrote: >Can anybody explain to me why Glantri has so many fans and supporters while Ethengar is disqualified by all and gets the worse end always? Actually, Alexius has always liked the Ethengars, and has a couple of friends among them. He wasn't remotely close to happy to hear that the Great Khan had been killed by Ludwig the Sewer Rat, and has plans to avenge the assassination. Glen *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 8 Jun 1998 00:23:38 +0100 From: "Rob" Subject: [MYSTARA] - The Rise of Entropy >But that would suggest that in locations very distant from Glantri such as Skothar, Davania, the Savage Coast, the Sylvan Realm, and the Hollow World, there must be some areas that used to show the effects of loss of Energy and are now showing the effects of loss of Entropy. Does anyone have any ideas about such areas? Hmm. No obvious ideas, but a possibility. The cinnabryl of the Savage Coast is formed magically, as a self regenerating source, put their by Nithian magic. It would be unfortunate if it all started running out... Furthering Entropy when people get afflicted (and some of those people would become Cursed Ones, and go on to afflict even the ones protected by clerics). Maybe the very Curse itself, powered as it is partially by Nithian pyramids and monoliths, would be altered in some unspeakable way... Maybe the manscorpions, orcs and gurrash would start expanding more, pushing back the enduks/aranea/wallaras/phanatons. Maybe the evil Cardinal of Renardy, who is actually a cleric of Ranivorus, will choose that time to make his Bid for Power... :) In the Hollow World maybe the Spell of Preservation would weaken sufficiently to cause a major change. I think that would be a shock, after all the inhabitants are used to living in a more or less static environment. Also some nations are artificially kept intact, next to other nations more powerful than then, through the SoP. Perhaps Nithia will actually finally succeed in kicking some major Milenian butt? Perhaps the Schattenalfen will actually be able to take Chitlacan and kill all the Azcan bosses? Without the SoP to keep everyone in line the Hollow World could be plunged into a dark age that could last centuries... Cheerz ROB *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 8 Jun 1998 00:50:25 +0100 From: "Rob" Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Midland Forest - ----- >Wild elves work for me ;) Me too.. Wild elves rule. Always thought the Kagonesti were the best elven race on Krynn. I was happy when I found out about Clan Grunalf and Clan Longrunner. Cheerz ROB *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 8 Jun 1998 00:43:19 +0100 From: "Rob" Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - [MYSTARA] Almanac - - >It's a plane, where a good dwarven-made plate armour +5 is just a simple toy, where dwarven bards can sing (magical) dwarven runes, where elves do not die even after ten thousand of years. It's a plane where immortals don't have much power and clerics are unknown. >It's a plane I wish to leave as soon as possible. It's a DM who has only the faintest idea about Mystara and who LIKES AD&D. I don't like his DMing style, but unfortunately I'm the minority in all these matters. sounds munchkinesque to me. Its the +5 plate being a toy that gets me het up (ahhh!!! magic item!!!). You should try my campaign (its in Ravenloft at the moment, but they'll be back in Karameikos soon). One poor sod had six different insanities, died once, had his Charisma reduced to 5 for a while by having his nose bitten off by a goblyn, had his True Love mercilessly butchered, swallowed a throat leech, got chased by an undead Loch Ness Monster, killed god only knows how many times in various dream sequences, and even did a spell in Dr Illhousens asylum. And, after this backbreaking toil, he racked up the proud sum of 3000xp, and a rose flower he thought was magical, but in fact wasnt. Ah well, served him right for playing a Swashbuckler in Ravenloft (its that special hindrance again, and the need to be heroic...) I'm so tight, it even makes me cringe sometimes. Funny thing is, they keep on playing! masochists... Cheerz ROB *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 8 Jun 1998 00:46:12 +0100 From: "Rob" Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - The Alphatian Council >Besides, the Great Council is to big for day-to-day work, although it has less than twice the number of the German parliament. Probably most work is done by committees, for defense, finance, inner politic, outer politic, education, and so on. Don't forget, that we mostly use Alphatia as the "most modern" country of Mystara. Most MGC (Member of Great Council) will be absent most time but some will do the real politic, especially the leaders of the real important and powerful committees. Anybody should work something out. If nobody do the work, I might do (if I will find the time :-( ) Probably like the Houses of Parliament. Look at the House of Commons. 600+ MPs, but only a hundred are normally in at any one time. And in the House of Lords everyone seems to be a senile 80+ year old, quietly sleeping happily in the corner. Cheerz ROB *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 8 Jun 1998 00:14:26 +0100 From: "Rob" Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Greetings to Newbie - ----> There was even a DUNGEONS & DRAGONS: HOLLOW WORLD game for the >Sega Genesis if I remember correctly (IIRC). Does anybody know what that was like? Apparently the idea was you play characters who are involved in a raid on their home village. Just before everyone gets slaughtered, POOF! your in the Hollow World. Cue a Bards Tale esque romp (starts off in the Azcan Empire, but apparently the scope widens later on). I think the idea is to find out what the hell happened, and maybe even get back to the surface world. However, all this is second hand... Cheerz ROB *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ End of mystara-digest V1997 #393 ******************************** *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara' as the body of the message. Date: Mon, 8 Jun 1998 01:43:14 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: phaser.Showcase.MPGN.COM: majordom set sender to owner-mystara-l@ using -f From: (mystara-digest) To: mystara-digest@Phaser.ShowCase.MPGN.COM Subject: mystara-digest V1997 #394 Reply-To: mystara@mpgn.com X-UIDL: 4b14f45c4556713610668705e61dabc0 mystara-digest Monday, June 8 1998 Volume 1997 : Number 394 Mystara is a trademark of TSR Inc. All Rights Reserved. The following topics are covered in this digest: Re: [MYSTARA] - The NoS and Entropy [MYSTARA] - Mystara without Ethengar? - nahh, u have to have someone for Glantri to invade... :) [MYSTARA] - Hule Maps [MYSTARA] - [ADMIN] Register With the MML Directory! [MYSTARA] - [ADMIN] Get a Link to Your Mystara Page on the MML Home Page! [MYSTARA] - [ADMIN] The MML Page Has Been Updated! Re: [MYSTARA] - Mystara without Ethengar? Re: [MYSTARA] - Midland Forest Re: [MYSTARA] - Hule Maps Re: [MYSTARA] - Mystara without Ethengar: the Nature of Fantasy in a Sedentary World (LONG) Re: [MYSTARA] - Hule Maps Re: [MYSTARA] - The NoS and Entropy [MYSTARA] - CoM, WotI Re: [MYSTARA] - Hule Maps [MYSTARA] - Re: [MYSTARA] Ethengar's Invasion ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Mon, 8 Jun 1998 00:26:34 +0100 From: "Rob" Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - The NoS and Entropy >Anyhow, as I perceived it, "draining from the Sphere of Entropy" means a weakening of this sphere, as the Brotherhood of Shadow got a major stroke for that. >Jamuga Khan I have to say I agree with the Khan (whose word is law, of course...). After all this assumes that the PCs succeed at WotI, that the NoS is fixed, and we can all live Happily Ever After. This is the result of a successful, Entropy bashing campaign, after all... Cheerz ROB *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 8 Jun 1998 00:36:24 +0100 From: "Rob" Subject: [MYSTARA] - Mystara without Ethengar? - nahh, u have to have someone for Glantri to invade... :) ><< (I still vote we move Ethengar or curse them wwith centaur forms. Doesn't that have a nice sound to it? The Ethengar Centaurs ;) >> >DEFINITELY NOT!!! >Can anybody explain to me why Glantri has so many fans and supporters while Ethengar is disqualified by all and gets the worse end always? I quite like the Ethies where they are... Although I have to say that I'm not sure how well the Mongol horde fits in next to the Vikings, the Crusaders, Venice(ok, i can buy that) and the Land of the Merchants. I always thought it was even more contrived that Ylaraum (I can buy the Ylari desert, it being the result of the demise of the Nithians). Ethie centaurs??? no, i dont like that one either... As to why Glantri is more favoured than the Ethies... i think its probably a better campaign setting. Glantri has so much variety, that you could run an entire campaign in Glantri and never leave. From Scotland (they may take our lives, but they'll never take our freedom!) to Transylvania (I never dvink - vine...) to Venice (political skulduggery galore!) to even a couple of Ethie-like principalities, if you want them... Glantri has it all... I dont think Ethengar has that amount of variety of character that you can play. Plus the "all property belongs to the Khan" thing is doubtless going to put off the looting and pillaging players (unless you can get them ALL to play Ethies - no mean feat!)... Perhaps im just being biased. Hey Khan, any ideas for a high level party doing an adventure with the Khanates? I'll run it, and then decide if my opinion has changed... Cheerz ROB (BTW - that 300 wizards vs the legion... I posed that to the PCs. They reckoned, no, they couldnt stop the legion from getting to its destination in a day. But they do think that given a month they could eliminate that legion. They reckon they could nail all the commanders pretty swiftly, which would greatly hinder the legions operations) *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 07 Jun 1998 19:38:26 -0500 From: Galwylin Subject: [MYSTARA] - Hule Maps Has Hule been mapped anywhere? I've been looking but have only found a small amount of the area in Champions of Mystara and Red Steel sets. - -- This has been a Galwylin© Production http://www.airnet.net/galwylin/ galwylin@airnet.net | ICQ #6755972 | AIM: Galwylin *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 7 Jun 1998 19:28:33 -0600 From: "Leroy Van Camp III" Subject: [MYSTARA] - [ADMIN] Register With the MML Directory! Mystarans, Want others on the list to know more about you? Want them to be able to contact you more easily? Well, then, send in your entry for the MML Member Directory! The only required components are the first two: Name and E-Mail Address. The ones thereafter are all optional, merely suggestions. Add additonal material if you like (although the Admin reserves the right to edit for brevity and relavence. We don't need a four paragraph description of your dog, for example :) Please send all responses to me rather than the list (unless you really want to send it to the list, though we had a thread like this not too long ago). I encourage everyone to join! >>>>>>>Snip -- Send this part only<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<< Name: E-Mail: Home Page: Home City/State/Country: Year I Started Playing RPG's: Year I Started Playing Mystara: Current Mystara Projects I Am Working On: Other xD&D Settings I Play: Other RPG's I Play: Occupation: Year of Birth: Other Hobbies: General Comments: >>>>>>>Snip -- Send this part only<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<< Leroy Van Camp III malacoda@lesbois.com owner-mystara-l@mpgn.com ICQ #4253672 "You know, not kneeing you in the groin is a constant struggle." MST3K *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 7 Jun 1998 19:29:03 -0600 From: "Leroy Van Camp III" Subject: [MYSTARA] - [ADMIN] Get a Link to Your Mystara Page on the MML Home Page! Mystarans, Do you have a Mystara web page out there? If you do feel free to send the URL to the list Admin at one of the addresses below to have your page listed on the MML home page Mystara Links page. Leroy Van Camp III malacoda@lesbois.com owner-mystara-l@mpgn.com ICQ #4253672 "You know, not kneeing you in the groin is a constant struggle." MST3K *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 7 Jun 1998 19:37:56 -0600 From: "Leroy Van Camp III" Subject: [MYSTARA] - [ADMIN] The MML Page Has Been Updated! Mystarans, Took me a while this time, but the MML home page has been updated. I have updated the Directory with all submissions I have had, and I do believe there is a new article in the list of online Dragon articles that I added a couple of weeks ago but did not advertise. The FAQ has had something added, inspired by the recent Almanac posting. : ) If you are new to the list, I recommend checking the FAQ out. There is also lotsa Spelljammer stuff for anyone who cares... : ) http://www.lesbois.com/members/malacoda/TarkasBrainLabIV.html Sometimes when I sit down to update the MML page I wonder if some people are looking to keep their Mystara sites off of the MML home page specifically. I know there are many more out there, owned by people on the list... Leroy Van Camp III malacoda@lesbois.com owner-mystara-l@mpgn.com ICQ #4253672 "You know, not kneeing you in the groin is a constant struggle." MST3K *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 07 Jun 1998 22:58:34 -0400 From: Daly Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Mystara without Ethengar? At 11:50 AM 6/7/98 EDT, JamugaKhan@aol.com wrote: <<< (I still vote we move Ethengar or curse them wwith centaur forms. Doesn't that have a nice sound to it? The Ethengar Centaurs ;) >> >DEFINITELY NOT!!! >Can anybody explain to me why Glantri has so many fans and supporters while Ethengar is disqualified by all and gets the worse end always? Now now Jamuga! Did I not get into a lengthy debate with our friend Inconu over the ability of Ethengar to overrun Glantri? Sheesh! *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 07 Jun 1998 23:06:42 -0400 From: Daly Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Midland Forest At 12:05 PM 6/7/98 -0500, Galwylin wrote: JJamugaKhan@aol.com wrote: >>According to the Dragonlord trilogy, there's no civilization in this area, and the only elves out there are Wild Elves. So I would say go ahead with your ideas. >Wild elves work for me ;) >>BTW, when I say "out there", I remember the "Orcwars" map from "Orcs of Thar". One end of the caravan routes was "Out there" on the Adri Varma plateau. Do anybody know what TSR had in mind when creating this map? (And, as always, a cry for help to Bruce: Do you know anything about it?) >"Out There" from that map has an interesting item just above it... New Elven Homeland (suggested). Of course that was just a joke (as was the whole map). The suggested new elven homeland was placed there by an orc who wanted to move the blasted elves into a nasty region. *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 07 Jun 1998 23:17:17 -0400 From: Daly Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Hule Maps At 07:38 PM 6/7/98 -0500, Galwylin wrote: HHas Hule been mapped anywhere? I've been looking but have only found a small amount of the area in Champions of Mystara and Red Steel sets. Well of course there is the map in Temple of Death... *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 7 Jun 1998 20:51:06 -0700 (PDT) From: Adam Curtis Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Mystara without Ethengar: the Nature of Fantasy in a Sedentary World (LONG) Jamuga Khan wrote: << << (I still vote we move Ethengar or curse them with centaur forms. Doesn't that have a nice sound to it? The Ethengar Centaurs ;) >> DEFINITELY NOT!!! Can anybody explain to me why Glantri has so many fans and supporters while Ethengar is disqualified by all and gets the worse end always? Jamuga Khan "The Mighty Khan is not amused." >> As well his magnificence should feel! I've formally studied Fantasy in a college lit. course and learned some things that I believe apply here (I'll get to why I believe Ethengarians aren't popular, just keep reading): fantasy is a genre writers use to undermine a real world status quo and present what is considered a better alternative. One tool (as there are many) in fantasy is to provide protagonists, foils, cultures, etc. with characteristics the reader may identify with so the reader can picture himself/herself in such a world where the better alternative occurs and succeeds. Now Mystara isn't a fantasy novel, but the above rule remains somewhat true for RPG fantasy. If you notice, most players choose to play humans. After all, we're all humans, and we know how humans generally behave. For the generic player, humans are easiest to identify with in almost any fantasy setting. Elves are second in popularity. Most RPG players at least have environmentalist sympathies if they're not environmentalists (J.R.R. Tolkien probably had a hand in this). Because elves represent the noble human ideal of harmony with nature, a vast population of players find playing an elven PC appealing. The idea that elves more or less look human with the notable exception of ears helps with identifying with them, hence a further boost in their popularity. Dwarves are next down. They personify the noble human ideal of the work ethic. Their rowdy humor also endears them to many players. However, dwarven stature (short, heavy) and their less human look doesn't help their popularity (NOTE: I truly believe looks should not ever matter in just about anything, but sadly most people factor looks into all their decisions even if only subconsciously, especially those of western cultures and its ideals of light hair and eyes, tall height, and skinny shape. Fantasy writers know this and almost always make their heroes both human, tall, and comely for broader audience appeal). Halflings are on about the same level as dwarves, give or take some rungs. They personify the noble human ideals of strong family and a simple life. Though perhaps more "human" than the other demihumans culturally, their childlike stature is a huge detractor to their popularity (see NOTE above. Still, it's nothing good writing and/or imagination can't overcome). Gnomes, well, I've always had the hardest time trying to imagine them physically or culturally no matter how hard I've tried (especially considering the overall lack of material written about them), and those I've talked with about the issue usually mention the same problem I have. IMO, gnomes are the demihuman race most unlike humanity; hence the gnomes are the least popular among players because of the difficulty with readily identifying with one. The above should give a basic method as to possibly why certain races are more popular than others. Now, Ethengarians are human, but for some reason they're unpopular among most Mystara players. Here's the likely reason why: The "standard" human of the Known World is based on a generic human of the early renaissance European culture, a major precursor to modern European, North American, and Oceanian cultures. The United States, Canada, Europe, Australia, and New Zealand hold the vast majority of the world's RPG players. If tenets of these modern cultures are generalized and compared with the general aspects of Mystaran culture, they're extremely similar. For instance, modern European culture and "standard" Mystaran human culture (only a few possible similarities noted): - - utilize similar economic models (capitalist) - - have similar architectural styles (classical, gothic, renaissance, etc. The Mystaran magical dynamic and modern world steel yield incredibly different results, but both cultures have enormous Date: Mon, 8 Jun 1998 01:43:14 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: phaser.Showcase.MPGN.COM: majordom set sender to owner-mystara-l@ using -f From: (mystara-digest) To: mystara-digest@Phaser.ShowCase.MPGN.COM Subject: mystara-digest V1997 #394 Reply-To: mystara@mpgn.com X-UIDL: 4b14f45c4556713610668705e61dabc0 similarity nonetheless). - - have (had in some cases) similar government types (republic, federation, oligarchy, tyrrany, dictatorship, plutocracy, aristocracy, monarchy, empire, theocracy. Magocracy, modern democracy, and communism don't overlap worlds). - - a completely civilized (in the sense of sedentary) lifestyle (*most* significant similarity as it shapes a huge portion of any culture). Now, if we compare Ethengarian (old Mongolian) culture with modern European culture, fewer similarities may be found. Those who haven't studied much history, psychology, or palientology usually find differences between the two cultures are far more noticeable than any similarities: - - Money is of little importance in Ethengarian society. Wealth is determined by how much livestock a family tends. However, the nomadic gap between the rich and the poor is no where near what you'd see in any civilization. - - Ethengarians are nomadic, a complete polar opposite of our sedentary lifestyle (*very key*). - - Ethengarians are extremely limited in their choice of profession. Other than the occasional holy men, artisans, and few other minor exceptions, Ethengarians are horsemen herders/warriors. A much greater diversity in professions may be found in any civilized society. - - Ethengarians create few if any permanent structures while they are absolutely necessary in our lifestyle. Not only does one from the modern European culture have a much more difficult time identifying with Ethengarian culture than the standard Mystaran culture, but the life of an Ethengarian adventurer may also be seen as extremely harsh and limited in comparison with the standard human Mystaran adventurer. For instance: - - Ethengarian rulers rule clans instead of lands (ie. really no dominons). - - Ethengarian adventurers must work extremely hard just to ensure their physical sustenance. The standard Mystaran adventurer needs to worry about this much less. - - Ethengarian adventurers typically never become materially wealthy, especially since they don't like to own more than they can carry or herd. - - Ethengarians don't enjoy most of the little comforts civilizations have, such as matresses, chairs, carriages, candles, roads, glass, eating utensils, etc. - - Even more than the average civilian of standard Mystara, the lives of even most of the better off Ethengarians are, in the words of Hobbes: "savage, brutish, and short." All things considered, the average RPG player from our culture will have a harder time identifying with an Ethengarian than a standard Mystaran human, perhaps even an elf or a dwarf, and easily notices "negatives" in Ethengarian culture. Hence Ethengarians are among the least popular PCs to play. However, as a history major and voracious reader, I've studied Mongolian (real world Ethengarian equivalent) culture, history, and military history. It's utterly fascinating! After just reading a little bit on Mongolia, I guarantee a whole slew of players would gain a sudden interest in Ethengar (I know. Almost no one researches history of the real life culture the fantasy one is based on, but it's often worth it). Maybe a quick primer could pique some interest. Mongolians were unsurpassed in warfare in their day. There was only one kind of soldier: the horseman. The typical horseman was male, though female soldiers were not unheard of (at the very least, those women didn't fight in battle would comb the fresh battlefields to pick up arrows and would slit the throats of wounded enemies). The horseman's weaponry consisted of a lance, a saber, and the deadly nomad bow. Less than half the size of the Welsh (or English) longbow, the nomad bow had greater pull, a greater range, greater accuracy, and could be fired from horseback. The bow was the main weapon of the Mongolian horseman, and Mongolians could fire arrows from them rapidly, even at a full gallop and turned to fire backwards. Mongolian armor typically never utilized even a single scrap of metal. They would wear a thick coat, comparable to a trenchcoat, but much warmer to deal with harsh winters. The layer below was usually tanned leather, and most importantly, the final layer was a thick silk shirt. Arrows practically never pierce silk, hence horsemen were almost unshootable. Conversely, arrows, even from less sophisticated bows, often penetrated the toughest of full metal armor French knights wore in the late renaissance. So the Mongolians received far superior protection (probably an equivalent of -10 to -15 AC) from missles while greatly reducing the weight their steeds had to carry. Mongolian armies moved at astronomical speeds for their time. The typical elite feudal army could cover about 20 miles on a good day. A Mongolian army, not needing supply lines and fully mounted, could easily cover 70 miles a day in fair weather. That number could jump to over 100 miles a day if a forced march was called for. When unified under one Khan, the Mongolians easily conquered every land from the Yangtze river in China to the Carpathian mountains in eastern Europe by about 1200 AD *without a scratch*. Their expansion was spurred by the civilized world that scoffed at Mongolian "barbary" and refused to even treat them with minor respect. One by one, each nation in its hubris welcomed war with the backward Mongols soon to find its armies mercilessly slaughtered. Only the death of Ogedai Khan saved North Africa and Europe from entering the Mongolian Empire; had his death been more timely, Ogedai Khan would have undisputedly ruled the largest empire the world ever saw (only the British Empire would possibly exceed the extent of the Mongolian Empire). I could be wrong, but I believe the above are the most broadly interesting tidbits of Mongolian culture and history to RPG players. Now, translate it all into Ethengar. Should the DM decide to make the Ethengarians as powerful and battle effective as they should be, (sorry Heldann fans) the Heldann Freeholds would have been easily swatted away like flies into history (I don't care how much Vanya likes you. You can't hope to catch Ethengarians off guard much less even pace them at a gallop when you've placed 400 pounds on your horse's back unless you have Alphatian-abundant magic, nor can you last long against a hail of arrows if you can't strike back decisively). Likely the rest of the northern Known World not nestled in the mountains like Rockhome and Glantri would fall to the Ethengarians easily. It won't *officially* happen for various reasons (especially because no one wants to see every Known World government crumble under the weight of an omnipotent warlord), but that shouldn't stop DMs out there. Powerful Ethengarians become Khans, so it's very conceivable that a PC could conquer the world . . . If you play an Ethengar warrior who leaves the steppes, an additonal myriad of possibilities opens up. Someone with such superior training will be feared, and many royal courts more concerned with results than appearances will pay a high price for the Ethengarian's skills. The Ethengarian, as part of an adventuring group, could easily intimidate a large goblin band into temporary servitude and send it into a path of hostile trolls bearing down on a village without the aid of spells (excellent way to buy time). He could raise his own mercenary band, and drilling his band in Ethengarian mobility and archery, he could conceivably seize his own domain in a legendary campaign reminiscent of David v. Goliath. The list continues . . . . . . but this post is probably too long already, so I'll wrap it up. The Mystara designers wanted Mystara to hold most of the real world's cultures in close quarters. The result: a small area of a continent mostly representing Europe, but also bearing Mongolian, Arabic, Native American, African, and Indian cultures. Though so diverse a cultural range probably could not exist in such a small area at that equivalent time period, it's incredibly fun to have so much variety to choose from. You would think that a culture as specialized as the Ethengar culture would be found on a vast steppeland away from civilization. It would make sense, but I prefer to suspend disbelief here. Banishing so incredible a culture thousands of miles to the northwest would seriously detract from the diversity of Mystara, perhaps the greatest and most marketable unique feature among RPGs it has to offer gamers. _________________________________________________________ DO YOU YAHOO!? Get your free @yahoo.com address at http://mail.yahoo.com *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 07 Jun 1998 22:56:28 -0500 From: Galwylin Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Hule Maps Daly wrote: >Well of course there is the map in Temple of Death... I suppose that is X5, the module I'm missing ;/ - -- This has been a Galwylin© Production http://www.airnet.net/galwylin/ galwylin@airnet.net | ICQ #6755972 | AIM: Galwylin *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 07 Jun 1998 21:00:29 -0700 (MST) From: "Cthulhudrew, The Great Old One" Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - The NoS and Entropy On Sat, 6 Jun 1998 Magesmiley@AOL.COM wrote: >I'm going to throw a new theory into the fire on the draining effect. First off if the nucleus is draining magic shouldn't it be drawing power from the whole prime plane? But its not, its just draining magic from Mystara. My theory is that it isn't actually draining the magic, but doing something which has a very similar effect, specifically strengthening the anti-magical properties of the world shield. I've had similar thoughts over the years- perhaps the Radiance gives off some sort of waste product that affects the World Shield, or that it simply draws on the energies of the World Shield itself with the result that there are fluctuations in the Shields anti-magical properties. I recall that there were some problems with this theory, but for the life of me, I can't think of any of them offhand... - ------------------------ Cthuludrew, the Great Old One (aka Andrew Theisen, mild mannered *former* college student) "Actions have consequences." URL- http://www.public.asu.edu/~jsmill *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 7 Jun 1998 22:39:15 +0000 From: "Mike Harvey" Subject: [MYSTARA] - CoM, WotI What information is covered in Champions of Mystara and Wrath of the Immortals? Specifically: Does Champions of Mystara have all the Princess Ark material? Or is it the expedition to the Hollow World? Does Wrath of the Immortals have generally-useful information about Mystara? I am not especially interested in the immortals themselves or events connected with them (and would in fact probably junk them in favor of my own religious system) but the set may contain other useful information... Thanks, Mike - ---------------------------------------------------------------------- bing@iccom.com (formerly mike@cs.pdx.edu) Mike Harvey HTTP://www.iccom.com/usrwww/bing/home.html Beaverton, Oregon *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 7 Jun 1998 22:19:34 -0700 From: "Jesse LaBranche" Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Hule Maps >Has Hule been mapped anywhere? I've been looking but have only found a small amount of the area in Champions of Mystara and Red Steel sets. This has been a Galwylin© Production Modules X4 and X5- Master of the Desert Nomads series. If you cannot get a hold of this I'll send you a copy- but it's on graph paper instead of hex. Later. Jesse. *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 7 Jun 1998 22:40:00 -0700 (PDT) From: Adam Curtis Subject: [MYSTARA] - Re: [MYSTARA] Ethengar's Invasion Kaviyd@aol.com wrote: << << > I was just looking at the map of Glantri, and I am wondering why Moglai >chose to go through the hilly Boldavia and Klantyre, when there is another, >shorter, and much flatter route: through Belcadiz, directly to Glantri City! >That way, Moglai would have had to fight only the forces in Belcadiz, as >opposed to all those others. See my point? >> To begin with, Belcadiz is also hilly -- >> Trust me. Hills are not an issue for Ethengar horsemen. Mountains and steep craters are. << and also much closer to the Broken Lands, whose inhabitants are no friendlier to the Ethengarians than they are to the Glantrians. >> But they're far easier to push around than Jaggar Von Drachenfels and his toys. << And once they have conquered Belcadiz, they would really have no place to go but Glantri City itself -- Except for the rest of Glantri. Ethengar armies conquer through destroying armies and collecting tribute, not holding territory. They'd pick off Glantri's weaker defenses first and work their way up, and it's not as if there isn't a ton of open country around Glantri City. << Given the devastation in the southern part of Glantri, attacking Glantri City from the south seems to be a dicy proposition. >> If the Ethengarians were more interested in actually conquering all of Glantri without prejudice, they'd gallop around the south of the Colossus Mountains where the defenses aren't as formidable. However, the Ethengars have three excellent reasons why they attacked the way they did. First, Boldavia is a full-fleged principality that is wide open to attack from the steppes (no protective mountains). Second, Boldavia is utterly infested with undead. Being religious, Ethengarians would much like to wipe those fell creatures off the planet. Third, if the Ethengarians successfully penetrate Glantri this way, they have a faster route to Krondahar, Prince Jherek's realm. He's at the top of the Khan's hit list because he's an ethnic Ethengar, practices barbaric magery, and is (or was) unyielding in applying the death penalty upon clerics. So though they consider military strategy, the Ethengars are moved more by personal scores to settle in this instant. _________________________________________________________ DO YOU YAHOO!? Get your free @yahoo.com address at http://mail.yahoo.com *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ End of mystara-digest V1997 #394 ******************************** *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara' as the body of the message. Date: Mon, 8 Jun 1998 09:59:54 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: phaser.Showcase.MPGN.COM: majordom set sender to owner-mystara-l@ using -f From: (mystara-digest) To: mystara-digest@Phaser.ShowCase.MPGN.COM Subject: mystara-digest V1997 #395 Reply-To: mystara@mpgn.com X-UIDL: e5cf341e04422e345549f330544285d4 mystara-digest Monday, June 8 1998 Volume 1997 : Number 395 Mystara is a trademark of TSR Inc. All Rights Reserved. The following topics are covered in this digest: Re: [MYSTARA] - CoM, WotI Re: Re: [MYSTARA] - Class Kits for the Known World Re: [MYSTARA] - Mystara without Ethengar? Re: Re: [MYSTARA] - Mystara without Ethengar? Re: [MYSTARA] - Mystara without Ethengar? Re: [MYSTARA] -Alphatian Council Re: [MYSTARA] - Mystara without Ethengar? Re: [MYSTARA] - Re: [MYSTARA] Ethengar's Invasion Re: [MYSTARA] - Spelljammer and Mystara (was: Why Mystara?) Re: [MYSTARA] - Mystara without Ethengar? Re: [MYSTARA] - Spelljammer and Mystara (was: Why Mystara?) Re: [MYSTARA] - Spelljammer and Mystara (was: Why Mystara?) Re: [MYSTARA] -Alphatian Council Re: [MYSTARA] - Mystara without Ethengar? Re: [MYSTARA] - Almanac/Glantri Re: [MYSTARA] - Mystara without Ethengar? Re: [MYSTARA] - Spelljammer and Mystara (was: Why Mystara?) Re: [MYSTARA] - Greetings from Northern Europe Re: [MYSTARA] - The NoS and Entropy Re: [MYSTARA] - The NoS and Entropy Re: [MYSTARA] - Adri Varma Plateau Re: [MYSTARA] - Mystara without Ethengar: the Nature of Fantasy in a Sedentary World (LONG) Re: [MYSTARA] - Spelljammer and Mystara (was: Why Mystara?) ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Mon, 08 Jun 1998 00:49:42 -0500 From: Galwylin Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - CoM, WotI Mike Harvey wrote: >Does Champions of Mystara have all the Princess Ark material? Or is it the expedition to the Hollow World? CoM covers the areas around Sind (and Sind itself). Has the Princess Ark articles summerized and guide to building airships mostly. >Does Wrath of the Immortals have generally-useful information about Mystara? I am not especially interested in the immortals themselves or events connected with them (and would in fact probably junk them in favor of my own religious system) but the set may contain other useful information... WotI has the the timeline from 1000 Ac to 1009 AC and maps of the landscape changes. Most of the material is devoted to the Immortal rules though. - -- This has been a Galwylin© Production http://www.airnet.net/galwylin/ galwylin@airnet.net | ICQ #6755972 | AIM: Galwylin *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 8 Jun 1998 01:55:42 EDT From: BoBoII@aol.com Subject: Re: Re: [MYSTARA] - Class Kits for the Known World What would be some KW specific kits to make/post? Alphatian Air Mage Flaemish fire mage Graduate of the Great School Ethengarian Horseman Elvish Treekeeper Elvish Treewalker Vyalia Forester Hattian Storm soldier Kerenden Dragoon Belcadiz Duelist Alphatian Duelist (magical kind, like a prizefighter/gunslinger) Darokin Merchant Orcish Legionnaire Thyatian Gladiator Minrothad Sea Elf Shire Pirate Thothian Death Priest Sailors (Minrothad, Irendi, Skyship) Northern Raiders, Skaalds, Rune readers Glantrian Monster Handlers Irendi Silver Knives (purgers of Lyc.s and vamp.s) Heldannic Knights Thyatian Rakes Fist of the Khan I'm thinking of groups that would be readily recognized as different from the norm and regionally specific . . . more thematicly than "Game stat"-wise. So please wrack your collective brains to come up with these unique types who help to give Mystara its flavor. "Stats" would be up to the individual DM's. I also ask for help on this list as possible inspiration points for NPC's, Adventure ideas, or for original works from the WritersList. Thanks for the help so far, and you can just send em to me if the rest of the list gets tired of it. *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 8 Jun 1998 02:07:36 EDT From: BoBoII@aol.com Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Mystara without Ethengar? In a message dated 6/7/98 12:04:09 PM, The Khan wrote: <<"The Mighty Khan is not amused." >> I don't know why Ethengar doesn't have the same following. Maybe if TSR came out with one more CD Box Set called "Ethengar: Land of Grass" Just kidding Khan. *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 8 Jun 1998 02:29:53 EDT From: BoBoII@aol.com Subject: Re: Re: [MYSTARA] - Mystara without Ethengar? In a message dated 6/7/98 1:09:39 PM, galwilyn wrote: <> I know its keep to the whole "patchwork quilt" concept, but I also feel that almost all the Ethengar info would be well served if moved to Jennite Holdings. Substitute their longstanding rivals Glantri for Expansionist Alphatians. Note, they would be the ferocious riders who were too tough for even the Alphatians to fully colonize, Khan. If the designers had known what it would all look like by the time they did DotE, they might have done it this way. So what happens in Eastern Brun? Well you could spread the desert further north, and have it become colder and less "Arabia", more like the Gobi and have Ylari culture (the remnants of once great Nithian Empire) have a larger sway. Perhaps these Northern tribesmen have not converted to the Eternal Truth and also pose a threat to Ylaruam. Or, give the proximity to Northern Reaches, the Ethengar area could become a huge tract less forest inhabited by Known World Germanic Tribes, or groups related to the Goths (Ostrogoths, Visigoths, Vandals, Franks). [Those of you more familiar with the cultures and history of Central Europe, please chime in.] Remember, Attila was different from Ghengis, and Europe was faces with many "waves" of migrating peoples who passed through, battled, and joined the local populations. So there are a variety of RW hordes to chose from, while keeping the Golden Horde as the tip of the MOrient iceberg. *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 08 Jun 1998 01:40:23 -0500 From: Galwylin Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Mystara without Ethengar? BoBoII@aol.com wrote: >I don't know why Ethengar doesn't have the same following. Maybe if TSR came out with one more CD Box Set called "Ethengar: Land of Grass" That's too funny! Also, look at everything important that happens in Mystara. No Ethengar involvement. To play an Ethengarian means to probably never have an impact beyond the borders. A character might not in any nation but the possibility exist much more elsewhere than in Ethengar. - -- This has been a Galwylin© Production http://www.airnet.net/galwylin/ galwylin@airnet.net | ICQ #6755972 | AIM: Galwylin *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 08 Jun 1998 02:00:08 +0000 From: Mike Miller Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] -Alphatian Council JamugaKhan@aol.com wrote: ><< I've found this rule to be generally bad. After all in the above case, a wwizard gets to be 8th level just by collecting a paycheck? I don't think so. I generally give xp's for special treasure such as valuable paintings and such and give wizards xp's for spellcasting & double xp's for spell research and magical item creation. Fighters get xp's by training with a mentor or fighting for hire and such. Rogues get xps by stealing, clerics get xp's for healing and founding a church and spreading the word of thier deity. just giving xp's for earning money is not a good rule. If however they earn the gold by slaying the dragon guarding it that's a different story! >> >Sounds like a really interesting and realistic solution! >Sounds like a too difficult and complicated solution too. >Jamuga Khan >"Hear and obey, because the Mighty Khan's word is law." It can get complicated. It all depends on what you are willing to do. If all else fails, talk to your DM or your players, and have them suggest a simple solution that works for all. It gets them involved and takes the weight off your shoulders. Mike Miller darkone1@swbell.net *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 8 Jun 1998 00:05:29 -0700 From: "Jesse LaBranche" Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Mystara without Ethengar? >BoBoII@aol.com wrote: >>I don't know why Ethengar doesn't have the same following. Maybe if TSR came >>out with one more CD Box Set called "Ethengar: Land of Grass" >That's too funny! >Also, look at everything important that happens in Mystara. No Ethengar involvement. To play an Ethengarian means to probably never have an impact beyond the borders. A character might not in any nation but the possibility exist much more elsewhere than in Ethengar. This has been a Galwylin© Production This thread has definitely sparked my curiosity. The only thing that I have regarding the Ethengarians is the module X3 The Curse of Xanathon... (Spoiler space) = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = Okay, in X3 the city of Rhoona has a Priest and a small sector that belongs to the Ethengarians. I always thought that this module was meant to show the style of the Ethengarians. I'd always related them more to thieves and subversives much more than I attributed them to the Mongolian empire, although steppes horsemen- they seemed aloof and conniving much more than warlike. I can see the mistakes that I was making, but I think that the above thread of "never having an impact beyond the border" seems to go a different direction as well. Just a curiosity for those familiar with it. How well does the module fit in with the information presented in the Gazetteer ? Later. Jesse. *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 8 Jun 1998 08:31:29 +0100 From: "Rob" Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Re: [MYSTARA] Ethengar's Invasion >However, the Ethengars have three excellent reasons why they attacked the way they did. First, Boldavia is a full-fleged principality that is wide open to attack from the steppes (no protective mountains). Second, Boldavia is utterly infested with undead. Being religious, Ethengarians would much like to wipe those fell creatures off the planet. Third, if the Ethengarians successfully penetrate Glantri this way, they have a faster route to Krondahar, Prince Jherek's realm. He's at the top of the Khan's hit list because he's an ethnic Ethengar, practices barbaric magery, and is (or was) unyielding in applying the death penalty upon clerics. Also, Belcadiz elves are probably Bloody Hard - being elves. Remember what Alfheim did to Darokin? The Ethies would have to get past Monteleone and deal with elven swashbucklers to get thru Belcadiz. Probably as hard as, if not harder than, Boldavia. Cheerz ROB *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 8 Jun 1998 08:25:34 +0100 From: "Rob" Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Spelljammer and Mystara (was: Why Mystara?) >Just a thought here. Couldn't a helm be added to Voidships ? I mean if Mystara were to be converted to AD&D, wouldn't the Voidship still be as it is adding a helm ? Well, a helm can be added to a bit of driftwood (wont be very maneuverable tho!) so I cant see why not. But I like the idea of Voidships. Means that Mystara is different - and not at the mercy of the Arcane for their spelljamming technology. That sets Mystara apart - Alphatia could be trading rivals with the Arcane... Cheerz ROB *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 08 Jun 1998 02:44:49 -0500 From: Galwylin Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Mystara without Ethengar? Jesse LaBranche wrote: >Just a curiosity for those familiar with it. How well does the module fit in with the information presented in the Gazetteer ? I don't think they conflict each other too harshly. The Ethangarians in Vestland are probably typical of a people trying to adapt to different way of life. They are vastly different in the Gazetteer though. At the first part of the Gazetteer it says "...the renowned horse warriors..." and goes on showing that these are the historical Mongols of Mystara. Not thieves and liars (though they do have the 'lie' spell). - -- This has been a Galwylin© Production http://www.airnet.net/galwylin/ galwylin@airnet.net | ICQ #6755972 | AIM: Galwylin *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 8 Jun 1998 00:45:54 -0700 From: "Jesse LaBranche" Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Spelljammer and Mystara (was: Why Mystara?) >>Just a thought here. Couldn't a helm be added to Voidships ? I mean if Mystara were to be converted to AD&D, wouldn't the Voidship still be as it is adding a helm ? >Well, a helm can be added to a bit of driftwood (wont be very maneuverable tho!) so I cant see why not. >But I like the idea of Voidships. Means that Mystara is different - and not >at the mercy of the Arcane for their spelljamming technology. That sets Mystara apart - Alphatia could be trading rivals with the Arcane... Cheerz >ROB Well, if a Voidship had both- then they could go faster with the helm- and do just fine when they couldn't use the arcane abilities. Right ? Not trying to push circumstances- just curious. Later. Jesse. *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. Date: Mon, 8 Jun 1998 09:59:54 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: phaser.Showcase.MPGN.COM: majordom set sender to owner-mystara-l@ using -f From: (mystara-digest) To: mystara-digest@Phaser.ShowCase.MPGN.COM Subject: mystara-digest V1997 #395 Reply-To: mystara@mpgn.com X-UIDL: e5cf341e04422e345549f330544285d4 ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 08 Jun 1998 03:51:35 -0500 From: Galwylin Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Spelljammer and Mystara (was: Why Mystara?) Rob wrote: >But I like the idea of Voidships. Means that Mystara is different - and not at the mercy of the Arcane for their spelljamming technology. That sets Mystara apart - Alphatia could be trading rivals with the Arcane... The Arcane motives are mysterious but they have a nice racket going with being the only ones offering a method of space travel. I don't think Alphatia is a viable rival to the Arcane though. One reason being their sinking and another that they're not aware that their space maybe in a crystal sphere that is possible to leave. Of course, that shouldn't last long once Mystarans start encountering others from different worlds. - -- This has been a Galwylin© Production http://www.airnet.net/galwylin/ galwylin@airnet.net | ICQ #6755972 | AIM: Galwylin *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 8 Jun 1998 07:09:30 EDT From: Inconu@aol.com Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] -Alphatian Council << I've found this rule to be generally bad. After all in the above case, a wizard gets to be 8th level just by collecting a paycheck? I don't think so. >> Right. I think Experience points should be given out when a character learns or experiences something. If a XP point was given out to each gold earned......then anyone with a steady job for some time would be high level. NPC market sales men could be ninth level or whatever by this rule. A King could just sit on his throne for years, but he'd be over 20th level in no time by the taxes he'd be collecting. Perhaps, Xp could be given out for learning a new job or maybe a proficency slot given out. Not for each GP earned though. That's too funny of a rule to actually use IMO. - -Inconu *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 08 Jun 1998 12:14:36 +0000 (GMT) From: Gordon McCormick Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Mystara without Ethengar? The Great Khan wrote: ><< (I still vote we move Ethengar or curse them wwith centaur forms. Doesn't that have a nice sound to it? The Ethengar Centaurs ;) >> >DEFINITELY NOT!!! >Can anybody explain to me why Glantri has so many fans and supporters while Ethengar is disqualified by all and gets the worse end always? Personally I prefer Glantri because of it's incredible amount of conflict. Not combat, but conflict between the Houses, individual nobles, people at the school and the hosts of Guilds, Brotherhoods etc. No other land in Mystara has so detailed and so many rivalries that the PC's can get involved in. There's also an incredible variety of "flavours" in the setting, French, Scots, Germans, Dutch, Spanish, Romanian, Italians, to name a few...(also I play the Alphatians like the English and the Erewan like Scandawegians...mainly for accents rather than behaviour...) Compared to this, Alphatia seems too...empty...Ethengar is better with it's details of conflicts within the Clans, but I still prefer Glantri. BTW, did anyone see the documentry "Storm From the East"? It was on a few years ago, the BBC did it I think. Very good at scaring anyone who thinks tha Mongols are wimps...played an Ethengarian campaign straight after watching it :) gordon *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 8 Jun 1998 07:15:36 EDT From: Inconu@aol.com Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Almanac/Glantri << But that would suggest that in locations very distant from Glantri such as Skothar, Davania, the Savage Coast, the Sylvan Realm, and the Hollow World, there must be some areas that used to show the effects of loss of Energy and are now showing the effects of loss of Entropy. Does anyone have any ideas about such areas? >> I have a Davanian campaign. In it, the Day of Dread is a complete mystery in which many sages have been trying to figure out for a few years now. Also, reachers try to track it and hire bodyguards to protect them. Some have realized that the point of origin is to the north, but having a tough time pinpointing it. - -Inconu *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 8 Jun 1998 07:26:55 EDT From: Inconu@aol.com Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Mystara without Ethengar? << Now now Jamuga! Did I not get into a lengthy debate with our friend Inconu over the ability of Ethengar to overrun Glantri? Sheesh! No need to start this up again Daly...... ;) - -Inconu *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 8 Jun 1998 12:31:26 +0100 From: "Rob" Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Spelljammer and Mystara (was: Why Mystara?) Well, if a Voidship had both- then they could go faster with the helm- and ddo just fine when they couldn't use the arcane abilities. Right ? Not trying >to push circumstances- just curious. Probably. There are spelljammers with all sorts of magic on them (non detection, that sort of thing) and that doesnt interfere with the helm. Perhaps it is possible to amalgamate the two technologies - have a helm powered by some bound energy (like the Nightwalker that powers the Alphatian Flying Castle in Vengeance of Alphaks). Best of both worlds... Cheerz ROB *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 8 Jun 1998 14:56:26 +0200 (METDST) From: DM Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Greetings from Northern Europe At 14.28 06/06/98 +0100, Jakup Michaelsen wrote: II'm new to this list and to RPGs as well. My name is Jakup Michaelsen, I'm from the Faroe Islands - 18 islands in the North Atlantic - and I'm 18 years old. Hi to you! it's nice to have another newbie here! feel free to ask and we'll answer :) >Anyway. Mystara sounds like a very interesting world. Which books should I buy to get started? Well, Jakup, to tell the truth Mystara is the name of the original D&D setting (the map you find in Expert set -the blue boxed set). I haven't understood WHICH D&D set you own (is the 3rd edition boxes or the Rules Cyclopaedia? or AD&D?), but these are the books you should have to start a Mystara campaign: - -Poor Wizard's Almanac 1-2-3 (provide info on ALL the nations of Mystara, their armies and the most important NPCs with stats and histories; provide also Timeline of events from AC1010 to AC1012) - -Rules Cyclopaedia OR D&D boxed sets from Basic to Master (core rules) - -Wrath of the Immortals boxed set OR Immortal boxed set (rules regarding Immortals; with WotI you also get a world shaking adventure and fine maps of Mystara) This is the core: if you can spend more and are able to find older supplements,also look for: - -Hollow World boxed set (describes lost civilizations who live INSIDE Mystara) - -All Gazetteers (detail each of the major nations of the Known World) - -Champions of Mystara (rules for flying ships and other neat maps + info on new areas of Mystara -you can find this in PWA too) - -Thyatis & Alphatia boxed set (info on these two empires) - -Red Steel OR Savage Coast book (info on the Savage Coast of Mystara: it's for AD&D but i see no big problems converting it into D&D rules) You can also download for free some Mystara and Red Steel/Savage Coast supplements from TSR site (www.tsrinc.com) And for other information, check out my site (UPDATED for this month!) -see my signature at the end of the letter. AVOID these products: Player's and Dungeon Master's Survival Kit Glantri: Kingdom of Magic (if you already own GAZ3: Principalities of Glantri) Karameikos: Kingdom of Adventure (if you already own GAZ1: Grand Duchy of Karameikos) Hope to have satisfied your curiosity! :) DM Visit My Mystara Homepage at: http://www.geocities.com/TimesSquare/Dungeon/2967 Updated every month!! *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 8 Jun 1998 15:05:19 +0200 (METDST) From: DM Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - The NoS and Entropy At 21.37 06/06/98 +0100, Rob wrote: >><< Ofcourse Draining from Entropy only strengthens Entropy. Strange, but ttthats the way it is.. >> >I suppose if you consider Entropy to be a negative force, subtracting from that force is going to give - a bigger negative! Yep, that's what i was trying to say when i hypothesized that the dramatical events of this year were a product of the augmented influence of Entropy on the Known World due to the altered NoS! You thought i was a fool, uh? Well, it could be... but then, it's only another side effect of Entropy spreading!! ;)) DM Visit My Mystara Homepage at: http://www.geocities.com/TimesSquare/Dungeon/2967 Updated every month!! *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 8 Jun 1998 15:06:12 +0200 (METDST) From: DM Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - The NoS and Entropy At 04.22 06/06/98 PDT, you wrote: >By the way where does it say anything about NoS allowing new Entropic immortals? I`ve no recollection of such. About one year ago there was a similar discussion on the list that saw also the contribution of Bruce Heard, who explained some obscure points about NoS and Entropy. I've put it on my site at this URL: http://www.geocities.com/TimesSquare/Dungeon/2967/nucleus.html Feel free to peruse it: it will answer many of your doubts! DM Visit My Mystara Homepage at: http://www.geocities.com/TimesSquare/Dungeon/2967 Updated every month!! *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 08 Jun 1998 15:40:05 +0200 From: DM Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Adri Varma Plateau At 05.38 07/06/98 EDT, Jamuga wrote: >I remember vaguely that I've read once that there are "cactus-like treants" living on the Adri Varma Plateau. Can anybody remember that too? If yes, from what source it has originated? Never heard that. The only info i have on Adri varma is from Steven B. Wilson's gaz about that region that also introduced the Sandmen as inhabitants of that region. it's on my site if you wanna check it out... (Mystara Miscellanea section) DM Visit My Mystara Homepage at: http://www.geocities.com/TimesSquare/Dungeon/2967 Updated every month! *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 8 Jun 1998 09:50:26 -0400 (EDT) From: Glen Sprigg Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Mystara without Ethengar: the Nature of Fantasy in a Sedentary World (LONG) At 08:51 PM 6/7/98 -0700, you wrote: >I've formally studied Fantasy in a college lit. course and learned some things that I believe apply here (I'll get to why I believe Ethengarians aren't popular, just keep reading): fantasy is a genre writers use to undermine a real world status quo and present what is considered a better alternative. One tool (as there are many) in fantasy is to provide protagonists, foils, cultures, etc. with characteristics the reader may identify with so the reader can picture himself/herself in such a world where the better alternative occurs and succeeds. Wow! Quite a length discourse, Adam! A lot of good points there. But I still prefer the noble Ethengarian horse warriors to those slimy bureaucratic Glantrians :-) Alexius/Glen *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 08 Jun 1998 15:57:48 +0200 From: DM Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Spelljammer and Mystara (was: Why Mystara?) At 11.50 07/06/98 EDT, Jamuga wrote: ><< When it comes to Warp (Spelljamming) speed, tthey work the same. we can say that Mystaran skyships are to Spelljammers the same thing the old Fokkers were to modern days Tornado or F-15 >> >Do you really think that? A spelljammer has constantly to be powered by the magical energy of spellcaster, a good voidship not unless it is powered by a dynamo of flying. Besides spelljammers are normal ships with this "helm" added to, while Mystaran voidships are magical from the beginning of construction. I think a spelljammer is no match for a good voidship. Yeah, those whimpy groundlings know some good tricks too! I do think Voidships are simply more antiquate for the reasons i stated, but i'll repeat them: - -MSkyships are slower (compare the skyships max speed with Spelljamer's: Jammers can go from a minimum of 240' per round to a maximum of 2400' PER round, depending on the level of the helmsman) - -Mskyships are more expensive and for this reason rarer - -Jammers have an advantage in their helmsman: he can see and perceive everything happening on board and see around him as if he was the ship Maneauvrability is the same for both ships.. For these reasons i think a Spelljammer has the edge over the common Skyship from Mystara. DM *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ End of mystara-digest V1997 #395 ******************************** *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara' as the body of the message. Date: Mon, 8 Jun 1998 12:12:33 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: phaser.Showcase.MPGN.COM: majordom set sender to owner-mystara-l@ using -f From: (mystara-digest) To: mystara-digest@Phaser.ShowCase.MPGN.COM Subject: mystara-digest V1997 #396 Reply-To: mystara@mpgn.com X-UIDL: 859efac39ece9a327fc20f48c5b48ddb mystara-digest Monday, June 8 1998 Volume 1997 : Number 396 Mystara is a trademark of TSR Inc. All Rights Reserved. The following topics are covered in this digest: Re: [MYSTARA] - Mystara without Ethengar? Re: [MYSTARA] - Hule Maps Re: [MYSTARA] - Jenni's Monumental Memo of Mystara Re: [MYSTARA] - [Mystara] Re: Almanac Re: [MYSTARA] - [Mystara] Re: Almanac Re: [MYSTARA] - CoM, WotI Re: [MYSTARA] - Spelljammer and Mystara (was: Why Mystara?) Re: [MYSTARA] - The NoS and Entropy Re: [MYSTARA] - Mystara without Ethengar? Re: [MYSTARA] - Hule Maps [MYSTARA] - Gazetteer Re: [MYSTARA] - Greetings from Northern Europe Re: [MYSTARA] - [Mystara] Re: Almanac Re: [MYSTARA] - Spelljammer and Mystara (was: Why Mystara?) Re: [MYSTARA] - The NoS and Entropy Re: [MYSTARA] - The NoS and Entropy Re: [MYSTARA] - The NoS and Entropy Re: [MYSTARA] - Greetings from Northern Europe Re: [MYSTARA] - The NoS and Entropy Re: [MYSTARA] - Midland Forest Re: [MYSTARA] - Midland Forest Re: [MYSTARA] - The NoS and Entropy ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Sun, 7 Jun 1998 22:54:20 +0300 From: "Aleksei Andrievski" Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Mystara without Ethengar? >Can anybody explain to me why Glantri has so many fans and supporters while Ethengar is disqualified by all and gets the worse end always? I guess it's because most of us here are very evil people who love intrigue, treachery, and backstabbing :) ****************** Aleksei Andrievski aka Solmyr, Archmage of the Azure Star Visit the Archmage's Tower at http://www.geocities.com/TimesSquare/Fortress/2198/index.html *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 08 Jun 1998 16:25:38 +0200 From: DM Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Hule Maps At 19.38 07/06/98 -0500, you wrote: >Has Hule been mapped anywhere? I've been looking but have only found a small amount of the area in Champions of Mystara and Red Steel sets. The only Hule Map i know of it's in X5: Temple of Death, but... err... it's not so richly detailed and it's B/W... still, it's better than nothing... :) DM *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 8 Jun 1998 10:43:47 -0400 (EDT) From: Mischa E Gelman Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Jenni's Monumental Memo of Mystara On Sun, 7 Jun 1998, [iso-8859-1] Håvard Rųnne Faanes wrote: >I agree that cultivatin the differences is what we must do. Even if this means changing Mystara slightly. One thing that Makes Mystara unique in my opinion is that the Known World has quite a few _interesting_ cultures. The countries are not standard fantasy countries like we find in Krynn, on the Sword Coast of FR (Moo), and probably in Greyhawk. We have byzantine style Empires, Italian Renessance Magocracies, Norse Barbarians, and native american style tribes. I think that developing these traits could be what is needed to make Mystara different. No more thyatians called "Dexter the Warrior", No more Darokinians with Longswords, no more Northern Reaches Warriors with longswords, and so on. Make sure that every NPC has a name and uses weapons that are appropriate in his/her culture. This is what the Hollow World tried to do, with the cultural weapons rules and things of that sort. I don't know much about Greek culture, but the Milenian HWR seems pretty well-done and a good attempt at fitting that cutlure into a fantasy setting. As for the variety of RW-type cultures, most TSR settings have this, but not on the scale of Mystara. It is definitely one of the world's selling points! Slightly off-topic:I'm researching Scythians and Sarmatians now (Pitt has almost no books on anything except their art) for an attempt at a Jennite HWR. If anyone wishes to help out or point out sources of info on these horsemen (and women) I certainly wouldn't mind that help. >>You mean a boxed set with an outline of the Known World-Bellissarian-Savage Coast-Hollow World regions, plus generalities on the planet itself? Sure, this would be useful as an intro to Mystara. Helps people place all these neat settings. Let's not make the mistake of trying to design/fill-out all the other regions, however. I've seen this happen too many times in other settings, and the result were always BAD. Plus it gives us fans more room to work. I've seen on the list several attempts to further look at Hule culture or Wendar or other nations not overloaded with info. Bringing back the GAZes though and updating them (as Jenni I think suggested) would be nice - Mystara did a good job of going in-depth on many areas. >The problem with such a product is that it probably will lack a focus. I think the product should include some info in the planet as a whole (history and geography etc) something on the Savage coast, and a little on the HW, and a litle on the Known World in General. This should not amount to more than one or two chapters though. The rest of the product should be devoted to one specific area. I think Thyatis would be a nice place to set it. Provide details of the average Thyatians life. What is it like to grow up in thyatis, among nobles, farmers, poor people and Gladiators. What is the life of a soldier like? Doing some extensive research on Byzantium and other cultures you want to borrow from is a good idea. One good thing about focusing on Thyatis is that Roman and Byzantine culture has been written about ALOT. I just found a book strictly focusing on Byzantine social welfare institutions! I'm glad in a way that Alphatia isn't in the KW anymore to share the glory with Thyatis - to many outsiders it would seem a typical ho-hum high-fantasy culture. Perhaps Mystara should be sold as a relatively low-fantasy,more realistic setting (excluding the distinctive regions like Glantri which could be made to stand out more)? Overall, very nice ideas - a brief summary of the world, and major focus on the major nation. >Then Provide ideas for adventures and campaigns. Do not make the mistake of marketing Mystara as the best place to set your dungeons in. Dungeons can be set anywhere. Focus on campaigns like "Life in the Imperial Legion", "High Society in Thyatis", "Mercheants of Biazzan" etc. Good idea! Most of the modules, even good ones like X3, missed opportunities to expand the world. The best ones of course, like B10 and CM1 (and I've heard alot of praise for X2,X4 and X5 which I don't have) have focused on one region of the world and tried to expand the setting better. >Finally: Art. This is very Important. TSR owns a lot of great art, but All Mystara art should be designed especially for Mystara. Every pricture or illustration must show exactly what Mystaran people look like. Any standard fantasy art should be thrown away. One should be able to look at a picture and see which country this picture is from by looking at the people and buildings and landscape. In the example of Thyatis, show Legions, gladiators, senators, commoners in Byzantain clothes, not "adventurers gear". And for gosh sakes make people the proper skin color. TSR has this nasty habit of making everyone white. The only exception I can think of off the top of my head is the HW boxed set where the Nithian queen has a reasonable skin tone. For really funny examples of bad TSR art, check out Maquesta Kar-Thon and the first two books of Defenders of Magic in the DL series. All three portray black chars as being white on the cover. It doesn't hurt to reach out to minorities by showing RPGs isn't just a white folks' game (though I have only met one black role-player ever and they are probably less into RPGs at the moment than us whites, attempts should be made to include anyone who might buy the product) >However, religion is a part of peoples every day life, so extensive descriptions of immortals and churches should be included. Agreed! And in the nations where it is not a big deal (Glantri,Alphatia come to mind) explain why. >Pierre Savoie (spl?) posted the FAQ from the L5R Card Game Mailing list. It said that WOTI owns everything posted on that list. Did not sound friendly at all to me :( Nope. Just a little hand to the fans would not hurt IMO. I don't think most of us would mind if TSR used our stuff to revitalize the setting as long as they acknowledged the creators. >BTW: are anyone saving these messages? I think all the digests are in an archive somewhere. They checked my head and found I had a brain. That was real encouraging - Lions quarterback Steve Mitchell, on tests run after a game in which he suffered from dizziness *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 08 Jun 1998 16:44:45 CEST From: "Herve Musseau" Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - [Mystara] Re: Almanac From: =?iso-8859-1?Q?H=E5vard_R=F8nne_Faanes?