mystara-digest Wednesday, February 17 1999 Volume 1999 : Number 093 Mystara is a trademark of TSR Inc. All Rights Reserved. The following topics are covered in this digest: RE: [MYSTARA] - Acronyms Re: [MYSTARA] - MYSTARA: CUSTOM: MYSTARA GRIMOIRE Re: [MYSTARA] - Vecna - Apologies RE: [MYSTARA] - Champions Of Mystara Re: [MYSTARA] - Vecna - Apologies Re: [MYSTARA] - Champions Of Mystara Re: [MYSTARA] - Megaliths Re: [MYSTARA] - Furmenglaive Re: [MYSTARA] - Megaliths Re: [MYSTARA] - Megaliths Re: [MYSTARA] - Dragonlord Chronicles Re: [MYSTARA] - Etienne's Immortal status Re: [MYSTARA] - The Taymora Re: [MYSTARA] - The Taymora [MYSTARA] - Re: Dwarves of Thonia (MPicts?) Re: [MYSTARA] - Re: Dwarves of Thonia (MPicts?) ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Wed, 17 Feb 1999 17:15:37 CET From: "Herve Musseau" Subject: RE: [MYSTARA] - Acronyms From: Kristian Kramer >And OTOH? Can't seem to find that one... Please can you (and others as well) stop quoting whole pages of messages when just adding one or two lines. That's very bad Netiquette (now, you probably don't know what Netiquette is if you don't know what OTOH means). OTOH and similar acronyms are not in this list because the list is only of Mystara specific acronyms, not generic ones. OTOH = on the other hand. ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 17 Feb 1999 12:45:42 -0500 (EST) From: SteelAngel Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - MYSTARA: CUSTOM: MYSTARA GRIMOIRE Ahh, Let me add to your wonderful wizards collection: * Zodiak Mentrix TECHNOMANCY 788BC - 2099+AC "In Magic, there is only Technomancy - All the others are stamp collecting." Zodiak has been the headmaster of the School of Magic and Technology in the city of Thimhallan for the past 1700 years. His research interests include: Quantum Magical theory, Magic fields theory, Magductive elements, and Magical String theory. * * Matoia Pendrax TECHNOMANCY 788BC - 2099+AC "Curiosity Didn't kill this cat. But then again, I can't die.." Matoia is the headmistress of the School of Magic and Technology, and has been for the past 1700 years. She's also an Alphatian tiger shapeshifter. Matoia is more of an experimentalist than Zodiak is. Her research is in the areas of Cybernetics, Constructs, Artificial Intelligence, and Extraplanar Magics. * Ethan - -- Ethan Deneault - PH/MU '99 www.wpi.edu/~eand - wpi.flame Quote Archive. *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 17 Feb 1999 17:24:55 -0000 From: "Rob" Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Vecna - Apologies >See, this is how panics set in. Some slag read that and assumed that Vecna >drained 2d10 + 14 levels with each hit. > No, dude: it is 2d10 + 14 damage with each hit. Hit Points (life energy) >not energy levels (sloppy phrasing, I admit. I assume it was TSR's >phrasing). > Most Immortals could do fine against Vecna. They produce magical effects >and have immunities in similar ways. Any Hierarch could flip him into the >trash with ease. Non-Immortal PCs on the other hand, should pursue the >"Brave, Brave Sir Robin" strategy when dealing with Vecna. . . My wild mage could take him... Maybe not. "For Glantri!!!!!!" *zap* Cheerz Rob *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 17 Feb 1999 10:20:59 -0800 From: "Jenni A. M. Merrifield" Subject: RE: [MYSTARA] - Champions Of Mystara First, On Tue, 16 February 1999 Jason Murphy wrote: >Heyhey everyone. I was just lucky enough to purchase a new Champions of >Mystara Box. Unfortunately i seem to have recieved to of the same ship >reference cards. Two Heldannic light warbirds. The others i have are >Oosdock airship, Alphatian yaucht, alphatian galleon, elven airship, some >dragon ship, and i cant remember the eight one off hand. Would someone who >has or knows about this box set tell me what ships i have missed in the >above list? And then, On Wed, 17 Feb 1999 Jason Murphy also wrote: >Ahh. yup i have the geodome. So it looks like i am missing a Heavy Warbird. >Yup that would sound logical. Having a light Warbird, the heavy variant >would be a natural extension. :) > >Well then if any kind soul out there could scan me the Heavy Warbird card it >would be much appreciated. Or possibly just email the stats? I have CoM and nope, there is no Heavy Warbird in the card set. What you are missing is "The Flying Barge of Sayr Ulan". Thus, the complete list of eight cards is as follows: 1. Alphatian Man-of-War 2. Alphatian Yacht 3. Azlum Swith's Geodome Airship 4. Elven Swan Ship 5. Light Heldannic Warbird 6. Oberack's Dragon Prow Longship 7. Oostdock Airship 8. The Flying Barge of Sayr Ulan. I will happily scan in the one card and email the results to you -- I figure that is "fair use" since you should own the card. Keep an eye out for it. Jenni A. M. Merrifield - -=> strawberryJAMM <=- - -- Jenni A. M. Merrifield <==> strawberryJAMM Designs strawberry@jamm.com <==> http://www.jamm.com/jamm/ <------------------------------------------------------------------> God created Light. Then Earth, Vegetables, Animals, Man and Woman. Then God started to think: "I should create things I *like*!" And God said: "Let There Be Strawberries!" *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 17 Feb 1999 21:35:01 -0000 From: "Edward Phillips" Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Vecna - Apologies Can you post the older stats for him please (from eye & hand I believe) also the eye and hand as well. PS: So how the hell did the lords of Ravenloft trp somebody with his abilities???? - -----Original Message----- From: Harvey, Michael To: 'mystara-l@MPGN.COM' Date: 17 February 1999 00:41 Subject: RE: [MYSTARA] - Vecna - Apologies >> Sorry if this isn't about Mystara, but does somebody have the >> Stats for Vecna? > > >Subject: Re: How Tough is Vecna Anyway? >Date: 7 Jan 1999 17:37:27 GMT >From: dalmayas@aol.comnojunk (Dalmayas) >Newsgroups: rec.games.frp.dnd > >> I've heard about the lich for years, but never got a chance to >> see his stats(heard he is a God of Ravenloft now). Does anyone >> know his level, hps, etc.... >> Cywatt > >If anyone reads the above he asked for stats, I've read 27 postings with no >stats. Just peoples opinions, some of them aren't even about Vecna. Here >we go! > >Lord Vecna the Whipered One, the Master of the Spider Throne, the Undying >King, the Lord of the Rotted Tower, the Maimed Lord, the Master of Secrets, >the One Named Only in Whispers, the Dying King and most recently the Chained >God (he is a prisoner in Ravenloft and very unhappy about it). (If you live >for long enough you get a lot of titles.) > >Demi-god (Lich), Lawful Evil >Armor Class: -10 >Movement: 9 >Level/Hit Dice: 30 >Hit Point: 150 >Thac0: 2 >Number of Attacks: 2 >Damage/Attacks: 2d10+14 (due to strength) >Special Attacks: Paralysis, multi-tasking, spells. >Special Defenses: Immortality, need +5 or better magical weapon to hit, >paralysis. >Magic Resistance: See Below > >All Stats (Str. Con. etc....) are at 25! > >Combat: Each attack with his withered hand does 2d10 life drain energy (no >save or protection), and +14 from strength. Then you must save vs Paralysis >or be frozen in place (elves whom are immune to ghoul type paralysis are not >immune to this). It is permanent unless a "DISPEL EVIL" is used. "Dispel >Magic" just won't cut it. > >Vecna is cloaked in an aura of pure evil. The exact effect depends on the >level of the victim as indicated on the table below. (The effects below are >for Ravenloft rules, I have taken the liberty of adding other options if you >don't have access to those rules) > >Level/HD Effect >-------- ----------- >1-4 Madness check >5-8 Horror check >9-12 Fear check >17+ Morale check > >Varients: > >Madness check: Symbol of Insanity (8th level Wizard, Players Handbook) H.P. >restrictions do not apply, it works on an unlimited amount of people. It is >only restricted to affecting 1st to 4th level beings. No Save! > >Horror check: Symbol of Fear (8th level Wizard, Players Handbook) But the >save is at -8, and the duration is doubled. > >Fear check: Fear (4th level Wizard, Players Handbook) > >Moral check: Scare (2nd level Wizard, Players Handbook) No Save and is not >restricted to 6HD or less creatures. > >He is immune to harm from weapons of less than +5 magical bonus. The only >exception to this rule is he may be affected by a Holy Avenger weapon of any >magical bonus, when weilded by a paladin. He cannot be turned by priests of >any level. > >He has a natural 70% magic resistance to all spells cast by mortal >creatures, a 40% resistance to all cast by other Demi-gods, and a 20% >resistance to Gods of greater stature. In addition, he is immune to all >spells from the schools of enchantment/charm, illusion/phantasm, and >necromancy, as well as those from the charm, healing, and chaos spheres. No >manner of polymorph or similar spell can affect Vecna. Vecna has a saving >throw of 4 at all times. No act of a mortal can reduce his chances of >success when attempting a save. > >Vecna may cast any wizard or priest spell. He casts these by act of will, >requiring no components. In addition, any spell has a casting time of 0. > >He is able to preform 2 tasks a round without penalty. Hit twice, hit and >use a spell, use a spell and an item, use two items, use two spells, and so >forth. Vecna automatically gains initiative when fighting mortals, there >are NO exceptions, and no spell, item, or action by his victim can alter >this. > >He can understand ANY form of communication. Foriegn language, code, sign >language, color change, morse code, semaphore, sanscrit, pig latin, and so >on. This also applies to written communications. > >No mortal creature or Demi-god can snuff out Vecna's life force. Due to his >high constitution, he regenerates 1 hit point every turn. If he is somehow >slain by such beings, his body will disintegrate; however, 1d100 days later, >the lich god will rise again and seek out and destroy those who harmed him. > >Vecna is the god of secrets and magic. As such nothing can be kept from >him. He knows instantly of everything that happens within the walls of his >citadel. This ability also extends to his followers, so he knows everything >they see or do. > >Now this isn't word for word, his entire entry takes up a few page, but you >get the idea. He is a walking death machine, and oozes all kinds of >evil.(Darth Vader eat your artificial heart out!) > >I also have an older list for him at 20th level, one where he is actually >fightable and won't kill you quicker than two jiggles of a jack rabbit's >ass. If you want that listing e-mail me and ask me for it and I will send >you the info. I also have two sets of stats for Kas the Bloody-Handed, the >Terrible, blah blah blah. Boy do these guys like titles! >*************************************************************************** >To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line >'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 17 Feb 1999 21:40:30 -0000 From: "Edward Phillips" Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Champions Of Mystara No I understand their breakdown just fine, although IMHO basing them so heaviliy on Byazantine is a mistake, it is just that after the pasting they got during WOTI they seem a bit too tough and 'with it'. The heretaria and Draco units are cool but a bit much. With armies like the ones you posted Thyatis could quite easily roll over every nation in the KW without stopping, the problem being that there is no counterpoint to them now that Alphatia is gone. Pretty cool nonetheless but not what I'd personally go for. - -----Original Message----- From: James Ruhland To: mystara-l@MPGN.COM Date: 16 February 1999 23:47 Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Champions Of Mystara > >> >> I'll copy them up and post them then. >> >Ok. > >> PS: You the guy with the REALLY hard Thyatian army website? If you are >I'd >> love to see the construction details for those phase ships. >> >Yes, I'm that dude. >Firstly, wadda ya mean by hard? Hard as in difficult? I'm curious because >if so then I might have to make it easier. > As for the phase ships I haven't uploaded 'em yet. I've been busier lately >than I was or thought I'd be, and I'm way behind my self-imposed schedule >for uploading things. I'll let you know when I update the info though. > >*************************************************************************** >To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line >'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 17 Feb 1999 21:44:02 -0000 From: "Edward Phillips" Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Megaliths Hey how do you know it was Nithian aid to the Followers of the Air that didn't destroy old Alphatia??? :-) Supposedly Nithian magic was far more powerful than anything else going (and where did they get that power from I here you ask?) so the Nithians could quite as easily been the breaking point to the Alphatain Civil war. - -----Original Message----- From: Geoff Gander To: mystara-l@MPGN.COM Date: 17 February 1999 00:30 Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Megaliths >Sharon wrote: > >>I suppose that'd work for the Lhomarrians and other "Primal"-era cultures. >>It's more the Blackmoor and Nithian eras I'd been thinking of, as possible >>periods when they might've been released. Neither of these later >>civilizations could've known very much about the (loooong-vanished) >>Carnifex, and both would have produced loads of adventurers with the >>firepower -- be it magical or technological -- to bust through the gates. > >But then again, who's to say that some Carnifex *didn't* escape earlier? >For all we know, some ancient fire mages on Old Alphatia may have accidentally >contacted the Carnifex in their battles against the Followers of Air - >who, in return for being guided to the location of Old Alphatia, were >willing to trade some of their powerful magic (even by Alphatian >standards) to the Followers of Fire. The Carnifex wouldn't tell their >unwitting liberators who they were or why they were trapped, they would >likely give the spells and leave - either in search of a new world or to >Mystara once more to settle a score with the Immortals. > >These magics could ultimately have been used to destroy Old Alphatia once >that war reached a fever point - a fitting gift from the Carnifex. In the >meantime, those Carnifex either got lost in space, were re-imprisoned by >the Immortals, or found a suitable world to rebuild their civilization, >and even now they are researching their old knowledge, slowly building up >to the point where they can challenge the Immortals once more.... > >Just a brainstorm, but I thought it would work. :) > >>Heck ... maybe the Carnifex DID break loose, during one of these eras! >>Either the pre-Landfall Alphatians, or Blackmoor's empire at its height, >>could probably have given those scaley so-and-sos from M3 a run for their >>money. ;-) > >They certainly could! Maybe those "nightmarish horrors" hinted at in the >DA-series modules were actually Carnifex and their servitors, freed once >more to ravage Skothar after being accidentally freed by the >Blackmoorians. Of course, the Blackmoorian wizards were able to regain >control and kill off the escaped Carnifex, or chase them away, butthe >battles would have been fierce, and would now only be those footnotes in >modern history (ie: the cryptic references in the modules). > >As for the Nithians, well, after they were corrupted they certainly could >have fallen prey to darker influences (read: open worship of Outer Beings >in some cities). The Carnifex, ever eager to break free, could have >insinuated themselves in this manner and arrived on Mystara, but they were >likely destroyed by Nithian mages who realized what they had done, or by >the Immortals in their clean-up effort in BC 500. > >How are these for explanations (or at least possible ones)? Should we >clip 'n' save? :) > >Geoff > >-- >Geoff Gander, BA 97 >Cartographer/Game Designer/Government Peon >Part-Time High Priest, Ottawa Chapter of the Church of Y'hog >au998@freenet.carleton.ca >*************************************************************************** >To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line >'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 17 Feb 1999 21:51:07 -0000 From: "Edward Phillips" Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Furmenglaive Well diff of Opinion I guess :-) It is just that it seems a bit close to the video for me that's all, it could work with some modification. cheers for the effort anyway. - -----Original Message----- From: DM To: mystara-l@MPGN.COM Date: 17 February 1999 14:31 Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Furmenglaive >On Tue, 16 Feb 1999 16:38:13 -0000, "Edward Phillips" > wrote: > ><lesson. Copywright aside.>> > >Hey, Vampire Hunter D is not second rate! In Japan there are about 15 novels >published starring D and they all sell damn good! > >anyway, sorry it wasn't what u were looking for... but maybe if you just >change his name it might still work? After all, this D is not named after >Dracula, but rather after his mother... guess who she is now.. :) > >DM > >*************************************************************************** >To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line >'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. > *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 17 Feb 1999 19:08:49 -0500 From: Sharon Dornhoff Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Megaliths >But then again, who's to say that some Carnifex *didn't* escape earlier? > >These magics could ultimately have been used to destroy Old Alphatia once >that war reached a fever point - a fitting gift from the Carnifex. >As for the Nithians, well, after they were corrupted they certainly could >have fallen prey to darker influences (read: open worship of Outer Beings >in some cities). > >How are these for explanations (or at least possible ones)? Should we >clip 'n' save? :) > >Geoff I dunno, Geoff.... if we start blaming TOO many past civilizations' destruction on the Carnifex and/or the Outer Beings, things might get to be too much like White Wolf's WoD (:-P), where ordinary humans never get do ANYTHING: it's always the "dark forces" behind the scenes, that control history. Mystara's had a bit too much of that, already, what with the Immortals' constant tampering; once in a while -- as with Old Alphatia's demise, at the hands of squabbling academic boneheads -- we "mere mortals" ought to be able to mess ourselves up royally, WITHOUT anybody's help! ;-) *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 17 Feb 1999 19:19:49 -0500 From: Sharon Dornhoff Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Megaliths >Ur-Carnifex - Sharon's creation! These boys started it all, waaay back >when Mystara was a savage world of steaming fens and primordial seas. >>From what I've gathered from her writings (please correct me if I'm wrong, >Sharon, or fill in the gaps), these guys are large, savage brutes - not >far removed from their saurian ancestors. Oh, GOODIE! "Mr. Carnifex", himself, is adopting the Ur-tribes! Guess they can't get more "official" than that, now that nothing new's getting published anymore. ;-D Yep, they're big and savage ... the Carnifex equivalent of garls, kind of. They're NOT so slow and stupid, however: even at the dawn of their race's evolution, the carnosauroids were quick, cunning hunters. The Ur-Carnifex may be stuck in the Stone Age, but you can make some NASTY weapons with Neolithic-level materials. (Ever tried to extract a splintered bamboo wedge from your arm, that'd been set into the end of the arrow you got shot with...?) :-) *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 17 Feb 1999 19:28:17 -0500 From: Sharon Dornhoff Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Dragonlord Chronicles >I'm finally getting around to reading the second and third novels in >this series. Does anyone know what years it takes place? I figured its >somewhere between 450 AC and 788 AC. But seems before 585 AC would be >best. Just wondering. I believe there's a reference to how the Flaemish people had lived on Mystara for a little over 100 years, at the time the novels take place. So that would place Thelvyn & Co. in the early 500s (the Flaem settled Glantri in 395 AC). Note that the characters shouldn't have been calling Ylaruam by that name, in the 6th century. Back then, "Ylaruam" was just a minor oasis/village in the middle of nowhere, and the region as a whole was called the Alasiyan Desert. Other than that, I think the novels had their time-period fairly straight. (Pick, pick, pick... :-D) *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 17 Feb 1999 19:42:59 -0500 From: Sharon Dornhoff Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Etienne's Immortal status >IIRC, Simon has spells in the X2 module, he bears a christian Holy Symbol, >and X2 also says he is evil and corrupted. Clergy in Averoigne may not >make open use of magic, but this seems to imply that they have spells. >However, I do not remember any other cleric in the X2. > > Giampaolo Agosta In the original Averoigne stories, there was an evil church official who secretly worshipped the Devil and had magical powers; however, they were a product of witchcraft (i.e. wizardry), not clerical magic. It was the NPC clergy in the "Old Averoigne" section of the module I was referring to, as being without spells. I think the module implies that PCs can't get healed by the local priests, so my guess is that they CAN'T heal, not that they're forbidden to. Besides, if all magic is considered sacriligious and evil there, why would the Averoignese God WANT to grant it to His priests...? Or, if He DID, why would the Church make it illegal...? Presumably Simon's holy symbol can be "edited out" of X2, now that we know which Immortal he follows. Or he could've been wearing a cross in mockery of the Averoignese clergy, for whom his family obviously has a long-standing grudge: since the God from CAS's stories doesn't seem to grant His clergy spells, He probably wasn't going to strike Simon down with a bolt of lightning for taking His symbol in vain, either. *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 17 Feb 1999 20:00:55 -0500 From: Sharon Dornhoff Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - The Taymora >> That doesn't mean Hutaakan culture and Nithian culture are necessarily much >> alike. While their system of writing is similar, there's plenty of things >> about these two groups that differ considerably: language, architecture, >> presence or absence of a Pharaoh, activity patterns (KW Hutaakans were >> nocturnal), types of agriculture they practice (flood-plain farming vs >> montane lizard-herding), and how warlike they are. > > >Do Hutaakans herd lizards? I thought they relied on intensive farming, >using slaves (the Traldars). > > Giampaolo Agosta Oh, they grow crops and keep livestock too. It was the differences between the cultures I was trying to emphasize: the Hutaakans keep giant footpad lizards for riding -- a handy steed for the mountains, since those critters can walk up cliffs! -- whereas the Nithians seldom even ride horses. And I don't think the Traldar were enslaved until the gnolls' invasion reduced both cultures to poverty, and the Hutaakans started treating them more harshly, to compensate. When the races first encountered one another, the Traldar were more like day-laborers than slaves, and the Hutaakans helped them to regain many of the civilized skills they'd forgotten. The key subtext of the "Traldar vs Hutaakans" chapter, in module B10-Night's Dark Terror -- the one which first introduced these two races and their history -- is the PCs' gradual discovery that BOTH races are misrepresenting their past relationship: the Traldar had reason to rebel against their cruel mistreatment, but the Hutaakans had been quite fair to them for many centuries before that. AFAIK, the HW Hutaakans don't even keep slaves ... another BIG difference, between them and the Nithians. *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 17 Feb 1999 20:07:10 -0600 From: "Timothy R. Haney" Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - The Taymora Sharon Dornhoff wrote: > > And I don't think the Traldar were enslaved until the gnolls' invasion > reduced both cultures to poverty, and the Hutaakans started treating them > more harshly, to compensate. When the races first encountered one another, > the Traldar were more like day-laborers than slaves, and the Hutaakans > helped them to regain many of the civilized skills they'd forgotten. The > key subtext of the "Traldar vs Hutaakans" chapter, in module B10-Night's > Dark Terror -- the one which first introduced these two races and their > history -- is the PCs' gradual discovery that BOTH races are > misrepresenting their past relationship: the Traldar had reason to rebel > against their cruel mistreatment, but the Hutaakans had been quite fair to > them for many centuries before that. What I remember happened is the gnoll invasion caused the Hutaakans to remove themselves from the Traldar who they had 'enslaved' (the impression is the Hutaakans were actually guiding the Traldar regrowth. I took this to be Pflarr's image of what Nithia should be). They did take a few young Traldar with them as they retreated to their hidden valley (which in turn infuriated Pflarr causing him to remove a few to the Hollow World and forget the rest). Those are the Traldar found in B10. To the remaining Traldar, they must have thought the Hutaakans had died in the gnoll invasion. So, they lost most their population (again) and guidance. This is the time I thought would be when the practices of the Taymora were looked at closer and adopted. - -- Timothy R. Haney galwylin@airnet.net The Tome of Galwylin - http://www.airnet.net/galwylin/ Galwylin's Bookshop - http://www.airnet.net/galwylin/bookshop/ *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 17 Feb 1999 22:31:41 EST From: BoBoII@aol.com Subject: [MYSTARA] - Re: Dwarves of Thonia (MPicts?) In a message dated 2/15/99 11:14:48 PM, beyowulf@pipeline.com writes: << Spiked hair and tattoos? Your average dwarf, IMHO, tends to be conservative. Maybe this way in battle, but in normal everyday life, nah, I just don't see it. >> If this is the norm for them, then sticking with it WOULD be "conservative, n'est pas? Personally I like the idea of Wild Dwarves. Make them out as M-Picts/M-Gauls in an Asterix kind of way. *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 17 Feb 1999 23:28:15 -0500 From: Andrew Toth Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Re: Dwarves of Thonia (MPicts?) At 10:31 PM 2/17/99 EST, you wrote: > >In a message dated 2/15/99 11:14:48 PM, beyowulf@pipeline.com writes: > ><< Spiked hair and tattoos? Your average dwarf, IMHO, tends to be >conservative. >Maybe this way in battle, but in normal everyday life, nah, I just don't >see it. > >> > > If this is the norm for them, then sticking with it WOULD be "conservative, >n'est pas? > >Personally I like the idea of Wild Dwarves. Make them out as M-Picts/M-Gauls >in an Asterix kind of way. Okay, I suppose I could live with tatoos, supposing such serve a purpose(ritualistic, right of passage, etc) but what reason could you come up with for spiking your hair? Has any RW culture, and there are many, ever had spiked hair as part of normal society, as in everyday people went around like this? I can think of very few(maybe Scythians, and Picts), so if your going to say that these dwarves have spiked hair, you'd have to have to a pretty good reason for that. Beyowulf Steely Blue Dragon -==UDIC==- |/ "Ours is not to reason why, but to blow this joint before we die" -Ratrap, BeastWars *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ End of mystara-digest V1999 #93 ******************************* *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara' as the body of the message. mystara-digest Thursday, February 18 1999 Volume 1999 : Number 094 Mystara is a trademark of TSR Inc. All Rights Reserved. The following topics are covered in this digest: Re: [MYSTARA] - Re: Dwarves of Thonia (MPicts?) Re: [MYSTARA] - Re: Dwarves of Thonia (MPicts?) RE: [MYSTARA] - Re: Dwarves of Thonia (MPicts?) Re: [MYSTARA] - Re: Dwarves of Thonia (MPicts?) RE: [MYSTARA] - Re: Dwarves of Thonia (MPicts?) Re: [MYSTARA] - Vecna - Apologies Re: [MYSTARA] - The Taymora RE: [MYSTARA] - Re: Dwarves of Thonia (MPicts?) Re: [MYSTARA] - MYSTARA: CUSTOM: MYSTARA GRIMOIRE Re: [MYSTARA] - Guardian Mesa RE: [MYSTARA] - Re: Dwarves of Thonia (MPicts?) Re: [MYSTARA] - Re: Dwarves of Thonia (MPicts?) Re: [MYSTARA] - Dragonlord Chronicles Re: [MYSTARA] - Wild Dwarves of Thonia Re: [MYSTARA] - Re: Dwarves of Thonia (MPicts?) Re: [MYSTARA] - Vecna - Apologies Re: [MYSTARA] - The Taymora Re: [MYSTARA] - Wild Dwarves of Thonia Re: [MYSTARA] - The Taymora Re: [MYSTARA] - Re: Dwarves of Thonia (MPicts?) Re: [MYSTARA] - Re: Dwarves of Thonia (MPicts?) Re: [MYSTARA] - The Taymora ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Wed, 17 Feb 1999 23:25:47 EST From: BoBoII@aol.com Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Re: Dwarves of Thonia (MPicts?) In a message dated 2/18/99 12:16:04 AM, beyowulf@pipeline.com writes: << kay, I suppose I could live with tatoos, supposing such serve a purpose(ritualistic, right of passage, etc) but what reason could you come up with for spiking your hair? >> I like this. Special tatoos like "Of Protection +1", or "Animal control" etc. and the warriors go on great quests/lots of piratical raiding to gather the materials needed for the priests to perform the ceremonies. *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 17 Feb 1999 23:40:16 EST From: GlobalFrog@aol.com Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Re: Dwarves of Thonia (MPicts?) I REEEAAALLLY like the idea of magical tatoos for these dwarves...just think of one that is a CAUSE FEAR on their opponents and what kinds of benefits that would give the Painted Ones in battle...I am liking this more and more all the time. As it is my dwarves are Scottish like in their dress and clans (their version of a kilt, the "targ", comes in formal, everyday, and battle styles) and adding magical tatoos and body paints would make them even more distinctive. cj (aka One Eye the Dwarf and his alter ego STUMPY the Axe) *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 18 Feb 1999 12:47:23 +0800 From: Murphy Jason Subject: RE: [MYSTARA] - Re: Dwarves of Thonia (MPicts?) > I REEEAAALLLY like the idea of magical tatoos for these dwarves...just > think > of one that is a CAUSE FEAR on their opponents and what kinds of benefits > that would give the Painted Ones in battle...I am liking this more and > more > all the time. As it is my dwarves are Scottish like in their dress and > clans > (their version of a kilt, the "targ", comes in formal, everyday, and > battle > styles) and adding magical tatoos and body paints would make them even > more > distinctive. > > cj > > [MURPHY Jason] Is it just me or does this style of dwarf smell very similar to the Warhammer game variety. I am certain i remember seeing artwork of spike haired tattooed dwarves with fierce countenances and bloody great axes. And then in the Warhammer Shadow of a horned rat computer game they even had scottish accents. But hey what the hell do i know? :) Jason Murphy Software Engineer MITS Limited EMAIL: jason.murphy@mitswa.com.au PHONE: 08 9481 4066 FAX: 08 9481 4064 *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 18 Feb 1999 00:03:13 EST From: GlobalFrog@aol.com Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Re: Dwarves of Thonia (MPicts?) In a message dated 2/17/99 11:51:43 PM EST, jason.murphy@mitswa.com.au writes: << [MURPHY Jason] Is it just me or does this style of dwarf smell very similar to the Warhammer game variety >> I don't know...I have never played a warhammer product (other than the computerized blood bowl...now THAT is an enjoyable game)...I think that the appeal in this type of dwarf is that it doesn't seem to be your standard "Tolkeinesque" style of underground dweller. cj *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 18 Feb 1999 13:17:52 +0800 From: Murphy Jason Subject: RE: [MYSTARA] - Re: Dwarves of Thonia (MPicts?) Actually, now that i remember. It wasnt just your regular dwarf that looked that way in warhammer. It was in fact dwarven berserkers. But i am pretty sure they match the descriptions being bandied. If you have a look at some warhammer boxed sets i dare say you will be able to see some artwork that matches. And also, warhammer being a miniatures game, will have miniatures of the dwarves in question. :) yeehah Jason Murphy Software Engineer MITS Limited EMAIL: jason.murphy@mitswa.com.au PHONE: 08 9481 4066 FAX: 08 9481 4064 *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 18 Feb 1999 10:49:06 +0100 From: Michele Vacchiano Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Vecna - Apologies Edward Phillips invaded my mailbox saying:: > -----Original Message-----.............. Could you please stop quoting long messages? *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 18 Feb 1999 11:44:54 +0100 (MET) From: Agathokles Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - The Taymora On Wed, 17 Feb 1999, Sharon Dornhoff wrote: > Oh, they grow crops and keep livestock too. It was the differences between > the cultures I was trying to emphasize: the Hutaakans keep giant footpad > lizards for riding -- a handy steed for the mountains, since those critters > can walk up cliffs! -- whereas the Nithians seldom even ride horses. In B10, Hutaakans don't ride lizards. The PCs have to get lizards from the Traldars. > > And I don't think the Traldar were enslaved until the gnolls' invasion > reduced both cultures to poverty, and the Hutaakans started treating them > more harshly, to compensate. When the races first encountered one another, > the Traldar were more like day-laborers than slaves, and the Hutaakans > helped them to regain many of the civilized skills they'd forgotten. They imposed their cultural dominance on the Traldar just because they were not warriors. The difference between "day-laborers" and "slaves" may be quite small when the there are such differences in technological advancement. I think it's something like colonialism. The > key subtext of the "Traldar vs Hutaakans" chapter, in module B10-Night's > Dark Terror -- the one which first introduced these two races and their > history -- is the PCs' gradual discovery that BOTH races are > misrepresenting their past relationship: the Traldar had reason to rebel > against their cruel mistreatment, but the Hutaakans had been quite fair to > them for many centuries before that. It is also said that Hutaakans aren't great workers, so it is quite natural for them to use slave work. > > AFAIK, the HW Hutaakans don't even keep slaves ... another BIG difference, > between them and the Nithians. > Sorry, I didn't know about HW Hutaakans However, the biggest differences between Hutaakans and Nithians are probably in architecture (looking at the Temple of Pflarr in B10) and society (Hutaakan society is matriarcal, as High Clerics are all females). Giampaolo Agosta *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 18 Feb 1999 08:38:39 -0500 From: Andrew Toth Subject: RE: [MYSTARA] - Re: Dwarves of Thonia (MPicts?) At 12:47 PM 2/18/99 +0800, you wrote: > > > > > >> I REEEAAALLLY like the idea of magical tatoos for these dwarves...just >> think >> of one that is a CAUSE FEAR on their opponents and what kinds of benefits >> that would give the Painted Ones in battle...I am liking this more and >> more >> all the time. As it is my dwarves are Scottish like in their dress and >> clans >> (their version of a kilt, the "targ", comes in formal, everyday, and >> battle >> styles) and adding magical tatoos and body paints would make them even >> more >> distinctive. >> >> cj >> >> > [MURPHY Jason] > Is it just me or does this style of dwarf smell very similar to the >Warhammer game variety. I am certain i remember seeing artwork of spike >haired tattooed dwarves with fierce countenances and bloody great axes. And >then in the Warhammer Shadow of a horned rat computer game they even had >scottish accents. > But hey what the hell do i know? :) Well its not just there, in Raymond Feist's Riftwar Saga, the Dwarves there also have Scottish accents, though not Scottish clothing, far as I know. Beyowulf Steely Blue Dragon -==UDIC==- |/ "Ours is not to reason why, but to blow this joint before we die" -Ratrap, BeastWars *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 18 Feb 1999 08:33:32 -0600 From: Aaron E Nowack Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - MYSTARA: CUSTOM: MYSTARA GRIMOIRE >PARALLEL WORLDS: >"If they give you lined paper, write the other way." >Following are Mystara continuums where events have not taken place as >written >in the TSR published packages and books. > >These parallels are NOT parallel "Heisnberg Event" worlds, where the >same >timestream divides based on what a character or nation does; they are >parallel >multiversal dimensions where things have always been fundamentally >different >from the "official" Mystara. > >It is worth noting that a majority of responses to date have used the >AD&D >Outer Planes AND the Mystara multiverse as part of the same cosmos >without >distinguishing clearly between the two. Well, there's one other, Solmyr's Mystara Birthright PBEM. It deviates in 1004 from the normal timeline. There are changes to numerous to mention, but here comes the gist of it. The Master seized Sind in late 1003 apparently, and moved on to darokin, pausing to take care of Ethengar. Thyatis has formed a Hegemony of itself, the "Principality of Traladara", and Alfheim (Minrothad was formerly a member). Darokin has been split into three hostile states (the Republic of Darokin, the Darokinian Democratic Republic, and the Kingdom of Darokin). Currently (late 1007 I believe), the Master was just slain by heroes from the Hegemony, Denagoth has invaded Wendar and the newly liberated Heldannic Freeholds, and Alfheim and the Shadow Elves are fighting the Hidden Temple of Atzanteotl. Aaron Nowack "Never let reality get in the way of a good hypothesis." http://www.geocities.com/TimesSquare/Dungeon/5930/ ___________________________________________________________________ You don't need to buy Internet access to use free Internet e-mail. Get completely free e-mail from Juno at http://www.juno.com/getjuno.html or call Juno at (800) 654-JUNO [654-5866] *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 18 Feb 1999 17:47:44 +0100 From: DM Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Guardian Mesa On Mon, 15 Feb 1999 18:04:13 -0500, Sharon Dornhoff wrote: << It's mostly the time frame of it all, that disturbs me. Even if there's only a few Master-level characters out there, in every generation, that means there've been THOUSANDS of such characters -- millions even, if you've set the Carnifex as far back in time as Mystaros has -- in the various (pre)historical periods since their original imprisonment. Claiming that NONE of those people has ever been powerful enough, and ignorant or foolish enough, to blunder across the means of freeing the carnosaur-folk -- at least, not until those boneheaded PCs come along! ;-) - - -- just seems like too much of a stretch, to me. :-/>> Well, to me there is an explanation that could hold: first of all, the mortals should not know about the Carnifex' existance at all, so they don't look for them. The Immortals took great care of purging the world from all memories of the Greater Carnifex (those living in the Pits) and after their failure, only scatter samples of their majestic civilization survived. This all happened around BC 9,000 IMHO (I am one of those who think Mystara has far shorter timeframes than RW) and even the second generation carnifex (Y'hog Carnifex) who arose after their forefathers' demise had vague memories about their predecessors' might and powers, although they still worshipped the Outer Beings. These carnifex then vanished as well (because of the Lhomarrians' actions and the Immortals' intervention again), leaving behind little remains and ruins, and only degenerate specimen who burrowed deep into the earth to avoid persecutions and abandoned the OB's worship, thinking they had been the cause of their disaster (these are the Deep Carnifex that now dwell in Davania.. but I don't wanna give away too much..). During all these years, probably somebody stumbled upon the Guardian Mesa and tried to unlock the secret of its magics. Unfortunately, the Immortals took a great many precautions to seal the Pits of Banishment and many of the first explorers merely died in the Seven Realms. Remember that the Pits are sealed off from the Astral Plane and the only access is the Guardian Mesa, a gate which can be opened only by retrieving the seven keys guarded in the Seven Realms which (IMHO) separate the Pits from the rest of the Multiverse. Mind you, somebody probably even managed to open the gate and to enter Castle Carnifex, but alas the Gate was not permanent and it closed seven minutes after the unwary explorer crossed its doorstep, confining him in that bleak place, where he was either devoured by the Carnifex or by any other unspeakable thing confined there. And I don't think that many did succeed in opening it anyway, maybe a dozen in 10,000 years: and even then, they didn't really know what to expect there. They didn't understand that a gate could have been built to keep something inside and not to keep others from going in.. Heck, my PCs are damn tough, but nonetheless only two out of 16 characters (both PCs and NPCs) of Companion-Master level managed to survive that adventure!!!! It's the ultimate D&D meatgrinder If you ask me.. Show me another D&D adventure that tough and I'll bow to you (I've played M5 as well and M3 is more dangerous than that!). DM *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 18 Feb 1999 12:56:44 -0500 (EST) From: au998@freenet.carleton.ca (Geoff Gander) Subject: RE: [MYSTARA] - Re: Dwarves of Thonia (MPicts?) Jason Murphy wrote: > Is it just me or does this style of dwarf smell very similar to the >Warhammer game variety. I am certain i remember seeing artwork of spike >haired tattooed dwarves with fierce countenances and bloody great axes. And >then in the Warhammer Shadow of a horned rat computer game they even had >scottish accents. > But hey what the hell do i know? :) That's the first thing that came to my mind as well - Warhammer FRP dwarves! But I think this is a neat departure from the "conventional" hi-ho-hi-ho types dwaves. :) Geoff - -- Geoff Gander, BA 97 Cartographer/Game Designer/Government Peon Part-Time High Priest, Ottawa Chapter of the Church of Y'hog au998@freenet.carleton.ca *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 18 Feb 1999 13:33:38 EST From: BoBoII@aol.com Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Re: Dwarves of Thonia (MPicts?) In a message dated 99-02-18 12:58:41 EST, you write: << That's the first thing that came to my mind as well - Warhammer FRP dwarves! But I think this is a neat departure from the "conventional" hi-ho-hi-ho types dwaves. :) >> While not familiar with the Warhammer line o products, I see these savage raider dwarves' hair as more plaited and spikey, not the b/w mohawk i've seen on the Shadowrun stuff. Anybody got solid info on the Picts? I think Pendragon has some. Also, I'm still wondering, Where are the MRussians? Sure Traldar are kinda Slavic, but anyone got Ideas? What are the barbarians who savage Hule's Northern Marches like? Thanks BoBo II *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 18 Feb 1999 13:59:45 -0600 From: "Timothy R. Haney" Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Dragonlord Chronicles Sharon Dornhoff wrote: > > I believe