= AAAlso, what did people think about the theory on the sphere of Principiu= >m >>that I introduced in the post #5 about Gareth? (hint) >I think it is interesting. Wouldn't that make him a hierarch? I mean ever= >y >Sphere must have a Hierarch... Well, just like you aren't born a 36th level hero, you aren't born a Hierarch. You have to earn it... So I'd say no. However, you probably meant that every sphere must have someone who is reigning on it (and it happens that it always is a Hierarch too), but since there is no Hierarch yet in that new sphere that would make him the sole representative of the sphere and thus the reigning one... Strange situation, for sure, but normal for the creation of a new sphere... There was probably the same problem when Khoronus discovered the sphere of Time by accident... ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 08 Jun 1998 16:49:42 CEST From: "Herve Musseau" Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - [Mystara] Re: Almanac From: "paul dooley" MMore details on this please for us newbies! <;-P >>>Also, what did people think about the theory on the sphere of PPrincipium that I introduced in the post #5 about Gareth? Well, since it refers to a series of posts from the past few weeks, I didn't think I would lose anyone here.. Oh well, there are always newbies, so even a post from 5 minutes ago may be unknown to them ;) So, I'm doing a series of posts about who Gareth may be, detailing the various possibilities. So far, there are 5 such posts, with more to come (I know, didn't make one for quite some time :( I won't repost such recent stuff, so if you're interested you should check Shawn's page where the articles are collected. _____________________________________________________________ Herve Musseau Homepage: http://www.geocities.com/TimesSquare/Lair/8932/ Almanac page: http://www.geocities.com/TimesSquare/Lair/9037/ ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 08 Jun 1998 16:51:04 +0200 From: DM Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - CoM, WotI At 22.39 07/06/98 +0000, Mike Wrote wrote: WWhat information is covered in Champions of Mystara and Wrath of the Immortals? Specifically: >Does Champions of Mystara have all the Princess Ark material? Or is it the expedition to the Hollow World? It comes with three books: Book 1: Princess Ark's log, full of articles detailing all the PA voyages AFTER the completion of the Thothian Enchantment (from Sind exploration to Jibarł), with stats covering the PA crew, the PA map, new monsters and the thothian Enchantment itself Book 2: The Explorer's Manual, details Sind, Yavdlom and Karimari land (three gaz in one book, mainly) Book 3: Skyships and Worldbuilder, details the rules for creating your own skyship and rules for creating a world. It also comprises: maps of the Serpent Peninsula and the Great Waste; maps of the Princess Ark; cardboards with pictures of some skyships and their map (a la Spelljammer) >Does Wrath of the Immortals have generally-useful information about Mystara? I am not especially interested in the immortals themselves or events connected with them (and would in fact probably junk them in favor of my own religious system) but the set may contain other useful information... It has a small section at the end with info on Mystaran artifacts and their creation by the DM and the description of the Multiverse. DM *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 08 Jun 1998 16:57:46 +0200 From: DM Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Spelljammer and Mystara (was: Why Mystara?) At 00.45 08/06/98 -0700, Jesse wrote: >Well, if a Voidship had both- then they could go faster with the helm- and do just fine when they couldn't use the arcane abilities. Right ? Not trying to push circumstances- just curious. As i said, yes, it could, but the ship's magician or engineer would have a hell time trying to insert the helm inside the ship to make it function in the same magic wavelength the ship exploits. The energy fields generatedby an helm and the magical hull are in fact a bit different, so he should try to adjust the helm with some maintenance work to tune it to the ship's magical field (technicalities ;)). DM *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 08 Jun 1998 08:16:48 PDT From: "paul dooley" Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - The NoS and Entropy >At 04.22 06/06/98 PDT, you wrote: >>By the way where does it say anything about NoS allowing new Entropic immortals? I`ve no recollection of such. >About one year ago there was a similar discussion on the list that saw also >the contribution of Bruce Heard, who explained some obscure points about NoS >and Entropy. I've put it on my site at this URL: Thanks ive got a copy, now all I need is time to read it <;-P ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 08 Jun 1998 08:22:06 PDT From: "paul dooley" Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Mystara without Ethengar? >>Can anybody explain to me why Glantri has so many fans and supporters while Ethengar is disqualified by all and gets the worse end always? >I guess it's because most of us here are very evil people who love intrigue, >treachery, and backstabbing :) Date: Mon, 8 Jun 1998 12:12:33 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: phaser.Showcase.MPGN.COM: majordom set sender to owner-mystara-l@ using -f From: (mystara-digest) To: mystara-digest@Phaser.ShowCase.MPGN.COM Subject: mystara-digest V1997 #396 Reply-To: mystara@mpgn.com X-UIDL: 859efac39ece9a327fc20f48c5b48ddb AW, I wanted to say that! Who wants to be a short, smelly,bowlegged, grunt who doesn`t even own the shirt offof his back (unless your a Kahn), when you can plot to rule the world with your mastery of magic NYEH NYEH NYEH <;-P ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 08 Jun 1998 11:24:30 -0400 From: Daly Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Hule Maps At 10:56 PM 6/7/98 -0500, Galwylin wrote: DDaly wrote: >>Well of course there is the map in Temple of Death... >I suppose that is X5, the module I'm missing ;/ Oh no! You HAVE to get ahold of it! It is an excellent module! Perhaps the Nomad series will be one of the ones revived... *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 8 Jun 1998 16:25:57 +0100 From: elrond@post.olivant.fo (Jakup Michaelsen) Subject: [MYSTARA] - Gazetteer Hi. I just got an update from http://www.titan-games.com/ - they have Gaz 1-13. Jakup *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 8 Jun 1998 16:22:03 +0100 From: elrond@post.olivant.fo (Jakup Michaelsen) Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Greetings from Northern Europe Greets. >Well, Jakup, to tell the truth Mystara is the name of the original D&D setting (the map you find in Expert set -the blue boxed set). I haven't understood WHICH D&D set you own (is the 3rd edition boxes or the Rules Cyclopaedia? or AD&D?), I have the 3rd ed. of Basic D&D from '79. >but these are the books you should have to start a Mystara campaign: >-Poor Wizard's Almanac 1-2-3 (provide info on ALL the nations of Mystara, their armies and the most important NPCs with stats and histories; provide >also Timeline of events from AC1010 to AC1012) -Rules Cyclopaedia OR D&D boxed sets from Basic to Master (core rules) -Wrath of the Immortals boxed set OR Immortal boxed set (rules regarding Immortals; with WotI you also get a world shaking adventure and fine maps of >Mystara) Sounds cool. I'll start with the D&D boxed sets. It will probably take a l o n g time to collect all that material - and a lot of money. >This is the core: if you can spend more and are able to find older supplements,also look for: >-Hollow World boxed set (describes lost civilizations who live INSIDE Mystara) >-All Gazetteers (detail each of the major nations of the Known World) -Champions of Mystara (rules for flying ships and other neat maps + info on >new areas of Mystara -you can find this in PWA too) -Thyatis & Alphatia boxed set (info on these two empires) -Red Steel OR Savage Coast book (info on the Savage Coast of Mystara: it's >for AD&D but i see no big problems converting it into D&D rules) Yeah I'd really like to get thos Gazetteers. >You can also download for free some Mystara and Red Steel/Savage Coast supplements from TSR site (www.tsrinc.com) Where exactly? - I tried to look around there but couldn't find any. >And for other information, check out my site (UPDATED for this month!) - -see >my signature at the end of the letter. Will do. >AVOID these products: >Player's and Dungeon Master's Survival Kit Glantri: Kingdom of Magic (if you already own GAZ3: Principalities of Glantri) >Karameikos: Kingdom of Adventure (if you already own GAZ1: Grand Duchy of Karameikos) >Hope to have satisfied your curiosity! :) Yes thanks. Jakup *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 08 Jun 1998 08:29:46 PDT From: "paul dooley" Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - [Mystara] Re: Almanac >There was probably the same problem when Khoronus discovered the sphere of Time by accident.. Pardon? what about Protius, he wass around for milennia before Khronus. see WotI bk1 for details. Also there are many other Immortals not mentioned cos they have no interest in Mystra one of them was probably once reigning heirarch. Alternately there may be areigning heirarch for each area of interest, they all get togeter once an eon or so for a convention where the play games like PA`s&Accountants etc. <;-P ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 08 Jun 1998 11:31:55 -0400 From: Daly Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Spelljammer and Mystara (was: Why Mystara?) At 03:51 AM 6/8/98 -0500, Galwylin wrote: RRob wrote: >>But I like the idea of Voidships. Means that Mystara is different - and not >>at the mercy of the Arcane for their spelljamming technology. That sets Mystara apart - Alphatia could be trading rivals with the Arcane... >The Arcane motives are mysterious but they have a nice racket going with being the only ones offering a method of space travel. I don't think Alphatia is a viable rival to the Arcane though. One reason being their sinking and another that they're not aware that their space maybe in a crystal sphere that is possible to leave. Of course, that shouldn't last long once Mystarans start encountering others from different worlds. How do they not know? I mean, how do you know they don't know? They spent some time wandering and they come from an extremely well developed (though not in game terms) civilization that has no doubt had experience dealing with all kinds of secrets and powers beyond the ken of normal mortals. Especially given the special means of travel in M1 Into the Maelstrom. Their is a gate that consists of a fog which will take a traveller anywhere. Can't you just imagine the Alphatian airships using this gate to ply their trade with other worlds? In fact, maybe they DON'T know about the crystal spheres because they have never needed to know... *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 08 Jun 1998 08:49:09 PDT From: "paul dooley" Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - The NoS and Entropy >>Isn`t it enough that they now have Rafiels reactor due to the changing=20 >>face of Aengmor/Alfheim >I'm not sure if I understand this question. Rafiel's Chamber of the Stars >has nothing to do with the changing of Alfheim or Entropy as far as I know..? I was refering to the fact that with Atzanteotl having regaine control of Shadowelves and temple of Rafiel being resetup in resurgent Alfheim that entropics now have two NoS. A qwikfix would be that reactor doesnt drain but old NoS will allow access to any of the upper? spheres classes other than mages would get portents etc of a ritual to activate NoS power. This would give entropics one to themselves and the upper 4 would have to share ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 08 Jun 1998 08:56:26 PDT From: "paul dooley" Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - The NoS and Entropy >Oi! This is worst than trying to figure out time travel and its affects! So the drain on Entropy is really not a drain but an addition of power? I`m sorry I totally disagree with this any drain is a diminishment we`re talking about absolute values here. The fact that its negative energy is irrelevant its the ammount that is being reduced the big pile of neg energy gets smaller a net loss! ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 08 Jun 1998 08:58:24 PDT From: "paul dooley" Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - The NoS and Entropy >I suppose if you consider Entropy to be a negative force, subtracting from >that force is going to give - a bigger negative! >Cheerz >ROB WRONG!!! ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 08 Jun 1998 18:02:42 +0200 From: DM Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Greetings from Northern Europe At 16.22 08/06/98 +0100, Jakup wrote: >I have the 3rd ed. of Basic D&D from '79. Okay then, with Basic set you won't get much: you MUST buy Expert immediately ;), and then Companion and Master (don't bother about Immortal rules now). OR, still better: buy Rules Cyclopaedia, for it has all info of Expert and Companion set, plus some things new and corrected, some rules from Master set and precious entries and maps driven from the Gazetteers detailing the Known World!! And then of course, you should get the Rules Cyclopaedia Errata Corrige to fix some errata it has (easy to do: the article's on my site ;)). Try this URL for the RC Errata: http://www.geocities.com/TimesSquare/Dungeon/2967/rcerrata.html >Sounds cool. I'll start with the D&D boxed sets. It will probably take a l o n g time to collect all that material - and a lot of money. I KNOW! I have more than $700 of D&D material at home, without counting Ravenloft and Spelljammer... >>You can also download for free some Mystara and Red Steel/Savage Coast supplements from TSR site (www.tsrinc.com) >Where exactly? - I tried to look around there but couldn't find any. Okay, either try: ftp.mpgn.com/Gaming/ADND/Worlds/ then choose Mystara and Savage Coast OR TSR site: http://www.tsrinc.com/games/adnd/mystara/index.html AND http://www.tsrinc.com/games/adnd/savagecoast/index.html Also try out this URL for old Dragon Magazine Issues: http://www.tsrinc.com/periodicals/dragon/dragon.html And for Dungeon adventures: http://www.tsrinc.com/periodicals/dungeon/dungeon.html DM Visit My Mystara Homepage at: http://www.geocities.com/TimesSquare/Dungeon/2967 Updated every month! *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 08 Jun 1998 09:04:14 PDT From: "paul dooley" Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - The NoS and Entropy >><< Ofcourse Draining from Entropy only strengthens Entropy. Strange, bu= >t >>thats the way it is.. >> >>Could you elaborate on this point? >I think Rob explained it pretty clearly when he said that it was like adding a negative value to another negative one.=20 >Draining is the nature of Entropy. Of this reason Entropy will develope a >sort of immunity to the draining effects of the radience, and eventually >the Nucleus of the Spheres will help strenghten Entropy. (Providing more >Immortals etc..) >PS: Bruce, if I got this wrong feel free to correct me, this was your ide= >a >in the first place, right? :) >H=E5vard Is it just me? Do I just not get it? This must all have come about by the cofusion of metaphysical constructs, the spheres, with physical constructs, the planes, but that is just another philisophical excuseanyway! It`s the AMMOUNT of power that is being reduced so whether its positive power or negativ power is totally irrelevant, it gets SMALLER! <;-P ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 08 Jun 1998 09:06:22 PDT From: "paul dooley" Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Midland Forest >There is a considerable difference between a Forester and a Ranger. A Forester is basically a Fighter/Mage who is able to cast spells from the time he starts play Also she can wear any armour and still cast spells and has some of the special abilities of OD&D Elves! <;-P ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 08 Jun 1998 09:09:38 PDT From: "paul dooley" Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Midland Forest >The Midland forest is HUGE. I seriously doubt that Hule has claimed the entire forest. I dont have any maps here, so the Dark Wood may very well, >be part of the Midland forest. IIRC there was an errata note in an issue of dragon on this matter in Bruces`s column maybe someon can id the issue? <;-P ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 08 Jun 1998 09:12:06 PDT From: "paul dooley" Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - The NoS and Entropy ><< I suppose if you consider Entropy to be a negative force, subtracting from >that force is going to give - a bigger negative! >> >I'd consider a bigger negative to occur if more Entropy was added. a negative >plus a negative equals a larger negative. However, i beleive the nucleus of >spheres isn't like adding a negative. It's a draining effect instead. You have >X amount of Entropy, and after some is drained, the X amount isn't as much as >it was before the drain. For a more clear example, if you took an apple out of >a basket of apples there is a less total amount. >-Inconu Did any of you lot learn any maths? I keep saying its the scalar size thats important not the vector sign!! <;-P ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ End of mystara-digest V1997 #396 ******************************** *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara' as the body of the message. Date: Mon, 8 Jun 1998 14:26:37 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: phaser.Showcase.MPGN.COM: majordom set sender to owner-mystara-l@ using -f From: (mystara-digest) To: mystara-digest@Phaser.ShowCase.MPGN.COM Subject: mystara-digest V1997 #397 Reply-To: mystara@mpgn.com X-UIDL: 00dff179a2de4c547c43935022fc1f1f mystara-digest Monday, June 8 1998 Volume 1997 : Number 397 Mystara is a trademark of TSR Inc. All Rights Reserved. The following topics are covered in this digest: Re: [MYSTARA] - The NoS and Entropy Re: [MYSTARA] - The NoS and Entropy Re: [MYSTARA] - The NoS and Entropy Re: [MYSTARA] - Re: Greetins from Northern Europe Re: [MYSTARA] - Almanac/Glantri Re: [MYSTARA] - The NoS and Entropy Re: [MYSTARA] - The NoS and Entropy Re: [MYSTARA] - Re: Immortals Re: [MYSTARA] - The NoS and Entropy Re: [MYSTARA] - The NoS and Entropy Re: [MYSTARA] - The NoS and Entropy Re: [MYSTARA] - The NoS and Entropy Re: [MYSTARA] - MYSTARA - Immortals Re: [MYSTARA] - Sylvan Realm [MYSTARA] - Re: MYSTARA theNos and Entropy Re: [MYSTARA] - Greetings from Northern Europe Re: [MYSTARA] - MYSTARA - Immortals Re: [MYSTARA] - The NoS and Entropy Re: [MYSTARA] - Spelljammer and Mystara (was: Why Mystara?) Re: [MYSTARA] - Celts on Mystara Re: [MYSTARA] - Mystara without Ethengar? Re: [MYSTARA] - Star Wars on Mystara? Re: [MYSTARA] - Mystara without Ethengar? Re: [MYSTARA] - Mystara without Ethengar? Re: [MYSTARA] - [Mystara] Re: Almanac Re: [MYSTARA] - The NoS and Entropy Re: [MYSTARA] - Spelljammer and Mystara (was: Why Mystara?) Re: [MYSTARA] - The NoS and Entropy Re: [MYSTARA] - The NoS and Entropy ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Mon, 08 Jun 1998 18:14:28 +0200 From: DM Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - The NoS and Entropy At 08.49 08/06/98 PDT, Paul wrote: >I was refering to the fact that with Atzanteotl having regaine control of Shadowelves and temple of Rafiel being resetup in resurgent Alfheim that entropics now have two NoS. Sorry to contradict you here, but Atzy is in control of the Schattenalfen only, and the Shadowelves he really controls inhabit Aengmor/Oenkmar (there are others, i know, but they are not influent for my point). So Atzy doesn't control the Chamber of the Spheres nor City of Stars, and if you read last almanac well it's clearly stated on the 28 of Kaldmont that his troops loose against the SE due to the fact that their shamans are able to cast spells thanks to the CotS. So we have the NoS draining energy from Entropy but AIDING Entropy as much as it aided Energy and now CotS working for Energy which re-balances the forces on Mystara. DM Visit My Mystara Homepage at: http://www.geocities.com/TimesSquare/Dungeon/2967 Updated every month! *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 08 Jun 1998 18:18:52 +0200 From: DM Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - The NoS and Entropy At 08.58 08/06/98 PDT, Paul wrote: Rob wrote: >>I suppose if you consider Entropy to be a negative force, subtracting ffrom >>that force is going to give - a bigger negative! >WRONG!!! Actually, theoretically speaking he's right. Example: - -6 - 3 = -9 Normally, -6 is bigger than -9 (being closer to 0), BUT if we assume Entropy is negative energy and it functions the opposite way of normal energy, then "the further from the zero it goes, the bigger it becomes". Don't think using plain maths terms here.. DM *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 8 Jun 1998 18:19:24 +0200 (MET DST) From: =?iso-8859-1?Q?H=E5vard_R=F8nne_Faanes?= Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - The NoS and Entropy On Mon, 8 Jun 1998, paul dooley wrote: >>>Isn`t it enough that they now have Rafiels reactor due to the cchanging=20 >>>face of Aengmor/Alfheim >>I'm not sure if I understand this question. Rafiel's Chamber of the SStars >>has nothing to do with the changing of Alfheim or Entropy as far as I know..? >I was refering to the fact that with Atzanteotl having regaine control of Shadowelves and temple of Rafiel being resetup in resurgent Alfheim that entropics now have two NoS. A qwikfix would be that reactor doesnt drain but old NoS will allow access to any of the upper? spheres classes other than mages would get portents etc of a ritual to activate NoS power. This would give entropics one to themselves and the upper 4 would have to share I didn't know Atzanteotl was in control of the Chamber of the Stars. Maybe I should reread the latest almanacs.(?) Anyway, CoS is still connected with the Sphere of Energy, even if controlled by followers of Entropic Immortals. NoS OTOH is connected with Entropy though controlled by followers of Energy. (Well, the Glantrians do not really follow anyone) Håvard *** Haavard R. Faanes (hoc@nvg.ntnu.no) http://www.nvg.ntnu.no/~hoc "Every turkey dies. Not all turkeys truly live." -Chef, South Park *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 08 Jun 1998 09:25:57 PDT From: "paul dooley" Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Re: Greetins from Northern Europe Hi Jakup, the Gents seem to have left out PC1-4 in thieir reccomendations. PC1 Tall Tales of the Wee Folk deals with faerie folk and forest races such as dryads treants etc PC2 Top Ballista deals with the flying city of Serraine and its inhabitants of gnomes harpies gremlins etc is COOL you can fly magic biplanes etc PC3 Sea Peoples with seagiants tritons merrow etc PC4 Night Howlers is all about lycanthropes and their country in Glantri and is a HOOT (its so good I lent it out and never got it back!!) Hope you enjoy the hobby and get to buy some of the good stuff, but remember that the best games are usually DM`s own imagination cos whilst they too can buy the books they cant read your mind (YET!!) <;-P ttfn, Paul ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 08 Jun 1998 09:33:07 PDT From: "paul dooley" Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Almanac/Glantri >>Isnt Jagger still owed a favour from stepping down as dragon ruler time >>to cash it in ? >Okay -- how could any dragon help him? >*************************************************************************** What I`m refering to is the fact that in Gaz3 Jagger had become the Star Dragon but stepped down when he realised what he had done! This is all irrelevant due to Diamonds writeup in WotI, but wouldn`t a Lawful creatur like the Great One sort of pay off an old debt? Jagger didn`t break any rules according to gaz3 but when he realised the cost to dragonkind he stepped down a verh lawful (OD&D) thing to do. Doing the right thing is sometimes rewarded just so it happens again! ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 08 Jun 1998 09:14:24 PDT From: "paul dooley" Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - The NoS and Entropy >Oh, I thought this was your idea Harvard..... Okay, well I would aprreciate it >if the original poster could explain this idea. It sounds good, but i still >haven't grasped it yet. >-Inconu Apparently me too but the I`ve only got a PhD in theoretical math! <;-P ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 8 Jun 1998 18:13:55 +0200 (MET DST) From: =?iso-8859-1?Q?H=E5vard_R=F8nne_Faanes?= Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - The NoS and Entropy On Mon, 8 Jun 1998, paul dooley wrote: >I`m sorry I totally disagree with this any drain is a diminishment we`re talking about absolute values here. The fact that its negative energy is irrelevant its the ammount that is being reduced the big pile of neg energy gets smaller a net loss! It is not a drain of negative energy, but of Entropy. Entropy is not an element, but an esotheric force. I don't think it is as simple as you make it. Anyway, I think I've only caused confusion with my posts on this. Check the article on DM's site, it will probably make things clearer. I'm not syaing you have to accept that, but at least you'll know what I was trying to say. Håvard *** Haavard R. Faanes (hoc@nvg.ntnu.no) http://www.nvg.ntnu.no/~hoc "Every turkey dies. Not all turkeys truly live." -Chef, South Park *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 08 Jun 1998 09:41:07 PDT From: "paul dooley" Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Re: Immortals >>What punishment did Alphaks recieve for his rockthrowing? >Was he ever caught, or was he just suspected? I think that this would have been thoroughly checked into by Rad at least, and maybe Asterius he`s a major patron of darokin >"The emperor has displeased the Immortals, so none will let him be healed." Nah! This is Thyatis we`re talking about everyones got an angle! Koryis would probably love to show that following the bloodthirst bitch was a bad idea. IMC it`s come out and all hell has broken loose!! <;-P ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 08 Jun 1998 09:45:05 PDT From: "paul dooley" Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - The NoS and Entropy >>By the way -- does anyone have any theories as to who could have been reporting events from the Hollow World in the PWAs? What about one of the fair folk? what with the reopening of the Alfheim access they have openings to both in & out IIRC its in AZcan empire ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 08 Jun 1998 09:52:24 PDT From: "paul dooley" Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - The NoS and Entropy So Atzy >doesn't control the Chamber of the Spheres nor City of Stars, and if you >read last almanac well it's clearly stated on the 28 of Kaldmont that his >troops loose against the SE due to the fact that their shamans are able to >cast spells thanks to the CotS. So we have the NoS draining energy from Entropy but AIDING Entropy as much as it aided Energy and now CotS working >for Energy which re-balances the forces on Mystara. >DM Thanks as I`ve already said I have more to read than tome to do so, my skimming is just not thoroughenough gonna have to take gleaning lessons <;-P ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 08 Jun 1998 12:58:24 -0400 From: Daly Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - The NoS and Entropy At 09:12 AM 6/8/98 PDT, paul dooley wrote: >><< I suppose if you consider Entropy to be a negative force, ssubtracting from >>that force is going to give - a bigger negative! >> >>I'd consider a bigger negative to occur if more Entropy was added. a nnegative >>plus a negative equals a larger negative. However, i beleive the nnucleus of >>spheres isn't like adding a negative. It's a draining effect instead. -Inconu >Did any of you lot learn any maths? I keep saying its the scalar size thats important not the vector sign!! <;-P Of course we learned math, silly! But as for the terms you used, I did not realize we were discussing dragons (scalar...?) or voidship navigational plotting (vector..?) In any case. Let's translate this discussion to English: The destruction, or depletion, of Entropy is still destruction or depletion. Entropy is interested in these things. Make of it what you will... *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 08 Jun 1998 10:07:58 PDT From: "paul dooley" Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - The NoS and Entropy >It is not a drain of negative energy, but of Entropy. Entropy is not an element, but an esotheric force. I don't think it is as simple as you mak= >e >it. Anyway, I think I've only caused confusion with my posts on this. Check the article on DM's site, it will probably make things clearer. I'm >not syaing you have to accept that, but at least you'll know what I was trying to say. Its not that I disagree with the idea, but I`d like to Know more of the thinking behind it. I`m not being a pain am I? I`m the only Mystara DM I know so I`m used to getting my own way with rules interpretations, and anyway the discussion itself is what I`m interested in! <;-p ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 8 Jun 1998 17:57:54 +0300 From: "Aleksei Andrievski" Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - MYSTARA - Immortals >That depends on how he feels about Harald. In my own campaign he refused to accept any charge -- he let Harald keep his post and let a new Chamberlain be elected without a qualm. I think Etienne and Harald respect each other, both being 'research-minded' and users of the Radiance. And Etienne doesn't really need the post all that much; I don't think anybody would dare try to deny him access to all the School's resources. ****************** Aleksei Andrievski aka Solmyr, Archmage of the Azure Star Visit the Archmage's Tower at http://www.geocities.com/TimesSquare/Fortress/2198/index.html Date: Mon, 8 Jun 1998 14:26:37 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: phaser.Showcase.MPGN.COM: majordom set sender to owner-mystara-l@ using -f From: (mystara-digest) To: mystara-digest@Phaser.ShowCase.MPGN.COM Subject: mystara-digest V1997 #397 Reply-To: mystara@mpgn.com X-UIDL: 00dff179a2de4c547c43935022fc1f1f *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 8 Jun 1998 13:25:57 -0400 (EDT) From: SteelAngel Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Sylvan Realm On Fri, 5 Jun 1998, Geoff Gander wrote: >This is correct. I was reading through AC11 last night for my own nefarious purposes (which will become clear next year MWAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!!!), and, indeed, he is in Karameikos, by all appearances. Dragonflies of Doom on the savage coast? Or are those 2 relatively insane brothers on a rampage to clean all the dungeons without leaving foorprints? Brick Mac meets the shadow elves? But then again, that Gargantoid had already been mentioned in PWA III. Max IV - Fount of Useless Knowledge anyone? *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 08 Jun 1998 10:34:51 PDT From: "paul dooley" Subject: [MYSTARA] - Re: MYSTARA theNos and Entropy >>><< I suppose if you consider Entropy to be a negative force, sssubtracting from >>>that force is going to give - a bigger negative! >> >>>I'd consider a bigger negative to occur if more Entropy was added. a nnnegative >>>plus a negative equals a larger negative. However, i beleive the nnnucleus of >>>spheres isn't like adding a negative. It's a draining effect instead. YYYou have >>>X amount of Entropy, and after some is drained, the X amount isn't as mmmuch as >>>it was before the drain. For a more clear example, if you took an aapple >>out of >>>a basket of apples there is a less total amount. >>>-Inconu >>Did any of you lot learn any maths? I keep saying its the scalar size thats important not the vector sign!! <;-P >This got posted somehow without the line `At last a light at the end of the tunnel, someone else who can count!!`. This undeserving worm humbly seeks to appologise to the great `Inconu` for the slur that he unwittingly brought upon you. <;-P P.S. Has the list crashed again this is edited from a no send message ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 8 Jun 1998 13:36:45 -0400 (EDT) From: SteelAngel Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Greetings from Northern Europe On Sat, 6 Jun 1998, Dan Groves wrote: >Things to buy, I've seen mention of the _Principalities of Glantri_, _Elves of Alfheim_, If ANYONE would sell these, that'd be the day. I have been looking for these 2 gaz's since they came out, and have only seen Glantri once (in the collection of a friend of mine, who refused to sell) Bah. Those are the 2 that I need to complete the collection. (Unless Hule, Heldann and Wendar come out mysteriously ;) I'd pay twice the list price for those 2 in V.G. - Mint condition.. Max IV - Random ranting. *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 08 Jun 1998 10:41:12 PDT From: "paul dooley" Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - MYSTARA - Immortals >I think Etienne and Harald respect each other, both being 'research-minded' >and users of the Radiance. And Etienne doesn't really need the post all that >much; I don't think anybody would dare try to deny him access to all the >School's resources. AH but what about the loss of political power inherant in this? Politics as much as magic is the lifeblood of Glantri just look at the infighting going on over what happened to Jagger! If Ettienne is back he needs to have his powerbase to stave off the rise of entropy in Glantri <;-P ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 8 Jun 1998 13:45:36 -0400 (EDT) From: SteelAngel Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - The NoS and Entropy On Sat, 6 Jun 1998, Galwylin wrote: >magic away from Mystara. What if the worldshield is tied to the Immortals' power in some way? Immortals don't just come from Mystara, Contrary to popular opinion. Heck, even the Federation may have some immortals. The fact that Mystara is so prominent is that there is an Old one artifact (The NoS) buried in the planet itself. The NoS is the power, the Worldshield just creates the gravity of the planet, and a latent magical ability for some people/races. It was the NoS that permeated Mystara with magic because of high energy E-M background fields. On this point, I wonder if a Mystaran on another planet in the Prime gives off enough electromagnetic background radiation to screw up compasses. Max IV - Mystarans are Magnets? *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 8 Jun 1998 13:58:04 -0400 (EDT) From: SteelAngel Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Spelljammer and Mystara (was: Why Mystara?) On Mon, 8 Jun 1998, DM wrote: >For these reasons i think a Spelljammer has the edge over the common Skyship from Mystara. No problems with that. BUT one question remains: Skyships are not really designed to go beyond the skyshield. And the pages in CoM on Voidships are rather indistinct on what they can actually do. Maybe Voidships are the same as Spelljammers without the helm? Or maybe Voidships were meant to be a link between SJ and Mystara.. Max IV - -- ("`_/")_.-'"``-._ E.A.Deneault "Sanity is the . . )`-._ )-,;-,_`) PH/MU '99 playground of the (v_,)' _ )`-.\ ``-' eand@wpi.edu unimaginative" _.- _..-_/ / ((.' http://homebase.res.wpi.net ((,.-' ((,/ -Simba *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 8 Jun 1998 13:58:10 EDT From: LandoTW@aol.com Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Celts on Mystara In a message dated 98-06-06 11:12:14 EDT, you write: << << You've also got Scottish/Celtic-type place names in the Grand Duchy of Westrourke on the IoD. I think you were wrong, Geoff, as there were Celtic names in the County of Redstone. >> For other "Celtic" type stuff....try the Kingdom of Robrenn on the Savage Coast *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 8 Jun 1998 13:58:50 EDT From: JamugaKhan@aol.com Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Mystara without Ethengar? << Just a curiosity for those familiar with it. How well does the module fit in with the information presented in the Gazetteer ? >> Not too well as Rhoona isn't even noticed in the GAZ. OTOH I want to keep the Xanathon as the title of the high priest in Rhoona. Jamuga Khan "Hear and obey, because the Mighty Khan's word is law." *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 8 Jun 1998 14:06:11 EDT From: DuncanTKD@aol.com Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Star Wars on Mystara? Should it not be more like Dolores becomming the Emperor. *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 8 Jun 1998 13:58:52 EDT From: JamugaKhan@aol.com Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Mystara without Ethengar? << I guess it's because most of us here are very evil people who love intrigue, treachery, and backstabbing :) >> That is has to be. :-( Ethenor, personal advisor of the Great Khan "I'm sorry, the Mighty Khan left for a few hours of whining in his yurt." *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 8 Jun 1998 13:58:49 EDT From: JamugaKhan@aol.com Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Mystara without Ethengar? << Now now Jamuga! Did I not get into a lengthy debate with our friend Inconu over the ability of Ethengar to overrun Glantri? Sheesh! >> Exceptions confirm the the normal rules. Sorry though. Jamuga Khan "Hear and obey, because the Mighty Khan's word is law." *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 8 Jun 1998 13:58:53 EDT From: JamugaKhan@aol.com Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - [Mystara] Re: Almanac << Pardon? what about Protius, he wass around for milennia before Khronus. see WotI bk1 for details. >> Sorry, Protius was sponsored by Khoronus and THEN sent back into the past to rule over the seven seas (and under the seas too, of course.) Jamuga Khan "Hear and obey, because the Mighty Khan's word is law." *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 8 Jun 1998 14:15:36 -0400 (EDT) From: Shin Chyang Yu Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - The NoS and Entropy Inconu@aol.com pontificated: >Khoronus would have to be in on it, and they would also have to somehow avoid the guardians (Protectors of the Time Realm). Also, a few other Immortals can time travel as well (including Thanatos), so it would be a good adventure for a very high-level campaign I would suppose. Actually, based on the Night Rage series of module, all Immortals can travel through time. - -- John Yu, scy2g@virginia.edu | Chief Combustion Engineer UVa, Material Science Dept. | Advanced Materials Specialist IPM Lab | CEA of LNT Committee (804) 984-3789 | -SEMO International Racing Team *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 8 Jun 1998 13:58:52 EDT From: JamugaKhan@aol.com Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Spelljammer and Mystara (was: Why Mystara?) << -MSkyships are slower (compare the skyships max speed with Spelljamer's: Jammers can go from a minimum of 240' per round to a maximum of 2400' PER round, depending on the level of the helmsman) >> IIRC voidships can go at a speed of 3600' per round, and this is only "impuls speed". Antique? Jamuga Khan "Hear and obey, because the Mighty Khan's word is law." *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 8 Jun 1998 13:39:14 -0400 (EDT) From: SteelAngel Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - The NoS and Entropy On Sat, 6 Jun 1998, Aleksei Andrievski wrote: >appear) will mean that our beloved Glantri never existed, which is why I wouldn't recommend this turn of events for the Almanac... Not just glantri, but Blackmoor would have never existed. The Elves would have never left Evergrun, The Hollow World would have remained undiscovered, and The Immortals' ranks would be much smaller. And that's not even HALF of what would have happened had the Engines not failed on the Beagle. (See my story about this from an earlier post :) Max IV *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 8 Jun 1998 14:23:37 -0400 (EDT) From: Shin Chyang Yu Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - The NoS and Entropy =?iso-8859-1?Q?H=E5vard_R=F8nne_Faanes?= pontificated: >Well, this is from a theory by Bruce. Draining entropy doesn't work since draining is what Entropy is all about. In the short run, the NoS will be = a >blow against entropy, but in the long run, it will actually change and reverse its effect, thus strenghtening Entropy. I dont know if I accept, this, but it seems like most people do. (and since I dont have any better ideas..:) Humm, interesting, this is reverse of what I think was happening. I assumed that the NoS will be increase the influence of Entropy for a short time, but in long run will be hurting Entropy. Similar to what happen to Energy when NoS was draining form it. At first it increase the power of Energy by creating a new way of for Energy Immortals to come to being, and a new type of magic which will get more mortals interested in magic. But in the long run it will destory all magic. The Entropy Immortal knows this long term effect very well, as they are part of team that placed the "curse" on NoS in the first place, which is why Hel suffered a major stroke when NoS starts to drain from Entropy, even thou there are no immediate effects from it. But that is just my theory. - -- John Yu, scy2g@virginia.edu | Chief Combustion Engineer UVa, Material Science Dept. | Advanced Materials Specialist IPM Lab | CEA of LNT Committee (804) 984-3789 | -SEMO International Racing Team *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ End of mystara-digest V1997 #397 ******************************** *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara' as the body of the message. mystara-digest Monday, June 8 1998 Volume 1997 : Number 398 Mystara is a trademark of TSR Inc. All Rights Reserved. The following topics are covered in this digest: Re: [MYSTARA] - Mystara without Ethengar? - nahh, u have to have someone for . Re: [MYSTARA] - Mystara without Ethengar? Re: [MYSTARA] - The NoS and Entropy Re: [MYSTARA] - The NoS and Entropy [MYSTARA] - AntiD&D controversy Re: [MYSTARA] - Spelljammer and Mystara (was: Why Mystara?) [MYSTARA] - (Hominid) Races in D&D? [MYSTARA] - Gazetteers Are Back! Re: [MYSTARA] - Mystara without Ethengar? Re: [MYSTARA] - Hule Maps Re: [MYSTARA] - Midland Forest Re: [MYSTARA] - MYSTARA - Immortals Re: [MYSTARA] - Mystara without Ethengar? Re: [MYSTARA] - Mystara without Ethengar? Re: [MYSTARA] - Midland Forest Re: [MYSTARA] - Midland Forest [MYSTARA] - Look for GAZ 8 Re: [MYSTARA] - AntiD&D controversy Re: [MYSTARA] - Spelljammer and Mystara (was: Why Mystara?) Re: [MYSTARA] - Gazetteers Are Back! Re: [MYSTARA] - Spelljammer and Mystara (was: Why Mystara?) Re: [MYSTARA] - Spelljammer and Mystara (was: Why Mystara?) Re: [MYSTARA] - Spelljammer and Mystara (was: Why Mystara?) Re: [MYSTARA] - Spelljammer and Mystara (was: Why Mystara?) ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Mon, 8 Jun 1998 13:58:48 EDT From: JamugaKhan@aol.com Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Mystara without Ethengar? - nahh, u have to have someone for . << Hey Khan, any ideas for a high level party doing an adventure with the Khanates? I'll run it, and then decide if my opinion has changed... >> Hunting Heldannic Knights? Hunting Heldannic Warbirds? I must admit that I don't have too much ideas what to do on the steppes than send special force teams out to other countries to fulfill important task for the Khan. One big disadvantage is still the small size of the area of the steppes and the population. One idea is to conquer more steppes first before conquering the civilized world. Two possibilities are the Yazak steppes or the Great Escarpement on the Isle of Dawn. Of course there are a lot of logistic problems to solve. A great possibility is the Spirit World. You can play EVERY kind of adventure there. Jamuga Khan "Hear and obey, because the Mighty Khan's word is law." *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 8 Jun 1998 13:58:51 EDT From: JamugaKhan@aol.com Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Mystara without Ethengar? << BTW, did anyone see the documentry "Storm From the East"? It was on a few years ago, the BBC did it I think. Very good at scaring anyone who thinks tha Mongols are wimps...played an Ethengarian campaign straight after watching it :) >> I saw it or something similar. It may surprise all European or American members, but the Mongols were no primitive babarians compared to the Europeans. Vice versa: Europe was less developed in most things (with the exception of building houses and cities) and even that they learned when they conquered China. Peking was an theoretical concept for a city, but it was Kublai Khan who built it. The laws were more modern than Europe's, the military was better and the science. With the European attitude against less developed cultures shown some centuries later, Europe had to have fall to the Riders from the East. One word to Russia: The Mongols reduced the status of Kiew (capital of the Ukraine) and sponsored Moskau which hadn't had any significance before. Do you remember the Muslim storm which ended with the conquest of Spain? Do you know the Caliph of Bagdad? (No, I don't mean Saddam Hussein!) When the Mongols came they destroyed the holy Caliphate. To simply spoken the Mongols were really impressing. (And I'm glad that I haven't lived in that time too.) Jamuga Khan "Hear and obey, because the Mighty Khan's word is law." *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 8 Jun 1998 20:41:00 +0200 (MET DST) From: =?iso-8859-1?Q?H=E5vard_R=F8nne_Faanes?= Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - The NoS and Entropy On Mon, 8 Jun 1998, paul dooley wrote: >Its not that I disagree with the idea, but I`d like to Know more of the thinking behind it. I`m not being a pain am I? I`m the only Mystara DM I know so I`m used to getting my own way with rules interpretations, and anyway the discussion itself is what I`m interested in! <;-p You are not being a pain. Sorry if I made it sound that way. However, I am not quite sure that I understand all the theories behind this myself and that makes it a bit hard for me to explain it. I think the "mistake" you may be making is to see Entropy as a mass or an amount of energy, or even a force in the sense these terms are used in physics. Entropy is something more abstract, which means you cannot neccesarily apply maths to it. The Spheres do not represent actual things in this world, but rather their nature. The Draining of Entropy is an event, and is thus affected by Entropy itself. Håvard, pondering on strange stuff.. *** Haavard R. Faanes (hoc@nvg.ntnu.no) http://www.nvg.ntnu.no/~hoc "Every turkey dies. Not all turkeys truly live." -Chef, South Park *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 8 Jun 1998 15:12:47 EDT From: BoBoII@aol.com Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - The NoS and Entropy In a message dated 98-06-08 12:26:01 EDT, you write: << Did any of you lot learn any maths? I keep saying its the scalar size thats important not the vector sign!! <;-P For your own peice of mind, I'm with you all the way on this. Okay, breath deeply . . . You are a valuble being of light . . . Much better . . . . BoBoII *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 8 Jun 1998 16:47:34 -0400 (EDT) From: Pierre Savoie Subject: [MYSTARA] - AntiD&D controversy >Date: Sun, 7 Jun 1998 14:55:00 +0100 >From: elrond@post.olivant.fo (Jakup Michaelsen) Subject: [MYSTARA] - Re: Greetins from Northern Europe >Hi. >Thanks for the feedback everyone. >And yes satanic panic is very common here. Ones there was this band in tv, they were interviewed at their home, and they showed off D&D. A week later they were supposed to play in a small town, and everybody was like "those satanists" - "how dare they let them play" etc. >And once a brother of one of the players in our group confronted my like "is it true you're going to buy Dungeons & Dragons!?!" and he really urged us not to do so. And I think his parents don't like me for it... >Sad isn't it..? Pathetic, unnecessary, and worth shovelling information to your local news media. I suggested my Web-page http://people.unt.edu/~jl0007/draco.htm (and links) but it looks like you should also look at the most heavy-duty pages with historical information: http://blues.helsinki.fi/~vvitane/rec.games.frp.Faq_Part_2.txt The Frequently Asked Questions file of the rec.games.frp newspgroups, Part 2.1. Six gamers give their opinion on the "controversy", of which I furnished the most solid historical data. http://www.cybercomm.net/~dano/rpg-arch-pulling.html ("The Pulling Report": summarizes the most active and famous anti-D&D activist in the U.S.; she is now dead of cancer with no chance of being Raised...) No gamer should be without a look at that. We are fighting an uphill battle: it's a very dramatic notion that a gamer would lose touch with reality (one of famous actor Tom Hanks' earliest movies about it was called MAZES & MONSTERS, on the CBS TV network, 1982). But as for losing touch with reality, the American TV networks did that by falsely quoting and even falsely depicting the AD&D books on nation-wide (shucks, CONTINENT-wide) television in 1992. I don't really like uncorrected hate-literature against D&D beamed into millions of minds. It's too bad the idea of mental alienation through D&D has no foundation in the official psychiatric literature. The few papers I've found in a thorough PsychLit search on D&D only mention its benefits to (get this) help asocial 7-to-9-year-olds learn cooperation skills, or in a psychological testing of attendants at one convention, showing them as dead-normal even when data was weighted so a person playing D&D longer would count more! Also mix in the other notion that fantasy-fiction = the occult and Satanism, and you have a devil's brew. Even in religious terms, the fraud against D&D is Satan's way of sucking in the souls of those who consider themselves doing right by condemning it blindly, but the Ninth Commandment here is "Thou shalt not Bear False Witness against Dungeons & Dragons-players." They avoid sin pitfalls all their lives only to fall into this one which their religious follow-the-leader attitudes predispose them to. If they aren't straightened out they will go straight to the hot underground place (no, not Iceland!) Fraud does great damage to Christian communities. These accusations are not accusations against an inanimate object, but inevitably slanders against the players themselves, since by a simple experiment, I found that a D&D boxed set doesn't DO anything on its own. :-) It is worth stamping out this hydra of bad press in no uncertain terms. This is my gaming specialty; I hope I'm not BORING anyone... >Anyway, abour those books. Was there ever a like a boxed set about Mystara? You should find a complete list of Mystara (formerly called "Known World") products from somewhere. It started out as original D&D's only campaign world. - ---Pierre Savoie (ab966@torfree.net) *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 08 Jun 1998 15:50:33 -0500 From: Galwylin Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Spelljammer and Mystara (was: Why Mystara?) Daly wrote: >How do they not know? I mean, how do you know they don't know? Well, I asked Terari and he thought I was bonkers to suggest such a thing >In fact, maybe they DON'T know about the crystal spheres because they have never needed to know... I don't see why that can't be true. - -- This has been a Galwylin© Production http://www.airnet.net/galwylin/ galwylin@airnet.net | ICQ #6755972 | AIM: Galwylin *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 8 Jun 1998 16:55:55 -0400 (EDT) From: Pierre Savoie Subject: [MYSTARA] - (Hominid) Races in D&D? >Date: Mon, 8 Jun 1998 10:43:47 -0400 (EDT) From: Mischa E Gelman Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Jenni's Monumental Memo of Mystara >And for gosh sakes make people the proper skin color. TSR has this nasty habit of making everyone white. The only exception I can think of off the top of my head is the HW boxed set where the Nithian queen has a reasonable skin tone. For really funny examples of bad TSR art, check out Well, if truth be told, the Egyptians who built the great empires were lighter-skinned than the Arabs you see now. They even found one mummy of an Egyptian queen with RED hair. An overdose of henna, perhaps? I don't think so. There is a poisonous doctrine going around called Afrocentrism, which even goes around claiming that Socrates and Cleopatra (a Macedonian) were Black, but this is handily debunked at http://www.cycad.com/cgi-bin/Upstream/Issues/afroc/index.html The Upstream academic Web-site displays those academics willing to swim "upstream" from Political Correctness. We are finding out from the preserved mummies that the truth was closer to THE TEN COMMANDMENTS than the Michael Jackson "Remember the Time" video with celebrity Black actors and basketball stars in it. >Maquesta Kar-Thon and the first two books of Defenders of Magic in the DL series. All three portray black chars as being white on the cover. It doesn't hurt to reach out to minorities by showing RPGs isn't just a white folks' game (though I have only met one black role-player ever and they are probably less into RPGs at the moment than us whites, attempts should be made to include anyone who might buy the product) But if history doesn't include them in a setting, why should TSR? Egypt, Sumeria, and India were not in the skin-tones we find today. The ROBIN HOOD movie with Kevin Costner and Morgan Freeman was really "reaching", trying to put a Black character in England, and insultingly, the story told through the character's eyes as if he were the only one able to read and write and chronicle the adventure. I also find it odd when seeing any sort of pioneer museum such as one of those "pioneer villages" with Black or Oriental employees; it's ahistorical. It seems offensive to my ancestors who were in homogeneous North American communities since 1642. Some rule against that should be set up to preserve pioneer reality. If you ask me, TSR did the right thing by putting Black societies far away in Mystara or the Hollow World. It would have only highlighted the fragmentation into 1,200 languages, the lack of the wheel, beasts of burden, or writing in the real historical African societies, and how easily conquerable they would have been with the help of those mysterious inventions. Thyatian colonies would have been formed on the coast of any such land, building the first cities to be found there. - ---Pierre Savoie (ab966@torfree.net) *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 08 Jun 1998 15:54:34 -0500 From: Galwylin Subject: [MYSTARA] - Gazetteers Are Back! I was reading through the Ravenloft list and see that TSR is going back and using the Gazetteer format for that setting. Just wanted everyone to know that they haven't given up on the format (though sadly none are scheduled for Mystara). BTW Jeff, have you heard back from the petition you sent? - -- This has been a Galwylin© Production http://www.airnet.net/galwylin/ galwylin@airnet.net | ICQ #6755972 | AIM: Galwylin *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 08 Jun 1998 23:30:38 +0200 From: Fabrizio Paoli Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Mystara without Ethengar? At 01.40 08/06/98 -0500, Galwylin wrote: >Also, look at everything important that happens in Mystara. No Ethengar involvement. To play an Ethengarian means to probably never have an impact beyond the borders. A character might not in any nation but the possibility exist much more elsewhere than in Ethengar. Interesting point, but IMO the same applies for Atruaghin PCs, OTOH no one has ever proposed a Mystara without Atruaghin Clans. Are there any Atruaghin fans around here (except me)? - -------------- Fabrizio Paoli brizio@lunet.it Home Page: http://www.geocities.com/TimesSquare/Dungeon/4560 - -------------- *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 08 Jun 1998 23:30:49 +0200 From: Fabrizio Paoli Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Hule Maps Date: Mon, 8 Jun 1998 22:04:33 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: phaser.Showcase.MPGN.COM: majordom set sender to owner-mystara-l@ using -f From: (mystara-digest) To: mystara-digest@Phaser.ShowCase.MPGN.COM Subject: mystara-digest V1997 #398 Reply-To: mystara@mpgn.com X-UIDL: 0ad7124981d03b376e84e4050fe106da Status: RO At 19.38 07/06/98 -0500, Galwylin wrote: HHas Hule been mapped anywhere? I've been looking but have only found a small amount of the area in Champions of Mystara and Red Steel sets. Have a look at the map in the Princess Ark series in Dragon Magazine #172. Not much more than the RS map, but it has hexes. *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 8 Jun 1998 23:34:14 +0200 (MET DST) From: =?iso-8859-1?Q?H=E5vard_R=F8nne_Faanes?= Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Midland Forest On Sat, 6 Jun 1998, Galwylin wrote: >Oh, one other thought about this forest. What about it being the home of Brun's grand druid? Perhaps the whole council. I don't really like the idea of Mystara having one organization of Druids with a grand druid superior to all druids on the planet. Rather I think there should be several Druidic organizations, each with their own hierarchy. Going back to my idea about forest loving orcs, maybe druidic orcs could do the trick? Orc rangers? We have plenty of human cultures, so why not develope the less developed nonhuman peoples? just a though.. Håvard Haavard R. Faanes (hoc@nvg.ntnu.no) http://www.nvg.ntnu.no/~hoc "Every turkey dies. Not all turkeys truly live." -Chef, South Park *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 9 Jun 1998 00:45:04 +0300 From: "Aleksei Andrievski" Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - MYSTARA - Immortals >AH but what about the loss of political power inherant in this? Politics as much as magic is the lifeblood of Glantri just look at the infighting going on over what happened to Jagger! If Ettienne is back he needs to have his powerbase to stave off the rise of entropy in Glantri <;-P I think Etienne can make convincing suggestions in the Council even without the voting points. And him being Rad he can influence the whole course of Glantri through his Shepherds. ****************** Aleksei Andrievski aka Solmyr, Archmage of the Azure Star Visit the Archmage's Tower at http://www.geocities.com/TimesSquare/Fortress/2198/index.html *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 9 Jun 1998 00:49:31 +0300 From: "Aleksei Andrievski" Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Mystara without Ethengar? >Do you remember the Muslim storm which ended with the conquest of Spain? Do you know the Caliph of Bagdad? (No, I don't mean Saddam Hussein!) When the Mongols came they destroyed the holy Caliphate. How ironic that Ethengarians and Ylari are allies... or are they? Hmm... Mongols moving through Persia to destroy Baghdad... Ethengars moving through Darokin to destroy Ylaruam... ****************** Aleksei Andrievski aka Solmyr, Archmage of the Azure Star Visit the Archmage's Tower at http://www.geocities.com/TimesSquare/Fortress/2198/index.html *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 08 Jun 1998 16:56:03 -0500 From: Galwylin Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Mystara without Ethengar? Fabrizio Paoli wrote: >Interesting point, but IMO the same applies for Atruaghin PCs, OTOH no one has ever proposed a Mystara without Atruaghin Clans. Are there any Atruaghin fans around here (except me)? When I wrote that, I was thinking the same of the Atruaghin Clans but decided not to open that one. But now that you have, I like the Clans but would have no trouble at all seeing them moved either. The problem with both Ethengar and Atruaghin is that they simply stick out from the surrounding lands. Not a major problem but when even the designers and writers don't use them because of that, its understandably they don't get noticed much. Seems that these two Gazetteers went to extreme lengths to isolate both cultures and they succeeded very well it seems. The Known World has a desert in the middle of it that is out of place but no one really says much about moving them (though its been mentioned) mainly because Ylaruam has ties to the rest of the area. Ethengar and Atruaghin are missing those ties or they've not been explored yet. So the idea of moving them doesn't seem to mess with the rest of the setting. - -- This has been a Galwylin© Production http://www.airnet.net/galwylin/ galwylin@airnet.net | ICQ #6755972 | AIM: Galwylin *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 8 Jun 1998 18:06:50 -0400 (EDT) From: SteelAngel Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Midland Forest On Mon, 8 Jun 1998, [iso-8859-1] Håvard Rųnne Faanes wrote: >there should be several Druidic organizations, each with their own hierarchy. I beleive each continent has a set of Druids. Max IV *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 08 Jun 1998 17:10:41 -0500 From: Galwylin Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Midland Forest Håvard Rųnne Faanes wrote: >I don't really like the idea of Mystara having one organization of Druids with a grand druid superior to all druids on the planet. Rather I think there should be several Druidic organizations, each with their own hierarchy. I wouldn't go with the grand druid in Midland forest being for the whole planet (he'd be the one to go to for information if there was) but a grand druid for all of Brun works. There's really not that many large forests that could be home to such a druid. I wouldn't have one in elven controlled lands as that's redundant (an elf that hates trees? Doubtful so no need). But the smaller forest of Brun could have lower level druids accordingly to their size with the grand druid located in Midland Forest. >Going back to my idea about forest loving orcs, maybe druidic orcs could do the trick? Orc rangers? We have plenty of human cultures, so why not develope the less developed nonhuman peoples? Forest loving orcs sound like a fine idea. I'm hesitant of making them druids or rangers though (It would be interesting to see one or two fall under the beliefs of druids though). Mostly because I'm not sure if I like humanoids taking up human cultures. I'd much rather work something out that is alien to cultures we know of. Of course we'll have to base it on something we're familiar with but humanoids could be the chance to combine some unlikely characteristics of different cultures. For example, forest orcs could have clan setup of Ireland but a philosophy of life the way of the Orient. Throw in the religious outlook of the New Age. Maybe they even picked up the sacrificial ways of the Azcans. Lots of things to combine to get an alien culture. Just some ponderings... - -- This has been a Galwylin© Production http://www.airnet.net/galwylin/ galwylin@airnet.net | ICQ #6755972 | AIM: Galwylin *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 8 Jun 1998 18:25:45 EDT From: Dleggend@aol.com Subject: [MYSTARA] - Look for GAZ 8 I am looking for GAZ8: The Five Shires and I was wondering if anybody is willing to sell or trade for it. Please respond to me directly. Thank You DLeggend@aol.com *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 08 Jun 1998 18:57:13 -0400 From: Daly Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - AntiD&D controversy At 04:47 PM 6/8/98 -0400, Pierre Savoie wrote: Even in religious terms, the fraud against D&D is Satan's way oof sucking in the souls of those who consider themselves doing right by condemning it blindly, This is absolutely true. CS Lewis and Tolkien were both strong Christians and their writing does show it. The funny part is, of late there HAVE been younger gamers attracted to D&D for its darker qualities. These young gamers have come to believe the hype against the game and have taken it up for that reason. They typically play a few chaotic games and then figure out it is not what they were looking for. But they will keep the artwork around to annoy their parents. Back to the original point: As a Christian, I am very annoyed by the hordes of ignorants who will leap on the bandwagon and condemn gamers when there are loads of real problems out there... *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 08 Jun 1998 18:58:54 -0400 From: Daly Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Spelljammer and Mystara (was: Why Mystara?) At 03:50 PM 6/8/98 -0500, Galwylin wrote: DDaly wrote: >>How do they not know? I mean, how do you know they don't know? >Well, I asked Terari and he thought I was bonkers to suggest such a thing But Terari told me he wasn't speaking to you anymore. In fact, he is rather annoyed at us all for letting his home sink... >>In fact, maybe they DON'T know about the crystal spheres because they have never needed to know... >I don't see why that can't be true. I kinda like the idea of Alphatians hopping around to the same worlds but seeing them entirely differently because of the particular methods of travel they use. *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 08 Jun 1998 19:06:45 -0400 From: Daly Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Gazetteers Are Back! At 03:54 PM 6/8/98 -0500, Galwylin wrote: II was reading through the Ravenloft list and see that TSR is going back and using the Gazetteer format for that setting. Just wanted everyone to know that they haven't given up on the format (though sadly none are scheduled for Mystara). >BTW Jeff, have you heard back from the petition you sent? Thanks for asking! Not yet, but it has only been about half a week and perhaps they are checking addresses and whatnot. Perhaps a quick reply would have meant a cursory glance... *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 08 Jun 1998 19:04:13 -0500 From: Galwylin Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Spelljammer and Mystara (was: Why Mystara?) Daly wrote: >But Terari told me he wasn't speaking to you anymore. In fact, he is rather annoyed at us all for letting his home sink... Well, he got over that. All I had to do was remind him where he was when Alphatia sunk (of course, that resulted in me spending a few days as a small rodent). >I kinda like the idea of Alphatians hopping around to the same worlds but seeing them entirely differently because of the particular methods of travel they use. Just imagine an Alphatian trying to understand what exactly a crystal sphere is and why anyone would want to know. "Let me get this straight. You get on a ship and go into space then through a wall in this crystal sphere into some kinda rainbow-colored stuff to another crystal sphere. Interesting. Tell me, do you wait in a house for a tornado to come to get to the planes?" ::walks off muttering something about bass-ackward mages:: - -- This has been a Galwylin© Production http://www.airnet.net/galwylin/ galwylin@airnet.net | ICQ #6755972 | AIM: Galwylin *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 8 Jun 1998 17:09:30 -0700 From: "Jesse LaBranche" Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Spelljammer and Mystara (was: Why Mystara?) >Well, if a Voidship had both- then they could go faster with the helm- and dddo just fine when they couldn't use the arcane abilities. Right ? Not trying >>to push circumstances- just curious. >Probably. There are spelljammers with all sorts of magic on them (non detection, that sort of thing) and that doesnt interfere with the helm. Perhaps it is possible to amalgamate the two technologies - have a helm powered by some bound energy (like the Nightwalker that powers the Alphatian Flying Castle in Vengeance of Alphaks). Best of both worlds... Cheerz >ROB This, also, allows for full compatibility with the SJ game while keeping the things that make Mystara unique ;-) Jesse. *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 8 Jun 1998 21:09:38 -0400 (EDT) From: SteelAngel Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Spelljammer and Mystara (was: Why Mystara?) On Mon, 8 Jun 1998, Galwylin wrote: >this crystal sphere into some kinda rainbow-colored stuff to another crystal sphere. Interesting. Tell me, do you wait in a house for a tornado to come to get to the planes?" ::walks off muttering something about bass-ackward mages:: LOL. That is typical Alphatian arrogance, but one of the funniest things I have read in a while :) Max IV *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 08 Jun 1998 22:05:13 -0400 From: Daly Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Spelljammer and Mystara (was: Why Mystara?) At 07:04 PM 6/8/98 -0500, Galwylin wrote: DDaly wrote: >>But Terari told me he wasn't speaking to you anymore. In fact, he is rather annoyed at us all for letting his home sink... >Well, he got over that. All I had to do was remind him where he was when Alphatia sunk (of course, that resulted in me spending a few days as a small rodent). Ouch! Say, I forgot...where was he? >>I kinda like the idea of Alphatians hopping around to the same worlds but seeing them entirely differently because of the particular methods of travel they use. >Just imagine an Alphatian trying to understand what exactly a crystal sphere is and why anyone would want to know. "Let me get this straight. You get on a ship and go into space then through a wall in this crystal sphere into some kinda rainbow-colored stuff to another crystal sphere. Interesting. Tell me, do you wait in a house for a tornado to come to get to the planes?" ::walks off muttering something about bass-ackward mages:: That is exactly how I pictured it! *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ End of mystara-digest V1997 #398 ******************************** *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara' as the body of the message. mystara-digest Tuesday, June 9 1998 Volume 1997 : Number 399 Mystara is a trademark of TSR Inc. All Rights Reserved. The following topics are covered in this digest: Re: [MYSTARA] - Spelljammer and Mystara (was: Why Mystara?) [MYSTARA] - Magical Parrying Re: [MYSTARA] - [Mystara] Re: Almanac Re: [MYSTARA] - The NoS and Entropy Re: [MYSTARA] - The NoS and Entropy Re: [MYSTARA] - [Mystara] Re: Almanac [MYSTARA] - Re: Sylvan Realm Re: [MYSTARA] - The NoS and Entropy [MYSTARA] - Human races in D&D was (Re: Midland Forest) [MYSTARA] - Human races in D&D was (Re: Midland Forest) [MYSTARA] - Principium, Propostitium and no other big "P" words was (Re: Almanac/Glantri) [MYSTARA] - Human races in D&D was (Re: (Hominid) Races in D&D?) Re: [MYSTARA] - Greetings from Northern Europe Re: [MYSTARA] - [Mystara] Re: Almanac Re: [MYSTARA] - The NoS and Entropy Re: [MYSTARA] - Principium, Propostitium and no other big Re: [MYSTARA] - Spelljammer and Mystara (was: Why Mystara?) Re: [MYSTARA] - The NoS and Entropy Re: [MYSTARA] - The NoS and Entropy Re: [MYSTARA] - Mystara without Ethengar? Re: [MYSTARA] - Why the Council of Alphatia is reasonable ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Mon, 08 Jun 1998 21:39:59 -0500 From: Galwylin Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Spelljammer and Mystara (was: Why Mystara?) Daly wrote: >Ouch! Say, I forgot...where was he? He was in Helskir on the Isle of Dawn visiting two of his favorite students. Unfortunately, Helskir had sided with Thyatis during the Great War (WotI) so Terari is a little sensitive that he was in an enemy land when his nation sank. Can't blame him really, you know how the press are these days. Scandal, scandal, scandal - -- This has been a Galwylin© Production http://www.airnet.net/galwylin/ galwylin@airnet.net | ICQ #6755972 | AIM: Galwylin *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 8 Jun 1998 22:07:56 -0700 (PDT) From: Adam Curtis Subject: [MYSTARA] - Magical Parrying I haven't read much about the formal magical duels that take place upon Mystara, but knowing the standard D&D/AD&D magic systems, I imagine they're not often as epic as they should be. One good spell, and your opponent's toast. Obviously a physical blow can achieve the same instant death effect in real life, but it usually doesn't in D&D (makes for better climax combats). You'd think at least that when mages are duelling, the potential for the "win initiative, instantly kill opponent" would seriously dwindle. So I started kicking around an idea to lengthen magic duels. GAZ03, *The Principalities of Glantri*, outlines some interesting special skills in its "Complimentary Courses" section. Perhaps an additional course could be something called *Raw Mana Manipulation*. *Raw Mana Manipulation*, as I've thought of it, would be much less effective than standard magic. After all, mana (or magical energy) simply grabbed and flung isn't nearly as potent when compared with a painstakingly crafted spell designed to utilize mana in supreme efficieny. However, unlike standard magic, *Raw Mana Manipulation* is incredibly flexible and may be used without preparation totalling more than a second or two. Less importantly, this skill could create all those little magical cantrip effects mages love without having to waste precious spell slots on a cantrip spell. For instance, a mage with mana manipulation could make a simple skill check to create that dramatic small gust of wind that flickers candles when entering a room, make floorboards slightly creak while walking across a normally quiet floor, create a very small flame within his hand to provide some illumination (about as bright as a match), or very slowly (probably making nine or ten skill checks, no need to make them all succeed in a row) alter the blue color of a small object into a green color. More importantly, a mana manipulator could slightly alter gathered raw mana into a jet of flame or an electrical discharge. Since mana isn't nearly as efficiently consumed in this way as it is in a real spell, its effects would be much weaker. So crude an offensive weapon would perhaps cause 1d4 points of damage per caster level (max 10d4), save v. magic for half. Most importantly, mana manipulation could "parry" offensive spells thrown at the practitioner through quickly channeling a concentrated beam of raw mana to disrupt the intricate structure of the incoming spell. For instance, someone with mana manipulation could, on a successful skill check, reduce or nullify a fireball just cast at them. Obviously, so instant a *dispel magic* is way too powerful, so limitations on the above effect must be made. I'd say a mage with mana manipulation trying to achieve the above dispel effect OR even the cheap magical attack immediately before it, obviously requiring much more effort than moving a little air through a room, would be physically taxing unlike standard spell casting. Therefore, the mage would subtract two points of constitution every time he/she attempted a magical parry or a raw mana attack. If the constitution of the mage ever dropped below 3, he/she'd instantly lose consciousness. Constitution points lost in such a way could only be restored with a heal spell, a wish, or good old rest (at 1 point per hour's rest). In addition, the mana manipulator must be aware that a spell is being cast against him the instant the casting begins to prepare a quick parry, otherwise he/she won't have enough time to muster enough raw magic. To muster the mana, the mage must remain motionless (no dex bonus to AC during the manipulation) and devote full concentration on drawing in mana. The parry must also be unleashed within instants of the completion of the offending spell, just before the spell completely "gells" (that'll make this ability useless for dispelling already charmed and/or enchanted beings and/or things). Finally, the mana manipulator may only disrupt spells of a spell level he/she may personally cast. For instance, a mana manipulator capable of casting level 1, 2, and 3 spells, could disrupt a fog wall (level 1 spell), an acid arrow (level 2 spell), and a fireball (level 3 spell), but not an ice storm (level 4 spell). I know the way I listed the idea isn't concise, nor are all loopholes likely accounted for, nor does the idea of mana manipulation seem at all simple, but the intention of the above rules is to take the bite out of the nastier KO spells used in magic duels, such as fireballs and meteor swarms, in addition to providing a few other cool effects. If the above was revised for clarity and conciseness, I think it'd make a very positive and fun contribution to the D&D/AD&D systems. Anyone have any comments? AC _________________________________________________________ DO YOU YAHOO!? Get your free @yahoo.com address at http://mail.yahoo.com *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 09 Jun 1998 11:21:16 CEST From: "Herve Musseau" Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - [Mystara] Re: Almanac From: "paul dooley" TTThere was probably the same problem when Khoronus discovered the sphere of Time by accident.. >Pardon? what about Protius, he wass around for milennia before Khronus. see WotI bk1 for details. Also there are many other Immortals not mentioned cos they have no interest in Mystra one of them was probably once reigning heirarch. Alternately there may be areigning heirarch for each area of interest, they all get togeter once an eon or so for a convention where the play games like PA`s&Accountants etc. <;-P Oh you know Paul, Time is tricky... Immortals ofTime keep using chronomancy just to keep us embroiled ;) No really, it's as Jamuga said: Khoronus went back through time to sponsor Protius at the dawn of time. It may seem like a time paradox, but hey it's fantasy. I'm not too sure where this is from, but I guess it's from WotI. ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 9 Jun 1998 07:06:33 EDT From: Inconu@aol.com Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - The NoS and Entropy << I`m sorry I totally disagree with this any drain is a diminishment we`re talking about absolute values here. The fact that its negative energy is irrelevant its the ammount that is being reduced the big pile of neg energy gets smaller a net loss! >> I agree here. Draining and adding negative enegry are two completly different things. Entropy can't be getting stronger if it's being drained. - -Inconu *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 9 Jun 1998 07:09:25 EDT From: Inconu@aol.com Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - The NoS and Entropy << Normally, -6 is bigger than -9 (being closer to 0), BUT if we assume Entropy is negative energy and it functions the opposite way of normal energy, then "the further from the zero it goes, the bigger it becomes". Don't think using plain maths terms here.. >> But the energy drain has nothing to do with adding negatives. You aren't subtracting from entropy, you are draining. The absolute amount of Entropy lessens under a draining effect whether or not it's negative energy. - -Inconu *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 9 Jun 1998 07:17:49 EDT From: Inconu@aol.com Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - [Mystara] Re: Almanac << Sorry, Protius was sponsored by Khoronus and THEN sent back into the past to rule over the seven seas (and under the seas too, of course.) >> I don't believe that's entirely accurate. If i recall correctly, Protius only served before Khoronus' existence. At least that's my impression after reading WOTI. Do you have a reference point for that statement Jamuga? - -Inconu *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 9 Jun 1998 21:25:22 +1000 From: shawn@leme.anu.edu.au (stan) Subject: [MYSTARA] - Re: Sylvan Realm >From: au998@freenet.carleton.ca (Geoff Gander) >Marco of DM said: >>First of all, SR location: i've always thought it was located on the west coast, south of Hyborea and north of Arm of the Immortals, and this is mainly because of CM7 map (which shows a body of water west of the SR -i thought it was the western unnamed ocean) and of GAZ5 map, which shows clearly where Ilsundal's migration stopped (on the west coast of Brun). However, since CM7 says that the SR was surrounded by many humans who threatened their woods (and Moorkroft is their self-styled king/tyrant), how do you explain that nobody in the Savage Coast 8not even the Sea Powers) knows of this place and Moorkroft's kingdom? >Perhaps the Endworld Line (I think that's what the western mountains are called) is an effective barrier between west and east. Yeah, they're a fairly effective barrier. I can't recall are the Endworld Line and Arm of Immortals connected ... no hang on a minute, in the Masters boxed set I don't think that there were any mountains drawn on the Arm of the Immortals, I think these were an addition by Bruce later. If I'm remembering correctly this would mean that it is up to us whether the Endworld Line and Arm of Immortals mountains make a long chain down this side of western Brun. >If Gombar and >Suma'a have not contacted the Savage Coast nations yet because of the high mountains and rough seas, and they're closer together, The reasons why Gombar and Suma'a haven't made contact with the Savage Coast are perhaps a little more complex than "just because of the mountains", it amounts to that however. Firstly we have Bruce's wonderful suggestion of a weather disturbance in the Strait of Izonda which makes east-west travel across difficult, for those who've read Geoff's Lhomarrian/Y'hog stuff, we then have a reason for why the area exists. Secondly the Gombarians and Suma'ans aren't too interested in overland travel apart from searching for the next mineral deposit - they're a culture who use the sea for trade and it's their life blood - the minerals in the geologically interesting area provide them with funds and tradeable goods. Thirdly the ee'aar, and by logical progression the Eshunites, have decided not to tell the ogrekin about the existance of life on the other side of the Arm - they have their very good reasons (well perhaps just reason, singular). >then I can't see >how Mookroft's land would contact the eastern realms. Well I guess, as in my example of Gombar and Suma'a it depends on the inhabitants of the mountains. Previous sources, PC2 and Dragon issue 200, have told us that the mountains of the Arm of the Immortals are populated by flying creatures, some of whom we will assume have formed relatively advanced societies. Whether this trend of the odd flying creature society in the mountains extends up to the Endworld Line and more importantly to the area to the east of the Sylvan Realm is something we have to think about. Given that the elves felt the need to travel from the Sylvan Realm by rainbow and not just simply walk (like the way they left Davania) we can assume that the mountains to the east of the Sylvan Realm are either pretty treacherous and not easily traversed - or are inhabited by some really scary things - any one got a mother-in-law who needs a place to stay :) >IMO, his nation >would be long and thin - sort of like Chile. I'll put my geographic hat on now and suggest that countries on the eastern edges of continents with mountain ranges to their right should be as dry as all hell. In an upcoming post about G+S I am suggesting such a thing and looking at the real world we only have to look at the aforementioned Chile or even the Kalahari desert or western Australia or the western edge of US as an example of this. But taking my geographic hat of I conceed that Mystaran is magical and it's very easy to say that there is some external factor which allows a jolly nice forest ala the Sylvan Realm exist where it does. stan http://www.geocities.com/TimesSquare/5304 *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 9 Jun 1998 07:27:16 EDT From: Inconu@aol.com Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - The NoS and Entropy << I think the "mistake" you may be making is to see Entropy as a mass or an amount of energy, or even a force in the sense these terms are used in physics. Entropy is something more abstract, which means you cannot neccesarily apply maths to it.>> (trying not to be a pain as well) In my opinion, regardless as to how an individual percieves entropy, the effect doesn't change. It's not necessarily just mathematics. Just the effect of draining alone leads me to my opinions on this matter. << The Spheres do not represent actual things in this world, but rather their nature. The Draining of Entropy is an event, and is thus affected by Entropy itself. I don't interpet the action the same way you seem to..... it seems. Unfortunetly this seems to be leading to another "My campaign, Your campaign" debate. I see the trouble of defending someone else's arguement, but i will ultimetly stay along the lines of Entropy being weakend by the drain. Thanks for the insight and ideas anyways Harvard. - -Inconu *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 9 Jun 1998 21:43:28 +1000 From: shawn@leme.anu.edu.au (stan) Subject: [MYSTARA] - Human races in D&D was (Re: Midland Forest) >From: =?iso-8859-1?Q?H=E5vard_R=F8nne_Faanes?= >Going back to my idea about forest loving orcs, maybe druidic orcs could do the trick? Orc rangers? We have plenty of human cultures, so why not develope the less developed nonhuman peoples? >just a though.. I read this after my previous post. Although I said that this sort of thing has been done in Mystara already I agree that more of this sort of thing should be done. Of course we don't have to give everyone earth-based cultures Date: Tue, 9 Jun 1998 10:25:25 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: phaser.Showcase.MPGN.COM: majordom set sender to owner-mystara-l@ using -f From: (mystara-digest) To: mystara-digest@Phaser.ShowCase.MPGN.COM Subject: mystara-digest V1997 #399 Reply-To: mystara@mpgn.com X-UIDL: e143f87ae8666609ae80f6c804e28024 although that is significantly easier given the expanse of human knowledge but some forest loving druidic orcs in the Midland Forest sound like fun. The elves of Mystara might not know about them however. Or else you wouldn't have had elves successively using a rainbow to walk over the top of them. Hmmm ... let me think ... there's like minded creatures in the forest below us - OK, they're orcs but they love the forest. Will we set the rainbow down here or go on to an area that doesn't have a forest and go to all the bother of creating one? Hmmm ... have to think real hard about this one. stan http://www.geocities.com/TimesSquare/5304 *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 9 Jun 1998 22:01:22 +1000 From: shawn@leme.anu.edu.au (stan) Subject: [MYSTARA] - Human races in D&D was (Re: Midland Forest) >From: Galwylin I read Galwylin's post after posting my last message, hmmm maybe I should read the WHOLE digest before replying to thinks. Since I'm not doing that for this message it doesn't seem that I'll be starting anytime soon however :) >Mostly because I'm not sure if I >like humanoids taking up human cultures. I'd much rather work something out that is alien to cultures we know of. Of course we'll have to base it on something we're familiar with but humanoids could be the chance to combine some unlikely characteristics of different cultures. For example, forest orcs could have clan setup of Ireland but a philosophy of life the way of the Orient. Throw in the religious outlook of the New Age. Maybe they even picked up the sacrificial ways of the Azcans. Lots of things to combine to get an alien culture. Just some ponderings... I sort of have to agree with you there. But I think that non-human races with earth cultures is already pretty different than my perception of other RPGs (please everybody don't post your examples of other gaming worlds which are really great in this regard. I found Mystara first and am rather myopic about these sorts of things - however I've recently discovered Vampire I still am of the, perhaps misconceived, impression that Mystara is the best gaming world ever invented bar none.) The problem, Galwylin, with coming up with alien cultures is the extent of human experience. A culture which is based on Irish and Oriental models may be a bit odd but it still isn't alien - it's Irish and Oriental. When you think about thinking up alien cultures is jolly hard, even something like the Klingons and Minbarri are basically Oriental in their cultural designs (I apologise to Prof B Summerfield who'll write a book about this in the far future and I apologise to all those non DW fans in the present who just missed that reference entirely). To get some idea of how we can't even think about alien cultures I remember lectures from palaeontology where we taught about fish who had (and probably still have - I never studied biology) like up to 36 senses including things like the ability to "see" electrical impulses. Sod infravision and ultravision (although these are pretty alien in and of themselves those without these disorders/peculiarties) to have senses such as the ability to "see" electrical impulses or even "see" let's say for example gamma radiation is pretty alien. OK, we now have instruments which can see a wide range of the EM spectrum but imagine being a creatures that can see within specific bands of the spectrum rather than the visible light spectrum. Man that would be freaky, I can't find myself readily imagining that. Sorry that this post is straying from Mystara a bit although the creation of new cultures (like is going on in many parts of Mystara as we speak) may be of some relevance. My next post will be more relevant - I promise. stan http://www.geocities.com/TimesSquare/5304 *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 9 Jun 1998 22:06:39 +1000 From: shawn@leme.anu.edu.au (stan) Subject: [MYSTARA] - Principium, Propostitium and no other big "P" words was (Re: Almanac/Glantri) >From: "Herve Musseau" >Also, what did people think about the theory on the sphere of Principium that I >introduced in the post #5 about Gareth? (hint) The existance of such a sphere is an interesting idea. Sort of like the co- discovery of calculus by Newton and the other guy, Estlor must have used similar logic to yourself with the sphere of Propostitium. An excerpt from Estlor's net book follows - >The Sphere of Propostitium doesn't actually exist (or if it does, there are no Immortals for it). It is hypothesised to be the Sphere of the Positive Material Plane, the Sphere of life, healing, and sustenance. The sages feel it >would combat the effects of entropy, while assuring the existence of matter, energy, time, and thought. This book will take the all-knowing approach and tell how to become an Immortal of this Sphere (later), though no mortal could know the procedure. I never really found myself thinking about such things but now that it's come up again it seems to be a fairly plausible idea. stan http://www.geocities.com/TimesSquare/5304 *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 9 Jun 1998 22:08:09 +1000 From: shawn@leme.anu.edu.au (stan) Subject: [MYSTARA] - Human races in D&D was (Re: (Hominid) Races in D&D?) >>From: Mischa E Gelman >>And for gosh sakes make people the proper skin color. TSR has this nasty habit of making everyone white. FFrom: Pierre Savoie >If you ask me, TSR did the right thing by putting Black societies far away in Mystara or the Hollow World. I also have to commed TSR. Although I'm not overly fond of the idea of things like MThis or MTheOther - insofar as people tend to create areas specifically based on earth-cultures rather than create totally new fantastical ones (which would be a lot harder any rate what with us being earth based creatures) I do like the way particularly by Bruce in the Voyage of the Princess Ark that non-human Mystaran races were given cultures that were obviously MThis and MTheOther. I think the idea of given non-human races human cultures helps to inject the fantastical element into the game (something that has been missing in most other RPG's I've glanced at - other than the ocassional Oriental Ogre Magi). I just had to commend the Mystaran setting for having these elements in it which make jolly fun to play and help create. I'll stop spouting now :) stan http://www.geocities.com/TimesSquare/5304 *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 09 Jun 1998 06:37:32 PDT From: "paul dooley" Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Greetings from Northern Europe >Bah. Those are the 2 that I need to complete the collection. (Unless Hule, >Heldann and Wendar come out mysteriously ;) >I'd pay twice the list price for those 2 in V.G. - Mint condition.. >Max IV - Random ranting. I`ve a friend who owns a gamestore with the items you require priblem is where are you I`m in Liverpool England ttfn, Paul ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 09 Jun 1998 06:44:54 PDT From: "paul dooley" Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - [Mystara] Re: Almanac >Sorry, Protius was sponsored by Khoronus and THEN sent back into the past to rule over the seven seas (and under the seas too, of course.) Exactly, whilst Khronus is dickering trying to become an Immortal the sphere of time has been represented for eons! <;-P ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 09 Jun 1998 06:49:55 PDT From: "paul dooley" Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - The NoS and Entropy >Actually, based on the Night Rage series of module, all Immortals can travel through time. IIRC the past was described as a frozen green river which could only be observed not modified, but then again as per usual I am probably wrong <;-P ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 09 Jun 1998 15:52:12 CEST From: "Herve Musseau" Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Principium, Propostitium and no other big From: shawn@leme.anu.edu.au (stan) >>From: "Herve Musseau" Also, what did people think about the theory on the sphere of Principium that >>I >>introduced in the post #5 about Gareth? (hint) >The existance of such a sphere is an interesting idea. Sort of like the co- >discovery of calculus by Newton and the other guy, Estlor must have used >similar logic to yourself with the sphere of Propostitium. An excerpt from Estlor's net book follows - Actually, I didn't make it up but used Estlor's original idea (maybe I should have given credit where it is due - I thought most people were aware of this theory just as am I and didn't think wrong when using it; now I realize that I knew about it because I used to mirror his site and not everyone may be aware of his work). Note: On his homepage this Sphere's name is spelled Principium (I never read his Mystara Netbook, as it never displayed correctly on my computer). My intent was to actually use his original idea and elaborate on it. >>The Sphere of Propostitium doesn't actually exist (or if it does, there >>are no Immortals for it). It is hypothesised to be the Sphere of the Positive >>Material Plane, the Sphere of life, healing, and sustenance. The sages feel >>it >>would combat the effects of entropy, while assuring the existence of matter, >>energy, time, and thought. This book will take the all-knowing approach and >>tell how to become an Immortal of this Sphere (later), though no mortal could >>know the procedure. >I never really found myself thinking about such things but now that it's >come up again it seems to be a fairly plausible idea. I myself always was intrigued by this idea ever since I read about it on Estlor's page. While writing my 5th post about Gareth, it occured to me that I could use that idea and turn it into something quite interesting. ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 09 Jun 1998 06:52:30 PDT From: "paul dooley" Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Spelljammer and Mystara (was: Why Mystara?) ><< -MSkyships are slower (compare the skyships max speed with Spelljamer's: >Jammers can go from a minimum of 240' per round to a maximum of 2400' PER >round, depending on the level of the helmsman) >> >IIRC voidships can go at a speed of 3600' per round, and this is only "impuls speed". Antique? >Jamuga Khan Also because they`re so big its well nigh impossible to d.m them, and they dont run out of fresh air because there magic constantly renews it ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 09 Jun 1998 07:11:23 PDT From: "paul dooley" Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - The NoS and Entropy >The Spheres do not represent actual things in this world, but >rather their nature. The Draining of Entropy is an event, and is >thus affected by Entropy itself. Ah, the possibility of ideas! But there are little ideas and big ideas they grow with the ammount of belief and diminish the same way. Now tats a croc of (insert rude wordhere). An old thought there afre two basic forces in the universe Intergration and Dissolution set up by the Old Ones. The universe itself has a built in runtime for the experiments end, when either of these two forces gain absolute mastery. Entropy is Dissolution`s manifestation, the other four are Intergrations. the diminishment of Entropy would allow Intergration to accelerate, BUT since it has not had to withstand the full power of entropy it would be flawed. Rather like building insufficient foundation, it may hold for a long time but when it goes, it REALLY goes. <;-P ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 09 Jun 1998 07:13:11 PDT From: "paul dooley" Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - The NoS and Entropy >For your own peice of mind, I'm with you all the way on this. >Okay, breath deeply . . . >You are a valuble being of light . . . >Much better . . . . >BoBoII THANKS (I think?) <;-P ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 09 Jun 1998 07:23:30 PDT From: "paul dooley" Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Mystara without Ethengar? >Are there any Atruaghin fans around here (except me)? YEP! One of my favourite ever characters in a game I ran was a Bear clan shaman, despite being known as `Rug Salesman` by all the other pcs he was a hoot. <;-P ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 9 Jun 1998 10:24:37 EDT From: Alex295@aol.com Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Why the Council of Alphatia is reasonable In a message dated 98-06-07 05:51:16 EDT, you write: << << IMO the Imperial Court also has a standing Imperial Army, Navy, and Air Fleet. These are composed of troops from all over the Empire. The individual kingdom armies are intended to suppliment this force in times of war. >> Me As far as I've understood it there's no "Air Fleet". Instead swimming and flying units are part of the Imperial Navy. Look at CoM.>> Jamuga Khan Yes and no. If you look at the CoM Box and look at the Design Book, you'll see the description on Alphatian Windriders. Some have a comment about these types being commisioned by the Imperial Court. So essentially, the Imperial Court would control them. The term "Air Fleet" was used to state a difference between the two services. Had I included both under the singular "Imperial Navy" designation, someone would have pointed out that aspect. Better safe than sorry. Alex *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ End of mystara-digest V1997 #399 ******************************** *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara' as the body of the message. mystara-digest Tuesday, June 9 1998 Volume 1997 : Number 400 Mystara is a trademark of TSR Inc. All Rights Reserved. The following topics are covered in this digest: Re: [MYSTARA] - Midland Forest Re: [MYSTARA] - MYSTARA - Immortals Re: [MYSTARA] - Mystara without Ethengar? Re: [MYSTARA] - Magical Parrying Re: [MYSTARA] - The NoS and Entropy Re: [MYSTARA] - Principium, Propostitium and no other big Re: [MYSTARA] - (Hominid) Races in D&D? Re: [MYSTARA] - The NoS and Entropy Re: [MYSTARA] - (Hominid) Races in D&D? Re: [MYSTARA] - Magical Parrying [MYSTARA] - Gazetteer Re: [MYSTARA] - The NoS and Entropy Re: [MYSTARA] - The NoS and Entropy Re: [MYSTARA] - Magical Parrying Re: [MYSTARA] - Gazetteer Re: [MYSTARA] - Spelljammer and Mystara (was: Why Mystara?) Re: [MYSTARA] - Midland Forest Re: [MYSTARA] - Gazetteer Re: [MYSTARA] - Human races in D&D was (Re: Midland Forest) ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Tue, 09 Jun 1998 07:29:18 PDT From: "paul dooley" Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Midland Forest >I don't really like the idea of Mystara having one organization of Druids >with a grand druid superior to all druids on the planet. Rather I think there should be several Druidic organizations, each with their own hierarchy. I agre, IMC there are the dryad/treant alliance, various Balancers (druids who follow Immortals or clerics whose patron gives druidlike abilities) and several different groups of Druids (including one group who have gained the sponsorship of Mystara`s Megalith URT) <;-P ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 09 Jun 1998 07:32:38 PDT From: "paul dooley" Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - MYSTARA - Immortals >I think Etienne can make convincing suggestions in the Council even without >the voting points. And him being Rad he can influence the whole course of >Glantri through his Shepherds. But why not have as much chance as possible to get your own way. Glantri seems to be where the action is so get as big a slice as possible (just like Triple choc mud cake) <;-P ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 09 Jun 1998 07:35:31 PDT From: "paul dooley" Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Mystara without Ethengar? >Mongols moving through Persia to destroy Baghdad... Ethengars moving through >Darokin to destroy Ylaruam... So thats what the Makastani (excuse spelling if wrong) have been up to all this time. Talk about thinking ahead! <;-P ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 09 Jun 1998 07:48:35 PDT From: "paul dooley" Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Magical Parrying >Anyone have any comments? >AC IIRC there is some stuff in the high level campaign book about this. Yet another thing that I havent had time to read through properly. <;-p ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 09 Jun 1998 07:55:00 PDT From: "paul dooley" Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - The NoS and Entropy >But the energy drain has nothing to do with adding negatives. You aren't >subtracting from entropy, you are draining. The absolute amount of Entropy >lessens under a draining effect whether or not it's negative energy. >-Inconu Great Scott someone actually agrees with me! I`m no longer a lone voice out in the wilderness. The revolution has begun?? ERROR. Redo from Start!! <;-P ttfn, Paul ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 09 Jun 1998 08:03:32 PDT From: "paul dooley" Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Principium, Propostitium and no other big >>The Sphere of Propostitium doesn't actually exist (or if it does, there >>are no Immortals for it). It is hypothesised to be the Sphere of the Positive >>Material Plane, the Sphere of life, healing, and sustenance. Are there no new ideas under the sun? ive been basing my campaigns on just such an idea for over a decade. Its all finally coming together now as one group is getting close to Immortality <;-P ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 9 Jun 1998 11:13:34 -0400 (EDT) From: Mischa E Gelman Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - (Hominid) Races in D&D? Pierre Savoie wrote, >Well, if truth be told, the Egyptians who built the great empires were lighter-skinned than the Arabs you see now. I guess you learn something new every day. And now that I look at the desc of her in the book (and I assume that's who the cover portrays), it mentions fair skin. An error in the other direction for once by TSR's group of poor artists. (WAY OFF-TOPIC:for wonderful fantasy art, check out the works of Michael Whelan, who did the covers for Memory, Sorrow and Thorn) >There is a poisonous doctrine going around called Afrocentrism >The Upstream academic Web-site displays those academics willing to swim "upstream" from Political Correctness. Actually, tons of academics hate Afrocentrism and Eurocentrism and any belief that claims one culture is superior. Another fine book on the topic is "Not out of Africa:how Afrocentrism became an excuse to teach myth as history" by Mary Lefkowitz. In my sociology text from last semester, there were alot more academic articles debunking Afrocentrism than celebrating it. And this book was definitely upstream scholarly stuff and hardly racist in tone either. >But if history doesn't include them in a setting, why should TSR? History includes people of color in all settings. It's just that our Eurocentric history (and Eurocentrism is as dangerous as Afrocentrism) has ignored them until recently. I am glad that TSR put the Atraughin Clans, the Tanagoroan Plainsmen, Oltecs, Azcans, Jennite horse-archers, Pearl Islanders, the Ethengar Khanate and similar areas in their world. Considering every historical European civilization is represented, it only makes sense. >If you ask me, TSR did the right thing by putting Black societies far away in Mystara or the Hollow World. Far away? They're right out there. Unlike Dragonlance or FR, wherein they are buried off to the side. >It would have only highlighted the fragmentation into 1,200 languages, the lack of the wheel, beasts of burden, or writing in the real historical African societies And historical Europe didn't have the same language fragmentation??? Unlike modern French or German, which are wide-spoken, language changed every few miles as one community was isolated from the next. This is more than the simple difference between English and Texan..this is a whole difference in language. As for 'lack of writing', one of the greatest areas for scholarship in the primitive world was in Timbuktu. Perhaps some historical African societies lacked writing, but I doubt literacy was rampant in historical Europe or Asia or America. >how easily conquerable they would have been with the help of those mysterious iinventions. Err?? Port-au-Prince resident on the economic miracle of Papa Doc's rule: "He has taught us to live without money and eat without food. No, that's not all. Duvalier has taught us to live without life." *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 9 Jun 1998 12:54:01 EDT From: JamugaKhan@aol.com Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - The NoS and Entropy << So we have the NoS draining energy from Entropy but AIDING Entropy as much as it aided Energy and now CotS working for Energy which re-balances the forces on Mystara. >> But the magic is still vanishing from Mystara? Jamuga Khan "Hear and obey, because the Mighty Khan's word is law." *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 09 Jun 1998 12:18:35 +0000 From: Mike Miller Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - (Hominid) Races in D&D? Pierre Savoie wrote: >>Date: Mon, 8 Jun 1998 10:43:47 -0400 (EDT) From: Mischa E Gelman Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Jenni's Monumental Memo of Mystara >>And for gosh sakes make people the proper skin color. TSR has this nasty habit of making everyone white. The only exception I can think of off the top of my head is the HW boxed set where the Nithian queen has a reasonable skin tone. For really funny examples of bad TSR art, check out >Well, if truth be told, the Egyptians who built the great empires were lighter-skinned than the Arabs you see now. They even found one mummy of an Egyptian queen with RED hair. An overdose of henna, perhaps? I don't think so. >There is a poisonous doctrine going around called Afrocentrism, which even goes around claiming that Socrates and Cleopatra (a Macedonian) were Black, but this is handily debunked at http://www.cycad.com/cgi-bin/Upstream/Issues/afroc/index.html The Upstream academic Web-site displays those academics willing to swim "upstream" from Political Correctness. WWe are finding out from the preserved mummies that the truth was closer to THE TEN COMMANDMENTS than the Michael Jackson "Remember the Time" video with celebrity Black actors and basketball stars in it. >>Maquesta Kar-Thon and the first two books of Defenders of Magic in the DL series. All three portray black chars as being white on the cover. It doesn't hurt to reach out to minorities by showing RPGs isn't just a white folks' game (though I have only met one black role-player ever and they are probably less into RPGs at the moment than us whites, attempts should be made to include anyone wwho might buy the product) >But if history doesn't include them in a setting, why should TSR? Egypt, Sumeria, and India were not in the skin-tones we find today. The ROBIN HOOD movie with Kevin Costner and Morgan Freeman was really "reaching", trying to put a Black character in England, and insultingly, the story told through the character's eyes as if he were the only one able to read and write and chronicle the adventure. I also find it odd when seeing any sort of pioneer museum such as one of those "pioneer villages" with Black or Oriental employees; it's ahistorical. It seems offensive to my ancestors who were in homogeneous North American communities since 1642. Some rule against that should be set up to preserve pioneer reality. IIf you ask me, TSR did the right thing by putting Black societies far away in Mystara or the Hollow World. It would have only highlighted the fragmentation into 1,200 languages, the lack of the wheel, beasts of burden, or writing in the real historical African societies, and how easily conquerable they would have been with the help of those mysterious inventions. Thyatian colonies would have been formed on the coast of any such land, building the first cities to be found there. >---Pierre Savoie (ab966@torfree.net) >************************************************************************ I can agree with everything except the workplace. If you do that in the workplace you are discriminating. Mike Miller darkone1@swbell.net *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 09 Jun 1998 12:30:30 +0000 From: Mike Miller Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Magical Parrying Adam Curtis wrote: >I haven't read much about the formal magical duels that take place upon Mystara, but knowing the standard D&D/AD&D magic systems, I imagine they're not often as epic as they should be. >One good spell, and your opponent's toast. Obviously a physical blow can achieve the same instant death effect in real life, but it usually doesn't in D&D (makes for better climax combats). You'd think at least that when mages are duelling, the potential for the "win initiative, instantly kill opponent" would seriously dwindle. >So I started kicking around an idea to lengthen magic duels. GAZ03, *The Principalities of Glantri*, outlines some interesting special skills in its "Complimentary Courses" section. Perhaps an additional course could be something called *Raw Mana Manipulation*. >*Raw Mana Manipulation*, as I've thought of it, would be much less effective than standard magic. After all, mana (or magical energy) simply grabbed and flung isn't nearly as potent when compared with a painstakingly crafted spell designed to utilize mana in supreme efficieny. However, unlike standard magic, *Raw Mana Manipulation* is incredibly flexible and may be used without preparation totalling more than a second or two. >Less importantly, this skill could create all those little magical cantrip effects mages love without having to waste precious spell slots on a cantrip spell. For instance, a mage with mana manipulation could make a simple skill check to create that dramatic small gust of wind that flickers candles when entering a room, make floorboards slightly creak while walking across a normally quiet floor, create a very small flame within his hand to provide some illumination (about as bright as a match), or very slowly (probably making nine or ten skill checks, no need to make them all succeed in a row) alter the blue color of a small object into a green color. >More importantly, a mana manipulator could slightly alter gathered raw mana into a jet of flame or an electrical discharge. Since mana isn't nearly as efficiently consumed in this way as it is in a real spell, its effects would be much weaker. So crude an offensive weapon would perhaps cause 1d4 points of damage per caster level (max 10d4), save v. magic for half. >Most importantly, mana manipulation could "parry" offensive spells thrown at the practitioner through quickly channeling a concentrated beam of raw mana to disrupt the intricate structure of the incoming spell. For instance, someone with mana manipulation could, on a successful skill check, reduce or nullify a fireball just cast at them. >Obviously, so instant a *dispel magic* is way too Date: Tue, 9 Jun 1998 14:21:06 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: phaser.Showcase.MPGN.COM: majordom set sender to owner-mystara-l@ using -f From: (mystara-digest) To: mystara-digest@Phaser.ShowCase.MPGN.COM Subject: mystara-digest V1997 #400 Reply-To: mystara@mpgn.com X-UIDL: cd0e33a1469bd006838f91fd0928a0a0 >powerful, so limitations on the above effect must be made. I'd say a mage with mana manipulation trying to achieve the above dispel effect OR even the cheap magical attack immediately before it, obviously requiring much more effort than moving a little air through a room, would be physically taxing unlike standard spell casting. Therefore, the mage would subtract two points of constitution every time he/she attempted a magical parry or a raw mana attack. If the constitution of the mage ever dropped below 3, he/she'd instantly lose consciousness. Constitution points lost in such a way could only be restored with a heal spell, a wish, or good old rest (at 1 point per hour's rest). >In addition, the mana manipulator must be aware that a spell is being cast against him the instant the casting begins to prepare a quick parry, otherwise he/she won't have enough time to muster enough raw magic. To muster the mana, the mage must remain motionless (no dex bonus to AC during the manipulation) and devote full concentration on drawing in mana. >The parry must also be unleashed within instants of the completion of the offending spell, just before the spell completely "gells" (that'll make this ability useless for dispelling already charmed and/or enchanted beings and/or things). Finally, the mana manipulator may only disrupt spells of a spell level he/she may personally cast. For instance, a mana manipulator capable of casting level 1, 2, and 3 spells, could disrupt a fog wall (level 1 spell), an acid arrow (level 2 spell), and a fireball (level 3 spell), but not an ice storm (level 4 spell). >I know the way I listed the idea isn't concise, nor are all loopholes likely accounted for, nor does the idea of mana manipulation seem at all simple, but the intention of the above rules is to take the bite out of the nastier KO spells used in magic duels, such as fireballs and meteor swarms, in addition to providing a few other cool effects. If the above was revised for clarity and conciseness, I think it'd make a very positive and fun contribution to the D&D/AD&D systems. >Anyone have any comments? >AC >_________________________________________________________ DO YOU YAHOO!? >Get your free @yahoo.com address at http://mail.yahoo.com >*************************************************************************** It sounds great to me! plus it also allows for a quick counter attack while trying to decide what spells to cast. for example... a low level wizard gets ambushed by a group of goblins. he needs a spell quick. while recovering from shock, he sends a small burst of fire at one goblin to make him think about attacking again while he tries to find a way out of this situation. Mike Miller < darkone1@swbell.net > *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 9 Jun 1998 18:37:05 +0100 From: elrond@post.olivant.fo (Jakup Michaelsen) Subject: [MYSTARA] - Gazetteer I was just wondering - How many pages approx. are the Gazetteers? Jakup *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 9 Jun 1998 19:44:42 +0200 (MET DST) From: =?iso-8859-1?Q?H=E5vard_R=F8nne_Faanes?= Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - The NoS and Entropy On Tue, 9 Jun 1998 JamugaKhan@aol.com wrote: >But the magic is still vanishing from Mystara? No. Though, there is disagreement on what effect the NoS has on Entropy, it is clear that NoS no longer drains Energy and thus, the magic level is now stable. The Day of Dread is a result of the final drain of the NoS before the Mysterious Figure(tm) in WotI changed it. G:KoM's references about the Radience draining magic is an error. I am not making this up. That is official. PS: anyone care to write an errata of the AD&D boxed sets? Håvard *** Haavard R. Faanes (hoc@nvg.ntnu.no) http://www.nvg.ntnu.no/~hoc "Every turkey dies. Not all turkeys truly live." -Chef, South Park *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 9 Jun 1998 19:51:58 +0200 (MET DST) From: =?iso-8859-1?Q?H=E5vard_R=F8nne_Faanes?= Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - The NoS and Entropy On Tue, 9 Jun 1998 Inconu@aol.com wrote: >(trying not to be a pain as well) >In my opinion, regardless as to how an individual percieves entropy, the effect doesn't change. It's not necessarily just mathematics. Just the effect of draining alone leads me to my opinions on this matter. This is exactly where I disagree with you. :) The nature of Entropy is very relevant for whether it can be drained or not. IMO all draining furthers the interests of Entropy, even the draining of Entropy itself. According to Bruce, this will result in Entropy evolving an immunity to the drain, and since NoS now produces Entropic Immortals, it will strenghten Entropy. ><< The >Spheres do not represent actual things in this world, but rather their nature. The Draining of Entropy is an event, and is thus affected by Entropy itself. >I don't interpet the action the same way you seem to..... it seems. Unfortunetly this seems to be leading to another "My campaign, Your campaign" debate. I see the trouble of defending someone else's arguement, but i will ultimetly stay along the lines of Entropy being weakend by the drain. Thanks for the insight and ideas anyways Harvard. Thanks. By the way you are misspelling my name. I am not named after any American university :) Håvard *** Haavard R. Faanes (hoc@nvg.ntnu.no) http://www.nvg.ntnu.no/~hoc "Every turkey dies. Not all turkeys truly live." -Chef, South Park *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 9 Jun 1998 18:55:49 +0100 From: "Rob" Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Magical Parrying >I haven't read much about the formal magical duels that take place upon Mystara, but knowing the standard D&D/AD&D magic systems, I imagine they're not often as epic as they should be. Depends what level mage you are talking about. Casting time is extremely relavant in a mage duel. Most mage fights ive seen involve magic missile/burning hands hurling, and moving up the spell levels, simply because if you attempt a higher level spell, you will definitely lose the initiative, thus most likely being disrupted (and fragged, as well.) Upto level 13 this is true. You aint going to go for your disintegrate spell in round 1, with its casting time of six, because the bad guy will go for a magic missile with speed 1 and hit you, making you lose your spell (and some hit points!). Of course, he could have cast shield, so thats when it becomes tactical. At level 14 and higher the Power Words wreck this. With Power Word Stun, its whoever wins the initiative. Even then, thanks to some AD+D spells (contingency silence 15' radius, sound bubble, counterspell immunity, the list is endless) even these spells can be got around to some degree. But if u match two 18th level archmages, dont expect the battle to go on for a long time. 9th level spells are Gross. I wouldnt expect someone to survive when a 9th level spell is cast at him. As it should be, IMHO. Even then the casting time comes in. A Meteor swarm is shite in AD+D, with a casting time of 9. You might as well not bother. Especially if the other guy has a power word, a maze spell, or even a lowly magic missile or flame arrow (does piercing damage as well as fire, no defence!) It so happens that down here we take great pleasure in make believe "character duels". I dont know about you lot, but deep down I everyone around here would like to see if their character could "take" the party. (A lot of fun when a character is dominated by the evil psionicist and set against their mates - oh yes, all players enjoy that...). So we have duels (just a laugh, not serious) just to compare tactics and munchkinness. So in my experience thats the way mage fights turn out... Changing the subject, the finely tuned nature of a magical fight allows me to suggest that a smart mages spellbook is going to have carefully selected spells, that fit perfectly into his overall battle plan. (Some would say "powergamed" at this point). But IMO any mage who may possibly get into a magic fight (remember, mages are smart) will have spent some time deciding on the precise nature of his contingency spell, maintaining his magical defences, and memorising only the best. Joe the Mage knows that if he's caught with his pants down by Fred the Mage, he is but Dust In the Wind (maybe literally!). After all, you wouldnt expect a warrior to walk around in a rusted suit of chainmail with a blunt sword, would you? Mystaras a dangerous place. And Glantri is probably one of the more dangerous places (and we are talking about mages here, right?). Cheerz ROB *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 9 Jun 1998 20:00:55 +0200 (MET DST) From: =?iso-8859-1?Q?H=E5vard_R=F8nne_Faanes?= Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Gazetteer On Tue, 9 Jun 1998, Jakup Michaelsen wrote: >I was just wondering - How many pages approx. are the Gazetteers? around 100 pages IRC. Karameikos has 63, Alfheim has 95. The others are divided into players and DM's section so I'm guessing they contain a few more pages. Håvard *** Haavard R. Faanes (hoc@nvg.ntnu.no) http://www.nvg.ntnu.no/~hoc "Every turkey dies. Not all turkeys truly live." -Chef, South Park *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 9 Jun 1998 19:05:13 +0100 From: "Rob" Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Spelljammer and Mystara (was: Why Mystara?) >I kinda like the idea of Alphatians hopping around to the same worlds but seeing them entirely differently because of the particular methods of travel they use. Sez in Spelljammer that spelljammers are less efficient than planar travel - which is why some races (drow) arent major spelljamming races (always puzzled me about illithids, but anyhow... :). If the Alphatians are skilled in planar magics (and they are, coz otherwise how else did they get to Mystara? Through a magical gate, i believe it hints. Not flying ships) they wouldnt even need spelljammers. Hence they are backward in spelljamming technology, because they have superior modes of transport available to them. They need only military skyships - which need not be interplanetary capable. Cheerz ROB *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 9 Jun 1998 20:11:59 +0200 (MET DST) From: =?iso-8859-1?Q?H=E5vard_R=F8nne_Faanes?= Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Midland Forest On Mon, 8 Jun 1998, SteelAngel wrote: >On Mon, 8 Jun 1998, [iso-8859-1] Håvard Rųnne Faanes wrote: >>there should be several Druidic organizations, each with their own hierarchy. >I beleive each continent has a set of Druids. There is nothing official on this except a few vague references in HW which easily could be ignored. I think even one druidic culture per continet is too few. The Known World druids have no contact with anyone in the midland forest. Neither do the Robrenn Druids of the Savage Coast. The reason why I prefer to keep it that way is information. I do not want people to have too much information about what is going on outside their part of the world. This should apply to the druids as well as others. I also don't like the fact that they all share the same ideology just because they have the same class. Just as there are many types of Clerics, there could be many types of Druids. (IMO) Håvard *** Haavard R. Faanes (hoc@nvg.ntnu.no) http://www.nvg.ntnu.no/~hoc "Every turkey dies. Not all turkeys truly live." -Chef, South Park *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 09 Jun 1998 20:17:24 +0200 From: DM Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Gazetteer At 18.37 09/06/98 +0100, Jakup wrote: >I was just wondering - How many pages approx. are the Gazetteers? The first ones (1-2) are 64 pages long, then all the others are 96 pages. Some have a DM's book and a Player's book, others simply have a leaflet for players to understand what this country is like (general flavour) DM *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 9 Jun 1998 20:20:09 +0200 (MET DST) From: =?iso-8859-1?Q?H=E5vard_R=F8nne_Faanes?= Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Human races in D&D was (Re: Midland Forest) On Tue, 9 Jun 1998, stan wrote: >>From: >>Going back to my idea about forest loving orcs, maybe druidic orcs could do the trick? Orc rangers? We have plenty of human cultures, so why not develope the less developed nonhuman peoples? >I read this after my previous post. Although I said that this sort of thing has been done in Mystara already I agree that more of this sort of thing should be done. Of course we don't have to give everyone earth-based cultures although that is significantly easier given the expanse of human knowledge but some forest loving druidic orcs in the Midland Forest sound like fun. The elves of Mystara might not know about them however. Or else you wouldn't have had elves successively using a rainbow to walk over the top of them. I don't neccesarily think these orcs have to be earth based, even though they have rangers and druids. Actually I would argue that the average Druids and Rangers are far from Earth-based. Anyway, a good idea for making a new culture is to base it on a RW-culture(or even better two, as Galwilyn suggested) and then alter it somewhat as you flesh it out. I think this should be done to both human and non-human cultures. >Hmmm ... let me think ... there's like minded creatures in the forest below us - OK, they're orcs but they love the forest. Will we set the rainbow down here or go on to an area that doesn't have a forest and go to all the bother of creating one? >Hmmm ... have to think real hard about this one. Good point. The Elves probably did not know about them. Perhaps the culture changed a lot since that elven migration. And, it is also possible that Mealiden did not fully master the ways of the rainbow... "How do you stop this darn thing!? Press that blinking button!" Håvard *** Haavard R. Faanes (hoc@nvg.ntnu.no) http://www.nvg.ntnu.no/~hoc "Every turkey dies. Not all turkeys truly live." -Chef, South Park *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ End of mystara-digest V1997 #400 ******************************** *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara' as the body of the message. mystara-digest Tuesday, June 9 1998 Volume 1997 : Number 401 Mystara is a trademark of TSR Inc. All Rights Reserved. The following topics are covered in this digest: Re: [MYSTARA] - Class Kits for the Known World Re: [MYSTARA] - [Mystara] Re: Other places on Mystara Re: [MYSTARA] - Principium, Propostitium and no other big [MYSTARA] - MISC: Second Annual(?) AD&D Sale Re: [MYSTARA] - Gazetteer Re: [MYSTARA] - The NoS and Entropy Re: [MYSTARA] - The NoS and Entropy Re: [MYSTARA] - Principium, Propostitium and no other big Re: [MYSTARA] - Adri Varma Plateau Re: [MYSTARA] - The NoS and Entropy Re: [MYSTARA] - Midland Forest Re: [MYSTARA] - Class Kits for the Known World Re: [MYSTARA] - Magical Parrying Re: [MYSTARA] - Principium, Propostitium and no other big Re: [MYSTARA] - The NoS and Entropy Re: [MYSTARA] - The NoS and Entropy Re: [MYSTARA] - The NoS and Entropy Re: [MYSTARA] - The NoS and Entropy Re: [MYSTARA] - Class Kits for the Known World Re: [MYSTARA] - Adri Varma Plateau Re: [MYSTARA] - The NoS and Entropy Re: [MYSTARA] - The NoS and Entropy Re: [MYSTARA] - The NoS and Entropy [MYSTARA] - Dragons of Mystara - Jaelynix ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Tue, 9 Jun 1998 20:26:24 +0200 (MET DST) From: =?iso-8859-1?Q?H=E5vard_R=F8nne_Faanes?= Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Class Kits for the Known World On Sun, 7 Jun 1998, Galwylin wrote: >Magesmiley@aol.com wrote: >>Hate to say it but kits are one point of AD&D I haven't liked ever. The background and ideas are good, but the extra abilities aren't. IJust my point of view, but kits are one thing I do not want to see on Mystara. >I think others feel that way but I hope we get many Mystaran kits. I play a bladesinger in a game because I like the background (and the name's pretty cool). Just because a kit has extra abilities doesn't mean they have to be used. Or that you can't pick and choose which abilities you do use (just be sure to also pick a disability to balance it out). More Kits. Not all the kits were good. As a matter of fact many of the kits sucked. The main problem was IMO that they were really unbalancing, game machanically-wise. The idea, though, is brilliant. I would love to see someone flesh out some kits specifially for mystara. This will be interesting even for us who do not use AD&D as kits often show more about character types which exist in the setting. I suggest that when making kits, try not to make them too powerful, yet powerful enough to be interesting. Complete Bards handbook is one of the best IMO. Check it out for ideas of what interesting benefits can be like. Håvard *** Haavard R. Faanes (hoc@nvg.ntnu.no) http://www.nvg.ntnu.no/~hoc "Every turkey dies. Not all turkeys truly live." -Chef, South Park *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 9 Jun 1998 20:36:49 +0200 (MET DST) From: =?iso-8859-1?Q?H=E5vard_R=F8nne_Faanes?= Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - [Mystara] Re: Other places on Mystara On Sat, 6 Jun 1998, Galwylin wrote: >Håvard Rųnne Faanes wrote: >>I was thinking that they might be tribal, or something similar. Though I have also been toying with the idea of a culture similar to the greek city states. I see them as a Bronze Age cultue, thus considered barbarians, but with deep knowledge in phisophy, music and poetry. Central in Centaur culture is the Sage. Centaur Sages have a function similar to druids in Celtic myth. They are not part of any tribe/clan and act as judges and councillors, respected by all. I've also been toying with the idea of Oracles, possibly connected with the seers of yavldon? >Sounds good. To follow the mythological history of centaurs, they are sought as teachers? The Oracles are sought out for advice. They predict the future. The Sages are the Teachers. Many centaurs are more concerned with war and hunting than with history and philosphy though >>As for the idea of the cursed ethengars, I was thinking about something similar. I though that these people whom I call Kantahri(from which Centaur is derived) are the descendants of theAfridhi, a nomadic people at the time of blackmoor. These people became so attached to their mounts that they went through a ceremony which merged them completely. Unfortunately, I don't know enough about Mystaras history to flesh this out any further. Any help is appreaciated. >Well, that would take care of where they came from on the evolution standpoint. Have you given any thought to what their magical origins have on them today? When you say druids like Celtic, are you also given the D&D druidic abilities? I think it would be good to get the history of centaurs fleshed out and will see what I can find and help with. Yes. I've been thinking about this link with the Afridhi. I will have to work more on this though. Giving the Sages druidic abilities sounds good. My reference to Celtic druids may have been a bit vague since noone knows exactly what the RW druids were like. But I was thinking a group of well respected well educated sages and judges who do not belong to any clan and are thus not biased towards any clan and respected equally by all. Thanks, Håvard *** Haavard R. Faanes (hoc@nvg.ntnu.no) http://www.nvg.ntnu.no/~hoc "Every turkey dies. Not all turkeys truly live." -Chef, South Park *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 9 Jun 1998 19:55:03 +0100 From: "Rob" Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Principium, Propostitium and no other big - ----->I myself always was intrigued by this idea ever since I read about it on >Estlor's page. While writing my 5th post about Gareth, it occured to me that I could use that idea and turn it into something quite interesting. It hints at their being a positive Sphere in the Red Steel campaign book too. Almost canon... Cheerz ROB *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 9 Jun 98 14:55:47 EDT From: "Emanuel Matos" Subject: [MYSTARA] - MISC: Second Annual(?) AD&D Sale *** Lurker mode off *** To all those on multiple mailing lists, I apologise for the cross-post. Once again I am having a sale of my AD&D stuff. Prices are good as is the quality of what I am selling. PLEASE E-MAIL ME DIRECTLY. DO NOT SEND IT TO THE LIST! Make sure to include "SALE" in the subject line for a faster reply. Everything is for cash only (no trades or exchanges) and is on a first-come, first served basis. Sometimes people do not go through with their purchases, so I will be using a waiting list for all items. Items will be held in reserve for no more than 2 weeks. Surf on to my web site for more details: http:\\lucas.dfl.doc.ca\emoo\sale.htm Thanks! Emanuel E-mail: Emanuel.Matos@space.gc.ca *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 9 Jun 1998 15:13:56 -0400 (EDT) From: SteelAngel Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Gazetteer On Tue, 9 Jun 1998, Jakup Michaelsen wrote: >I was just wondering - How many pages approx. are the Gazetteers? Maybe 70-100.. I don't have any of mine at my apartment right now. Max IV *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 9 Jun 1998 15:16:56 -0400 (EDT) From: SteelAngel Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - The NoS and Entropy On Tue, 9 Jun 1998, [iso-8859-1] Håvard Rųnne Faanes wrote: >before the Mysterious Figure(tm) in WotI changed it. The book said it was an Old One. Plus with XP bonuses like that, it'd better be something world shatteringly powerful! Max IV - Speaking of that, how powerful is an old one? If an Immortal can create and destroy planes at will (except for planes he doesn't own) Can an old one will entire dimensions, or multiverses into being? And destroy gods/immortals/Aos with less than the effort it takes Etienne to cast a spell? *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 9 Jun 1998 21:49:31 +0200 (MET DST) From: =?iso-8859-1?Q?H=E5vard_R=F8nne_Faanes?= Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - The NoS and Entropy On Tue, 9 Jun 1998, SteelAngel wrote: >On Tue, 9 Jun 1998, [iso-8859-1] Håvard Rųnne Faanes wrote: >>before the Mysterious Figure(tm) in WotI changed it. >The book said it was an Old One. Plus with XP bonuses like that, it'd better be something world shatteringly powerful! IIRC the book sais that the Immortals suspect it being an Old One. I'm not sure if I like that explaination, though. That is why I did not use that term. >Max IV - Speaking of that, how powerful is an old one? If an Immortal can create and destroy planes at will (except for planes he doesn't own) Can an old one will entire dimensions, or multiverses into being? And destroy gods/immortals/Aos with less than the effort it takes Etienne to cast a spell? How powerful is God? (Assuming he, /Jahwe/ exists) I think you are close to it. A better explaination is probably more powerful than we can immagine. Infinately powerful. Ifinity is something beyond human grasp. We can express it through mathematics, but we can never hope to understand it. rambling.. Håvard *** Haavard R. Faanes (hoc@nvg.ntnu.no) http://www.nvg.ntnu.no/~hoc "Every turkey dies. Not all turkeys truly live." -Chef, South Park *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 9 Jun 1998 21:51:36 +0200 (MET DST) From: =?iso-8859-1?Q?H=E5vard_R=F8nne_Faanes?= Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Principium, Propostitium and no other big On Tue, 9 Jun 1998, Rob wrote: >----->I myself always was intrigued by this idea ever since I read about it on >>Estlor's page. While writing my 5th post about Gareth, it occured to me that I could use that idea and turn it into something quite interesting. >It hints at their being a positive Sphere in the Red Steel campaign book too. Almost canon... And ofcourse, there is the speculations about the Sphere of Life described in PC1 - Tall Tales of the Wee Folk. Håvard *** Haavard R. Faanes (hoc@nvg.ntnu.no) http://www.nvg.ntnu.no/~hoc "Every turkey dies. Not all turkeys truly live." -Chef, South Park *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 9 Jun 1998 21:53:10 +0200 (MET DST) From: =?iso-8859-1?Q?H=E5vard_R=F8nne_Faanes?= Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Adri Varma Plateau On Sun, 7 Jun 1998 JamugaKhan@aol.com wrote: >I remember vaguely that I've read once that there are "cactus-like treants" living on the Adri Varma Plateau. Can anybody remember that too? If yes, from what source it has originated? Never heard of it before, but that is a cool idea. Worth using :) Håvard *** Haavard R. Faanes (hoc@nvg.ntnu.no) http://www.nvg.ntnu.no/~hoc "Every turkey dies. Not all turkeys truly live." -Chef, South Park *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 9 Jun 1998 16:01:57 -0400 (EDT) From: SteelAngel Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - The NoS and Entropy On Tue, 9 Jun 1998, [iso-8859-1] Håvard Rųnne Faanes wrote: >IIRC the book sais that the Immortals suspect it being an Old One. I'm not sure if I like that explaination, though. That is why I did not use that term. I think that the "Immortals suspect it was" is given to the players at the end of the campaign. But the book clearly defines it to the DM as an Old One (When the XP is given out, it says to the effect that 20000 xp to players who saw the Old one and stayed awake. Since the book defined it in "DM speak" as an Old one, Then I'd assume that it was an Old one. >immagine. Infinately powerful. Ifinity is something beyond human grasp. We can express it through mathematics, but we can never hope to understand it. Probably the reason that the Gold Box referred to reaching Old One status to "Winning the Game" Max IV - How do you win at D&D? Reach Hierarch twice, and find out.. *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 09 Jun 1998 15:01:30 -0500 From: Galwylin Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Midland Forest Håvard Rųnne Faanes wrote: >There is nothing official on this except a few vague references in HW which easily could be ignored. I think even one druidic culture per continet is too few. The Known World druids have no contact with anyone in the midland forest. Neither do the Robrenn Druids of the Savage Coast. The reason why I prefer to keep it that way is information. I do not want people to have too much information about what is going on outside their part of the world. This should apply to the druids as well as others. I also don't like the fact that they all share the same ideology just because they have the same class. Just as there are many types of Clerics, there could be many types of Druids. (IMO) Okay, this is the way I see the druidic society that would allow a single druid over a whole continent. There are many ideologies among druids. In fact, at the higher levels, they have to defeat a druid of the level they hope to advance in. That supports that ideas differ and they're not just ambitious. So the druidic network across a continent could change all the time depending on which group takes the ruling seats. Now the rules for druids in AD&D differ from that view in that the grand druid isn't ever challenged for his position. The grand druid selects his successor. I wouldn't use that approach because the whole society isn't going to change much. The grand druid should be changed as the world changes. Some could be friendly with civilization or fight against it. The Known World and Savage Coast druids would have knowledge of each other but the exchange of information would probably only take place when both have the same outlook. The archdruid would have more knowledge as he's higher up in the network and needs to. Doesn't mean he shares that with others. After all, what's happening in Midland Forest isn't really something they need to be concerned with. So, if an adventurer asked a druid about a far off land, he's no likely to know much more than if there are druids there. In any case, he's also not likely to encourage any expedition to an area that is free of civilization. - -- This has been a Galwylin© Production http://www.airnet.net/galwylin/ galwylin@airnet.net | ICQ #6755972 | AIM: Galwylin *************************************************************************** Date: Tue, 9 Jun 1998 17:40:39 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: phaser.Showcase.MPGN.COM: majordom set sender to owner-mystara-l@ using -f From: (mystara-digest) To: mystara-digest@Phaser.ShowCase.MPGN.COM Subject: mystara-digest V1997 #401 Reply-To: mystara@mpgn.com X-UIDL: 53b4964b8bbf04717c89d41147822dae To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 09 Jun 1998 15:18:08 -0500 From: Galwylin Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Class Kits for the Known World Håvard Rųnne Faanes wrote: >More Kits. Not all the kits were good. As a matter of fact many of the kits sucked. The main problem was IMO that they were really unbalancing, game machanically-wise. The idea, though, is brilliant. I would love to see someone flesh out some kits specifially for mystara. This will be interesting even for us who do not use AD&D as kits often show more about character types which exist in the setting. I suggest that when making kits, try not to make them too powerful, yet powerful enough to be interesting. Complete Bards handbook is one of the best IMO. Check it out for ideas of what interesting benefits can be like. One thing I liked about the kits has more to do with their role in their society or group. I think concentrating on that will develope more acceptable kits. In the article I'm doing on the Order of the Griffon (which DRAGON has expressed interest in. Yea!), I'm hoping to detail a griffon-rider kit. What I'm mainly concentrating on is his role in the Order and hindrances of being a air-born rider (I'm counting the griffon as a big plus). I'm finding that the setup of the PO:S&P book kits more thoughtout than some of the Complete Books. - -- This has been a Galwylin© Production http://www.airnet.net/galwylin/ galwylin@airnet.net | ICQ #6755972 | AIM: Galwylin *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 9 Jun 1998 16:36:08 EDT From: MAESTROPI@aol.com Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Magical Parrying <> i was playing around with the idea of this for a couple of hours, wondering about using this as a type of proficiency, how it could effect gameplay and such. a curiosity question arouse in my mind. would it be totally out of the question for a non-mage to aquire this skill? a high level fighter fighting a high level mage might find it helpfull, allowing him to perhaps go that extra round or two. although i personally would allow the possibility under certain circumstances, i was wondering what others might think. *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 09 Jun 1998 15:36:19 -0500 From: Galwylin Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Principium, Propostitium and no other big This reminds me of AD&D's inner plane setup. You have water (time), air (thought), fire (energy) and earth (matter) with negative (entropy) and positive (principium) poles. - -- This has been a Galwylin© Production http://www.airnet.net/galwylin/ galwylin@airnet.net | ICQ #6755972 | AIM: Galwylin *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 9 Jun 1998 13:38:50 -0700 (PDT) From: Dominique Rivard Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - The NoS and Entropy >On Tue, 9 Jun 1998, SteelAngel wrote: >>On Tue, 9 Jun 1998, [iso-8859-1] Håvard Rųnne Faanes wrote: >>Max IV - Speaking of that, how powerful is an old one? If an Immortal can >>create and destroy planes at will (except for planes he doesn't own) Can >>an old one will entire dimensions, or multiverses into being? And destroy >>gods/immortals/Aos with less than the effort it takes Etienne to cast a >>spell? >How powerful is God? (Assuming he, /Jahwe/ exists) I think you are close >to it. A better explaination is probably more powerful than we can immagine. Infinately powerful. Ifinity is something beyond human grasp. We >can express it through mathematics, but we can never hope to understand >it. I do agree with you Haavard, Old Ones should be too much powerful to be of any interest for us as DMs. If you define what is an Old One, you'll surely find something more powerful that you'll have, again, to define. Kinda going circles... and way from Mystara! == _________________________________________________________ Tharquil's French D&D Homepage at http://www.geocities.com/Area51/Rampart/5201 _________________________________________________________ DO YOU YAHOO!? Get your free @yahoo.com address at http://mail.yahoo.com *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 9 Jun 1998 13:43:07 -0700 (PDT) From: Dominique Rivard Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - The NoS and Entropy - ---SteelAngel wrote: >Probably the reason that the Gold Box referred to reaching Old One status >to "Winning the Game" >Max IV - How do you win at D&D? Reach Hierarch twice, and find out.. Mouhahaha! I didn't remember this one! Hihihihi! Says it All! :o) == _________________________________________________________ Tharquil's French D&D Homepage at http://www.geocities.com/Area51/Rampart/5201 _________________________________________________________ DO YOU YAHOO!? Get your free @yahoo.com address at http://mail.yahoo.com *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 9 Jun 1998 23:02:24 +0200 (MET DST) From: =?iso-8859-1?Q?H=E5vard_R=F8nne_Faanes?= Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - The NoS and Entropy On Tue, 9 Jun 1998, SteelAngel wrote: >On Tue, 9 Jun 1998, [iso-8859-1] Håvard Rųnne Faanes wrote: >>IIRC the book sais that the Immortals suspect it being an Old One. I'm not sure if I like that explaination, though. That is why I did not use that term. >I think that the "Immortals suspect it was" is given to the players at the end of the campaign. But the book clearly defines it to the DM as an Old One (When the XP is given out, it says to the effect that 20000 xp to players who saw the Old one and stayed awake. Since the book defined it in "DM speak" as an Old one, Then I'd assume that it was an Old one. Well, then again the definition of an OO is "something the Immortals do not understand" which would mean that the Mysterious Figure is an OO untill the Immortals figure out what it is. The same way a UFO no longer is a UFO once we recognize it as an Imperial Star Destroyer. This is really just nitpicking. However, I still do not like to have "evidence" that there are higher beings in the Multiverse than the Immortals. Håvard *** Haavard R. Faanes (hoc@nvg.ntnu.no) http://www.nvg.ntnu.no/~hoc "Every turkey dies. Not all turkeys truly live." -Chef, South Park *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 9 Jun 1998 17:27:24 EDT From: Inconu@aol.com Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - The NoS and Entropy << G:KoM's references about the Radience draining magic is an error. I am not making this up. That is official. >> Where was that published? - -Inconu *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 9 Jun 1998 23:27:32 +0200 (MET DST) From: =?iso-8859-1?Q?H=E5vard_R=F8nne_Faanes?= Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Class Kits for the Known World On Sun, 7 Jun 1998, Galwylin wrote: >Here's a short list from the AD&D series of Complete Handbooks that I think would work in eastern Brun (and where). What I really like about these books is that they give you a different interpretation of classes. The NWPs and bonus aren't the best part as much as the ideas a kit can give you. Could anyone make a similar list of the kits from Bards, Rangers, Druids, and Paladins handbook? (and others I may have forgotten?) I'd appreaciate it. Thanks, Håvard *** Haavard R. Faanes (hoc@nvg.ntnu.no) http://www.nvg.ntnu.no/~hoc "Every turkey dies. Not all turkeys truly live." -Chef, South Park *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 09 Jun 1998 23:21:42 +0200 From: Fabrizio Paoli Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Adri Varma Plateau At 05.38 07/06/98 EDT, JamugaKhan@aol.com wrote: II remember vaguely that I've read once that there are "cactus-like treants" living on the Adri Varma Plateau. Can anybody remember that too? If yes, from what source it has originated? I don't remember about "cactus-like-treants", but I do remember that there was a discussion about the Adri Varma Plateau in September 1996.... well, actually I've saved part of it on a disk. In this discussion Bruce Heard told us about "northern saguaros": >But of course, these must be the notorious northern saguaros! (says-he with a straight face). These are the result of a Glantrian agricultural experiment gone astray. These things are like kudzu growing out of control. They have the ability to leach warmth from the sunrays and from hapless creatures wandering nearby. After second thought, Glantrians left their failed experiment to grow there as a deterrent against nomadic incursions and monstrous visits. (Hey, it's fantasy, right!) :) For more about the Adri Varma check the digests of 15-20 September 1996. - -------------- Fabrizio Paoli brizio@lunet.it Home Page: http://www.geocities.com/TimesSquare/Dungeon/4560 - -------------- *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 9 Jun 1998 17:34:25 EDT From: Inconu@aol.com Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - The NoS and Entropy >According to Bruce, this will result in Entropy evolving an immunity to the drain, and since NoS now produces Entropic Immortals, it will strenghten Entropy. Well, so far, Bruce hasn't posted about describing how he believes the immunity will build up. Which is no problem, but it just doesn't make sense to me. Immunities to the NOS wasn't discussed before in anything I've read, and if Entropy could build an immunity up then why couldn't energy? Do you know if Bruce built this idea on published material, or if it was just his hypothesis? >Thanks. >By the way you are misspelling my name. I am not named after any American university :) I apoligize for that.... - -Inconu *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 9 Jun 1998 23:36:24 +0200 (MET DST) From: =?iso-8859-1?Q?H=E5vard_R=F8nne_Faanes?= Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - The NoS and Entropy On Tue, 9 Jun 1998 Inconu@aol.com wrote: ><< G:KoM's references about the Radience draining magic is an error. I am not mmaking this up. That is official. >> >Where was that published? It was clarified by Bruce Heard on the list. Håvard *** Haavard R. Faanes (hoc@nvg.ntnu.no) http://www.nvg.ntnu.no/~hoc "Every turkey dies. Not all turkeys truly live." -Chef, South Park *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 09 Jun 1998 23:33:51 +0200 From: Fabrizio Paoli Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - The NoS and Entropy At 23.02 09/06/98 +0200, Håvard Rųnne Faanes wrote: >Well, then again the definition of an OO is "something the Immortals do not understand" which would mean that the Mysterious Figure is an OO untill the Immortals figure out what it is. The same way a UFO no longer is a UFO once we recognize it as an Imperial Star Destroyer. >This is really just nitpicking. However, I still do not like to have "evidence" that there are higher beings in the Multiverse than the Immortals. Likewise I wouldn't like to have "evidence" that there's an Imperial Star Destroyer orbiting the Earth... :-) *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 09 Jun 1998 16:37:45 -0500 From: Galwylin Subject: [MYSTARA] - Dragons of Mystara - Jaelynix Another dragon for your enjoyment. ***** Jaelynix the Blue Scourge In the Sind Desert between the Twin Oases and Kesret Oases lays the mountainous lair of the old blue dragon Jaelynix. She has controlled the southern mountains and the desert to the south for over 600 years. Only in the last fifty years has she become a threat to the travelers the oases of the southern Sind Desert when she reached an agreement with the Sis'thik in the area. Agreement might not be the correct word as she gave the creatures little choice but to serve her or become an evening meal. Jaelynix was looking to expand her realm sixty years ago. She met with defeat for the first time in her 768 years when she attempted to gain control the Burning Wastes. She was severely injured by a clan of fire giants living in the Wastes and no longer has the use of her left wing. Unable to fly, she has employed the Sis'thik as the guardians of her realm and has them to attack any travelers between the two oasis looking for any artifacts that might help her restore her lost wing. Jaelynix's lair lies at the base of a mountain that overlooks her desert. She has an extremely bad disposition and will destroy any creature that dwells before her after she has lost interest in them. The last contact she has had with any being, besides the Sis'thik, was a large band of adventurers that had hoped to slay her. Alerted to their approach by the watchful Sis'thik, she awaited the fools as the quietly entered her lair. Using her breath weapon from behind an illusionary wall, she decimated the party the waded into the midst of the party slaughtering with tooth and claw. The Sis'thik captured the two that survived the initial attack as they fled. Jaelynix had them skinned and they now decorate her lair's entrance as a macabre sign of welcome. - -- This has been a Galwylin© Production http://www.airnet.net/galwylin/ galwylin@airnet.net | ICQ #6755972 | AIM: Galwylin *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ End of mystara-digest V1997 #401 ******************************** *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara' as the body of the message. mystara-digest Wednesday, June 10 1998 Volume 1997 : Number 402 Mystara is a trademark of TSR Inc. All Rights Reserved. The following topics are covered in this digest: Re: [MYSTARA] - The NoS and Entropy Re: [MYSTARA] - The NoS and Entropy Re: [MYSTARA] - The NoS and Entropy Re: [MYSTARA] - The NoS and Entropy Re: [MYSTARA] - The NoS and Entropy Re: [MYSTARA] - Dragons of Mystara - Jaelynix Re: [MYSTARA] - Dragons of Mystara - Jaelynix Re: [MYSTARA] - Dragons of Mystara - Jaelynix [MYSTARA] - Planning a GAZ Re: [MYSTARA] - Planning a GAZ [MYSTARA] - Arik's Imprisonment Re: [MYSTARA] - Arik's Imprisonment Re: [MYSTARA] - Arik's Imprisonment Re: [MYSTARA] - Arik's Imprisonment Re: [MYSTARA] - Dragons of Mystara - Jaelynix [MYSTARA] - Jenni's Monumental Memo of Mystara Re: Re: [MYSTARA] - Midland Forest Re: [MYSTARA] - Arik's Imprisonment Re: [MYSTARA] - Arik's Imprisonment Re: [MYSTARA] - Magical Parrying Re: [MYSTARA] - Adri Varma Plateau Re: [MYSTARA] - Jenni's Monumental Memo of Mystara Re: [MYSTARA] - CoM, WotI Re: [MYSTARA] - Principium, Propostitium and no other big "P" words was (Re: ... Re: [MYSTARA] - Dragons of Mystara - Jaelynix Re: [MYSTARA] - Planning a GAZ Re: [MYSTARA] - CoM, WotI ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Tue, 9 Jun 1998 17:41:04 EDT From: Inconu@aol.com Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - The NoS and Entropy In a message dated 98-06-09 15:29:59 EDT, you write: << Max IV - Speaking of that, how powerful is an old one? If an Immortal can create and destroy planes at will (except for planes he doesn't own) Can an old one will entire dimensions, or multiverses into being?>> The multiverse is just an experiment created by the old ones. I think that should give a clue as to how powerfull they are. < Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - The NoS and Entropy On Tue, 9 Jun 1998 Inconu@aol.com wrote: >Well, so far, Bruce hasn't posted about describing how he believes the immunity will build up. Which is no problem, but it just doesn't make sense to me. Immunities to the NOS wasn't discussed before in anything I've read, and if Entropy could build an immunity up then why couldn't energy? Do you know if Bruce built this idea on published material, or if it was just his hypothesis? I will let Bruce comment on this himself (if he wishes to do so), but it seemed more Matter of factly than his opinion to me. >>Thanks. >>By the way you are misspelling my name. I am not named after any American university :) >I apoligize for that.... Apology accepted :) Håvard *** Haavard R. Faanes (hoc@nvg.ntnu.no) http://www.nvg.ntnu.no/~hoc "Every turkey dies. Not all turkeys truly live." -Chef, South Park *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 9 Jun 1998 17:46:21 EDT From: Inconu@aol.com Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - The NoS and Entropy << How powerful is God? (Assuming he, /Jahwe/ exists) I think you are close to it. A better explaination is probably more powerful than we can immagine. Infinately powerful. Ifinity is something beyond human grasp. We can express it through mathematics, but we can never hope to understand it. >> I originally thought that a good way to explain their power is to equate it to the power of the DM. They control everything in the game. They have the final say in all outcomes of all instances regardless of the situation. They are responsible for all that exists everywhere. If i decided to create a world near Mystara, as DM, i could. Same with the old ones. The only reason i think old ones aren't as powerfull as the DM...... is because the DM, also controls the old ones. - -Inconu *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 9 Jun 1998 17:53:31 EDT From: Inconu@aol.com Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - The NoS and Entropy << This is really just nitpicking. However, I still do not like to have "evidence" that there are higher beings in the Multiverse than the Immortals. >> I do like it. It shows Immortals like Ixion, that there are others more powerfull than he. In fact, their power dwarf's his. WotI was a learning experience for most of the Immortals in my opinion. Some should be more carefull about thinking that there is no ends to the means they take, just because they are hiearchs or close friends to them. - -Inconu *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 9 Jun 1998 17:55:41 EDT From: Inconu@aol.com Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - The NoS and Entropy >Where was that published? <> .....but he doesn't work for TSR...... - -Inconu *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 9 Jun 1998 23:56:18 +0200 (MET DST) From: =?iso-8859-1?Q?H=E5vard_R=F8nne_Faanes?= Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Dragons of Mystara - Jaelynix On Tue, 9 Jun 1998, Galwylin wrote: >Another dragon for your enjoyment. Another one? Did I miss something? >***** >Jaelynix the Blue Scourge This looks good. Jaelynix sounds like a dangerous girl. What are her goals. To regrow her wing perhaps? So, youre doing a "Wyrms of the North"-serie here on the list, eh? Keep up the good work :) Håvard *** Haavard R. Faanes (hoc@nvg.ntnu.no) http://www.nvg.ntnu.no/~hoc "Every turkey dies. Not all turkeys truly live." -Chef, South Park *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 09 Jun 1998 17:22:57 -0500 From: Galwylin Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Dragons of Mystara - Jaelynix Håvard Rųnne Faanes wrote: >Another one? Did I miss something? The first was Valamaeraen the Bronze. >This looks good. Jaelynix sounds like a dangerous girl. What are her goals. To regrow her wing perhaps? That's her immediant goal. The long range one was to control all of the Sind Desert but now even keeping herself fed takes a bit of know-how. That's one reason she entered into a relationship with the Sis'thik. Repaying the fire giants is another goal. Seems the down-time she has had to experience hasn't helped her mood much ;> >So, youre doing a "Wyrms of the North"-serie here on the list, eh? Keep up the good work :) In a way. I love dragons as I think they are the ultimate foe adventurers face. And if you ever encounter one in my games... well, it would probably be best to keeps those eyes lowered in respect. Look for a red and green soon. Might even work out a gem dragons ;) - -- This has been a Galwylin© Production http://www.airnet.net/galwylin/ galwylin@airnet.net | ICQ #6755972 | AIM: Galwylin *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 09 Jun 1998 18:43:21 -0400 From: Daly Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Dragons of Mystara - Jaelynix At 04:37 PM 6/9/98 -0500, Galwylin wrote: AAnother dragon for your enjoyment. >***** >Jaelynix the Blue Scourge Yes! Sign this man up for the Mystaran Writers! Come join us...interested? I don't know if Polyhedron or Dragon would be interested in the Mystaran dragon...but it is short and I think you might be able to convince them... *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 10 Jun 1998 01:22:05 +0200 From: "=?ISO-8859-1?Q?Andr=E9s_Piquer_Otero?=" Subject: [MYSTARA] - Planning a GAZ Hello, I have thought of writing one Gazetter for the kingdom of Wendar in net-format, as events in that kingdom are being quite important in the last two almanacs. If it went out well, I could go on with the series with Denagoth and Heldann, three missing issues in the GAZ series. The material I have is: 1) Joshuan“s Almanac 2) Mystara Net Almanacs 1014 and 1015 AC (I finally read the whole of it: great piece of work, congratulations to the whole of the Almanac team!!!!!!!!!!) 3) GAZ13 and HW set (for info on other elf types) 4) CM1 (info on Norworld) I sadly lack module X11and Wrath of the Immortals, so I will appreciate any tips and hints on the events there depicted in connection with Wendar, as well as any suggestions for the whole of the document. Following the thread on kits and Mystara, I plan to introduce in this GAZ some new elven kits (in the idea of cultural tips and social factor, not the sher numeric advantages of the Compete Book of... series). Thanks beforehand, Andreas de Skie *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 9 Jun 1998 19:38:42 -0400 (EDT) From: SteelAngel Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Planning a GAZ On Wed, 10 Jun 1998, [ISO-8859-1] Andrés Piquer Otero wrote: >on kits and Mystara, I plan to introduce in this GAZ some new elven kits (in the idea of cultural tips and social factor, not the sher numeric advantages of the Compete Book of... series). Since this is seems a major offering (and not done by those crazed AD&D'ers at TSR ;) Would it be possible to implore you to also put in D&D stats too, for those of us who refuse to upgrade? Thnx :) Max IV *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 09 Jun 1998 18:59:52 -0500 From: Galwylin Subject: [MYSTARA] - Arik's Imprisonment Has it ever been revealed who imprisoned Arik into another dimension? I'm working on an adventure that deals with who imprisoned him and since I haven't found out who this person was yet, I wanted to make sure I wasn't stepping on any official toes ;) - -- This has been a Galwylin© Production http://www.airnet.net/galwylin/ galwylin@airnet.net | ICQ #6755972 | AIM: Galwylin *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 9 Jun 1998 21:04:24 -0400 (EDT) From: SteelAngel Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Arik's Imprisonment On Tue, 9 Jun 1998, Galwylin wrote: >Has it ever been revealed who imprisoned Arik into another dimension? I don't think so. But i would think that it may have been the whole council of Hierarchs, since imprisoning an Immortal isn't exactly taken lightly. Also, could Arik have been a heirarch of Entropy who went WAY out of control? (As in Even Orcus wouldn't touch him.) Max IV *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 9 Jun 1998 18:23:59 -0700 (PDT) From: Dominique Rivard Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Arik's Imprisonment - ---SteelAngel wrote: >On Tue, 9 Jun 1998, Galwylin wrote: >Also, could Arik have been a heirarch of Entropy who went WAY out of control? (As in Even Orcus wouldn't touch him.) WotI defines Arik has an entropic celestial. == _________________________________________________________ Tharquil's French D&D Homepage at http://www.geocities.com/Area51/Rampart/5201 _________________________________________________________ DO YOU YAHOO!? Get your free @yahoo.com address at http://mail.yahoo.com *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 09 Jun 1998 20:49:45 -0500 From: Galwylin Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Arik's Imprisonment SteelAngel wrote: >I don't think so. But i would think that it may have been the whole council of Hierarchs, since imprisoning an Immortal isn't exactly taken lightly. Well, I asked for a meeting between the Hierarchs to discussed this but they seem to be too busy so I'm going without them. They're going to ignore me once too often and I'll demote the whole lot to demi-god status one day! >Also, could Arik have been a heirarch of Entropy who went WAY out of control? (As in Even Orcus wouldn't touch him.) Well, who said anything about Orcus or any other Immortal banishing him, hmm? Maybe his crimes didn't concern anyone but a small group of adventurers. From WotI and B3, seems like its not clear exactly why and how he was banished. Now if anyone has B1-9 could you look on page 47 for more clues? - -- This has been a Galwylin© Production http://www.airnet.net/galwylin/ galwylin@airnet.net | ICQ #6755972 | AIM: Galwylin *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 09 Jun 1998 20:52:25 -0500 From: Galwylin Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Dragons of Mystara - Jaelynix Daly wrote: >Yes! Sign this man up for the Mystaran Writers! Come join us...interested? I looked to see if I could find more information on how this Mystaran Writers works. Guess you'll just have to tell me again as I can't find anything ;) >I don't know if Polyhedron or Dragon would be interested in the Mystaran dragon...but it is short and I think you might be able to convince them... I've got a query in at Polyhedron (as I'm already working on something for Dragon). I'll just have to wait and see, I suppose ;) - -- This has been a Galwylin© Production http://www.airnet.net/galwylin/ galwylin@airnet.net | ICQ #6755972 | AIM: Galwylin *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line Date: Wed, 10 Jun 1998 08:22:49 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: phaser.Showcase.MPGN.COM: majordom set sender to owner-mystara-l@ using -f From: (mystara-digest) To: mystara-digest@Phaser.ShowCase.MPGN.COM Subject: mystara-digest V1997 #402 Reply-To: mystara@mpgn.com X-UIDL: 7c422b031225ce5f3a096f7c00583f55 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 9 Jun 1998 22:14:20 EDT From: Ambreville@aol.com Subject: [MYSTARA] - Jenni's Monumental Memo of Mystara >>Finally: Art. This is very Important. TSR owns a lot of great art, but All Mystara art should be designed especially for Mystara. Every pricture or illustration must show exactly what Mystaran people look like. Any standard fantasy art should be thrown away. [...]<< Håvard Wishful thinking... The acquisition of art at TSR has always been difficult in the past for budget and time limitations. That's why you often see pickup art work its way into various product lines. I agree that appropriate art would be nice, but don't hold your breath. It was pure hell trying to get art from our main contributing illustrator (Fabian, freelancer) for the Gazetteers, especially when other editors "discovered" how cool his stuff was and started ordering art from him as well. Fabian finally retired, taking his unique style along with him. The same can be said of Clyde Caldwell's Gazetteer paintings (who's no longer working with TSR) which were also unique and very specific back then. All this to say -- having dedicated artists, internal illustrators, graphic designers, and mappers whose personal styles permeate a whole line does more for me than different "ethnic" styles for each setting. This is also another limitation to the total number/sized of projects that can be released in a year. >>[...] It gave me the feeling that TSR gave up on the setting before Glantri went to press. A few pictures were good but so many weren't. Art and style should give you a feeling of the people and the country.<< Galwylin How would you paint the cover for "RW-USA" Gazetteer without dropping many flavors that make up with great, big nation? The same can be said of the Glantri Gazetteer -- Glantri is a mosaic of ethnics and eccentricity which cannot be easily portrayed in a single painting. >>Didn't sound friendly and with him mentioning not to post ideas to the list made me think he wasn't too sure if his interpretation of copyright laws would hold up in court. He certainly wasn't confident enough to let it happen and risk a lawsuit. Sounded more like someone needs a course in PR.<< Galwylin On the issue of posting personal material on proprietary web sites: don't post there if the owner declares ownership of posted contents! Why bother with this issue at all? I simply don't post on the net any material for which I want to retain ownership. Bruce Heard *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 9 Jun 1998 23:39:21 EDT From: BoBoII@aol.com Subject: Re: Re: [MYSTARA] - Midland Forest I for one like the idea of a Orcish culture that is Druidical and, thus neutral. I would urge that it be solely Orcish, as some of the humanoids -as - -one- big -lumpy -group approach of Post Thar material I think robs each race of their unique contributions (not sure what they are, but they are there if you hold your nose and look hard enough.) So what I ask of the group, and the Midland Forest Orc fans on the list, is what event or events might have lead the normal "the weak are to be killed and eaten" orcish clan/s to turn to following Druids as their holy men/women. I'm looking for inspired high-fantasy here, Listers. What would that do to them over time. Was it a gradual, voluntary thing or a desperate switch for their own survival. What distinctly "orcish" traits are left over in their society? Maybe, as someone said, they have some of the "darker" elements of Druid/Wise that TSR seems to have left behind. *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 9 Jun 1998 23:49:52 -0400 (EDT) From: SteelAngel Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Arik's Imprisonment On Tue, 9 Jun 1998, Dominique Rivard wrote: >WotI defines Arik has an entropic celestial. Doh. I don't remember reading that at all. Where does it mention Arik? On that note, is there any mention of Haven's Protector? Max IV - Rereading "The Silver Princess" *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 9 Jun 1998 23:52:17 -0400 (EDT) From: SteelAngel Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Arik's Imprisonment On Tue, 9 Jun 1998, Galwylin wrote: >Well, who said anything about Orcus or any other Immortal banishing him, hmm? Well, Orcus is a troublemaker, and he hasn't gotten sent to the Bakka chains yet :D >how he was banished. Now if anyone has B1-9 could you look on page 47 for more clues? IIRC, Nothing there relating to *WHY*, except that Arik (Of the hundred eyes) Was imprisoned because he was pretty bad. Max IV *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 9 Jun 1998 23:55:08 +0000 From: "Mike Harvey" Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Magical Parrying >One good spell, and your opponent's toast. Obviously a physical blow can achieve the same instant death effect in real life, but it usually doesn't in D&D (makes for better climax combats). You'd think at least that when mages are duelling, the potential for the "win initiative, instantly kill opponent" would seriously dwindle. Heh. You should read "The Dying Earth" by Jack Vance. It uses the same style of magic, and duels are over even faster than D&D. I don't think I've seen a duel in any of Vance's works last longer than 1-2 spells... but then Vance's wizards seldom have more than 3-5 spells anyway, so they have to be powerful. Usually it is a threat or bluff from one duellist ("one move and I'll vaporize you")... the defender either escapes or gets vaporized. I never liked D&D magic much until I read Vance. :-) Mike - ---------------------------------------------------------------------- bing@iccom.com (formerly mike@cs.pdx.edu) Mike Harvey HTTP://www.iccom.com/usrwww/bing/home.html Beaverton, Oregon *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 10 Jun 1998 00:31:15 -0700 (MST) From: "Cthulhudrew, The Great Old One" Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Adri Varma Plateau On Tue, 9 Jun 1998, [iso-8859-1] Håvard Rųnne Faanes wrote: >On Sun, 7 Jun 1998 JamugaKhan@aol.com wrote: >>I remember vaguely that I've read once that there are "cactus-like treants" living on the Adri Varma Plateau. Can anybody remember that too? If yes, from what source it has originated? >Never heard of it before, but that is a cool idea. Worth using :) The closest I've ever heard are the (non-sentient) cold absorbing cacti that Bruce Heard proposed once. Perhaps they are Treant-like? Hm... - ------------------------ Cthuludrew, the Great Old One (aka Andrew Theisen, mild mannered *former* college student) "Actions have consequences." URL- http://www.public.asu.edu/~jsmill *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 10 Jun 1998 03:52:19 -0500 From: Galwylin Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Jenni's Monumental Memo of Mystara Ambreville@aol.com wrote: >>>[...] It gave me the feeling that TSR gave up on the setting before Glantri wwent to press. A few pictures were good but so many weren't. Art and style should give you a feeling of the people and the country.<< Galwylin >How would you paint the cover for "RW-USA" Gazetteer without dropping many flavors that make up with great, big nation? The same can be said of the Glantri Gazetteer -- Glantri is a mosaic of ethnics and eccentricity which cannot be easily portrayed in a single painting. I'm not saying a single piece of art should represent a nation (though it can) but that the art in the Glantri set is really bad compared to the Karameikos set. I personally think the art work for the Karameikos box set was superb. Examples of the old style of Karameikan art with the new style was just another reminder that Karameikos was coming from the old into the new (symbolic of the forming of the new nation, I think). Portraits actually looked like they were paintings of real people with irregular facial features (who ever knew the royal family had such large noses?). It all contributed to a nice set that I'm glad to own. The Glantri artwork on the other hand was simply dull. It didn't have any feeling in it at all and symbolized nothing. The portraits seemed cold and lifeless. The cover of the box set was the only interesting piece that said Glantri, I think. The Karameikan set far surpassed the Glantri set in terms of art. It just looked to me that TSR had given up on the line and had the artist to hurry and just send in his sketches. It's really sad too because the artists had a lot to draw from but apparently little time to draw it. I still don't understand why the Karameikos set included the cover of the original Gazetteer on its adventure while the Glantri set used the cover of a Dragonlance book on theirs. Oh well, at least the box set cover was nice. As for a single piece of art representing a nation... for the RW-USA, flying eagles are often used to represent the USA as a whole. Its not the ethnics or eccentricities of America that is focused on, but the freedom and eagles are used to represent it very well. Replace the eagle with magic and the same technique could be used for Glantri. - -- This has been a Galwylin© Production http://www.airnet.net/galwylin/ galwylin@airnet.net | ICQ #6755972 | AIM: Galwylin *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 10 Jun 1998 06:20:31 EDT From: Kaviyd@aol.com Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - CoM, WotI In a message dated 98-06-08 01:41:03 EDT, bing@iccom.com writes: >Does Champions of Mystara have all the Princess Ark material? Or is iit the expedition to the Hollow World? It has much but not all of the Princess Ark material -- but it does have a great deal of information about peoples and nations between the Known World and the Savage Coast. >Does Wrath of the Immortals have generally-useful information about Mystara? I am not especially interested in the immortals themselves or events connected with them (and would in fact probably junk them in favor of my own religious system) but the set may contain other useful information... >From what you are saying it would seem that you would be igoring most of the information in that boxed set, especially if your Clerics are not intended to be followers of specific Immortals (for most players the special abilities of Clerics serving specific Immortals would be the most useful part of this set). About all that might be left for you to make use of would be the descriptions of various planes and dimensions. *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 10 Jun 1998 06:21:03 EDT From: Kaviyd@aol.com Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Principium, Propostitium and no other big "P" words was (Re: ... In a message dated 98-06-09 08:17:47 EDT, shawn@leme.anu.edu.au writes: >The existance of such a sphere is an interesting idea. Sort of like the co- ddiscovery of calculus by Newton and the other guy, Estlor must have used similar logic to yourself with the sphere of Propostitium. An excerpt from Estlor's net book follows - What is the URL for that net book again? *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 10 Jun 1998 12:26:17 CEST From: "Herve Musseau" Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Dragons of Mystara - Jaelynix From: =?iso-8859-1?Q?H=E5vard_R=F8nne_Faanes?= OOn Tue, 9 Jun 1998, Galwylin wrote: >>Another dragon for your enjoyment. >Another one? Did I miss something? I didn't get it either, it probably didn't hit the list. >>***** >>Jaelynix the Blue Scourge > >This looks good. Jaelynix sounds like a dangerous girl. What are her goals. To regrow her wing perhaps? What are her relationship with the Graakalians (okay, spelling probably not correct)? With the humanoids of the Black Mountains that invaded Graakalia? With the Huleans? With Sindhis? ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 10 Jun 1998 12:47:50 CEST From: "Herve Musseau" Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Planning a GAZ From: "=?ISO-8859-1?Q?Andr=E9s_Piquer_Otero?=" II have thought of writing one Gazetter for the kingdom of Wendar in net-format, as events in that kingdom are being quite important in the la= >st >two almanacs. Well, I think Marco is already working on such a Gaz. ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 10 Jun 1998 13:25:00 +0100 From: "Rob" Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - CoM, WotI - - >>Does Champions of Mystara have all the Princess Ark material? Or is iiit the expedition to the Hollow World? >It has much but not all of the Princess Ark material -- but it does have a great >deal of information about peoples and nations between the Known World and the Savage Coast. Is any of the Savage Coast info from CoM available on the Net? As i lack CoM... Cheerz ROB *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ End of mystara-digest V1997 #402 ******************************** *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara' as the body of the message. mystara-digest Wednesday, June 10 1998 Volume 1997 : Number 403 Mystara is a trademark of TSR Inc. All Rights Reserved. The following topics are covered in this digest: Re: [MYSTARA] - Class Kits for the Known World Re: [MYSTARA] - Magical Parrying Re: [MYSTARA] - Gazetteer Re: [MYSTARA] - The NoS and Entropy Re: [MYSTARA] - The NoS and Entropy Re: [MYSTARA] - Human races in D&D was (Re: Midland Forest) Re: [MYSTARA] - Class Kits for the Known World Re: [MYSTARA] - The NoS and Entropy Re: [MYSTARA] - Arik's Imprisonment Re: [MYSTARA] - Principium, Propostitium and no other big Re: [MYSTARA] - The NoS and Entropy Re: [MYSTARA] - Class Kits for the Known World Re: [MYSTARA] - Magical Parrying Re: [MYSTARA] - The NoS and Entropy Re: [MYSTARA] - The NoS and Entropy Re: [MYSTARA] - Arik's Imprisonment Re: Re: [MYSTARA] - Midland Forest Re: [MYSTARA] - Jenni's Monumental Memo of Mystara Re: [MYSTARA] - Human races in D&D was (Re: Midland Forest) Re: [MYSTARA] - Arik's Imprisonment Re: [MYSTARA] - The NoS and Entropy Re: [MYSTARA] - Human races in D&D was (Re: Midland Forest) Re: [MYSTARA] - Human races in D&D was (Re: Midland Forest) Re: [MYSTARA] - Human races in D&D was (Re: Midland Forest) Re: [MYSTARA] - Arik's Imprisonment Re: [MYSTARA] - The NoS and Entropy Re: [MYSTARA] - Human races in D&D was (Re: Midland Forest) [MYSTARA] - Cultural Edifice Complex ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Wed, 10 Jun 1998 13:31:06 +0100 From: "Rob" Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Class Kits for the Known World Could anyone make a similar list of the kits from Bards, Rangers, Druids, and Paladins handbook? (and others I may have forgotten?) Well, I can help u with the Bards book... True Bard Blade Charlatan Gallant (the coolest!) Gypsy bard Herald (James Bard, pretty cool too!) Jester Jongleur Loremaster Meistersinger (the Pied Piper) Riddlemaster Skald Thespian Dwarven Chanter Elven Minstrel Halfling Whistler Trader (from the Red Steel book) Cheerz ROB *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 10 Jun 1998 06:33:13 PDT From: "Tim Ryan" Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Magical Parrying Ok, initial comments. I like the concept, but not the execution. Being a fan of Mage, Ars Magica and suchlike games where duels between mages are epic sights to behold, I agree that the 'fireball, you're dead' tendency isn't as fufilling. However... >*Raw Mana Manipulation*, as I've thought of it, would be much less effective than standard magic. After all, mana (or magical energy) simply grabbed and flung isn't nearly as potent when compared with a painstakingly crafted spell designed to utilize mana in supreme efficieny. However, unlike standard magic, *Raw Mana Manipulation* is incredibly flexible and may be used without preparation totalling more than a second or two. This is somewhat akin to the 'wild mage' rules for AD&D, but even more permissive. Basically, without a spell, the mage can cast burning hands, not a earth-shaking spell, but because it's not a spell, he can use it repeatedly, burning down a village or forest, essentially turning every mage with this into a walking flamethrower. (yes, the 'fatigue' helps, but because D&D doesn't use a fatigue system for anything else, there's nothing wrong with just using it all up, no 'exhaustion penalties', nor should there be, as D&D tries to be _less_ rules intensive.) I agree it would be nice for the effect value (the cantrip stuff you mention, though the color alteration strikes me as asking for trouble, i'm not certain why), but maybe a better solution would be to create a Glantri-specific spell that lets you do X number of 'cool things' (wind, eerie chill, etc.) in a given time limit. This would permit the effects without lending itself to abuse. >Most importantly, mana manipulation could "parry" offensive spells thrown at the practitioner through quickly channeling a concentrated beam of raw mana to disrupt the intricate structure of the incoming spell. For instance, someone with mana manipulation could, on a successful skill check, reduce or nullify a fireball just cast at them. Also leading itself to abuse, and reducing the impact of magic on the game-world (the use of magic in large-scale battle just drops significantly when a few mages in the opposing force with this can just cancel your spells..) >I know the way I listed the idea isn't concise, nor are all loopholes likely accounted for, nor does the idea of mana manipulation seem at all simple, but the intention of the above rules is to take the bite out of the nastier KO spells used in magic duels, such as fireballs and meteor swarms, in addition to providing a few other cool effects. If the above was revised for clarity and conciseness, I think it'd make a very positive and fun contribution to the D&D/AD&D systems. As far as duelling goes, my initial thought would run to a 'duel spell' that would set up an environment (magically, not physically) for a duel, for example allowing you to expend your own spell-levels (from memory) to counter your opponents. The raw-magic parry wouldn't help this much, especially since the 'flamethrower' would be used as a first-strike by a lot, making things even worse (mages get d4 hp/level, the blast does d4/level.. hmm..). >Anyone have any comments? There are a few..