there's a reference to how the Flaemish people had lived on > Mystara for a little over 100 years, at the time the novels take place. So > that would place Thelvyn & Co. in the early 500s (the Flaem settled Glantri > in 395 AC). Ah, good. I was within the right time period :) BTW, I finished this series. The third book is much better than the second. I know the author doesn't really exist but was the series handled by more than one? I must say I did like the background the books provided (villages, events, history). The idea of the Eldar was interesting and I think I might try and use it. About the only thing that bothered me was the plot. I found the idea of an other world threat mixed with the Immortals too similiar to the Penhaligon Trilogy. It was much better but I couldn't help notice that both authors must have thought threats from outside Mystara and the presence of the Immortals more interesting than Mystara itself. I really didn't care for Dark Knight of Karameikos and now I've got the Black Vessel to read (and hunt for this Son of Dawn). So, anyone care to say what they thought of all these Mystara books? :) - -- Timothy R. Haney galwylin@airnet.net The Tome of Galwylin - http://www.airnet.net/galwylin/ Galwylin's Bookshop - http://www.airnet.net/galwylin/bookshop/ *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 18 Feb 1999 21:04:49 +0100 From: "Jamuga Khan" Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Wild Dwarves of Thonia > Actually, now that i remember. It wasnt just your regular dwarf that looked > that way in warhammer. It was in fact dwarven berserkers. But i am pretty > sure they match the descriptions being bandied. If you have a look at some > warhammer boxed sets i dare say you will be able to see some artwork that > matches. And also, warhammer being a miniatures game, will have miniatures > of the dwarves in question. :) Hm, this reminds me to this dwarven berserker in the FR - The Legacy ff. What was his name? Thibbledorf Pwent, or so? In German he was called a "Schlachtenwueter". From what it was translated? Jamuga Khan "Hear and obey, because the Mighty Khan's word is law." *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 18 Feb 1999 21:05:05 +0100 From: "Jamuga Khan" Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Re: Dwarves of Thonia (MPicts?) > That's the first thing that came to my mind as well - Warhammer FRP > dwarves! But I think this is a neat departure from the "conventional" > hi-ho-hi-ho types dwaves. :) > > Geoff Well, when thinking at a dwarven chorus, I constantly have in mind the soundtrack of "1492 - Conquest of Paradise". This hi-ho-hi-ho singing is only something for merry dwarves on a march. But when are Mystaran dwarves SOO merry? Jamuga Khan "Hear and obey, because the Mighty Khan's word is law." *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 18 Feb 1999 20:45:05 -0000 From: "Edward Phillips" Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Vecna - Apologies >Edward Phillips invaded my mailbox saying:: Not everybody knows the rules chuckles, but in the spirit of things my apologies. Now more importantly has anyone got the stats for Vecna from that Greyhawk module where the PCs have to track him down to Tavag Baru??? Please. (I want a new shadowlord and Mr Happy go lucky seems to fit the bill). After all I've got Lolth and the Drow running round under Skothar why not Vecna? *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 18 Feb 1999 17:23:35 -0500 From: Sharon Dornhoff Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - The Taymora >In B10, Hutaakans don't ride lizards. The PCs have to get lizards from the >Traldars. But the HW Hutaakans do use such mounts. Presumably, the degenerate Hutaakans in the Lost Valley gave up on using footpad mounts, after the Traldar (who are much better fighters than they) kept besting them in cavalry battles. Remember that "relict" Hutaakans and Traldar from B10 aren't really representative of their respective cultures at their height; both KW groups have fallen a loooong way, since then. >They imposed their cultural dominance on the Traldar just because they >were not warriors. The difference between "day-laborers" and "slaves" may >be quite small when the there are such differences in technological >advancement. I think it's something like colonialism. Granted. Still, the HW Traldar are a very tough, independent people (they're like "Golden Age" Greeks, a la Homer) and don't have Hutaakans looking over their shoulders all the time. Because the SoP preserves cultures so perfectly, the KW Traldar MUST have been self-governing at the time of the gnollish invasion. Otherwise, there wouldn't have been a King Halav or Queen Petra: they'd have had Hutaakan governors to rule them instead! >It is also said that Hutaakans aren't great workers, so it is quite >natural for them to use slave work. It says they're poor WARRIORS, not poor workers. Most Hutaakans are of the worker/artisan class; a few do become fighters, but most of their power to defend themselves is vested in their priests. Plus, there's a small colony of Hutaakans on the Serpent Peninsula, which appears in "The Black Vessel"; in that novel, they're peaceful farmers who keep strictly to themselves, and are afraid of humans. >> AFAIK, the HW Hutaakans don't even keep slaves ... another BIG difference, >> between them and the Nithians. > >Sorry, I didn't know about HW Hutaakans Well, those are the ones I was going by, in extrapolating what Hutaakan culture had been like prior to the gnollish invasion. Thanks to the SoP, it's a near-perfect example of how the "original" Hutaakans' society was organized and what their cultural habits were ... except, of course, that there's no night for them to be active in. *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 18 Feb 1999 17:31:30 -0500 From: Sharon Dornhoff Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Wild Dwarves of Thonia >Hm, this reminds me to this dwarven berserker in the FR - The Legacy ff. >What was his name? Thibbledorf Pwent, or so? In German he was called >a "Schlachtenwueter". From what it was translated? The Complete Book of Dwarves introduced the "battlerager" kit ... essentially, a berserker-dwarf that's almost identical (!) to the Warhammer dwarves in appearance/dress. I think that's what Thibbledorf was supposed to be. (Don'tcha hate it, when TSR sponges off other game-companies' ideas, instead of using a little imagination...? :-P) *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 18 Feb 1999 17:50:44 -0500 From: Sharon Dornhoff Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - The Taymora >What I remember happened is the gnoll invasion caused the Hutaakans to >remove themselves from the Traldar who they had 'enslaved' (the >impression is the Hutaakans were actually guiding the Traldar regrowth. >I took this to be Pflarr's image of what Nithia should be). Yes, they retreated to their valley and left most of the Traldar behind to fight. But the Traldar had their own kings and queens -- Halav and Petra, among them -- and were obviously armed: they actually did stop the gnolls, albeit at great cost! So they couldn't have been truly "enslaved", because even the Hutaakans aren't arrogant enough to think they can give slaves weapons and expect them to still do as they're told. >They did >take a few young Traldar with them as they retreated to their hidden >valley (which in turn infuriated Pflarr causing him to remove a few to >the Hollow World and forget the rest). I think Pflarr got fed up with Nithia's corruption, not with the Hutaakans. He'd lost interest in the whole of the outer world, and moved a random selection of Hutaakans to the Hollow World so he wouldn't have to bother with the KW anymore. The Hutaakans did bring a number of Traldar workers with them to the Lost Valley -- where they started mistreating them, leading to their revolt -- but I doubt if Pflarr could've cared less, about that. >Those are the Traldar found in >B10. To the remaining Traldar, they must have thought the Hutaakans had >died in the gnoll invasion. So, they lost most their population (again) >and guidance. According to Gaz1, the Traldar thought the cowardly Hutaakans had abandoned them in their hour of need (and they were right, too!). After that, future generations told their children that the "dog-heads" were ALL evil and treacherous, whether Hutaakans or gnolls. By the Traladaran era, they'd even forgotten that Hutaakans and gnolls were two different races. >This is the time I thought would be when the practices of >the Taymora were looked at closer and adopted. Remember that the gnolls invaded in 1000 BC, and that Taymoran civilization collapsed roughly a thousand years before that date. That seems like a loooong time for humans -- a short-lived race -- to retain any substantial knowledge of a previous culture, without the SoP to guide them. Not to say that it COULDN'T have happened ... just that it seems unlikely, IMHO. *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 18 Feb 1999 17:54:42 -0500 From: Sharon Dornhoff Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Re: Dwarves of Thonia (MPicts?) >Has any RW culture, and there are many, ever had spiked hair as part of >normal society, >as in everyday people went around like this? I can think of very few(maybe >Scythians, >and Picts), so if your going to say that these dwarves have spiked hair, >you'd have >to have to a pretty good reason for that. IIRC, there were some pretty bizarre hairstyles among Native American cultures, too. I don't know about "spiked" hair specifically, but women among the old Pueblo peoples (Zuni, Hopi, etc) used to arrange their hair in ways that look "punk" to modern eyes. *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 18 Feb 1999 18:09:32 -0500 From: Sharon Dornhoff Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Re: Dwarves of Thonia (MPicts?) >Also, I'm still wondering, Where are the MRussians? Sure Traldar are kinda >Slavic, but anyone got Ideas? What are the barbarians who savage Hule's >Northern Marches like? > >Thanks >BoBo II MRussians might be tricky, since the Rus were actually Norse, not Slavic! Perhaps some ancestors of the Ostlanders could have founded a colony (but where...?) several hundred years ago, and they brought along Traladaran slaves to work the land. The colony could've then lost contact with the Northern Reaches, and over the generations the two cultures -- Northman and Traladaran -- became mixed. Slagovich and the City-States of the RS setting are Slavic already. There's also a (non-canon) MLatvian country that Geoff has designed, which you can find in Stan's Archive. And I've got a "High Traladaran" nation in store for the Hollow Moon, which will be based on Renaissance Poland ... a chance to show an old Eastern European culture at its height, for a change! :-) *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 18 Feb 1999 17:21:25 -0600 From: "Timothy R. Haney" Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - The Taymora Sharon Dornhoff wrote: > > Granted. Still, the HW Traldar are a very tough, independent people > (they're like "Golden Age" Greeks, a la Homer) and don't have Hutaakans > looking over their shoulders all the time. Because the SoP preserves > cultures so perfectly, the KW Traldar MUST have been self-governing at the > time of the gnollish invasion. Otherwise, there wouldn't have been a King > Halav or Queen Petra: they'd have had Hutaakan governors to rule them > instead! Not necessarily. The Hutaakans could have been seen as something like advisors. Wise men who guided the people through the kings. The Hutaakans didn't exactly have to be oppressive to guide the growth of the Traldar. I'm making a leap without checking first but Nithia (if its like its Egypt counterpart) probably believed its kings were divine (or at least spoke with divine authority). There was a break from that with the Traldar and I'm not convinced Pflarr would have pushed for this removal of thought that kings served at the request of the Immortals. I've always thought of Traladara history as being hinted at but not documented. The Taymorans may have brought the idea of the hero-king that the Traladarans adopted later giving rise to Halav saving them in the past. Remember, history spoke how Halav was forced to kill the previous king for not believing in the words from the unnamed Immortals (who may actually be Halav, Petra, and Zirchev before assuming the names from these legends). That may have just been fluff added to the legend of Halav later. At any rate, I don't think the history of the Traldar has been completely revealed and the Hollow World only preserves what the Immortals wish it to. > Well, those are the ones I was going by, in extrapolating what Hutaakan > culture had been like prior to the gnollish invasion. Thanks to the SoP, > it's a near-perfect example of how the "original" Hutaakans' society was > organized and what their cultural habits were ... except, of course, that > there's no night for them to be active in. The SoP is like a snap shot of a culture. It represents a moment in time. In the Hutaakans' culture, a moment of time that Pflarr thought the best. There's not anything to support he transplanted the actual culture but instead chose those that best reflected what he wanted of the Hutaakans. That may have never existed except in the hopes of a few of them. - -- Timothy R. Haney galwylin@airnet.net The Tome of Galwylin - http://www.airnet.net/galwylin/ Galwylin's Bookshop - http://www.airnet.net/galwylin/bookshop/ *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ End of mystara-digest V1999 #94 ******************************* *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara' as the body of the message. mystara-digest Friday, February 19 1999 Volume 1999 : Number 095 Mystara is a trademark of TSR Inc. All Rights Reserved. The following topics are covered in this digest: Re: [MYSTARA] - Dragonlord Chronicles Re: [MYSTARA] - Re: Dwarves of Thonia (MPicts?) Re: [MYSTARA] - The Taymora Re: [MYSTARA] - Dragonlord Chronicles Re: [MYSTARA] - The Taymora Re: [MYSTARA] - Dragonlord Chronicles Re: [MYSTARA] - The Taymora Re: [MYSTARA] - Dragonlord Chronicles RE: [MYSTARA] - Dragonlord Chronicles Re: [MYSTARA] - Dragonlord Chronicles Re: [MYSTARA] - Re: Dwarves of Thonia (MPicts?) Re: [MYSTARA] - Vecna - Apologies Re: [MYSTARA] - Vecna - Apologies [MYSTARA] - Mapping Question RE: [MYSTARA] - Vecna - Apologies Re: [MYSTARA] - Vecna - Apologies ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Thu, 18 Feb 1999 18:48:17 -0500 From: Sharon Dornhoff Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Dragonlord Chronicles >BTW, I finished this series. The third book is much better than the >second. I know the author doesn't really exist but was the series >handled by more than one? I must say I did like the background the >books provided (villages, events, history). The idea of the Eldar was >interesting and I think I might try and use it. I think the Eldar are one of the few things the DL series made a mistake on, to be honest! Trying to tie the origins of elves and dragons together seems way too much like another case of "elf-worship" by fantasy authors, IMHO: it's like they feared the dragons wouldn't really be "cool" enough for the readers' tastes, if they weren't linked to elves somehow. Arguing that the drakes form a common link between the two is just plain wrong, since woodrakes are related to PC1's fairies. Not to mention that Ordana would hardly have allowed "her" elves to evolve into creatures that breathed (ugh!) fire.... >About the only thing >that bothered me was the plot. I found the idea of an other world >threat mixed with the Immortals too similiar to the Penhaligon Trilogy. The consensus among Mystara-buffs seems to be that the Penhaligon novels are just a made-up story, probably written to glamorize the (genuine) Order of the Three Suns. If so, then naturally the Mystaran who wrote them would credit their heroine with saving her entire world from a horrific, otherworldly threat: it's not SUPPOSED to be plausible; it's advertising! ;-) Setting aside the "Is it canon?" issue and stepping out-of-character: Sure, the idea of an otherplanar invasion had been done before ... but at least this time, it was done well! And the Overlord's invasion was just one of several conflicts Thelvyn had to deal with, and there were very different tactical and political elements to each battle he faced. The abelaat invasion, OTOH, took up three books, and offered little or no variety as to the problems its main character had to deal with. >I really didn't care for Dark Knight of Karameikos and now I've got the >Black Vessel to read (and hunt for this Son of Dawn). So, anyone care >to say what they thought of all these Mystara books? :) The Penhaligon novels were just plain lousy, IMHO: the monsters aren't frightening; the gimmick with the all-seeing "abelaat stones" is ridiculous; and the characters only seem realistic when they're suffering, which is hardly something that makes you want to keep reading the books. "Dark Knight" wasn't so bad up until the end -- the plot is interesting, and Grygory makes for a decent-enough hero -- but its blatantly non-Mystaran conclusion spoiled it for me. So... thumbs down, for those. :-P "The Black Vessel" is probably the best-written of the Mystara novels, with fully-developed characters and a scale that's not so overblown. It's also VERY well researched, both with regards to cultural flavor, and in sticking to "canon" facts about the setting. The Dragonlord series is by far the most entertaining of the books: I especially like the fact it's willing to show the "invincible" hero making mistakes or getting beaten once in a while! "Son of Dawn" is simplistic -- it's very much a children's novel -- but the characters are appealing and believable (with the notable exception of Struth the Shaker, a cartoon "Mr. Bad Guy" if there ever was one!), and it's nice to read another adventure with a less-than-global scope. Thumbs up for all of these, IMHO. :-D That's my review, in a nutshell, for all of the Mystara novels I've read. (If "Rogues To Riches" ever got published, I've never seen a copy.) *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 18 Feb 1999 18:51:16 EST From: BoBoII@aol.com Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Re: Dwarves of Thonia (MPicts?) In a message dated 2/18/99 4:06:35 PM, JamugaKhan@gmx.net writes: << Well, when thinking at a dwarven chorus, I constantly have in mind the soundtrack of "1492 - Conquest of Paradise". >> The perfect wild dwarf rowing song!! *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 18 Feb 1999 17:53:42 -0600 From: "Timothy R. Haney" Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - The Taymora Sharon Dornhoff wrote: > > Yes, they retreated to their valley and left most of the Traldar behind to > fight. But the Traldar had their own kings and queens -- Halav and Petra, > among them -- and were obviously armed: they actually did stop the gnolls, > albeit at great cost! So they couldn't have been truly "enslaved", because > even the Hutaakans aren't arrogant enough to think they can give slaves > weapons and expect them to still do as they're told. If the Hutaakans kept the idea in the culture that they spoke with Immortal authority, that could be seen as a form of enslavement ("To disobey us is to be damned!"). Like I said before, the history is filled with ideas that don't exactly fit together correctly. What Pflarr created the Hutaakans for and what they became in the outer world doesn't fit (perhaps because he removed the very ones that would create his ideal culture). > I think Pflarr got fed up with Nithia's corruption, not with the Hutaakans. > He'd lost interest in the whole of the outer world, and moved a random > selection of Hutaakans to the Hollow World so he wouldn't have to bother > with the KW anymore. True. Though the HW set says he grew disgusted with all the outer world. This is where I would insert the Traldar feeling the Immortals had abadoned them (up until the time when Halav presented himself to them). They in turn abadoned the Immortals and looked within themselves, bringing back the old beliefs of the Taymora into the culture. > The Hutaakans did bring a number of Traldar workers with them to the Lost > Valley -- where they started mistreating them, leading to their revolt -- > but I doubt if Pflarr could've cared less, about that. And he may be the reason for it :) > Remember that the gnolls invaded in 1000 BC, and that Taymoran civilization > collapsed roughly a thousand years before that date. That seems like a > loooong time for humans -- a short-lived race -- to retain any substantial > knowledge of a previous culture, without the SoP to guide them. Oh, I agree that its a long time. But I think Taymoran culture survived in legend. I like to think of the modern day druids, how they attempt to recapture a lost religion without a clear understanding of that religion. Our superstitions, ideas about vampires, all have survived with a SoP. They've been adapted for the modern day though they don't always resemble their original form. D&D is a form of bring the past forward without knowing exactly what that past was. > Not to say that it COULDN'T have happened ... just that it seems unlikely, > IMHO. I think if you consider what we think we know of myths and legends today to what we really know, you'd see why I think it more likely than not. Especially in a culture that doesn't keep written records (or have anything other than verbal legends around the campfire for entertainment). I don't think a culture in the Hollow World is a good measuring stick to know what a culture was like. But its a fair way of measuring what an Immortal that placed that culture there is like :) Putting the Traladaran history together looks to involve a lot of reading between the lines of the text. One big question for me is why Pflarr created the Hutaakans. If they were meant to influence Nithian growth, then why did the Traldar differ from Nithia. He's still involved in Nithia, so some aspects of it must be as he wishes. And if the Traldar did differ from Nithia, what was the reason for that when Pflarr maintained such a strong influence over them. Would have Halav been called a pharaoh in his own lifetime or had the break occurred before then? There's no indication that the Traldar rebelled against Nithia, so I assume that some contact was maintained up until Nithia's destruction. Pflarr kept the Immortals of Entropy from corrupting the Traldar through the Hutaakans but I don't see where he wouldn't want a cleric on the throne. Well, a few big questions :) - -- Timothy R. Haney galwylin@airnet.net The Tome of Galwylin - http://www.airnet.net/galwylin/ Galwylin's Bookshop - http://www.airnet.net/galwylin/bookshop/ *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 18 Feb 1999 18:22:40 -0600 From: "Timothy R. Haney" Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Dragonlord Chronicles Sharon Dornhoff wrote: > > I think the Eldar are one of the few things the DL series made a mistake > on, to be honest! Trying to tie the origins of elves and dragons together > seems way too much like another case of "elf-worship" by fantasy authors, > IMHO: it's like they feared the dragons wouldn't really be "cool" enough > for the readers' tastes, if they weren't linked to elves somehow. Arguing > that the drakes form a common link between the two is just plain wrong, > since woodrakes are related to PC1's fairies. Not to mention that Ordana > would hardly have allowed "her" elves to evolve into creatures that > breathed (ugh!) fire.... Oh, I don't know if it was elf-worship. Both races are magical in nature and I have wondered how dragons fit into Mystara (who created them, were they just big animals, etc.). I think that's why they kept talking about dragons cooking their meals (which bothered me alot until I thought that these aren't animals like an owlbear). Of course I wonder exactly what is different between an eldar and an elf. I did like that half-elves still don't exist officially in Mystara. And it offered a great way to introduce weird creatures that are left out of the origin history (like beholders) :) > That's my review, in a nutshell, for all of the Mystara novels I've read. > (If "Rogues To Riches" ever got published, I've never seen a copy.) "Rogues to Riches"?? Any ideas where it takes place? - -- Timothy R. Haney galwylin@airnet.net The Tome of Galwylin - http://www.airnet.net/galwylin/ Galwylin's Bookshop - http://www.airnet.net/galwylin/bookshop/ *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 18 Feb 1999 19:28:19 -0500 From: Sharon Dornhoff Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - The Taymora >I'm making a leap without checking first but Nithia (if >its like its Egypt counterpart) probably believed its kings were divine >(or at least spoke with divine authority). There was a break from that >with the Traldar and I'm not convinced Pflarr would have pushed for this >removal of thought that kings served at the request of the Immortals. That brings up an interesting question: who did the Traldar worship, BEFORE the Traladaran Immortals had achieved Immortality? The HW Traldar worship Halav and Petra, but presumably these faiths were introduced after their arrival in the Hollow World. At the time of the gnollish invasion, those two and Zirchev were still mortals. Conversely, if they'd worshipped Pflarr (being descendents of Nithians), they'd probably have been taken to the HW along with the Hutaakans, and would make up the HW Hutaakans' labor-class. So it's probably not him, who was their patron before the Traladaran Immortals came along. Rathanos is also unlikely, as he probably wouldn't have endorsed Petra's rulership, and there's no indication that fire meant anything special to the Traldar. Perhaps the Northern Reaches' pantheon -- perfect for a hero-worshipping culture -- was revered there...? >At any rate, I don't think the history of the Traldar >has been completely revealed and the Hollow World only preserves what >the Immortals wish it to. Only if they make a special effort to be selective. If you think about it, we don't know WHO brought the Traldar to the HW -- again, the Traladaran Immortals were still mortal at the time -- but if it was some impartial figure like Ka (the "default" choice), he'd try not to be picky or biased about what to take and what to leave. Ixion and Ka didn't leave human sacrifice behind when they moved the Azcans, after all ... and I doubt if either one approves of THAT, very much! If you ask me, I think there's probably a rule set by the Council of the Hollow World that if a culture's to be moved, you have to move the whole thing: good AND bad elements. There's too many aspects of HW cultures that Immortals would've left out, if they had a choice, for such a rule NOT to exist! Sure, there can be a bias in who's transported -- e.g. bringing only the less-degenerate Milenians -- but you CAN'T be so exacting/picky that there's no "down side" at all, to the resulting HW culture (so there's still Milenian officials who take bribes, etc). >The SoP is like a snap shot of a culture. It represents a moment in >time. In the Hutaakans' culture, a moment of time that Pflarr thought >the best. There's not anything to support he transplanted the actual >culture but instead chose those that best reflected what he wanted of >the Hutaakans. That may have never existed except in the hopes of a few >of them. Not so! The HW DM's book specifically states that Pflarr chose half the Hutaakans at random, to go to the Hollow World. He might have figured this was fair ... or he might honestly not have cared who went there and who didn't. Any claims the HW Hutaakans might make, that they are "chosen of Pflarr", is thus belied by the fact that every one of their ancestors could've just as easily been left behind, to slowly be driven to extinction in the Lost Valley. The overall impression which the products give, of Pflarr's personality, is that he's an unfeeling snob with a superiority complex, who cares far less for his worshippers than they care about him. This is the irony underlying the Hutaakans' arrogant stance as "Pflarr's Children", and it gives their race's piety an element of tragedy, for those in-the-know. *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 18 Feb 1999 18:43:25 -0600 From: Aaron E Nowack Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Dragonlord Chronicles >"The Black Vessel" is probably the best-written of the Mystara novels, >with >fully-developed characters and a scale that's not so overblown. It's >also >VERY well researched, both with regards to cultural flavor, and in >sticking >to "canon" facts about the setting. I have to agree here. My only problem with it is that, the author seems to believe Gargona is spelt Gorgona. BTW, the Mystara blurb at the back of the book is what TSR should have advertised AD&D Mystara as. Aaron Nowack "Never let reality get in the way of a good hypothesis." http://www.geocities.com/TimesSquare/Dungeon/5930/ ___________________________________________________________________ You don't need to buy Internet access to use free Internet e-mail. Get completely free e-mail from Juno at http://www.juno.com/getjuno.html or call Juno at (800) 654-JUNO [654-5866] *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 18 Feb 1999 19:50:33 EST From: Mystaros@aol.com Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - The Taymora In a message dated 99-02-18 19:29:24 EST, dornhoff@bio.umass.edu writes: << That brings up an interesting question: who did the Traldar worship, BEFORE the Traladaran Immortals had achieved Immortality? >> My own take on the Traldar Immortals can be found on Shawn's site... it's pretty much an outgorwth of the RW Greek pantheon, mixed in with elements of Mystaran lore... much like the Norse pantheon of Mystara versus the RW Norse pantheon... IMC the reverence of Petra, Halav and Zirchev grew out of the Hero Cults of the Traldar, much as did the worship of Herakles in the RW (for a while Herakles had a religious following that was not unlike that of Christianity, in that the Heraklian faith worshipped the Son of the High God, who was born half-God half-mortal, died as a mortal and ascended into "Heaven" to sit at the right-hand of his father (as Zeuses cup-bearer, nonetheless))... Mystaros *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 18 Feb 1999 19:51:46 -0500 From: Sharon Dornhoff Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Dragonlord Chronicles >Oh, I don't know if it was elf-worship. Both races are magical in >nature and I have wondered how dragons fit into Mystara (who created >them, were they just big animals, etc.). Elves are hardly the only race that's "magical in nature", however. If that's the only requirement to be a possible forerunner of dragons, then the Carnifex -- who are reptilian, AND even more magical than elves -- might be better candidates for their relations! (OTOH, if they're descended from THOSE bloodthirsty S.O.B.s, then dragons might not want to own up to the fact..... ;-D) Besides, it's already established that dragons are related to the chameleon men, and (by extension) to the various lizard-people of the RS setting. The Malpheggi lizard men speak the dragon language in addition to their own, in the HW. And the Schattenalfen's flapsail mounts seem to be small, unintelligent precursors to the red dragons of today. All these things support the idea that dragons always had reptilian affinities, and aren't easily reconciled with the notion that they "evolved" from Eldar. >And it >offered a great way to introduce weird creatures that are left out of >the origin history (like beholders) :) Now THAT part, I liked too! Of course, that means that if there's beholders mentioned in the products, at any time before 500 AC, we have to figure out how they'd gotten to Mystara so early.... :-) >"Rogues to Riches"?? Any ideas where it takes place? Nope. Haven't read it. But I assume it's post-WotI, since the other "young adult" novel (Son of Dawn) is. *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 19 Feb 1999 08:56:36 +0800 From: Murphy Jason Subject: RE: [MYSTARA] - Dragonlord Chronicles > I have to agree here. My only problem with it is that, the author seems > to believe Gargona is spelt Gorgona. > > BTW, the Mystara blurb at the back of the book is what TSR should have > advertised AD&D Mystara as. > > > Aaron Nowack > "Never let reality get in the way of a good hypothesis." > http://www.geocities.com/TimesSquare/Dungeon/5930/ > > [MURPHY Jason] Hmm there wouldnt be any chance of you typing the blurb from the back of the book onto the MML would you. Or maybe just give me the general idea of what it said? :) Sounds interesting. Jason Murphy Software Engineer MITS Limited EMAIL: jason.murphy@mitswa.com.au PHONE: 08 9481 4066 FAX: 08 9481 4064 *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 18 Feb 1999 21:05:53 -0600 From: Aaron E Nowack Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Dragonlord Chronicles >> I have to agree here. My only problem with it is that, the author >seems >> to believe Gargona is spelt Gorgona. >> >> BTW, the Mystara blurb at the back of the book is what TSR should >have >> advertised AD&D Mystara as. > [MURPHY Jason] > Hmm there wouldnt be any chance of you typing the blurb from >the >back of the book onto the MML would you. Or maybe just give me the >general >idea of what it said? :) > Sounds interesting. Sure thing. Here goes: Mystara Sprawling across the boundries of the Known World like a great, serpentine dragon lies the bustling, ever-startling world of Mystara, a land where the only constant is change. Mystara has managed to survive three disasters of cataclysmic proportions. The first such disaster, the Great Rain of Fire, came about some four millenia ago. It was then that the ancient Blackmoors, masters of magic and technology, loosed their powerful weapons on the land in an Armageddon that forever changed the face of the wolrd. Although the people of Blackmoor failed to survive this self-inflicted calamity, they were nevetheless players in the second major disaster some thirteen hundred years later, when unsuspecting elves unwittingly detonated a powerful artifact left behind by the men of Blackmoor. The resulting explosion not only wiped out whole rraces but also brought about a change in climate that spawned a new ice age. In more modern times, vengeful gods and goddesses brought about a series of cataclysmic events known as the Wrath of the Immortals. A giant meteorite struck the land, an entire continent sank beneath the ocean, and a deadly plauge began to spread. Mystara is a world of constant suprises. Where else would you expect to find a flying city, a magical mountain, a floating continent, an invisible moon complete with inhabitants, and an entire region of the world with its population held under the sinister, body-altering influence of a mysterious magical substance? What other land posseses an entire seprate world within its hollow core, with neither world's population aware of the existance of the other? In Mystara, you'll discover brave adventurers, powerful mages, evil villains, majestic dragons, lurking monsters. An entire civilization that has lived underground for hundreds of years, a nation of halflings, an island kingdom of pirates, Immortals who dabble in the affairs of mere mortals for their own ammusement. An entire race that has migrated to Mystara from another world. Fire and air magic... A blighted, magically enchanted forest... A sunken continent... It's all here and much, much more, when you there visit the magical, mystical world of Mystara! Aaron Nowack "Never let reality get in the way of a good hypothesis." http://www.geocities.com/TimesSquare/Dungeon/5930/ ___________________________________________________________________ You don't need to buy Internet access to use free Internet e-mail. Get completely free e-mail from Juno at http://www.juno.com/getjuno.html or call Juno at (800) 654-JUNO [654-5866] *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 18 Feb 1999 22:25:35 -0500 (EST) From: au998@freenet.carleton.ca (Geoff Gander) Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Re: Dwarves of Thonia (MPicts?) > >>Has any RW culture, and there are many, ever had spiked hair as part of >>normal society, >>as in everyday people went around like this? I can think of very few(maybe >>Scythians, >>and Picts), so if your going to say that these dwarves have spiked hair, >>you'd have >>to have to a pretty good reason for that. > >IIRC, there were some pretty bizarre hairstyles among Native American >cultures, too. I don't know about "spiked" hair specifically, but women >among the old Pueblo peoples (Zuni, Hopi, etc) used to arrange their hair >in ways that look "punk" to modern eyes. > > >*************************************************************************** >To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line >'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. > > - -- Geoff Gander, BA 97 Cartographer/Game Designer/Government Peon Part-Time High Priest, Ottawa Chapter of the Church of Y'hog au998@freenet.carleton.ca *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 18 Feb 1999 23:00:44 EST From: Arminath@aol.com Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Vecna - Apologies In a message dated 2/18/99 3:48:23 PM Eastern Standard Time, edward.phillips@virgin.net writes: << After all I've got Lolth and the Drow running round under Skothar why not Vecna? >> Oh the shame mine poor ears hath been witness to! Mystara was the *one* world that had broken from the traditional TSR philosophy good elves/bad elves, bad elves = drow and where's those drow are, their demon queen follows. 'Tis a sad day in mine heart to see another hapless gamer fall into the trap of the Drow Juggernaut and place them on the one world where the Elven Way for each culture is truly unique to their own... Arminath Wynter, Shadow Elf adventurer *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 19 Feb 1999 15:19:23 +1100 (EST) From: "Jonathan Nolan, Barrister & Solicitor, FTIA" Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Vecna - Apologies > << After all I've got Lolth and the Drow running round under Skothar why not > Vecna? >> > > Oh the shame mine poor ears hath been witness to! Mystara was the *one* world > that had broken from the traditional TSR philosophy good elves/bad elves, bad > elves = drow and where's those drow are, their demon queen follows. 'Tis a > sad day in mine heart to see another hapless gamer fall into the trap of the > Drow Juggernaut and place them on the one world where the Elven Way for each > culture is truly unique to their own... > > Arminath Wynter, Shadow Elf adventurer Ah but Arminath-sama, when some of the Shadow Elves turn from Rafiel and seek darker paths to power, what could be more natural than the Sun-God and his ilk scorching the rebellious Shadow Elves, so that their skin becomes like the eclipsed sun, and their hair snow-white to remind them of the pale Shadow Elf heritage they are forevermore denied? And deep in his caverns, the Blood Serpent laughs. ... [and you KNOW how popular Drizzt is... no Dark Elves/Drow, no Drizzt... (in Homer Simpson voice) you can see the bind we're in! :)] How are the Drow introduced by the dude with the Vecna crush, that's what I wanna know. I mean if we get sixtygazillion* Carnifex posts**, let's at least have one Drow***-athon..! :) * ...or five. ** not that it's a bad thing of course. *** Drow... I mean it's so FR... what about 'Dark Elves'? 'Blood Elves'? 'The Accursed'? 'Mzintlirn Quenya'? *** Now, Elminster fleeing to Mystara, having finally been cast out of FR, that's MY nightmare. *** "Had someone told me what would come from my theories, I would have become a watchmaker." - Onestone of Blackmoor - - *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 18 Feb 1999 23:18:44 EST From: Arminath@aol.com Subject: [MYSTARA] - Mapping Question I need to draw some new maps up and was wondering if anyone can recommend something (and where I can find it)? I need to make some new maps of my Karameikos campaign to reflect the changes in geographyand new town and dungeons for my group to crawl through. Jim *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 19 Feb 1999 12:58:18 +0800 From: Murphy Jason Subject: RE: [MYSTARA] - Vecna - Apologies > << After all I've got Lolth and the Drow running round under Skothar why > not > Vecna? >> > > Oh the shame mine poor ears hath been witness to! Mystara was the *one* > world > that had broken from the traditional TSR philosophy good elves/bad elves, > bad > elves = drow and where's those drow are, their demon queen follows. 'Tis > a > sad day in mine heart to see another hapless gamer fall into the trap of > the > Drow Juggernaut and place them on the one world where the Elven Way for > each > culture is truly unique to their own... > > Arminath Wynter, Shadow Elf adventurer > [MURPHY Jason] Ok, everyone has seen the the filthy underside of the subterranean elves. Even with the shadow elves there is the odd despicably evil character. Everyone has done it to death. What i wanna see, dammit, is a truely evil, bloodthirsty, psychopathic, sociopathic, schizophrenic, rape the fields and pillage the women (hmm maybe the men as well. I have to be politically correct here), death to all the innocents, cat kicking, dog beating, baby biting ALFHEIM SURFACE ELF!!! Maybe i have missed something in the mystara stuff, but i have never seen one mentioned. There is always the politically ambitious, selfish ones, but never a really died in the wool killer. You know the type of one that asks what the red button on the side of the ZORG 5000 does. Anyway.....dammit i now have the basis for my next campaign. :) Just bouncing ideas of you fellow freaks :) Jason "Its about time we saw a dark side to this pansy race" Murphy Jason Murphy Software Engineer MITS Limited EMAIL: jason.murphy@mitswa.com.au PHONE: 08 9481 4066 FAX: 08 9481 4064 *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 18 Feb 1999 23:22:02 -0600 From: "James Ruhland" Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Vecna - Apologies > > >Edward Phillips invaded my mailbox saying:: > > Not everybody knows the rules chuckles, but in the spirit of things my > apologies. > > Now more importantly has anyone got the stats for Vecna from that Greyhawk > module where the PCs have to track him down to Tavag Baru??? Please. > While others are nattering about Drow, I'll answer your question: Vecna's Manifestation (20th level Evil Wizad Suthaze type) Vecna's manifestation takes the form of a middle aged man marked by some crippling handicap, usually a missing leg. He carries no weapon other than a simple wooden crutch. He casts spells as a 20th level wizard [note from me: I'd give him the abilities of a Lich-Necromancer, by which I mean all the advantages of Necromantic specialization without loosing access to any spell schools. But that's just me.] Although mortal in form, the manifestation retains many of the properties of Vecna's previous incarnation as an arch-lich. STR: 14 Dex: 14 Con: 18 Int: 20 Wis: 18 Cha: 13 Mv: 9 SZ: M (5' 6") MR: 45% AC: 0 (not including any magic items et al) HD: 18 HP: 116 #Att: 1 THAC0: 10 Dmg: 1d10 If Vecna has recovered his Eye and Hand, these staticstics for his manifestation become STR 19, DEX 17, Mv: 12, MR: 70%, HD 20, HP: 124. [Campaigns could be based on preventing him from recovering his artifacts or somehow getting them out of his grip if he has them.] Special Att/Def: Vecna's manifestation can utilize all the powers of a normal lich at will. He can generate a fear aura, causing creatures of 5 HD (or levels) to roll a successful saving throw vs. spell or flee for 5d20 rounds. His touch can chill, causing 1d10 points od damage and paralysis until dispelled. He can be hit only by weapons of +1 or better enchantment. In addition to his magical resistance, Vecna's manifestation is immune to Charm, Sleep, Enfeeblement, Polymorph, Cold, Electricity, Insanity, and Death spells and powers. The manifestation cannot be turned (as undead). As a wizard he can cast spells as if 20th level (including the restriction of spells per level) but he does not need spell books or material components. Vecna's manifestation has access to all spells of all schools. Finally, the manifestation (in keeping with Vecna's role as master of secrets) can discover any personal secret a character might have. He often uses this power to keep worshipers in line and to blackmail powerful figures. [Note that with the exception of parts in brackets, the above is a verbatim quote from pp.73-74 of "Vecna Lives", by David "Zeb" Cook, copywright 1990 TSR inc. All rights reserved, penalty of death by fireball and/or disintigration, etc. etc.] *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ End of mystara-digest V1999 #95 ******************************* *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara' as the body of the message. mystara-digest Friday, February 19 1999 Volume 1999 : Number 096 Mystara is a trademark of TSR Inc. All Rights Reserved. The following topics are covered in this digest: Re: [MYSTARA] - Mapping Question Re: [MYSTARA] - Vecna - Apologies Re: [MYSTARA] - Vecna - Apologies Re: [MYSTARA] - Mapping Question RE: [MYSTARA] - Vecna - Apologies [MYSTARA] - Tome of Spellcraft, 2nd Edition Re: [MYSTARA] - Etienne's Immortal status Re: [MYSTARA] - Vecna - Apologies [MYSTARA] - The Aasimar, revised Re: [MYSTARA] - The Aasimar, revised [MYSTARA] - MonCon '99 [MYSTARA] - [MYSTARA] Traldar Immortals (was: - The Taymora) Re: [MYSTARA] - Re: Dwarves of Thonia (MPicts?) RE: [MYSTARA] - Re: Dwarves of Thonia (MPicts?) Re: [MYSTARA] - Re: Dwarves of Thonia (MPicts?) Re: [MYSTARA] - Dragonlord Chronicles [MYSTARA] - Carnifex Question Re: [MYSTARA] - Grimoire of spells (long) Re: [MYSTARA] - Dragonlord Chronicles RE: [MYSTARA] - Vecna - Apologies RE: [MYSTARA] - Vecna - Apologies Re: [MYSTARA] - The Taymora ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Fri, 19 Feb 1999 01:20:14 -0500 From: Jerry Hovenanian Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Mapping Question Arminath@aol.com, AKA Jim, wrote: > I need to draw some new maps up and was wondering if anyone can recommend > something (and where I can find it)? I need to make some new maps of my > Karameikos campaign to reflect the changes in geographyand new town and > dungeons for my group to crawl through. Goto http://akira.gameverse.org/Download/ and get WildMap.zip....this a Free program called Wilderness Mapper. It easyly makes hex maps and you can export them as .bmp for printing...I think this is what you...and everyone else needs :)....let me know if you like it...I do. - -- Jerry Hovenanian clumsydwarf@hotmail.com *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 19 Feb 1999 02:16:18 EST From: Arminath@aol.com Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Vecna - Apologies In a message dated 2/18/99 11:20:28 PM Eastern Standard Time, geckoes@ozemail.com.au writes: << Shadow Elves turn from Rafiel and seek darker paths to power, what could be more natural than the Sun-God and his ilk scorching the rebellious Shadow Elves, so that their skin becomes like the eclipsed sun, and their hair snow-white to remind them of the pale Shadow Elf heritage >> That is their choice, but I've never laid mine eyes upon an elf of the World Below that was dark of skin. Mayhap the eyes of the person ye're relying on for information was having tricks played upon hm by a pixie? Arminath *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 19 Feb 1999 02:27:57 EST From: Arminath@aol.com Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Vecna - Apologies In a message dated 2/19/99 12:03:06 AM Eastern Standard Time, jason.murphy@mitswa.com.au writes: << Everyone has done it to death. What i wanna see, dammit, is a truely evil, bloodthirsty, psychopathic, sociopathic, schizophrenic, rape the fields and pillage the women (hmm maybe the men as well. I have to be politically correct here), death to all the innocents, cat kicking, dog beating, baby biting ALFHEIM SURFACE ELF!!! >> I think that ye're stereotyping our race, kind sir. Elves, no matter what type, have an inner desire for life, not destruction of it. When moved, an ired elf can weak havoc of great proportions, but the kind of race that ye describe above only fits one out of the many I've encountered in all my travels: Humanity. "Tis sure that not every human is that way, but I've noticed over the centuries that all humans tend to try to accumulate as much of what each considers important as quickly as possible. Some tend to do this with less than scrupulous methods and others are kind and upstanding citizenry, ye all do it. Of course we all have a dark half to judge out inner light by, but even the Elves of the Land of the Red Sun cannot match the cold and calculating ways of evil humans. Arminath Wynter *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 19 Feb 1999 02:35:12 EST From: Arminath@aol.com Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Mapping Question Thanks alot! I do like the program. Now I just need something to make towne/dungeon maps, anyone know where I can get a mapper for that? Jim *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 19 Feb 1999 15:46:16 +0800 From: Murphy Jason Subject: RE: [MYSTARA] - Vecna - Apologies > I think that ye're stereotyping our race, kind sir. Elves, no matter what > type, have an inner desire for life, not destruction of it. When moved, > an > ired elf can weak havoc of great proportions, but the kind of race that ye > describe above only fits one out of the many I've encountered in all my > travels: Humanity. "Tis sure that not every human is that way, but I've > noticed over the centuries that all humans tend to try to accumulate as > much > of what each considers important as quickly as possible. Some tend to do > this > with less than scrupulous methods and others are kind and upstanding > citizenry, ye all do it. Of course we all have a dark half to judge out > inner > light by, but even the Elves of the Land of the Red Sun cannot match the > cold > and calculating ways of evil humans. > > Arminath Wynter > [MURPHY Jason] Actually my treehugging friend.....oops.....your a shadow elf, ok then my stalactite hugging friend :). Thats was the point i was trying to make. You elves are terminally nice. This penchant for herbal tea, ivy doilies and flowers behinds the ears must be brought to an end. And i am just the perverted personality to do it. My mission should i choose to accept it, which i have, is to bring to life a surface dwelling alfheim elf so deviated from the norm, so disgustingly putrified, such an abomination to the very planet that has allowed his existance, that elven hippies the world over will find there ears drooping in racial impotence at the very mention name. I hope to break the stereotype Arminath not create one :) Jason "what cheeses me off" Murphy Jason Murphy Software Engineer MITS Limited EMAIL: jason.murphy@mitswa.com.au PHONE: 08 9481 4066 FAX: 08 9481 4064 *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 19 Feb 1999 02:49:47 EST From: Arminath@aol.com Subject: [MYSTARA] - Tome of Spellcraft, 2nd Edition The OD&D Tome of Spellcraft has enough new spells to warrant a new edition! Keep the new spells coming! The Tome will be sent automatically to the people that requested and recieved the 1st Edition. If you don't get one, email me and I'll be sure and reach you! As always, feedback is greatly appreciated! Complaints, questions, suggestions or whatever, email them to me so I can make the next one better than the last 2! Jim *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 19 Feb 1999 09:21:34 +0100 (MET) From: Agathokles Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Etienne's Immortal status On Wed, 17 Feb 1999, Sharon Dornhoff wrote: > In the original Averoigne stories, there was an evil church official who > secretly worshipped the Devil and had magical powers; however, they were a > product of witchcraft (i.e. wizardry), not clerical magic. It was the NPC > clergy in the "Old Averoigne" section of the module I was referring to, as > being without spells. I think the module implies that PCs can't get healed > by the local priests, so my guess is that they CAN'T heal, not that they're > forbidden to. > > Besides, if all magic is considered sacriligious and evil there, why would > the Averoignese God WANT to grant it to His priests...? Or, if He DID, why > would the Church make it illegal...? > Witchcraft is considered evil, but priestly magic is far different, sometimes not even recognizable as magic. Spells like bless or sanctify or atonement can easily pass for prayers, while the effects might be viewed as god's blessings. A priest often do not use material components, except holy symbols and water. Maybe Averoignese clergy may use only a limited selection of spells, which are not considered magic, while things like healing spells are provided only to "saints" (LG high level priests with high Wisdom and Charisma). Giampaolo Agosta *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 19 Feb 1999 04:17:24 EST From: Arminath@aol.com Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Vecna - Apologies In a message dated 2/19/99 2:50:25 AM Eastern Standard Time, jason.murphy@mitswa.com.au writes: << is to bring to life a surface dwelling alfheim elf so deviated from the norm, so disgustingly putrified, such an abomination to the very planet that has allowed his existance, that elven hippies the world over will find there ears drooping in racial impotence at the very mention name. I hope to break the stereotype Arminath not create one :) >> *sigh* Leave it to a human to tinker with perfection. Why do ye all need to create a demon darker than ye're own inner nightmares? Ah as well, I look forward to learning about this race and its origins before it becomes the way of the surface world dinosaur. As for the tree and rock hugging hippies, well, that's another human stereotype that I'll save for yet another day. Arminath "I'll waste it with my crossbow!" Wynter *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 19 Feb 1999 04:59:59 EST From: Arminath@aol.com Subject: [MYSTARA] - The Aasimar, revised Some people made some suggestions about the Aasimar I posted, here is what we've come up with: Aasimar Armor Class: 3 (base 8) Hit Dice: 3+3*** (M) Move: 120' (40') Attacks: 1 weapon or spell Damage: by weapon +1 or spell No. Appearing: 1 (1-6) Save As: Fighter 3 Morale: 8 Treasure Type: V (G) Intelligence: 13 Alignment: Any XP Value: 125 Cleric: 150 M-U3: 125 M-U4: 225 M-U5: 675 M-U6: 1,175 M-U7: 2,050 Monster Type: Humaniod (Very Rare) Aasimar are creatures that can't quite be called mortal. In their veins flows the blood of both mortals and Immortals. Aasimar are beautiful creatures, with calm, serene features and an inner radiance that shines from their faces. They've got long manes of white-gold hair and bright, piercing eyes that seem to look right though a person. It's easy to mistake an aasimar for a human of unnatural purity, a half-elf, or even an elf. Aasimar tend to be noble, honest, and courageous, but a person shouldn't always assume an aasimar means him well; there are a few cross-traders and mercenaries among the aasimar, despite their noble birth. There are other types of aasimar that are related to gnomes, dwarves and halflings, but these are extremely rare. Aasimar are scattered throughout the Multiverse, but naturally avoid prolonged stays on any of the Entropic Planes. They usually dress to fit in with the population around them, so an aasimar living among the elven folk dresses like an elf and assumes many of his hosts' mannerisms. Where an aasimar's moved to great emotion, his heritage shines through his face like sunlight through clouds. There aren't many evil creatures who can look an angry aasimar in the eye. Aasimar are upright and fair warriors with deep reserves of strength and faith (17 strength and 13 wisdom). Unfortunately, their mixed blood makes them somewhat frail (8 constitution). It's real hard to sneak up on an aasimar; they've got senses like a cat's it seems. All aasirnar have infravision to a range of 60' and are normally suprised only on a 1 due to their unnatural hearing and alertness. Aasimar suffer only half damage from fire and cold, and gain a +2 to saving throws versus any kind of mental influencing effect. Due to their immortal bloodline they enjoy a weak Anit- magic rating of 10%. They have the standard abilities of the mortal race they are spawned from as well. The typical aasimar is a warrior. Most aasimar favor well-made heavy armor such as plate mail, banded mail or suit armor. They're likely to wear beautifully decorated suits, emblazoned with their coats-of:arms or other such finery; an aasimar likes to stand tall and proud, and doesn't care who knows it. Because aasimar seem to pick a lot of scraps with powerful evil creatures, they are fond of large weapons that take advantage of their natural strength. An aasimar'll rarely be seen with an assassin's weapon like a hand crossbow or poisoned dagger; they like big two-handed swords, halberds, and maces, and mighty long bows. About 25% of all aasimar are clerics of 3rd-level. About 10% more are mages of 3rd to 7th level. Aasimar mages do not gain the 10% Anti-magic rating of the race. As noted ahove, aasimar prefer to blend in with their neighbors and form no indepenant societies. They tend to be great travelers and wanderers and can pass without notice in most places. Some aasimar set themselves up as traders and merchants; these do a good business since everyone feels they're trustworthy. Aasimar's expertise at fitting in with their settings makes them model citizens. They are upright and honest in their dealings, live clean and moral lives, and aren't afraid to stand up for what's right. They've got an uncanny ability to ferret out underhanded schemes and put a stop to them. Terrain: Any *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 19 Feb 1999 11:10:30 +0100 (MET) From: Agathokles Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - The Aasimar, revised About Aasimar PCs: tables for these and other planr races should be available at the TSR website (Planescape downloads area). (It is AD&D stuff, of course). Tieflings could be used as lower-planar counterparts of the Aasimars. Giampaolo Agosta *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 19 Feb 1999 07:35:59 -0500 From: Tal Meta Subject: [MYSTARA] - MonCon '99 Greetings! I'd like to announce that pre-registration booklets are now available for MonCon99, to be held at the Holiday Inn in Tinton Falls, NJ, on March 19th-21st. This year we're proud to announce our widest selection of RPGs, Miniature Battles, Board & Card Games, and LARPs ever! Interested parties are welcome to visit our official website at http://www.gameconvention.com/MonCon/ You can view our event lists, download our online pre-registration book, request a pre-registration book be mailed to you, access information on hotel accommodations, directions to the hotel from nearby metropolitan areas, and information on how you can earn free attendance at the convention by volunteering your time to help with our security and/or courtesy department. Thanks for your interest, and we look forward to seeing you there! - -- talmeta@bellatlantic.net - Heretic & Dilettante ICQ - 12594453 AIM - talmeta1 Homepage - *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 19 Feb 1999 14:11:56 +0100 (CET) From: =?iso-8859-1?Q?H=E5vard_R=F8nne_Faanes?= Subject: [MYSTARA] - [MYSTARA] Traldar Immortals (was: - The Taymora) On Thu, 18 Feb 1999 Mystaros@aol.com wrote: > My own take on the Traldar Immortals can be found on Shawn's site... it's > pretty much an outgorwth of the RW Greek pantheon, mixed in with elements of > Mystaran lore... much like the Norse pantheon of Mystara versus the RW Norse > pantheon... I´ve been using your Traldar Immortals IMC. However I have been wondering if you have any thoughts on the history of traldaran worship of these Immortals. When and why did they start worshipping them? Could this pantheon also be the one that evolved into the Thyatian pantheon? One theory is that these religious belives were planted into the minds of the Traldar when Nithia was destroyed to prevent the Traldar from becoming corrupted like their cousins. Whatdoya think? Hĺvard Haavard R. Faanes (hoc@nvg.ntnu.no) http://www.nvg.ntnu.no/~hoc "Remember, there are no stupid questions, just stupid people." -Mr Garrison, South Park. *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 19 Feb 1999 14:19:04 +0100 (CET) From: =?iso-8859-1?Q?H=E5vard_R=F8nne_Faanes?= Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Re: Dwarves of Thonia (MPicts?) On Wed, 17 Feb 1999, Andrew Toth wrote: > Okay, I suppose I could live with tatoos, supposing such serve a > purpose(ritualistic, > right of passage, etc) but what reason could you come up with for spiking > your hair? Probably a war-thing. To make you look scarier to discourage your enemies. It might also be considered attractive. Warriors being central to the culture and all. A cult of masculinity-type of thing.. *** Hĺvard Haavard R. Faanes (hoc@nvg.ntnu.no) http://www.nvg.ntnu.no/~hoc "Remember, there are no stupid questions, just stupid people." -Mr Garrison, South Park. *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 19 Feb 1999 14:21:34 +0100 (CET) From: =?iso-8859-1?Q?H=E5vard_R=F8nne_Faanes?= Subject: RE: [MYSTARA] - Re: Dwarves of Thonia (MPicts?) On Thu, 18 Feb 1999, Murphy Jason wrote: > Is it just me or does this style of dwarf smell very similar to the > Warhammer game variety. I am certain i remember seeing artwork of spike > haired tattooed dwarves with fierce countenances and bloody great axes. And > then in the Warhammer Shadow of a horned rat computer game they even had > scottish accents. Yup. The Warhammer Dwarves is one of the few attempts ever made to create dwarves that are a wee bit different from Tolkien´s and was partly my source of inspiration. Unfortunately, certain pieces of warhammer art and the Bloodball game made it difficult to take the thing serious. Hĺvard *** Haavard R. Faanes (hoc@nvg.ntnu.no) http://www.nvg.ntnu.no/~hoc "Remember, there are no stupid questions, just stupid people." -Mr Garrison, South Park. *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 19 Feb 1999 14:26:29 +0100 (CET) From: =?iso-8859-1?Q?H=E5vard_R=F8nne_Faanes?= Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Re: Dwarves of Thonia (MPicts?) On Thu, 18 Feb 1999 BoBoII@aol.com wrote: > While not familiar with the Warhammer line o products, I see these savage > raider dwarves' hair as more plaited and spikey, not the b/w mohawk i've seen > on the Shadowrun stuff. Anybody got solid info on the Picts? I think Pendragon > has some. Solid info on Picts is hard to find. In fact AFAIK the only written sources on them is Caesars writings from his conquest of Britain. I havent read those, but i dont think there was all that much on the picts there. Going naked into battle and painting themselves with woad is supposedly a Pict thing though. Pendragon´s "Beyond the Wall" is an entire book dealing with the Picts of Mythic Britain. From what I hear its pretty good. Hĺvard Haavard R. Faanes (hoc@nvg.ntnu.no) http://www.nvg.ntnu.no/~hoc "Remember, there are no stupid questions, just stupid people." -Mr Garrison, South Park. *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 19 Feb 1999 14:34:27 +0100 (CET) From: =?iso-8859-1?Q?H=E5vard_R=F8nne_Faanes?= Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Dragonlord Chronicles Sharon Dornhof: > I think the Eldar are one of the few things the DL series made a mistake > on, to be honest! Trying to tie the origins of elves and dragons together > seems way too much like another case of "elf-worship" by fantasy authors, I made a different approach with the Eldar when working on the Mystara-space project. My theory is this: There was a Space travelling race called Elai´dar who had great magical abilities, especially those of shape changing. A group of Elai´dar came to Mystara at the time of the Rain of Fire. Because of the disasaster, they were scattered throughout mystara, using their abilities to infiltrate other societies like that of the elves and that of the dragons. The elai´dar are degenerate and have forgotten their true origin. They can now only take the shapes of dragons and elves and refer to themselves as the Eldar, beleaving to be ancestors of both races. As for the true origon of Dragons, Im using Mystaros´ theory that they came from a different world, possibly having originally come from the outer planes. Hĺvard Haavard R. Faanes (hoc@nvg.ntnu.no) http://www.nvg.ntnu.no/~hoc "Remember, there are no stupid questions, just stupid people." -Mr Garrison, South Park. *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 19 Feb 1999 14:58:13 +0100 (CET) From: =?iso-8859-1?Q?H=E5vard_R=F8nne_Faanes?= Subject: [MYSTARA] - Carnifex Question When was the Carnifex era? When did it start and when did it end? I guess canon isnt clear on this but id like to hear existing theories? Anyone wanna make a compilation of all the carnifex stuff made? BTW: What *if* some Carnifex-dudes actually did escape to outer planes and were slightly changed by say Thanatos to make them too unrecognizable to be wiped out by Immortal carnifex hunters. Wouldnt that make a bunch of cool outer-planar monsters, huh? :) Hĺvard Haavard R. Faanes (hoc@nvg.ntnu.no) http://www.nvg.ntnu.no/~hoc "Remember, there are no stupid questions, just stupid people." -Mr Garrison, South Park. *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 19 Feb 1999 18:46:27 +0200 From: =?iso-8859-1?Q?=E0=E9=EC=EF_=F9=E7=ED?= Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Grimoire of spells (long) >>Morphail's Slowsnake ( ad&d- necromency/summoning) >> >>this spell creates a Slowsnake, a being from the nightmare dimension that >>eill serve the caster for one week. >I'd bet a practitioner of the Secret Craft of Dream Mastery could conjure >these things up, too! (A new skill-option for Dream Masters to choose >from, maybe? If so, which "circle" would it be?) I don't know G:KoM but I think you mean the Illusionist from GAZ3. if that is the case sure it can become a circle but what I am getting at you dont have to use different systems of magic for different KINDS of magic. BTW I really think there should be a magic point system for XD&D if theyre ever going to make a 3ed version or Rulls Cyclopidia II. and speaking about G:KoM I understand it has some new spells, can someone pleas tell me what they are? >>dame Camille's "S'occuper de Luop" (eye on wolf). (divination) >> >>-this spell was invented by Ettiene d'Amberville's ageless mother to help >>fight lycanthropy in the family. >Hah! And I thought MY grandmother was nosy.... ;-D LoL! there is a sterotype about jewish grandmothers (and mothers) in my experiance they are all true... >This one really explains a lot; a GREAT spell, for any paranoid >game-setting or NPC! (I might even drop a scroll with this spell on it >into a Ravenloft game, sometime... heh heh heh.) thank you. I loved it too. it seems ESP tends to ruin lots of detective style adventures so I made a version that adds to the plot instead. (it only works in low level campaigns though...) >Kudos, Ohad! Let us know, when you've got more spells for us to droll >over. :-) well so far, sharon, it seems not too many people are drolling but I will ignore that and give you my next three glantrian spells: (it is enough that you liked them I dont care if youre the only one...) ___________________________________________________________ Harald's Instant Jelly (in AD&D - alteration) level: 2 range: 10 ft duration: 3 turns +1/level AoE: 10'x10'x10' volume of water save: nil - -prince Harald of Haaskinz made this spell as a means of cleaning and patroling the dungeons under the Great School of Magic. it is also fairly useful in combat. to activate this spell all the caster needs is a sufficiant vulume of water, and a magical powder that is thrown in to the water. the result is a jelatinious qube that the caster has full controle of. the only commands that can be given to the qube are movements (left, right, forward). the qube is exactly like in the RC and after the and of the spell anything caught in the qube which is not magical will vanish with it. magical items will fall to the ground. - ------- Genevieve de Sephora's "Emotional Landscapes" (terrain du sentiment) (in AD&D- charm) level: 8 range: 1km per level duration: perement AoE: one squere km (or mile) for every level of the caster. save: none - -this spell was in an ancient scroll that genevieve brouht with here to mystara. it is an old la'terran spell that originated in ancient Greece. Dame de' Sephora couldnt master it untill she reached 19 level in Glantri. the d'Ambervilles dont know it yet but she is planning to teach it in the school in order to immortalize herself (not as in becoming an immortal just in name...). BTW I got the name from a song by Bjork... Emotional lanscapes will cause a homogenic region of one sqere km per level to become imbued with one magical emotion. this only affects one well defined terrain (desert, lake, forest etc.) the caster must name an emotion at the time of the casting. examples could be - fear, hate, love, joy, pleasure, depression and so on. all living things in the terrain are affected by the spell and get no saving throw. the effects vary from case to case (lots of DM discretion) but a few examples follow: - -fields of joy: all it this field become blissfuly happy and want to stay there, but not if someone attacks them or hurts them. - -fear mountain: all in this place will want to leave it exept for the most brave souls who will still be frightend like little children when they are in the effect of the spell. - -hate swamp: people will hate anyone they dont know and see the bad sides in people they do. it wont get as extreme as loved ones attacking each other but two armies would certaily war against each other. - -love hill: strangers will fall in love. people who hate each other wont. - ------(spoiler alert)------- prince Brannart's Well Kept Secret (AD&D- abjuration) level: 7 range: touch duration: perement AoE: one person - -this spell was devised by Brannart but is now tought at high levels of the Great School. Well Kept Secret is strong anti divination magic. by use of this spell the person in question recieves absolute protection from divining magic about one fact. only one Well Kept Secret can be cast on one person. the fact should be said out loud at the moment of casting and wording is important. all divining spells that would reveale the specified fact will not work. if ESP is used against the person no thoughts about the kept secret will be pickd up. true seeing will not reveale a secret identity and detect magic wont show a spell cast on the subject. comune/contact plane, will allow questions that dont directly concern the fact but will give false answers to qestions directly conserning the secret. for example Brannnart's secret is "I am an undead" . a preist casting a comune has three questione. he asks "can brannart die of old age?" and gets "no" he asks "can brannart serving darkness?" and gets "yes" he asks "is brannart a lich" and gets "no" (cause a yes would mean he is undead). thats all for now.. Morphail (Ohad Shaham) "and all the while as vampires feed- I bleed..." /the Pixies *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 19 Feb 1999 14:22:35 -0500 From: Sharon Dornhoff Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Dragonlord Chronicles >My theory is this: >There was a Space travelling race called Elai´dar who had great >magical abilities, especially those of shape changing. A group of Elai´dar >came to Mystara at the time of the Rain of Fire. Because of the >disaster, they were scattered throughout Mystara, using their abilities >to infiltrate other societies like that of the elves and that of the >dragons. The elai´dar are degenerate and have forgotten their true >origin. They can now only take the shapes of dragons and elves and refer >to themselves as the Eldar, beleaving to be ancestors of both races. So the dragons' belief that they're related to Eldar is so much hooey...? Now that theory, I can live with! It would even be in keeping with how the dragons got confused about the original Dragonlord of Blackmoor, by forgetting that his attacks on them were a misunderstanding. Just goes to show you: on Mystara, not even dragons necessarily have their history straight! :-) *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 19 Feb 1999 14:29:19 -0500 From: Sharon Dornhoff Subject: RE: [MYSTARA] - Vecna - Apologies >What i wanna see, dammit, is a >truely evil, bloodthirsty, psychopathic, sociopathic, schizophrenic, rape >the fields and pillage the women (hmm maybe the men as well. I have to be >politically correct here), death to all the innocents, cat kicking, dog >beating, baby biting ALFHEIM SURFACE ELF!!! You mean like Atziann...? He was born a surface elf*, IIRC. ;-) [* - NOT an "Alfheimer", granted... but Alfheim didn't even exist until 900 years later, so we can't really blame ol' Atz for that.] *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 19 Feb 1999 14:33:36 -0500 From: Sharon Dornhoff Subject: RE: [MYSTARA] - Vecna - Apologies >Thats was the point i was trying to >make. You elves are terminally nice. This penchant for herbal tea, ivy >doilies and flowers behinds the ears must be brought to an end. And i am >just the perverted personality to do it. My mission should i choose to >accept it, which i have, is to bring to life a surface dwelling alfheim elf >so deviated from the norm, so disgustingly putrified, such an abomination to >the very planet that has allowed his existance, that elven hippies the world >over will find there ears drooping in racial impotence at the very mention >name. I hope to break the stereotype Arminath not create one :) > > Jason "what cheeses me off" Murphy Actually, I think I like this idea! It could even be the very thing the Alfheim elves need, to shake their image of being boooooring, when compared to shadow elves. :-) *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 19 Feb 1999 15:09:21 -0500 From: Sharon Dornhoff Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - The Taymora >> Remember that the gnolls invaded in 1000 BC, and that Taymoran civilization >> collapsed roughly a thousand years before that date. That seems like a >> loooong time for humans -- a short-lived race -- to retain any substantial >> knowledge of a previous culture, without the SoP to guide them. > >Oh, I agree that its a long time. But I think Taymoran culture survived >in legend. I like to think of the modern day druids, how they attempt >to recapture a lost religion without a clear understanding of that >religion. Well, considering that modern-day druids obsess over Stonehenge (which the IRL druids had nothing to do with), I doubt if they'd have come up with anything that's very close to reality! More likely, they'd have reinterpreted ancient tales of the Taymorans from their own culture's viewpoint. A bit like how medieval writers and historians turned a classical-age commander, who'd led the Romanized Celts against invading Anglo-Saxons, into the courtly, chivalrous, plate mail-clad King Arthur. Ever read Edward Rutherford's "Sarum"...? I just finished it recently (I'm reading "London" now), and it's a fascinating study in how the actual facts of history become distorted, covered up, transposed or lost, over the course of generations. >Putting the Traladaran history together looks to involve a lot of >reading between the lines of the text. One big question for me is why >Pflarr created the Hutaakans. Ego trip, maybe...? (He DID create them in his own image, after all! ;-D) >If they were meant to influence Nithian >growth, then why did the Traldar differ from Nithia. He's still >involved in Nithia, so some aspects of it must be as he wishes. And if >the Traldar did differ from Nithia, what was the reason for that when >Pflarr maintained such a strong influence over them. Remember that the Nithians had a LOT of other Immortals besides Pflarr, and all of these would've had their own influence on Nithia's society. The Hutaakans are essentially monotheistic, so Pflarr can tell them precisely how to live their lives; but he's got to compromise with the other members of the Nithian pantheon, when he dictates his human worshippers' conduct. On top of that, once he had a race of his own to guide, Pflarr may not have wanted to trouble himself with humans: a species he clearly considers inferior to his "Children". While he didn't forsake his priesthood in Nithia -- which, after all, was THE greatest military power of its era, and could've crushed the Hutaakans' nation like a bug had the Nithians not considered them "holy messengers"! -- Pflarr has never seemed all that interested in humans' welfare, and probably figured that a ragamuffin lot like the Traldar were beneath his notice. >Would have Halav >been called a pharaoh in his own lifetime or had the break occurred >before then? Nithia (and Ancient Egypt) also had kings and queens who weren't Pharaohs. The "Pharaoh" corresponds to an emperor, with lesser kings or queens ruling the different parts of his or her domain. So even if the Traldar hadn't forgotten that title, Halav would've been called a king: like the Pope, there can only be one legitimate Pharaoh in the world, and that'd be the one in Nithia (or Thothia, after 500 BC). *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ End of mystara-digest V1999 #96 ******************************* *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara' as the body of the message. mystara-digest Saturday, February 20 1999 Volume 1999 : Number 097 Mystara is a trademark of TSR Inc. All Rights Reserved. The following topics are covered in this digest: Re: [MYSTARA] - Carnifex Question Re: [MYSTARA] - Vecna - Apologies Re: [MYSTARA] - Vecna - Apologies Re: [MYSTARA] - The Aasimar, revised Re: [MYSTARA] - Carnifex Question Re: [MYSTARA] - Carnifex Question Re: [MYSTARA] - Vecna - Apologies [MYSTARA] - OD&D Alu-fiends, Childern of the Immortals [MYSTARA] - Mass Death - A new perspective. (fwd) Re: [MYSTARA] - Carnifex Question Re: [MYSTARA] - Dragonlord Chronicles Re: [MYSTARA] - The Taymora [MYSTARA] - Genealogy Re: [MYSTARA] - Vecna - Apologies Re: [MYSTARA] - Genealogy Re: [MYSTARA] - Re: Dwarves of Thonia (MPicts?) ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Fri, 19 Feb 1999 15:25:18 -0500 From: Sharon Dornhoff Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Carnifex Question >When was the Carnifex era? When did it start and when did it end? I guess >canon isnt clear on this but id like to hear existing theories? Anyone >wanna make a compilation of all the carnifex stuff made? There's no "canon" dates for when the Carnifex were active on Mystara, although they're definitely too ancient to appear on the HW boxed set's timeline. That history starts up around 6000 BC, with the Brute-men existing as the Known World's dominant race (thanks to the absence of competitors) for an unspecified time before that. Presumably the Carnifex would've exterminated and eaten the Brute-men, had they encountered them, so it's a safe assumption they were gone before the Neanderthals made their appearance. I've arbitrarily dated the origin of the "Greater" Carnifex -- the same ones from M3, who are dinosaurian equivalents of humans and can pursue similar character classes -- to 15,000 BC. Their ancestors, the Ur-Carnifex -- my own idea; Carnifex cave-men, essentially ;-D -- evolved tens of thousands of years before that. I haven't picked a date for the Greater Carnifex's exile to the Pits of Banishment -- haven't needed to, to be honest -- but the last of the Ur-tribes had been wiped out by their smarter descendents (or hijacked to the Hollow Moon) by 14,500 BC. All that's just IMC, of course. I know for a fact there's other timelines out there, that trace the Carnifex back for hundreds of thousands of years. :-) *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 19 Feb 1999 21:17:39 -0000 From: "Edward Phillips" Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Vecna - Apologies >How are the Drow introduced by the dude with the Vecna crush, that's what >I wanna know. I mean if we get sixtygazillion* Carnifex posts**, let's at >least have one Drow***-athon..! > I felt like it (if you really want a reason call it radiation poisoning coupled with magic the elves used to try & protect themselves from it, sort of like sunblock 5 million), after all I've got the Carnifax responsible for the Nithian Slide toward Entropy (not in the way you think though), I haven't got an Alphatian continent (20% of their population got rescued and transferred to the southern shore of the Mer of Utat to rebuild) & I've got Black Elves, Lolth & Vecna running round. I use some of my favourite bad guys running round in my favorite world. Ps: I'm also converting all the Immortals into AD&D stats. Immortal stat -18 then divided by 11.71 then add on 18 again, gives you a stat somewhere between 19 & 25. It seems to work although I don't actually have WOTL (Sob). *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 19 Feb 1999 21:20:21 -0000 From: "Edward Phillips" Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Vecna - Apologies >While others are nattering about Drow, I'll answer your question: Thank you oh thank you. Ps: No worries about the last bit I made my saving throw Vs magic. *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 19 Feb 1999 16:30:02 EST From: Arminath@aol.com Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - The Aasimar, revised In a message dated 2/19/99 5:11:24 AM Eastern Standard Time, piu2014@ccrd200.cdc.polimi.it writes: << About Aasimar PCs: tables for these and other planr races should be available at the TSR website (Planescape downloads area). (It is AD&D stuff, of course). Tieflings could be used as lower-planar counterparts of the Aasimars. Giampaolo Agosta >> Tanks very much, but I did this as a OD&D conversion for an example of what Children of the Immortals would be like. I never stated that I created the creature. Jim *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 19 Feb 1999 18:00:03 -0500 (EST) From: au998@freenet.carleton.ca (Geoff Gander) Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Carnifex Question Haavard wrote; >When was the Carnifex era? When did it start and when did it end? I guess >canon isnt clear on this but id like to hear existing theories? Anyone >wanna make a compilation of all the carnifex stuff made? Hmmm, if you go by Mystaros' work (care to jump in, Mystaros?), then I *believe* that the Carnifex era began several hundred thousand years ago - it took a long time for them to evolve from carnosauroids into the more bipedal, magic-using heavies we know and love - and lasted until roughly BC 10,000. I used this last date as the start of the era of the Y'hog Carnifex (who really became worthy of notice in BC 9,000). M3 (Twilight Calling) doesn't give a time frame, just "a very long time ago" (ie: before Blackmoor). Now, this doesn't exactly jive with Sharon's material concerning the Ur-Carnifex (when did you place them exactly, Sharon?). So, in response to your suggestion, I think it would be an excellent idea if all the Carnifex-related material were collected together in one place, and harmonized. Marco wrote an excellent piece called "The Carnifex File" - in it (IIRC) he addressed Ka's origins, and tried to place the Carnifex temporally as well. >BTW: What *if* some Carnifex-dudes actually did escape to outer planes and >were slightly changed by say Thanatos to make them too unrecognizable to >be wiped out by Immortal carnifex hunters. Wouldnt that make a bunch of >cool outer-planar monsters, huh? :) Now that *would* be neat! What do you suppose they would be like? Why do you think Thanatos would do this, given that the GC threatened all Immortals' power, including his own? Geoff - -- Geoff Gander, BA 97 Cartographer/Game Designer/Government Peon Part-Time High Priest, Ottawa Chapter of the Church of Y'hog au998@freenet.carleton.ca *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 19 Feb 1999 18:14:33 -0500 (EST) From: au998@freenet.carleton.ca (Geoff Gander) Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Carnifex Question Sharon wrote: >I've arbitrarily dated the origin of the "Greater" Carnifex -- the same >ones from M3, who are dinosaurian equivalents of humans and can pursue >similar character classes -- to 15,000 BC. Their ancestors, the >Ur-Carnifex -- my own idea; Carnifex cave-men, essentially ;-D -- evolved >tens of thousands of years before that. I haven't picked a date for the >Greater Carnifex's exile to the Pits of Banishment -- haven't needed to, to >be honest -- but the last of the Ur-tribes had been wiped out by their >smarter descendents (or hijacked to the Hollow Moon) by 14,500 BC. This is also a more than reasonable way to do it. So, if we take down the dates, plus those from the Y'hog Carnifex, we get: The Carnifex Eras (just one idea to throw around, nothing intended to be official):* Ur-Carnifex BC 35,000 - BC 14,500 Greater Carnifex BC 15,000 - BC 10,000 Y'hog Carnifex BC 10,000 - BC 7,022 Deep Carnifex BC 8,000 - present** *This does not mean that there were clean breaks between the subgroups; there is overlap to some extent, but these periods mark the times when the subgroup in particular was dominant. **The Deep Carnifex underwent several traumatic disasters, and as such regressed to a primitive state for several millennia. They have only relatively recently started rebuilding their civilization, and do not even worship the Outer Beings anymore. As such, they have very little in common with the Greater or Y'hog Carnifex in cultural or religious terms. Also note that during the time period when both the Deep and Y'hog Carnifex coexisted, the Deep Carnifex were very subservient to their cousins, when the two groups interacted at all. Geoff - -- Geoff Gander, BA 97 Cartographer/Game Designer/Government Peon Part-Time High Priest, Ottawa Chapter of the Church of Y'hog au998@freenet.carleton.ca *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 19 Feb 1999 20:09:55 EST From: Arminath@aol.com Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Vecna - Apologies In a message dated 2/19/99 4:21:04 PM Eastern Standard Time, edward.phillips@virgin.net writes: << Ps: I'm also converting all the Immortals into AD&D stats. Immortal stat - -18 then divided by 11.71 then add on 18 again, gives you a stat somewhere between 19 & 25. It seems to work although I don't actually have WOTL (Sob). >> Actually, that comes out very close! How'd you figure that out??? Jim *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 19 Feb 1999 23:01:48 EST From: Arminath@aol.com Subject: [MYSTARA] - OD&D Alu-fiends, Childern of the Immortals In continuation of the "Childern of the Immortals", here are OD&D Alu-fiends, female offspring of Immortal and Exalted Fiends and mortals. Alu-fiend* Armor Class: 5 (base) or better Hit Dice: 2*** (M) Move: 120' (40') Fly: 150' (50') Attacks: 1 weapon or spell Damage: by weapon or spell No. Appearing: 1-2 (1-2) Save As: Fighter 2 Morale: 7 Treasure Type: V (G) Intelligence: 14 Alignment: Neutral or Chaotic XP Value: 35 MU1: 40 MU7: 2,450 MU2: 40 MU8: 3,400 MU3: 65 MU9: 5,100 MU4: 275 MU10: 5,500 MU5: 800 MU11: 5,900 MU6: 1,400 MU12: 6,500 Monster Type: Humaniod (Very Rare) Alu-fiends, the