=) Tim Ryan ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 10 Jun 1998 06:35:50 PDT From: "paul dooley" Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Gazetteer >I was just wondering - How many pages approx. are the Gazetteers? >Jakup Usually 96 pages split into seperate player and gm info in the later ones, plus aposter sized map and a cover that had some info on it. <;-P ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 10 Jun 1998 06:39:45 PDT From: "paul dooley" Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - The NoS and Entropy >G:KoM's references about the Radience draining magic is an error. I am not making this up. That is official. Is that Official, `tis canon thou decry it at thy peril, or official, `we decided it and we don`t want any arguement? <;-P ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 10 Jun 1998 06:44:43 PDT From: "paul dooley" Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - The NoS and Entropy >Thanks. >By the way you are misspelling my name. I am not named after any American >university :) And why not are you saying that there is something wrong with American `universities` . an OXFORD graduate <;-P ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 10 Jun 1998 06:59:05 PDT From: "paul dooley" Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Human races in D&D was (Re: Midland Forest) >Good point. The Elves probably did not know about them. Perhaps the culture changed a lot since that elven migration. And, it is also possibl= >e >that Mealiden did not fully master the ways of the rainbow... "How do you stop this darn thing!? Press that blinking button!" It is an artifact after all, and I do LOVE the idea of the stuck up elves landing in the wrong place yet again. LONG LIVE KOL (yes I know he`s an elf to but his followers dont!) <;-P ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 10 Jun 1998 07:07:47 PDT From: "paul dooley" Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Class Kits for the Known World >Complete Bards handbook is one of the best IMO. Check it out for ideas of what interesting benefits can be like. God God! we actually agree on something Mystara kits should give you the feel of the character type not just awhole slew of proficiencies for free. I`ve no complaint about free proficiencies if they are balanced by severe requirements such as armour&weapon restrictions AND hardly used proficiencies which Must be taken IE r/w for a fighter is 2 slots so if forced to take it you wont be a blacksmith/armourer/weaponsmith at low level anymore ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 10 Jun 1998 07:11:41 PDT From: "paul dooley" Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - The NoS and Entropy >Max IV - Speaking of that, how powerful is an old one? If an Immortal can >create and destroy planes at will (except for planes he doesn't own) Can >an old one will entire dimensions, or multiverses into being? And destroy >gods/immortals/Aos with less than the effort it takes Etienne to cast a spell? We are all but thoughts in the mind of God or somesuch (FBG) <;-P ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 10 Jun 1998 07:06:57 -0700 (PDT) From: Dominique Rivard Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Arik's Imprisonment - ---SteelAngel wrote: >On Tue, 9 Jun 1998, Dominique Rivard wrote: >>WotI defines Arik has an entropic celestial. >Doh. I don't remember reading that at all. Where does it mention Arik? On that note, is there any mention of Haven's Protector? It's in WotI, just after the complete descriptions of the main immortals, Arik is barely described among the other immortals judged less important that where created in previous D&D stuff. No there's nothing about Haven's Protectors, sorry. == Tharquil's French D&D Homepage at http://www.geocities.com/Area51/Rampart/5201 _________________________________________________________ DO YOU YAHOO!? Get your free @yahoo.com address at http://mail.yahoo.com *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 10 Jun 1998 07:16:15 PDT From: "paul dooley" Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Principium, Propostitium and no other big >And ofcourse, there is the speculations about the Sphere of Life described in PC1 - Tall Tales of the Wee Folk.=20 I knew there was another reason I really liked PC1. It didnt contradict MY ideas as much as some other releases. By the way did any of you find that you would run your own campaign based on what you thought was an obscure bot of Mystaralore only to find that tsr revamped it 6-12 months later? ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 10 Jun 1998 07:19:30 PDT From: "paul dooley" Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - The NoS and Entropy >rambling.. >Haavard Nothing new there then. BITCH MODE EXECUTION TERMINATED!!! <;-P ttfn, Paul P.S. Sorry I couldn`t resist shooting the fish in that barrel ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 10 Jun 1998 07:24:53 PDT From: "paul dooley" Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Class Kits for the Known World >In the article I'm doing on the Order of the Griffon (which DRAGON has expressed interest in. Yea!), I'm hoping to detail a griffon-rider kit I presume youre going to use some of the HW Milenean Empire stuff IIRC there is a griffon rider git for OD&D in either the gaz or adventure. <;-P ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 10 Jun 1998 07:30:54 PDT From: "paul dooley" Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Magical Parrying >i was playing around with the idea of this for a couple of hours, wondering >about using this as a type of proficiency, how it could effect gameplay and >such. a curiosity question arouse in my mind. would it be totally out of the >question for a non-mage to aquire this skill? a high level fighter fighting a >high level mage might find it helpfull, allowing him to perhaps go that extra >round or two. although i personally would allow the possibility under certain >circumstances, i was wondering what others might think. I like this its definately got possibilities. fighter makes prof check round one delays attack round two mage starts casting fighter attacks mage wh Has to stand there or lose his spell, fighter delays this rounds attacks until she sees mage begin to cast in round 3 etc I REALLY like this. will have to reread original posting now to see what I didnt like about it originally. Thankyou for adding to my already huge reading list! <;-P ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 10 Jun 1998 07:35:02 PDT From: "paul dooley" Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - The NoS and Entropy >This is really just nitpicking. However, I still do not like to have "evidence" that there are higher beings in the Multiverse than the Immortals Speak softly, for the Gods are amongst us!( attr. 445bc) <;-P ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 10 Jun 1998 07:49:50 PDT From: "paul dooley" Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - The NoS and Entropy ><> Date: Wed, 10 Jun 1998 12:59:22 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: phaser.Showcase.MPGN.COM: majordom set sender to owner-mystara-l@ using -f From: (mystara-digest) To: mystara-digest@Phaser.ShowCase.MPGN.COM Subject: mystara-digest V1997 #403 Reply-To: mystara@mpgn.com X-UIDL: a84f9609a61d5da6e0c83bbbf61a6503 >.....but he doesn't work for TSR...... >-Inconu Neither do most of us but we seem to be the ones now in control of Mystara. That`s why I argue so much Real people that I can reach are now deciding it`s fate. However they must realise that those of us new to the net don`t neccesrily (HOW do you spell that?) agree with all that they have done upto now, and its a lot easier to argue the point with them . Take the one armed jagger question for example IMC a PC is a supporter of him and this pcs adventuring buddy is a very high level cleric so my PC will offer his friends services either gratis or for some future recompence such as a yes vote when he wants to become a Baron. The problem is in all gameworlds PCs can really alter situations like this so it CAN`T become canon since in many cases it just wont stay that way, and as we go along the `canon` bears lees and lees relevance to our own campaigns. <;-P ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 10 Jun 1998 07:55:05 PDT From: "paul dooley" Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Arik's Imprisonment >Also, could Arik have been a heirarch of Entropy who went WAY out of control? (As in Even Orcus wouldn't touch him.) Nope HE nearly made it to Old ONE status and His lessers blinsided him when he was gonna bring the whole experiment to an end! <;-P ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 10 Jun 1998 08:02:21 PDT From: "paul dooley" Subject: Re: Re: [MYSTARA] - Midland Forest >what event or events might have lead the normal "the weak are to be killed >and eaten" orcish clan/s to turn to following Druids as their holy men/women. Does there have to be a difference at all. Some druids think of all humanoids in the larger sense as anathema to nature and would have no problem with a culture which agressively culls it own kind with a little bit of guidance from the local druidess. You use your magic so that lees feeds more and get willing defenders of your sacred commision. <;-P ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 10 Jun 1998 08:06:02 PDT From: "paul dooley" Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Jenni's Monumental Memo of Mystara >As for a single piece of art representing a nation... for the RW-USA, flying eagles are often used to represent the USA as a whole. Its not the ethnics or eccentricities of America that is focused on, but the freedom and eagles are used to represent it very well. Yet your eagles are onthe endangered list what does that say about the culture? ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 10 Jun 1998 11:19:00 -0400 (EDT) From: SteelAngel Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Human races in D&D was (Re: Midland Forest) On Wed, 10 Jun 1998, paul dooley wrote: >elves landing in the wrong place yet again. LONG LIVE KOL (yes I know he`s an elf to but his followers dont!) <;-P Kol is an Elf? Since when? Or am i missing these major racial transformations somewhere.. Max IV *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 10 Jun 1998 11:20:52 -0400 (EDT) From: SteelAngel Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Arik's Imprisonment On Wed, 10 Jun 1998, Dominique Rivard wrote: >immortals, Arik is barely described among the other immortals judged less important that where created in previous D&D stuff. No there's A ha! Found it. Jeez. Right up there with Usimagaras, and those crazy Cycindeans. (B4 ROCKS!!!!!) >nothing about Haven's Protectors, sorry. She might be another Immortal. Any Ideas? Max IV *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 10 Jun 1998 17:31:15 +0200 (MET DST) From: =?iso-8859-1?Q?H=E5vard_R=F8nne_Faanes?= Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - The NoS and Entropy On Wed, 10 Jun 1998, paul dooley wrote: >>G:KoM's references about the Radience draining magic is an error. I am nnot making this up. That is official. >Is that Official, `tis canon thou decry it at thy peril, or official, `we decided it and we don`t want any arguement? <;-P urk. Maybe that sounded a bit "one-and-holy-canon"-style. I'm not going into that debate since we had a rather heated discussion on this earlier this year. What I meant was that according to Bruce, this was never meant to be in the Glantri box. The reason it ended up there was that the people who made it didn't know much about Mystara. (which resulted in lots of other errors and weird ideas. Jaggar being LE f.eks.) I'm not saying other ideas are not valid. Recent discussions have made me concerned that those of us who have been on the list a while have problems accepting new ideas. This may not be the case, though new people may get that impression. Which is bad. For my own campaign, I use many ideas posted here, even if the contradict published material. As long as I like the ideas. Håvard *** Haavard R. Faanes (hoc@nvg.ntnu.no) http://www.nvg.ntnu.no/~hoc "Every turkey dies. Not all turkeys truly live." -Chef, South Park *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 10 Jun 1998 17:32:40 +0200 (MET DST) From: =?iso-8859-1?Q?H=E5vard_R=F8nne_Faanes?= Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Human races in D&D was (Re: Midland Forest) On Wed, 10 Jun 1998, SteelAngel wrote: >Kol is an Elf? Since when? Or am i missing these major racial transformations somewhere.. According to G:KoM, Kol is a Shadowelf. However, this is not mentioned in later published almanacs. So, pick what you like. I suppose :) Haavard R. Faanes (hoc@nvg.ntnu.no) http://www.nvg.ntnu.no/~hoc "Every turkey dies. Not all turkeys truly live." -Chef, South Park *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 10 Jun 1998 16:33:24 +0000 (GMT) From: Gordon McCormick Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Human races in D&D was (Re: Midland Forest) Max IV wrote: >On Wed, 10 Jun 1998, paul dooley wrote: >>elves landing in the wrong place yet again. LONG LIVE KOL (yes I know he`s an elf to but his followers dont!) <;-P >Kol is an Elf? Since when? Or am i missing these major racial transformations somewhere.. In the later PWA's they list Kol as a Shadowelf, one of the mishapen ones who was left in the tunnels and picked up by Humanoids. Nice idea but I prefer Kol to be a Kobald. I hate the idea of all humanoids being useless...nothing more scary than Orcs once levels come into it...got a 10th level Orc in my Glantri Campaign (actually a sort of ally of the PC's) and he can be downright scary. Which is something humanoids should be able to do IMHO gordon *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 10 Jun 1998 08:39:28 PDT From: "paul dooley" Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Human races in D&D was (Re: Midland Forest) >Kol is an Elf? Since when? Or am i missing these major racial transformations somewhere.. >Max IV He`s a shadow elf who was abandoned due to his deformity thats why hes so good at magic for a gobbo <;-P ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 10 Jun 1998 17:40:21 +0200 (MET DST) From: =?iso-8859-1?Q?H=E5vard_R=F8nne_Faanes?= Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Arik's Imprisonment On Tue, 9 Jun 1998, SteelAngel wrote: >On Tue, 9 Jun 1998, Dominique Rivard wrote: >>WotI defines Arik has an entropic celestial. >Doh. I don't remember reading that at all. Where does it mention Arik? On that note, is there any mention of Haven's Protector? In the "Other Immortals" section (p39). Haven's Protector is Thendara. Thendara is an alias of Ordana (WotI codex p31) Mystaros did a writeup on Arik a few months ago. It may be available on web, at least in the archives. You may find it interesting. Håvard *** Haavard R. Faanes (hoc@nvg.ntnu.no) http://www.nvg.ntnu.no/~hoc "Every turkey dies. Not all turkeys truly live." -Chef, South Park *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 10 Jun 1998 12:30:47 -0400 (EDT) From: SteelAngel Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - The NoS and Entropy On Wed, 10 Jun 1998, [iso-8859-1] Håvard Rųnne Faanes wrote: >other errors and weird ideas. Jaggar being LE f.eks.) ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ Huh? Max IV *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 10 Jun 1998 12:33:05 -0400 (EDT) From: SteelAngel Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Human races in D&D was (Re: Midland Forest) On Wed, 10 Jun 1998, [iso-8859-1] Håvard Rųnne Faanes wrote: >>Kol is an Elf? Since when? Or am i missing these major racial transformations somewhere.. >According to G:KoM, Kol is a Shadowelf. However, this is not mentioned in later published almanacs. So, pick what you like. I suppose :) ACK! Kol is a KOBOLD! Their about as related to SE's as an Orc is. Jeez. where do these people GET these ideas. Kol isn't even an Elven NAME! Chalk up another errata. Max IV *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 10 Jun 1998 12:59:10 -0400 (EDT) From: Pierre Savoie Subject: [MYSTARA] - Cultural Edifice Complex >Date: Tue, 9 Jun 1998 11:13:34 -0400 (EDT) From: Mischa E Gelman Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - (Hominid) Races in D&D? >>But if history doesn't include them in a setting, why should TSR? >History includes people of color in all settings. It's just that our Eurocentric history (and Eurocentrism is as dangerous as Afrocentrism) has ignored them until recently. I am glad that TSR put the Atraughin Clans, Well, such cultures can be safely ignored when there are innovations in Europe which had no counterpart anywhere else, such as the Scientific Method, the invention of an efficient means of trial-and-error invention. If you want to do a history of science, you have no choice but to start in Europe (with a nod to the ancient Greeks as observers and data-recorders, but not methodical hypothesizers). Another thing which originated only in Europe was the deposition of the monarchs and the formation of republics. Self-rule by serfs, imagine that! It only occurred by the expansion of the middle-class: people who developed both comfort and the literate, free flow of ideas, in a way not possible in the socially stratified societies elsewhere (the printing-presses of China, for example, were locked up in the Imperial Courts for their sole use). To try to steamroller the world and pretend history is made equally everywhere is laughable. This is beyond the D&D setting anyway, which is set before gunpowder or any such explosion of innovations. >>It would have only highlighted the fragmentation into 1,200 languages, the lack of the wheel, beasts of burden, or writing in the real historical African societies >And historical Europe didn't have the same language fragmentation??? Unlike modern French or German, which are wide-spoken, language changed every few miles as one community was isolated from the next. This is more Yes, I am aware of the older languages in present-day France such as Picardin, Occitan or Provencal. They were all connected, however, by Latin scholarship, vestige of a far-flung Roman Empire. After the Middle Ages, other languages had a unifying role over a vast area for some sort of scholarly aspect, French for diplomacy, German for science (the Japanese to this day call potassium "karyumu" (Kalium)), and now American for bad rock- videos... >than the simple difference between English and Texan..this is a whole difference in language. As for 'lack of writing', one of the greatest areas for scholarship in the primitive world was in Timbuktu. Perhaps Well, this is a surprising claim. What was this Timbuktu? What survives from it? Why, then, don't we read ancient African philosophers the way we do ancient Greek ones? Without sufficient legacy, it is difficult to believe any story of ancient African grandeur (as distinct from Arab influences). We could tell the Roman Empire existed even if all traces of Latin texts were burned -- because all the old clock-towers in Europe have funny numbers made of I's, V's and X's. What comparable traces are left in Africa of anything? Do tribal chiefs speaking different languages still have badges of office inspired by some pan-African empire? An overzealous invention or promotion of such history is what Afrocentrism is all about; it is a hideous "Edifice Complex" on the part of those with African ancestry. There is by contrast no need to exaggerate the achievements of Western European society, because they are self-evident and in fact central to keeping the world's population alive, fed and healthy. Whew! Nothing much relevant any more to D&D-playing except the idea of lost cultures. It is hinted that the Karameikan society was greater and self-ruling long ago. The Hutaakan culture existed long ago, and characters may come across traces of it in dungeons. Have there been any kinds of adventures where discoveries of ancient cultures and artifacts challenge official truth and put dungeon-explorers at odds with their rulers? Fight Thyatocentrism! :-) - ---Pierre Savoie (ab966@torfree.net) *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ End of mystara-digest V1997 #403 ******************************** *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara' as the body of the message. Date: Wed, 10 Jun 1998 18:44:44 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: phaser.Showcase.MPGN.COM: majordom set sender to owner-mystara-l@ using -f From: (mystara-digest) To: mystara-digest@Phaser.ShowCase.MPGN.COM Subject: mystara-digest V1997 #404 Reply-To: mystara@mpgn.com X-UIDL: 42953b525302d245f4b3a73eff757544 mystara-digest Wednesday, June 10 1998 Volume 1997 : Number 404 Mystara is a trademark of TSR Inc. All Rights Reserved. The following topics are covered in this digest: Re: [MYSTARA] - Human races in D&D was (Re: Midland Forest) Re: [MYSTARA] - Jenni's Monumental Memo of Mystara Re: [MYSTARA] - [Mystara] Re: Almanac Re: [MYSTARA] - [Mystara] Re: Almanac Re: [MYSTARA] - The NoS and Entropy Re: [MYSTARA] - Why the Council of Alphatia is reasonable Re: [MYSTARA] - The NoS and Entropy Re: [MYSTARA] - The NoS and Entropy Re: [MYSTARA] - Arik's Imprisonment Re: [MYSTARA] - Adri Varma Plateau Re: [MYSTARA] - Human races in D&D was (Re: Midland Forest) Re: [MYSTARA] - Human races in D&D was (Re: Midland Forest) Re: [MYSTARA] - The NoS and Entropy Re: [MYSTARA] - Jenni's Monumental Memo of Mystara Re: [MYSTARA] - Human races in D&D was (Re: Midland Forest) Re: [MYSTARA] - Human races in D&D was (Re: Midland Forest) Re: [MYSTARA] - Human races in D&D was (Re: Midland Forest) Re: [MYSTARA] - Arik's Imprisonment Re: [MYSTARA] - Human races in D&D was (Re: Midland Forest) Re: [MYSTARA] - Gazetteer [MYSTARA] - [MYSTARA] Mystara Pics Re: [MYSTARA] - Arik's Imprisonment Re: Re: [MYSTARA] - Human races in D&D was (Re: Midland Forest) [MYSTARA] - Re: Kol Re: Re: [MYSTARA] - Human races in D&D was (Re: Midland Forest) Re: Re: [MYSTARA] - Human races in D&D was (Re: Midland Forest) Re: Re: [MYSTARA] - Class Kits for the Known World Re: [MYSTARA] - The NoS and Entropy [MYSTARA] - Deformed Shadowelves Re: [MYSTARA] - Dragons of Mystara - Jaelynix [MYSTARA] - Ignorant comments regarding American "culture" ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Wed, 10 Jun 1998 10:04:57 -0700 From: "Joe Gerber" Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Human races in D&D was (Re: Midland Forest) - -----Original Message----- From: SteelAngel >On Wed, 10 Jun 1998, [iso-8859-1] Håvard Rųnne Faanes wrote: >>>Kol is an Elf? Since when? Or am i missing these major racial transformations somewhere.. >>According to G:KoM, Kol is a Shadowelf. However, this is not mentioned in later published almanacs. So, pick what you like. I suppose :) >ACK! Kol is a KOBOLD! Their about as related to SE's as an Orc is. Jeez. where do these people GET these ideas. Kol isn't even an Elven NAME! >Chalk up another errata. Actually, IIRC, it was first "revealed" in PWA 3; then continued as "cannon" in Joshuan's Almanac; and *then* mentioned in G:KoM. (As a cheap way of explaining his ability to cast high-level Mage spells.) Joe *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 10 Jun 1998 12:48:15 -0500 (CDT) From: Stephen Dolan Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Jenni's Monumental Memo of Mystara On Wed, 10 Jun 1998, paul dooley wrote: >Yet your eagles are onthe endangered list what does that say about the culture? Actully they just removed them from the endagered list to a threated list or something on that order. :P Steve *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 10 Jun 1998 14:06:20 EDT From: JamugaKhan@aol.com Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - [Mystara] Re: Almanac << I don't believe that's entirely accurate. If i recall correctly, Protius only served before Khoronus' existence. At least that's my impression after reading WOTI. Do you have a reference point for that statement Jamuga? >> Yes, WotI !! I mean the description about Protius. Jamuga Khan "Hear and obey, because the Mighty Khan's word is law." *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 10 Jun 1998 14:06:15 EDT From: JamugaKhan@aol.com Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - [Mystara] Re: Almanac << No really, it's as Jamuga said: Khoronus went back through time to sponsor Protius at the dawn of time. It may seem like a time paradox, but hey it's fantasy. I'm not too sure where this is from, but I guess it's from WotI. >> You're right, but I assume that this a normal thing for Immortals from the Sphere of TIME (!). The same is true for Petra and Vanya. WotI stated that Vanya was Petras sponsor. on first lokk this is surprising for two reasons: Vanya dislikes the Traldar/Milenian culture and she lived her mortal life in the time of the Milenian Empire while Petra was a contemporary of King Milen, the founder of Milenia. But it's reasonable though: First both are women, and Vanya may be a really stupid thing from time to time, but with such macho guys like Rathanos as adversaries it's good to promote more women to be immortals. Second both are members of the sphere of time, and paradoxons are the daily bread of these immortals. Jamuga Khan "Hear and obey, because the Mighty Khan's word is law." *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 10 Jun 1998 14:06:19 EDT From: JamugaKhan@aol.com Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - The NoS and Entropy << But the energy drain has nothing to do with adding negatives. You aren't subtracting from entropy, you are draining. The absolute amount of Entropy lessens under a draining effect whether or not it's negative energy. >> What simply means, that "draining" means to ADD something to this negative force so that the amount of entropy (sum without sign) is smaller than before. Simple maths... Hm, what happens if entropy would reach a positive value? Probably the destruction of the universe. Jamuga Khan "Hear and obey, because the Mighty Khan's word is law." *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 10 Jun 1998 14:06:09 EDT From: JamugaKhan@aol.com Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Why the Council of Alphatia is reasonable << Yes and no. If you look at the CoM Box and look at the Design Book, you'll see the description on Alphatian Windriders. Some have a comment about these types being commisioned by the Imperial Court. So essentially, the Imperial Court would control them. The term "Air Fleet" was used to state a difference between the two services. Had I included both under the singular "Imperial Navy" designation, someone would have pointed out that aspect. Better safe than sorry. >> A difficult thing! The Princess Ark is organized and led according to the standards of the Alphatian Imperial Navy. Jamuga Khan "Hear and obey, because the Mighty Khan's word is law." *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 10 Jun 1998 15:16:37 EDT From: JamugaKhan@aol.com Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - The NoS and Entropy << > But the magic is still vanishing from Mystara? No. Though, there is disagreement on what effect the NoS has on Entropy, it is clear that NoS no longer drains Energy and thus, the magic level is now stable. The Day of Dread is a result of the final drain of the NoS before the Mysterious Figure(tm) in WotI changed it. >> O.k., the NoS drains power from Eentropy. But what's about the Chamber of Stars reactor? Drains it from Energy or from nothing as perhaps no Old One did anything to it (yet)? Jamuga Khan "Hear and obey, because the Mighty Khan's word is law." *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 10 Jun 1998 15:16:38 EDT From: JamugaKhan@aol.com Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - The NoS and Entropy << > Where was that published? It was clarified by Bruce Heard on the list. Maybe we've found an error of Bruce finally. :-) Sorry, Bruce, no insult meant. Jamuga Khan "Hear and obey, because the Mighty Khan's word is law." *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 10 Jun 1998 15:16:39 EDT From: JamugaKhan@aol.com Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Arik's Imprisonment << >Also, could Arik have been a heirarch of Entropy who went WAY out of ccontrol? (As in Even Orcus wouldn't touch him.) Nope HE nearly made it to Old ONE status and His lessers blinsided him when he was gonna bring the whole experiment to an end! <;-P >> Bah, probably he managed it to insult Thanatos AND Hel at the same time by not greeting them on the annual SoE convention. It should be enough to get imprisoned... Jamuga Khan "Hear and obey, because the Mighty Khan's word is law." *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 10 Jun 1998 15:16:34 EDT From: JamugaKhan@aol.com Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Adri Varma Plateau << > > I remember vaguely that I've read once that there are "cactus-like tttreants" living on the Adri Varma Plateau. Can anybody remember that too? If yes, from what source it has originated? The closest I've ever heard are the (non-sentient) cold absorbing cacti that Bruce Heard proposed once. Perhaps they are Treant-like? Hm... >> Too sad. I had hoped that somebody would remember. If I'm entering a delirium tremens, it must be an official source like the Glantri GAZ or CoM. I have searched but I haven't found anything. Jamuga Khan "Hear and obey, because the Mighty Khan's word is law." *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 10 Jun 1998 15:44:43 EDT From: JamugaKhan@aol.com Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Human races in D&D was (Re: Midland Forest) << Kol is an Elf? Since when? Or am i missing these major racial transformations somewhere.. >> SInce one of the PWAs, III probably. In "Orcs of Thar" and "Shadow Elves" was mentioned that the deformed babies are confused with humanoids easily. And now Kol is no longer a kobold, but a Shadow Elf. I don't like it. To be a simple little kobold makes him much cooler. Jamuga Khan "Hear and obey, because the Mighty Khan's word is law." *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 10 Jun 1998 15:44:45 EDT From: JamugaKhan@aol.com Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Human races in D&D was (Re: Midland Forest) << > According to G:KoM, Kol is a Shadowelf. However, this is not mentioned in llater published almanacs. So, pick what you like. I suppose :) ACK! Kol is a KOBOLD! Their about as related to SE's as an Orc is. Jeez. where do these people GET these ideas. Kol isn't even an Elven NAME! >> A real stupid idea. "Orcs of Thar" said that he is a kobold level 20! Kobold are smart and cunning. He NEED not to be a Shadow Elf to be what he is. BTW: Anybody noticed what problems TSR bought when they switched Mystara to AD&D? Beside being level 20 Kol was a wicca/wokani level 5 which means that he is a magic-user. According to AD&D he is a "witch-doctor" and is therefore a CLERIC!!! A humanoid prince in Glantri? O.k.! A cleric prince in Glantri? Unbelievable!!! Jamuga Khan "Hear and obey, because the Mighty Khan's word is law." *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 10 Jun 1998 16:01:52 EDT From: Inconu@aol.com Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - The NoS and Entropy In a message dated 98-06-10 11:04:07 EDT, you write: << ><> >.....but he doesn't work for TSR...... >-Inconu <> The question was to see if this was a canon source or not. <> I don't see what this had to do with my previous comment. It seems like you are questioning something about canonical sources. - -Inconu *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line Date: Wed, 10 Jun 1998 18:44:44 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: phaser.Showcase.MPGN.COM: majordom set sender to owner-mystara-l@ using -f From: (mystara-digest) To: mystara-digest@Phaser.ShowCase.MPGN.COM Subject: mystara-digest V1997 #404 Reply-To: mystara@mpgn.com X-UIDL: 42953b525302d245f4b3a73eff757544 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 10 Jun 1998 16:03:47 EDT From: Inconu@aol.com Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Jenni's Monumental Memo of Mystara << Yet your eagles are onthe endangered list what does that say about the culture? >> It says that you don't understand the analogy. - -Inconu *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 10 Jun 1998 16:04:41 EDT From: Inconu@aol.com Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Human races in D&D was (Re: Midland Forest) << Kol is an Elf? Since when? Or am i missing these major racial transformations somewhere.. He was born a demented-looking shadow elf. Even he doesn't know his true race if i recall correctly. - -Inconu *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 10 Jun 1998 16:08:58 -0400 (EDT) From: SteelAngel Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Human races in D&D was (Re: Midland Forest) On Wed, 10 Jun 1998, Joe Gerber wrote: >Actually, IIRC, it was first "revealed" in PWA 3; then continued as "cannon" in Joshuan's Almanac; and *then* mentioned in G:KoM. (As a cheap way of explaining his ability to cast high-level Mage spells.) Eesh.. That is poor. What, Being Kobold isn't good enough? And that really does kind of contradict the Orcs Gaz a bit. But who cares. IMC he's as Koboldish as they come :) Max IV *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 10 Jun 1998 16:09:49 EDT From: Inconu@aol.com Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Human races in D&D was (Re: Midland Forest) << ACK! Kol is a KOBOLD! Their about as related to SE's as an Orc is. Jeez. where do these people GET these ideas. Kol isn't even an Elven NAME! >> He was thrown out after his birth. So, he was rasied by kobalds. That's how he gets his name and why he acts how he does. He's pure shadow elf blood. - -Inconu *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 10 Jun 1998 16:13:56 -0400 (EDT) From: SteelAngel Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Arik's Imprisonment On Wed, 10 Jun 1998 JamugaKhan@aol.com wrote: >Bah, probably he managed it to insult Thanatos AND Hel at the same time by not greeting them on the annual SoE convention. It should be enough to get imprisoned... I don't think that not greeting Thanatos and Hel is grounds for imprisonment. Of course, managing to destroy a few large, populated planes is.. :) Max IV *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 10 Jun 1998 16:18:56 -0400 (EDT) From: SteelAngel Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Human races in D&D was (Re: Midland Forest) On Wed, 10 Jun 1998 Inconu@aol.com wrote: >He was born a demented-looking shadow elf. Even he doesn't know his true race if i recall correctly. But why tell us if it's not even known to him (or anyone else. who really cares?) Plus, look at his picture in Joshuan's Almanac. I DONT think that SE babies grow up to look like that. Orcs maybe, Trolls maybe (a bit short tho..) RED Orcs maybe.. But little dog faced guys? Bah. That's a load of HooHaa. I have always considered mutant SE's to look like severely facially deformed humans. And Kobolds are a BIT of a stretch. Max IV *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 10 Jun 1998 16:33:10 -0400 From: deg121@psu.edu Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Gazetteer Jakup Michaelsen wrote: >I was just wondering - How many pages approx. are the Gazetteers? >Jakup I think each varied, somewhere between 64 and 128. Dan *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 10 Jun 1998 03:39:22 -0500 From: Allen Barrett Subject: [MYSTARA] - [MYSTARA] Mystara Pics Does anyone know an URL that has .jpg, .gif, or .bmp files that a of a Mystara theme. I'd really like to setup some desktop backgrounds at work to kinda remind me of my obsession. Thanks *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 10 Jun 1998 14:12:48 -0700 (PDT) From: Dominique Rivard Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Arik's Imprisonment - ---SteelAngel wrote: >On Wed, 10 Jun 1998, Dominique Rivard wrote: >>nothing about Haven's Protectors, sorry. >She might be another Immortal. Any Ideas? Correct me if I'm wrong (scenario's at home) , but there are no reference to a specific immortal guarding the Haven. Instead, they refer to many little green men named "protectors", right? If so, I would suggest to make them exalted people. What about something like those presented by Haavard last week perhaps weaker. == Tharquil's French D&D Homepage at http://www.geocities.com/Area51/Rampart/5201 _________________________________________________________ DO YOU YAHOO!? Get your free @yahoo.com address at http://mail.yahoo.com *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 10 Jun 1998 17:28:09 EDT From: BoBoII@aol.com Subject: Re: Re: [MYSTARA] - Human races in D&D was (Re: Midland Forest) In a message dated 6/10/98 11:47:02 AM, Haarvard wrote: < Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - The NoS and Entropy - ---JamugaKhan@aol.com wrote: >Hm, what happens if entropy would reach a positive value? Probably the destruction of the universe. If Entropy is the Void (I mean the void of everything, Matter, Thought, Time and Energy), if there is no more Void, there no more place for Matter to be in. That's the clearer example that I have of this. But I think it demonstrate one possible relation between Entropy and the 4 spheres. They All fit into entropy, without It, they have no more place to exist. So yes it cold be the destruction of the universe. == Tharquil's French D&D Homepage at http://www.geocities.com/Area51/Rampart/5201 _________________________________________________________ DO YOU YAHOO!? Get your free @yahoo.com address at http://mail.yahoo.com *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 10 Jun 1998 15:27:09 -0700 (PDT) From: Dominique Rivard Subject: [MYSTARA] - Deformed Shadowelves What a controversial subject! Well it is clearly indicated in Gaz 10 and in Gaz 13 that some shadowelves are born deformed and that they look like humanoid. It's a pity that it's not mentioned anywhere else but what do you want, we live into an imperfect world, no? But I'll let you argue about Kol (I know that he's a shadowelf IMC ;o), and I'll bring my own subject. Do you remember the originals Beastmen? You know, those without hereditary potential? Could the shadowelves random deformity be somewhat related? == Tharquil's French D&D Homepage at http://www.geocities.com/Area51/Rampart/5201 _________________________________________________________ DO YOU YAHOO!? Get your free @yahoo.com address at http://mail.yahoo.com *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 10 Jun 1998 17:38:00 -0500 From: Galwylin Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Dragons of Mystara - Jaelynix Herve Musseau wrote: >I didn't get it either, it probably didn't hit the list. I guess I had only thought I had sent it since I don't have a copy of the post myself. >What are her relationship with the Graakalians (okay, spelling probably not correct)? With the humanoids of the Black Mountains that invaded Graakalia? With the Huleans? With Sindhis? These questions will have to wait, I'm afraid, as Polyhedron has expressed interest in Jaelynix and Valamaeraen along with the others I'm working on. I'll keep you informed and if they don't make it into print in Polyhedron (hopefully under a Dragons of Mystara title ;) I'll be sure to make them available here. Just to let you all know what I've got going, I'm working of the Order of the Griffon for DRAGON, the Dragons of Mystara for Polyhedron and also an adventure for DUNGEON concerning the banishers of the Immortal Arik. I'm not sure if the Arik adventure can be published there as its rather long (at least what's in my head is) so I may send it to the RPGA instead. - -- This has been a Galwylin© Production http://www.airnet.net/galwylin/ galwylin@airnet.net | ICQ #6755972 | AIM: Galwylin *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 10 Jun 1998 18:45:49 -0400 From: Daly Subject: [MYSTARA] - Ignorant comments regarding American "culture" At 04:03 PM 6/10/98 EDT, Inconu@aol.com wrote: <<< Yet your eagles are onthe endangered list what does that say about the cculture? >> >It says that you don't understand the analogy. Not only that, but to suggest that Canada and America intended to hurt the bald eagle is totally ignorant. Back in the 30s and 40s DDT was used worldwide as a pesticide. The breakdown product, DDE, is what caused a thinning of the bald eagles' eggshells. Since they have a long life and low birthrate, the problem was not seen for a long time. Even after the problem was realized, the CAUSE was not discovered for a good while after that. North America has worked hard to bring the eagle back and it has been taken off the endangered list. Now, if you really want to get into a "my culture is better than yours" debate, we should move the discussion way off this board. It is not appropriate here to insult other cultures. *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ End of mystara-digest V1997 #404 ******************************** *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara' as the body of the message. mystara-digest Wednesday, June 10 1998 Volume 1997 : Number 405 Mystara is a trademark of TSR Inc. All Rights Reserved. The following topics are covered in this digest: Re: [MYSTARA] - Human races in D&D was (Re: Midland Forest) Re: [MYSTARA] - Deformed Shadowelves Re: [MYSTARA] - Greetings to Newbie Re: [MYSTARA] - AntiD&D controversy Re: [MYSTARA] - The NoS and Entropy [MYSTARA] - Meddling in the Affairs of Dragons... [MYSTARA] - Powerful beings Re: [MYSTARA] - AntiD&D controversy Re: [MYSTARA] - Powerful beings Re: [MYSTARA] - Arik's Imprisonment Re: [MYSTARA] - Deformed Shadowelves [MYSTARA] - Kol Re: [MYSTARA] - Deformed Shadowelves RE: [MYSTARA] - Deformed Shadowelves RE: [MYSTARA] - Planning a GAZ + one kit example Re: [MYSTARA] - Powerful beings Re: [MYSTARA] - Arik's Imprisonment [MYSTARA] - Mystara-BoR question Re: [MYSTARA] - Planning a GAZ + one kit example Re: [MYSTARA] - Powerful beings Re: [MYSTARA] - Arik's Imprisonment Re: [MYSTARA] - Deformed Shadowelves ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Wed, 10 Jun 1998 17:52:56 +0000 From: Mike Miller Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Human races in D&D was (Re: Midland Forest) JamugaKhan@aol.com wrote: ><< > According to G:KoM, Kol is a Shadowelf. However, this is not mentioned in lllater published almanacs. So, pick what you like. I suppose :) >ACK! Kol is a KOBOLD! Their about as related to SE's as an Orc is. Jeez. where do these people GET these ideas. Kol isn't even an Elven NAME! >> >A real stupid idea. "Orcs of Thar" said that he is a kobold level 20! Kobold are smart and cunning. He NEED not to be a Shadow Elf to be what he is. >BTW: Anybody noticed what problems TSR bought when they switched Mystara to AD&D? Beside being level 20 Kol was a wicca/wokani level 5 which means that he is a magic-user. According to AD&D he is a "witch-doctor" and is therefore a CLERIC!!! >A humanoid prince in Glantri? O.k.! >A cleric prince in Glantri? Unbelievable!!! >Jamuga Khan >"Hear and obey, because the Mighty Khan's word is law." Actually, witch-doctors are like Cleric-Mages. they have spells of both. Check the Complete Book of Humanoids p79 for more info. Mike Miller < darkone1@swbell.net > *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 10 Jun 1998 18:05:07 -0500 From: Galwylin Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Deformed Shadowelves Dominique Rivard wrote: >Do you remember the originals Beastmen? You know, those without hereditary potential? Could the shadowelves random deformity be somewhat related? A deformed shadowelf mating with a beastman creating the race of kobolds? Anything is really possible since neither have been explained completely ;> - -- This has been a Galwylin© Production http://www.airnet.net/galwylin/ galwylin@airnet.net | ICQ #6755972 | AIM: Galwylin *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 11 Jun 1998 00:13:38 +0100 From: elrond@post.olivant.fo (Jakup Michaelsen) Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Greetings to Newbie Hi Pierre. Well we spell it Fųroyar :-) Actually we're an "independent nation within the Danish kingdom". We govern ourselves, have our own language and culture. But technicaly we belong to Denmark. Not for long though. In a couple of years the Faroe Islands will indeed be a country on it's own. - - "They may take our lives, but they'll never take our freedom!" >That took you a long time! Tibetan monks got their copy before you did. There must be over 300 role-playing games in the English-speaking world alone. There is no problem with availability of the "Advanced" Dungeons & Dragons hardcover book version of the game. :-) But I wanted to start with the first one - the infamous D&D...... Jakup *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 11 Jun 1998 00:13:04 +0100 From: elrond@post.olivant.fo (Jakup Michaelsen) Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - AntiD&D controversy A very interesting thread. All the condemnation against me and our gaming group, is solely due to wrong information and propaganda. Even Dragonraid a Christian rpg went down because of the right people saying the wrong things. Over here the main source of this is Norwegian books. In my church a lot of people read such books, and thus their attitude. Sorry Håvard :-) So here's my question: Should I openly "confess" my hobby? - Is it worth going through all the hassle of explaining all about the game to each person hearing this..? 'Cause that would indeed be necessary. Jakup *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 10 Jun 1998 18:31:47 -0500 From: Galwylin Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - The NoS and Entropy I don't think I look at Entropy and the other spheres the same as most. To me, they are just cliques the Immortals have divided themselves in. One reason is because I don't see anything dividing the spheres in terms of magic used or granted by the Immortals. An Immortal of Matter can manipulate time as easily as an Immortal of Time. Immortals can granted charm spells regardless if they belong to the sphere of Thought or not. Since there is no apparent benefit of belonging to one sphere or the other, I'm not sure if the NoS has the ability to drain any of them (especially a sphere that is nothing). Is there any better explaination of the spheres than the Immortal rules and WotI? They seem like rules for meta-physical ideas that can't be explained with five spheres. In fact, it reminds me of the ancient idea that all matter is composed of a combination of fire, earth, water and air atoms :) - -- This has been a Galwylin© Production http://www.airnet.net/galwylin/ galwylin@airnet.net | ICQ #6755972 | AIM: Galwylin *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 10 Jun 1998 16:54:39 -0700 From: "Jenni A. M. Merrifield" Subject: [MYSTARA] - Meddling in the Affairs of Dragons... Mystarans: Sorry about this 'Sorta' off topic post, but I saw this in somebody else's signature file and thought that, what with the recent post by Galwylin, the list membership might appreciate it. Hope at least some of you get a chuckle out of it. ;-) Jenni PS: I've removed the original 'owners' name and e-dress for privacy reasons. - ------------------------------------------------------------------- |\___/| Do not meddle in the affairs of dragons, __/ O O\ 'cuz you are crunchy and taste good with ketchup. _\/ \ \ _\/ '@___@ -+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+- _\/ |U \/ | Someone Else - someone@somewhere.com - ------------------------------------------------------------------- - -- Jenni A. M. Merrifield http://www.jamm.com/jenni/home.html - -=> strawberryJAMM <=- strawberry@jamm.com *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 10 Jun 1998 19:59:59 -0400 From: David Brian Olsen Subject: [MYSTARA] - Powerful beings >I originally thought that a good way to explain their [Old Ones] power is to equate it to >the power of the DM. They control everything in the game. They have the final say in all outcomes of all instances regardless of the situation. They are responsible for all that exists everywhere. If i decided to create a world near Mystara, as DM, i could. Same with the old ones. The only reason i think old ones aren't as powerfull as the DM...... is because the DM, also controls the old ones. >><> >>.....but he doesn't work for TSR...... >>-Inconu >Neither do most of us but we seem to be the ones now in control of >Mystara. That`s why I argue so much Real people that I can reach are now deciding it`s fate. However they must realise that those of us new to the net don`t neccesrily (HOW do you spell that?) agree with all that they have done upto now, and its a lot easier to argue the point with them . Take the one armed jagger question for example IMC a PC is a supporter of him and this pcs adventuring buddy is a very high level cleric so my PC will offer his friends services either gratis or for some future recompence such as a yes vote when he wants to become a Baron. The problem is in all gameworlds PCs can really alter situations like this so it CAN`T become canon since in many cases it just wont stay that way, and as we go along the `canon` bears lees and lees relevance to our own campaigns. ><;-P So let me get this straight. The "hierachy" for powerful beings goes like this:Mortals Immortals Old Ones DM MML Or did I miss a step in their? :-) - -David *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 10 Jun 1998 18:58:16 -0500 From: Galwylin Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - AntiD&D controversy Jakup Michaelsen wrote: >Should I openly "confess" my hobby? - Is it worth going through all the hassle of explaining all about the game to each person hearing this..? 'Cause that would indeed be necessary. I wouldn't say hide what you do but I personally wouldn't 'confess' anything unless the person wanted to know or expressed an interest. It would be nice if people could enjoy a hobby without having to put up the ideas of people that believe they speak for god, nation and all of humankind on it. Remember, we live in a time where the ones that should be guiding us spiritually are more interested in what we do in our bedroom than if we have a good relationship with god of whatever religion we belong to. My question for all these naysayers of D&D is why have they given up a responsibily of caring for the poor and old and let it fall to governments when the Bible clearly states this is the job of the Church (according to Christian belief) and have instead focused on a game that individuals should only answer to their god about? I wonder how many starving and abused children are passed by the religious on their way to a meeting about the dangers of D&D. Someone needs to be reminded about 'get your own house in order'. - -- This has been a Galwylin© Production http://www.airnet.net/galwylin/ galwylin@airnet.net | ICQ #6755972 | AIM: Galwylin *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 10 Jun 1998 17:59:56 -0600 From: "Leroy Van Camp III" Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Powerful beings David Brian Olsen meandered fecklessly... >So let me get this straight. The "hierachy" for powerful beings goes like >this:Mortals >Immortals >Old Ones >DM >MML >Or did I miss a step in their? :-) So where would the controller of the MML go? Leroy "The Godhead" Van Camp III malacoda@lesbois.com owner-mystara-l@mpgn.com ICQ #4253672 "You know, not kneeing you in the groin is a constant struggle." MST3K *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 10 Jun 1998 20:21:43 -0400 (EDT) From: SteelAngel Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Arik's Imprisonment On Wed, 10 Jun 1998, Dominique Rivard wrote: >refer to many little green men named "protectors", right? If so, I No.. actually in B1-9 (Which i have) It says Thendara is an Immortal. Though why an immortal would call upon 1-3 level mortals is a mystery. Max IV *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 10 Jun 1998 20:25:12 -0400 (EDT) From: SteelAngel Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Deformed Shadowelves On Wed, 10 Jun 1998, Dominique Rivard wrote: >hereditary potential? Could the shadowelves random deformity be somewhat related? Think of the deformity as radioactive mutation. The shadowelves original clan blew up a Blckmoor device (possibly a Chernobyl-like reactor) and were driven underground Max iV *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 10 Jun 1998 20:29:35 -0400 From: David Brian Olsen Subject: [MYSTARA] - Kol >All three PWA's list him as a Kobold. Ijust checked. >He even has gold inlay in his stubby little kobold horns. >He was born a demented-looking shadow elf. Even he doesn't know his true race >if i recall correctly. Maybe we should do a DNA test on him? If the List is even more powerful than the Old Ones it shouldn't be that difficult :-) - -David *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 10 Jun 1998 20:25:12 -0400 (EDT) From: SteelAngel Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Deformed Shadowelves On Wed, 10 Jun 1998, Dominique Rivard wrote: >hereditary potential? Could the shadowelves random deformity be somewhat related? Think of the deformity as radioactive mutation. The shadowelves original clan blew up a Blckmoor device (possibly a Chernobyl-like reactor) and were driven underground Max iV *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 11 Jun 1998 01:47:04 +0200 From: "=?ISO-8859-1?Q?Andr=E9s_Piquer_Otero?=" Subject: RE: [MYSTARA] - Deformed Shadowelves >Dominique Rivard wrote: Date: Wed, 10 Jun 1998 23:09:01 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: phaser.Showcase.MPGN.COM: majordom set sender to owner-mystara-l@ using -f From: (mystara-digest) To: mystara-digest@Phaser.ShowCase.MPGN.COM Subject: mystara-digest V1997 #405 Reply-To: mystara@mpgn.com X-UIDL: 36b7f0548d6a3e1394ce06a087c51acb >>Do you remember the originals Beastmen? You know, those without hereditary potential? Could the shadowelves random deformity be somewhat related? Two examples appear in the HWA series: the two Blood Berthren are suggested to be deformed shadow elves raised by humanoids (and later lured to Thanatos“grasp). Andreas de Skie *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 11 Jun 1998 02:26:26 +0200 From: "=?ISO-8859-1?Q?Andr=E9s_Piquer_Otero?=" Subject: RE: [MYSTARA] - Planning a GAZ + one kit example >>I have thought of writing one Gazetter for the kingdom of Wendar in net-format, as events in that kingdom are being quite important in the lla= >>st >>two almanacs. >Well, I think Marco is already working on such a Gaz. I had no faintest idea; I would not like to intrude in anybody“s area. But I would like to develop my spare time into some kind of project. Could you suggest an area whose GAZ has not been written by TSR or on the web? By this I mean a full-fledged GAZ, with maps, history, society, new rules (in the line of DoE) and artwork. I thought of Wendar because I am starting to develop some D&D kits for elves with some rules in the line of GAZ 13. I will post one example; please give me some feedback on it: PRANKSTER This is the merrymaking elf who loves to live idly in the dark of the forest, feasting, drinking fine wine and playing games of skill, wits and magic with his fellows. One of their favorite hobbies is laying in clearings near paths which are to be travelled by humans and other non-elves. With them they play jokes and sophisticated puns; if the victims are patient, good-hearted or witty, the elves may give them help or a little present (mostly wine and food delicatessen) or some help; otherwise, the foreigners will get a good headache (perhaps being lost or imprisoned for a couple of days). REQUIREMENTS Pranksters follow the basic Elf advancement, HP and ST tables, as well as their spell progression and attack ranks. There is a remarkable difference: any level after level 1, a prankster may choose to gain one level of thieving skills instead of the usual spell advance (hiding, picking items, climbing and so on are vital to carry out a prankster“s jokes). This can be done as often as desired, but: 1) a Prankster cannot attain thieving skills above level 9 ability (by trading all his magic advances excepting level 1) 2) after reaching level 10, the elf can gain any missing spell use advances each time he gets a new attack rank, till he reaches the usual maximum. So, a level 10 prankster can have, for instance, spells as a lvl 6 elf and thieving skills as a lvl 4 thief. He cannot advance further as a thief, but, when he gets to AR A, he will get the spells of a lvl 7 elf, and so on. 3) praksters cannot backstab nor open locks, nor does their detect/ disarm trap skill aply to mechanical traps, but it does to snares, lassos, tripwires, falling logs and the typical traps set on a forest (including trappers“ snares), but they can use their RT to actually SET a trap against intruders or enemies (if they have time and materials). They don“t get the read any language ability at lvl 4. 4) spell choice is limited: it is against the character of a prankster to learn or use spells whose basic aplication is producing directly physical damage. So, they cannot cast Magic Missile or Fireball, but Wall of Fire would be OK (it only causes damage if someone tries to cross the flames). They are required to take at least one spell per level which can be used in jokes: Ventriloquism, Invisibility, Phantasmal Force, Polymorph (self and other), Dimension Door... 5) A prankster must have a DEX of 13 or higher in addition to any other elf requirements 6) Pranksters must choose the following general skills: Tree-Walking, Food Tasting, Deception. 7) Pranksters may be found in nearly anny Known World forest elf community which has contact with other races. Callarii and Vyalia praksters are merry fellows who prey on helpless traders and adventurers in their borders; Wendar ones take a more militant outlook: to show the folly and gullibility of humans before the intellect of elves, their jokes tend to be quite heavy and at times crude or dangerous, especially when dealing with Heldannics; they also act as spies, unsuspectedly gaining information from any traveller in their realm (who would suspect that those little elves who set a snare, caught our party and partaked their wine and jokes with us till everybody got a bit tipsy are reporting every detail of the party to the King?). Erewan and Alfheim have sadly lost their taste for that kind of games, and they do not appear in Belcadiz“s urban culture. 8) They can be of any alignment; Lawful ones want to give lessons anf teach foreigners the ways of the forest; neutrals are interested in protecting their way of life and having a good time; Chaotics are out for pure fun (sometimes a sadistic one) and getting some shiny items in the process. There are rumours of isolated communities of evil prankster elves, who actually steal babies, sour milk and curse crops, besides capturing humans and making them go lost in the forest for half a century. None of this rumours have been confirmed to date. 9) Adventuring pranksters fall in two main types; the first one has annoyed his more serious fellow-elves (hey guy, making the Treekeeper“s robe Invisible during a ceremoy was NOT funny...) and must find **safer lands where his fine wits may prey on. The second has suffered a kind of shock, like his friends being captured or slain by monsters, and now wants to avenge or rescue them, giving some practical use to the skills he learnt in his idle and innocent days in the forest. That is all for now. I hope you find it of any use. Andreas de Skie *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 10 Jun 1998 20:29:46 -0400 (EDT) From: SteelAngel Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Powerful beings On Wed, 10 Jun 1998, Leroy Van Camp III wrote: >>this:Mortals >>Immortals >>Old Ones >>DM >>MML >So where would the controller of the MML go? Somewhere beneath mortals i think :) Max IV - being a bit bratty *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 10 Jun 1998 19:56:31 -0500 From: Galwylin Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Arik's Imprisonment SteelAngel wrote: >No.. actually in B1-9 (Which i have) It says Thendara is an Immortal. >Though why an immortal would call upon 1-3 level mortals is a mystery. Thendara probably was re-conned into an Immortal much the same as Arik was (he was a god before). Why would Thendara call on mortals? Maybe it has something to do with mortals banishing and keeping Arik imprisoned? ;> - -- This has been a Galwylin© Production http://www.airnet.net/galwylin/ galwylin@airnet.net | ICQ #6755972 | AIM: Galwylin *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 11 Jun 1998 03:57:03 +0300 From: "O" Subject: [MYSTARA] - Mystara-BoR question This is a multi-part message in MIME format. - ------=_NextPart_000_00A2_01BD94EC.FE7ADF20 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Hail. I was wondering, does anyone know how many people are part of the = Brotherhood of the Radiance? There should be around 9 or ten... I know = there are at least five... OKS - ------=_NextPart_000_00A2_01BD94EC.FE7ADF20 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Hail.