horrid female offspring of fiends and mortals, look like comely females of their mortal parent's race with attractive, powerful features. Only their sharp, upsloping eyebrows and wings indicate the truth. Alu-fiends usually communicate using telepathy, but can sometimes speak additional languages. Alu-fiends have an innate intuition that warns them of impending danger 75% of the time. They have no natural attack forms save fists and teeth (normal human damage). About 75% of them carry enchanted weapons, gifts from their fiendish parent. These weapons are most likely of common make (i.e. + 1, +2, etc.), but there is a 15% chance for a special weapon. An alu-fiend relies heavily on a special weapon and never willingly parts with it. Alu-fiends can restore their own hit points at the expense of their opponents. This requires an attack roll and inflicts 1d8 points of damage, of which the alu-fiend gets half (round up). These creatures have base Armor Class 5, a gift of the heritage of their unnatural parent. Enchanted armor or protective items can improve the base AC. As with weapons, 75% of alu-fiends wear enchanted armor of common make (+ 1, +2, etc.). There is a 5% chance such armor is special (i.e. Platemail of Ethereality, etc.). If the armor possessed is worse than the alu-fiend's natural AC then it provides no extra protection. For both magical armor and weapons, choose appropriate items from the tables on pages 230-231 of the Dungeons & Dragons Rules Cyclopedia. Alu-fiends have the following spell-like powers: Charm Person, Dimension Door, ESP (1/day each) and Shapechange (to a humanoid form of approximately their own height and weight only, 2/day). All alu-fiends have infravision to 240'. Alu-fiends are affected only by silver or magical weapons. Fully 10% of alu-fiends are very intelligent (18); they have all the spell- like powers of their sisters and are also actual magic-users. These alu- fiends are 1st - 12th level magic-users with full spell ability. Like elves, they may cast spells and wear armor without penalty. Alu-fiends tend to be hateful, even by fiendish standards, because of their dual nature. They view themstlves as outcasts, neither mortal or fiend. Other fiends view them the same way, as lowly and without purpose. Only the alu-fiends' power keeps them in contention as a race. If an alu-fiend can somehow hide her wings, she will be mistaken for a female of her mortal parent's race 70% of the time. Interestingly, about 20% of alu-fiends are neutral in alignment. This usually occurs when a fiend mates with a non-evil mortal and the offspring retains a hint of their morality. Terrain: Any *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 20 Feb 1999 16:24:55 +1100 (EST) From: "Jonathan Nolan, Barrister & Solicitor, FTIA" Subject: [MYSTARA] - Mass Death - A new perspective. (fwd) - ---------- Forwarded message ---------- Date: Fri, 19 Feb 1999 17:22:06 CST From: Bazza Clarke To: geckoes@ozemail.com.au Subject: Mass Death - A new perspective. Mass Death - A new perspective. The Potential of Chromatic Orb/Chromatic Orb to the Nth Degree. The combined armies of the Mystaran Known World were sent on a mission. The armies were composed of paladins, holy warriors, clerics and many orders of knighthood. Their mission was to put to death one man, ONE MAN. This man a wizard was known by many names but the most well known were Thanatos on Mystara and Black Death. Black Death was a master of the Dark Arts and mentor to many a infamous necromancer. The armies of the Known World were sent to slay him in his keep, 'Praise to Thanatos.' The armies marched several days coming to his keep. They made camp for the night. The scribe recorded the size of the camp as 'equal to many a town, with the most strongest, battle-harden soldiers the Known World has ever seen gathered in one place - to kill one man. Morning came and they packed up ready to storm the Keep, when the multitudes saw a lone figure flying overhead. A crackle of energy erupted from the flying person and hundreds of tiny black orb-like missiles were directed to cover the camp. Then in one hand gesture from above each orb released its 'cargo'. Each orb contained a death spell which wiped out nearly everybody in one foul stroke. The Known World was in disarray, the best warriors died in their thousands, the Immortals wept but Thanatos was kept happy. Mystara was shaken on its axis as a sign of the sorrow, felt on that day. Thanatos pleased with Black Death and he was granted demi-Immortal status. - ---So ends the Story of Sir Llyelwyn of Threshold KODT Dave "Just raking in the XPs by the thousands, wahoo" Bob "The man's a genius" Sara "Poor soldiers, I express my sorrow" B.A. "Dave, roll for demi-Immortal status" Dave "Ah, NO!" Bob "Ha, ha you rolled an 01" Brian "Now your a thinking zombie, man you blew it" Dave (crying) Sara "I give Dave my cloak of sympathy" B.A. "Ok Sara, man Dave you really blew it" The spells that Black Death (L20) used were these, Chromatic Missile III, Id's Missile X, Id's Chroamtic Missile Metaspell (all of them), Id's CM Wrapper (when done), Death Spell and another unnamed spell to release the effect all at a given signal (the hand gesture, maybe Chain Contingency). That is approx 400 missiles with the Death Spell stored in each missile, covering line of sight (that is why Black Death was air bound, to see all the armies), no saving throw (as per Death Spell). That effect can cause potentially, well I'll step through it. AoE for Death Spell (DS) is 30 foot cube per level. One missile has an AoE of a 600 foot cube each. Total AoE is 240,000 foot cube or 20 kilometers. The number of people killed is up to 32000. With that combination of spells (Chain Contingency comes to mind) overlapping the AoE to kill the more powerful creatures (as discussed before, with the comination of the Death Spell and Death special power) would be a smart idea. Kill the lower characters first, then wipe out the 'tall poppies' - the leaders of the armies to complete the job. Well as you can see the combined effect would certainly cause alot of death and put a big hole into the combined armies of the Known World. End result is a total loss of morale for the army not to mention the logistics on how to bury thousands of people I do not want to imagine. (For a necromancer to raise as a skeleton army :). Now you know about MASS DEATH. Id's Chromatic Missile Metaspell (Alteration?) Level: 5 Range: Special Components: V, S, M Duration: Special Casting Time: 5 segments Area of Effect: Special Saving Throw: None This spell alters the spell Chromatic Missile I, II and III. Some of these metamagical effects can also affect the spell Magic Missile and variants and the spell Chromatic Orb. The list of known metamagical effects (so far) are: List of Chromatic Missile Metaspells. Id's Line of Sight: Spell range is increased to line of sight. (Usuable with Magic Missile) Id's Missile 3: 3 missiles per level of caster. (Usuable with Magic Missile) Id's Effect Duration: L1, The effects from the special powers are extended from 1 round to 1d4 rounds and rounds become turns. (Usuable with Chromatic Orb) Id's No Last Dice: No saving throw for targeted victims if spells has one. (Usuable with Chromatic Orb) Material Components are [up to you Jon, suggestions are below, co-credit?] Id's Missile X (Alteration?) Level: 5 Range: Special Components: V, S, M Duration: Special Casting Time: 5 segments Area of Effect: Special Saving Throw: None This spell increases the number of missiles per level of the spell Chromatic Misssile I, II and III. The formula for calculating it is the maximum spell level the caster can cast * 2, then subtract 1. Note this is per level of the caster. For example at 9th level the caster can control [5*2-1] = 9 missiles per level ie a maximum of (9*9) 81 missiles. Material components are the same as Chromatic Missile, one gem of the appropriate hue worth 50gp or a diamond per missile. This spell is compatible with Magic Missile and variants and the material components for this use of the spell are one diamond per extra missile generated with this spell. For example a 9th level caster needs 76 diamonds, as the Magic Missile spell is only capable of generating 5 missiles. Damage is the same as Magic Missile for this use of the spell, 1d4 per missile. This spell must immediately cast before the Chromatic Missile I, II, III or Magic Missile either by the same wizard in the next round or by another wizard in the same round or following round. Failure means the spell disapates without effect. Still have the spell wrapper to complete, but might be best to work that out on Friday or Sunday. Will have to come up with a list of common spells, to put with it and uncommon ones. Rare and very rare spells will be up to individual DM's. A quick list includes: Heat Metal, Fireball, Stinking Cloud, Superior Magnetism (PO:S&M), Hold Person, Petrifying Gaze (WSC) and Death. Light and Blindness are included in Chromatic Missile for free. Replacing Stinking Cloud for Cloudkill come to mind. Of course the wizard might end up being caught up in his own death trap, so discression is the better part of valour. Id's Line of Sight is a good choice to put some distance between the caster and the place the spell explodes. One use for multiple missile capability of Chromatic Missile is having each missile with special power Light explode 20 foot from the other one for a continuous source of light in a dungeon. This requires another metaspell, soon to be developed. Eventually I'll put together the Idiot's Spellbook of Chromatic Missile when all the spells are detailed. Is it to late to change Id's legacy to his Chromatic Missile Spellbook, when detailed? Not even did I think that one spell, Chromatic Missile, could be so useful, in so many ways, and lead to all this tinkering with the Magic System of AD&D. Welcome, Bazza to DM status? ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 20 Feb 1999 00:47:29 EST From: Mystaros@aol.com Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Carnifex Question In a message dated 99-02-19 18:01:45 EST, au998@freenet.carleton.ca writes: << Hmmm, if you go by Mystaros' work (care to jump in, Mystaros?), then I *believe* that the Carnifex era began several hundred thousand years ago - it took a long time for them to evolve from carnosauroids into the more bipedal, magic-using heavies we know and love - and lasted until roughly BC 10,000. >> My own take on the Carnifex is that they were originally created by Ka circa 50,000,000 years BC, in an incipient-intelligent state. They evolved slowly over the next several aeons, until the first great Kingdoms arose ca. 25,000,000 BC. The Carnifex Tyranny conquered Mystara about 15,000,000 BC, and slowly expanded into the Multiverse over the several million years thereafter. The conflict with the Immortals occured about 5,000,000 BC. Note that IMC, 1000 AC is about 5,000,000,000 years after the Creation of the Multiverse, give or take a million (check out my Multiverse Creation Epic for more info, available on Shawn's site)... My scale for the Caernifex in the Mystaran Timeline tends toward the Lovecraftian, in that the Carnifex are of such ancient antiquity that the modern lands literally grow around the ancient ruins of the Carnifex (one of my favorite Mythos stories is Howard's "The Black Stone", which gives a sense of where I place the Carnifex in the timestream). For a more "modern" take on the concept, read the Star Trek novel "First Contact" (not the movie version, the Classic Trek novel, in which Kirk & Company are involved in the events that so traumatically affected Earth 65 million years ago)... Note that the Mystara map also resembles the RW map several million years after that EVENT, some 60 million years ago... not a coincidence IMC... The Serpentines, however, ruled much later than the Carnifex, closer to the time of the Gazetteers, a mere 1,000,000 through 100,000 BC. You may have been thinking of the materials I've written concerning the Serpentine Empire... That's my own take on the era of the Carnifex... all only IMC of course... Mystaros *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 20 Feb 1999 00:59:30 -0600 From: "Timothy R. Haney" Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Dragonlord Chronicles Aaron E Nowack wrote: > > In more modern times, vengeful gods and goddesses brought about a > series of cataclysmic events known as the Wrath of the Immortals. A > giant meteorite struck the land, an entire continent sank beneath the > ocean, and a deadly plauge began to spread. Sounds like that didn't want to take two pages to explain that Mystara doesn't have gods but Immortals that are sort of like gods but not exactly :) - -- Timothy R. Haney galwylin@airnet.net The Tome of Galwylin - http://www.airnet.net/galwylin/ Galwylin's Bookshop - http://www.airnet.net/galwylin/bookshop/ *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 20 Feb 1999 01:28:36 -0600 From: "Timothy R. Haney" Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - The Taymora Sharon Dornhoff wrote: > > Well, considering that modern-day druids obsess over Stonehenge (which the > IRL druids had nothing to do with), I doubt if they'd have come up with > anything that's very close to reality! More likely, they'd have > reinterpreted ancient tales of the Taymorans from their own culture's > viewpoint. A bit like how medieval writers and historians turned a > classical-age commander, who'd led the Romanized Celts against invading > Anglo-Saxons, into the courtly, chivalrous, plate mail-clad King Arthur. Yes! That's what I was talking about :) They took their cue from those ancient Taymoran legends and warped them to fit their current outlook. The Traladaran have that belief they are destined for greatness. The way I'm looking at it is that their betrayal by the Immortals (the abandonment of the Hutaakans) was turned inward so that instead of looking to the Immortals to provide, they are their own source of legend. The legend of Halav was an outgrowth of that. I think he supposedly lived 500 years before that legend served as the uniting factor of their culture. I thought this would be from the influence of the Taymoran beliefs because the Nithians weren't a people that built monuments to the past. Only to the present and the afterlife. Perhaps Taymora was ruled similar to Ierendi today or some kind of culture that had the past very important in the culture in some way. I think the Makai may be a relation to the Taymorans (perhaps the southern people) in which they've influence the Ierendi culture. Now to figure out how dark-skinned Nithians became pale-skinned Traladarans :) > Ever read Edward Rutherford's "Sarum"...? I just finished it recently (I'm > reading "London" now), and it's a fascinating study in how the actual facts > of history become distorted, covered up, transposed or lost, over the > course of generations. Its sitting on my shelf just hadn't the time yet. > Ego trip, maybe...? (He DID create them in his own image, after all! ;-D) Oh but that describes all the Immortals :) > Remember that the Nithians had a LOT of other Immortals besides Pflarr, and > all of these would've had their own influence on Nithia's society. The > Hutaakans are essentially monotheistic, so Pflarr can tell them precisely > how to live their lives; but he's got to compromise with the other members > of the Nithian pantheon, when he dictates his human worshippers' conduct. True. But he probably saw a chance with the Traldar to create the ultimate worshippers. I mean its probably nice to create a race that worships you but it might also feel like a fixed game. He knows the ending score. For a great ego boost, convince a whole people to worship you voluntarily :) > On top of that, once he had a race of his own to guide, Pflarr may not have > wanted to trouble himself with humans: a species he clearly considers > inferior to his "Children". While he didn't forsake his priesthood in > Nithia -- which, after all, was THE greatest military power of its era, and > could've crushed the Hutaakans' nation like a bug had the Nithians not > considered them "holy messengers"! -- Pflarr has never seemed all that > interested in humans' welfare, and probably figured that a ragamuffin lot > like the Traldar were beneath his notice. But his Hutaakans failed him with Traldar. Not only is Nithia crumbling (pre-HW) but a people turned to himself are left to be destroyed by his 'children'. Maybe his random choosing of which Hutaakans to preserve is a sign that none of his children were especially worthy. He gives up trying to bring a following of humans to himself and settles with what he has. BTW, Pflarr may have been the one that preserved the Traldar in the HW and was shamed into letting Halav take over their religion. Maybe. (Of course, since Nithia created the gnolls and they invade Traladara from the other side (I think), perhaps the Hutaakans were the dog-faced men that destroy 80% of their population in truth :) > Nithia (and Ancient Egypt) also had kings and queens who weren't Pharaohs. > The "Pharaoh" corresponds to an emperor, with lesser kings or queens ruling > the different parts of his or her domain. So even if the Traldar hadn't > forgotten that title, Halav would've been called a king: like the Pope, > there can only be one legitimate Pharaoh in the world, and that'd be the > one in Nithia (or Thothia, after 500 BC). Ah, got it :) - -- Timothy R. Haney galwylin@airnet.net The Tome of Galwylin - http://www.airnet.net/galwylin/ Galwylin's Bookshop - http://www.airnet.net/galwylin/bookshop/ *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 20 Feb 1999 01:54:44 -0600 From: "Timothy R. Haney" Subject: [MYSTARA] - Genealogy I've been trying to peice the human races together. The Hollow World set helps some but does give a very detail look at migration (have no idea where the Neathar, Oltec, or Tanagoro races began). Let me know if I have this right so far. About the only thing I can say is that the Neathar began on or near eastern Brun. That's where they seem to spread out from. The human race must have started in Skothar. Looking at the pre-cataclysmic map, I'd say they stared in Skothar where its labeled Tanagoro and spread westward. Leaving the people that would become the Neathar somewhere around the Dawn Territories and the Oltecs moving farther westward. I have them in this format: Race Name Race or people decendeded from above Race or people deceded from above Oltec Azcans Atruaghin Jennites Neathar Antalian Heldannic Freeholds Northern Reaches Thyatians Makai Taymora (maybe a mix of Azcan and Neathar) Traldaran Mixed Neathar/Oltec Ethengar Makistani (Ylaruam) Nithian Alasiyan (Ylaruam) Traldar Milenian Traldaran Minrothad Guilds - -- Timothy R. Haney galwylin@airnet.net The Tome of Galwylin - http://www.airnet.net/galwylin/ Galwylin's Bookshop - http://www.airnet.net/galwylin/bookshop/ *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 20 Feb 1999 09:46:16 -0000 From: "Edward Phillips" Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Vecna - Apologies > >Actually, that comes out very close! How'd you figure that out??? > >Jim I remembered, from before my water leak destroyed everything, that the highest stat for an Immortal was 100. From there it was relatviely simple. For some Immortals there is a direct AD&D deity translation e.g: Protius=Poseiden, Rathanos=Ra, Ixion=Seker *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 20 Feb 1999 07:21:26 EST From: Arminath@aol.com Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Genealogy In a message dated 2/20/99 2:58:17 AM Eastern Standard Time, galwylin@airnet.net writes: << Looking at the pre-cataclysmic map, >> Is there a page online that has the Precataclysmic map? THAT would be very helpful to have! Jim *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 20 Feb 1999 00:09:53 +0100 From: "Jamuga Khan" Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Re: Dwarves of Thonia (MPicts?) > << Well, when thinking at a dwarven chorus, I constantly have in mind > > the soundtrack of "1492 - Conquest of Paradise". >> > > The perfect wild dwarf rowing song!! It would be nice as a battle song for normal dwarves, too. Jamuga Khan "Hear and obey, because the Mighty Khan's word is law." *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ End of mystara-digest V1999 #97 ******************************* *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara' as the body of the message. mystara-digest Sunday, February 21 1999 Volume 1999 : Number 098 Mystara is a trademark of TSR Inc. All Rights Reserved. The following topics are covered in this digest: Re: [MYSTARA] - Vecna - Apologies Re: [MYSTARA] - Wild Dwarves of Thonia [MYSTARA] - OD&D Tome of Spellcraft Survey Re: [MYSTARA] - OD&D Tome of Spellcraft Survey [MYSTARA] - OD&D Tome of Spellcraft survey, discontinued! Re: [MYSTARA] - Dragonlord Chronicles Re: [MYSTARA] - Grimoire of spells (long) Re: [MYSTARA] - Carnifex Question Re: [MYSTARA] - Carnifex Question Re: [MYSTARA] - The Taymora Re: [MYSTARA] - Genealogy Re: [MYSTARA] - The Taymora Re: [MYSTARA] - Genealogy Re: [MYSTARA] - The Taymora Re: [MYSTARA] - The Taymora RE: [MYSTARA] - Vecna - Apologies ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Sat, 20 Feb 1999 23:37:03 +0100 From: "Jamuga Khan" Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Vecna - Apologies > ... (hmm maybe the men as well. I have to be > politically correct here) IMHO, the whole idea about "political correctness" has already become an abomination and should be avoided at all cost... Jamuga Khan "See this as the 'Word for the Sunday'." *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 20 Feb 1999 00:04:49 +0100 From: "Jamuga Khan" Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Wild Dwarves of Thonia > >Hm, this reminds me to this dwarven berserker in the FR - The Legacy ff. > >What was his name? Thibbledorf Pwent, or so? In German he was called > >a "Schlachtenwueter". From what it was translated? > > > The Complete Book of Dwarves introduced the "battlerager" kit ... > essentially, a berserker-dwarf that's almost identical (!) to the Warhammer > dwarves in appearance/dress. I think that's what Thibbledorf was supposed > to be. THIS is fascinating: "To rage" means "wueten" and "rage" "Wut" according to my dictionary, so "Schlachtenwueter" is a literally translation from "battlerager". Jamuga Khan "Hear and obey, because the Mighty Khan's word is law." *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 20 Feb 1999 18:19:31 EST From: Arminath@aol.com Subject: [MYSTARA] - OD&D Tome of Spellcraft Survey Hey y'all, This is your friendly Tome of Spellcraft editor here and I have an important (at least to me) question for everyone that is interested in the Tome. For the 3rd Edition I have been toying with the idea of including the "core" OD&D spells to begin make it a definitive reference. For those of you that use it, I imagine that you have at least 2 reference books, the Tome and the rulebook with the "core" spells, and possibly more if you use the Gazateer's that introduced new magic as well. In order to keep this as simple as possible (and keep OD&D's spells more condensed, I always hated AD&D for creating 50 references). I would like peoples opinions that are interested, if I should begin to include the original spells from the rules along with the player's creations? Thank you, Jim *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 20 Feb 1999 18:26:13 EST From: GlobalFrog@aol.com Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - OD&D Tome of Spellcraft Survey In a message dated 2/20/99 4:21:34 PM Mountain Standard Time, Arminath@aol.com writes: << I would like peoples opinions that are interested, if I should begin to include the original spells from the rules along with the player's creations? >> I would like that...but be careful of the dreaded copyright laws... One Eye *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 20 Feb 1999 20:43:12 EST From: Arminath@aol.com Subject: [MYSTARA] - OD&D Tome of Spellcraft survey, discontinued! Hi y'all! It's been brought to my attention that using copyrighted material, whether it is out of print or not, in whole or in part is illegal. So, that means that I will NOT be able to include spells from the OD&D "core", nor any of the spells from the GAZ series. I wasn't aware of this at the time I posted the Survey question, as I thought since I was only using the material as a part of a free service there would be no problems. So keep on sending your own spells! ;-) Jim *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 20 Feb 1999 19:12:22 -0600 From: Aaron E Nowack Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Dragonlord Chronicles On Sat, 20 Feb 1999 00:59:30 -0600 "Timothy R. Haney" writes: >Aaron E Nowack wrote: >> >> In more modern times, vengeful gods and goddesses brought >about a >> series of cataclysmic events known as the Wrath of the Immortals. A >> giant meteorite struck the land, an entire continent sank beneath >the >> ocean, and a deadly plauge began to spread. > >Sounds like that didn't want to take two pages to explain that Mystara >doesn't have gods but Immortals that are sort of like gods but not >exactly :) My take on it exactly :) Aaron Nowack "Never let reality get in the way of a good hypothesis." http://www.geocities.com/TimesSquare/Dungeon/5930/ ___________________________________________________________________ You don't need to buy Internet access to use free Internet e-mail. Get completely free e-mail from Juno at http://www.juno.com/getjuno.html or call Juno at (800) 654-JUNO [654-5866] *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 20 Feb 1999 22:06:18 -0500 From: Sharon Dornhoff Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Grimoire of spells (long) >I don't know G:KoM but I think you mean the Illusionist from GAZ3. Well, they already have an illusionist character class in AD&D, so the G:KoM authors retitled that Secret Craft to avoid confusion. They also renamed practitioners of the Secret Craft of Necromancy "Death Masters", since necromancers are a class in themselves, in AD&D. >LoL! there is a sterotype about jewish grandmothers (and mothers) in my >experiance they are all true... That's because it's true of ALL grandmothers, whether they're Jewish or not. ;-) >Harald's Instant Jelly (in AD&D - alteration) > >-prince Harald of Haaskinz made this spell as a means of cleaning and >patroling the dungeons under the Great School of Magic. it is also fairly >useful in combat. LOL! You said you hadn't read G:KoM, Ohad ... but there's several spells in it that don't do anything but clean your clothes, or help you stay "stylish" even in a filthy dungeon! Looks like you've hit upon the same idea: that Glantrians enjoy spells that keep things squeaky-clean. :-) Spells from G:KoM are included in the Wizards' Spell Compendium. There's an appendix in the back of the 4th volume which lists unique spells from different worlds, Mystara included. So if you peek at a copy in a game shop or borrow Vol. 4 from a friend, that'll tell you what the boxed set's spells are. >Genevieve de Sephora's "Emotional Landscapes" (terrain du sentiment) (in >AD&D- charm) >-fields of joy: all it this field become blissfuly happy and want to stay >there, but not if someone attacks them or hurts them. >-fear mountain: all in this place will want to leave it exept for the most >brave souls who will still be frightend like little children when they are >in the effect of the spell. >-hate swamp: people will hate anyone they dont know and see the bad sides >in people they do. it wont get as extreme as loved ones attacking each >other but two armies would certaily war against each other. >-love hill: strangers will fall in love. people who hate each other wont. Ooooh, this one's got potential! There's plenty of ways a DM could use this effect, either to entrap or influence the PCs themselves, or to set large groups of normally-peaceful NPCs against each other. >prince Brannart's Well Kept Secret (AD&D- abjuration) >> >Well Kept Secret is strong anti divination magic. by use of this spell the >person in question recieves absolute protection from divining magic about >one fact. only one Well Kept Secret can be cast on one person.< Why didn't TSR ever think of this one, before?!? This is a GREAT idea, IMHO: it's precisely the sort of spell that a powerful, cunning wizard ought to have available. It even pairs up well with one of the G:KoM spells -- an anti-Charm defense, that lets a wizard place a "contingency command" into the minds of his or her servants, that'll take effect if their minds are tampered with (e.g. "run away" or "attack anyone who Charms you"). :-) One suggestion: Maybe "Well-Kept Secret" should be in the Divination school, instead of Abjuration. I'm not sure whether keeping a secret from being told could be considered "protection", in the same sense that blocking attacks or breaking hostile curses can. But diviners presumably know the best ways to mess up other diviners' spells, and the Divination school REALLY needs more good, high-level spells in it. Thanks again, Ohad! I'm gonna try to use these IMC, really soon. :-D *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 20 Feb 1999 22:15:04 -0500 From: Sharon Dornhoff Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Carnifex Question >The Carnifex Eras (just one idea to throw around, nothing intended to be >official):* > >Ur-Carnifex BC 35,000 - BC 14,500 >Greater Carnifex BC 15,000 - BC 10,000 >Y'hog Carnifex BC 10,000 - BC 7,022 >Deep Carnifex BC 8,000 - present** Yes, this works fine with my history too. If you're also using the pteryx, they'd have co-existed with the Ur-Carnifex since about 30,000 BC. The Greater Carnifex crushed the pterosauroids' civilization around 12,500 BC, and the last of them died out on Mystara by the end of that millenium. So neither of the other two subraces -- Y'hog or Deep Carnifex -- ever encountered the pteryx ... except, perhaps, a few undead ones (they'd be half-fossilized by then, but it's a possibility ;-D). >**The Deep Carnifex underwent several traumatic disasters, and as such >regressed to a primitive state for several millennia. They have only >relatively recently started rebuilding their civilization, and do not even >worship the Outer Beings anymore. Really? Who are they worshipping now? *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 20 Feb 1999 22:33:28 -0500 From: Sharon Dornhoff Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Carnifex Question >Note that the >Mystara map also resembles the RW map several million years after that EVENT, >some 60 million years ago... not a coincidence IMC... Naturally! It was this disaster that got Ka going on his "Hollow World" kick, in the first place! Once he'd discovered the planet's empty interior, and he and the other Immortals made it livable, that's when the HW Council started dumping dinosaurs and so forth into their little "nature preserve". Shortly after that, Immortals' interference greatly accelerated the rates of evolution on Mystara, IMHO; that's why we've still got dinosaurs on the outer world, living side by side with both archaic and modern mammals. :-) >That's my own take on the era of the Carnifex... all only IMC of course... Very Lovecraftian, indeed! Granted, I've chosen to use a much shorter time-frame for the Carnifex rise and fall -- mostly because I figured a race as vicious and amoral as THEIRS seems to be, couldn't have reigned for long, without poor Mystara's going the way of Old Alphatia! -- but I very much enjoyed your work on the Serpentines, and just might find a suitably-villainous use for them, in another context (they'd make GREAT enemies for an Alternity campaign! ;-D). *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 20 Feb 1999 23:09:09 -0500 From: Sharon Dornhoff Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - The Taymora >Now to figure out how >dark-skinned Nithians became pale-skinned Traladarans :) Frankly, that little detail of complexion makes me think the Traldar might NOT be just Nithians, after all! Perhaps the Nithian colonists brought a large number of slaves with them to the southern coast -- either Alasiyans or Thy/Ker/Hat tribesfolk -- and it's really these slaves whom the Traldar descend from. At the very least, they'd have far outnumbered their "true" Nithian overlords; after the colony failed, they could've absorbed their ex-masters into their own gene pool, totally masking the Nithian's skin-tones and slight stature. >Its sitting on my shelf just hadn't the time yet. Don't let "Sarum"'s size intimidate you: every chapter is a self-contained story, generations apart from the previous one. So you needn't read the whole, huge novel in one sitting. :-) >True. But he probably saw a chance with the Traldar to create the >ultimate worshippers. I guess we're really just disagreeing on whether the Traldar worshipped Pflarr, or not. You say they kept following the same Immortals as the Nithians; I say they would've adopted some others, after their initial colony failed. (Or perhaps, that they'd never BEEN true Nithians, but slaves descended from some Neathar ethnic group with patrons of its own.) Obviously neither of us wants to change his/her mind, but that's fine: to each his/her own. ;-) In any case, Pflarr didn't actually create the Hutaakans until 1500 BC, and the Traldar colony collapsed in 1400 BC. So Hutaaka, itself, couldn't have been as big or sophisticated a nation as it eventually grew to be, at the time of initial contact. Pflarr probably didn't create all that many Hutaakans, to start with (to save on PPs), and it takes a LOT more than 100 years for a small population to grow sufficiently for it to start building towns or B10-style temples. BTW, Tim -- since you seem to be one of the few folks who's actually GOT a copy of the much-prized B10, besides me -- have you ever come up with a story for what that slimy, "Cthulhu-oid" amoeba-monster, Kartoeba (sp?), is doing inside the Lost Valley temple...? Has anybody else? Frankly, I'm stumped on explaining THAT sucker... *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 20 Feb 1999 23:20:53 -0500 From: Sharon Dornhoff Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Genealogy >Race Name > Race or people decendeded from above > Race or people deceded from above > >Neathar > Makai I think a lot of people on the MML figure the Makai are descended from Oltecs, not Neathar. The HW boxed set lumps them together with the Thousand Tribes, but that's mostly because the HW Makai are a Neolithic culture: they've got the same cultural bias for Stone Age weapons and equipment, so it's less redundant to just list them as "Neathar", than to give them a whole entry of their own. The Ierendi Gaz clearly describes the Makai as dark-skinned. Certainly, if you're basing them on the IRL native Hawai'ians, they shouldn't be pure Neathar; yet another Oltec/Neathar cross seems more fitting. *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 21 Feb 1999 02:09:16 -0600 From: "Timothy R. Haney" Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - The Taymora Sharon Dornhoff wrote: > > Frankly, that little detail of complexion makes me think the Traldar might > NOT be just Nithians, after all! Perhaps the Nithian colonists brought a > large number of slaves with them to the southern coast -- either Alasiyans > or Thy/Ker/Hat tribesfolk -- and it's really these slaves whom the Traldar > descend from. At the very least, they'd have far outnumbered their "true" > Nithian overlords; after the colony failed, they could've absorbed their > ex-masters into their own gene pool, totally masking the Nithian's > skin-tones and slight stature. Well, anything is possible since some references speak of the Traldar as a clan of Nithians and others as a people that took the name Traldar that came from the direction of Nithia :) A little more on skin-tone below... > Don't let "Sarum"'s size intimidate you: every chapter is a self-contained > story, generations apart from the previous one. So you needn't read the > whole, huge novel in one sitting. :-) Oh, size doesn't matter Its just the itch to get into hasn't needed scratched since I bought it. > I guess we're really just disagreeing on whether the Traldar worshipped > Pflarr, or not. You say they kept following the same Immortals as the > Nithians; I say they would've adopted some others, after their initial > colony failed. (Or perhaps, that they'd never BEEN true Nithians, but > slaves descended from some Neathar ethnic group with patrons of its own.) > Obviously neither of us wants to change his/her mind, but that's fine: to > each his/her own. ;-) I'm not trying to change your mind (at least not with you know I'm trying :) Its just it fits best for me if they bring their gods with them. That's always how faiths have traveled. The only reason I wonder about them adopting other Immortals is from where when so much of their contact would have been with Nithia and the population was constantly kept low so that every time some cultural change could have started, over half the people are killed so they fall back on what they knew. I really don't know enough about how Egypt's colonies worked so I'm falling back on what I do know about Greek colonization. > In any case, Pflarr didn't actually create the Hutaakans until 1500 BC, and > the Traldar colony collapsed in 1400 BC. So Hutaaka, itself, couldn't have > been as big or sophisticated a nation as it eventually grew to be, at the > time of initial contact. Pflarr probably didn't create all that many > Hutaakans, to start with (to save on PPs), and it takes a LOT more than 100 > years for a small population to grow sufficiently for it to start building > towns or B10-style temples. I would say the temples are Traldar. Something like the same style used by Nithia only adapted. Say Nithia built pyramids to house their dead, the Traldar built small pyramids near their dead. Applying the same reasoning to the Immortals, as Entropy gained a foothold, the Traldar turned more and more to the Hutaakan (thus Pflarr). That small population problem is why I think the ties to Nithia were much closer. Maybe enough that Traladara was a protectorate of Nithia. That its empire stretched that far but isolated enough that some change could take root. The land is seen as a waste of money, so Nithia abandons it. > BTW, Tim -- since you seem to be one of the few folks who's actually GOT a > copy of the much-prized B10, besides me -- have you ever come up with a > story for what that slimy, "Cthulhu-oid" amoeba-monster, Kartoeba (sp?), is > doing inside the Lost Valley temple...? Has anybody else? Frankly, I'm > stumped on explaining THAT sucker... I wouldn't even try to explain that. Remember, that was a time in TSR history where 20 goblins lived in a locked room of a dungeon without a thing to eat :) Maybe one of the Hutaakans summoned it and it got away? That which you can't explain, blame on magic - -- Timothy R. Haney galwylin@airnet.net The Tome of Galwylin - http://www.airnet.net/galwylin/ Galwylin's Bookshop - http://www.airnet.net/galwylin/bookshop/ *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 21 Feb 1999 02:16:48 -0600 From: "Timothy R. Haney" Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Genealogy Sharon Dornhoff wrote: > > The Ierendi Gaz clearly describes the Makai as dark-skinned. Certainly, if > you're basing them on the IRL native Hawai'ians, they shouldn't be pure > Neathar; yet another Oltec/Neathar cross seems more fitting. This is the same problem I spoke about with the Traldarans and the Nithians. Skin tones not matching their ancestors. I think if you place them right, you can have the Taymorans descended from the Neathar with the Makai between them and the Azcans so they blend the tones. BTW, what if Nithians were the ones that weren't really dark-skinned? Of course, since we don't have the migration patterns of the Tanagoro, maybe they got in there some how. I forget when but they did manage to get from the Serpent Peninsula to the Pearl Islands some way. I'm not surprised TSR never worked out a migration of the original races. The world is a checker board with light, dark, light, dark, etc. - -- Timothy R. Haney galwylin@airnet.net The Tome of Galwylin - http://www.airnet.net/galwylin/ Galwylin's Bookshop - http://www.airnet.net/galwylin/bookshop/ *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 21 Feb 1999 16:23:22 -0500 From: Sharon Dornhoff Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - The Taymora >> BTW, Tim -- since you seem to be one of the few folks who's actually GOT a >> copy of the much-prized B10, besides me -- have you ever come up with a >> story for what that slimy, "Cthulhu-oid" amoeba-monster, Kartoeba (sp?), is >> doing inside the Lost Valley temple...? Has anybody else? Frankly, I'm >> stumped on explaining THAT sucker... > >I wouldn't even try to explain that. Remember, that was a time in TSR >history where 20 goblins lived in a locked room of a dungeon without a >thing to eat :) Maybe one of the Hutaakans summoned it and it got >away? That which you can't explain, blame on magic Heh heh heh. And when the core rulebooks told us every dungeon in the world had the same assortment of "wandering monsters" in it, regardless of whether it's a wizard's lair, a humanoid stronghold, an ancient catacomb, or whatever! What was it: 1d6 goblins on Level 1, 1d4+1 hobgoblins on Level 2, 1d3 wererats on Level 3.... ;-D Still, B10 came out of the TSR-U.K. design group, and those modules tended to be of MUCH higher quality than the ones which the Wisconsin offices came out with in those days. (Ever read the solo AD&D module where a lone ranger or druid gets dumped off in a roc's nest, and has to work his/her way down from the mountaintop...? Incredible!) Never mind resurrecting Gygax; I wish the WotC management would rehire the old-guard writers from the U.K. division! :-) *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 21 Feb 1999 15:37:10 -0600 From: "Timothy R. Haney" Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - The Taymora Sharon Dornhoff wrote: > > Still, B10 came out of the TSR-U.K. design group, and those modules tended > to be of MUCH higher quality than the ones which the Wisconsin offices came > out with in those days. (Ever read the solo AD&D module where a lone > ranger or druid gets dumped off in a roc's nest, and has to work his/her > way down from the mountaintop...? Incredible!) Never mind resurrecting > Gygax; I wish the WotC management would rehire the old-guard writers from > the U.K. division! :-) I'd forgot about that! I had always thought the British wrote better while I was in school (loved English Lit) and now we see Shakespeare wasn't a fluke years later - -- Timothy R. Haney galwylin@airnet.net The Tome of Galwylin - http://www.airnet.net/galwylin/ Galwylin's Bookshop - http://www.airnet.net/galwylin/bookshop/ *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 22 Feb 1999 09:06:33 +0800 From: Murphy Jason Subject: RE: [MYSTARA] - Vecna - Apologies > *sigh* Leave it to a human to tinker with perfection. Why do ye all need > to > create a demon darker than ye're own inner nightmares? Ah as well, I look > forward to learning about this race and its origins before it becomes the > way > of the surface world dinosaur. As for the tree and rock hugging hippies, > well, that's another human stereotype that I'll save for yet another day. > > Arminath "I'll waste it with my crossbow!" Wynter > [MURPHY Jason] Oops. We seem to have gotten our wires crossed here. I wasnt actually talking about an evil "race". The drow pretty much have that sown up. I was simply talking of an idividual. Jason Murphy Software Engineer MITS Limited EMAIL: jason.murphy@mitswa.com.au PHONE: 08 9481 4066 FAX: 08 9481 4064 *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ End of mystara-digest V1999 #98 ******************************* *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara' as the body of the message. mystara-digest Monday, February 22 1999 Volume 1999 : Number 099 Mystara is a trademark of TSR Inc. All Rights Reserved. The following topics are covered in this digest: RE: [MYSTARA] - Vecna - Apologies [MYSTARA] - Did anyone flesh out Thieves Alley in GAZ11? Re: [MYSTARA] - The Taymora Re: [MYSTARA] - Dragonlord Chronicles Re: [MYSTARA] - OD&D Tome of Spellcraft survey, discontinued! Re: [MYSTARA] - OD&D Tome of Spellcraft survey, discontinued! [MYSTARA] - More New OD&D Spells Re: [MYSTARA] - OD&D Tome of Spellcraft survey, discontinued! Re: [MYSTARA] - OD&D Tome of Spellcraft survey, discontinued! ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Mon, 22 Feb 1999 09:09:07 +0800 From: Murphy Jason Subject: RE: [MYSTARA] - Vecna - Apologies > Actually, I think I like this idea! It could even be the very thing the > Alfheim elves need, to shake their image of being boooooring, when > compared > to shadow elves. :-) > > > > [MURPHY Jason] Well thats what i am hoping for :) And your probably right about Atziann. But i think we need a more contemporary and current villain. Jason Murphy Software Engineer MITS Limited EMAIL: jason.murphy@mitswa.com.au PHONE: 08 9481 4066 FAX: 08 9481 4064 *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 21 Feb 1999 19:11:35 -0800 From: Dave Keyser Subject: [MYSTARA] - Did anyone flesh out Thieves Alley in GAZ11? I noticed on the map of Darokin City's central market one alley labelled Thieves Alley. The map is on the inner cover of GAZ11. Did anyone flesh this out? I couldn't find anything in the Gazeteer, and was looking for ideas. Dave Keyser *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 21 Feb 1999 22:29:40 EST From: Mystaros@aol.com Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - The Taymora In a message dated 99-02-20 23:20:55 EST, dornhoff@bio.umass.edu writes: << Frankly, that little detail of complexion makes me think the Traldar might NOT be just Nithians, after all! >> In my campaign the Traldar are descended from a Neathar tribe that lived in Nithia for several centuries... here's the origins of the Traldar IMC, excerpted from the Origins of Nithia, found on Shawn's site... "During this period Orisis became acquainted with a traveller from the far east, an elderly wizard who went by the name Thoth. Thoth and Orisis became quick friends, despite the Undying nature of the OverKing. Thoth revealed himself to be one of the legendary Stone Folk who was on a great quest: he was searching for the reason behind the slow demise of the Elder Dwarven race. Orisis was unable to help him directly, though he was able to inform Thoth about Dwarven settlements to the north. Thoth eventually continued on to the Dwarven lands in the north, accompanied by his companion, the Dwarf known as Laughing Axe. After a very nasty encounter with the minions of the Vampire- Queen Nennaya-Sherat, the pair finally reached the lands of the Kogolor Dwarves in 1900 BC [modern Rockhome]. The elderly sage and his companion were surprised to discover not only Dwarves, but also a race of Humans living in the mountains. The Humans were a tribe of Neathar that had been pushed out of the Northern Plains by invading hordes of Oltecs around 2000 BC; they had long been the allies of the Dwarves, and found refuge among them. But the Neathar were nomads, and found the mountains and valleys to be extremely restrictive. During his time in the Kogolor lands, when he was not investigating the history of the Dwarves, Thoth regaled the Neathar with tales of the rich plains to the south which were dominated by Tamyris, the realm ruled by Nennaya-Sherat. Being a friend of Orisis, who was an enemy of Nennaya-Sherat, and having his own vendetta against the Vampire-Queen, Thoth convinced the Neathar clans to cleanse the plains of the realm of Nennaya-Sherat. In doing so, they would win their own lands, lands that were not unlike those they had left behind a hundred years before. Thoth communicated with Orisis using magical means, and set up a series of meetings whereby the Neathar clans would join with the forces of Orisis in a concerted effort to destroy the realm of Tamyris. In return for his assistance, the Neathar were able to acquaint Thoth with their Patron Immortal, Kagyar, for the Neathar were known as the People of Kagyar. [Eventually, Thoth would convince Kagyar to assist the Dwarves, and Thoth would go on to earn Immortality under the sponsorship of Kagyar]. Khypta was taken by the united forces of the People of Kagyar and the forces of the city of Nithus in 1875 BC, and in 1850 BC the allies destroyed Tamarnak itself. Her city razed and her forces shattered, Nennaya-Sherat fled to the Isle of Serpents where abode her ally, Setu-Kha. The People of Kagyar had settled in the plains around Khypta in 1875 BC, and eventually they rebuilt the city, renaming it Khyptahr. Over the years they would eventually adopt many Nithian customs. They became known to the Nithians as the "Ptahr Al-Dar" ("House of Ptahr" (Kagyar))."... thus, centuries later, the semi- Nithian Ptahr Al-Dar settled in the southern lands, and regressed to their more primitive culture, eventually calling themselves the Traldar... Mystaros *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 22 Feb 1999 19:41:36 +0100 (CET) From: =?iso-8859-1?Q?H=E5vard_R=F8nne_Faanes?= Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Dragonlord Chronicles On Fri, 19 Feb 1999, Sharon Dornhoff wrote: > So the dragons' belief that they're related to Eldar is so much hooey...? > Now that theory, I can live with! It would even be in keeping with how the > dragons got confused about the original Dragonlord of Blackmoor, by > forgetting that his attacks on them were a misunderstanding. Im glad you liked my idea! Hĺvard Haavard R. Faanes (hoc@nvg.ntnu.no) http://www.nvg.ntnu.no/~hoc "Remember, there are no stupid questions, just stupid people." -Mr Garrison, South Park. *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 22 Feb 1999 10:50:45 -0800 From: "Jenni A. M. Merrifield" Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - OD&D Tome of Spellcraft survey, discontinued! Jim: >On Sat, 20 Feb 1999 20:43:12 EST You said: >Hi y'all! > >It's been brought to my attention that using copyrighted material, whether it >is out of print or not, in whole or in part is illegal. So, that means that >I will NOT be able to include spells from the OD&D "core", nor any of the >spells from the GAZ series. I wasn't aware of this at the time I posted the >Survey question, as I thought since I was only using the material as a part of >a free service there would be no problems. So keep on sending your own >spells! What if you just included the name, source(s), range, duration, a /brief/ description (one or two sentences) of the spell's end results? Here are two examples: LEVEL 1 SPELLS MAGIC MISILE Source: Rules Cyclolpedia, p45 Range: 150' Duration: 1 round Description: Shoots one or more magical arrows at a target. BLEACH Source: Dawn of the Empires, Player's Guide to Alphatia, p21 Range: Touch Duration: Permanent Description: Bleaches a certain amount of material to its original color. Fades pigments and can dispell the *color* spell. I think the above examples would fall under 'fair use' since it is, in effect, a synopsis rather than a complete copy. Note that the description you provide should also be different from the 'Effect' line given in the source books, which can sometimes be a very basic description. By doing the above, you would at least give people who didn't have the all the reference material an idea of the complete list of oD&D spells. Jenni - -- Jenni A. M. Merrifield <==> strawberryJAMM Designs strawberry@jamm.com <==> http://www.jamm.com/jamm/ <------------------------------------------------------------------> God created Light. Then Earth, Vegetables, Animals, Man and Woman. Then God started to think: "I should create things I *like*!" And God said: "Let There Be Strawberries!" *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 22 Feb 1999 16:50:08 -0500 From: Jeff Daly Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - OD&D Tome of Spellcraft survey, discontinued! And if that isn't enough, title and description would be. Jenni A. M. Merrifield wrote: > Jim: > > >On Sat, 20 Feb 1999 20:43:12 EST You said: > >Hi y'all! > > > >It's been brought to my attention that using copyrighted material, whether it > >is out of print or not, in whole or in part is illegal. So, that means that > >I will NOT be able to include spells from the OD&D "core", nor any of the > >spells from the GAZ series. I wasn't aware of this at the time I posted the > >Survey question, as I thought since I was only using the material as a > part of > >a free service there would be no problems. So keep on sending your own > >spells! > > What if you just included the name, source(s), range, duration, a /brief/ > description (one or two sentences) of the spell's end results? Here are > two examples: > > LEVEL 1 SPELLS > > MAGIC MISILE > Source: Rules Cyclolpedia, p45 > Range: 150' > Duration: 1 round > Description: Shoots one or more magical arrows at a target. > > BLEACH > Source: Dawn of the Empires, Player's Guide to Alphatia, p21 > Range: Touch > Duration: Permanent > Description: Bleaches a certain amount of material to its original color. > Fades pigments and can dispell the *color* spell. > > I think the above examples would fall under 'fair use' since it is, in > effect, a synopsis rather than a complete copy. Note that the description > you provide should also be different from the 'Effect' line given in the > source books, which can sometimes be a very basic description. > > By doing the above, you would at least give people who didn't have the > all the reference material an idea of the complete list of oD&D spells. > > Jenni > > -- > Jenni A. M. Merrifield <==> strawberryJAMM Designs > strawberry@jamm.com <==> http://www.jamm.com/jamm/ > <------------------------------------------------------------------> > God created Light. Then Earth, Vegetables, Animals, Man and Woman. > Then God started to think: "I should create things I *like*!" > And God said: "Let There Be Strawberries!" > > *************************************************************************** > To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line > 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 22 Feb 1999 13:53:14 -0800 From: "Jenni A. M. Merrifield" Subject: [MYSTARA] - More New OD&D Spells Heya. Here are a few more of the OD&D spells I've created for my campaigns. A few were inspired by 1st ED AD&D spells, but they are generally different enough that I personally consider them to be new OD&D spells and I have given them unique names. This set are all 1st level. Jenni - -=> strawberryJAMM <=- - -=-=-=-=-=-=-=- LEVEL 1 SPELLS - -=-=-=-=-=-=-=- CAMPFIRE Range: 5'/level Duration: 6 turns + 1 turn/level Effect: Ignites a campfire This spell allows the magic user to ignite the equivalent of a standard 1-˝' campfire located within range. The fire itself is non-magical and permanent as long as a fuel source remains. The magic user may choose the size of the fire - from as small as a torch or lantern, to as large as a bonfire of 3' maximum diameter. Reducing the size of the fire will cut fuel consumption to half normal, and increasing the fire will double consumption. During the official duration of the spell, the magic user may also adjust the the light output of the fire simply by concentrating for one round. The light output may become as low as a match or as bright as a light spell. Note that the heat output will not be altered by a change in the light output. Light output will return to normal when the spell duration ends. DRIFT Range: 10'/level Duration: 6 rounds/level Effect: Subject drifts as if weightless When this spell is cast, the creature(s) or object(s) affected immediately begins to drift as if it was only 1/10th it's regular mass. Affected creatures may propell themselves in unusual directions or to unusual heights by pushing off a solid object with their legs. The recipient of this spell may control their own movement to some degree - twisting, turning and tumbling as necessary. Movements have the same appearance as that of a man on the Moon and large gusts of wind can easily send an individual flying off in an unexpected direction if they are not holding onto something. Weapons may be used by affected creatures but they will only do half damage due to the reduction in their effective mass. If a creature begins to fall while the spell is in effect their maximum rate of falling will never be more than 1' per second (10' per round), and no damage will be incurred if they land under these conditions. However, when the spell duration ceases, if the creature happens to be suspended above ground the normal rate of falling will occur. *Drift* may affect creatures and/or objects in an area of up to 10' cubed and of a maximum combined total weight equal to a base of 2000cn plus 2000cn per level of the spell caster. The spell can be cast upon the magic-user or other creatures or objects at up to the maximum range of 10' per level of experience of the spell caster. This spell works only upon whole objects or creatures. Thus it can not be used to affect only a sword blow, although when cast on an unsuspecting creature that is attacking, it will suffer a -4 to their first round of attacks. GLAMOUR Range: Caster only Duration: 2 turns + 2 turns/level Effect: Superficially alters caster's appearance This spell enables the caster to alter the appearance of his or her form - including clothing and equipment - to appear up to 1' shorter or taller; thin, fat or in between; human, humanoid, or any other generally man-shaped bipedal creature. The caster's shape is not actually changed but is seen to be changed to all observers. Note that the changed appearance will not be reflected by mirrors and other reflective surfaces. *Glamour* is treated as an illusion with respect to detection and dispelling. LEAP Range: Touch Duration: 1 turn Effect: leap long distance This spell empowers an individual with one opportunity to leap a long distance. For every two levels of the caster the spell allows the affected individual to leap up to 20' forward, 10' backward or 5' straight upward, cumulative. Thus *leap* cast by a 1st or 2nd level magic-user allows the recipient to leap up to 20' forward, 10' backwards or 5' upwards while a 5th or 6th level magic-user would allow a leap of up to 60' forward, 30' backwards or 15' upwards. Horizontal leaps forward or backward are in a slight arc - about 2' per 10' of distance travelled. The *leap* spell does not insure any safety in landing or grasping at the end of the leap (and remember that what goes up must come back down...) The leap must be completed within 1 turn after the spell is cast, for after that period has elapsed the spell wears off. RAINBOW ATTACK Range: 10'/level Duration: 1 round Effect: Bathes area with a rainbow of colours Upon casting this spell, the magic-user causes a bright rainbow of colours to descend out of the sky and bathe a designated 20' x 20' square in a riot of colour. Up to 1d6 creatures within the area of effect may be affected by the attack. Affected creatures whose level or number of hit dice is less than or equal to that of the spell caster will be struck unconscious for 2d4 minutes due to sensory overloard. If their level or hit dice is 1 or 2 greater than the spell caster, they will be blinded by the colours for 1d4 minutes. All other affected creatures are stunned - reeling and unable to think clearly or act - for 1d4 rounds. All creatures above the level of the spell caster and all creatures of 5th level or 5 or more hit dice are entitled to a saving throw versus the *Rainbow Attack* spell. WHISPER Range: 60' + 10'/level Duration: 3 rounds + 1 round/level Effect: Pass a whispered message to one other creature When this spell is cast, the magic-user can whisper a message while concentrating on one other creature in view and within range, and the whisper will travel in a straight line to be audible to that creature. The message spoken during the whisper must fit into the spell duration to be completely heard. If there is time remaining once the caster has completed her message, the creature who received the whisper can make a whispered reply that will be heard by the spell caster. Note that there must be an open an unobstructed path, of at least 1' width, between the spell caster and the recipient of the spell. - -- Jenni A. M. Merrifield <==> strawberryJAMM Designs strawberry@jamm.com <==> http://www.jamm.com/jamm/ <------------------------------------------------------------------> God created Light. Then Earth, Vegetables, Animals, Man and Woman. Then God started to think: "I should create things I *like*!" And God said: "Let There Be Strawberries!" *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 23 Feb 1999 01:04:42 +0100 From: "=?ISO-8859-1?Q?Andr=E9s_Piquer_Otero?=" Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - OD&D Tome of Spellcraft survey, discontinued! Somebody wrote: > > > > > > >It's been brought to my attention that using copyrighted material, whether it > > >is out of print or not, in whole or in part is illegal. So, that means that > > >I will NOT be able to include spells from the OD&D "core", nor any of the > > >spells from the GAZ series. Anyway, it would be a good idea to include the name of the spell (such quoting, giving the reference work where it is taken from does NOT violate any copyright) and any notes and variations that people may come up with. EG: 1) 2nd LEVEL MU: WEB The caster has the option of reducing the level of "stickiness" of the webs, so that it may be used to create a temporary rope brigde across a chasm. In that way, the Compendium will double as a comprehensive index of spells and will add some optional rules tu increased spell creativity and flexibility. Andrés *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 22 Feb 1999 20:48:25 EST From: Arminath@aol.com Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - OD&D Tome of Spellcraft survey, discontinued! Good idea Jenni! I'll check into it! Jim *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ End of mystara-digest V1999 #99 ******************************* *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara' as the body of the message. mystara-digest Tuesday, February 23 1999 Volume 1999 : Number 100 Mystara is a trademark of TSR Inc. All Rights Reserved. The following topics are covered in this digest: Re: [MYSTARA] - More New OD&D Spells Re: [MYSTARA] - The Aasimar, revised Re: [MYSTARA] - OD&D Tome of Spellcraft survey, discontinued! Re: [MYSTARA] - More New OD&D Spells [Commentary] [MYSTARA] - Origin of Dragons Re: [MYSTARA] - More New OD&D Spells Re: [MYSTARA] - More New OD&D Spells ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Mon, 22 Feb 1999 22:24:49 -0500 (EST) From: au998@freenet.carleton.ca (Geoff Gander) Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - More New OD&D Spells Jenni wrote: >CAMPFIRE >Range: 5'/level >Duration: 6 turns + 1 turn/level >Effect: Ignites a campfire This is a very handy spell - good for those times when the party forgets to bring a torch, or the tindexbox is conveniently "lost". :) Does anyone else have handy spells like this in their campaigns - ie: 1st level spells that perform otherwise mundane functions? >DRIFT >Range: 10'/level >Duration: 6 rounds/level >Effect: Subject drifts as if weightless >When this spell is cast, the creature(s) or object(s) affected >immediately begins to drift as if it was only 1/10th it's regular >mass. Affected creatures may propell themselves in unusual directions >or to unusual heights by pushing off a solid object with their legs. I wonder...what would be the movement rate of a person who pushes themselves off of a wall or other surface? Would we have to account for strength, as muscle mass and power would likely play a large role in determining the initial forward thrust? Gotta hate those crosswinds, though.. :-) >GLAMOUR >Range: Caster only >Duration: 2 turns + 2 turns/level >Effect: Superficially alters caster's appearance Now *this* is a highly useful spell for assassins and thieves! Neat! >RAINBOW ATTACK >Range: 10'/level >Duration: 1 round >Effect: Bathes area with a rainbow of colours Another spell I can throw against my nasty players. *cackle* >WHISPER >Range: 60' + 10'/level >Duration: 3 rounds + 1 round/level >Effect: Pass a whispered message to one other creature This would also make a neat magic item - something like a horn of whispering - so that other character classes could benefit from this. Great spells, Jenni! I'll include these IMC for sure! :) Geoff - -- Geoff Gander, BA 97 Cartographer/Game Designer/Government Peon Part-Time High Priest, Ottawa Chapter of the Church of Y'hog au998@freenet.carleton.ca *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 23 Feb 1999 08:54:44 +0100 (MET) From: Agathokles Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - The Aasimar, revised On Fri, 19 Feb 1999 Arminath@aol.com wrote: > > Tanks very much, but I did this as a OD&D conversion for an example of what > Children of the Immortals would be like. I understood it. The advice was for those who play AD&D, but don't use PlaneScape. > I never stated that I created the > creature. > I didn't suggest that. Giampaolo Agosta *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 23 Feb 1999 18:57:34 +1100 (EST) From: "Jonathan Nolan, Barrister & Solicitor, FTIA" Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - OD&D Tome of Spellcraft survey, discontinued! > What if you just included the name, source(s), range, duration, a /brief/ > description (one or two sentences) of the spell's end results? Here are > two examples: > > LEVEL 1 SPELLS > > MAGIC MISILE > Source: Rules Cyclolpedia, p45 > Range: 150' > Duration: 1 round > Description: Shoots one or more magical arrows at a target. > > BLEACH > Source: Dawn of the Empires, Player's Guide to Alphatia, p21 > Range: Touch > Duration: Permanent > Description: Bleaches a certain amount of material to its original color. > Fades pigments and can dispell the *color* spell. > > By doing the above, you would at least give people who didn't have the > all the reference material an idea of the complete list of oD&D spells. > > Jenni > > -- > Jenni A. M. Merrifield <==> strawberryJAMM Designs This would potentially be outside the fair use guidelines. There is no editorial comment, comparison, review with changes or acknowledgement of TSR/WotC copyright. I drafted a 'hip' copyright notice which is attached to the end of my netbooks - that would cover this netbook as easily with a few changes, but the one thing you can't do is list existing TSR spells, as it is a reproduction and a reproduction fundamentally offends against copyright. If the OD&D netbook of spells is running into these difficulties it might be better to include a preamble or endpiece as I have done with the Mystara Grimoire, stating openly the source of the spells and NOT putting any in that appeared first or only in game aids or books as opposed to magazines or third party adventures. It's quite a complex area. - -Jonathan "Joe Lawyer" Nolan :) *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 23 Feb 1999 09:00:09 -0800 From: "Jenni A. M. Merrifield" Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - More New OD&D Spells [Commentary] Hello MML'ers. I got some "Off List" commentary on a few of the spells I posted from Richard Drozdik, someone whom I know personally and didn't even know was on the MML! Apparently, he's been lurking for only a short period of time and wasn't sure if his comments would be acceptable material for the list. I asked him if he'd mind if I shared his commentary and our discussion with the list, since I thought it might spark further discussion, which I'd be interested in. He has agreed, and the three relevant messages are included below my note. I'll send further replies to his last set of comments to the list. Oh, as an aside, Rich uses his own, personalized AD&D version of Mystara. Not that it effects his discusion at all, but Magic is a bit different for both Mages and Clerics. And here's something a few of you will really find intriguing: He's completly redesigned Irendi into something else. Jenni - -=-=-=-=- Message 1 - -=-=-=-=- Date: Mon, 22 Feb 1999 16:44:43 -0800 To: strawberry@jamm.com From: Richard Drozdik Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - More New OD&D Spells Hey Jenn, Decided that the need to comment finally out-weighed the need to maintain a lurker status on this group. I was looking the spells you posted, and I will have to say that I agree with most of them and even recognize a few of them. But I must say that I disagree with the level you atributed to DRIFT, my personal opinion is that that would be a second level spell. But everyone is entitled to their own opinion and that's not why I'm sending you this message. My question concerns your CAMPFIRE spell (btw: On thinking about it, I also consider this to be a 2nd Level, but that is neither here nor there). You mention in the spell that reducing the size of the fire will reduce the fuel comsumption accordingly and you give measurements in terms of campfires. What would happen if say I did a reduced output ignition, but I was igniting a torch instead of a campfire, and so the spell output would actually be matching the medium that I was igniting. (I seem to remember you describing this spell to me before, but at that I time I believe it was stated that this spell could only be used to ignite campfires and not other combustables, not noted below, which would make my question moot) Also, you mention that after the fire has been ignited, a person can regulate the light output of the fire, without affecting the heat output. Does this have any effect on consumption (ie are the flames physically dimmed thereby reducing consumption, or is it the case that the light from the flames is being dimmed without any reduction to the flames themselves.). Oh well, I've wasted enough time on this issue, TTUL Richard >CAMPFIRE >Range: 5'/level >Duration: 6 turns + 1 turn/level >Effect: Ignites a campfire > >This spell allows the magic user to ignite the equivalent of a standard >1-˝' campfire located within range. The fire itself is non-magical and >permanent as long as a fuel source remains. The magic user may choose >the size of the fire - from as small as a torch or lantern, to as large >as a bonfire of 3' maximum diameter. Reducing the size of the fire >will cut fuel consumption to half normal, and increasing the fire will >double consumption. > >During the official duration of the spell, the magic user may also >adjust the the light output of the fire simply by concentrating for >one round. The light output may become as low as a match or as bright >as a light spell. Note that the heat output will not be altered by a >change in the light output. Light output will return to normal when >the spell duration ends. > - -=-=-=-=- Message 2 - -=-=-=-=- Date: Mon, 22 Feb 1999 20:18:27 -0800 To: Richard Drozdik From: "Jenni A. M. Merrifield" Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - More New OD&D Spells Hey Richard! :-) At 04:44 PM 2/22/99 -0800, you wrote: >Hey Jenn, > >Decided that the need to comment finally out-weighed the need to maintain a >lurker status on this group. How come you only replied to me and not the list as a whole? Not that I ind, really, but this is the sort of debate that the whole list will sometimes pick up and comment on. To each his own, I suppose. :-) >I was looking the spells you posted, and I will have to say that I agree >with most of them and even recognize a few of them. But I must say that I >disagree with the level you atributed to DRIFT, my personal opinion is that >that would be a second level spell. But everyone is entitled to their own >opinion and that's not why I'm sending you this message. DRIFT was loosly based on "Feather Fall", which is a first level 1st Ed spell (no idea what it is in 2nd Ed.). The duration of 6 rounds/level (equal to 1 minute/level) is, perhaps a bit long for a 1st level spell -- I suppose something like 2 or 3 rounds/level might be preferable (1 round/level doesn't seem enough to me because it would really reduce its use at 1st level) or even 6 rounds + 1 round/level would be a good alternative. That's all I'll say to that though, since it wasn't what you were really commenting on... > My question concerns your CAMPFIRE spell (btw: On thinking about it, I >also consider this to be a 2nd Level, but that is neither here nor there). CAMPFIRE is loosly based on "Affect Normal Fires" -- another first level 1st Ed spell. I decided on the given length of time in order to make it useful when trying to hide but still wanting to cook food. Anything less than an hour (6 turns) wouldn't be very useful. Again, I supose half an hour (3 turns) plus 1 per level might be better for a first level spell. >You mention in the spell that reducing the size of the fire will reduce the >fuel comsumption accordingly and you give measurements in terms of >campfires. What would happen if say I did a reduced output ignition, but I >was igniting a torch instead of a campfire, and so the spell output would >actually be matching the medium that I was igniting. (I seem to remember >you describing this spell to me before, but at that I time I believe it was >stated that this spell could only be used to ignite campfires and not other >combustables, not noted below, which would make my question moot) If you cast a regular campfire on a torch and didn't reduce the output to torch levels it would effectively burn the torch at twice normal rates, while casting it at torch levels would burn at a torches usual rate. The idea is that, a torch is (roughly) 1/2 the fuel of a small campfire, which is 1/2 the fuel of a 3' bonfire. Its an approximation, of course, but that's uually okay for OD&D. > Also, you >mention that after the fire has been ignited, a person can regulate the >light output of the fire, without affecting the heat output. Does this have >any effect on consumption (ie are the flames physically dimmed thereby >reducing consumption, or is it the case that the light from the flames is >being dimmed without any reduction to the flames themselves.). No, it has no effect on consumption. The flames are still there, at whatever level the caster selected, and the light from the flames is being dimmed or brightened magically. I suppose one could also ask what would happen if someone cast this spell when a fire was already burning. I'd have to say that it would allow the caster to increase/decrease the existing fire output, as long as it is no larger than the bonfire maximum, when initially cast and then provides the light modification options. >Oh well, I've wasted enough time on this issue, Not wasted -- they were good questions. Would you mind if I forwarded this reply to the list? Others might be enlightened. If you don't want to be "outed" on the list I don't have to give your name... Jenni - -=-=-=-=- Message 3 - -=-=-=-=- Date: Mon, 22 Feb 1999 23:53:53 -0800 To: "Jenni A. M. Merrifield" From: Richard Drozdik Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - More New OD&D Spells At 08:18 PM 22/02/99 , you wrote: >Hey Richard! :-) > > How come you only replied to me and not the list as a whole? Not that I >mind, really, but this is the sort of debate that the whole list will >sometimes pick up and comment on. To each his own, I suppose. :-) > I haven't been on the list long enough to know whether this type of commenting would be appropriate and it was off-topic for the thread. Also, it's a matter of differing opinions amoung DMs and is not of great importance. (ie. I mention it off hand because I know you and I happened to be writing you anyway, but if I didn't know you, I probably wouldn't have posted). Feel free to forward that post and my comments from this post to the list if your interested in further discussion (and feel free to attach my name). > > DRIFT was loosly based on "Feather Fall", which is a first level 1st Ed >spell (no idea what it is in 2nd Ed.). The duration of 6 rounds/level >(equal to 1 minute/level) is, perhaps a bit long for a 1st level spell -- I >suppose something like 2 or 3 rounds/level might be preferable (1 >round/level doesn't seem enough to me because it would really reduce its >use at 1st level) or even 6 rounds + 1 round/level would be a good >alternative. > It took me awhile, but I did actually recognize the elements of Feather Fall near the end of what I was writing earlier. I don't know the stats of Feather Fall off by heart, and technically I'm at the computer to write a cover letter so I'm not going to look it up now, but the reason I rank Drift higher then Feather Fall is because with Drift, you not only get the effects of the Feather Fall spell (which I believe is limited to slowing downward movement and has no effect on horizontal or upwards motion), but you get the added bonus of full vertical and horizontal movement assuming you can find a surface to push off of. By my reading of your description, the spell reduces the receipiant to 1/10th mass and so therefore the user would be able to jump 10x as far. This would mean that a person who could jump say two feet straight up can now jump 20' straight up before he slowly begins to drift straight down. This effect looks very simillar to the effect of the jump spell that you listed with first post. Now, I'll admit that I didn't re-check as to whether you made specific mention about the amount of force that a person could output with the magically reduced mass (It makes sense, reduced mass = reduced exertable force, but then with magic anything is possible. I don't remember the you putting in the reduced force clause but as I said earlier, I didn't double check). Because I didn't see anything about reducing force, I'm assuming that it is not there. So to give this spell a level, I look at simillar spells and compare the effects. At first level, we have Jump and we have Feather Fall, at third level, we have Fly and at second level, we have Levitate. I'm not going to go through the whole process of weighing the pros and cons of each spell, but to my mind Drift comes out to being about equal to Levitate for pros/cons and that's why I think it should be level 2. Now if you really wanted it to be a level one spell in my campaign, I would explicitly state that the force a person can exert is reduced along with there mass. This being the case, they can no longer use Drift like a Jump spell. There are combat implications that I'm not going to assess to closely, other then to say that reduced force by a factor of ten would technically remove anyone effect by the spell from any sort of physical combat, but you did mention 1/2 damage and I might let that go as plausable for the situation. With all this said, I would give the spell 2/3 the duration of feather fall (because just sitting here I've thought of a least one way to massage the wording of the spell to get greater usage out of the spell even with the exertable force limitation). <...snip large informative discussion on Campfire...> Firstly, let me say thanks for the reply, you answered my questions and I am now reasonably sure that I understand how the spell is supposed to work. That said, I have to re-iterate that I think it is probably a second level spell (I say probably because it is not as powerful as I previously thought but it still is powerful enough to be considered boarderline). I actually developed my own personal solution to this sort of problem and it is as follows: I modified Affect Normal Fires to have an alternate effect as well as the one listed in the book; instead of using the spell to manipulate the size and fuel consumption of a fire(s), a person can use the spell to attempt to cause combustable materials to burst into flames. This type of casting effectively has an instanteous duration as the magic is spent entirely in the ignition leaving nothing left to further manipulate the fire. Easily combustable materials, such as candle wicks, a small (few inches of length) section of rope, oil or oil soaked materials will automatically light (and I would usually allow muliple objects to be lit simultaneously though not in excessive amounts (I think the most generous I've been was to allow Kris to ignite three ropes with one casting)). Larger ignitions such as a person's clothing, a campfire, several torches can performed but each item attempting to be lit is allowed to make an item's saving throw vs. normal fire to resist the ignition (this is an AD&D thing..that may or may not translate to D&D). Should this save succeed the item(s) in question will warm and smoulder but no actually flames will appear. Failure to save of course ignites the item. I complement this spell with a 2nd level spell called Ignition, which in the hands of a low level caster can perform higher level ignition functions of the ANF spell with ease, but then allows casters of higher levels to increase the volumns of there fires porportionally. Eventually they would be able to use the spell to light large bonfires, trees and wide areas of brush, upto buildings and other large constructions. The problems I have with your Campfire spell is again that it seems to have alot of multifunctionality. To summarize your spell, it allows you to light a fire at range, set the fuel consumption rate of that fire to possibly nonstandard levels for a standard fire of the type lit and then allow you to tweak the light the fire sheds for a good duration while the fire is burning. And that it can be used upon pre-exsisting fires. I actually find this spell hard to judge because it's not put together anywhere close to how I would put it together. My inclination is to say that it is now actually a powerful first level spell or a really weak second level spell. It is no where near in power to my Ignition spell which I admit is a strong second level spell. Your spell is stronger then the ANF as listed in the PHB, and probably stronger then my version of ANF as well. My problem arises in that the spell bundles alot of useful effects together, but there not all effects that I can see a person really wanting to use all a once except in special circumstances. To make it a safe first level spell, I would explicitly state that once the spell duration has ended, the fuel consumption becomes that of a standard fire of that type. I would say that it only effects on fire, and I would say that light output is a function of the intensity of the fire an so if you want to get the equivalent of a light spell out of this fire fuel consumption would be adjusted accordingly and of course if you wanted to reduce this fire to a candle light then full consumption is adjusted accordingly. Oh well, I've spent two hours mulling over this post and I guess I'm not going to be writing my cover letter tonight, Looking forward to hearing your thoughts, and again feel free to move this discussion to the list if you'd like, Richard - -- Jenni A. M. Merrifield <==> strawberryJAMM Designs strawberry@jamm.com <==> http://www.jamm.com/jamm/ <------------------------------------------------------------------> God created Light. Then Earth, Vegetables, Animals, Man and Woman. Then God started to think: "I should create things I *like*!" And God said: "Let There Be Strawberries!" *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 22 Feb 1999 21:09:30 +0100 From: "JamugaKhan" Subject: [MYSTARA] - Origin of Dragons Well, after reading much about Dragons and Carnifex in the last time, I have got the idea that those races are linked somehow. All you experts for the (very) early history of Mystara, do you have any ideas? Or should we explain the origin of the dragons as being from outer-plane (like the gemstone dragons)? Jamuga Khan "Hear and obey, because the Mighty Khan's word is law." *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 23 Feb 1999 10:34:20 -0800 From: "Jenni A. M. Merrifield" Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - More New OD&D Spells At 11:53 PM 2/22/99 -0800, Richard Drozdik wrote: >At 08:18 PM 22/02/99 , Jenni A. M. Merrifield wrote: >> DRIFT was loosly based on "Feather Fall", [...] >> > >It took me awhile, but I did actually recognize the elements of Feather >Fall near the end of what I was writing earlier. [...] >[...] the reason I rank >Drift higher then Feather Fall is because with Drift, you not only get the >effects of the Feather Fall spell (which I believe is limited to slowing >downward movement and has no effect on horizontal or upwards motion), No, *Feather Fall* can be used to effect horizontal and upwards motion. The restriction is that it must be a 'free falling body' -- a missile, a thrown object, or a falling person will be effected, but not an individual sword blow. >you get the added bonus of full vertical and horizontal movement assuming >you can find a surface to push off of. By my reading of your description, >the spell reduces the receipiant to 1/10th mass and so therefore the user >would be able to jump 10x as far. This would mean that a person who could >jump say two feet straight up can now jump 20' straight up before he slowly >begins to drift straight down. This effect looks very simillar to the >effect of the jump spell that you listed with first post. You make some good points. I was really aiming at a 'low gravity' effect - -- I almost called the spell 'anti-gravity' but decided that was two close to the 7th level spell 'reverse gravity' I just looked up the stats for our Moon and according to the World Book encyclopedia, the moon has 1/6th the gravity, thus objects have 1/6th the mass. I'm thinking that perhaps 'drift' should give the recipient 1/6th or even 1/5th (easier to calculate with) their usual mass instead of 1/10th. At 1/5th mass, by your calculations, a person who could jump 2' straight up would be able to drift 10' straight up and then drift slowly downward, and assuming a person could normally jump 5' forward, they could now drift 25' forward if they pushed. The difference between the horizontal/vertical aspects of *drift* and *jump* is that jump doesn't guarantee that you will land safely, while *drift* does (assuming it is still in effect). From this alone I can see where *drift*, as it is currently defined, could actually be a 2nd level spell. >Now, I'll admit >that I didn't re-check as to whether you made specific mention about the >amount of force that a person could output with the magically reduced mass >(It makes sense, reduced mass = reduced exertable force, but then with >magic anything is possible. I don't remember the you putting in the reduced >force clause but as I said earlier, I didn't double check). Because I >didn't see anything about reducing force, I'm assuming that it is not >there. No, you're right, there's no force difference, at least not in the sense of pushing off with your legs or hands. > So to give this spell a level, I look at simillar spells and compare >the effects. At first level, we have Jump and we have Feather Fall, at >third level, we have Fly and at second level, we have Levitate. I'm not >going to go through the whole process of weighing the pros and cons of each >spell, but to my mind Drift comes out to being about equal to Levitate for >pros/cons and that's why I think it should be level 2. Don't forget that OD&D DOESN'T have *Jump* or *Feather Fall* (one of the reasons I invented *Leap* and *Drift*). Also, unlike *Levitate* and *Fly*, the recipients of *Drift* will be affected by all stray air currents, which can make it significantly more difficult to manuoever -- especially if the wind is strong! > Now if you really wanted it to be a level one spell in my campaign, I >would explicitly state that the force a person can exert is reduced along >with there mass. This being the case, they can no longer use Drift like a >Jump spell. There are combat implications that I'm not going to assess to >closely, other then to say that reduced force by a factor of ten would >technically remove anyone effect by the spell from any sort of physical >combat, but you did mention 1/2 damage and I might let that go as plausable >for the situation. With all this said, I would give the spell 2/3 the >duration of feather fall (because just sitting here I've thought of a least >one way to massage the wording of the spell to get greater usage out of the >spell even with the exertable force limitation). I was really aiming for a first level spell here, but I can see that it needs to be toned down AND/OR some more significant faults need to be applied. However, I'm not fond of your exerted force suggestion because that changes the effect I had in mind. I really wanted recipients to end up looking like men on the moon, except now they also have to contend with air currents. Reducing the length of time it is active might be a good start. 