I was = wondering, does anyone=20 know how many people are part of the Brotherhood of the Radiance? There = should=20 be around 9 or ten... I know there are at least five...
 
OKS
- ------=_NextPart_000_00A2_01BD94EC.FE7ADF20-- *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 10 Jun 1998 20:02:32 -0500 From: Galwylin Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Planning a GAZ + one kit example I like this kit! A few comments... Andrés Piquer Otero wrote: >1) a Prankster cannot attain thieving skills above level 9 ability (by trading all his magic advances >excepting level 1) I like this! >2) after reaching level 10, the elf can gain any missing spell use advances each time he gets a new attack rank, till he reaches the usual maximum. I probably wouldn't allow any retrieval of spell levels. He traded them for thief abilities and so should remain lost to him. >3) praksters cannot backstab nor open locks, nor does their detect/ disarm trap skill aply to mechanical traps, but it does to snares, lassos, tripwires, falling logs and the typical traps set on a forest (including trappers“ snares), but they can use their RT to actually SET a trap against intruders or enemies (if they have time and materials). They don“t get the read any language ability at lvl 4. Goes nicely with the rest of the kit. >4) spell choice is limited: it is against the character of a prankster to learn or use spells whose basic aplication is producing directly physical damage. So, they cannot cast Magic Missile or Fireball, but Wall of Fire would be OK (it only causes damage if someone tries to cross the flames). They are required to take at least one spell per level which can be used in jokes: Ventriloquism, Invisibility, Phantasmal Force, Polymorph (self and other), Dimension Door... Another nice touch. >7) Pranksters may be found in nearly anny Known World forest elf community which has contact with other races. Callarii and Vyalia praksters are merry fellows who prey on helpless traders and adventurers in their borders; Wendar ones take a more militant outlook: to show the folly and gullibility of humans before the intellect of elves, their jokes tend to be quite heavy and at times crude or dangerous, especially when dealing with Heldannics; they also act as spies, unsuspectedly gaining information from any traveller in their realm (who would suspect that those little elves who set a snare, caught our party and partaked their wine and jokes with us till everybody got a bit tipsy are reporting every detail of the party to the King?). Erewan and Alfheim have sadly lost their taste for that kind of games, and they do not appear in Belcadiz“s urban culture. I probably wouldn't include the Vyalia with the Callarii as merry. They strike me as more xenophobic but that may just be my interpretation. All in all, I think its a nicely thought out kit! - -- This has been a Galwylin© Production http://www.airnet.net/galwylin/ galwylin@airnet.net | ICQ #6755972 | AIM: Galwylin *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 10 Jun 1998 22:17:57 -0400 (EDT) From: Shin Chyang Yu Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Powerful beings David Brian Olsen meandered fecklessly... SSo let me get this straight. The "hierachy" for powerful beings goes like >this:Mortals >Immortals >Old Ones >DM >MML >Or did I miss a step in their? :-) Ahh, but if the mortals in Mystara stop believeing in the Immortals, the Immortals will fade, which cause the Old Ones to die, and then we will all cease to exist... :) - -- John Yu, scy2g@virginia.edu | Chief Combustion Engineer UVa, Material Science Dept. | Advanced Materials Specialist IPM Lab | CEA of LNT Committee (804) 984-3789 | -SEMO International Racing Team *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 10 Jun 1998 22:26:21 EDT From: Mystaros@aol.com Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Arik's Imprisonment In a message dated 98-06-09 20:12:18 EDT, you write: << Has it ever been revealed who imprisoned Arik into another dimension? I'm working on an adventure that deals with who imprisoned him and since I haven't found out who this person was yet, I wanted to make sure I wasn't stepping on any official toes ;) This has been a Galwylin© Production >> I did a writeup about Arik and Haven a while back; both are currently on Shawn Stanley's site. It's nothing official, but it all fits in with my Carnifex stuff... Mystaros *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 10 Jun 1998 20:10:11 -0700 (PDT) From: Dominique Rivard Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Deformed Shadowelves - ---SteelAngel wrote: >Think of the deformity as radioactive mutation. The shadowelves original >clan blew up a Blckmoor device (possibly a Chernobyl-like reactor) and were driven underground Sorry, I've made my homework. I'll answer my question and never again (well, never say never) write without proper research first ;o) Seems that there is an explanation for the deformities of the shadowelves after all, in GAZ13 it's mentioned that the deformities are caused by the shadowelves soul crystal and NoS. Just corrupt future life instead of the user's life. == Tharquil's French D&D Homepage at http://www.geocities.com/Area51/Rampart/5201 _________________________________________________________ DO YOU YAHOO!? Get your free @yahoo.com address at http://mail.yahoo.com *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ End of mystara-digest V1997 #405 ******************************** *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara' as the body of the message. mystara-digest Thursday, June 11 1998 Volume 1997 : Number 406 Mystara is a trademark of TSR Inc. All Rights Reserved. The following topics are covered in this digest: Re: [MYSTARA] - Mystara without Ethengar? Re: [MYSTARA] - MYSTARA - Immortals [MYSTARA] - XPs for GPs (was Re: Alphatian Council) RE: [MYSTARA] - Planning a GAZ + one kit example Re: [MYSTARA] - Powerful beings Re: [MYSTARA] - Arik's Imprisonment Re: [MYSTARA] - Powerful beings Re: Re: [MYSTARA] - Human races in D&D was (Re: Midland Forest) Re: [MYSTARA] - Human races in D&D was (Re: Midland Forest) Re: [MYSTARA] - Human races in D&D was (Re: Midland Forest) Re: [MYSTARA] - Human races in D&D was (Re: Midland Forest) Re: Re: [MYSTARA] - Class Kits for the Known World Re: [MYSTARA] - Cultural Edifice Complex Re: [MYSTARA] - Jenni's Monumental Memo of Mystara Re: [MYSTARA] - [MYSTARA] Mystara Pics Re: [MYSTARA] - The NoS and Entropy Re: [MYSTARA] - Arik's Imprisonment Re: [MYSTARA] - Arik's Imprisonment Re: [MYSTARA] - The NoS and Entropy Re: [MYSTARA] - The NoS and Entropy Re: [MYSTARA] - Adri Varma Plateau Re: [MYSTARA] - The NoS and Entropy Re: [MYSTARA] - Jenni's Monumental Memo of Mystara Re: [MYSTARA] - Deformed Shadowelves [MYSTARA] - AN APOLOGY Re: [MYSTARA] - The NoS and Entropy Re: [MYSTARA] - Arik's Imprisonment Re: [MYSTARA] - Meddling in the Affairs of Dragons... Re: [MYSTARA] - Powerful beings ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Thu, 11 Jun 1998 01:20:38 EDT From: Kaviyd@aol.com Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Mystara without Ethengar? In a message dated 98-06-08 18:27:46 EDT, galwylin@airnet.net writes: >Ethengar and Atruaghin are missing those ties or they've not been eexplored yet. So the idea of moving them doesn't seem to mess with the rest of the setting. Ethengar does have ties with its neighbors -- mainly it fights wars with them (in the case of Glantri and the Heldannic Territories) or attempts to subvert them with a strange chaotic cult (Vestland in the Northern Reaches, in one of the X-modules). And Ethengarians seldom visit Rockhome or Ylaruam, the two nations that are the closest to being friendly with Ethengar. I think the idea for trying to evict the Ethengarians from the steppes is a direct result of these conflicts -- but I don't think that the circumstances of the immediate post-Wrath era are favorable to the sort of alliance that would be required to carry out such an operation. Maybe a better idea would be to start playing up the connections between Ethengar and the Northern Reaches so as to explain the growth of the cult of Cretia in Vestland? On the other hand, the Atruaghins are truly isolated -- they are located on an all but inacessible plateau and have a culture and lifestyle that have nothing in common with the rest of the region. At this point it would seem that nearly everyone is satisfied to leave them alone. *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 11 Jun 1998 01:20:47 EDT From: Kaviyd@aol.com Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - MYSTARA - Immortals In a message dated 98-06-09 10:46:02 EDT, ezaqwazy@hotmail.com writes: >But why not have as much chance as possible to get your own way. Glantri sseems to be where the action is so get as big a slice as possible (just like Triple choc mud cake) <;-P But there could be good reasons to refuse added voting power. For example, accepting the charge of Grand Master of the Great School of Magic would give Etienne ten more votes but antagonize Harald Haskinz and his allies -- which would ensure that more than ten votes would be used to shoot down his motions in the Council. Politics, especially in Glantri, is never simple. *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 11 Jun 1998 03:19:06 EDT From: Kaviyd@aol.com Subject: [MYSTARA] - XPs for GPs (was Re: Alphatian Council) Using the rules for buying training that I once used in one of my campaigns, it would not have been possible for a Mage to get from 4th level to 8th level solely by earning a paycheck -- since each level gained would require a combination of adventuring XPs and training XPs, the Mage could well have spent most of his income on training -- but I would have required that he play through at least four adventures -- one per level gained. To count for "adventuring XPs" the adventure would have had to involve a significant level of risk -- no kobold or giant rat hunts! And unless these adventures were assigned as part of the Mage's job, he would probably be unemployed once those adventures were completed. *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 11 Jun 1998 11:01:48 CEST From: "Herve Musseau" Subject: RE: [MYSTARA] - Planning a GAZ + one kit example From: "=?ISO-8859-1?Q?Andr=E9s_Piquer_Otero?=" WWWell, I think Marco is already working on such a Gaz. =20 >I had no faintest idea; I would not like to intrude in anybody=B4s area. = Oh, I didn't say this to detract you from doing it, just mentioning that their is already a group working on such a thing. Maybe you could join them (Marco's address is ). >But >I would like to develop my spare time into some kind of project. Could yo= >u >suggest an area whose GAZ has not been written by TSR or on the web? By this I mean a full-fledged GAZ, with maps, history, society, new rules (i= >n >the line of DoE) and artwork. I thought of Wendar because I am starting t= >o >develop some D&D kits for elves with some rules in the line of GAZ 13. I >will post one example; please give me some feedback on it: >PRANKSTER It's a good kit, a must for Shiye elves of Alphatia and Norwold. ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 11 Jun 1998 06:46:46 EDT From: Inconu@aol.com Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Powerful beings << So let me get this straight. The "hierachy" for powerful beings goes like this:Mortals Immortals Old Ones DM MML Or did I miss a step in their? :-) >> No, I don't think you missed anything. Looks pretty accurate to me. ;) - -Inconu *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 11 Jun 1998 12:43:35 +0100 From: "Rob" Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Arik's Imprisonment >No.. actually in B1-9 (Which i have) It says Thendara is an Immortal. >Though why an immortal would call upon 1-3 level mortals is a mystery. Thendara is another name for Ordana in WotI. *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 11 Jun 1998 12:50:43 +0000 (GMT) From: Gordon McCormick Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Powerful beings >So let me get this straight. The "hierachy" for powerful beings goes like this:Mortals >Immortals >Old Ones >DM >MML >Or did I miss a step in their? :-) >> I notice no players in this setup, maybe that's intentional :) gordon *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 11 Jun 1998 12:58:58 +0100 From: "Rob" Subject: Re: Re: [MYSTARA] - Human races in D&D was (Re: Midland Forest) >In a message dated 6/10/98 3:57:52 PM, the Khan wrote: ><All three PWA's list him as a Kobold. Ijust checked. >He even has gold inlay in his stubby little kobold horns. >BoBo II >PS. so where does it say he's a shadowelf? Any G;KoM owners out there got a page reference? It says hes a shadow elf, but no one (not even himself) knows. He was one of the deformed shadowelves who gets left in some cave when they are babies. He got found by some kobolds, and he joined their tribe. His deformities are so bad that he looks like a kobold, although it says that there are some differerences... Dont know the precise page, and i have lent G:KoM to one of my friends, but its in his description, with the rest of New Kolland. Cheerz ROB *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 11 Jun 1998 05:01:54 PDT From: "paul dooley" Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Human races in D&D was (Re: Midland Forest) >According to G:KoM, Kol is a Shadowelf. However, this is not mentioned in >later published almanacs. So, pick what you like. I suppose :) IIRC it`s also hinted at in Gaz10 Orcs of Thar ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 11 Jun 1998 05:08:29 PDT From: "paul dooley" Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Human races in D&D was (Re: Midland Forest) >.got a 10th level Orc in my Glantri Campaign (actually a sort of ally of the PC's) and he can be downright scary. Which is something humanoids should be able to do IMHO I agree with your scary orc theory but all the Kol thing does is add a little spice if it ever comes out. Which, being Glantri, it`s bound to do <;-P ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 11 Jun 1998 05:13:22 PDT From: "paul dooley" Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Human races in D&D was (Re: Midland Forest) >ACK! Kol is a KOBOLD! Their about as related to SE's as an Orc is.=20 Jeez. where do these people GET these ideas. Kol isn't even an Elven NAME= OOPS!! Did I hit a nerve somewhere? I was just having a bit of fun guys . U know FUN! It`s your game Make of him what you will. <;-P <<<< CLUE! ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 11 Jun 1998 13:22:43 +0100 From: "Rob" Subject: Re: Re: [MYSTARA] - Class Kits for the Known World >Rob , where would some of these bard kits be geographically located? Skaald in >Northern Reaches? Whistler in Shires (only?) >Thanks. >BoBo II >From start to finish... True Bard ("generic" bard, anywhere) Blade (assassin/spy, perhaps Glantri? (effectively a mage assassin) Also the "Fastest Gun in the West" for Cimarron County would most likely be a Blade, shooting guns out of people hands and so on) Charlatan (I like the idea of Darokinian charlatans, but just about in any civilised country) Gallant (Karameikos knights, any Hero type - i like the idea of elven Gallants myself - also Gallants could be a variation on the Swashbuckler, which is a Darokin/Belcadiz/Savage Coast kit). Gypsy bard - this just HAS to be the Traladarans and Boldavians. Herald - Karameikos, Heldannic Territories. They arent just Heralds, they are also orators and spies, so Glantri (theres a Glantrian guild that sounds heraldic to me, the ones with the "Dune" ripoff diamonds on their foreheads). And of course the Bellaynish news reporters from the Company of the Sun... Jester - Jesters are supposed to be panto/mime artists as well, so Nouvelle Averoigne seems appropriate to me. Of course, elven Jesters seem appropriate as well (happy go lucky comedians). And they may be employed by all the monarchs of the KW in their courts. Jongleur - Nouvelle Averoigne again? Juggler/acrobats... i dont know where else you could find them! Loremaster - could be found in any scholastically inclined area. Glantri (of course), Thyatis, and I say Ierendi (Honour Islanders using their knowledge to entertain the tourists!) Meistersinger - these are definitive elven bards. Animal charmers too - the snake charmers of Sind? Riddlemaster - these guys are the Masters of Wit, and as such i consider them to be swashbucklering types again (challenging dragons to riddle contests and that sort of thing!). Also they might be popular in any society where intelligence is considered to be a virtue - Alphatia i would bet on... Defeat your enemies by being smarter than them, rather than spells and swordsmanship! Skald - The Northern Reaches, Eusdria, Klantyre, the Heldannic Territories. Heldannic and Klantyrish Skalds strike me as being rebels against mages/clerics... (I just remember Braveheart, at the end - "they fought like warrior poets, they fought like Scotsmen. And they won their freedom...". Skalds are described as warrior poets... Thespian - Emilio the Great of Karameikos is a Thesp IMC! Seems that the idea of actors and theatre is a Thyatian thing in Mystara. So thats where I would expect Thespians to be found. Also, of course, Bellayne... The dwarven chanter/elven minstrel/halfling whistler are all purely demihuman only. Especially the whistler/chanter. In AD+D dwarves and halflings cannot cast spells, the guys at TSR invented these two kits so that you could play bardic dwarves and halflings. The chanter is the same sort of thing as a Skald, the whistler is pretty odd, IMO. Elves can be bards however. I think the idea of the Minstrel is that its a bard who plays music more as a form of art - a grey elven sort of thing. Erewan I'm sure has lots of Minstrels, singing heartbreakingly beautiful songs describing the slow decline of the Clan of Ellerovyn... Minstrels seem the sort of bards that play golden elven harps... Really, this stuff is all off the top of my head. Bards IMC include Billy Date: Thu, 11 Jun 1998 09:55:21 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: phaser.Showcase.MPGN.COM: majordom set sender to owner-mystara-l@ using -f From: (mystara-digest) To: mystara-digest@Phaser.ShowCase.MPGN.COM Subject: mystara-digest V1997 #406 Reply-To: mystara@mpgn.com X-UIDL: e7d5257307fe61097f5f5390e1af8d94 the Kid (Blade from Cimarron - and PC, sadly to say...:), Emilio the Great (Thespian) and Jean-Luc Deveraux (lupin Gallant - one for all and all for one!). I was disappointed to see Emilio in K:KoA being 0 level human. If anyone on Mystara was going to be a bard, it was him... I guess thats our pals at TSR missing out on a possible D+D/AD+D conversion? That reminds me of King Koryn the Harpist - maybe a bard candidate upon conversion to 2nd ed? Cheerz ROB *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 11 Jun 1998 05:23:55 PDT From: "paul dooley" Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Cultural Edifice Complex >Well, such cultures can be safely ignored when there are innovations in >Europe which had no counterpart anywhere else, such as the Scientific Method, Trust a YANK to ignore the fact that all the european knowledge was based upon Arabic ideas preserved and improved upon whilst europe was in the DARK ages ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 11 Jun 1998 05:26:29 PDT From: "paul dooley" Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Jenni's Monumental Memo of Mystara >Actully they just removed them from the endagered list to a threated list >or something on that order. :P >Steve So there`s now TWO breeding pairs right? <;-P ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 11 Jun 1998 14:33:19 +0200 (MET DST) From: =?iso-8859-1?Q?H=E5vard_R=F8nne_Faanes?= Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - [MYSTARA] Mystara Pics On Wed, 10 Jun 1998, Allen Barrett wrote: >Does anyone know an URL that has .jpg, .gif, or .bmp files that a of a Mystara theme. I'd really like to setup some desktop backgrounds at work to kinda remind me of my obsession. Thanks http://www.geocities.com/Area51/Corridor/4206/ It has most of the pics from the Gaz covers. Håvard *** Haavard R. Faanes (hoc@nvg.ntnu.no) http://www.nvg.ntnu.no/~hoc "Every turkey dies. Not all turkeys truly live." -Chef, South Park *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 11 Jun 1998 05:34:00 PDT From: "paul dooley" Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - The NoS and Entropy >Hm, what happens if entropy would reach a positive value? Probably the destruction of the universe. End of experiment! Redo from start with an alteration of just one thing to see what happens this time perhaps? <;-P ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 11 Jun 1998 14:36:39 +0200 (MET DST) From: =?iso-8859-1?Q?H=E5vard_R=F8nne_Faanes?= Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Arik's Imprisonment On Wed, 10 Jun 1998, Dominique Rivard wrote: >Correct me if I'm wrong (scenario's at home) , but there are no reference to a specific immortal guarding the Haven. Instead, they refer to many little green men named "protectors", right? If so, I would suggest to make them exalted people. What about something like those presented by Haavard last week perhaps weaker. Ordana is the woman you are looking for. I agree that Protectors are probably exalted servants (of Ordana). Any ideas for these creatures other than that they look likle green elves? (hmm..white elves, black elves, green elves? This is starting to soun like Glorantha..) skål! Håvard *** Haavard R. Faanes (hoc@nvg.ntnu.no) http://www.nvg.ntnu.no/~hoc "Every turkey dies. Not all turkeys truly live." -Chef, South Park *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 11 Jun 1998 05:37:31 PDT From: "paul dooley" Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Arik's Imprisonment >Bah, probably he managed it to insult Thanatos AND Hel at the same time by not greeting them on the annual SoE convention. It should be enough to get imprisoned... I like my one better! <;-P ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 11 Jun 1998 14:41:02 +0200 (MET DST) From: =?iso-8859-1?Q?H=E5vard_R=F8nne_Faanes?= Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - The NoS and Entropy On Wed, 10 Jun 1998, SteelAngel wrote: >On Wed, 10 Jun 1998, [iso-8859-1] Håvard Rųnne Faanes wrote: >>other errors and weird ideas. Jaggar being LE f.eks.) >Huh? According to G:KoM Jaggar is Lawful Evil. Most people who were familiar with the original Gaz found this absurd. Håvard *** Haavard R. Faanes (hoc@nvg.ntnu.no) http://www.nvg.ntnu.no/~hoc "Every turkey dies. Not all turkeys truly live." -Chef, South Park *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 11 Jun 1998 05:42:05 PDT From: "paul dooley" Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - The NoS and Entropy >O.k., the NoS drains power from Entropy. But what's about the Chamber of Stars reactor? Drains it from Energy or from nothing as perhaps no Old One did anything to it (yet)? IIRC it hasn`t been cursed the way NoS was, and it isn`t even operational yet so no drain. <;-P ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 11 Jun 1998 05:46:20 PDT From: "paul dooley" Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Adri Varma Plateau >Too sad. I had hoped that somebody would remember. If I'm entering a delirium tremens, it must be an official source like the Glantri GAZ or CoM. I have searched but I haven't found anything. Maybe M5 in new monster section? (actually trying to be helpful) <;-P ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 11 Jun 1998 05:54:21 PDT From: "paul dooley" Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - The NoS and Entropy >I don't see what this had to do with my previous comment. It seems like you >are questioning something about canonical sources. Yep sorry about that I do seem to have totally lost the point there, but I do feel so much better having gotten it off of my chest! <;-P ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 11 Jun 1998 05:55:59 PDT From: "paul dooley" Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Jenni's Monumental Memo of Mystara >It says that you don't understand the analogy. >-Inconu OOOH! YOU BITCH!!! <;-P ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 11 Jun 1998 06:24:23 PDT From: "paul dooley" Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Deformed Shadowelves >Do you remember the originals Beastmen? You know, those without hereditary potential? Could the shadowelves random deformity be somewhat related? Interesting idea. IIrc the deformities are what the curse on CotS is,you get the power,your descendants the problems. This could lead to a counterbalance of the entropy loss from NoS if the deformaties become more widespread. I only threw the Kol comment in for a laugh but it seems that we could get something useful from it after all! BTW I Know this contradicts what I said about CotS in an earlier posting , but I`ve only just remembered it. Anyway consistency is the product of a limited mind! <;-P ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 11 Jun 1998 06:38:11 PDT From: "paul dooley" Subject: [MYSTARA] - AN APOLOGY >Now, if you really want to get into a "my culture is better than yours" debate, we should move the discussion way off this board. It is not appropriate here to insult other cultures. Sorry, that was not my intention at all. My intention was to take a small bit of what was posted, comment on that as if it were canon, and see what reactions occured! I thought that I would just get something back about `how can such a narrow minded jeck come to play rpgs not opposethem` and we`d all laugh it off. Being a member of the RSPB myself I am aware of the great strides being made by many countries to preserve their native wildlife of any sort and I am REALLY sorry that the nly person who saw the irony in this particular posting was me. I`ll try to stick to the subject in future and forget anysort of humour ttfn, Paul ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 11 Jun 1998 06:47:25 PDT From: "paul dooley" Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - The NoS and Entropy >One reason is because I don't see anything dividing the spheres in terms >of magic used or granted by the Immortals. An Immortal of Matter can manipulate time as easily as an Immortal of Time. I`m rather puzzled here, you mention the gold box but seem to ignore the fact that it contained different spells for each Sphere. Yes you can cast spells from another sphere, but at an increased cost. A similar sort of thing happened depending on your sphere in relation to the dominant sphere of the plane that you are within. If you stll have a copy of goldbox look again there is some useful stuff there regarding this. ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 11 Jun 1998 09:47:15 EDT From: JamugaKhan@aol.com Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Arik's Imprisonment << > Bah, probably he managed it to insult Thanatos AND Hel at the ssame time by not greeting them on the annual SoE convention. It should be enough to get imprisoned... I don't think that not greeting Thanatos and Hel is grounds for imprisonment. Of course, managing to destroy a few large, populated planes is.. :) >> But the point is that imprisoning evil immortal for doing evil deeds would mean that the non-evil immortals would have to imprison ALL evil immortals. OTOH a young and evil immortal who accomplishes it to get onto the "white list" of more than one hierarch is a really good candidate for some penalties. Jamuga Khan "Hear and obey, because the Mighty Khan's word is law." *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 11 Jun 1998 06:50:35 PDT From: "paul dooley" Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Meddling in the Affairs of Dragons... Jenni, cheers I liked it. After eating humble pie today just what I needed <;-P ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 11 Jun 1998 06:54:47 PDT From: "paul dooley" Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Powerful beings >So let me get this straight. The "hierachy" for powerful beings goes like >this:Mortals >Immortals >Old Ones >DM >MML >Or did I miss a step in their? :-) >-David YES! for DM read OTHER DM, and beneath MML ie REALLY IMPORTANT ONE insert your OWN NAME whatever that may be! ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ End of mystara-digest V1997 #406 ******************************** *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara' as the body of the message. Date: Thu, 11 Jun 1998 13:09:37 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: phaser.Showcase.MPGN.COM: majordom set sender to owner-mystara-l@ using -f From: (mystara-digest) To: mystara-digest@Phaser.ShowCase.MPGN.COM Subject: mystara-digest V1997 #407 Reply-To: mystara@mpgn.com X-UIDL: 3d09a4f4420aba60a93397c5aa0d4aa2 mystara-digest Thursday, June 11 1998 Volume 1997 : Number 407 Mystara is a trademark of TSR Inc. All Rights Reserved. The following topics are covered in this digest: Re: [MYSTARA] - MYSTARA - Immortals Re: [MYSTARA] - Mystara without Ethengar? [MYSTARA] - Vanya getting away with murder Re: [MYSTARA] - Cultural Edifice Complex Re: [MYSTARA] - Arik's Imprisonment Re: [MYSTARA] - The NoS and Entropy Re: [MYSTARA] - Arik's Imprisonment Re: [MYSTARA] - The NoS and Entropy Re: [MYSTARA] - Cultural Edifice Complex Re: [MYSTARA] - The NoS and Entropy Re: [MYSTARA] - Arik's Imprisonment Re: [MYSTARA] - Arik's Imprisonment Re: [MYSTARA] - The NoS and Entropy [MYSTARA] - Mystara FAQ v5.3 Re: [MYSTARA] - Jenni's Monumental Memo of Mystara Re: [MYSTARA] - Jenni's Monumental Memo of Mystara Re: [MYSTARA] - Arik's Imprisonment Re: [MYSTARA] - Deformed Shadowelves Re: [MYSTARA] - The NoS and Entropy ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Thu, 11 Jun 1998 07:06:13 PDT From: "paul dooley" Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - MYSTARA - Immortals >Politics, especially in Glantri, is never simple. That`s my point! Your saying that others wouldnt give their new jobs easily, but expect Ettienne to do just that! I know that he`s an immortal but of all of them he`s surely learned the cost of direct meddling withthe prime. <;-P ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 11 Jun 1998 07:12:04 PDT From: "paul dooley" Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Mystara without Ethengar? >On the other hand, the Atruaghins are truly isolated -- they are located >on an all but inacessible plateau and have a culture and lifestyle that have nothing in common with the rest of the region. At this point it would >seem that nearly everyone is satisfied to leave them alone. That is until it gets out about the great glass elevator! A route to the hollow world which is quicK! Just watch the stampeed to gain control. Side thought for the next almanac, maybe its an atruaghin who will give them all the hollow world details under an alias obviously. <;-P ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 11 Jun 1998 07:27:21 PDT From: "paul dooley" Subject: [MYSTARA] - Vanya getting away with murder In my last post on the subject I chose a poor adversary in Koryis, for that i appologise, however the idea of Vanya being busted over cursing Thincol works if one uses Halav or Rathanos since thet`re listed as her chief foes along with Petra who, though, IIRC doesnt have much of a following in Thyatis. <;-P ttfn, Paul ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 11 Jun 1998 10:27:57 -0400 (EDT) From: SteelAngel Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Cultural Edifice Complex On Thu, 11 Jun 1998, paul dooley wrote: >based upon Arabic ideas preserved and improved upon whilst europe was in the DARK ages Umm.. nope. It was the Celtic Monestaries which retained most of the Roman learning during the dark ages (Right up until the Papacy decided that they knew too much) Max IV - -- ("`_/")_.-'"``-._ E.A.Deneault "Sanity is the . . )`-._ )-,;-,_`) PH/MU '99 playground of the (v_,)' _ )`-.\ ``-' eand@wpi.edu unimaginative" _.- _..-_/ / ((.' http://homebase.res.wpi.net ((,.-' ((,/ -Simba *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 11 Jun 1998 10:30:07 -0400 (EDT) From: SteelAngel Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Arik's Imprisonment On Thu, 11 Jun 1998, [iso-8859-1] Håvard Rųnne Faanes wrote: >probably exalted servants (of Ordana). Any ideas for these creatures other than that they look likle green elves? (hmm..white elves, black elves, green elves? This is starting to soun like Glorantha..) Um. no.. there are no "little green men" in the Silver Princess. The only Little Green Men that deal with Mystara are either Reheddrian Benekander, or those Alien Druids living on Davania. Max IV *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 11 Jun 1998 10:31:58 -0400 (EDT) From: SteelAngel Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - The NoS and Entropy On Thu, 11 Jun 1998, paul dooley wrote: >IIRC it hasn`t been cursed the way NoS was, and it isn`t even operational yet so no drain. <;-P Actually, yes it has been operational for about half a day on Kaldmont 28 1015 :) Course, that being that last day of the year, too. Max IV - looking forward to a coming year of NoS craziness *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 11 Jun 1998 10:39:55 -0400 (EDT) From: SteelAngel Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Arik's Imprisonment On Thu, 11 Jun 1998 JamugaKhan@aol.com wrote: >But the point is that imprisoning evil immortal for doing evil deeds would mean that the non-evil immortals would have to imprison ALL evil immortals. Not Quite. Remember, the most violent Immortal is Orcus. Thanatos sponsored him, yet has nothing to do with him now. There are different levels of evil, and I'm sure that even Thanatos would get a bit pissy if someone blew up a few planes. Max IV *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 11 Jun 1998 10:42:43 -0400 (EDT) From: SteelAngel Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - The NoS and Entropy On Thu, 11 Jun 1998, paul dooley wrote: >dominant sphere of the plane that you are within. If you stll have a copy of goldbox look again there is some useful stuff there regarding this. In the interests of Simplicity, The Gold box's ideas of Bias, and spells per sphere were dropped (WotI). THAT is canon. 'nuff said. And on that note, the Gold Box had the single most convoluted rules structure I have ever seen. There is VERY little there that i would consider using in a campaign. Max IV *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 11 Jun 1998 07:56:05 PDT From: "paul dooley" Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Cultural Edifice Complex >Umm.. nope. It was the Celtic Monestaries which retained most of the Roman >learning during the dark ages (Right up until the Papacy decided that they >knew too much) ZERO, Medicine etc all I`m trying to say is that eurocentricity is essentially wrong. All that my ancestors did was MISuse the things that they AND others had learned, BUT that`s what everyone does anyway. WE were just more ruthless about it! ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 11 Jun 1998 08:00:28 PDT From: "paul dooley" Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - The NoS and Entropy >Actually, yes it has been operational for about half a day on Kaldmont 28 >1015 :) >Course, that being that last day of the year, too. Pity that its only felmont in my most advanced, timelinewise, campaign tho` isn`t it, but it does mean that my mutation of other races idea could at least be workable. <;-p ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 11 Jun 1998 08:05:10 PDT From: "paul dooley" Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Arik's Imprisonment >Not Quite. Remember, the most violent Immortal is Orcus. Thanatos sponsored him, yet has nothing to do with him now. There are different levels of evil, and I'm sure that even Thanatos would get a bit pissy if >someone blew up a few planes. Only if he hadn`t instgated the idea in the first place. Anyway about big T hasn`t Hel recovered from her stroke yet and gotten her position back. Expanding the effect of curse on CotS would qualify wouldn`t it? ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 11 Jun 1998 11:10:43 -0400 (EDT) From: SteelAngel Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Arik's Imprisonment On Thu, 11 Jun 1998, paul dooley wrote: >back. Expanding the effect of curse on CotS would qualify wouldn`t it? Just asking but when did the City of the Stars get a curse? Last time i checked it was just a cavern that happened to be spack dab in the middle of the world sheild. Of course, Hel isn't into Curses, she's into Undead. Max IV *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 11 Jun 1998 08:15:03 PDT From: "paul dooley" Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - The NoS and Entropy >In the interests of Simplicity, The Gold box's ideas of Bias, and spells >per sphere were dropped (WotI). THAT is canon. 'nuff said. >And on that note, the Gold Box had the single most convoluted rules structure I have ever seen. There is VERY little there that i would consider using in a campaign. Help was asked for and given! OK it wasn`t very good help as I agree about the complexity, but it did give a reason. You could Keep the spirit of those rules whilst ignoring the game rules and you find out that it IS easier for Time Immortals to meddle with time. Alternatively USE the old rules for PCs and just fudge it most of the time for npcs unless of approx equal power level. Give them the headache so they come to realise that it`s muchtougher to play with the big boys. The game CAN have as many/few simple/complex rules as you as DM and your players are happy with can`t it? IF not i think I`ll just go ant cheat at SOLITAIRE!! <;-P ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 11 Jun 1998 17:15:54 CEST From: "Herve Musseau" Subject: [MYSTARA] - Mystara FAQ v5.3 Mystara FAQ version 5.3 by Hervé Musseau Q: What is Mystara? A: Mystara is an imaginary world created by TSR as a campaign world for roleplaying games using the rules of Dungeons and Dragons. Q: What is a roleplaying game? A: Roleplaying games are games in which people play the role of imaginary fantastic characters like warriors or wizards and try to complete an adventure under the guidance of a game master. Q: I never heard of Mystara, but I know a setting called the Known World which looks pretty the same. What's the difference? A: Mystara got a name as a world only recently; before that, it was often referred to as the Known World, although Mystara is more than just the Known World. Q: So, what's Mystara? The Known World and what else? A: Mystara is basically composed of 2 main parts, the Outer World and the Hollow World, plus 2 moons, and some other exotic settings. Q: A Hollow World? A: Yes. Mystara, unlike our earth, is hollow, an empty sphere. It has an internal sun that lights the interior world, making it inhabitable. It holds old civilizations that are now extinct on the Outer World, placed there by the Immortals with strong magic preventing them from evolving much or dying away. The only entrances to the Hollow World are through underground passages between the two worlds, and through the holes that stand in place of the north and south poles. Q: And the Outer World? A: The Outer World is mostly like our Earth. It comprises: * the Known World (now called Old World), where the most civilized countries are located, * Alphatia (only before AC 1009), * the Savage Coast and Hule, * the southern continent, called Davania, * the eastern continent, called Skothar. Q: Why is Alphatia part of Mystara only up to AC 1009? A: Because Alphatia, which is a large continent east of the Known World, sank into the ocean in AC 1009, at the end of the major event called Wrath of the Immortals. It is now a floating continent located in the Hollow World. Q: What exactly is Wrath of the Immortals? A: Wrath of the Immortals (or WotI) is a great campaign that TSR published to update the Known World. It deals with the Great War that involves the major countries of Mystara and that was caused by the Immortals to obtain control of the Nucleus of the Spheres, a powerful artifact located under Glantri. At the end of the war, Alphatia sinks, Glantri and Thyatis have suffered dramatically from the conflict and three new powers enter the political scene of Mystara: the Heldannic Territories, the Hagiarchy of Hule and the "revamped" Kingdom of Karameikos. Q: On the continental map published in the Master DM's book, there are some empires I've never read anything about in other products and on the list, like the Empire of Dorphin IV or the Empire of the Great Khan. Do they exist? Where can I find information about these? A: The map in the Master set is wrong, wrong, wrong! In the series of articles written by Bruce Heard in Dragon Magazine, the first in the series (Dragon #153) explains this all. The map was the was released by a very imaginative Thyatian, and wrongly accepted for the truth. There is no Empire of Dorphin IV, no Empire of the Great Khan, etc. Also, as you probably guessed, the size of the Thyatian Empire was largely exagerated on this map... Q: I've already heard from the Known World, and from the Hollow World Date: Thu, 11 Jun 1998 13:09:37 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: phaser.Showcase.MPGN.COM: majordom set sender to owner-mystara-l@ using -f From: (mystara-digest) To: mystara-digest@Phaser.ShowCase.MPGN.COM Subject: mystara-digest V1997 #407 Reply-To: mystara@mpgn.com X-UIDL: 3d09a4f4420aba60a93397c5aa0d4aa2 too, but never as Mystara. What does all this mean? A: This is because Mystara is a very old world, one of the oldest created by TSR, and, as TSR grew, so did Mystara. All of these product lines are revelant to Mystara: * Mystara, of course, * the Known World and most stuff that were made for D&D (as opposed to AD&D) like these old good modules B and X, or the Gazetteers, * the Hollow World, * Red Steel/the Savage Coast, * Blackmoor. Also, some products bearing the label First Quest are related to Mystara. Q: Blackmoor? I know a Blackmoor, but it's part of Greyhawk, isn't it? A: Blackmoor was, like Greyhawk, the campaign world of one of TSR's founder. It was later placed in both Greyhawk and the Known World (as a past kingdom in the later), effectively making two Blackmoors exist. It seems there is no further relation between the two Blackmoors, however, although some people made the assumption. Q: Where is it located? A: Blackmoor was a techno-magical kingdom that blew itself up a few millenia ago. The event shifted the planet's axis and Blackmoor is now the north pole. Sources are contradictory as to where Blackmoor stands; some place it on Brun, some on Skothar. Arguments in favor of Brun are the position of the Inn Between the Worlds and the Nucleus of the Sphere, and the fact that the Known World stands there; this is the solution proposed in some Gazetteers. Arguments in favor of Skothar are its sort of canonical status, and the feeling that all civilizations should not systamatically come from the Known World; this is the solution proposed in the Hollow World box. Note that, if you consider the Hollow World solution to be the truth in your campaign, the map in the box does have a typo : the names of Blackmoor and Thonia have been reversed (Blackmoor was north of the Empire of Thonia according to all other sources). Bruce Heard's opinion on this matter : << Blackmoor -- the travelling legend. If there were archaeologist on Mystara, they would have a devil of time figuring where the darn place was really located. Officially, it's supposed to be up there by the Thonian Marches. Unfortunately, conflicting info has crept into several products, getting in the way of the Thonian theory. The best thing is to assume evidence of Blackmoor's presence elsewhere is the result of later colonizations and outposts. Other communities were also magically displaced (such as a certain ancient tavern in the Broken Lands of the Known World). Definitely a messy development of the World of Mystara! :) >> So officially the answer is Skothar. Q: Ok, and now what's Red Steel? A: Red Steel is a setting that is part of Mystara (west of the Known World), although it was released as a stand-alone setting. Q: I have a player of the Church of Karameikos, and I whant to give him an Immortal, I suppose that it's a church with many Immortals (like the Greek / Latin church) but in Gaz 1 I dind't find any list of Inmortals... A: These are the immortals of the Church of Karameikos, as told by Bruce Heard in an old Dragon Magazine: Asterius (Eternal of Thought), Leader Kagyar (Eternal of Matter) Ilsundal (Hierarch of Thought) Valerias (Hierarch of Matter) Vanya (Empyreal of Time). Also, although Chardastes is a native Traladaran Immortal, he is venerated through the auspices of the Church of Karameikos, not the Church of Traladara. This is extrapolated from info in B1-9 In Search of Adventure. The Immortals of the Church of Traladara are: Halav Petra Zirchev. Q: You spoke of Immortals, what are they? Are they Gods? A: Mystara has a different pantheon when compared to other D&D settings. Most notably, it has no gods, but beings called Immortals. Immortals are mortals who, through their deeds, have reached a higher status granting them more power than mere mortals. Basically, however, Immortals are not very different from Gods of other settings. Q: Is Jaggar von Drachenfelds the Star Dragon? A: No. According to Bruce Heard's article in Dragon #170 http://www.tsrinc.com/periodicals/dragon/backissues/170jun91/170FromHatchlingTo.txt he became the Star Dragon for a brief period but relinquished the title for absolution. Q: Also you mentionned something about D&D not being AD&D. What does that mean? A: Mystara was the world designed to be used with the rules of D&D (often called OD&D to better distinct it from AD&D and from the generic term D&D which could mean both; OD&D stands for Old D&D or Original D&D). It appeared in the old boxed rules: the Expert box, the Companion box and the Master box. Most of the earlier modules designed for D&D were set in this world. Recently, however, Mystara has been converted to AD&D (along with Red Steel), but many people who play in Mystara do it with the old rules (or their reedition, Rules Cyclopedia). Q: When I read stuff about Mystara I keep seeing acronyms I cannot understand like WotI or PWA. What do they mean? A: There is a list of Mystara relevant acronyms at http://www.geocities.com/TimesSquare/Lair/8932/ Q: I heard that the Mystara line was cancelled. Is this true? A: It is unfortunately true. And Red Steel is cancelled too. Some novels pertaining to Mystara may be released as part of the First Quest line, and modules may be part of the Odyssey line. AFAIK, there is no such products in preparation however, though Wizards of the Coast (which bought TSR) has expressed its willingness to publish material for dead worlds, but never namely mentioned Mystara. Keep faith. Joshuan's Almanach was the last product of Mystara (to be precise the novel "The Black Vessel" has been released after, and to be even more precise it deals with the Savage Coast) and the Savages Baronies the last of Red Steel (except for online exclusives). Q: But I saw in TSR's 97 preview that there would be Red Steel modules released as online exclusive. What does this mean? A: TSR has released these modules for free on its site of MPGN at ftp://ftp.mpgn.com and http://www.tsrinc.com. Q: So, if TSR has dropped the line, how can I get new material for Mystara? A: There are many people on the web who love Mystara and have taken upon themselves to keep Mystara alive (and well alive). There is a mailing list dedicated to Mystara where people discuss together about it, exchanging ideas, points of view, and more. To subscribe, send e-mail to majordomo@mpgn.com. In the body, have the single line: subscribe Mystara-L . It has 224 people, as of end April. Not quite a billion served, but we're getting there. As a comparison, there are 395 people on the Realms list, TSR's flagship world (source : Leroy Van Camp, list admin). There are also the TSR message boards at http://tsronline.wizards.com:80/mb/system/addnewuser.shtml and, according to Jeff Daly and Bruce Heard, Mystara rules there, with our board being second only to the generic DM's board but far more active than any other world-specific board. There are also many pages around the net dedicated to Mystara, sometimes with lots of interesting materials. Some of these pages are organized into a Webring, check http://www.geocities.com/TimesSquare/Dungeon/2967/mystring.html for info about the Mystara webring. Now more than ever you should express your views on how Mystara should be brought back at http://CWSpot.com/Mystara/SaveMystara or join the SaveMystara Writer's Group whose goal is to get as many adventures and articles to the periodicals as we can. Q: Where can I find the old messages of the Mystara mailing list? A: The digests are collected at ftp://ftp.mpgn.com/Gaming/ADND/Worlds/Mystara/MailingListArchive/ and the oldest ones (prior to 1998) can be found at ftp://ftp.io.com/pub/mailing-lists/mystara-digest/ However for your convenience the most interesting aricles the list has come up with are collected and sorted on Shawn's page at http://www.geocities.com/TimesSquare/5304/ Q: Where can I find the old messages of the Mystara message board? A: You can't. The messages are neither archived nor collected. If you're interested in a specific message, try asking on either the board or the list, maybe someone did save it. Q: Where can I find a complete list of the material published for Mystara? A: The most complete lists to my knowledge is at http://www.geocities.com/TimesSquare/Dungeon/2304/prodlist.html It includes rulebooks and modules published by TSR, Mystara-relevant Judge Guild supplements, a list of various magazine #s that contain adventures, rules or world description pertaining to Mystara, novels, TSR net resources, and Clark Ashton Smith stories related to Averoigne. All of these are ranked according to compatibility with Mystara (explicit, implicit, compatible, etc.) and the type of product (campaign source, rules supplement, adventure, etc.). Q: And where can I buy those products? A: Since the Mystara line is out of print, it is difficult to find them. If you're lucky you can find them in any shop that sells RPG stuff, or buy second-hand books. Some places where you can find Mystara stuff on the web: http://www.dragontrove.com/listing.html http://www.titan-games.com/ http://www.rpgspot.com/main.htm http://www.hitpointe.com http://www.eskimo.com/~darkh/ http://www.ida.net/users/groverm/sleeping.dragon/sdh.html http://www.djhobby.com/catalog/index.html http://www.sagesguild.com/ http://www.crazyegors.com/ the newsgroup rec.games.frp.marketplace. Q: Where can I find the FAQ for the Mystara mailing list? A: Check at http://www.io.com/~oryon/mmlfaq.htm. AFAIK there is no plain text version of this FAQ. _____________________________________________________________ Herve Musseau Homepage: http://www.geocities.com/TimesSquare/Lair/8932/ Almanac page: http://www.geocities.com/TimesSquare/Lair/9037/ ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 11 Jun 1998 11:28:11 +0000 From: darkone1@swbell.net Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Jenni's Monumental Memo of Mystara paul dooley wrote: >>Actully they just removed them from the endagered list to a threated llist >>or something on that order. :P >>Steve >So there`s now TWO breeding pairs right? <;-P >______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. Actually, there are several hundred breeding pairs currently. *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 11 Jun 1998 11:30:04 +0000 From: darkone1@swbell.net Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Jenni's Monumental Memo of Mystara paul dooley wrote: >>It says that you don't understand the analogy. >>-Inconu >OOOH! YOU BITCH!!! <;-P HEY! WATCH THE LANGUAGE! KIDS READ THIS STUFF! *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 11 Jun 1998 09:50:12 -0700 (PDT) From: Dominique Rivard Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Arik's Imprisonment Haavard wrote: >Ordana is the woman you are looking for. I agree that Protectors are probably exalted servants (of Ordana). Any ideas for these creatures other >than that they look likle green elves? (hmm..white elves, black elves, green elves? This is starting to soun like Glorantha..) >skål! >Håvard Yeah, perhaps to much like Glorantha and it seems that the module I have is from an older version because I'm sure of it now, there's not an only immortal but many little green elf-like being. Anyway, it's I won't argue over this, I'll keep the protectors *and* I'll had the immortal, I like the sound of it. By the way, it's true that this adventure should be made more difficult and played by expert/companion level PCs. IMC that's what I've done. Skål! PS: But I'll let you the Aqvavit (not sure how to write it, but I'm sure how it tastes) Håvard, if you don't mind ;o) == Tharquil's French D&D Homepage at http://www.geocities.com/Area51/Rampart/5201 _________________________________________________________ DO YOU YAHOO!? Get your free @yahoo.com address at http://mail.yahoo.com *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 11 Jun 1998 09:54:13 -0700 (PDT) From: Dominique Rivard Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Deformed Shadowelves - ---paul dooley wrote: >Interesting idea. IIrc the deformities are what the curse on CotS is,you >get the power,your descendants the problems. This could lead to a counterbalance of the entropy loss from NoS if the deformities become more widespread. Yeah, but I was thinking that perhaps the deformities effects could be the result of a subtle plot by Atzy on the CotS. He would have been making somewhat the same thing Hel did to create the beastmen to make humanoid races more powerful over time. == Tharquil's French D&D Homepage at http://www.geocities.com/Area51/Rampart/5201 _________________________________________________________ DO YOU YAHOO!? Get your free @yahoo.com address at http://mail.yahoo.com *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 11 Jun 1998 12:07:59 -0500 From: Galwylin Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - The NoS and Entropy paul dooley wrote: >I`m rather puzzled here, you mention the gold box but seem to ignore the fact that it contained different spells for each Sphere. Yes you can cast spells from another sphere, but at an increased cost. A similar sort of thing happened depending on your sphere in relation to the dominant sphere of the plane that you are within. If you stll have a copy of goldbox look again there is some useful stuff there regarding this. My problem stems from the fact that all spells are granted to clerics by the Immortals regardless of their sphere. This makes me think an Immortal sphere doesn't determine anything except where he gets to park his car. If the system of Immortals having to pay extra from their spells, shouldn't their clerics also have trouble being granted that spell? Say a cleric of an Immortal of Thought ask for a spell like Purify Food and Water (which would probably be a spell concerning Matter), he gets it without additional cost. And just where do these healing spells come from? Energy, Matter, Time? Just seems like the spheres of the Immortals aren't true spheres of power or substance but only a view of the universe. - -- This has been a Galwylin© Production http://www.airnet.net/galwylin/ galwylin@airnet.net | ICQ #6755972 | AIM: Galwylin *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ End of mystara-digest V1997 #407 ******************************** *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara' as the body of the message. Date: Thu, 11 Jun 1998 14:48:15 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: phaser.Showcase.MPGN.COM: majordom set sender to owner-mystara-l@ using -f From: (mystara-digest) To: mystara-digest@Phaser.ShowCase.MPGN.COM Subject: mystara-digest V1997 #408 Reply-To: mystara@mpgn.com X-UIDL: e1e21ca0a7dd72ffaf10da2999a683a1 mystara-digest Thursday, June 11 1998 Volume 1997 : Number 408 Mystara is a trademark of TSR Inc. All Rights Reserved. The following topics are covered in this digest: Re: [MYSTARA] - Cultural Edifice Complex Re: [MYSTARA] - Spelljammer and Mystara (was: Why Mystara?) Re: [MYSTARA] - Spelljammer and Mystara (was: Why Mystara?) Re: [MYSTARA] - Magical Parrying [MYSTARA] - Kol ID [MYSTARA] - G:KoM.. Re: [MYSTARA] - Adri Varma Plateau [MYSTARA] - Kols a Cleric! Re: [MYSTARA] - The NoS and Entropy Re: [MYSTARA] - Cultural Edifice Complex Re: [MYSTARA] - Principium, Propostitium and no other big Re: [MYSTARA] - Human races in D&D was (Re: Midland Forest) [MYSTARA] - Eagles, Lions and Athena Re: [MYSTARA] - Cultural Edifice Complex Re: [MYSTARA] - The NoS and Entropy [MYSTARA] - Deformed Shadowelves/Ranger Kits [MYSTARA] - Timelines ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Thu, 11 Jun 1998 10:40:12 -0700 (PDT) From: Diego Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Cultural Edifice Complex As a Yank I think that something needs to be said: :) On Thu, 11 Jun 1998, SteelAngel wrote: >On Thu, 11 Jun 1998, paul dooley wrote: >>based upon Arabic ideas preserved and improved upon whilst europe was in the DARK ages >Umm.. nope. It was the Celtic Monestaries which retained most of the Roman learning during the dark ages (Right up until the Papacy decided that they knew too much) First this is in part correct. The celtic Monestaries did preserve some material and they did help Charlemegne start the Carolingian renaissance. But, they did not preserve anything Greek like Aristotle or Plato, and the carolingian Renaissance was very short lived. The Arabs kept the greek authors and it was with the conquest of Spain, and other Muslim countries, that some information again returned to Europe. In addition, a lot of algebra came from the Arabs, as did astronomy. BTW where did you find the information about the Papacy? Did you read Thomas Cahill's book: how the Irish saved Civilization? It is rubish! I have not read anything good about it in any monitered journal. Sorry for the off topic post, if people wish to further talk about this subject, we should probably move it off the list. - -Diego *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 11 Jun 1998 20:02:55 +0200 From: DM Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Spelljammer and Mystara (was: Why Mystara?) Third time i try to send it... drat! Steelangel asked: <> Well, while i might agree on the first part (Skyships were not meant to brave Voidspace, especially if you think that Mystara atmosphere is so damn difficult to bypass for Skyships it seems it's been placed there to avoid mystarans voyages into space..) and on the basic principle that Skyships are similar to Spelljammers, i must add something to clarify a bit. Spelljamming helms cannot be created by PCs: sure there is an eighth level spell that allows a mage to enchant a normal helm with spelljamming capacities, but it is normally not permanent and has some drawbacks. Only Arcanes know how to build Major and Minor spelljamming engines, and other races have their own versions of these (pool helm, orbus, death helms, furnaces, etc.). In Mystara you see PCs who can actually build by themselves a flying ship able to transport them from one country to the other, so here flying ships are more PC friendly, so to speak ;) Also, Voidships are indeed spelljammers without spelljamming helm, but hey, this is not really a meaningful definition, or is it? Like saying: airplanes are zeppelins without the hotair ballon. Sure they are, but in saying so you're basically saying they are a completely different thing, mind you..? Final thought: probably Voidships were meant to be a connection to SJR, also since at the end of the Skyship Builder manual there are conversion tables to translate the D&D stuff into AD&D spelljammer.. ;) PS: IMC i rule that Spelljammers are able to punch thru Mystara Skyshield without problems due to their superior nature and different magical nature. So basically the Skyshield is there to keep Mystaran skyships inside the atmosphere, but has no power over spelljamming tech.. DM Visit My Mystara Homepage at: http://www.geocities.com/TimesSquare/Dungeon/2967 Updated every month! *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 11 Jun 1998 20:03:21 +0200 From: DM Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Spelljammer and Mystara (was: Why Mystara?) Jamuga wrote: <> Okay, i knew i should have quoted the actual stats, so here you are: "A flying ship in the SJR universe moves 500 YARDS per ROUND for EVERY point of its SHIP'S RATING (outside the atmosphere -my note). [...] "For each point of SJR Ship's Rating, a ship has a movement factor of 24 for movement in air (inside the atmosphere -my note)." -Spelljammer, Concordance of Arcane Space, page 51 >From what i recall, a movement of 24 in AD&D is equal to 240 feet in D&D, right? Now, the ship's rating is based on the level of the helmsman (magic wielder) as follows: Major Helm: Lvl 1-3 (SR1), Lvl 4-5 (SR2), lvl 6-7 (SR3), lvl 8-9 (SR4) [you got the progression].. lvl 18-19 (SR9) and Lvl 20 (SR10) With a Minor Helm the maximum speed is SR6 achievable at 18th level. Note: these are AD&D levels of course. Now, this means that a medium (8th) level spellcaster can move a spelljamming ship with a major helm to a maximum of: 4 (SR) x 500 = 2,000 yards PER round in space; and: 4 (SR) x 240 = 960 feet per round in atmosphere! Let's look at Mystaran Skyships: "Mechanical devices operated by magical fuel (potions of flying, for instance) should provide Air Speeds equivalent to the spell effect -360 yards (120yds) for fly spells. [...] "A wind driven skyship's daily movement rate (in miles) is also usually three times her encounter speed (in yards). [...] "Air Speed determines the vessel's maximum speed and depends on the Motive Power used (normally wind -my note). [..] Skyships measure movement in yards and miles. An Air Speed of 320 (120) gives a normal daily movement of 360 miles and an encounter speed of 120 yards per round. (This works out to roughly 25 mph and assumes skyships do not fly at maximum speed 24 hours each day.)[...] "[In the Void] Speeds are faster ("Impulse Speed" is 10x Air Speed), so movement should be figured in units of 100 yards instead of 10 yards." -Champions of Mystara, Designer's Manual (pages 7, 9, 11, 34) Note that in Voidspace a ship only travels by using magic (hull must be enchanted with Fly) or using Solar currents, which are slower than wind currents. Also, the average Air Speed using wind currents given in a table on page 5 of the same book for Clippers, Man-O-War and Schooners is roughly 140' (70'). So, in Voidspace a Mystaran Skyship enchanted with Fly flies at: 120 x 10 = 1200 yards PER ROUND, which is less than a Spelljammer powered by an eighth level spellcaster (the Mystaran Skyship Air Speed is comparable to a Spelljammer with a Ship's Rating of 2-3, but 3 is faster.. achievable with a fourth to sixth level spellcaster..). Spelljammers have an edge over Mystaran Skyships in the Void, definitely. Inside the Atmosphere the movement is 120 yards per round for the Mystaran Skyship and 960' for the SJR with a Ship's Rating of 4, which means in yards.. 