1st Ed AD&D *Feather Fall* lasts for 1 segment/level (6 seconds/level). The closest approximation in OD&D is 1 round/level (10 seconds/level). Unfortunately, 1 round/level seems too limited at low levels for the effect I wanted *Drift* to have. Perhaps 5 rounds + 1 round/level instead of 6 rounds/level (1 minute/level)? 1 minute of bouncing around and only a little more as levels increase? Or maybe it could be something constant -- actually, I rather like that. Restricting the spell to always be something like 6 or 9 rounds (1 or 1-1/2 minutes) would definitely move it more towards being first level. Does anyone have other suggestions for bringing *Drift* more into line as a first level OD&D spell? ><...snip large informative discussion on Campfire...> > >Firstly, let me say thanks for the reply, you answered my questions and I >am now reasonably sure that I understand how the spell is supposed to work. >That said, I have to re-iterate that I think it is probably a second level >spell (I say probably because it is not as powerful as I previously thought >but it still is powerful enough to be considered boarderline). In this case, making it a 2nd level spell wouldn't bother me as much. The first 'core' fire-based spell is the 3rd level *Fireball* spell, so either 1st or 2nd would be an improvment. I set it to first level because the inspiration, *Affect Normal Fires*, was first level. >I actually developed my own personal solution to this sort of problem and >it is as follows: I modified Affect Normal Fires to have an alternate >effect as well as the one listed in the book; instead of using the spell to >manipulate the size and fuel consumption of a fire(s), a person can use the >spell to attempt to cause combustable materials to burst into flames. This >type of casting effectively has an instanteous duration as the magic is >spent entirely in the ignition leaving nothing left to further manipulate >the fire. Easily combustable materials, such as candle wicks, a small (few >inches of length) section of rope, oil or oil soaked materials will >automatically light (and I would usually allow muliple objects to be lit >simultaneously though not in excessive amounts (I think the most generous >I've been was to allow Kris to ignite three ropes with one casting)). >Larger ignitions such as a person's clothing, a campfire, several torches >can performed but each item attempting to be lit is allowed to make an >item's saving throw vs. normal fire to resist the ignition (this is an AD&D >thing..that may or may not translate to D&D). Should this save succeed the >item(s) in question will warm and smoulder but no actually flames will >appear. Failure to save of course ignites the item. Interesting alternative, and you have several restrictions I hadn't thought of (like allowing objects some kind of save vs. the fire). There is no direct 'object saving throw' rule in OD&D that I can think of (someone please correct me if I'm wrong) but there is a section on handling fire vs. wooden structures under the Combat chapter of the RC (p 116) that I could certainly work with. I'll give this some thought. One of the things I wanted a Mage to be able to do with *Campfire* is create a 'stealthy campfire'. Example: Say the PC's are on the run from some antagonists and are forced to camp in the woods. Normally, they would be restricted to sleeping in the cold and eating cold food because the light and/or smoke from their fire would attract attention. By using the *Campfire* spell, the mage could restrict the light output while providing warmth to the group. Of course, the smoke would still be there, but it would only be one risk instead of two, and would not matter as much if it were at night. >I complement this spell with a 2nd level spell called Ignition, which in >the hands of a low level caster can perform higher level ignition functions >of the ANF spell with ease, but then allows casters of higher levels to >increase the volumns of there fires porportionally. Eventually they would >be able to use the spell to light large bonfires, trees and wide areas of >brush, upto buildings and other large constructions. To me, that seems even higher than 2nd level, if it ultimately allows the burning of large areas. Unless there are saving throws applied here as well? I'd probably make two separate higher level spells, one that was more powerful than your version of ANF, but not as ultimately powerful as your Ignition and then make Ignition 3rd level. >The problems I have with your Campfire spell is again that it seems to have >alot of multifunctionality. To summarize your spell, it allows you to light >a fire at range, set the fuel consumption rate of that fire to possibly >nonstandard levels for a standard fire of the type lit and then allow you >to tweak the light the fire sheds for a good duration while the fire is >burning. And that it can be used upon pre-exsisting fires. I actually find >this spell hard to judge because it's not put together anywhere close to >how I would put it together. My inclination is to say that it is now >actually a powerful first level spell or a really weak second level spell. Perhaps one good restriction would be to say it can ONLY be used on pre-existing fires. Thus, it does the Mage no good unless a fire has already started. That would certainly reduce the power of the spell -- while you can increase/decrease the consumption rate and/or light output of a fire in range, you can't actually START a fire. Then I'd want to make a 2nd level fire that did allow fires to be started, but not manipulated, so a mage who knew both could start a fire with the 2nd level spell and then use the 1st level spell to manipulate it. I'd probably call the 2nd level one CAMPFIRE and come up with another name for the 1st level one. (Any suggestions?) >It is no where near in power to my Ignition spell which I admit is a strong >second level spell. Your spell is stronger then the ANF as listed in the >PHB, and probably stronger then my version of ANF as well. My problem >arises in that the spell bundles alot of useful effects together, but there >not all effects that I can see a person really wanting to use all a once >except in special circumstances. To make it a safe first level spell, I >would explicitly state that once the spell duration has ended, the fuel >consumption becomes that of a standard fire of that type. That's a very good suggestion. > I would say that it only effects one fire, I meant to imply that, but stating it explicitly couldn't hurt. >and I would say that light output is a function of >the intensity of the fire an so if you want to get the equivalent of a >light spell out of this fire fuel consumption would be adjusted accordingly >and of course if you wanted to reduce this fire to a candle light then full >consumption is adjusted accordingly. That defeats my desire for a 'stealth fire' though, so while I can see your point, I don't think I'd personally choose to use that restriction. >Oh well, > >I've spent two hours mulling over this post and I guess I'm not going to be >writing my cover letter tonight, Sorry. I certainly didn't mean to keep you from more pressing duties. :-) >Looking forward to hearing your thoughts, and again feel free to move this >discussion to the list if you'd like, Done, and Done! Jenni - -- Jenni A. M. Merrifield <==> strawberryJAMM Designs strawberry@jamm.com <==> http://www.jamm.com/jamm/ <------------------------------------------------------------------> God created Light. Then Earth, Vegetables, Animals, Man and Woman. Then God started to think: "I should create things I *like*!" And God said: "Let There Be Strawberries!" *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 24 Feb 1999 01:06:10 +0100 From: "=?ISO-8859-1?Q?Andr=E9s_Piquer_Otero?=" Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - More New OD&D Spells - ---------- > >At 08:18 PM 22/02/99 , Jenni A. M. Merrifield wrote: > >> DRIFT was loosly based on "Feather Fall", [...] I invented a TUMBLE spell for Alphatian Stage Mages (a kit idea for OD&D I previously posted to the list). It has some points in common: TUMBLE 1st Lvl Range: Touch Duration: 1 round /special Area of Effect: 1 individual This spell was devised by Alphatian actors interested in performing spectacular and dramatic "falling scenes" in theatre preformances. The spell lets the individual tumble or fall along a wall, slope or similar surface without fearing any serious damage (ie. the maximum damage sustained will be 1d6 damage, if the parameters below are met). The caster may fall 10' plus 10' for every level of experience he has attained. Nevertheless, he must be tumbling (over a slope or similar) or quite near to a solid surface (like a wall or tower). The distance to the surface begins at level 1 with 0' (ie. the caster must be touching the wall or sliding along the slope) and it increases by 5' each time the caster attains a level which can be divided by 6. Saving this, there is no limit to the inclination of the surface or to its characteristics (the spell protects against both abrasion and impact). So, the spell is quite weaker than AD&D Feather Fall: it cannot be used in the middle of nothing, as per falling from your mount in an aerial battle. Andrés *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ End of mystara-digest V1999 #100 ******************************** *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara' as the body of the message. mystara-digest Thursday, February 25 1999 Volume 1999 : Number 101 Mystara is a trademark of TSR Inc. All Rights Reserved. The following topics are covered in this digest: Re: [MYSTARA] - More New OD&D Spells [Commentary] Re: [MYSTARA] - More New OD&D Spells [MYSTARA] - Homemade OD&D Module based in Darokin RE: [MYSTARA] - Homemade OD&D Module based in Darokin RE: [MYSTARA] - Homemade OD&D Module based in Darokin Re: [MYSTARA] - OD&D Tome of Spellcraft survey, discontinued! Re: [MYSTARA] - More New OD&D Spells Re: [MYSTARA] - Carnifex Question [MYSTARA] - To Catch a Lepre...con? [MYSTARA] - Problems with the list? ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Tue, 23 Feb 1999 17:33:06 -0700 From: "Leroy Van Camp III" Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - More New OD&D Spells [Commentary] Jenni A. M. Merrifield meandered fecklessly... > Oh, as an aside, Rich uses his own, personalized AD&D > version of Mystara. > He's completly redesigned Irendi into something else. I like him already... ; ) Leroy Van Camp III malacoda@lesbois.com ICQ #20039817 "Let's show this prehistoric bitch how we do things downtown." Dr. Venkmen, Ghostbusters *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 24 Feb 1999 01:28:04 -0000 From: "Rob" Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - More New OD&D Spells > Don't forget that OD&D DOESN'T have *Jump* or *Feather Fall* (one of the >reasons I invented *Leap* and *Drift*). Also, unlike *Levitate* and *Fly*, >the recipients of *Drift* will be affected by all stray air currents, which >can make it significantly more difficult to manuoever -- especially if the >wind is strong! Hmm. That reminds me of Ride of the Wind (hey, I played an aeromancer once, so sue me :) Its a bit better than what you describe - its more like an amped version of Levitate. In fact, its identical to Levitate except that you are at the mercy of the wind. (Hmm. Thought you might have been with basic levitation as well. Ho hum) Cheerz Rob, Air Wizard of Alphatia *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 23 Feb 1999 18:03:01 -0800 From: "Jenni A. M. Merrifield" Subject: [MYSTARA] - Homemade OD&D Module based in Darokin Hello there! Many, many, /many/ moons ago, I mentioned an OD&D Module I had invented that was based in Darokin. It still needed a lot of correction after playtesting but I had asked if anyone would be interested in seeing it when it was done. Well, I've finally found the time to update and correct this module and will offer it to anyone who is interested. In order to pique your curiousity, I'm including, pretty much verbatim, the introductory and explanatory text from the beginning of the module. Contact me privately (strawberry@jamm.com) if you'd like to receive the rest. The full module is a fully formatted Word 97 document that contains all necessary maps and complete DM Notes to all areas, including boxed text to be read to the players. Unfortunately, because of all the special formatting, I can't really offer it in any other format, except maybe RTF. Jenni - -=> strawberryJAMM <=- - -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- JET BLACK by Jenni A. M. Merrifield This is a D&D Module for Characters Level 3-7 (Total Party Level between 18 and 28, with at least one Magic User or Elf capable of 3rd level spells or higher). It is based on the Adventure Synopsis "Works of Art" from TSR Gazetteer 11, The Republic Of Darokin, p56. Much of the text in the "Introduction" and in "What's Going On Here?" are quoted or paraphrased from the Adventure Synopsis, all remaining module details are by Jenni A. Merrifield. - -=-=-=-=-=-=- Introduction - -=-=-=-=-=-=- The craftsmen of Darokin are among the finest in the Known World. As such, the goods which they produce are greatly valued and highly sought after. Just When world of a new artisan of exceptional talent reaches the market place, there is often a frenzy of speculation about his or her future and a great deal of haggling over the worth of their existing pieces. It is just such and event that brings the characters face to face with a true fiend in this adventure. A female artisan by the name of Matrissa has suddenly taken the Darokin Art World by surprise. Rumours of her talent and skill for crafting magnificent stone busts has spread throughout the city. She works only in jet and produces pieces of such detail and quality that none like it has been seen in recent history. Exactly four of her works are on display at a local museum/art gallery in the city of Darokin, brought to the city by Simon Treemonsha, an Elf from Akorros, who is well known as an agent of Toney House. No other examples of her work are known to have been sold to private individuals and speculation on the eventual value of her art is high. The works on display are to be auctioned off in a few days time, and the success or failure of this auction will partially determine what will happen in the art world. The PC's either decide or are hired to make a voyage to Matrissa's home which is known to be south of Akorros. The journey to her home should have but one primary purpose: to purchase as much of her work as the characters can for as little as they can. If possible, they will also want to entice her to deal only with them (or the merchant whom they represent). Although Simon is known to be an agent of Toney House of Akorros, it is easily determined, if the right sources are asked or sent to investigate, that he is working directly on behalf of Matrissa and not on behalf of Toney House. However, he does have high hopes of his House becoming the sole distributor of her works, especially if the Auction is successful. The PC's should be asked or advised to wait to see what happens at the auction - if it fails, there is little reason to go rushing off. On the other hand, once the auction has occurred, they will have to move fast if they wish to chat with Matrissa personally before Simon returns to Akorros with the wonderful news. - -=-=-=-=-=-=- The Art Work: - -=-=-=-=-=-=- The four busts that are to be auctioned are amazingly beautiful and incredibly detailed - it seems as if every individual hair has been meticulously carved. The busts are life-size, the subjects are very beautiful, and the expressions are full of life-like depth. The subjects are two male humans, a male elf and a female human. 1. The first male human has short, wavy hair, and is looking forward with an "expressionless" expression. However, it isn't a "flat" expression, like many artists achieve, it is more as if he were a soldier remaining at attention while at his post. 2. The second human male has short straight, hair, and his head is turned about 45 degrees towards his right shoulder. His eyes are dropped so that he has a somewhat wistful expression on his face. 3. The male elf is an even more powerful and beautiful example of Matrissa's art - he has hair which looks as if it may have been waist length on the subject, but Matrissa has carved it to fit the dimensions of the bust, chopping it off just below the shoulder line. 4. The female human is the prize of the exhibit, having full, curly shoulder length hair, and a dreamy, seductive look on her beautiful face. The art will be constantly guarded, both magically and mechanically, before and during the auction. It is not recommended that thief PC's be allowed to steal any of the busts. If anyone examines the busts, they appear to be flawless jet stone, and do not radiate magic if a *detect magic* spell is cast in their vicinity. - -=-=-=-=-=-=- The Auction: - -=-=-=-=-=-=- Everyone who is anyone in the art and business world is at the auction, and anticipation is high. The Auction is a smashing success, even though Simon had set the initial bids signficantally higher than might be normally expected for a new artist. The first two (the human males) start at 2000gp, and ultimately sell for 2800gp and 3000gp. The male elf starts at a slightly higher initial bid of 2500gp and a more heated series of bidding takes it right up to 5100gp. The female also begins at the same price as the elf (2500gp), but after two or three reasonable bids, someone very important and well connected with Mauntea House (the number one Darokin Merchant House) jumps the bid by a huge amount, taking it well past the selling price of the elf (i.e 6000gp or 7000gp). This move leads to an intense bidding war between this person and a similarly important representative for Linton House (the number two Merchant House). It is left to the DM's whim who ultimately wins, but whoever it is, it ends at the astronomically outrageous sum of 10,000gp. This should put pressure on the PC's to get to Matrissa before anyone else. With returns like that, how can they go wrong (especially if they are going for themselves or have worked out some kind of "percentage deal" with the Merchants who have hired them.) - -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- What's Going On Here? - -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- (If you're not the DM, you should stop reading at this point) Although Matrissa will be a kind and charming hostess, she hides a dark secret in the cellars beneath her richly appointed manor, which is about a days ride to the south east of Akorros [on the 8 miles to the hex map of Darokin, start at Akorros and go south two hexes and then south east one hex]. Matrissa is a fairly powerful magic-user, though the manor house in which she lives appears to be rather ordinary, if remote. But behind a secret door or two, lies the heart of her great evil. In a well secluded dungeon, protected from intruders or potential escapes by numerous magical, and non-magical traps, she keeps a row of cells in which she imprisons those who will serve as "models" for her works of art. In addition, this area contains a pit which is home to a *shockingly black cockatrice*, which is like a regular Cocatrice in all respects except that its feathers and scales are a dull matte-black and it turns its victims into black jet instead of a more standard stone such as granite. When Matrissa decides to create a new sculpture, she simply arranges to "toss" one of her prisoners into the pit and waits. Once the monster has done its work, she recovers the victim and, usually, cuts the head and shoulders from the jet corpse to make a bust. Matrissa "creates" her art by the judicious use of various spells such as charm person, sleep, hold person, and telekinesis. She will coerce a subject into the position that she "envisions" and then lifts them by telekinesis into the pit. Sometimes the resulting "art work" is so pain and fear-filled that she keeps it for her "personal viewing pleasure". Simon was charmed by Matrissa and then she talked him into taking her "art" to Darokin on her behalf. Since her victims have all been from Akorros, she decided not to sell them there. She chose to use an "agent" because she didn't want to deal with the drudgery of it all - besides, she has more masterpieces just waiting to be made. Simon has since broken out of the charm. However, except for representing her on his own and not as an agent of Toney House, her suggestion would have been acceptable anyway and so he is not entirely aware that he was mentally manipulated. Now that things have gone swimmingly he expects he will convince her to give Toney House exclusive rights to handling sales of her work. Simon is not expecting anyone else to try and undermine him (he's not terribly bright for an elf...) and will spend a minimum of two full days after the Auction dealing with final arrangements before heading back to Akorros. It should also be noted that despite her manipulation, Simon still managed to get the best of the deal, because she agreed to a flat rate for each statue, if he could sell it. And while Simon set these rates quite high (they were masterful pieces of art and he is generally an honest elf), the fact that it was an auction and the unexpected bidding war on the last bust means that Simon pulled in many times the amount he must actually give to Matrissa. In fact, Simon set the minimum bids 500gp higher than what he must give her, so all he owes out of the 20,900gp is 7000gp - that's 13,900gp in his pocket!. - -=-=-=-=-=- Resolution: - -=-=-=-=-=- When the PC's confront Matrissa, they should find her to be a dangerous foe who is almost impossible to overcome. Still, with luck, they should be able to defeat her. A particularly satisfying end would be to hurl her into the cockatrice's pit where she can experience for herself the frightful death of her victims. The PC's will find that the prisoners in the cells are all very beautiful people who fell victim to Matrissa's magical lures and found themselves suddenly abducted by the evil woman. Their sadistic captor made the manner of their deaths quite clear to them and they have lived in terror that each day would be their last, sometimes while watching Matrissa "create" other "works of art". Matrissa also brought some of her "guests" up to "play" with her in her personal and very private "fun room" (a Torture Chamber) - after all, she only needed to keep their faces in perfect condition. The intense gratitude which her current prisoners will feel upon their release makes it easy for the DM to introduce one or more of them as a useful contact or romantic interest for the PC's in future games. (These NPC have been left for the DM to define as best suits their overall campaign) In addition to the treasure which they recover from looting Matrissa's home and dungeon, the PC's should receive a great deal of publicity for the rescue of the prisoners, the identification of the dead, and the return of any undamaged victims of paralysis. In Akorros, where the victims came from, they were all assumed to have been killed or abducted by some unknown person, but the lack of clues meant that the town guards were wholly unable to find any of them. Rewards from the victims' families may be provided also, at the DM's discretion, and should be determined in accordance with the specific level of the campaign. [[The rest of the module is available by request.]] - -- Jenni A. M. Merrifield <==> strawberryJAMM Designs strawberry@jamm.com <==> http://www.jamm.com/jamm/ <------------------------------------------------------------------> God created Light. Then Earth, Vegetables, Animals, Man and Woman. Then God started to think: "I should create things I *like*!" And God said: "Let There Be Strawberries!" *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 24 Feb 1999 10:18:27 +0800 From: jason.murphy@mitswa.com.au Subject: RE: [MYSTARA] - Homemade OD&D Module based in Darokin Okey dokey Jenni. I am going to have to insist on you sending me the rest of the module. :) please...please To be honest this may just fit perfectly into a campaign i am running at the moment. Thanks in advance and good work. Smilies all round Jason Murphy Software Engineer MITS Limited EMAIL: jason.murphy@mitswa.com.au PHONE: 08 9481 4066 FAX: 08 9481 4064 *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 24 Feb 1999 10:26:36 +0800 From: jason.murphy@mitswa.com.au Subject: RE: [MYSTARA] - Homemade OD&D Module based in Darokin oops sorry...that was meant to be a direct to jenni email i think. Well aint i an idiot. Jason Murphy Software Engineer MITS Limited EMAIL: jason.murphy@mitswa.com.au PHONE: 08 9481 4066 FAX: 08 9481 4064 *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 24 Feb 1999 03:39:02 EST From: Arminath@aol.com Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - OD&D Tome of Spellcraft survey, discontinued! In a message dated 2/23/99 3:01:51 AM Eastern Standard Time, geckoes@ozemail.com.au writes: << If the OD&D netbook of spells is running into these difficulties it might be better to include a preamble or endpiece as I have done with the Mystara Grimoire, stating openly the source of the spells and NOT putting any in that appeared first or only in game aids or books as opposed to magazines or third party adventures. It's quite a complex area. -Jonathan "Joe Lawyer" Nolan >> But what if the only information I included was the spell's name and the reference book? Such as: Magic Missile (TSR - Rules Cyclopedia p42) Would this be moving into a forbidden area? Jim *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 24 Feb 1999 04:03:52 EST From: Arminath@aol.com Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - More New OD&D Spells In a message dated 2/23/99 8:36:56 PM Eastern Standard Time, rmunch@easynet.co.uk writes: << Hmm. That reminds me of Ride of the Wind (hey, I played an aeromancer once, so sue me :) Its a bit better than what you describe - its more like an amped version of Levitate. In fact, its identical to Levitate except that you are at the mercy of the wind. >> If the winds are strong enough, the wind can push you if you're Levitating. *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 24 Feb 1999 12:56:59 +0100 (CET) From: =?iso-8859-1?Q?H=E5vard_R=F8nne_Faanes?= Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Carnifex Question On Fri, 19 Feb 1999, Geoff Gander wrote: > Haavard wrote; > >BTW: What *if* some Carnifex-dudes actually did escape to outer planes and > >were slightly changed by say Thanatos to make them too unrecognizable to > >be wiped out by Immortal carnifex hunters. Wouldnt that make a bunch of > >cool outer-planar monsters, huh? :) > > Now that *would* be neat! What do you suppose they would be like? Why do > you think Thanatos would do this, given that the GC threatened all > Immortals' power, including his own? He would probably make a few changes to make them a bit less powerful. However, that doesnt mean that they arent a dangerous play thing, evenm for a powerful immortal. Evil masterminds dont seem to worry too much about that, do they? :) Now these Carnoids (in lack of a better name) are on the loose in the inner and outer planes. Id suggest that ther are two variants, the Astral Carnoid and the Ethereal Carnoid. The former being the most powerful. But lets hear some ideas? What would these critters be like? Hĺvard *** Haavard R. Faanes (hoc@nvg.ntnu.no) http://www.nvg.ntnu.no/~hoc "Remember, there are no stupid questions, just stupid people." -Mr Garrison, South Park. *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 24 Feb 1999 12:50:10 EST From: Ambreville@aol.com Subject: [MYSTARA] - To Catch a Lepre...con? I just got back from a game convention in Ireland, Leprecon XX (oh my, they've already had twenty of them!?) I thought I'd drop a little note about it, just for fun. Leprecon took place in Dublin, within the grounds of Trinity College (RAH! RAH!), an establishment older than the United States -- 400+ years I'm told. Their library is worth the trip, trust me. When I was invited to go, I immediately imagined Guinness drinkers galore, skinheads, and colorful, body-piercing, mohawk-wearing punkies. This came from a report I saw on TV about youth in Ireland a few years ago. It must all have been a shameless plot by the American Tourism Lobby to disinform the clue less American traveler. From what I could see, the above-described persons (if any) made a point to dress up for LARP games and that, honestly, the Con really looked like your basic fun & games event in beautiful and exotic midwest USA! Nope, not a wee drop o'Guinness or Whiskey to be found on site. Not even the slightest cigarette butt to kick around. Trinity College would not approve. Wow. That was a shock! I remember Euro GenCon being more of the former than the latter, which had its own sort of charm except you couldn't breathe from the smoke. I had a grand time at Leprecon. It wasn't a huge convention, but it certainly had enough to keep an honest gamer busy. And... I'm not lying when I say that at least 5% of all gamers who attended were devout Mystara players. Naturally, I was invited to join a party of adventurers trying to retrieve a certain blue knife and an imprisoned kobold from the Tower of Sighs in Glantri City. We had the pleasure of running into a certain Lady Hillsbury, who at the time was the head of the Glantrian Constabulary. We attended a party at no less than Prince Gorevitch-Woszlany's mansion, in a plot to swap kobold for political intrigue, also involving a fierce-looking and rather intimidating werewolf-firemage-follower-of-Rad-apprentice-immortal and-M1-Abrams-prototype (I think) and a trip to the Court of Miracles. Between the noise in the room, the predominant Irish accent (muddled with a vaguely Scottish twang, mind you), and happily munching upon genuine Irish milk chocolate strewn about the table, I tried to follow the storyline without sounding like a total idiot. I think it worked, although I wonder if they laughed for the same things I did! Then I played a little adventure designed for the occasion, where everyone was a Heldannic Knight on a warbird. Picture a game where the DM is this Frenchman tawkin' American (at least trying to), with a truly fake and overdone German accent, while the players, true and proud Irish folks (except for the one Scottish immigrant), also trying to speak with a truly fake and equally overdone German accent. We never had the time to finish the adventure, but it did take them a while to rid themselves of this Teuton-jive afterward. At least in this I prevailed! I also played in a table-top miniatures game depicting a cool pacific island. Here we are in what appears to be a 1950's SF B-Movie, where Doktor von Braun has discovered what appears to be a crashed UFO. He's on the island with his daughter and his assistant, studying the... (suddenly we hear screams on the radio, crashing sounds, machine guns firing, and the radio goes dead...) Aha... So, knowing the commies are everywhere, waiting for an occasion to get their filthy hands on this new technology, the president orders the marines in. So here we are, eight players standing at one end of the table with eight landing crafts filled with marines, mortars, flame throwers, bazookas, and tanks, proudly storming the beaches. Almost immediately, it's evident that the UFOs' radiation altered the island's wildlife, as triffids and giant spiders, lizards, and other horrors begin attacking our poor marines. Half-way through the scenario, War of the World-like flying saucers begin to pop up, disintegrating anything that moves.. Yikes. We find Herr Doktor, retreat toward the beaches, dodge the giant bats, the quicksands, and the giant alligators, and try to board *the* landing craft. Only one was needed since everyone else had died horribly on this forsaken island. Oh no! The alien death machine vaporized the doctor's daughter! That's all right, says one player. She's expandable! We flee toward the landing craft, fighting back the giant snapping turtles. Two mortar units had already clambered on board just when one of the alien death machines appears over the coconut trees and turns the landing craft into this much loose molecules. The doctor and the last few remnants of the mighty marines desperately try to contact the task force. Roll a six, roll a six, we all shout with glee! HE ROLLS A SIX! HURRAY! WE HAVE CONTACT! The fleet fires a heavy gun barrage upon the alien death machine and sends another landing craft. ...but, wait. Oh no! The gleaming alien machine atop its long spidery legs walks out of the storm of fire and smoke. It is unharmed. It stops. It scans. It fires its death ray. Everyone ducks. Please no, not the barge! But Corporal Hank and his guys buy it and their pitiful shadows remain on the beach, scorched upon the harsh coral. At last, the survivors reach the landing craft and flee at sea! The good guys win again! The end... Well, not quite yet. There were more games and even though the place had to close by 7pm (the college rules), then it was off to dinner and the ubiquitous pub. This was a great convention. Games are always fun, but in truth it's really the people who make it so. I did not catch a leprechaun but I did indeed find a pot of gold. I tip my hat to my hosts and say thanks to them all from the bottom of my heart! :o) Bruce Heard *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 25 Feb 1999 03:09:24 EST From: Arminath@aol.com Subject: [MYSTARA] - Problems with the list? Have I been bumped off or is the last day just very slow? Jim *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ End of mystara-digest V1999 #101 ******************************** *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara' as the body of the message. mystara-digest Thursday, February 25 1999 Volume 1999 : Number 102 Mystara is a trademark of TSR Inc. All Rights Reserved. The following topics are covered in this digest: Re: [MYSTARA] - Problems with the list? Re: [MYSTARA] - Problems with the list? RE: [MYSTARA] - Problems with the list? [MYSTARA] - Introductions RE: [MYSTARA] - Introductions Re: [MYSTARA] - Problems with the list? [MYSTARA] - CUSTOM: STRANGERS IN TOWN Re: [MYSTARA] - Introductions Re: [MYSTARA] - Problems with the list? [MYSTARA] - MYSTARA: CUSTOM: fiction: was: what's wrong with the list? Re: [MYSTARA] - CUSTOM: STRANGERS IN TOWN Re: [MYSTARA] - Introductions Re: [MYSTARA] - Introductions Re: [MYSTARA] - CUSTOM: STRANGERS IN TOWN Re: [MYSTARA] - Homemade OD&D Module based in Darokin RE: [MYSTARA] - Entropy Sphere (was Introductions) Re: [MYSTARA] - Entropy Sphere (was Introductions) Re: [MYSTARA] - Entropy Sphere (was Introductions) [MYSTARA] - World in Flames RE: [MYSTARA] - World in Flames Re: [MYSTARA] - CUSTOM: STRANGERS IN TOWN [MYSTARA] - OD&D spell stuff [LONG] ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Thu, 25 Feb 1999 03:16:00 EST From: GlobalFrog@aol.com Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Problems with the list? Seems to be veeeeeeeeery slow One Eye *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 25 Feb 1999 02:22:37 -0600 From: "Timothy R. Haney" Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Problems with the list? Arminath@aol.com wrote: > > Have I been bumped off or is the last day just very slow? Very slow. - -- Timothy R. Haney galwylin@airnet.net The Tome of Galwylin - http://www.airnet.net/galwylin/ Galwylin's Bookshop - http://www.airnet.net/galwylin/bookshop/ *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 25 Feb 1999 09:44:21 +0100 From: Kristian Kramer Subject: RE: [MYSTARA] - Problems with the list? I t h i n k t h e r e i s s o m e t h i n g w r o n g W i T h t H e S e r V e R K r issss t i an *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 25 Feb 1999 10:14:51 +0100 From: "Jacob Skytte" Subject: [MYSTARA] - Introductions Hi there. I'm new to this list, so I was wondering if anybody could fill me in on recent events/discussions. I've seen a few posts regarding OD&D?!? And what is new on the Almanacs? Will they be continued beyond AC 1015??? Thanks in advance. Jacob; Denmark Jacob Skytte Skytte@virgil.ruc.dk *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 25 Feb 1999 12:25:16 +0100 From: Kristian Kramer Subject: RE: [MYSTARA] - Introductions Hi Jacob, Welcome to the list!! This last week we had discussions on the following topics: New OD&D spells (by Jenni Merrifield) A discussion about Vecna (and some (semi-)related topics) A very very long discussion about the Entropy sphere (whether it is evil or not) When did the Hin (halflings) 'arrive'? Elf Magic Missile of Slaying And many more. Here's a link where you can find old messages: Shawn's page at http://www.geocities.com/TimesSquare/5304/ Oh, and you might want to check out the FAQ: http://www.geocities.com/TimesSquare/Lair/8932/Mystara/mystfaq.html (by Hervé Musseau) About OD&D, from the FAQ: Q: Also you mentionned something about D&D not being AD&D. What does that mean? A: Mystara was the world designed to be used with the rules of D&D (often called OD&D to better distinct it from AD&D and from the generic term D&D which could mean both; OD&D stands for Old D&D or Original D&D) - note that some few people call it BD&D for Basic D&D to distinguish it from even older rules). It appeared in the old boxed rules: the Expert box, the Companion box and the Master box. Most of the earlier modules designed for D&D were set in this world. Recently, however, Mystara has been converted to AD&D (along with Red Steel), but many people who play in Mystara do it with the old rules (or their reedition, Rules Cyclopedia). Enjoy your stay!! Kristian Kramer *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 26 Feb 1999 01:08:42 +1100 (EST) From: "Jonathan Nolan, Barrister & Solicitor, FTIA" Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Problems with the list? > Have I been bumped off or is the last day just very slow? > > Jim > *************************************************************************** Didn't you notice that weird mist outside your house last night? Welcome to the Mistara Mailfist, in downtown Barovia! Yes, that's right, you've been claimed by the mists of TSRloft for daring to list their arcane arts! :) *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 26 Feb 1999 01:15:07 +1100 (EST) From: "Jonathan Nolan, Barrister & Solicitor, FTIA" Subject: [MYSTARA] - CUSTOM: STRANGERS IN TOWN Now that Alphatia went glub glub glub, I decided to let some other planars bleed into Mystara in a small way, if they die they die, if they thrive they thrive. First up were a group of Red Wizards. Thayvians are just a barrel of laughs all round, so I am developing them in the borderlands between Sind proper and Darokin, above the Malpheggi swamp. There aren't many of them, they have fled interdimensionally after some sort of climactic final battle against the Elminster androids or whatever that limb of Satan uses for his stormtroopers now that the Harper book series er I mean organisation is gone. The Thayvians have a blood-red tower and some undead lackeys. I have some ideas for ongoing campaign themes, but I want to have the Thayvian arrival be a modern version of Alphatia or Flaem, within reason. What will happen from there, oh fellow scions of the list? I ask for your opinions. "dust thou art, to dust returnest, was not spoken of the soul" - -------------------------------------------------------------------- * * Jonathan Nolan FTIA - International Law practice call 618 89310176 * * - -------------------------------------------------------------------- *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 25 Feb 1999 16:33:28 +0100 (CET) From: =?iso-8859-1?Q?H=E5vard_R=F8nne_Faanes?= Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Introductions On Thu, 25 Feb 1999, Jacob Skytte wrote: > Hi there. Hei, and welcome to the list! > I'm new to this list, so I was wondering if anybody could fill me in > on recent events/discussions. I've seen a few posts regarding OD&D?!? Kristian Kramer did a good job on that. OD&D topics show up from time to time. Lately there has been alot of spells and a few monsters. I have a bunch of monsters around somewhere myself that ill be posting when I find time. > And what is new on the Almanacs? Will they be continued beyond AC > 1015??? I'm not part of the almanac crew, but last thing i heard they had plans for an almanac for 1016. If you can't wait, check out Bruce Heards World in Flames alternative timeline for AC1010-1020. Hĺvard Haavard R. Faanes (hoc@nvg.ntnu.no) http://www.nvg.ntnu.no/~hoc "Remember, there are no stupid questions, just stupid people." -Mr Garrison, South Park. *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 25 Feb 1999 11:04:25 -0500 From: Sharon Dornhoff Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Problems with the list? >> Have I been bumped off or is the last day just very slow? >> >> Jim Midterms, maybe...? I know I haven't had so much time to post, this week, and maybe others are equally swamped. :-/ *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 26 Feb 1999 03:26:52 +1100 (EST) From: "Jonathan Nolan, Barrister & Solicitor, FTIA" Subject: [MYSTARA] - MYSTARA: CUSTOM: fiction: was: what's wrong with the list? From the 1999 KW Almanac apocrypha: It's no doubt a combination of the events of Kaldmont and Nuwmont, combining to produce after-effects up until now, just after the recent eclipse of the sun by Matera... The DM's notes for the current week indicate that all scrying and information devices including crystal balls and babbage engines will fall silent, in accordance with the prophecies of Sumadartson the Seer of New Averoigne. Just after this loss of wizardly contact between kingdoms, the situation in New Kolland and the newly independent region of Ovosok conspire to plunge the Known World into pandemic warfare, as the Alliance of the North Star Treaty between Karameikos, Darokin and Thyatis leads to them being drawn into a peacekeeping role in Ovosok only to discover that the wily renegade baron Starvik Milosen planned all along to wage guerilla warfare against the peacekeepers. This leads to warfare as predicted by Sumadartson, "In the year after the Emperor's Crowning 1999 in the seventh month, From the skies will come an Immortal paymaster He will reinvigorate the Humanoid King. Before and after, War reigns happily." Without serious intervention by heroes or demigods, the situation is grim for Known World civilisation - after centuries of ethnic intolerance towards humanoids and demihumans, the Last Days may be at hand... 