320 yards! Might this mean that it has to be referred to the first number (320/120) instead of the second (remember: i'm not really familiar with AD&D movement score)? In any way, either they've got the same Air Speed or SJR is faster, and if we take a ninth level spellcaster (SR goes to 5), then the SJR is surely faster than the Skyship! This all to confirm my statements: Spelljamers are more evolute than Skyships! ;p A last note: Designer's Manual says that it should take about 2 weeks to travel from one planet to another to a skyship enchanted with Fly spell, while traveling to another solar system might take three months or more. It does not specify the distance of the worlds, and so ends up being far too much generic for my tastes. Spelljammer Concordance of Arcane Space OTOH clearly states that: "A ship can travel 100 million miles per day regardless of its SR rating. This is the speed of all spelljamming ships over long distances [...] (About 4 million miles per hour)." -Concordance of Arcane Space, page 52. As you can see, i see no reason for applying the same rules to Mystaran Skyships or any other ship which has a similar (magical or high-tech) motive power (sails only don't count). And when you've found out the distance between the planets (written in Old Immortal set or in Spelljammer Concordance), the calculations are easy to make! :) Also Paul Dooley added: <> Answering to Paul: I haven't really understood your point. Are u saying that spelljammers are so big it's impossible to use them in a campaign because they give the DM many problems? If so, I think you're misunderstanding: the only BIG spelljammer ever is THE Spelljammer, the unique living ship, and it cannot be owned by any PC (or if the DM allows it, well, it'll be a helltime for that poor captain). All other spelljammer ships are standard size: the standard Alphatian Man O War is far HUGER and more powerful than the Elven Man O War (maybe comparable to an Elven Armada, but with far more Maneuvrability!). Don't think they're so big and difficult to manage as you say: quite the contrary! The Spelljammer rules are very simple and user friendly: it's easier and funnier to play a battle between skyships (and ships) using Spelljammer rules from War Captain's Companion than using those found in Mystara's supplements (SJR emphasizes on tactics and captain's and crew's actions while GAZ4 or DotE for example use simplicistic War Machine calculations that don't make you savour the game)! DM (who loves Star Trek and Spelljammer) Visit My Mystara Homepage at: http://www.geocities.com/TimesSquare/Dungeon/2967 Updated every month! *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 11 Jun 1998 20:03:52 +0200 From: DM Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Magical Parrying Adam Curtis wrote: <> Yeah, you hit the point, even though i found out that this tends to be the case only with low level mages (12th and lower): higher level mages have more HP and can withstand the attacks a bit more, so they don't usually cast an offensive spell on the first round, rather a defensive/protective spell or a conjuration spell (conjure/create a monster that keeps the enemy busy while you prepare yourself for the grand final). Also, think about this: often high level mages already have permanent defensive or evasive spells cast on them and other defensive magical trinkets that help them resist the most powerful spells. The problem comes in hand only with Basic-Expert wizards. <> Nice idea: i've always thought that part of Gaz3 (magic courses) could have been exploited a bit more. <> Don't know anything about this cantrip thing: i suspect it's AD&D. Anyway, from your explanation i infer this only duplicates low level spells (say lvl 1-2 spells?). I guess he would have a limit on the number of spells cast. This is the rule i'd use: the wizard could cast via mana manipulation only those spells he normally knows in this way: he has a Mana Power (points) equal to half his Int score (rounded down) and each spell he wants to cast using mana costs him a # o mana points equal to the spell's level. Also, the spell cast thru mana has only half the duration, effect and range, and to cast it effectively the wizard must make a Mana Manipulation check (Int check): if he fails nothing happens (or the spell backfires if he rolls a 20) but he "loses" mana points anyway. Mana Power is recharged at the rate of 1 point per hour spent without casting spells. <> Too powerful, imho. Either reduce it to half damage or use the Mana Power i proposed above in this way: he can create an offensive attack based on raw energy (flame, air, electricity, water?) by making a Mana Manipulation check and doing 1d4 points of damage for each Mana point he uses (remember he has a maximum of 9 MP if his Int is 18), save vs Spells (or Death Ray?) to halve damage. <> This is the part i really liked. << For instance, someone with mana manipulation could, on a successful skill check, reduce or nullify a fireball just cast at them.>> I'd say reduce at best.. <> In addition to the rules i presented above, i'd use yours as well, but limiting the Con loss to Magical Parry only (or maybe the wizard loses 1 Con point when using mana to attack and 2 Con points to parry.. or vice versa?) <> This way you don't really describe HOW he parries the spell. I'd use your level limitations and rule he must make a Mana Manipulation check to parry the attack, then he can choose: depending on the Mana Power of the wizard, he can either a) absorb the whole spell, consuming 1 Mana point per level of the spell and thus negating the effect altogether; b) absorb half the power of the spell, consuming 1 mana point each 2 levels of the spell, fraction down (minimum 1 MP, so 1st level spells are ALWAYS absorbed fully) Obviously, this also depends on how many mana points the wizard has got and are still unused. Optionally, for very spectacular scenes (particularly versus your players), you could allow the wizard to use mana to rebounce the spell back to its caster, spending double the amount of normal mana points for parry (ex: 2 to cast back 1st level spells, 4 for 2nd level, 6 for third, to a maximum of 8 for 4th level spells) after making a succesfull Mana Manipulation check (all hindrances and penalties apply normally). The only problem with my system is that you ought to have 9 mana points spared and be able to cast 9th level spells to stop a meteor swarm.. but i think high level mages have better ways to fight than using mana.. ;) This rule is best suited for Expert to Companion levels I think that with these rules i listed your idea sounds really neat.. and i'll surely add it to my campaign! Thanx for the input Adam! :) DM Visit My Mystara Homepage at: http://www.geocities.com/TimesSquare/Dungeon/2967 Updated every month! *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 11 Jun 1998 20:10:36 +0200 From: DM Subject: [MYSTARA] - Kol ID Somebody said: <> "Joshuan is a CRAP! All halflings are CRAP, for that matter! This is only an ominuos lie spread to cause chaos among the inhabitants of Kolland. Our mighty Prinz is in no way one of those wily puny and shady shadow elves: i testify this with my word! Heil Kol!" - Ludwig von Hendriks in one of his latest speech in Glantri City ;) DM *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 11 Jun 1998 20:14:40 +0200 From: DM Subject: [MYSTARA] - G:KoM.. At 14.41 11/06/98 +0200, Haavard wrote: >According to G:KoM Jaggar is Lawful Evil. Most people who were familiar with the original Gaz found this absurd. This is one of the hundreds reasons i HATE G:Ko...groan.. It seems with that set the writers took FAR too many liberties: Jaggar's alignment, new barons who won a title only because "friends" of this or that noble, Kol's incredible and useless ID change.. and i could go on, but it really gives me headache... DM *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 11 Jun 1998 20:17:59 +0200 From: DM Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Adri Varma Plateau At 05.46 11/06/98 PDT, Paul wrote: >>Too sad. I had hoped that somebody would remember. If I'm entering a delirium tremens, it must be an official source like the Glantri GAZ or CoM. I have searched but I haven't found anything. >Maybe M5 in new monster section? (actually trying to be helpful) No way. No cactuses in the entire M5, sorry :) I think Jamuga smoked something heavy before actually having that vision about animated cactuses on the Adri Varma... ;p The only beings living there i remember are the Sand Folk, detailed by Steve Wilson and on my site as well as Shawn's. DM *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 11 Jun 1998 19:16:27 +0100 From: "Rob" Subject: [MYSTARA] - Kols a Cleric! What almost tempts me to throw G:KoM in the bin is the fact that, get this... PRINCE KOL IS A PRIEST!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! he's listed as a 10/7 mage/cleric shadowelf. A priest PRINCE in Glantri? Cheerz ROB *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 11 Jun 1998 19:41:49 +0100 From: "Rob" Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - The NoS and Entropy >According to G:KoM Jaggar is Lawful Evil. Most people who were familiar with the original Gaz found this absurd. I thought that was ace! Lawful Evil - that could mean anything. Alignments MUST be broad - not a straitjacket! Jaggar (in G:KoM anyway) wanted to kick Ethie butt, for no other reason than his own racism. That is evil - maybe only slightly (hes not a Mouhahahah! type nutter like Landryn Teriak) - but not neutral. LE is the "Ends justifies the Means" alignment. Cheerz ROB *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 11 Jun 1998 18:59:52 +0100 From: "Rob" Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Cultural Edifice Complex - -->ZERO, Medicine etc all I`m trying to say is that eurocentricity is eessentially wrong. All that my ancestors did was MISuse the things that they AND others had learned, BUT that`s what everyone does anyway. WE were just more ruthless about it! Like I said with gunpowder. But then, thats life. Life is hard. There are winners, and there are losers. Ruthlessness, believe it or not, is (was, i hope, but i still doubt) a good road to success. No one ever said that life was fair. Bad luck for all the nations that have been trampled over the millenia. Cheerz ROB *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 11 Jun 1998 19:29:41 +0100 From: "Rob" Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Principium, Propostitium and no other big >This reminds me of AD&D's inner plane setup. You have water (time), air (thought), fire (energy) and earth (matter) with negative (entropy) and positive (principium) poles. Thats why Red Steel theorises as to a Positive sphere. It mentions the planar/sphere connection, and (possibly) ties Entropy with the Negative Material. It sez - This Sphere [Entropy] has no definite elemental analog, but some believe it may be tied to the Negative Material plane (hinting at the possibility of an undisclosed sixth Sphere tied to the Positive Material plane). Cheerz ROB *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 11 Jun 1998 19:19:22 +0100 From: "Rob" Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Human races in D&D was (Re: Midland Forest) >A humanoid prince in Glantri? O.k.! >A cleric prince in Glantri? Unbelievable!!! I think TSR got their wires crossed. When they converted him from kobold shaman/wokan to AD+D Shadowelf, they thought "hey cool, we can make him a mage/priest and he'll be just the same as he used to be!". Bad move. But then, wokani or SE, he still gets priest spells, and therefore there is no way he should be a prince. And "only" a kobold? King Thar is a Nosferatu, which explains his charming charisma and ability to win any fight with the magic weapon bereft orcs... All is not as it seems in the Broken Lands (Prince Jaggar being Thars advisor always cracks me up) Cheerz ROB *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 11 Jun 1998 19:23:15 +0100 From: "Rob" Subject: [MYSTARA] - Eagles, Lions and Athena >>As for a single piece of art representing a nation... for the RW-USA, flying eagles are often used to represent the USA as a whole. Its not the ethnics or eccentricities of America that is focused on, but the freedom and eagles are used to represent it very well. Wouldnt worry about it. England stole the lion and Athena (who we renamed Britannia). Look at a 50p coin and Athena stares back with her pet lion. She's even got her silver helmet and round shield, Aegis (although Aegis now has a Union Jack on the front!). I'm not aware of either lions or Athena being particularly English? (Cool tho. That reminds me of Pax Bellanica in Bellayne (Britannia?) being Tarastia) Cheerz ROB *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 11 Jun 1998 18:56:06 +0100 From: "Rob" Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Cultural Edifice Complex >Trust a YANK to ignore the fact that all the european knowledge was based upon Arabic ideas preserved and improved upon whilst europe was in the DARK ages Yeah, and humans were based on apes a couple of thousand years ago. Thats a bit irrelevant IMO. Pure academic knowledge (Greek philosophy?) doesnt get you anywhere. Take gunpowder. The Chinese invented that a long, long time before the Europeans got their hands on it. But they didnt use it. Europe did, and changed the world. The Industrial Revolution was probably the period of advancement that has defined the modern world. And that happened in Europe. (I never thought I would spring to the defence of a YANK. :) Cheerz ROB *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 11 Jun 1998 19:39:18 +0100 From: "Rob" Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - The NoS and Entropy >I don't think I look at Entropy and the other spheres the same as most. To me, they are just cliques the Immortals have divided themselves in. One reason is because I don't see anything dividing the spheres in terms of magic used or granted by the Immortals. An Immortal of Matter can manipulate time as easily as an Immortal of Time. Immortals can granted charm spells regardless if they belong to the sphere of Thought or not. Since there is no apparent benefit of belonging to one sphere or the other, I'm not sure if the NoS has the ability to drain any of them (especially a sphere that is nothing). Is there any better explaination of the spheres than the Immortal rules and WotI? I disliked that intensely. It also makes it very hard to run an Immortals campaign! Spheres are like Immortal classes almost. I revert the the Sacred Gold Box and the Magic Circle for what Immortals can do. I also like the idea of Immortals expending TPs to cast spells. (Even tho it makes them substantially weaker!) Cheerz ROB *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 11 Jun 1998 19:13:03 +0100 From: "Rob" Subject: [MYSTARA] - Deformed Shadowelves/Ranger Kits >Yeah, but I was thinking that perhaps the deformities effects could be the result of a subtle plot by Atzy on the CotS. He would have been making somewhat the same thing Hel did to create the beastmen to make humanoid races more powerful over time. I was struck by the similarity of the Progeny in Glantri. I know, it sez they are the result of crossbreeding with dragons/faeries etc. Long Ago, because Glantri is such a magical place, but I'm not sure I buy that. Sounds more plausible in Wendar perhaps, but not a one-time Alphatian colony / barren mountain range. IMC the Progeny are the result of the proximity of the NoS. I personally like all this "nuclear radiation" thing, I think its cool, so thats what the Progeny are for me. Mutants, basically. I agree with the SE Soul crystals deforming their babies. But - that could be explained similarly. Radiation in low doses damages genes, causes birth defects, stillbirths etc. Even sounds plausible! The eerie glow of the radiance - sounds like radium to me! And the SEs seem to be using soul crystals as "fuel" in their reactor - they were collecting them all and taking "incorporating them into the machinery" down there. BTW - if i recall the ranger kits were wanted as well as the bards? here ya go!!! Beastmaster Explorer Falconer Feralan (Mowgli!) Forest Runner Giant Killer (munchkin alert! 1st edition returns!) Greenwood Ranger (bizarre - half man, half tree!) Guardian Justifier Mountain Man Pathfinder Sea Ranger Seeker Stalker Warden (its Ranger Smith!) Cheerz ROB (who is, of course, a Fighter/Mage/Thief with the DM kit :) *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 11 Jun 1998 19:36:14 +0100 From: "Rob" Subject: [MYSTARA] - Timelines - ----- >Neither do most of us but we seem to be the ones now in control of Mystara. That`s why I argue so much Real people that I can reach are now deciding it`s fate. However they must realise that those of us new to the net don`t neccesrily (HOW do you spell that?) agree with all that they have done upto now, and its a lot easier to argue the point with them . Take the one armed jagger question for example IMC a PC is a supporter of him and this pcs adventuring buddy is a very high level cleric so my PC will offer his friends services either gratis or for some future recompence such as a yes vote when he wants to become a Baron. The problem is in all gameworlds PCs can really alter situations like this so it CAN`T become canon since in many cases it just wont stay that way, and as we go along the `canon` bears lees and lees relevance to our own campaigns. Well, thats the + and - of having a timeline. But the + far outweighs the -. And, if you really want, you can get the timeline back on track. The timeline is composed of a number of different story threads. The DM should just look at that thread, possibly cross it off as "resolved by the PCs" and move on. There are lots of other threads, which the DM can then have the PCs get involved in. The good thing is the idea of progression. Personally, even tho Jaggar rules, I wouldnt mind so much if he did die. I'm just itching for Elminster and Mordenkainen to pop their clogs, just because they have been around for soooooooooooo long. IMO they epitomise the static nature of those worlds. When I read that Thincol died I was just dumfounded, coz he was even cooler than Jaggar! But its good that he has died, because Mystara has Marched On, giving way for newer NPCs equally as interesting as Thincol. Cheerz ROB *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ End of mystara-digest V1997 #408 ******************************** *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara' as the body of the message. Date: Thu, 11 Jun 1998 19:50:35 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: phaser.Showcase.MPGN.COM: majordom set sender to owner-mystara-l@ using -f From: (mystara-digest) To: mystara-digest@Phaser.ShowCase.MPGN.COM Subject: mystara-digest V1997 #409 Reply-To: mystara@mpgn.com X-UIDL: 0f248201c5419e2e54665f76ba20956e mystara-digest Thursday, June 11 1998 Volume 1997 : Number 409 Mystara is a trademark of TSR Inc. All Rights Reserved. The following topics are covered in this digest: Re: [MYSTARA] - Class Kits for the Known World Re: [MYSTARA] - Kol ID Re: [MYSTARA] - Deformed Shadowelves Re: [MYSTARA] - The NoS and Entropy Re: [MYSTARA] - Arik's Imprisonment Re: [MYSTARA] - The NoS and Entropy Re: [MYSTARA] - Arik's Imprisonment Re: [MYSTARA] - Jenni's Monumental Memo of Mystara Re: [MYSTARA] - Arik's Imprisonment Re: [MYSTARA] - AntiD&D controversy Re: [MYSTARA] - Arik's Imprisonment [MYSTARA] - Heresy Re: [MYSTARA] - Human races in D&D was (Re: Midland Forest) Re: Re: Re: [MYSTARA] - Class Kits for the Known World Re: [MYSTARA] - Arik's Imprisonment Re: [MYSTARA] - Deformed Shadowelves Re: Re: [MYSTARA] - Human races in D&D was (Re: Midland Forest) Re: [MYSTARA] - Human races in D&D was (Re: Midland Forest) Re: [MYSTARA] - Adri Varma Plateau Re: [MYSTARA] - Almanac/Glantri Re: Re: [MYSTARA] - Human races in D&D was (Re: Midland Forest) [MYSTARA] - Cultural Edifice Complex [MYSTARA] - Jaggar's alignment Re: [MYSTARA] - Kols a Cleric! [MYSTARA] - [ADMIN] Nationalistic Name Calling (was Cultural Edifice Complex) ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Thu, 11 Jun 1998 18:51:00 +0100 From: "Rob" Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Class Kits for the Known World >>Complete Bards handbook is one of the best IMO. Check it out for ideas of what interesting benefits can be like. Bard kits arent really kits. They're all reworked bard classes. Those kits lose all their normal bardic abilities and get the kit ones instead. Perhaps thats why you like them? >God God! we actually agree on something Mystara kits should give you the feel of the character type not just awhole slew of proficiencies for free. Proficiencies arent exactly powergamed. What I hate is when they bring out proficiencies like Observation, Spelljamming, Spirit Summoning and that sort of thing which arent proficiencies they are new abilities. Personally i couldnt care less if a Noble gets etiquette and heraldry for free, or a Local Hero gets agriculture and carpentry. The sole effect is on roleplaying, because NWPs arent generally any use in an adventure (lol - except a monk with carpentry IMC who is known now as the War Machine builder...). I fail to see the problem! >I`ve no complaint about free proficiencies if they are balanced by severe requirements such as armour&weapon restrictions AND hardly used proficiencies which Must be taken IE r/w for a fighter is 2 slots so if forced to take it you wont be a blacksmith/armourer/weaponsmith at low level anymore Hmm. Well, I've read Wizards & Rogues of the Realms and I absolutely hate that book, because the only stuff in their are munchkin powers to add to your wizard/rogue - they dont define your character at all. The sole exception is the Nimbralese Wizard, because I think they are really quite different, and cool as well! The Red Steel book is my Gospel of kits, and I cant see much problem there. Even the fabled Swashbuckler isnt so bad really. Swashbuckler thieves may get fighter THAC0, but frankly, thieves are the lowest of the low in D+D and AD+D and I'm prepared to let thieves get away with murder (sometimes literally!), because, as a class, they are just naff. And any mage getting into hand to hand with his single attack, naff AC and hit points will just get killed anyway, fighter THAC0 or not. Even if he hits with his rapier he is doing a mere d6+1 damage. So he can kill kobolds, one on one, without too many wounds... I think Myrmidons are probably the most powered kit there, (free specialisation) but the hindrance is they must serve in the army! Pretty large hindrance that. Besides, I'm sure the idea of having lots of Thyatian legionaries (Myrmidons) being powerful warriors would appeal to a lot of Thyatian fans on this list. Sorry about the following slating, but as its kind of connected to what I'm saying I'll tack it on the end of this post anyway... Apologies in advance to all concerned... This stuff on parrying magic. As a nonweapon proficiency?????????? And you think kits are bad! That sounds like something out of FR, if I dare say - (probably between Halruaan Wizard and Mulmaster Thief). All a mage needs in a duel, is tactics. Not new skills! (especially as a proficiency. Munchkins will be attracted to that like flies round a dustbin). If an AD+D mage gets within sword reach of a warrior, that mage is in trouble. (Unless he has stoneskin, but I banned that... lol). Its this casting time thing again... the warrior just punches the mage, beats him to initiative every round, and the mage can't actually cast a spell! Or wrestles the mage to the ground in round 1. Cheerz (and apologies again) ROB *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 11 Jun 1998 14:32:06 -0400 (EDT) From: SteelAngel Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Kol ID On Thu, 11 Jun 1998, DM wrote: >"Joshuan is a CRAP! All halflings are CRAP, for that matter! This is only ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ Step outside for a few minutes, Ludwig. I have a master who'd like to talk to you... Max IV *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 11 Jun 1998 17:25:05 EDT From: JamugaKhan@aol.com Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Deformed Shadowelves << Think of the deformity as radioactive mutation. The shadowelves original clan blew up a Blckmoor device (possibly a Chernobyl-like reactor) and were driven underground Max iV >> Can you power a space ship by a Chernobyl-like reactor? I think not. The energy devices of Blackmoor based on the technology from the Beagle, so it might be a matter-antimatter reaction device what caused the Great Rain of Fire. Jamuga Khan "Hear and obey, because the Mighty Khan's word is law." *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 11 Jun 1998 17:48:41 -0400 From: Daly Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - The NoS and Entropy At 10:42 AM 6/11/98 -0400, SteelAngel wrote: OOn Thu, 11 Jun 1998, paul dooley wrote: >>dominant sphere of the plane that you are within. If you stll have a copy of goldbox look again there is some useful stuff there regarding this. >In the interests of Simplicity, The Gold box's ideas of Bias, and spells per sphere were dropped (WotI). THAT is canon. 'nuff said. >And on that note, the Gold Box had the single most convoluted rules structure I have ever seen. There is VERY little there that i would consider using in a campaign. For the interest of a elegant, simple system one can not ask for more than the gold box. It is a wonderful system. Of course, this is my opinion and you are welcome to yours too. So there! :) *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 11 Jun 1998 17:50:37 -0400 From: Daly Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Arik's Imprisonment At 10:30 AM 6/11/98 -0400, SteelAngel wrote: OOn Thu, 11 Jun 1998, [iso-8859-1] Håvard Rųnne Faanes wrote: >>probably exalted servants (of Ordana). Any ideas for these creatures other than that they look likle green elves? (hmm..white elves, black elves, green elves? This is starting to soun like Glorantha..) >Um. no.. there are no "little green men" in the Silver Princess. The only Little Green Men that deal with Mystara are either Reheddrian Benekander, or those Alien Druids living on Davania. Umm yes, hate to embarrass you but there were indeed little green men in Palace of the Silver Princess. They were called "the Protectors" and they were of the land of Faery. I understand B1-9 changed this for whatever reason...but B1-9 was in turn changed by Gaz1 which referred to Haven as a kind of Summer home for the Traladaran triad. So I suppose it is up to whatever works in your campaign... *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 11 Jun 1998 23:48:53 +0200 (MET DST) From: =?iso-8859-1?Q?H=E5vard_R=F8nne_Faanes?= Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - The NoS and Entropy On Thu, 11 Jun 1998, Rob wrote: >LE is the "Ends justifies the Means" alignment. First time I heard that interpretation of LE. I would think the Ende-justify-the-means alignment would be Chaotic something, while LE would be more like twisting rules to further your own ends. (Or just to cause misery to others.) Anyway, alignments are still a really bad idea. Håvard *** Haavard R. Faanes (hoc@nvg.ntnu.no) http://www.nvg.ntnu.no/~hoc "Every turkey dies. Not all turkeys truly live." -Chef, South Park *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 11 Jun 1998 17:50:24 EDT From: JamugaKhan@aol.com Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Arik's Imprisonment << Not Quite. Remember, the most violent Immortal is Orcus. Thanatos sponsored him, yet has nothing to do with him now. There are different levels of evil, and I'm sure that even Thanatos would get a bit pissy if someone blew up a few planes. >> Thanatos??? Yes, maybe, but only because HE wouldn't be responsible for it. Don't forget that old T-Bone stands for the destruction of ALL things, planes inclusive. Jamuga Khan "Hear and obey, because the Mighty Khan's word is law." *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 11 Jun 1998 17:50:27 EDT From: JamugaKhan@aol.com Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Jenni's Monumental Memo of Mystara << > OOOH! YOU XXXXX!!! <;-P HEY! WATCH THE LANGUAGE! KIDS READ THIS STUFF! >> Even worse! Kids WRITE this stuff! Jamuga Khan "Hear and obey, because the Mighty Khan's word is law." *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 11 Jun 1998 23:51:57 +0200 (MET DST) From: =?iso-8859-1?Q?H=E5vard_R=F8nne_Faanes?= Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Arik's Imprisonment On Thu, 11 Jun 1998, SteelAngel wrote: >On Thu, 11 Jun 1998, [iso-8859-1] Håvard Rųnne Faanes wrote: >>probably exalted servants (of Ordana). Any ideas for these creatures other than that they look likle green elves? (hmm..white elves, black elves, green elves? This is starting to soun like Glorantha..) >Um. no.. there are no "little green men" in the Silver Princess. The only Little Green Men that deal with Mystara are either Reheddrian Benekander, or those Alien Druids living on Davania. I could be mixing up the modules. There is definately a module dealing with Haven which details Thendara and Protectors(green men), though I don't know which one it is. Håvard *** Haavard R. Faanes (hoc@nvg.ntnu.no) http://www.nvg.ntnu.no/~hoc "Every turkey dies. Not all turkeys truly live." -Chef, South Park *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 11 Jun 1998 14:55:00 -0700 From: "Jesse LaBranche" Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - AntiD&D controversy >So here's my question: >Should I openly "confess" my hobby? - Is it worth going through all the hassle of explaining all about the game to each person hearing this..? 'Cause that would indeed be necessary. >Jakup First off, I'd say don't try to keep it a secret. The more secretive and mysterious, the more rumor and propaganda will crop up because of it. Explain the game to those that it will make a difference with. Some people just won't listen, so don't try to explain to them. Just my thoughts. Jesse. *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 11 Jun 1998 23:56:33 +0200 (MET DST) From: =?iso-8859-1?Q?H=E5vard_R=F8nne_Faanes?= Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Arik's Imprisonment On Thu, 11 Jun 1998, Dominique Rivard wrote: >Haavard wrote: >Yeah, perhaps to much like Glorantha and it seems that the module I have is from an older version because I'm sure of it now, there's not an only immortal but many little green elf-like being. Anyway, it's I won't argue over this, I'll keep the protectors *and* I'll had the immortal, I like the sound of it. I may be mixing up these modules as I said in my previous post. >By the way, it's true that this adventure should be made more difficult and played by expert/companion level PCs. IMC that's what I've done. >Skål! Wheee :) >PS: But I'll let you the Aqvavit (not sure how to write it, but I'm sure how it tastes) Håvard, if you don't mind ;o) Thanks Tranquil! Håvard *** Haavard R. Faanes (hoc@nvg.ntnu.no) http://www.nvg.ntnu.no/~hoc "Every turkey dies. Not all turkeys truly live." -Chef, South Park *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 11 Jun 1998 17:56:33 EDT From: BoBoII@aol.com Subject: [MYSTARA] - Heresy I would officially like to anounce my membership in the Kollian Heresy, a non- cannon branch of wild thinkers who think Kolbolds should stay Kobolds. Date: Thu, 11 Jun 1998 19:50:35 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: phaser.Showcase.MPGN.COM: majordom set sender to owner-mystara-l@ using -f From: (mystara-digest) To: mystara-digest@Phaser.ShowCase.MPGN.COM Subject: mystara-digest V1997 #409 Reply-To: mystara@mpgn.com X-UIDL: 0f248201c5419e2e54665f76ba20956e Services will be held Daily in the Broken Lands Embassy near you. *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 11 Jun 1998 23:40:28 +0200 From: Fabrizio Paoli Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Human races in D&D was (Re: Midland Forest) At 05.01 11/06/98 PDT, paul dooley wrote: >IIRC it`s also hinted at in Gaz10 Orcs of Thar Wrong! IIRC in Gaz 10 it's hinted then a Troll queen may be a shadow elf. - -------------- Fabrizio Paoli brizio@lunet.it Home Page: http://www.geocities.com/TimesSquare/Dungeon/4560 - -------------- *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 11 Jun 1998 18:00:05 EDT From: BoBoII@aol.com Subject: Re: Re: Re: [MYSTARA] - Class Kits for the Known World In a message dated 6/11/98 8:32:53 AM, Rmunch wrote: < Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Arik's Imprisonment On Thu, 11 Jun 1998, Daly wrote: >Umm yes, hate to embarrass you but there were indeed little green men in Palace of the Silver Princess. They were called "the Protectors" and they were of the land of Faery. I understand B1-9 changed this for whatever reason...but B1-9 was in turn changed by Gaz1 which referred to Haven as a kind of Summer home for the Traladaran triad. So, I was right then :) Just thought I'd add that Mystaros wrote a rather cool article on Haven some time back. It is available on my Homepage. (And probably on lots of other pages too.) Håvard *** Haavard R. Faanes (hoc@nvg.ntnu.no) http://www.nvg.ntnu.no/~hoc "Every turkey dies. Not all turkeys truly live." -Chef, South Park *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 12 Jun 1998 00:01:42 +0200 From: Fabrizio Paoli Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Deformed Shadowelves At 17.25 11/06/98 EDT, JamugaKhan@aol.com wrote: >Can you power a space ship by a Chernobyl-like reactor? I think not. Well, you can power a submarine, so why not a space ship? >The energy devices of Blackmoor based on the technology from the Beagle, so it might be a matter-antimatter reaction device what caused the Great Rain of Fire. Matter-antimatter is another option, but I wouldn't discard nuclear power. - -------------- Fabrizio Paoli brizio@lunet.it Home Page: http://www.geocities.com/TimesSquare/Dungeon/4560 - -------------- *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 11 Jun 1998 18:08:21 EDT From: BoBoII@aol.com Subject: Re: Re: [MYSTARA] - Human races in D&D was (Re: Midland Forest) In a message dated 6/11/98 3:02:04 PM, Rmunch wrote: << King Thar is a Nosferatu, which explains his charming charisma and ability to win any fight with the magic weapon bereft orcs... All is not as it seems in the Broken Lands (Prince Jaggar being Thars advisor always cracks me up) Does GKoM say this, cause its really been dropped in the PWA's. *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 11 Jun 1998 17:50:30 EDT From: JamugaKhan@aol.com Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Human races in D&D was (Re: Midland Forest) << But then, wokani or SE, he still gets priest spells, and therefore there is no way he should be a prince. >> Check your rulebook: A wokani only casts magic-user spells, no cleric spells. Those guys are called shamans. Jamuga Khan "Hear and obey, because the Mighty Khan's word is law." *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 11 Jun 1998 17:50:28 EDT From: JamugaKhan@aol.com Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Adri Varma Plateau << No way. No cactuses in the entire M5, sorry :) I think Jamuga smoked something heavy before actually having that vision about animated cactuses on the Adri Varma... ;p The only beings living there i remember are the Sand Folk, detailed by Steve Wilson and on my site as well as Shawn's. >> Good! Keep thinking! Finally we will find it out. Unfortunately I have to disappoint you, Marco. I'm a non-smoker for more than 30 years now. This cannot be the reason. Despite the excellent material of some net-authors the source, if really existing, has to be an official TSR one. Jamuga Khan "Hear and obey, because the Mighty Khan's word is law." *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 11 Jun 1998 18:15:06 EDT From: Kaviyd@aol.com Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Almanac/Glantri In a message dated 98-06-08 07:27:53 EDT, Inconu@aol.com writes: >I have a Davanian campaign. In it, the Day of Dread is a complete mystery in wwhich many sages have been trying to figure out for a few years now. Also, reachers try to track it and hire bodyguards to protect them. Some have realized that the point of origin is to the north, but having a tough time pinpointing it. That is an interesting idea, but I was thinking of something other than the Day of Dread, which affects Glantri as well as the rest of the world. What I was trying to get at was the visible effects of the draining of Energy or Entropy. That Day of Dread does not seem to be a direct effect of the draining -- if it were, why would magic and not some sort of entropic energy be what fails on that day? The direct effects of draining should be least visible in Glantri, as that is where the Sphere being drained (Energy or Entropy) has its power concentrated -- thus Glantri was very "magic friendly" before WotI and is becoming more "entropic" after WotI. But there must be some more distant areas where the affected Sphere is being visibly weakened -- does anyone have any ideas about those? I would assume that such areas were becoming "magic poor" prior to WotI and now are being afflicted with "anti-entropy", but I am not quite sure what the visible effects would be. *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 12 Jun 1998 00:34:02 +0200 From: Fabrizio Paoli Subject: Re: Re: [MYSTARA] - Human races in D&D was (Re: Midland Forest) At 18.08 11/06/98 EDT, BoBoII@aol.com wrote: >In a message dated 6/11/98 3:02:04 PM, Rmunch wrote: ><< King Thar is a Nosferatu, which explains his charming >charisma and ability to win any fight with the magic weapon bereft orcs... >All is not as it seems in the Broken Lands (Prince Jaggar being Thars >advisor always cracks me up) >Does GKoM say this, cause its really been dropped in the PWA's. I think it has been dropped just because Thar is no more in the Broken Lands. He moved to the Northern Reaches after WotI, i.e. far from Jaggar. *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 11 Jun 1998 16:04:13 -0700 From: "Jesse LaBranche" Subject: [MYSTARA] - Cultural Edifice Complex >>Trust a YANK to ignore the fact that all the European knowledge was based upon Arabic ideas preserved and improved upon whilst Europe was in the DARK ages Interesting. The Arabians preserved and improved upon all knowledge while Arabia was in the DARK ages. Then came the Renaissance (The Enlightenment ?). Have you noticed that European knowledge isn't "based" upon Arabic ideas ? NO ! Europeans, also, preserved and improved upon this knowledge while Arabic countries remain third (or was it fourth ?) world countries !!! Alright. Did the Arabic ideas create siege equipment that was used in the dark ages ? These items became the working parts of machinery that later would result in the industrial revolution. Did Arabic ideas create armor ? Crossbows ? Guns ? Mortars ? Cannons ? What about Astrology ? Medicine ? Newspapers ? These were all things created by European nations, aren't they ? >Yeah, and humans were based on apes a couple of thousand years ago. >Thats a bit irrelevant IMO. >Pure academic knowledge (Greek philosophy?) doesnt get you anywhere. >Take gunpowder. The Chinese invented that a long, long time before the EEuropeans got their hands on it. But they didnt use it. Europe did, and changed the world. >The Industrial Revolution was probably the period of advancement that has defined the modern world. And that happened in Europe. ((I never thought I would spring to the defense of a YANK. :) Cheerz >ROB Hey, I'm a "Yank" and d*mned proud of it too :-) I don't see why we need to go into statements like "leave it to a YANK" on this list. If I want to hear my country, or any other slandered and squaked about, I'll read world political news and the like. BTW: Thanks Rob :-) Later. Jesse. *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 11 Jun 1998 19:43:05 EDT From: Inconu@aol.com Subject: [MYSTARA] - Jaggar's alignment >>Håvard wrote: >>According to G:KoM Jaggar is Lawful Evil. Most people who were familiar with the original Gaz found this absurd. DM wrote: >It seems with that set the writers took FAR too many liberties: Jaggar's alignment....... I think Jaggar's alignment is perfect at LE. Which part don't you agree with? He has been lawful to his country and his people over the years. Plus, he is obviously evil as well.....in my opinion. He eaisly has the most powerfull principality in the nation, and even though he has over a hundred magically created creatures (Mankins, golems, etc..) he would never think to help the less protected fellow principalities. Why? Because he looks out for number one; himself. This is why I personally didn't agree to the net-almanac's amputation to Jaggar idea. After all his protection and power that he now has, he is still constantly at work to ensure his own safety and doesn't bother with his weaker brother-principalities. This is why he is documented as evil, I believe. Rob wrote: >Lawful Evil - that could mean anything. Alignments MUST be broad - not a straitjacket! Jaggar (in G:KoM anyway) wanted to kick Ethie butt, for no other reason than his own racism. That is evil - maybe only slightly (hes not a Mouhahahah! type nutter like Landryn Teriak) - but not neutral. A agree with you about the Ethie problem. If Jaggar knew of a way to defeat the Ethies, he would do it....Regardless to how it would effect his friends or fellow countrymen. I'm not suggesting it would come down to that scale, but if it did....I believe he would definately choose to exterminate Ethengar. - -Inconu *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 11 Jun 1998 19:48:29 -0400 (EDT) From: SteelAngel Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Kols a Cleric! On Thu, 11 Jun 1998, Rob wrote: >A priest PRINCE in Glantri? Maybe he hasn't shown his Clericy powers yet, or maybe, G:KoM is a piece of Rubbish :) Max IV - /me votes for the latter, after seeing G:KoM for the first time *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 11 Jun 1998 17:50:09 -0600 From: "Leroy Van Camp III" Subject: [MYSTARA] - [ADMIN] Nationalistic Name Calling (was Cultural Edifice Complex) Jesse LaBranche meandered fecklessly... >>>Trust a YANK to ignore the fact that all the European knowledge was based upon Arabic ideas preserved and improved upon whilst Europe was in the DARK ages >Hey, I'm a "Yank" and d*mned proud of it too :-) I don't see why we need >to go into statements like "leave it to a YANK" on this list. If I want to >hear my country, or any other slandered and squaked about, I'll read world >political news and the like. Your right, we don't need this kind of nonsense. If anyone keeps it up I will be forced to prove to Max I am at least a step or two above mortal when it pertains to the list... Leroy Van Camp III malacoda@lesbois.com owner-mystara-l@mpgn.com ICQ #4253672 "You know, not kneeing you in the groin is a constant struggle." MST3K *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ End of mystara-digest V1997 #409 ******************************** *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara' as the body of the message. mystara-digest Friday, June 12 1998 Volume 1997 : Number 410 Mystara is a trademark of TSR Inc. All Rights Reserved. The following topics are covered in this digest: [MYSTARA] - i need maps Re: [MYSTARA] - Deformed Shadowelves Re: [MYSTARA] - Arik's Imprisonment Re: [MYSTARA] - Arik's Imprisonment Re: [MYSTARA] - Heresy Re: [MYSTARA] - Cultural Edifice Complex Re: [MYSTARA] - Cultural Edifice Complex Re: [MYSTARA] - Kol ID Re: [MYSTARA] - Deformed Shadowelves Re: [MYSTARA] - Arik's Imprisonment Re: [MYSTARA] - Almanac/Glantri Re: [MYSTARA] - The NoS and Entropy [MYSTARA] - Re: Immortals Re: [MYSTARA] - Kols a Cleric! Re: [MYSTARA] - Heresy [MYSTARA] - Thar is a Vampire (he never dvinks vine, either) Re: [MYSTARA] - G:KoM.. [MYSTARA] - Anti-D&D controversy: pre-empting (LONG) [none] Re: [MYSTARA] - G:KoM.. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Fri, 12 Jun 1998 01:53:02 +0200 From: Antonio =?iso-8859-1?Q?L=F3pez?= Mercader Subject: [MYSTARA] - i need maps Hello. Where can i found maps from mystara&savage coast? I`ve already got the heldann freeholds and savage coast from TSR *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 11 Jun 1998 19:59:08 -0400 (EDT) From: SteelAngel Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Deformed Shadowelves On Thu, 11 Jun 1998 JamugaKhan@aol.com wrote: >The energy devices of Blackmoor based on the technology from the Beagle, so it might be a matter-antimatter reaction device what caused the Great Rain of Fire. Rafiel was a Nuclear Physicist. Nuclear Physicists work with High energy Nuclear reactions. If the only technology that Blackmoor had was not nuclear in nature, then he would have been a particle physicist, or a plasma physicist, not Nuclear. Also, who gives you reign to go with Star Trek and proclaim that all starships run on Matter/Antimatter? SpellJammers, any Robotech-esque space vessel, and MANY other fantasy vessels run on other power sources. However I do agree that the NoS was M/AntiM, but whose to say that the computer banks of the Beagle ONLY contained info on that kind of drive? Finally, if the exploded device was Matter/Antimatter, explain the fallout in Ethengar, or the Broken Lands themselves, or the radiation induced Deformities! C'mon people, think a bit. This is fantasy, given, but theres a whole realm of Quasi-scientific fact going on on Mystara (And it's not just on Serraine!) Oh also, the SE's didn't cause the great rain. They Went bottomside hundreds of years later. Max IV *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 11 Jun 1998 20:03:10 -0400 (EDT) From: SteelAngel Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Arik's Imprisonment On Thu, 11 Jun 1998, Daly wrote: >Umm yes, hate to embarrass you but there were indeed little green men in Palace of the Silver Princess. They were called "the Protectors" and they were of the land of Faery. Ah ha. Y'see, the only mention B1-9 has of changes in TSP is the removal of a specially programmed intro. There was no mention of the removal of "the Protectors" the only mention of "The Protector" is the Immortal Thendara. I guess I'm working from Faulty documents here, but I would have assumed that B1-9 would have mentioned this change were it important. Anyhoo, I stand corrected from the original module's perspective. Max IV *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 11 Jun 1998 20:06:06 -0400 (EDT) From: SteelAngel Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Arik's Imprisonment On Thu, 11 Jun 1998 JamugaKhan@aol.com wrote: >Yes, maybe, but only because HE wouldn't be responsible for it. Don't forget that old T-Bone stands for the destruction of ALL things, planes inclusive. True, but Thanatos doesn't go around actually doing much. His biggest plot is the end of all existence, and that's all it is, a big plot. Thanatos is a plotter and a schemer, more than a outright destroyer. Not many Entropic Immortals work together. For all we know, Arik may have stepped all over Thanatos's plots. That's what peeves him more than anything. Max IV *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 11 Jun 1998 20:08:51 -0400 (EDT) From: SteelAngel Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Heresy On Thu, 11 Jun 1998 BoBoII@aol.com wrote: >I would officially like to anounce my membership in the Kollian Heresy, a non- cannon branch of wild thinkers who think Kolbolds should stay Kobolds. I'll donate a few thousand GP to that cause, where's my "Lon' Liv Kol (da Kobold!!!@@!@!)" Hat? Max IV :) *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 11 Jun 1998 20:11:39 -0400 (EDT) From: SteelAngel Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Cultural Edifice Complex On Thu, 11 Jun 1998, Jesse LaBranche wrote: >What about Astrology ? Medicine ? Newspapers ? These were all things created ^^^^^^^^^ Oops! Gypsies were usually of Moorish birth. :P Max IV *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 11 Jun 1998 17:30:34 -0700 From: "Jesse LaBranche" Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Cultural Edifice Complex >On Thu, 11 Jun 1998, Jesse LaBranche wrote: WWWhat about Astrology ? Medicine ? Newspapers ? These were all things created >Oops! Gypsies were usually of Moorish birth. :P >Max IV Okay I stand corrected. Astronomy not Astrology but I noticed that there was no comment on the other points or was that because of list moderation ? We could carry this private if you have a desire to, but it's really not part of Mystara. Later. Jesse. *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 11 Jun 1998 21:21:59 -0400 (EDT) From: Glen Sprigg Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Kol ID At 02:32 PM 6/11/98 -0400, you wrote: >On Thu, 11 Jun 1998, DM wrote: >>"Joshuan is a CRAP! All halflings are CRAP, for that matter! This is only ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ >Step outside for a few minutes, Ludwig. I have a master who'd like to talk to you... Hey, Ludwig! I trust you're enjoying your last few moments of freedom...not all the Princes in Glantri will be able to hide you much longer. The King has a few things to discuss with you. I understand beheading was mentioned, as were hanging, and drawing and quartering. You get to choose which one is done to you. I will find you. Karamekian justice will be served. Sir Alexius Dannelaran *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 11 Jun 1998 21:41:40 -0700 (PDT) From: Dominique Rivard Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Deformed Shadowelves In GAZ13, about the NoS, they talk of a nuclear power plant, of immortals of the sphere of energy that discovered a nuclear reactor... they speak of radiation to. But when it come to deformities, the word used is corruption. I like it better, I don't intend to become a Nuclear physicist myself to master a game about the NoS ;o) So corruption, for me, refer to entropy so, to the curse the immortals of Matter, Thought and Time putted on the NoS. The deformities could be the work of entropy itself, not some side-effect of the power invoqued. Also, they effectively speak of radiation death but only when you're near the NoS. PS: Is there evidence that before the curse mortals could be corrupted by using the NoS? == Tharquil's French D&D Homepage at http://www.geocities.com/Area51/Rampart/5201 _________________________________________________________ DO YOU YAHOO!? Get your free @yahoo.com address at http://mail.yahoo.com *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 11 Jun 1998 21:51:25 -0700 (PDT) From: Dominique Rivard Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Arik's Imprisonment In WotI, it's written that imprisonnement is often the penalty for Immortals who have deliberately destroyed a fellow Immortal. == Tharquil's French D&D Homepage at http://www.geocities.com/Area51/Rampart/5201 _________________________________________________________ DO YOU YAHOO!? Get your free @yahoo.com address at http://mail.yahoo.com *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 12 Jun 1998 01:22:49 EDT From: Kaviyd@aol.com Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Almanac/Glantri In a message dated 98-06-08 12:49:23 EDT, ezaqwazy@hotmail.com writes: >What I`m refering to is the fact that in Gaz3 Jagger had become the Star DDragon but stepped down when he realised what he had done! This is all irrelevant due to Diamonds writeup in WotI, but wouldn`t a Lawful creatur like the Great One sort of pay off an old debt? Jagger didn`t break any rules according to gaz3 but when he realised the cost to dragonkind he stepped down a verh lawful (OD&D) thing to do. Doing the right thing is sometimes rewarded just so it happens again! You missed the point of my question -- I was not asking WHY the dragons should aid Jaggar (I do accept the argument that they might owe him a favor) but HOW they could aid him. Are you suggesting, perhaps, that the Star Dragon might cast a clerical "Regenerate" spell on Jaggar to give him his arm back? And would Jaggar accept help of that sort, given the negative effects of receiving such help in such a public manner? Or are you suggesting that the Star Dragon would use a "Wish" on his behalf? Certainly Jaggar would accept that form of aid, even though Jaggar would now be deeply in debt to the Star Dragon. *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 12 Jun 1998 01:23:51 EDT From: Kaviyd@aol.com Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - The NoS and Entropy In a message dated 98-06-08 13:03:09 EDT, ezaqwazy@hotmail.com writes: >What about one of the fair folk? what with the reopening of the Alfheim aaccess they have openings to both in & out IIRC its in AZcan empire That depends -- when was this "Alfheim access" reopened? Hollow World events would have had to have been reported during the years 1010-1012, although it is obvious that Joshuan either did not know or chose to ignore the reports of this correspondent. *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 12 Jun 1998 01:23:57 EDT From: Kaviyd@aol.com Subject: [MYSTARA] - Re: Immortals In a message dated 98-06-08 13:57:58 EDT, ezaqwazy@hotmail.com writes: >AH but what about the loss of political power inherant in this? Politics aas much as magic is the lifeblood of Glantri just look at the infighting going on over what happened to Jagger! If Ettienne is back he needs to have his powerbase to stave off the rise of entropy in Glantri <;-P But what he wants to do is increase the overall power of the "anti-Entropic" Princes -- increasing his own power at the cost of antagonizing a "good" Prince would be contrary to Etienne's purposes. By refusing the charge of Grand Master of the School he secures Harald's friendship -- and he may be able to secure yet another ally by supporting that Prince or Princess for Chamberlain. Presumably he would pick dependable allies who would not turn on him -- there are actually one or two Glantrian rulers who could be counted on in this regard. If he chooses his allies wisely, then the allies gained would far outweigh the charges lost or foregone. *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 12 Jun 1998 01:24:01 EDT From: Kaviyd@aol.com Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Kols a Cleric! In a message dated 98-06-11 14:56:25 EDT, rmunch@easynet.co.uk writes: >What almost tempts me to throw G:KoM in the bin is the fact that, get tthis... >PRINCE KOL IS A PRIEST!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! >he's listed as a 10/7 mage/cleric shadowelf. >A priest PRINCE in Glantri? I am inclined to disbelieve this one myself. Based on his D&D stats, Kol should be a Fighter/Mage. I think they made him a Cleric because according to the _Complete Book of Humanoids_ that is the only way a goblinoid can learn any Wizard spells. As far as Mystara goes, that is nonsense -- in that world goblinoids can and do learn wizardly magic, with or without (preferably without) learning priestly magic as well. So I am inclined to believe that the tale of Kol being a cleric is just a libel spread by a sage from Oerth or Toril who mistakenly thought he "knew" that no mere kobold could be a true Mage. *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 12 Jun 1998 01:24:03 EDT From: Kaviyd@aol.com Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Heresy In a message dated 98-06-11 18:13:54 EDT, BoBoII@aol.com writes: >I would officially like to anounce my membership in the Kollian Heresy, a non-cannon branch of wild thinkers who think Kolbolds should stay Kobolds. >Services will be held Daily in the Broken Lands Embassy near you. Hold on there -- until the MML as a whole denounces you (make that us) as heretics, let us try to put forward this viewpoint as the "orthodox" view, which indeed it was up through the AC 1011 PWA. I personally think that Kol may have had some Shadow Elf ancestry -- but that is a far cry from saying that he is a Shadow Elf -- given the number after his name, he must be mostly Kobold. *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 12 Jun 1998 08:56:23 +0100 From: "Rob" Subject: [MYSTARA] - Thar is a Vampire (he never dvinks vine, either) ><< King Thar is a Nosferatu, which explains his charming >charisma and ability to win any fight with the magic weapon bereft orcs... >All is not as it seems in the Broken Lands (Prince Jaggar being Thars >advisor always cracks me up) >Does GKoM say this, cause its really been dropped in the PWA's. PWA2, page 146... Combat Notes, level 30 orc, 9HD Nosferatu, #AT 1 bite or bastard sword... For that matter, the Orcs of Thar, page 15 - "during a recent raid Thar intercepted a convoy and captured a valuable spellbook belonging to the Date: Fri, 12 Jun 1998 07:51:32 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: phaser.Showcase.MPGN.COM: majordom set sender to owner-mystara-l@ using -f From: (mystara-digest) To: mystara-digest@Phaser.ShowCase.MPGN.COM Subject: mystara-digest V1997 #410 Reply-To: mystara@mpgn.com X-UIDL: da8613ff1678ca1990f2b421ffbafd77 Wizard Prince of Boldavia, a powerful Nosferatu... Thar was defeated and shortly became a nosferatu himself. He is only mentioned in about a line in G:KoM. Cheerz ROB *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 12 Jun 1998 09:49:01 +0000 (GMT) From: Gordon McCormick Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - G:KoM.. DM Wrote: >At 14.41 11/06/98 +0200, Haavard wrote: AAAccording to G:KoM Jaggar is Lawful Evil. Most people who were familiar with the original Gaz found this absurd. >This is one of the hundreds reasons i HATE G:Ko...groan.. It seems with that set the writers took FAR too many liberties: Jaggar's alignment, new barons who won a title only because "friends" of this or that noble, Kol's incredible and useless ID change.. and i could go on, but it really gives me headache... The turning of intricate politics into a more simplicstic "goodies" and "baddies" camps, the lack of NPC descriptions, the lack of the "Atmosphere setting" things that they had in Gaz3 (not the same ones, but they could've come up with something that imparted a similiar sense of the setting), oops, getting a headache I see what you mean :) gordon *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 12 Jun 1998 05:54:37 -0400 (EDT) From: Pierre Savoie Subject: [MYSTARA] - Anti-D&D controversy: pre-empting (LONG) >Date: Thu, 11 Jun 1998 00:13:04 +0100 >From: elrond@post.olivant.fo (Jakup Michaelsen) Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - AntiD&D controversy >Over here the main source of this is Norwegian books. In my church a lot of people read such books, and thus their attitude. Sorry Håvard :-) How easily can the Faeroese read Norwegian? If such anti-D&D information came through in Norwegian books, you may want to find if there was ever a Norwegian or Danish D&D boxed set. These would be even more readable to you than English. On French-language radio here in Toronto, Canada, I was interviewed and the final question was "What would you say to a parent who is worried about his teen playing D&D?" My answer which was particularly euphonious in French was, "Il faut tout d'abord comprendre que ce sont des LIVRES, ils peuvent e^tre LUS!" (One must understand first of all that these are BOOKS; they can be READ!) A direct look at D&D itself disprove theories against it. Only by successfully talking AROUND the hobby instead of talking ABOUT the hobby can a fraud-artist gain credibility. One tactic is trying to stir up horror at quotations from early editions of AD&D -- quotations often falsely presented with a lot of (...) marks, deliberately confusing the player with the actions the character takes, or equating medieval-type fantasy with the "actual" occult! The mix of lies and fear has a two-fold effect: the lies are for the believers, the fear is to keep the gamers' heads down so that the lack of response only confirms the lies about the hobby that it is some sinister cult, and so the cycle reinforces itself as bolder and bolder lies can be told, the more the local gamers don't want to confront the mess. Mike Stackpole had this to say about Patricia Pulling, a particularly energetic anti-D&D promoter: "[She] is the Exxon Valdez of ignorance. She's full of it, she's leaking it all over the place, and it's up to others to clean up the mess." The language barrier does not keep out anti-D&D stuff, it just delays it by a few years, 10 or 15 years even. A group of Italian gamers started to complain when news media IN 1994 started to latch on to D&D as an "explanation" for bad teens. They fought back with their own association and a Web-site: http://www.sincretech.it/3M/Stop-Non-Sense/Index-English.html They designed a logo "RPGs Care for a Better Living -- Do Not Let Them Die" which they invite anyone to stick on their own Web- page. The English version of their slogan is perhaps stilted, but the sentiment is welcome... >So here's my question: >Should I openly "confess" my hobby? - Is it worth going through all the hassle of explaining all about the game to each person hearing this..? >'Cause that would indeed be necessary. You run the risk of some religious minister adopting the topic of D&D as one of many "teen problems" and then he will do sermons bad-mouthing D&D as one of many "problems of society." Or even a non-religious media-hound will do so, like "Geraldo Rivera" or "Jerry Springer" in the U.S. Any such person could begin to add D&D to his litany of "social evils", any time. But you don't have to WAIT for it... The cure is to be open and public about what these role- playing games are. ANTICIPATE and PRE-EMPT any bad claims by politely showing the mistaken origin of American bad claims. There's plenty of information now available to answer any question, and evidence of the origin of anti-D&D stuff from VERY unsavory groups. With that, you will "let the air out of their tires" before they can even begin to roll. Of course, there's no need to be angry at at EVERYONE. Most people are innocents who have only "heard something" vague against the game. There are only a few truly active fraud-artists in each area of the world. Like someone suggested, if you wait for some minister to try to pull an anti-D&D scam as has been done before in the U.S., and THEN the local gamers appear to crawl into their shells, the believers will take this as evidence of guilt, of something hidden going on. Take the offensive! Complain publicly about these publications as slander; say that's not the way it is; take the importers to court, even! If some claims or books DO show up, you could do what I did -- relentlessly research and find out exactly what the book's sources were. Don't accept what sounds plausible to the religious mind: insist on REAL evidence that a suicide or murder was actually motivaged because of the game, or D&D causes "loss of reality." The sources always go back to two American ministers: Rev. R. Cotter (who got his start through the organization of Rev. John S. Torrell in Sacramento; 1980) and Albert James Dager (who published "Media Spotlight", a rather silly little Christian newsletter). In researching one such tract I got a surprising result: a Catholic tract widely circulated in North America against Dungeons & Dragons, called "Games Unsuspecting People Play", 1983, was pulled from the shelves when I showed that the author, Louise Shanahan, cited two notoriously ANTI-Catholic ministers as her sole source of information (the ones above)! Dager even compared the "evil of D&D" to the "evil" of the Catholic Church (a comment he disguised by the code-words "Babylon Mystery Religion")! The publishers (The Daughters of St. Paul) not only HAD to withdraw it but admitted to me they won't accept any more manuscripts from Louise Shanahan. This may help: the particular Christian sect of these people may not appeal to the brands of Christianity practiced in the Faeroes. Of course I inadvertently made that tract a collector's item, fetching a high price. Has anybody seen one? It was unintentionally hilarious, with lines like: "The adolescent cannot truly understand the profound and complex changes that will steadily occur in his life and personality as he surrenders his self-control and mind to the game. The graphs and maps he has prepared secretly in his room at night after everyone else has gone to bed become his prized possession. He is as "hooked" on Dungeons and Dragons as the addict is tied to his drugs..." This was funny to me because I *LIKE* drawing maps by hand; I can't wait to improve my computer so I can use the map-making software designed for DMs. I wouldn't say I cherish or fetishize any of them -- except for a map of GOTHICUS, a "cyberpunk" dance-club which I think is a really cool place what with its mechanical spiders and bats moving around inside. Too bad it doesn't REALLY exist... This sort of tract is loaded with many buried assumptions: that D&D-players are all teen-agers, that they are "hiding" their activity, that it becomes all-consuming. It *could* take up all of a person's recreational time, but so what? There is reason to JUSTIFY the individual's own choice, and since there's no more harm in it than golf or other established hobbies no one questions, there's no real problem. I have even seen contradictory claims people made while smearing the game, which I reworked into a slogan: They say D&D is "childish" but also "too complicated." They say D&D is "boring" but also "obsessive". "They" must be awfully confused. But most of all, explain what this hobby really is. Tie it into computer RPGs as well; nobody risks criticizing those because he would look like a reactionary Luddite, resistant to progress. All role-playing is is where players control complex CHARACTERS instead of playing-pieces on a board. Maybe you can even design a simple (tabletop) RPG in your own language. The rules structure does not need to be complicated. I've seen RPG rules as short as 12 pages in small type! Some notes on the right "attitude" towards role-playing are necessary as well. Otherwise, new players may play RPGs as if they were some sort of paper-and-pencil video-game, with no storytelling or role-playing fun. The "philosophy" of good role-playing is found in the occasional "how to RPG" books which have appeared in North America, such as: - --DICING WITH DRAGONS by Ian Livingstone (1982,83,86) - --ROLE-PLAYING MASTERY and MASTER OF THE GAME by Gary Gygax (1987 and 1989) - --HEROIC WORLDS by Lawrence Schick (Prometheus Press, 1991) - --THE FANTASY ROLE-PLAYING GAMER'S BIBLE by Sean Patrick Fannon, Prima Publishing, 1996). The later books tended to be larger "catalogues" of available games, but such lists quickly went out of date. Gygax's books were the most heavily about the "philosophy" of role-playing games. But DICING WITH DRAGONS was the best for new players, if you can still find it (published by two British publishing houses and Signet in the U.S.) - ---Pierre Savoie (ab966@torfree.net) Freedom to play games! Don't let them play games with our freedom! ** May 11th is Baron von Munchhausen's birthday--the first modern teller of "tall tales." Role-players could consider celebrating this date with more role-playing than they usually do.. ** *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 12 Jun 1998 05:59:20 -0400 (EDT) From: Pierre Savoie Subject: [none] >Date: Thu, 11 Jun 1998 05:23:55 PDT >From: "paul dooley" Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Cultural Edifice Complex >Well, such cultures can be safely ignored when there are innovations in >Europe which had no counterpart anywhere else, such as the Scientific Method, >Trust a YANK to ignore the fact that all the european knowledge was based upon Arabic ideas preserved and improved upon whilst europe was in the DARK ages 1) If you mean me, I am a Canadian. 2) European knowledge derived from the observational compilations of the Greeks and Romans, and their (often incorrect) declarations of what the laws of nature are (like matter being composed of only Earth, Air, Fire and Water, for example). 3) The Arabs preserved this knowledge (without improving on it), but so did Irish monks. Before the Greeks and Romans, the Arabs were nothing. 4) If the Arabs and Europeans are "offspring" to the same sources of knowledge, that does not make one offspring the "parent" of another. 5) We really must do away with all these historical notions that "steamroll the world" and try to make all cultures equally valid (the doctrine of Cultural Relativism.) We have to make objective choices and decisions about who comes out the best. 6) There STILL was no counterpart to the Scientific Method anywhere else but in Europe. Without this efficient mechanism, which is our only reliable means of arriving at solutions to problems, there is no real progress. Progress is often mired and stopped cold by adherence to dogma and tradition rather than active fact-finding. I think trying to obscure this is an attack on the European diaspora, making those of us unable to feel deserved pride at the great leap forward of the Age of Enlightenment that ultimately mapped the whole world and doubled the maximum human lifespan through navigational and medical knowledge. >Date: Thu, 11 Jun 1998 07:56:05 PDT >From: "paul dooley" Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Cultural Edifice Complex >>Umm.. nope. It was the Celtic Monestaries which retained most of the Roman learning during the dark ages (Right up until the Papacy decided that they knew too much) >ZERO, Medicine etc all I`m trying to say is that eurocentricity is essentially wrong. All that my ancestors did was MISuse the things that they AND others had learned, BUT that`s what everyone does anyway. WE were just more ruthless about it! There was a time when I would have mutely acquiesced to this kind of thinking. But during university I realized the silliness of political groups roaming around campus, trying to make what is ugly and backwards into something beautiful and progrssive. I decided not to accept the White Guilt Syndrome any more. Consider that the Rwandans have killed 800,000 of their own people, more than the number of people who have perished in Japan due to atomic blasts -- and the Rwandans achieved this figure BY HAND, using machetes. Does mere technological prowess in killing, sparingly used after diplomacy fails, make one more ruthless than a whole population seized with blind hate (of a non-racial kind, at that)? Or does it just make the killers "by-hand" more ignorant? Is their lack of technology in killing some kind of virtue when their intent is much more intense than in our contented, peaceful, advanced, in-touch societies? After all, they didn't invent liberalism and racial tolerance and pacifism: the European-descended did. I am not going to start onto the spiral of self-hate. To be Eurocentric is no different from acknowledging that a horse-race did not end in an 8-way tie. - ---Pierre Savoie (ab966@torfree.net) "I refuse to beat myself up." --Stuart Smalley's Personal Affirmations [by Al Franken], SATURDAY NIGHT LIVE *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 12 Jun 1998 12:51:47 +0100 From: "Rob" Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - G:KoM.. >>According to G:KoM Jaggar is Lawful Evil. Most people who were familiar with the original Gaz found this absurd. >This is one of the hundreds reasons i HATE G:Ko...groan.. It seems with that set the writers took FAR too many liberties: Jaggar's alignment, new barons who won a title only because "friends" of this or that noble, Kol's incredible and useless ID change.. and i could go on, but it really gives me headache... >The turning of intricate politics into a more simplicstic "goodies" and "baddies" camps, Only if you let it. Goodies and baddies? The Kingpriest of Istar on Krynn was Lawful Good, but it didnt stop him from being a genocidal Nazi who angered the Gods and caused the Cataclysm. Just because your evil doesnt mean your a bad person... "I take alignment with a pinch of salt, a slice of lemon, and a shot tequila" Cheerz ROB *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ End of mystara-digest V1997 #410 ******************************** *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara' as the body of the message. mystara-digest Friday, June 12 1998 Volume 1997 : Number 411 Mystara is a trademark of TSR Inc. All Rights Reserved. The following topics are covered in this digest: Re: [MYSTARA] - Arik's Imprisonment Re: [MYSTARA] - Deformed Shadowelves Re: [MYSTARA] - G:KoM.. Re: [MYSTARA] - The NoS and Entropy Re: [MYSTARA] - Spelljammer and Mystara (was: Why Mystara?) Re: [MYSTARA] - The NoS and Entropy Re: [MYSTARA] - Deformed Shadowelves/Ranger Kits Re: [MYSTARA] - Deformed Shadowelves Re: [MYSTARA] - Arik's Imprisonment Re: [MYSTARA] - Heresy Re: [MYSTARA] - Human races in D&D was (Re: Midland Forest) Re: Re: [MYSTARA] - Human races in D&D was (Re: Midland Forest) Re: [MYSTARA] - G:KoM.. Re: [MYSTARA] - Cultural Edifice Complex Re: [MYSTARA] - Re: Immortals Re: [MYSTARA] - The NoS and Entropy Re: [MYSTARA] - Almanac/Glantri [MYSTARA] - Gareth 6 : Gareth = an Old One Re: [MYSTARA] - Deformed Shadowelves Re: [MYSTARA] - Gareth 6 : Gareth = an Old One Re: [MYSTARA] - Cultural Edifice Complex Re: [MYSTARA] - Deformed Shadowelves/Ranger Kits ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Fri, 12 Jun 1998 06:17:47 PDT From: "paul dooley" Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Arik's Imprisonment >Just asking but when did the City of the Stars get a curse? OK I goofed just a bit the curse is upon users of soul crystals and was set there by Rafiel who made it happen that a users decendants would suffer deformities rather than the user themselves (I reread Gaz13 to check my facts, but I did IIRC didn`t I?) <;-P ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 12 Jun 1998 06:26:54 PDT From: "paul dooley" Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Deformed Shadowelves >>Interesting idea. IIrc the deformities are what the curse on CotS iis,you >>get the power,your descendants the problems. This could lead to a counterbalance of the entropy loss from NoS if the deformities become more widespread. >Yeah, but I was thinking that perhaps the deformities effects could be the result of a subtle plot by Atzy on the CotS. He would have been making somewhat the same thing Hel did to create the beastmen to make humanoid races more powerful over time. Well if we put your idea with my idea and any others that come to light and use them all the PCs will not know what hit `em. Imagine them scurrying round to fix the problem and they find out its several (sort of like the way RS cure is several interlinked). <;-P ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 12 Jun 1998 14:27:42 +0000 (GMT) From: Gordon McCormick Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - G:KoM.. Rob pontificated: >>>According to G:KoM Jaggar is Lawful Evil. Most people who were familiar with the original Gaz found this absurd. >>This is one of the hundreds reasons i HATE G:Ko...groan.. It seems with that set the writers took FAR too many liberties: Jaggar's alignment, new barons who won a title only because "friends" of this or that noble, Kol's incredible and useless ID change.. and i could go on, but it really gives me headache... >>The turning of intricate politics into a more simplicstic "goodies" and "baddies" camps, >Only if you let it. Yup, it's up to the DM how intricate the setting becomes, just on my readings through G:KOM (admitedlly not for a while now), it seemed more Black and White than before. On the other hand it does have cool spells :) >Goodies and baddies? The Kingpriest of Istar on Krynn was Lawful Good, but it didnt stop him from being a genocidal Nazi who angered the Gods and caused the Cataclysm. I loved the whole Genocidal stuff by the Kingpriest, I didn't know he was Lawful Good though, I mean presumably he started that way, but nonetheless, it's nice to see how "good" can be in the eye of the beholder. >Just because your evil doesnt mean your a bad person... :) Er, OK if you say so :) >"I take alignment with a pinch of salt, a slice of lemon, and a shot tequila" ROTFL! :) :) gordon, who still thinks alignments are silly anyway *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 12 Jun 1998 06:36:12 PDT From: "paul dooley" Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - The NoS and Entropy >My problem stems from the fact that all spells are granted to clerics by >the Immortals regardless of their sphere Perhaps you could restrict them yourself, If you use AD&D you could give them access to spheres at your convenience. such as would only get major access to Time and Water if patron was of Time etc. >Say a cleric of an Immortal of Thought ask for a spell like Purify Food and Water (which would probably be a spell concerning Matter) water related spells seem to call out for Time though since its the usuall relationship >Just seems like the >spheres of the Immortals aren't true spheres of power or substance but only a view of the universe. I think that that is it in a nutshell its more a way of looking at the Mystaraverse through ones own version of rose tinted spectacles, but thats just IMO <;-P ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 12 Jun 1998 06:58:04 PDT From: "paul dooley" Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Spelljammer and Mystara (was: Why Mystara?) ><> >Answering to Paul: I haven't really understood your point. Are u saying >that spelljammers are so big it's impossible to use them in a campaign No what I meant is that voidships count as one item and are huge helms can be Dispel Magiced (the seperation of a common language rears its ugly head yetagain and the fact is voidships have magic atmospheres spell jammers have to renew theirs periodically. sorry about the confusion i`ve only ever played SJ so my GM might have been playing fast `n`loose with the rules! If s0o more power to him! <;-P ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 12 Jun 1998 07:06:13 PDT From: "paul dooley" Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - The NoS and Entropy >I disliked that intensely. It also makes it very hard to run an Immortals >campaign! Spheres are like Immortal classes almost. >I revert the the Sacred Gold Box and the Magic Circle for what Immortals can >do. I also like the idea of Immortals expending TPs to cast spells. (Even >tho it makes them substantially weaker!) Have you read Primal Order by WotC (I think) it gives some more ideas for this level of campaign nothing radical but it does suprise PCs who think they`ve got the rules down pat. Don`t you just LOATHE them?? <;-P ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 12 Jun 1998 07:09:44 PDT From: "paul dooley" Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Deformed Shadowelves/Ranger Kits >ROB (who is, of course, a Fighter/Mage/Thief with the DM kit :) and here was me thinking that you were F/M/C who has the thief God/Immortal as your patron and therefore get all the thief abilities!! <;-P ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 12 Jun 1998 07:17:05 PDT From: "paul dooley" Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Deformed Shadowelves >Can you power a space ship by a Chernobyl-like reactor? I think not. However if your using a ramscoop type you`ll need something to provide the initial power fission reactors work fine for that. Think of them as the primer,anyway this is way off topic so ill finish now <;-P ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 12 Jun 1998 07:29:10 PDT From: "paul dooley" Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Arik's Imprisonment >So I suppose it is up to whatever works in your campaign... Yes this is the real CANON! However going back to my earlier rant about the online almanacs, firstly let me say THANK YOU to those wh put in the time and effort, you did a real good job! All that my postings on various points were meant to show was that if I could find some sort of quick fix then so could any player and there`s nothing worse than not being allowed to fix something just because the rules say so! Those involved are trying to keep Mystara alive and kicking, more power to them, but if their ideas begin to have less and less bearing on our own campaigns we will either a not use it in future or B tell them what we think is going wrong and all of us attempt to fix it in such a way that its closer to what we as individuals want as a resource for our campaigns! Rant over normal service wiil be resumed in 3-2-1 anything you still can`t cope with is your own affair <;-P ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 12 Jun 1998 07:34:14 PDT From: "paul dooley" Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Heresy To quote fromTalking Heads `Once in a Lifetime` "MY GOD WHAT HAVE I DONE!!" ttfn, Paul ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 12 Jun 1998 07:41:18 PDT From: "paul dooley" Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Human races in D&D was (Re: Midland Forest) >Wrong! IIRC in Gaz 10 it's hinted then a Troll queen may be a shadow elf. >-------------- IIRC there are 5 box sets of rules the cyclo, 14 gaz, PC1-4,G:Ko0M, K;KoA, DotE, CoM,HW, 3 HW gaz, 4 HWadv, WotI etc can YOU remember exactly where ALL this stuff is? I can`t but since my puter and my games stuff are in two seperate locations ill comment to the best of my memory and will thank those who can correct my mistakes cos ill not make the SAME one again! <;-P ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 12 Jun 1998 07:44:32 PDT From: "paul dooley" Subject: Re: Re: [MYSTARA] - Human races in D&D was (Re: Midland Forest) ><< King Thar is a Nosferatu, which explains his charming >charisma and ability to win any fight with the magic weapon bereft orcs... >All is not as it seems in the Broken Lands (Prince Jaggar being Thars >advisor always cracks me up) >Does GKoM say this, cause its really been dropped in the PWA's. I think it wasdropped because Thar was no longer in power and J didn`t need to influence him anymore ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 12 Jun 1998 10:47:22 EDT From: CRlPTONITE@aol.com Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - G:KoM.. Haavard wrote: >According to G:KoM Jaggar is Lawful Evil. Most people who were familiar with the original Gaz found this absurd. Rob wrote: >Just because your evil doesnt mean your a bad person... You are absolutly right, Rob. The term "Evil" in the game AD&D is different from Websters definition. The people who Haavard mentions were familiar with the Gaz's but they are not familiar with the AD&D alignment system. AD&Ds "evil" means that the character cares more about himself than for others. A good character will try to help the world while an evil character will only help himself. In Jaggar's case the Lawful Evil alignment fits fine. I just think TSR choose a bad term to represent those people. That's the whole problem. Once you understand Websters "evil" isn't the same thing as AD&Ds "evil" you will understand Jaggar's alignment. - --- -- --Criptonite *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 12 Jun 1998 07:53:22 PDT From: "paul dooley" Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Cultural Edifice Complex I`ve already said it once , but I`ll say it again It was a badly thoght out (eg No thought ) joke which has ba;lloned out of all proportionto what was intended. Basically I believe that ALL forms of nationalism,racism etc are basicall harmful and they scare me because so many people blindly follow on. You laugh at that which frightens you in order to make it less frightening. ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 12 Jun 1998 08:15:39 PDT From: "paul dooley" Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Re: Immortals there are actually one or two Glantrian rulers wwho could be counted on in this regard. If he chooses his allies wisely, >then the allies gained would far outweigh the charges lost or foregone. *************************************************************************** A good point, so what were looking at is some sort of alliance between Etienne, Harald, the princess with th dragon pretending to be her uncle, and the white wolf who IIRC are all goodguys? With the help of Jagger who is now deadset against Dolores! This could be another way to help Jaggers arm by the tradeof recovery in excange for membership in this faction. Does anyone have the figures to hand to see what sort of votepower were talking about here? is this enough to get things done or do we need more? I`ve left out the Erewan elves cos IIRC they are going to be a part of neew Alfheim aren`t they? Perhaps only some of them though thatwould be another one for the good guys. On the other side we have Dolores, Kol, Morphail and Brannart probably with the belcadiz elves voting with them in opposition to any erewan vote. Looks like the price of poison will be going up in Glantri for the forseeable future ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 12 Jun 1998 08:20:00 PDT From: "paul dooley" Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - The NoS and Entropy >That depends -- when was this "Alfheim access" reopened? IIRC it was one of the things that came up with the resurgence of Alpheim in one of the online almanacs, but lets be honest would you Date: Fri, 12 Jun 1998 13:11:08 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: phaser.Showcase.MPGN.COM: majordom set sender to owner-mystara-l@ using -f From: (mystara-digest) To: mystara-digest@Phaser.ShowCase.MPGN.COM Subject: mystara-digest V1997 #411 Reply-To: mystara@mpgn.com X-UIDL: 90f48803a9b6ce69f7b0ec26e5859fec trust a faerie with the giving of truthful and prompt information. their life expectancy is even more than an elf ifthey keep outof trouble but maybe it could still work ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 12 Jun 1998 08:30:13 PDT From: "paul dooley" Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Almanac/Glantri >You missed the point of my question -- I was not asking WHY the dragons should aid Jaggar (I do accept the argument that they might owe him a favor) but HOW they could aid him. Are you suggesting, perhaps, that the Star Dragon might cast a clerical "Regenerate" spell on Jaggar to give him his arm back? And would Jaggar accept help of that sort, given >the negative effects of receiving such help in such a public manner? >Or are you suggesting that the Star Dragon would use a "Wish" on his behalf? Certainly Jaggar would accept that form of aid, even though Jaggar would now be deeply in debt to the Star Dragon. *************************************************************************** Why do it in person? the dragonrulers have priesthoods and either a sufficiently powerful cleric could heal Jagger or a group which has a follower of a dragon as a member may have a suitable item for the job and parties greed(NEVER to be underestimated) could be directed to aid Jagger who is still a prince and has many friends (sSMART pcs are greedy for more than just gold). This is just off of the top of my head there must be loads of ways of getting Jaggers arm back that I haven`t covered yet ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 12 Jun 1998 17:55:32 CEST From: "Herve Musseau" Subject: [MYSTARA] - Gareth 6 : Gareth = an Old One Another possibility hinted to by WotI and the PWAs is that Gareth may be an Old One. The tricky part is, before we can see what it implies, we must first determine WHAT is an Old One. a. Old One is another term for DM This was probably what was originally intended by the designers of the game. There is nothing more powerful, gamewise, than the Immortals [though you may consider the Powers of AD&D more powerful IYC], and what's beyond are the DMs - the only beings that can do more than mere Immortals, as they can alter reality, kill Immortals, or even make all reality to stop by no more playing D&D! In that case, Old Ones are just a myth for the Immortals, with no game reality. The Old One that appears at the end of WotI is an alias of you, the DM, or of Aaron Allston. And if Gareth is also an Old One, then it's also your alter ego directly altering the world (or Ann Dupuis's). As the DM is almighty in his campaign, then Gareth is too. Dot. And he does exactly what wish... b. Old Ones are the Dark Powers This is based on Marco's work "Ravenloft and Mystara: A possible (frightening) connection." I also think someone wrote a scenario of an old war between the Dark Powers and the Immortals long, long ago, ending with the Dark Powers being imprisoned, though I can't find the original post. So there are Dark Powers that have huge powers, maybe even greater than the Immortals', but they were banished to another dimension long ago (similar to the Carnifex). Immortals lost knowledge of this war and the Dark Powers, and have begun to suppose the existence of the Old Ones, whose powers would be to theirs what theirs are to mortals'. The Old Ones live in the Vortex Dimension, protected by the Vortex. What the Immortals do not know is that the Vortex is also called the Mists, and that the Vortex Dimension is just another name for Ravenloft... The Dark Powers are trapped inside and can normally not do much except swallow people and places into the Lands of the Mists. But one of them has somehow managed to escape, or to have a part of him (an avatar?) escape the Vortex and roam the Multiverse... In that case you have an Entropic-like scenario, just even darker. The escaped Dark Power's goal is to complete the process of freeing himself from Ravenloft, and/or free the other Dark Powers so they can reclaim the Multiverse for their dark ends. Why did the Dark Power appear before Ixion and Rad at the end of WotI and stopped the war, when his goal should be to bring chaos? Well, the NoS is a key to freeing the Dark Powers! When Rad activated it and caused the WWM, this Dark Power escaped. However, it was insufficient to completely free him/them all. So he arranged for the NoS to become tied to the Sphere of Entropy, because only thus can it create the gate/whatever that will free the Dark Powers from their prison. Why did he say, as Gareth, that he had returned from the Vortex? Well, two possibilities: either he knew that the Immortals would assume he's an Old One and fear him, or he was just content to say that he had escaped from the Mists and is announcing the return of the Dark Powers (the Immortals' fault if they have lost knowlegde of what this means). Why did he start the cult of Gareth? For two reasons: First he needs some mortals to do his bidding, especially handling/activating the NoS when it's ready; second he's making ground for the upcoming war with the Immortals by sapping their power base, i.e. mortal followers; maybe he even believes that these mortals will serve the Dark Powers when they have destroyed the Immortals, as they do in Ravenloft. c. Old Ones are powerful beings just as in the Immortals' theory (i.e., classical theory about the Old Ones) Then, they are very powerful, created the Multiverse as their experiment, and more. If they are so powerful, why would they (or one of them) intervene, when they could simply alter what they want? c.1. Gareth wants to show the proper path Gareth is a good Old One, as they are all, and saw that the experiment was not going the good way. Rather than simply wash away this failed experiment, this Old One (with or without the agreement of the others) has decided to put it back on the right tracks. He thus interevened at the end of WotI, showed Immortals how bad they were behaving, recharged the NoS, and made of Rad a new experiement to see if he could change his ways. Then to make sure that the proper way would make ground, he created a new Immortal or assumed an Immortal identity, and preached a new way (as Gareth). c.2. Gareth is an evil Old One Not all Old Ones are good, there is a balance here as everywhere else. Old Ones are to Immortals what Immortals are to mortals, and they lend power to the Immortals in the form of access to the five spheres. As a Mutiverse becomes more attuned to one of the spheres, Old Ones that are aligned with that sphere gain power. Old Ones normally cannot intervene directly in the Multiverses. But this Entropic Old One has decided to bypass the directive (as some Entropic Immortals sometimes do on the Prime) in order to gain more power for himself and his sphere. That's why he turned the NoS into an Entropy artifact, and he's now posing as a good Immortal to wreak more havoc (as per Gareth = Loki). c.3. Gareth is a rogue Old One Old Ones vary in characters, and this one has decided to intervene himself in the experiment even though it's forbidden, because he thinks that will be fun. He does not really want to harm (although...) but just wants to meddle with the Multiverse experiment. Other Old Ones may or may not be aware of his actions. This scenario is an analogy with Q and the Q Continuum. _____________________________________________________________ Herve Musseau Homepage: http://www.geocities.com/TimesSquare/Lair/8932/ Almanac page: http://www.geocities.com/TimesSquare/Lair/9037/ ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 12 Jun 1998 12:13:24 EDT From: Alex295@aol.com Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Deformed Shadowelves In a message dated 98-06-11 18:22:18 EDT, Fabrizio writes: << At 17.25 11/06/98 EDT, JamugaKhan@aol.com wrote: >Can you power a space ship by a Chernobyl-like reactor? I think not. Well, you can power a submarine, so why not a space ship?>> Nuclear subs like the US SSN series run off a simple two tier approach. The reactor heats water that in turn turns a turbine thus turning a screw or more correctly screws. Hence you have propulsion. So the reactor does not directly turn the sub's screws. Instead it offers an energy source to the drive system that turns the screws. This sounds starnge but really should not. Pre nuclear subs also ran off a two tier approach. Diesel powerplant turning the screws while on the surface. The diesel engines also turning an alternator that charged the subs batteries to allow allow a powersource when running submerged. Hypothetically speaking a space travelling vessel needs a powersource that provides thrust. In a vaccum there is of course little means to make screws work (no mass to push against). So means have to be made to provide such thrust. The easiest means being rocket engines. Now.....a reactor type powerplant could be used to power a propulsion system. Such a powered system could work on a system along the lines of magnetic reaction.This system is obviously beyond present day tech and fall along the lines of sci-fi such as Star Wars, Star Trek, etc. These involve a reactor of sorts powering a drive system. >The energy devices of Blackmoor based on the technology from the Beagle, so it might be a matter-antimatter reaction device what caused the Great Rain of Fire. Matter-antimatter is another option, but I wouldn't discard nuclear power. >> IMO the Blackmoor did not have the NoS type reactors until late in their civilization period. And it was the activation of these "new" sources of power that blew up. Not by any shortcomings in design, but more due to the incapatibility of the FSS type reactors and the Mystara plane. Why develop such NoS reactors? Simple....cheap and plentiful power. IMO the Blackmoor depended heavily on more standard sources for power. Hydro, solar, fossil fuels, and nuclear....however their technological explosion called for more and cheaper power to be efficient and keep up. IMO some Blackmoor sage technician dusted off some schematics drawn from the Old Beagle days and began work. The reactors theorectically gave plentiful amounts of clean energy. The downside being that info was scarce as the PC/NPCs that infiltrated the Beagle had only made off with partial schematics and some crude renderings. After several generations a design was "perfected" and several examples begun. These "new" reactors were expected to replace the existing nuclear reactors and other existing powersources. So as these new style "super reactors" were brought online (IMO in some power grid type arrangement to explain the expansive amount of damage) the Blackmoor held their breath....and BOOM! The world rained fire. However, instead of having several meltdowns, you instead had several mega explosions that dwarfed the RW example shown in Chernobyl. Basically, I am saying that the NoS are IMO not a standard nuclear reactor. If anything, they are much more powerful and operate on a different theory of "atom splitting". Sort of like how Fission and Fusion reactors are different. Or how a turbine engine differs from an internal combustion engine. This is a fantasy setting, so why not have the technical aspect spiffed up with some sci-fi. BTW if what I say has any bearing then it may be very well possible that Raf's NoS could also blow up like its Blackmoor/FSS predecessors. Of course a simple fix could be that the NoS of Raf is based on an intermediate design predating the reactor types that caused the GRoF. This design offers little chance of going kaboom due to its being based on tried and true technology. Or you could say Rafiel has fixed the problems the Blackmoor reactors had during his long tenure as an Immortal. Hmm...perhaps his building the NoS was not just a sign of his being able to build it. But more importantly to prove his own theories as solid. Being able to have his SE build a copy is one thing, but to build one and prove his own theories correct would definitely prove the Immortal as being sane. Alex *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 12 Jun 1998 09:42:33 -0700 (PDT) From: Dominique Rivard Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Gareth 6 : Gareth = an Old One - ---Herve Musseau wrote: aa. Old One is another term for DM Yuck! If you put this one to make the others look more acceptable, it works. >b. Old Ones are the Dark Powers >This is based on Marco's work "Ravenloft and Mystara: A possible (frightening) connection."venloft. Are we playing Ravenloft or Mystara!? >c. Old Ones are powerful beings just as in the Immortals' theory (i.e., classical theory about the Old Ones) Euh... what's left? I'll go for the classic... but sincerely, I think letting an Old One pop in is really a bad idea. If they do are researchers making an experiment, just like a RW scientist doing one, what appeared in WotI should be a faint sample of what is an OO. Just like the RW scientist who's adding a chemical ingredient in his solution, not diving himself in it. So Gareth shouldn't be an OO, or if he is, he would always restraining himself from using even a small amount of his potential. PS: Could Gareth be a fallen OO? (perhaps because of the appearance in WotI) == Tharquil's French D&D Homepage at http://www.geocities.com/Area51/Rampart/5201 _________________________________________________________ DO YOU YAHOO!? Get your free @yahoo.com address at http://mail.yahoo.com *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 12 Jun 1998 19:17:59 +0300 From: "Aleksei Andrievski" Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Cultural Edifice Complex >Interesting. The Arabians preserved and improved upon all knowledge while Arabia was in the DARK ages. Then came the Renaissance (The Enlightenment ?). Actually Renaissance means "rebirth". >Have you noticed that European knowledge isn't "based" upon Arabic ideas >? NO ! Europeans, also, preserved and improved upon this knowledge while Arabic countries remain third (or was it fourth ?) world countries !!! That's because of that little incident in AD 1258, when Mongols razed Baghdad to the ground and finally destroyed the Caliphate. Who knows, if they didn't (and if the Caliphs maintained their authority), we could have had a powerful, single Arabic nation today. >Alright. Did the Arabic ideas create siege equipment that was used in the dark ages ? These items became the working parts of machinery that later >would result in the industrial revolution. DDid Arabic ideas create armor ? Crossbows ? Guns ? Mortars ? Cannons ? What about Astrology ? Medicine ? Newspapers ? These were all things created >by European nations, aren't they ? Astronomy and Medicine (and other sciences): I believe these were first conceived by the ancient Egyptians and Mesopotamians (who are not exactly Europeans). In fact, the first centers of civilization were located in Asia - Egypt, Mesopotamia, India, China. Only later did Greeks pick that up and developed some more. Gunpowder: created by the Chinese. They didn't use it for military purposes, but Europeans still weren't the first to use it either - Mongols used gunpowder (acquired from the Chinese) to blow up lots of stuff. ****************** Aleksei Andrievski aka Solmyr, Archmage of the Azure Star Visit the Archmage's Tower at http://www.geocities.com/TimesSquare/Fortress/2198/index.html *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 12 Jun 1998 17:43:11 +0100 From: "Rob" Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Deformed Shadowelves/Ranger Kits >>ROB (who is, of course, a Fighter/Mage/Thief with the DM kit :) >and here was me thinking that you were F/M/C who has the thief God/Immortal as your patron and therefore get all the thief abilities!! <;-P See? being a munchkin just doesnt come easy to me... *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ End of mystara-digest V1997 #411 ******************************** *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara' as the body of the message. Date: Fri, 12 Jun 1998 16:07:51 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: phaser.Showcase.MPGN.COM: majordom set sender to owner-mystara-l@ using -f From: (mystara-digest) To: mystara-digest@Phaser.ShowCase.MPGN.COM Subject: mystara-digest V1997 #412 Reply-To: mystara@mpgn.com X-UIDL: c30e19cdeaadd902601bbd82e17241c4 mystara-digest Friday, June 12 1998 Volume 1997 : Number 412 Mystara is a trademark of TSR Inc. All Rights Reserved. The following topics are covered in this digest: [MYSTARA] - Great Rain of Fire Re: [MYSTARA] - Cultural Edifice Complex [MYSTARA] - Jags being LE Re: [MYSTARA] - Gareth 6 : Gareth = an Old One Re: [MYSTARA] - Almanac/Glantri [MYSTARA] - Cure for Amputations? Re: [MYSTARA] - Cultural Edifice Complex Re: [MYSTARA] - Arik's Imprisonment Re: [MYSTARA] - Kols a Cleric! Re: [MYSTARA] - Almanac/Glantri Re: [MYSTARA] - Kols a Cleric! Re: [MYSTARA] - Gareth 6 : Gareth = an Old One Re: [MYSTARA] - Almanac/Glantri Re: [MYSTARA] - Gareth 6 : Gareth = an Old One Re: [MYSTARA] - Deformed Shadowelves Re: [MYSTARA] - Gareth 6 : Gareth = an Old One Re: [MYSTARA] - Almanac/Glantri [MYSTARA] - Abeelat Re: [MYSTARA] - Gareth 6 : Gareth = an Old One Re: [MYSTARA] - Ethengar's invasion [MYSTARA] - Day of Dread (was Almanac/Glantri) Re: [MYSTARA] - Anti-D&D controversy: pre-empting (LONG) Re: [MYSTARA] - Almanac/Glantri Re: [MYSTARA] - Gareth 6 : Gareth = an Old One Re: [MYSTARA] - Arik's Imprisonment Re: [MYSTARA] - Deformed Shadowelves ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Fri, 12 Jun 1998 17:42:10 +0100 From: "Rob" Subject: [MYSTARA] - Great Rain of Fire I know its strictly non-canon, but IMC I like the idea of Blackmoor being destroyed by a nuclear war. Like in Terry Brooks Shannara books (where the Great Wars sounded much like the GRoF). Cheerz ROB *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 12 Jun 1998 17:39:28 +0100 From: "Rob" Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Cultural Edifice Complex >I`ve already said it once , but I`ll say it again It was a badly thoght out (eg No thought ) joke which has ba;lloned out of all proportionto what was intended. Basically I believe that ALL forms of nationalism,racism etc are basicall harmful and they scare me because so many people blindly follow on. You laugh at that which frightens you in order to make it less frightening. Very true. I agree. And i will go on so far as to say that democracy scares me as well - simply because all too often it becomes mob rule. Especially when the media gets involved. (Bet that comment will shock all the democraphiles here!) Cheerz ROB *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 12 Jun 1998 18:10:03 +0100 From: "Rob" Subject: [MYSTARA] - Jags being LE I was in the bath, reading the Orcs of Thar (as you do) when I found out just what a sweinkopf Jaggar can be. Check out what he did to Ohr'r the bugbear! (P14-15, Orcs of Thar!). Thats just a bit vindictive, don't you think? I cant think of any PCs who would be too bothered about exacting vengeance on a bugbear (like attacking the village where the bugbear grew up?). Theres a cold, hard streak in Jags... Cheerz ROB *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 12 Jun 1998 18:14:26 +0100 From: "Rob" Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Gareth 6 : Gareth = an Old One >>b. Old Ones are the Dark Powers >>This is based on Marco's work "Ravenloft and Mystara: A possible (frightening) connection."venloft. >Are we playing Ravenloft or Mystara!? In my case, both... I really liked that idea! (But then I like the idea of the Old Ones being evil gits, like all Elder Gods seem to be - David Eddings, anyone?). Cheerz ROB *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 12 Jun 1998 13:25:38 -0400 (EDT) From: SteelAngel Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Almanac/Glantri On Fri, 12 Jun 1998 Kaviyd@aol.com wrote: >behalf? Certainly Jaggar would accept that form of aid, even though Jaggar would now be deeply in debt to the Star Dragon. Not really, Jaggar did give the Star Dragon his Job back :) They'd be about even. Max IV *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 12 Jun 1998 13:26:38 EDT From: JamugaKhan@aol.com Subject: [MYSTARA] - Cure for Amputations? << Are you suggesting, perhaps, that the Star Dragon might cast a clerical "Regenerate" spell on Jaggar to give him his arm back? And would Jaggar accept help of that sort, given the negative effects of receiving such help in such a public manner? >> "Regenerate"? Do you mean this level 7 spell against energy losses? I don't think that this would work. I'd promote "Cureall" and I will give you a prove for it. Patriarch Sherlane can cast spells up to level 6, and in the module B12-Queen's Harvest appears a Kerin who has lost his right arm in his last adventure. When the adventurers will meet him the next time, Baron Sherlane has arrived and Kerin has his arm back. You see, it must be "Cureall". Jamuga Khan "Hear and obey, because the Mighty Khan's word is law." *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 12 Jun 1998 13:26:35 EDT From: JamugaKhan@aol.com Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Cultural Edifice Complex << Did Arabic ideas create armor ? Crossbows ? Guns ? Mortars ? Cannons ? What about Astrology ? Medicine ? Newspapers ? These were all things created by European nations, aren't they ? >> MEDICINE??? Once I've read a description of Frank knights and their doctors during the Crusades by an Arabian doctor. His colleagues were simply stupid, inept and superstitious. The great time of European medicine came much later. Jamuga Khan "Hear and obey, because the Mighty Khan's word is law." *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 12 Jun 1998 13:26:37 EDT From: JamugaKhan@aol.com Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Arik's Imprisonment << Not many Entropic Immortals work together. For all we know, Arik may have stepped all over Thanatos's plots. That's what peeves him more than anything. >> Good argument! But this doesn't necessarily means that Arik had done something especially evil, only something which had annoyed one of the Big Guys. Jamuga Khan "Hear and obey, because the Mighty Khan's word is law." *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 12 Jun 1998 13:26:36 EDT From: JamugaKhan@aol.com Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Kols a Cleric! << Maybe he hasn't shown his Clericy powers yet, or maybe, G:KoM is a piece of Rubbish :) >> I favor the latter! But PWA III stated this too. :-( Jamuga Khan "Hear and obey, because the Mighty Khan's word is law." *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 12 Jun 1998 13:26:31 EDT From: JamugaKhan@aol.com Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Almanac/Glantri << That is an interesting idea, but I was thinking of something other than the Day of Dread, which affects Glantri as well as the rest of the world. What I was trying to get at was the visible effects of the draining of Energy or Entropy. That Day of Dread does not seem to be a direct effect of the draining -- if it were, why would magic and not some sort of entropic energy be what fails on that day? >> NO, the Day of Dread IS a consequence of the draining of the NoS. It was explained in Glantri GAZ. Continuing the effect would finally lead to the destruction of all magic in Mystara. Jamuga Khan "Hear and obey, because the Mighty Khan's word is law." *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 12 Jun 1998 13:27:22 -0400 (EDT) From: SteelAngel Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Kols a Cleric! On Fri, 12 Jun 1998 Kaviyd@aol.com wrote: >spread by a sage from Oerth or Toril who mistakenly thought he "knew" that no mere kobold could be a true Mage. And on that line, maybe this sage also thought that no mere Kobold could become a Prince in Glantri, Thus the Shadowelf race. Max IV *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 12 Jun 1998 19:34:15 CEST From: "Herve Musseau" Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Gareth 6 : Gareth = an Old One From: Dominique Rivard ----Herve Musseau wrote: aaa. Old One is another term for DM >Yuck! If you put this one to make the others look more acceptable, it works. >>b. Old Ones are the Dark Powers >>This is based on Marco's work "Ravenloft and Mystara: A possible (frightening) connection."venloft. >Are we playing Ravenloft or Mystara!? Mystara, but some people play both (FYI, I don't play Ravenloft!). Is there something wrong with trying to tie Mystara in with other settings? >>c. Old Ones are powerful beings just as in the Immortals' theory (i.e., classical theory about the Old Ones) >Euh... what's left? I'll go for the classic... but sincerely, I think letting an Old One pop in is really a bad idea. If they do are researchers making an experiment, just like a RW scientist doing one, what appeared in WotI should be a faint sample of what is an OO. Just like the RW scientist who's adding a chemical ingredient in his solution, not diving himself in it. So Gareth shouldn't be an OO, or if he is, he would always restraining himself from using even a small amount of his potential. FYI (you're probably a newby) it's the 6th post in a series about who Gareth may be (as written in the title). Each post is based on one such possibility, and explores with as much objectivity as possible what it implies, what are the consequences, the possible flaws, and likely scenarios a DM may play if he assumes in his campaign that Gareth is such or such. The posts have been collected on Shawn's site, for those that missed them and are intererested. >PS: Could Gareth be a fallen OO? (perhaps because of the appearance in WotI) Damn! I knew I had forgotten something. (and I've forgotten another one, which I'll detail after) So let's continue entry c.3. In an episode of ST:TNG, Q is stripped of his powers by the Q Continuum and must live as a mortal. If you push the Q analogy that far, you can have Gareth be stripped of his powers by the Old Ones after he intervenes in the Multiverse in WotI, and so he MUST assume the id of an Immortal. Maybe he was aware of the punishment he could have before he intervened, or not. Now he must redeem himself to become an Old One again, and accepting to be an Immortal (and thus creating a new faith, gaining followers etc) is part of the process. d. Gareth is an Old One that abandoned his status Just like Immortals can become Old Ones by dropping their status, starting back from the bottom, and then rising again, so can the Old Ones. An Old One who has mastered Hierarch Old One status may decide to give it up, and start again as a mere Initiate in the Multiverse, and when (if) he becomes an Hierarch Old One, he becomes what comes next [some people on the list have said it becomes an Very Old One, some said it's a circle an he becomes a simple mortal]. Since he claims that he returned from the Vortex (which is literally true), he must have retained some of his memory (contrary to an Immortal becoming a mortal). _____________________________________________________________ Herve Musseau Homepage: http://www.geocities.com/TimesSquare/Lair/8932/ Almanac page: http://www.geocities.com/TimesSquare/Lair/9037/ ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 12 Jun 1998 13:34:57 -0400 (EDT) From: SteelAngel Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Almanac/Glantri On Fri, 12 Jun 1998, paul dooley wrote: >Why do it in person? the dragonrulers have priesthoods and either a sufficiently powerful cleric could heal Jagger or a group which has a follower of a dragon as a member Who gets imprisoned immediately after walking into Glantri... Think people. Clerical spells for healing Jaggar are about as good of an idea as eating cinnabryl. Max IV *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 12 Jun 1998 13:39:49 -0400 (EDT) From: SteelAngel Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Gareth 6 : Gareth = an Old One >Then, they are very powerful, created the Multiverse as their experiment, and more. If they are so powerful, why would they (or one of them) intervene, when they could simply alter what they want? Well, maybe because alteration of the experiment is out of the question. They have to put in a guiding hand to make sure that the experiment doesn't break (Like altering the waveform generator in an LRC circuit) but Date: Fri, 12 Jun 1998 16:07:51 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: phaser.Showcase.MPGN.COM: majordom set sender to owner-mystara-l@ using -f From: (mystara-digest) To: mystara-digest@Phaser.ShowCase.MPGN.COM Subject: mystara-digest V1997 #412 Reply-To: mystara@mpgn.com X-UIDL: c30e19cdeaadd902601bbd82e17241c4 they can't just change the experiment without it becoming Irrevocably damaged, and them having to restart it all. This I think goes along more with the next scenario, and is in accordance with what I beleive to be true IMC. Max IV *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 12 Jun 1998 13:45:08 -0400 (EDT) From: SteelAngel Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Deformed Shadowelves On Fri, 12 Jun 1998 Alex295@aol.com wrote: >IMO the Blackmoor did not have the NoS type reactors until late in their civilization period. And it was the activation of these "new" sources of power that blew up. Not by any shortcomings in design, but more due to the incapatibility of the FSS type reactors and the Mystara plane. And if you read my short work on the last moments of the Beagle, this seems very evident :) >NoS could also blow up like its Blackmoor/FSS predecessors. Of course a simple Maybe so.. That would be scary. An underground explosion of that magnitude would be PRETTY bad for the KW. (What KW? We have a new hole to the Hollow world..) However, an Immortal so closely involved with this, would not let it happen. Remember, the GRoF caught the Immortals off guard because they didn't expect the reactors to be incompatible with the world-sheild's magics, or even the ambient magic of the Prime, so they couldn't save Blackmoor. But Rafiel is a scientist. He's competent enough, INHO to make sure that the SE's NoS would be safe. (Plus he's had ~3000 years of experience to work out the design :D Max IV *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 12 Jun 1998 13:56:24 -0400 (EDT) From: SteelAngel Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Gareth 6 : Gareth = an Old One On Fri, 12 Jun 1998, Herve Musseau wrote: >Just like Immortals can become Old Ones by dropping their status, starting back from the bottom, and then rising again, so can the Old ..... >returned from the Vortex (which is literally true), he must have retained some of his memory (contrary to an Immortal becoming a mortal). Holy $&%^ That works!! Maybe one Old one volunteered to reduce himself, so to make sure that the experiment didn't go awry again.. That could be a clue :) Max IV *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 12 Jun 1998 14:02:59 EDT From: CRlPTONITE@aol.com Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Almanac/Glantri paul dooley wrote: >>Why do it in person? the dragonrulers have priesthoods and either a sufficiently powerful cleric could heal Jagger or a group which has a follower of a dragon as a member Max IV >Who gets imprisoned immediately after walking into Glantri... Think people. Clerical spells for healing Jaggar are about as good of an idea as eating cinnabryl. That's not true. 1st off, if someone walked into Glantri how would anyone know the person is a priest? And even if someone walked over the border and claimed he or she is a cleric, they still won't be locked up. Clerics are allowed in Glantri. The cleric ban was lifted years ago. Clerics can enter Glantri with certain restrictions. Most choose not to live in Glantri because of those restrictions and because of the prejudice they recieve there. - --- -- --Criptonite *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 12 Jun 1998 12:02:38 PDT From: "Buck Satan" Subject: [MYSTARA] - Abeelat Hello out there. I was wondering if anyone out there could help me with the stats on the abeelat. There were references made on the abeelat in the "Tainted Sword Trilogy" set in the GDoK. Another reference was made in the "Escape from Thunder Rift" module, basically about it's crystals that provide for something like clairvoyance. It's not in the RC, the Creature Catalog, or anything else, so if anyone out there has its stats, or would be willing to offer some pretty good ones, or a reasonable comparison to another monster, I'd be grateful. P.S. - It's also been called abaout (I'm pretty sure it's misspelled), or watcher (not like the Beholder kind from AD&D though). ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 12 Jun 1998 17:13:02 +0000 (GMT) From: Gordon McCormick Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Gareth 6 : Gareth = an Old One >b. Old Ones are the Dark Powers >This is based on Marco's work "Ravenloft and Mystara: A possible (frightening) connection." I also think someone wrote a scenario of an old war between the Dark Powers and the Immortals long, long ago, ending with the Dark Powers being imprisoned, though I can't find the original post. <> Yoiks. This one is quite scary! I like it a lot...and i thought for sure I'd be going with Gareth=Loki :) I still think Gareth is a weird name for an immortal, since I know several Gareths. John, or Bert the Immortal just doesn't sound as impressive as Ixion or Thor :) gordon *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 12 Jun 1998 21:37:47 +0200 From: Fabrizio Paoli Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Ethengar's invasion This message got somehow lost in my Mailbox... At 18.28 04/06/98 +0300, Aleksei Andrievski wrote: II was just looking at the map of Glantri, and I am wondering why Moglai chose to go through the hilly Boldavia and Klantyre, when there is another, shorter, and much flatter route: through Belcadiz, directly to Glantri City! That way, Moglai would have had to fight only the forces in Belcadiz, as opposed to all those others. See my point? Yes. This is something I pointed out to rest of the Almanac team a few months ago during Almanac development, but nobody supported me :-) Anyway there're a few drawbacks in using that route too: 1) the area from Bramyra to the Broken Lands is likely to be heavily defended, since it's the main attack route to Glantri City. 2) Moglai's hordes are likely to get caught in a bottleneck between the Colossus Mtn. and the Broken Lands (same goes for the pass between Boldavia and Klantrie OTOH). 3) the Broken Lands: no one knows what can come out of that area these days ('noids, shadow elves...) 4) Belcadiz trees are not suited to mounted warriors 5) there're non roads in that area All in all I still think the southern route was a better one :-) - -------------- Fabrizio Paoli brizio@lunet.it Home Page: http://www.geocities.com/TimesSquare/Dungeon/4560 - -------------- *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 12 Jun 1998 21:05:44 +0200 From: Fabrizio Paoli Subject: [MYSTARA] - Day of Dread (was Almanac/Glantri) At 18.15 11/06/98 EDT, Kaviyd@aol.com wrote: >That Day of Dread does not seem to be a direct effect of the draining -- A thought about the DoD. After WotI DoD is a regular feature of the Mystaran year, but something similar existed also before WotI. If you look at the calendars given in some GAZ, you'll see that on 28 Kaldmont there's a 3% chance that all magic fails all over Mystara. This means that a magic-failure has probably already happened at least once in the previous 100 years and more than once since AC 0. So, IMO, there should me some written evidence about past DoD and some of the older mages may have experienced it at least once in the past. Instead, IIRC, such things are never mentioned and the DoD looks as a complete new and unknown feature to Mystaran sages and mages. Isn't it strange? - -------------- Fabrizio Paoli brizio@lunet.it Home Page: http://www.geocities.com/TimesSquare/Dungeon/4560 - -------------- *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 12 Jun 1998 21:17:50 +0200 From: Fabrizio Paoli Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Anti-D&D controversy: pre-empting (LONG) At 05.54 12/06/98 -0400, Pierre Savoie wrote: >The language barrier does not keep out anti-D&D stuff, it just delays it by a few years, 10 or 15 years even. A group of Italian gamers started to complain when news media IN 1994 started to latch on to D&D as an "explanation" for bad teens. They fought back with their own association and a Web-site: >http://www.sincretech.it/3M/Stop-Non-Sense/Index-English.html >They designed a logo "RPGs Care for a Better Living -- Do Not Let Them Die" which they invite anyone to stick on their own Web- page. The English version of their slogan is perhaps stilted, but the sentiment is welcome... Well, in Italy sometimes news media link RPG with drugs, evil cults and strange murders. A few years ago (I think it was right in 1994) a RPG was blamed for forcing a boy to commit suicide. Now there's an association that takes care of explaining to the people what RPGs are and also monitors news media. The problem is that often those who write on newspapers have never played RPGs and don't know anything about it. I remind seeing on TV a report on RPGs with Magic cards on the background and a voice telling us several falsities about what a Master is. Sorry for the OT. *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 12 Jun 1998 15:52:45 -0400 (EDT) From: SteelAngel Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Almanac/Glantri On Fri, 12 Jun 1998 CRlPTONITE@aol.com wrote: >claimed he or she is a cleric, they still won't be locked up. Clerics are allowed in Glantri. The cleric ban was lifted years ago. Clerics can enter I don't think it was completely lifted. I think it was lifted for only the plague, but I may be mistaken. Max IV *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 12 Jun 1998 15:54:57 -0400 (EDT) From: SteelAngel Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Gareth 6 : Gareth = an Old One On Fri, 12 Jun 1998, Gordon McCormick wrote: >several Gareths. John, or Bert the Immortal just doesn't sound as impressive as Ixion or Thor :) In the one shot Immortal campaign I was in, we had a "Bob the Immortal" (From the spehere of water, nonetheless) Max IV *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 12 Jun 1998 15:02:29 -0500 From: Galwylin Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Arik's Imprisonment JamugaKhan@aol.com wrote: >Good argument! But this doesn't necessarily means that Arik had done something especially evil, only something which had annoyed one of the Big Guys. I'm still going on the assumption that Arik was banished by someone other than an Immortal. In fact, I think it was just a small group of heroes that did the act and the only Immortal involvement was that some were clerics. Banishing him is one thing but keeping him out is another so these mortal (lets call them adventurers) have to pay a price. A price that might be seen as a curse to their descendants but that must be paid by each descendent or Arik is freed. The adventure I'm working on focuses on a few of these decendants and their efforts to remove a curse that they have no idea its purpose. The reason for the lost purpose of the curse is that bloodlines have spread out so people have lost track of exactly who their ancestors are. - -- This has been a Galwylin© Production http://www.airnet.net/galwylin/ galwylin@airnet.net | ICQ #6755972 | AIM: Galwylin *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 12 Jun 1998 15:06:59 -0500 From: Galwylin Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Deformed Shadowelves SteelAngel wrote: >However, an Immortal so closely involved with this, would not let it happen. Remember, the GRoF caught the Immortals off guard because they didn't expect the reactors to be incompatible with the world-sheild's magics, or even the ambient magic of the Prime, so they couldn't save Blackmoor. I thought the idea that Blackmoor wasn't saved was still up in the air. When dealing with time (and thus Immortals of Time), just because they were caught off guard doesn't necessarily mean they were unable to save Blackmoor. Blackmoor could still exist in the Hollow World, as a time displaced society, as a city caught in a dimensional flux or the Immortals could have just decided it was better gone. In any case, I don't think being caught off guard is the reason there is no more Blackmoor. The fact is, we just don't know.. yet ;> - -- This has been a Galwylin© Production http://www.airnet.net/galwylin/ galwylin@airnet.net | ICQ #6755972 | AIM: Galwylin *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ End of mystara-digest V1997 #412 ******************************** *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara' as the body of the message.