'Don't be asleep when The Time comes... for the Day of the Immortals cometh as a thief in the night...' ... "If to be fair is to be beautiful," said the Clown, "who can compare with me with my white face?" "who can compare with me," asked Death beside her, "for I am paler still." "You are very beautiful," sighed the Clown, turning her powdered face from the mirror. -Richard Chambers, 'The King in Yellow' ... - -Jonathan "go to bed and stop being such a weird bastard" Nolan *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 25 Feb 1999 11:30:34 -0500 From: Sharon Dornhoff Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - CUSTOM: STRANGERS IN TOWN >Now that Alphatia went glub glub glub, I decided to let some other planars >bleed into Mystara in a small way, if they die they die, if they thrive >they thrive. My money's on "die": those danged Thayvians never do anything right. ;-) >The Thayvians have a blood-red tower and some undead lackeys. How many Red Wizards are we talking about, here? What levels? This would have a big effect on whether they live or die -- if they're wimps, established Mystaran mages from Glantri or other places might try to subjugate them and learn their nifty, alien FR-magics; if they kick butt, the opposite might happen. Also, could they have brought some undead-types with them, that don't exist on Mystara? And have they found out, yet, that the "liege" rules of the oD&D setting allow more-powerful undead (heh heh heh...!) to take control of their lackeys away from them? >I have some ideas for ongoing campaign themes, but I want to have the >Thayvian arrival be a modern version of Alphatia or Flaem, within reason. That's actually an interesting analogy. Certainly, a MAJOR immigration from another world might help to fill in the power-vaccuum left by Alphatia's sinking. But it sounds like you've got something small-scale in mind.... hmmmmm. For that matter, we might also toss around the idea of an "invasion" by otherplanar strangers-in-town, who AREN'T mega-mages. There could be equally-great upheavals caused by the arrival of clerics of a new religion - -- maybe one that insists on calling its Immortals "gods", if you're using other TSR worlds for source material ;-D -- or even by a flood of 0-level peasent refugees who haven't a weapon or copper piece to their names ... not a one, in all 500,000 of them! >What will happen from there, oh fellow scions of the list? >I ask for your opinions. Again, the outcome of the Thayvians' arrival will depend on how powerful you're planning to make them. Whether or not they can find native guides - -- a local lich, perhaps, since you've got them hanging with the undead already? -- to enlighten them about Mystara's political situation and magic will also have a big effect on what sorts of trouble these Red Wizards can cause/get into. If they were smart, they'd lay low for several years while gathering as much information as they can about their new world ... but, being Thayvians, they'll probably blow it and try to grab themselves a power-base too soon, BEFORE they know who's going to get ticked off about their ham-handed ambitions. As for Mystarans' initial reaction to the Thayvians, they'll probably just mistake these jokers for more "leftover" Alphatian mages, who'd been stranded by their continent's sinking! Sure, there'd be quirky things about the newcomers -- always shaving their heads bald, for one thing; and their ridiculous, coy pretense that they don't even understand the Alphatian language! -- but it'll still take some doing for the Thayvians to disavow the yokels of this misconception. Every Mystaran EXPECTS Alphatians to act weird and exhibit odd affectations, after all. :-) *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 25 Feb 1999 11:33:51 -0500 From: Sharon Dornhoff Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Introductions >> And what is new on the Almanacs? Will they be continued beyond AC >> 1015??? > >I'm not part of the almanac crew, but last thing i heard they had plans >for an almanac for 1016. If you can't wait, check out Bruce Heards World >in Flames alternative timeline for AC1010-1020. Note that "World in Flames" ISN'T a preview of future editions of the Net-Almanacs. It's something Bruce Heard made up independently, as yet another possible future for Mystara; upcoming Almanacs will follow an entirely different one. :-) *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 25 Feb 1999 11:52:09 EST From: Arminath@aol.com Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Introductions In a message dated 2/25/99 4:19:34 AM Eastern Standard Time, SKYTTE@virgil.ruc.dk writes: << Hi there. I'm new to this list, so I was wondering if anybody could fill me in on recent events/discussions. I've seen a few posts regarding OD&D?!? And what is new on the Almanacs? Will they be continued beyond AC 1015??? Thanks in advance. Jacob; Denmark Jacob Skytte >> Welcome to ye Jacob! Here all that is Mystara (and a few things that are not) may be discussed freely and openly, sometimes to hot debate. Tis an interesting bunch to be found here, and mighty entertaining to boot! As for your comment on finding OD&D material here, all I can tell ye is that whether we play OD&D or AD&D, our beloved world is Mystara. So come in and hang ye're cloak by the door and mayhap we can get ye to share a few tales from ye're old campfires with us? Arminath Wynter, resident Shadow Elf lurker ;-) *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 25 Feb 1999 11:06:03 -0600 From: "James Ruhland" Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - CUSTOM: STRANGERS IN TOWN > I have some ideas for ongoing campaign themes, but I want to have the > Thayvian arrival be a modern version of Alphatia or Flaem, within reason. > > What will happen from there, oh fellow scions of the list? > I ask for your opinions. > Well it depends. I assume you've got them skulking around Darokin's borderlands. IMO, they should be circumspect (tough for a Red Wizard) for awhile, establishing themselves. Since they're on Mystara you might permit them to evidence more brains than they were given credit for having on Toril. Instead of having them immediately hostile to Darokin, have them "offer to help" Darokin. Make Darokin reliant on them. The Red Wizards could be hostile to Hosadus/Hule (even for real reasons. After all, world-conquering dudes have mutually-exclusive programs). While the Wizards are "helping" Darokin they can build a sureptitious organization, recruiting pawns and dupes. If the Wizards play things right, they can be top dog in a "liberated" Sind (perhaps afiliating with the Black Raja of Jaibul, perhaps bumping him off). This would give them a power base from which to operate from. Or/and they could work hand in glove with Synn in Glantri. Establish a Red Wizard Principality (Glantri's full of freaks, so what's one more group?) They could work to exploit the resources of that big plateau/escarpment to the northwest, using it as a recruiting ground for whatever shock-troops you think are appropriate. Eventually Synn and the R.W's interests will conflict. Then you can either have Glantri push the R-W's up atop that plateau (as a new nation for your campaign, ultimately) or have the R-W's end up dominating Glantri. Just a couple ideas. *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 25 Feb 1999 11:32:59 -0800 From: "Jenni A. M. Merrifield" Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Homemade OD&D Module based in Darokin Well, the response for my Module has been overwhelming! Also, among the many private replies I got Herve sent the following: At 10:21 AM 2/25/99 CET, Herve Musseau wrote: >Maybe you'd even be willing to put it on an online site? I'm sure Shawn >or anyone else (including me) would be happy to publish your module on >their site. Well Duh! Am I a silly-bunny or what. I already have a very small Mystara page at my site -- I put it up mainly as the store for the MOrient project files after our original site had to shut down. So, I've just uploaded zipped version of both an MS-Word 97 and RTF document there. So feel free to grab it from http://www.jamm.com/mystara/index.html Also, if you are one of the few early repliers that I already sent the file to, you might want to grab it again -- I noticed a few errors which have been corrected. Jenni - -- Jenni A. M. Merrifield <==> strawberryJAMM Designs strawberry@jamm.com <==> http://www.jamm.com/jamm/ <------------------------------------------------------------------> God created Light. Then Earth, Vegetables, Animals, Man and Woman. Then God started to think: "I should create things I *like*!" And God said: "Let There Be Strawberries!" *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 25 Feb 1999 16:45:23 -0500 (EST) From: Brad McMillan Subject: RE: [MYSTARA] - Entropy Sphere (was Introductions) At 12:25 PM 2/25/99 +0100, you wrote: >A very very long discussion about the Entropy sphere (whether it is evil or >not) I haven't been following this discussion until this statement was pointed out in the Introductions post (for Jacob Skytte), recently. It kind of surprises me that a discussion based on whether or not the Sphere of Entropy is evil has going on to such lengths. Now, this may have been said already by someone in the thread. I may be agreeing or disagreeing with many of you when I say, in my rather Zen like way, that Entropy simply -is-. Entropy is not evil. Entropy merely serves a purpose, like any other Sphere. In fact, if one were to say that Entropy was "evil", it must be said that the rest of the Sphere's are evil as well, since they each resist some natural process of existance; each Sphere resists each other in some way. Examples can be given then to easily support that all the Sphere's are "evil". I am assuming that when Entropy is being considered as evil it is with the mind that there are demon or devil like immortals or images within it, as well as the idea that destruction and death - two main principles of Entropy, but not the only ones - are somehow inherently evil. I say they are merely concepts. Ideologies. Of course, at the same time, evil itself is merely a point of view. Again, an ideology. So it can then be said that evil is in the eye of the beholder (Beholder? hehe). A matter of personal growth and cultural beliefs. In practice, evil, by perspective, is expressed through the actions of others in relation to the person perceiving the event. In other words, actions speak louder than words. The effect of 'evil' is a matter of one's upbringing alone. When we look back at the Immortals in Entropy now we must remember and understand that they perceive the universe on a much broader level than mortals can/do. Also, upon ascension, the new Immortal becomes aware that they represent not only a Sphere, but an ideal; serving a purpose in the grand skeme of existance. Although the Immortals in Entropy represent Entropy through their actions, they themselves may be deemed as 'evil' beings through the eyes of others, again, in relation to the perceivers upbringing. As a whole, the combined existance of all Entropic Immortals defines the Sphere of Entropy, and the Sphere itself is not evil, but represents a key link in the order and balance of existance...of Mystara. Anyways, I hope that helps. :) Brad. - --------------------------------------------------------------------------- Brad McMillan/Brude Mac a'Mhaoilein "Armchair" Celtic Archae-Anthropologist & Historian Goderich, Ontario, Canada Email: bmcmillan@odyssey.on.ca ICQ: 27482438 Homepage: http://members.tripod.com/~B_McMillan/index.html (Under Construction!) - ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 25 Feb 1999 17:16:59 -0600 From: "James Ruhland" Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Entropy Sphere (was Introductions) > Entropy is not evil. Entropy merely serves a purpose, like any > other Sphere. > Recognizing the danger of dredging up the old discussion, I'd just like to say that IMO their is a difference between the Sphere itself (which, like you said, just is: it isn't evil, or good. It just acts as a natural force) and the type of people who are willing to serve the Sphere as Immortals (not typically your nice, constructive, works-well-with-others type dudes). *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 25 Feb 1999 17:35:58 -0600 From: "Timothy R. Haney" Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Entropy Sphere (was Introductions) James Ruhland wrote: > > > Entropy is not evil. Entropy merely serves a purpose, like any > > other Sphere. > > > Recognizing the danger of dredging up the old discussion, I'd just like to > say that IMO their is a difference between the Sphere itself (which, like > you said, just is: it isn't evil, or good. It just acts as a natural force) > and the type of people who are willing to serve the Sphere as Immortals > (not typically your nice, constructive, works-well-with-others type dudes). I admit to getting a small chuckle when that popped up. Timing is everything, no? :) - -- Timothy R. Haney galwylin@airnet.net The Tome of Galwylin - http://www.airnet.net/galwylin/ Galwylin's Bookshop - http://www.airnet.net/galwylin/bookshop/ *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 26 Feb 1999 00:20:16 +0000 From: Michael K Jones Subject: [MYSTARA] - World in Flames Anyone out there know where the world in Flames stuff is? I believe it's on the Mystra newsgroup. If anyone knows the address, I'd be very happy :-) Flossy *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 26 Feb 1999 08:34:49 +0800 From: jason.murphy@mitswa.com.au Subject: RE: [MYSTARA] - World in Flames > Anyone out there know where the world in Flames stuff is? > > I believe it's on the Mystra newsgroup. > > If anyone knows the address, I'd be very happy :-) > > Flossy > > [MURPHY Jason] Stop it!!!...You people are confusing me. I am on another mailing list specifically for World in Flames, and it has nothing to do with Mystara. My poor brain just cant deal with the confusion. :) okokok, i am sure i will come to grips with it. Jason Murphy Software Engineer MITS Limited EMAIL: jason.murphy@mitswa.com.au PHONE: 08 9481 4066 FAX: 08 9481 4064 *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 26 Feb 1999 01:13:58 +0100 From: "=?ISO-8859-1?Q?Andr=E9s_Piquer_Otero?=" Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - CUSTOM: STRANGERS IN TOWN > > Now that Alphatia went glub glub glub, I decided to let some other planars > bleed into Mystara in a small way, if they die they die, if they thrive > they thrive. > Nice idea for people who enjoy several campaign worlds and like playing some "cross-overs". I thought of a queer plot: What about a group of powerful Wizards of High Sorcery from Krynn (the DL campaign) who, after their world being depleted of magic in the Summer of Chaos, manage to enter the Void thanks to an ancient artifact ? Perhaps they will be drawn to Mystara by the latent power of the Radiance. I would Love seeing them in Glantri: they would be powerful mages, of course, but their ethos and customs would be completely out-of-place in Mystara (especially Glantri): Dragonlance is the most "epic" "good vs. evil" "black or white" campaign. How could they survive in a world where a werewolf is one of the good guys, people can become Immortal (in Krynn, only two people attempted that and failed) and even the climate is inverted (Ansalon is in the South Hemisphere and the Old World is in the North), etc, etc...? I think it would be great fun to have this mages build a dominion in Glantri only to mess things up with good intentions. (perhaps they could even think that Dolores Hillsbury is an Avatar of the Dark Queen, and start a campaign of propaganda and paranoia). Think of a bunch of guys trying to start a "War of the Lance" in our Machiavelian lands of Mystara... Just day-dreaming Andrés *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 26 Feb 1999 02:35:24 +0100 From: "=?ISO-8859-1?Q?Andr=E9s_Piquer_Otero?=" Subject: [MYSTARA] - OD&D spell stuff [LONG] I have come upon some ideas which could be contributed to the OD&D Tome of Spells project, so I will post them to the list as time and PhD let me: (BTW, I think that this is also a practical campaign use to reinterpreting the theory of the spheres, as I told James some time ago). THE ALPHATIAN ART OF MAGICK 1. After going over and over through DotE and GAZ3 I have found that Glantri has quite a detailed "particular" spell system, but that Alphatia, the Empire of Magic, does not display a special set of magical tradition and powerful crafts (the sourcebook only gives some new spells that, mostly, could also be general knowledge in the KW). I really do not like this view, because, as I think magic should work, the magical power of a culture comes from their access to secret lore, not just from the number of 36th lvl mages who belong to the nation. 2. Reading the GAZs and other Mystara material, we get the impression that the most powerful and distinctive magics from the KW are in fact alien in origin: * Alphatian magic (mostly Followers of Air from Old Alphatia) * Glantrian Flaems (Followers of Fire from Old Alphatia) * Radiance Magic (the Nucleus of the Spheres from Federation Starship) * Averoignese Magic (as brought by the D'Ambrevilles and Madame de Sephora) 3. There are, nevertheless, magics which appear in Mystara from the beginning of sentient races: * Blackmoor Magic (apart from Technomancy) * Elvish Magic * other nations prominent in magic powers, like the Nithians. 4. So, I got the idea of dividing magic in two: High Magic and Low Magic: * Low Magic is the standard OD&D spell system: thanks to some natural aptitudes, experiment and practice, the mage learns formulae which allow him to tap the energies which permeate the world and get some tangible results. *High Magic delves into the nature of the force beyond this mundane energy: the Spheres. IMO, I think that this knowledge was only reached by two cultures in Mystara, both of them alien: Alphatians (including Flaems) and people from Old Averoigne (which for the moment I will not explain, as I am centering myself on Alphatia). So, High Magic may trascend the limited power of simple spells and reach the direct powers of the Spheres "behind the curtain", BUT it also requires some commitment: as Spheres oppose, consecrating oneself to one path excludes the others. [My invention of Alphatian Old Magic is developed upon RW traditions of Gnosticism, Hermeticisms and Qabbalah, as well as some Taosim and hermodinamics, but everything is changed and fantasy-altered to fit OD&D patterns, so do not expect scholarly precision!] 5. The Paths of the Spheres were discovered by the Old Alphatians via a combination of intellectual research and mystical experiences. This made them grow powerful and conquer whole worlds, but it also caused society to polarize into factions: the well-known Followers of Air and Fire, the less-known Followers of Earth and Water and the nearly unknown Followers of the Shell (see below). a fact which ultimately brought about the end of Old Alphatian civilization. 6. The Paths of the Spheres (DARKE SEPHIROT in Old Alphatian) are expressed in an old text, "The Book of Infinites" (SIPPARUM DE-AINE SOFIM). Here follow some passages [notes appear in brackets]: * Before the Beginning was the No-Begining and it wandered the BELIMA [Void] and in the Void expanded. [This No-Beginning surprasses and antecedes any Sphere. Some wise Alpahtian mages -most of them now Immortal- suppose that this No-Beginning is related to the Old Ones] *As it expanded and rotated, it took the form of one Sphere, burning and dry. And it held the power of the No-Beginning, and its name was HAYL, which is Energy. [the first Emanation is the Sphere of Energy. It is the full power concentrated before the existence of the Multiverse] *But HAYL could not be confinated unto limits, for it came from the No-Beginning, which limit has not, and as it spun it expanded and gave birth to another Sphere, the second: its name was MABUN, which is THOUGHT. And MABUN tried to set a path to the ardour of Energy. [The Sphere of Thought. As Energy is unable to exist per-se eternally, it emanates a consciousness which sets an order to its expansion] *And MABUN emanated another Sphere, ZABNO, which is the River of Time, so that Energy and Thought could fare together for all eternity. [Time. At this moment, the relationship cause-effect is made possible: enrhy bends itself to a path and Thought puts the initiative to the change processes happening] *But the high of HAYL should be abased, for if change would not be, all would return to No-Beginning. And MABUN took HAYL to cool along the path of ZABNO and it got hard and cold and so was born QUSSOYO, which is Matter. [The last Sphere: Enenrgy transforms itself freely into it. At this stage, Energy and Matter could transform into each other freely moved by Thought and following the line of Time - time is here reversible, which now "fixed time arrow". But thinks won't be so perfect for long] *But the four Spheres, infinite as the were and will be, could not hold the Glory of the No-Beginning, and their shells broke and their cores were drift asunder and the shells were driven in bits and pieces to the heart of the Void and some of them were lured to the call of their mothers striving outwards from the center of the Void and they took to their image like faces on wrinkling waters. [As the fracture happens, some bits of the Spheres merge, touch and oppose; as this happens, the Astral, Elemental, Ethereal, and Prime Planes are born. This is ruled by proximity to the original Sphere: _ Astral: is a rest of the Void subject to the emanation of shell fragments from all the Spheres _ Elemental: Further from the Spheres than the Astral, but more orientated to a Sphere than to others (Energy-Fire, Air-Thought, Water-Time, Earth-Matter) _ Ethereal: A region of the Void subject to emanation to the Elemental Planes _ Prime: the center of the Void, a balanced mixture of all Spheres]. *But as the Shells condensed and churned, they drew the line of SHIUR [Limit]. And then was the Beginning; and Beginning called to SOF [End], and SOF brought Wear to Energy, Silence to Thought, Direction to Time and Death to Matter; the Bigger QELIPPAH [Shell] to hold Them; so that they would not grow again and with shards the Creation smother. [This concise lines describe the start of Entropy: it is a Shell which contains the ohter Spheres. Its main effect is putting an arrow to Time, so that NOTHING IS REVERSIBLE. Spent Energy is spent Energy. That means that, some day, the degradation of spheres into "parts of the SHELL" will make the Multiverse end. But many Alphatians interpreted this as a return to the No-Beginning, as the conversion of the whole of the Spheres into "Shards of the Limit", would mean that there is No-Limit, starting a new cycle. Others think differently. I will resume their postures: 1. Those that think of QELIPPAH (Entropy) as a natural process which favours renovation inot a new cycle. 2. Those which think that the victory of QELIPPAH wil bring an end to all existence (eternal stagnation) and oppose it. 3. Those which do not care of the End, but staunchly support an Sphere to gain power (like Immortality) 4. Those psycho guys who think of the End like a desirable thing, for it will destroy everything they hate. Which one is right? It is up to you as DM. As far as I know, no D&D campaign has gone as far as reaching the end of a Multiverse cycle (the longest I run, not in Mystara, lasted for 100 game years), so, PCs may only guess...] This is my first par, a theory of the basis behind Alphatian Magic. More on schools and game mechanics in following postings (if you are interested). Andrés *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ End of mystara-digest V1999 #102 ******************************** *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara' as the body of the message. mystara-digest Saturday, February 27 1999 Volume 1999 : Number 103 Mystara is a trademark of TSR Inc. All Rights Reserved. The following topics are covered in this digest: Re: [MYSTARA] - Introductions Re: [MYSTARA] - Introductions Re: [MYSTARA] - Introductions RE: [MYSTARA] - Introductions Re: [MYSTARA] - CUSTOM: STRANGERS IN TOWN Re: [MYSTARA] - CUSTOM: STRANGERS IN TOWN Re: [MYSTARA] - Introductions Re: [MYSTARA] - CUSTOM: STRANGERS IN TOWN Re: [MYSTARA] - OD&D spell stuff [LONG] RE: [MYSTARA] - Introductions RE: [MYSTARA] - Entropy Sphere (was Introductions) RE: [MYSTARA] - World in Flames Re: [MYSTARA] - World in Flames Re: [MYSTARA] - World in Flames Re: [MYSTARA] - Introductions Re: [MYSTARA] - CUSTOM: STRANGERS IN TOWN Re: [MYSTARA] - OD&D spell stuff [LONG] Re: [MYSTARA] - CUSTOM: STRANGERS IN TOWN Re: [MYSTARA] - World in Flames [MYSTARA] - A journey to the past Re: [MYSTARA] - Introductions Re: [MYSTARA] - Mapping Question Re: [MYSTARA] - Day of Dread: Floating Ar ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Thu, 25 Feb 1999 20:46:44 -0500 (EST) From: Kevin Turner Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Introductions On Thu, 25 Feb 1999, Jacob Skytte wrote: > Hi there. > > I'm new to this list, so I was wondering if anybody could fill me in > on recent events/discussions. I've seen a few posts regarding OD&D?!? Well. Welcome to the fold, Jacob. Some recent events have included a nifty discussion about the Carnifex, a really cool thread about Vecna, and much discussion on heredeties of various Mystara races. As for OD&D, you'll see it a lot. Myself, I play a strange combination of Basic and Advanced, so I'm not totally familiar with a lot of the histories and Gazetteers that they talk about. But your opinion is always welcome, and feel free to stick your foot in your mouth at any time...I do on a consistent basis. And I'm still here. :-) Cheers, - --Frobozz-- *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 25 Feb 1999 20:34:56 -0600 From: "Rob Brooks" Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Introductions Hi there all, I'm new to the group as well. I've been lurking around for a bit over a week now, and I do beleive I might have gotten myself on the wrong list. I figured while introductions were already going around, now would be the best time to look a bit less foolish. Most everything that I've seen has been related to the original basic D&D, with a tad hint of some first edition advanced. I personally am about three weeks away from kicking off a Karameikos 2nd Ed. AD&D campaign and came here looking for a bit more background for the social interaction between the various kingdoms of the known world. From what I've seen here, there are alot of conflicts between the histories issued in the boxed set I have and the groups general discussions. Just a simple yes or no will suffice, but am I in the wrong place? No need to flame my choice of rules, after 12 years playing I think I like the 2nd Ed. a bit better, and if indeed a third edition is released I'll probably switch to that one too. Thank you for your time, Rob B. *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 25 Feb 1999 19:50:52 -0600 From: Aaron E Nowack Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Introductions >And what is new on the Almanacs? Will they be continued beyond AC >1015??? Absolutely. The 1016 Almanac is entering the editing stage (or at least parts of it are). Aaron Nowack "Never let reality get in the way of a good hypothesis." http://www.geocities.com/TimesSquare/Dungeon/5930/ ___________________________________________________________________ You don't need to buy Internet access to use free Internet e-mail. Get completely free e-mail from Juno at http://www.juno.com/getjuno.html or call Juno at (800) 654-JUNO [654-5866] *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 26 Feb 1999 10:49:30 +0800 From: jason.murphy@mitswa.com.au Subject: RE: [MYSTARA] - Introductions > Hi there all, > > I'm new to the group as well. I've been lurking around for a bit over a > week > now, and I do beleive I might have gotten myself on the wrong list. I > figured while introductions were already going around, now would be the > best > time to look a bit less foolish. > > Most everything that I've seen has been related to the original basic D&D, > with a tad hint of some first edition advanced. I personally am about > three > weeks away from kicking off a Karameikos 2nd Ed. AD&D campaign and came > here > looking for a bit more background for the social interaction between the > various kingdoms of the known world. From what I've seen here, there are > alot of conflicts between the histories issued in the boxed set I have and > the groups general discussions. > > Just a simple yes or no will suffice, but am I in the wrong place? No need > to flame my choice of rules, after 12 years playing I think I like the 2nd > Ed. a bit better, and if indeed a third edition is released I'll probably > switch to that one too. > > Thank you for your time, > > Rob B. > > [MURPHY Jason] Welcome to the list Rob. Nope by all means comment and read away. This list is for both AD&D and OD&D. Although it is mainly for AD&D in reference to the Mystara world, but noone seems to mind the odd bit of straight AD&D discussion as well. I play OD&D myself simply through personal preference. Certainly noone is going to flame you over your rules choice, in fact i get the feeling that the ratio of OD&D to AD&D players is fairly even here. Anyhow welcome, and i hope you get what your looking for :) Jason Murphy Software Engineer MITS Limited EMAIL: jason.murphy@mitswa.com.au PHONE: 08 9481 4066 FAX: 08 9481 4064 *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 26 Feb 1999 14:08:19 +1100 (EST) From: "Jonathan Nolan, Barrister & Solicitor, FTIA" Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - CUSTOM: STRANGERS IN TOWN The Thayvians are a small enclave, disoriented by the greater than expected dimensional 'wrench' of their spell. They were expecting to appear in the Shining South or somewhere but instead have appeared in a different continuum. I have given them some local 'converts', including agents of Mystaran evil powers interested in subverting the Thayvians... - -------------------------------------------------------------------- * * Jonathan Nolan FTIA - International Law practice call 618 89310176 * * - -------------------------------------------------------------------- *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 26 Feb 1999 14:14:29 +1100 (EST) From: "Jonathan Nolan, Barrister & Solicitor, FTIA" Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - CUSTOM: STRANGERS IN TOWN Re: the DL wizard idea, this is exactly the kind of thing iplay around with! I figure since Mystara is not "closed off", and has in fact had extradimensionals (EDs) as an integral part of its history, why should that only be a historical phenomenon... maybe some form of cosmic principle uses Mystara as an 'Altair 4' dumping ground for ED travellers..? - -------------------------------------------------------------------- * * Jonathan Nolan FTIA - International Law practice call 618 89310176 * * - -------------------------------------------------------------------- *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 26 Feb 1999 14:17:47 +1100 (EST) From: "Jonathan Nolan, Barrister & Solicitor, FTIA" Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Introductions I am also a 2edn AD&D DM and player and I run a 2edn AD&D Mystara campaign. You are definitely in the right place. And the more you say the righter the place will be! :) - -------------------------------------------------------------------- * * Jonathan Nolan FTIA - International Law practice call 618 89310176 * * - -------------------------------------------------------------------- *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 25 Feb 1999 22:35:54 -0500 From: Andrew Toth Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - CUSTOM: STRANGERS IN TOWN At 01:13 AM 2/26/99 +0100, you wrote: > >How could they survive in a world where a werewolf is one of the good guys, >people can become Immortal (in Krynn, only two people attempted that and >failed) Wasn't Astinus(the guy who writes all the time) and Majere(the God) once mortal? Beyowulf Steely Blue Dragon -==UDIC==- |/ "Ours is not to reason why, but to blow this joint before we die" -Ratrap, BeastWars *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 26 Feb 1999 00:20:40 EST From: Arminath@aol.com Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - OD&D spell stuff [LONG] In a message dated 2/25/99 8:50:59 PM Eastern Standard Time, anpro@accesocero.es writes: << This is my first par, a theory of the basis behind Alphatian Magic. More on schools and game mechanics in following postings (if you are interested). Andrés >> Um...where do I begin? You have alot of interesting theories about the origins of the types of magic, but, the Tome Project is for magics and spells that can be easily inserted into any campaign. New types of magic are always welcome along with spells, but I can't devote pages upon pages towards just one type of magical theory. I'm trying to understand most of what you posted, but it's not coming easily (maybe it's the quasi-latin) and I think that unless you broke it down some more so it's easier to grasp I'll never even be able to test it IMC and see if I can fit it in the Tome. Remember that the Tome has spells and magics for all levels of play, and only the highest levels of characters would even have a hint of knowledge of the 5 Spheres (let alone magic based on them). I think the Immortals would keep them a totally hidden knowledge for fear of the power mortals could draw upon in their own right. BTW, the 3rd edition is about ready. In the 4th edition, a new type of magic may be added: Path Magic. Someone sent me a few spells and the idea for it in OD&D so we're playtesting it out. I'm sad to report, but no new clerical spells have been added and I may just drop that section totally unless some lurking clerics contribute new spells. Jim *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 26 Feb 1999 09:42:47 +0100 From: Kristian Kramer Subject: RE: [MYSTARA] - Introductions Welcome Rob! No, you are not in the wrong place. Rob hesitantly wrote: >I'm new to the group as well. I've been lurking around for a bit over a week now, and I do beleive I might have gotten myself on the wrong list. I figured while >introductions were already going around, now would be the best time to look a bit less foolish. Someone who becomes a member of this list cannot be foolish! :-) And no, you're not on the wrong list, your comments are welcome. The idea of this list is to discuss Mystara, whether it is played using rules from AD&D, OD&D or a combination of the two (some people even use other systems, like GURPS). Kristian Kramer *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 26 Feb 1999 10:34:50 +0100 From: Kristian Kramer Subject: RE: [MYSTARA] - Entropy Sphere (was Introductions) I was afraid this would happen, but I had to inform Jacob, because it seemed important. And now look what I've done! :-) And now the sphere discussion is back in town!! (-: Should I (-: or )-,: ?? Kristian >I admit to getting a small chuckle when that popped up. Timing is > everything, no? :) > >-- >Timothy R. Haney *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 26 Feb 1999 10:49:05 +0100 From: Kristian Kramer Subject: RE: [MYSTARA] - World in Flames Don't you feel the sweltering Heat? Don't you see the crackling Flames? Don't you hear the wailing of the souls and the crying of countless people, forever dying ? Don't you smell the Burning and the Scorching of innocent creatures? Our world is in Flames, don't look any further, you have found it!! Poor soul... poor Flossy. You have found your destiny, don't fight it. > -----Original Message----- > From: Michael K Jones [SMTP:michael.jones@diamond.co.uk] > Sent: Friday, February 26, 1999 1:20 AM > To: mystara-l@mpgn.com > Subject: [MYSTARA] - World in Flames > > Anyone out there know where the world in Flames stuff is? > > I believe it's on the Mystra newsgroup. > > If anyone knows the address, I'd be very happy :-) > > Flossy > > ************************************************************************** > * > To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the > line > 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 26 Feb 1999 14:12:39 +0100 (CET) From: =?iso-8859-1?Q?H=E5vard_R=F8nne_Faanes?= Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - World in Flames On Fri, 26 Feb 1999, Michael K Jones wrote: > Anyone out there know where the world in Flames stuff is? It can be found on Stans site: http://www.geocities.com/TimesSquare/5304/ the article is here: http://www.geocities.com/TimesSquare/5304/ageowisd.html Hĺvard Haavard R. Faanes (hoc@nvg.ntnu.no) http://www.nvg.ntnu.no/~hoc "Remember, there are no stupid questions, just stupid people." -Mr Garrison, South Park. *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 26 Feb 1999 12:13:07 +0000 From: Michael K Jones Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - World in Flames Any useful answers out there please? I wantr to know where the TSR news server is. I lost the address when my hard drive went bottom up, and now I can't find it. Useful answers appreciated. Flossy Kristian Kramer wrote: > Don't you feel the sweltering Heat? > Don't you see the crackling Flames? > Don't you hear the wailing of the souls and the crying of countless people, > forever dying ? > Don't you smell the Burning and the Scorching of innocent creatures? > Our world is in Flames, don't look any further, you have found it!! > > Poor soul... poor Flossy. You have found your destiny, don't fight it. > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: Michael K Jones [SMTP:michael.jones@diamond.co.uk] > > Sent: Friday, February 26, 1999 1:20 AM > > To: mystara-l@mpgn.com > > Subject: [MYSTARA] - World in Flames > > > > Anyone out there know where the world in Flames stuff is? > > > > I believe it's on the Mystra newsgroup. > > > > If anyone knows the address, I'd be very happy :-) > > > > Flossy > > > > ************************************************************************** > > * > > To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the > > line > > 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. > *************************************************************************** > To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line > 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 26 Feb 1999 14:24:49 +0100 (CET) From: =?iso-8859-1?Q?H=E5vard_R=F8nne_Faanes?= Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Introductions On Thu, 25 Feb 1999, Rob Brooks wrote: > Hi there all, Hiya Rob! > Most everything that I've seen has been related to the original basic D&D, > with a tad hint of some first edition advanced. I personally am about three > weeks away from kicking off a Karameikos 2nd Ed. AD&D campaign and came here > looking for a bit more background for the social interaction between the > various kingdoms of the known world. From what I've seen here, there are > alot of conflicts between the histories issued in the boxed set I have and > the groups general discussions. Like others said, this list is priamrily about the Mystara setting. Any system can be discussed. Lately there has been alot of od&d stuff, but that is a new trend actually. There are alot of people on here using the AD&D2ndEd. Personally, im one of those weird guys who use GURPS. If you only own the Karameikos box, youre missing alot. A good idea would be to check out the Net almanacs and the World in Flames timeline, which presents two altermative future timelines for the setting. Both can be found at Shawn STANleys site: http://www.geocities.com/TimesSquare/5304/ > Just a simple yes or no will suffice, but am I in the wrong place? No need > to flame my choice of rules, after 12 years playing I think I like the 2nd > Ed. a bit better, and if indeed a third edition is released I'll probably > switch to that one too. I gave you a bit more than that, but no youre not in the wrong place. Do stay, cause we need every mystara-fan out there. BTW, id be interested in hearing more about your campaign as it developes. Im running a campaign in Karameikos myself, although it is set in AC1000, 10 years before the boxed set. Sincerely, Hĺvard Haavard R. Faanes (hoc@nvg.ntnu.no) http://www.nvg.ntnu.no/~hoc "Remember, there are no stupid questions, just stupid people." -Mr Garrison, South Park. *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 26 Feb 1999 14:29:46 +0100 (CET) From: =?iso-8859-1?Q?H=E5vard_R=F8nne_Faanes?= Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - CUSTOM: STRANGERS IN TOWN On Thu, 25 Feb 1999, Andrew Toth wrote: > Wasn't Astinus(the guy who writes all the time) and Majere(the God) once > mortal? Nope. Astinus is Gilean, the god of neutrality. Majere was a different God, although I dont know where he came from. He did however give his name to a rather famous family in that world. Hĺvard Haavard R. Faanes (hoc@nvg.ntnu.no) http://www.nvg.ntnu.no/~hoc "Remember, there are no stupid questions, just stupid people." -Mr Garrison, South Park. *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 26 Feb 1999 14:50:01 +0100 From: "=?ISO-8859-1?Q?Andr=E9s_Piquer_Otero?=" Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - OD&D spell stuff [LONG] > Remember that the Tome has spells and magics for all levels of play, and only > the highest levels of characters would even have a hint of knowledge of the 5 > Spheres (let alone magic based on them). I think the Immortals would keep > them a totally hidden knowledge for fear of the power mortals could draw upon > in their own right. Well, my first post was just an IC introduction. The practical magicks will follow during the weekend (I hope). They will be progressive magic powers (similar to Glantri crafts) and some "speciality" spells. Andrés *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 26 Feb 1999 14:47:27 +0100 From: "=?ISO-8859-1?Q?Andr=E9s_Piquer_Otero?=" Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - CUSTOM: STRANGERS IN TOWN > > Wasn't Astinus(the guy who writes all the time) and Majere(the God) once > mortal? Probably, but people in Kryn would not KNOW that. Paths to Immortality are an accesible (albeit arcane) lore in Mystara. Andrés *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 26 Feb 1999 14:10:36 +0000 From: gordon@ucd.ie Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - World in Flames 7F00,0000,0000> > Anyone out there know where the world in Flames stuff is? > > It can be found on Stans site: > http://www.geocities.com/TimesSquare/5304/ > > the article is here: > http://www.geocities.com/TimesSquare/5304/ageowisd.html It's actually http://www.geocities.com/TimesSquare/5304/worldflm.html So what's the other World in Flames thing then? gordon Gordon McCormick, System Management UCD Computing Services,Belfield, Dublin 4 ph. +353 1 7062017 *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 26 Feb 1999 15:23:03 +0100 From: "Jacob Skytte" Subject: [MYSTARA] - A journey to the past Well, thanks to all of you for your responses. My question about OD&D was a bit hasty. And a simple "It means Original D&D"-answer would have sufficed. If I had thought about it I could have figured that one out myself...Oh well... I prefer playing with D&D rules using whatever rules additions have cropped up over time. This means Gazetteer optional rules, the Princess Ark Dragon Series optional rules plus whatever comes along from the minds of weirdos and their like (including my own former playing group and of course myself(!)). In my plans for an upcoming campaign I've been delving into the subjects of time travel. Based on the DA1-4 (or at least 1-3) I mean to let my hapless PC's experience Blackmoor, get them familiar with the setting and then blow it all up!!! Yes, I want them to be present during the Great Rain of Fire, the Planetshift or whatever. In fact I'd love to let my PC's contribute significantly to the causes of the catastrophe. Then I plan to subject them to a modified version of the events described in the Wrath of the Immortals boxed set; hopefully corresponding to their experiences in the past (literally) and focusing on the people, places, and items they've encountered in the Blackmoor era. Right now I'm in the planning stages and would love to hear any ideas or comments from people on the list. I've downloaded a Blackmoor Gazetteer from someone's homepage (if you're reading this; thanks, it seems very helpful) for starters. Jacob Skytte; Denmark Jacob Skytte Skytte@virgil.ruc.dk *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 26 Feb 1999 11:38:29 -0500 (EST) From: Kevin Turner Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Introductions On Thu, 25 Feb 1999, Rob Brooks wrote: > Hi there all, > Rob B. No, you're not in the wrong place. The general consensus is that most of the people familiar with Mystara come from the OD&D background. Like yourself, I tend to run with AD&D2 rules for Mystara, and that's how I came to understand where Mystara had come from. Most of the people here speak in OD&D terms, but most of that is easily converted to AD&D for use in Mystara. It's the setting we love, not necessarily the rules. Welcome aboard. - --Frobozz-- *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 27 Feb 1999 10:05:04 +1300 From: Richard Vowles Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Mapping Question Try also Campaign Cartographer - at www.profantasy.com Arminath@aol.com wrote: > I need to draw some new maps up and was wondering if anyone can recommend > something (and where I can find it)? I need to make some new maps of my > Karameikos campaign to reflect the changes in geographyand new town and > dungeons for my group to crawl through. *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 26 Feb 1999 23:40:55 -0600 From: "James Ruhland" Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Day of Dread: Floating Ar Ok, so I was re-checking PWA II's entry on the Day of Dread just now (for my own nefarious purposes, which will be revealed some day if you're very, very good). I came across the line relating to Floating Ar (has nothing to do with what I was looking at the entry for, but going off on a tangent is a favorite past time). That sentance read: "Inhabitants of Floating Ar are once more relieved -- as on the last Day of Dread, their floating islands lose only a little altitude." Ok, so they don't crash into the see (or the Yanniev Islands) right away. But on each Day of Dread they lose a little altitude, right? So what are the ramifications. I can think of three possibilities: 1) Each year they get a little closer to the ground. After an unknown number of years, eventually they will land (or crash "softly"). 2) The next day they regain whatever altitude they lost on the Day of Dread, so no problem. 3) They don't automatically regain altitude, but the Ar-dudes (was going to write "Areans" but might confuse with others having similar appelations. Back to my regularly scheduled screed, already in progress) the Ar-dudes use whatever methods they have on hand to "tow" each islet back up to the proper altitude (which would follow, if they can move the islands to the Yanniev islands). So, which do folks think it is? My own surmise I guess is #3. But #1 might be more interesting (leads to a problem that must be solved. Of course, if it can be solved by #3, then we're back at that one. If it can't be solved by #3, then some other creative solution is needed). So, if we assume #1 (which we might not agree is the "right" one, but c'mon, just for the sake of speculation), what ideas do folks have for fixing this problem and keeping the Islets flying high. Here's one that might work for the smaller ones, but definately not the larger ones: lots of hot air balloons attached around the perimeter of the islet on the Day of Dread to keep it from loosing altitude. Any others? *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ End of mystara-digest V1999 #103 ******************************** *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara' as the body of the message. mystara-digest Sunday, February 28 1999 Volume 1999 : Number 104 Mystara is a trademark of TSR Inc. All Rights Reserved. The following topics are covered in this digest: Re: [MYSTARA] - Day of Dread: Floating Ar Re: [MYSTARA] - Day of Dread: Floating Ar Re: [MYSTARA] - Day of Dread: Floating Ar [MYSTARA] - MYSTARA: CUSTOM: Fighter Powers Re: [MYSTARA] - MYSTARA: CUSTOM: Fighter Powers [MYSTARA] - Slow travel Re: [MYSTARA] - Slow travel Re: [MYSTARA] - Slow travel Re: [MYSTARA] - Slow travel Re: [MYSTARA] - Slow travel Re: [MYSTARA] - Slow travel [MYSTARA] - [MYSTARA] locations Re: [MYSTARA] - Slow travel Re: [MYSTARA] - Slow travel in a hot environment Re: [MYSTARA] - Slow travel in a hot environment Re: [MYSTARA] - Slow travel in a hot environment Re: [MYSTARA] - MYSTARA: CUSTOM: Fighter Powers Re: [MYSTARA] - Slow travel Re: [MYSTARA] - MYSTARA: CUSTOM: Fighter Powers Re: [MYSTARA] - MYSTARA: CUSTOM: Fighter Powers ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Sat, 27 Feb 1999 01:33:48 -0500 From: Jerry Hovenanian Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Day of Dread: Floating Ar James Ruhland wrote: > 3) They don't automatically regain altitude, but the Ar-dudes (was going > to write "Areans" but might confuse with others having similar appelations. > Back to my regularly scheduled screed, already in progress) I think the word you were looking for was Arites or a slang term for them IMC...Floaters IIRC didn't someone do a write-up on the common terms for the people of mystara???? - -- Jerry Hovenanian clumsydwarf@hotmail.com *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 27 Feb 1999 00:41:31 -0600 From: "James Ruhland" Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Day of Dread: Floating Ar > IIRC didn't someone do a write-up on the common terms for the people of > mystara???? > Someone probably did, but I'm hardly going to go look for it at midnight when I'm all slap-happy from searching for missing reference material and screeding. 8-) *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 27 Feb 1999 01:32:54 -0600 From: "Timothy R. Haney" Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Day of Dread: Floating Ar James Ruhland wrote: > > 2) The next day they regain whatever altitude they lost on the Day of > Dread, so no problem. This one gets my vote. I think that magic gives them a certain attitude and when it kicks back in, back up they go (I don't understand why they lose attitude at all, they either have or they don't). But number three could be in play. BTW, any idea what happens to them during a storm? Do they get tossed around? Maybe find the answer how they maintain their position during that instance and you'd find the attitude answer. - -- Timothy R. Haney galwylin@airnet.net The Tome of Galwylin - http://www.airnet.net/galwylin/ Galwylin's Bookshop - http://www.airnet.net/galwylin/bookshop/ *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 28 Feb 1999 01:10:51 +1100 (EST) From: "Jonathan Nolan, Barrister & Solicitor, FTIA" Subject: [MYSTARA] - MYSTARA: CUSTOM: Fighter Powers Hi, here are some rles under works, an alternative system for fighter powers, similar in some ways to bits of the higher level D&D rules from Companion and Master. There are hundreds more fighter powers to add, schools and styles to assign, etc. once it's done I will put the free release version on the website as a companion to the Mystara Grimoire. The latest version of that is now on there - including the up-to-today spell additions. The fighter powers are termed "metafighting" as analgous to metamagic. I have rules for all sorts of "meta-" disciplines, had a big fad on them years ago, then lost interest, published em, moved on... :) *** FIGHTER POWERS - THE METAWARRIOR CONSTRUCTION SET An alternative system for Warrior's attributes in combat by Jonathan Nolan Each warrior has exactly the number of these abilities as given in the accompanying Chart One. Thus at Level 1 the warrior can mentally and physically practice and prepare to use one of these special abilities each day. Warriors using this system should be required to earn 30% more xp than normal warriors to relfect the advantage this system confers and the added difficulty of mastering so much training in each level. The powers of the various fighter techniques are closely parallel to similar level sorceror, shaman, battlemagician, wizard and priest magics. Typical users of such a system as this in various worlds would include: Medieval Orient - yamabushi, ninja, samurai, kensai, koruken, gekkenso Medieval Europe - knights, wakes, barbarians Fantasy - fighting monks and clerical characters, heroes and villains Just as most worlds have schools or colleges of magic, so too is fighting classed into styles and schools. Each power has added after it its school or style in parentheses. (CAPITALISED) names are of Schools, (Sentence) case names are of styles taken from Earth so that the gamemaster or moderator can apply the various powers much as they would do for spells - restricting access to those techniques learned from the warrior's school or found in manuals and scrolls relating to the fighting arts. Learning new abilities is determined as in Chart Two. CHART ONE: LEVEL PROGRESSION FOR FIGHTER POWERS Level of Warrior Number of Powers useable per day Level: 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 1 1 - - - - - - - - 2 2 - - - - - - - - 3 2 1 - - - - - - - 4 3 2 - - - - - - - 5 3 2 1 - - - - - - 6 3 3 - - - - - - - 7 3 3 1 - - - - - - 8 3 3 2 - - - - - - 9 3 3 2 1 - - - - - 10 3 3 3 1 - - - - - 11 3 3 3 2 - - - - - 12 3 3 3 3 - - - - - 13 3 3 3 3 1 - - - - 14 3 3 3 3 2 - - - - 15 3 3 3 3 3 - - - - 16 3 3 3 3 3 1 - - - 17 3 3 3 3 3 2 - - - 18 3 3 3 3 3 3 - - - 19 3 3 3 3 3 3 1 - - 20 3 3 3 3 3 3 2 - - LEVEL ONE Unerring Strike (ANY, Any) Duello Movement (FENCING, European) Confusing Dance (ANY, Any) Simple Slicing (ANY, Any) Ground Fighting (KARATE DO, Oriental) Unaimed Blow (ANY, Any) Dextrous Climbing (HASHISHIM, "Arabia") Precision Attack (JOUSTING, European) Leaping (ANY, Any) Sticking Hands (KUNG FU, Oriental) Eagle Claws (KUNG FU, Oriental) Shattering Fist (ANY, Any) LEVEL TWO Haymaker Twinkletoes Water Spirit Stance Monkey Form Stance Whip Hand Bewildering Dance Monkey Grip Heroic Leaping LEVEL THREE Shooting Star Fist Crescent Combination Leaping Kick Dodge Haymaker II Parrying Gesture Blade Dance Superheroic Leaping LEVEL FOUR Haymaker III Stunning Shout Mantis Gesture Warrior Charisma Safe Seat Ultraheroic Leaping LEVEL FIVE Immovable Stance Double Gesture Guard Stance Leadership Aura Dark Ocean Grip LEVEL SIX Spell Dodge Missile Deflection LEVEL SEVEN Missile Immunity LEVEL EIGHT Elemental Immunity - Fire Elemental Immunity - Air Elemental Immunity - Earth Elemental Immunity - Water LEVEL NINE Deathstrike Healing Hand Tenfold Bending Branch Pattern Dolorous Blow LEVEL TEN - LEGENDARY POWERS Unkillable Unstoppable Untouchable Ultimate Acrobatics Ultimate Parrying *** - -------------------------------------------------------------------- * * Jonathan Nolan FTIA - International Law practice call 618 89310176 * * - -------------------------------------------------------------------- Mystara/RPG Netbooks: www.physics.adelaide.edu.au/~ksimpson/netbooks.html PS a last word or footnote on Vecna: TRUE FACTS ____________________________________________________ 10 Obscure But True Facts About Vecna 1. Vecna was actually Jewish. His real name was Vecman. He changed it early on in his career as an evil archmage for unknown reasons. 2. He was married (didn't know that didja?) to a fiery red-head, who had previously divorced a deadbeat, go nowhere, Cuban bongo soloist. 3. Was the missing 6th "Village Person" (for trivia buffs, he was the Pizza Guy). 4. He never paid retail for anything. 5. His obsession with immortality was actually prompted not by a rabid desire to conquer Oerth, (as historians would have you believe) but by deeply rooted fear that he would be posthumously "outed" by _Out Magazine_. 6. Never got over the acute sense of betrayal following the publication of Kas' expose, "_Vecna Dearest, on the Inside Looking Out._" (24 weeks on the Greyhawk Bee's bestseller list). 7. Absolutely despised the Spice Girls. 8. Was a Swiss Citizen. 9. Fathered Two children, Herschel and Adam. Hercschel went on to become a chartered accountant, while, Adam (the youngest) changed his surname to Thrasher, went to The University of Alberta for a Ph. D. in Biomedical Engineering, (which he's putting to excellent use.) 10. Stockpiled Tab in the 70's when it looked like the supply was gonna dry up. copyright 31JUL97 Clayton T Johnson (except for "Vecna and Kas" owned by TSR/WOTC) *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 27 Feb 1999 15:24:50 -0000 From: "Edward Phillips" Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - MYSTARA: CUSTOM: Fighter Powers Interesting stuff about the fighter, cheers. Hey IMC a bit of Vecna escaped Ravenloft an is now wandering round Mystara. Any innovative ideas about where he could turn up? *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 27 Feb 1999 15:26:33 -0000 From: "Edward Phillips" Subject: [MYSTARA] - Slow travel Is it possible to 'walk' to the HW via the caverns underneath the Coliseum in Thyatis city? and if so how long would it take? (I want my PCs popping out somwhere in the milenian empire) *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 27 Feb 1999 10:50:29 -0500 From: Jeff Daly Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Slow travel I would say "yes" to the first question, though it should take a long time and be very difficult. As for exactly how long...I would confuse the situation by having them go through at least one gate... Edward Phillips wrote: > Is it possible to 'walk' to the HW via the caverns underneath the Coliseum > in Thyatis city? and if so how long would it take? (I want my PCs popping > out somwhere in the milenian empire) > > *************************************************************************** > To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line > 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 27 Feb 1999 18:07:14 +0200 (EET) From: Markus Olavi Montola Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Slow travel > Is it possible to 'walk' to the HW via the caverns underneath the Coliseum > in Thyatis city? and if so how long would it take? (I want my PCs popping > out somwhere in the milenian empire) _IMC_ no, the only way within known world is via Broken Lands, and the shaft described in the WotI (to Neatharum) sucks, but IYC it may pretty well be possible. The crust of Mystara is 1200 miles thick. First half of the way is relatively easy to travel. If the characters travel 30 degrees steep tunnnel downwards, they have to walk first 1200 miles long road downwards, and then another 1200 miles up. If they had to walk 2400 miles on a street, and they were munchkin adventurers with neglible equipinet and Con18 and Str18, they would walk 40 miles per day (with very sore feet), and thus joourneying for 60 days. However, the climb is very very much harder (especially with equipment), and at the bottom there is temperature something 45-90 degrees of celsius (water boils in 100 degrees, but because that is quite deadly so the characters probably penetrate the World Shield far enough from lava). (Of deadly temperatures, person, who's body temperature exceed 42 celsius dies instantly as the proteines coaculate, which is unevitable when staying for long period in such a hot environment). As a matter of fact, the fumes over the lava pools may very well be 5000-10000 degrees hot. So, I'd say that because the tunnels are a labyrith instead of a highway, the descent would take the two months, and the ascending quadruple time (!), that is, ten months of boring underworld hell with occasional monsters and absolutely no way of knowing that the road was leading anywhere. I recommend Jules Verne's "Journey to the Center of the World" (or whaddever it is called in English) for inspiration and scientific facts, as well as the Finnish sauna for enjoyment and getting to feel what is to travel in *HOT* environment. (Or to make love, which I absolutely do *not* recommend (not that I've tried, but anyways)). - Markus P.S. Magical cooling and such of course help *a lot*. ----------------------------------------------------------------- W A R I S P E A C E F R E E D O M I S S L A V E R Y I G N O R A N C E I S S T R E N G T H ----------------------------------------------------------------- *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 27 Feb 1999 10:21:47 -0600 From: "James Ruhland" Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Slow travel > > Is it possible to 'walk' to the HW via the caverns underneath the Coliseum > in Thyatis city? and if so how long would it take? (I want my PCs popping > out somwhere in the milenian empire) > Anything's possible if you want it to be in your campaign. If you have DDA1 they give some (scanty) details on this. It is possible according to the modules. Ratboy (Rurtifus) did it. No idea how long it would take. Quite a trip I imagine (at least a thousand miles of tunnels before reaching Milenia), but there could be ways to speed it up. You could have one of thouse "Teleport Rooms" that used to pop up in modules a lot. That would allow you to get the PCs to (but not beyond) the Worldshield (no Teleportation beyond that. . .unless you make the T-Room an Immortal Artifact type thing. I'd make sure the PCs couldn't move it then, though). HWA1 gives an idea, too: use an Earth Elemental and a Distance Distortion spell to shorten the trip. As to your Vecna question, funny you should ask. Another dude brought that up (sorry, can't remember who) a couple weeks ago. He had the idea of replacing the Shadow Lord of Denagoth with Vecna. Asside from that, you could probably put him anywhere you want. *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 27 Feb 1999 12:04:52 -0500 From: Bruce Pierpont Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Slow travel According HWA1 the crust is about 1000 miles thick. So assuming they travel in a straight line from Outer world to Hollow World it would take about 42 days (assuming a travel rate of 24 miles per day or about 2 miles per hour for 12 hours a day). Considering the trip is unlikely to be even remotely straight I'd at least double the time. You could give them access to the spell Distance Distortion (MU/Cleric Level 5) which would reduce the trip to approximately 3/4 of a mile. This involves an earth elemental, which while readily available normally, is impossible to summon in the HW. Incidentally the spell would still work in the HW if a free elemental were persuaded to aid the caster, since the spell itself still works. (Its not instant travel, only rapid travel.) Edward Phillips wrote: > > Is it possible to 'walk' to the HW via the caverns underneath the Coliseum > in Thyatis city? and if so how long would it take? (I want my PCs popping > out somwhere in the milenian empire) > > *************************************************************************** > To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line > 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 27 Feb 1999 12:37:36 -0500 (EST) From: Kevin Turner Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Slow travel On Sat, 27 Feb 1999, Markus Olavi Montola wrote: > travel in *HOT* environment. (Or to make love, which I absolutely do > *not* recommend (not that I've tried, but anyways)). Whoa! Markus! TMI, dude. Besides, this is a *fantasy* world. I say, let 'em do what they want. After all, how many Looney Toons have depicted tunneling through from the US to China? It's an age-old dream. Let 'em have fun. I'm not saying make it easy, and there certainly should be some "deadly peril" (run away! run away!), as well as the time factors you mentioned. But I still think it should be possible. My two cents, anyhoo. - --Frobozz-- *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 27 Feb 1999 15:05:21 -0500 (EST) From: Kevin Turner Subject: [MYSTARA] - [MYSTARA] locations I never saw much about where people were placing old AD&D modules in Mystara. I liked this idea, and I'd like to compile a list of possible locations for 1st edition AD&D modules, but moved into Mystara. Let me see your ideas. - --Frobozz-- *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 27 Feb 1999 16:41:20 -0500 From: Sharon Dornhoff Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Slow travel > Is it possible to 'walk' to the HW via the caverns underneath the Coliseum > in Thyatis city? and if so how long would it take? (I want my PCs popping > out somwhere in the milenian empire) The problem isn't just in traversing the 1200 miles of vertical distance, plus the horizontal distance to the Milenian regions. It's avoiding all the switchbacks, dead ends, and gravity distortions that the PCs might confront along the way! Don't forget that it took races like the Schattenalfen literally HUNDREDS of years to make the journey from KW to HW, underground ... or that most forms of divination-magic that could warn the PCs they're going in circles will only work for the first 600 miles of the journey. OTOH, if you want the PCs to get there FAST, you could let the tunnels under Thyatis lead to some plot device that'll carry them most of the way. In addition to man-made teleport chambers -- which can only reach as far as the the World-Shield, thanks to the SoP -- there might be artifacts that could send the PCs the whole distance, that were captured from the Milenians by ancient Thy/Ker/Hat heroes. Such an item, created by a Milenian patron Immortal, might automatically transport its users to the Imperial court of Milenia ... and might still do so, even though Milenia's not where it used to be, anymore. ;-) If that's too gimicky, there's also hundreds of tunnels between the HW and the surface, which were bored by the great annelids in the course of the HWA modules. The good things about this option are that it gives the PCs a rather straight route to follow ... and if the tunnel is sufficiently vertical, the party might even be able to Feather Fall themselves all the way down to the World-Shield! The down sides to it, are that the climb up the interior 600 miles could be even tougher, for the PCs, than spelunking an equal distance in gently-sloped tunnels; there might still be a great annelid snoozing in the passage ("Run away! Run away!" ;-D); and it opens up the possibility of Thyatis invading the Hollow World, should this oh-so-convenient entryway become known to the Empire. *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 28 Feb 1999 02:05:43 +0200 (EET) From: Markus Olavi Montola Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Slow travel in a hot environment > > travel in *HOT* environment. (Or to make love, which I absolutely do > > *not* recommend (not that I've tried, but anyways)). > Besides, this is a *fantasy* world. I say, let 'em do what they want. Okay. I hereby promise that if any or all of my players' imaginary role-characters want to make love in an exceptionally hot environment, they can freely do, and even have fun while doing it. > US to China? It's an age-old dream. Let 'em have fun. I'm not saying > make it easy, and there certainly should be some "deadly peril" (run > away! run away!), as well as the time factors you mentioned. But I > still think it should be possible. Uh, about the travelling? :) Yes, it is possible, but definitely not easy. Probably will be done IMC sooner or later (or even later) if the campaign goes on. We are in 1004 now, and that would come after WotI. > My two cents, anyhoo. :) ...I rarely play scientifically, but this kind of theories make it possible to try to imagine what kind of feat it is we are talking about. (Have you ever realized that if a billion dollars were changed in quarters and then piled in one high tower, and we suppose that a quarter is about 1mm thick, the tower would be 250km high! That's 28 Mount Everests. How much, then again, was the US military budget?) - Markus ----------------------------------------------------------------- W A R I S P E A C E F R E E D O M I S S L A V E R Y I G N O R A N C E I S S T R E N G T H ----------------------------------------------------------------- *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 27 Feb 1999 19:06:16 -0600 From: "James Ruhland" Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Slow travel in a hot environment > > (Have you ever realized that if a billion dollars were changed in > quarters and then piled in one high tower, and we suppose that a quarter > is about 1mm thick, the tower would be 250km high! That's 28 Mount > Everests. How much, then again, was the US military budget?) > Cool. Nice to see my money wasn't wasted on some sociologist. *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 28 Feb 1999 02:45:50 -0000 From: "Rob" Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Slow travel in a hot environment >> (Have you ever realized that if a billion dollars were changed in >> quarters and then piled in one high tower, and we suppose that a quarter >> is about 1mm thick, the tower would be 250km high! That's 28 Mount >> Everests. How much, then again, was the US military budget?) >> >Cool. Nice to see my money wasn't wasted on some sociologist. Lol. *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 28 Feb 1999 16:24:47 +1100 (EST) From: "Jonathan Nolan, Barrister & Solicitor, FTIA" Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - MYSTARA: CUSTOM: Fighter Powers > Hey IMC a bit of Vecna escaped Ravenloft an is now wandering round Mystara. > Any innovative ideas about where he could turn up? Well we just finished a session with Vecna - underground between Sind and Darokin - AND Strahd, turning up to wreak vengeance on Vecna ineptly... I figure since Mystara is not in the AD&D continuum the rules about exiling of Dark Lords is somewhat looser - it's very difficult but not impossible for them to enter Mystara as incarnations... I have Acererak as a disciple of Vecna - guess what's coming if or when Vecna is defeated... :) *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 28 Feb 1999 16:29:46 +1100 (EST) From: "Jonathan Nolan, Barrister & Solicitor, FTIA" Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Slow travel Re: the temperature thingy about the underground travel, 40 deg. C is the typical Australian desert type temperature, and although it CAN kill you, it by no means has to. And it's around thirty degrees C every day of the year in Darwin where I live - and sex is just fine thanx very much! :) - -------------------------------------------------------------------- * * Jonathan Nolan FTIA - International Law practice call 618 89310176 * * - -------------------------------------------------------------------- Mystara/RPG Netbooks: www.physics.adelaide.edu.au/~ksimpson/netbooks.html *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 28 Feb 1999 00:27:26 -0500 (EST) From: Kevin Turner Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - MYSTARA: CUSTOM: Fighter Powers On Sun, 28 Feb 1999, Jonathan Nolan, Barrister & Solicitor, FTIA wrote: > I have Acererak as a disciple of Vecna - guess what's coming if or when > Vecna is defeated... :) Don't you guys have laws about cruel and unusual punishment? I think that Return to Tomb of Horrors after having defeated Vecna and Strahd counts as such... I like it! :) - --Frobozz-- *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 28 Feb 1999 19:00:00 +1100 (EST) From: "Jonathan Nolan, Barrister & Solicitor, FTIA" Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - MYSTARA: CUSTOM: Fighter Powers > > I have Acererak as a disciple of Vecna - guess what's coming if or when > > Vecna is defeated... :) > > Don't you guys have laws about cruel and unusual punishment? I think > that Return to Tomb of Horrors after having defeated Vecna and Strahd > counts as such... > I like it! > > :) > --Frobozz-- I originally had grave, grave doubts about the whole saga but it turns out that the players vastly prefer it to some of the D&D stuff like the 'rescue Darokin merchants' type stuff - it's epic but Immortal free, more or less - unless you count Vecna and Strahd... which I do! :) - -------------------------------------------------------------------- * * Jonathan Nolan FTIA - International Law practice call 618 89310176 * * - -------------------------------------------------------------------- Mystara/RPG Netbooks: www.physics.adelaide.edu.au/~ksimpson/netbooks.html *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ End of mystara-digest V1999 #104 ******************************** *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara' as the body of the message. mystara-digest Monday, March 1 1999 Volume 1999 : Number 105 Mystara is a trademark of TSR Inc. All Rights Reserved. The following topics are covered in this digest: [MYSTARA] - MYSTARA: D&D [MYSTARA] - Low level adventures - was General Questions [MYSTARA] - Weapon mastery [MYSTARA] - MYSTARA: CUSTOM: Analects of the Immortals [MYSTARA] - AD&D SITES IN MYSTARA Re: [MYSTARA] - MYSTARA: CUSTOM: Analects of the Immortals Re: [MYSTARA] - Weapon mastery [MYSTARA] - [ADMIN] Subject Headers Re: [MYSTARA] - Slow travel Re: [MYSTARA] - Weapon mastery Re: [MYSTARA] - Weapon mastery [MYSTARA] - ALPHATIAN FOLLOWERS OF AIR Re: [MYSTARA] - MYSTARA: D&D Re: [MYSTARA] - MYSTARA: D&D Re: [MYSTARA] - AD&D SITES IN MYSTARA Re: [MYSTARA] - MYSTARA: D&D Re: [MYSTARA] - D&D ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Sun, 28 Feb 1999 19:13:44 +1100 (EST) From: "Jonathan Nolan, Barrister & Solicitor, FTIA" Subject: [MYSTARA] - MYSTARA: D&D Has anyone looked at or bought the new D&D Boxed set? Does it have anything at all to do with Mystara? - -------------------------------------------------------------------- * * Jonathan Nolan FTIA - International Law practice call 618 89310176 * * - -------------------------------------------------------------------- Mystara/RPG Netbooks: www.physics.adelaide.edu.au/~ksimpson/netbooks.html *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 28 Feb 1999 11:25:37 -0300 From: "Carlos Yoder" Subject: [MYSTARA] - Low level adventures - was General Questions >>After ploughing through this mailing list for the last couple of nights, I >have >>noticed that most people are playing at the high-level end of the game - a >lot >>even using immortal characters. Are there many who still play using a set of >>low(ish) level characters, roaming around dungeons ?? > >Well, IMC the PC with more PX is level 5. And I've never had PCs with level >higher than 9. >Anyway I don't like dungeons very much, I prefer wilderness adventures or >city ones. > Well, my main character never reached higher than level 9... or a normal table for that matter. Yep, my char is a 9E-level halfling. And yes, I spent a wish for that extra level... it's life or death against symbols or holy words!! Bungo Cervezarrubia *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 28 Feb 1999 12:02:28 -0300 From: "Carlos Yoder" Subject: [MYSTARA] - Weapon mastery Hey list. I was wondering... does anyone of you use the *real* weapon mastery rules? We (our group) think they do ridicously high amounts of damage, so we came up with something different. It's pretty simple, but it's been playtested for a while now (5 years more or less), so I can tell you it works. WM Bonus Basic Sorry no bonus! (*) Skilled +1 to hit Expert +1 to hit, +1 damage Master +2 to hit, +1 damage Grand Master +2 to hit, +2 damage Our DM tells us that it too works nicely for monsters. Bungo Cervezarrubia *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 1 Mar 1999 03:18:04 +1100 (EST) From: "Jonathan Nolan, Barrister & Solicitor, FTIA" Subject: [MYSTARA] - MYSTARA: CUSTOM: Analects of the Immortals ANALECTS OF THE IMMORTALS "Although the path you are on may not lead to the mountain, if you can see the mountain, you are not lost." Cult of Ixion "Time hates beauty and Old Age is its claw" Cult of Khoronus "No king ever dies alone" Church of Halav "The old order changes; yielding place to new. The Immortals fulfill themselves in many ways, lest one bad custom corrupt the world." Church of Vanya "My Loyalty is Honour" Heldannic Knights blade oath "Blood is life" Church of Nyx, Boldavian Sect "Many strange gods are worshipped as the fish turns in its pool" Cult of Calitha Starbrow "Those who do not honour the elderly are doomed to failure" Church of Karameikos "What is evil cannot be done in the name of Love; what is good cannot be done in the name of any other power" Church of Valeria "We poor few forged as brothers in this furnace will emerge as the steel of future generations" Legionary's prayer, Thyatis "Ixion! Help me, or do not help me; but do not hinder me!" Emperor's prayer, Thyatis "ONE SON has Laufey; LOKI LAUFEYSEN! The God of the Fire, The God of the Knife, The God of the Lie called Life" Priesthood of Loki "No man will out-stare Ixion, or outdrink Protius; no man will draw breath longer than Thanatos or cast a spell that will outlast Rad. But still we hold a fascination for all these powers, for with our thoughts, we shape the world" Followers of Gareth "A man may waste a life seeking a mythical treasure. A man may waste a life bowing down to idols. What is a life that is not wasted? Perhaps one in which we learn?" Philosophy of Truth "The light of the truth shines with the brightness of a thousand suns" Cult of Rad "We are the last fruit of Autumn; our Summer is gone and will never come again. Spring is forbidden to us; only Winter awaits the Elf races now." Lay of Alfheim "Idolatry is worse than carnage" The Nahmeh "Take me back to the grove of oaks, I want to worship Odin there" Cult of Odin - -------------------------------------------------------------------- * * Jonathan Nolan FTIA - International Law practice call 618 89310176 * * - -------------------------------------------------------------------- Mystara/RPG Netbooks: www.physics.adelaide.edu.au/~ksimpson/netbooks.html *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 1 Mar 1999 03:24:03 +1100 (EST) From: "Jonathan Nolan, Barrister & Solicitor, FTIA" Subject: [MYSTARA] - AD&D SITES IN MYSTARA In answer to the puissant Mage Frobozz, Gion MacThane of Klantyre makes answer in Council: ***ADDing to Mystara*** From the contributors to the Mystara PBeM I run / the Mystara Grimoire: (these are all from different campaigns but looking at them all together it would make a pretty damned interesting world that's for sure...) AL QADIM Zakhara/Al-Qadim is in the Utter West beyond Hule Golden Huzuz as a city in western Hule Al-Qadim map ignored but cities dotted around Ylaruam CHURCH OF DRAGONLANCE OF LATTER-DAY RULES Draconians used as monsters quite commonly Towers of Sorcery set in Glantri War of the Lance based in Wendar and plateau beyond Glantri COUNCIL OF WYRMS Io from Council of Worms beyond the Pearl Isle in the eastern ocean DARKSUN Athas-style Sorceror-King city ruling Hule Athas as a relatively nearby planetary system Gladiator rules used in Empire of Thyatis Preserver and Defiler strongholds in Glantri Forest Ridge on Arm of the Immortals FORGETTABLE REALMS Red Wizards - several people have sprinkled them or their spells into Glantri or elsewhere, one DM has 'cookie cuttered' Thay in toto as a realm beyond Glantri to the North Pirates of the Sea of whatever used for Minrothad Guilds Shadowdale added as an area of Karameikos Zhentil Keep added to Ylaruam as an emirate Dungeon Adventure series set in and around ruins of Myrkul temple in swamp set on Karameikan coast GREYHOCK Tomb of Horrors in Malpheggi Swamp Lendore Isle [Secret of Bone Hill / Assassin's Knot] has been put in the middle of the ocean on Mystara. City of Greyhawk on Skothar - Flaeness out there somewhere 'HISTORICAL' SERIES OF SOURCEBOOKS LaTerre campaigns (two known) where Mystara is a legendary world and the action takes place from Dark Ages to Renaissance on a recognisable Earth Use of 'Mighty Fortress' in conjunction with Chronomancer rules and Nouvelle Averoigne time travel LANKHMAR Lankhmar off coast directly opposite Specularum/Mirros ORIENTAL ADVENTURES Ochalea is a Japanese Oriental Adventures setting. Kara-Tur is placed above the Savage Coast within Hule RAVENLOFT Boldavia as Barovia from Ravenloft Mordenheim as an isle off Norwold's coast, approx. 20 miles out to sea SPELLJAMMER: Rock of Bral orbiting the Mystaran sun near where the Asteroid belt will be ie near Damocles Athas as a relatively nearby planetary system Spelljamming ships and races occasionally visiting Mystara - -Jonathan *** "If they give you lined paper, write the other way." - -------------------------------------------------------------------- * * Jonathan Nolan FTIA - International Law practice call 618 89310176 * * - -------------------------------------------------------------------- Mystara/RPG Netbooks: www.physics.adelaide.edu.au/~ksimpson/netbooks.html *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 28 Feb 1999 12:33:50 -0500 (EST) From: Mischa E Gelman Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - MYSTARA: CUSTOM: Analects of the Immortals > "Although the path you are on may not lead to the mountain, if you can see > the mountain, you are not lost." > Cult of Ixion Not sure if this is the correct saying for Ixion backers..it just doesn't have the proper tone to me. Too philosophical. > "Time hates beauty and Old Age is its claw" > Cult of Khoronus This seems to be going against the basis behind time, which doesn't sound right to me either. Perhaps something about how time and age bring wisdom and insight? > "Many strange gods are worshipped as the fish turns in its pool" > Cult of Calitha Starbrow Wonderful! > "What is evil cannot be done in the name of Love; what is good cannot be > done in the name of any other power" > Church of Valeria Again, right on the mark! Anyone want to expand the list for others? Some ideas of mine.. "A just path leads to just rewards" - The Church of Tarastia "Research, magic and experimentation are the only things that have ever progressed our world. Only by serving them do we further the planet." - Church of Pflarr "Good and bad vary upon your view, but a clever act is recognized by all." - Cult of Korotiku - Mischa Gelman ("Business is smart" - Republican bigwig Dick Armey) In a 1998 poll, only 23% of Fortune 1000 senior executives could explain what a modem is, as opposed to 93% of 6th-graders. *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 28 Feb 1999 12:47:41 -0500 (EST) From: Mischa E Gelman Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Weapon mastery > Hey list. Hi Mr. Yager! > I was wondering... does anyone of you use the *real* weapon mastery rules? I usually use them to a large extent. The to-hit and damage rules are used, and some of the extras (like the dagger double damage bonus or bow range changes). Against higher level monsters, these are needed to keep fighters and thieves "competitive" in a campaign with any serious amount of fighting (not necessarily [sp?] hack-n-slash). Some of the extras, like the AC bonuses, disarming, deflecting, etc. are rarely, if ever, used in campaigns I'm involved with. These are just too far over-the-top. - - Mischa Gelman Pittsburgh, PA ("Business is smart" - Republican bigwig Dick Armey) In a 1998 poll, only 23% of Fortune 1000 senior executives could explain what a modem is, as opposed to 93% of 6th-graders. *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 28 Feb 1999 12:03:38 -0700 From: "Leroy Van Camp III" Subject: [MYSTARA] - [ADMIN] Subject Headers Mystarans, A little bit on subject headers. The MML has no keyword system, so adding words like "CUSTOM" is unnecessary, since it is unlikely to really mean anything. You can if you wish, it just doesn't acheive much other than a busy header. On the other hand, the list already adds [MYSTARA] to the subject of every post, so adding it again is very unnecessary, giving us headers like "Re: [MYSTARA] - MYSTARA: D&D". So do not add to it; let the listserver do its job. Thank you. Leroy Van Camp III malacoda@lesbois.com ICQ #20039817 "Let's show this prehistoric bitch how we do things downtown." Dr. Venkmen, Ghostbusters *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 28 Feb 1999 16:29:49 -0500 From: Sharon Dornhoff Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Slow travel >Re: the temperature thingy about the underground travel, 40 deg. C is the >typical Australian desert type temperature, and although it CAN kill you, >it by no means has to. I remember hearing, in physiology class, about an IRL doctor/researcher -- his name escapes me -- who set out to prove that people who die from heat exhaustion, do so because of dehydration, NOT because of the heat itself. He demonstrated this by stripping himself naked (so hot clothing wouldn't sear his skin), entering a room that'd been heated to oven-temperature (!), and staying inside there for an entire day. By sipping warm water from a tap every few minutes, so his body wouldn't dry itself out from sweating, he proved that a well-hydrated person can endure extremes of heat with no ill effects ... even though the raw T-bone steak he'd brought into the room with him had been cooked through! So don't worry so much, about heat-resistance magics: it's a Decanter of Endless Water, that'll REALLY get the PCs through the magma layers. ;-) *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 28 Feb 1999 16:31:33 -0500 (EST) From: au998@freenet.carleton.ca (Geoff Gander) Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Weapon mastery Bungo wrote: >I was wondering... does anyone of you use the *real* weapon mastery rules? >We (our group) think they do ridicously high amounts of damage, so we came >up with something different. It's pretty simple, but it's been playtested >for a while now (5 years more or less), so I can tell you it works. This is one way to do it. To tell you the truth, my group uses the Weapon Mastery rules "as is", and we've never found that the damage is too high. Of course, I also use Weapon Mastery for intelligent monsters, so that evens out the balance a bit, as per the Rc... Geoff - -- Geoff Gander, BA 97 Cartographer/Game Designer/Government Peon Part-Time High Priest, Ottawa Chapter of the Church of Y'hog au998@freenet.carleton.ca *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 28 Feb 1999 19:44:09 -0500 From: Jeff Daly Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Weapon mastery Yeah, it bothered me more (before the Master Set came out) how a 20th level character does the exact same damage as a greenhorn. Geoff Gander wrote: > Bungo wrote: > > >I was wondering... does anyone of you use the *real* weapon mastery rules? > >We (our group) think they do ridicously high amounts of damage, so we came > >up with something different. It's pretty simple, but it's been playtested > >for a while now (5 years more or less), so I can tell you it works. > > > > This is one way to do it. To tell you the truth, my group uses the Weapon > Mastery rules "as is", and we've never found that the damage is too high. > Of course, I also use Weapon Mastery for intelligent monsters, so that > evens out the balance a bit, as per the Rc... > > Geoff > > -- > Geoff Gander, BA 97 > Cartographer/Game Designer/Government Peon > Part-Time High Priest, Ottawa Chapter of the Church of Y'hog > au998@freenet.carleton.ca > *************************************************************************** > To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line > 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 1 Mar 1999 02:12:27 +0100 From: "=?ISO-8859-1?Q?Andr=E9s_Piquer_Otero?=" Subject: [MYSTARA] - ALPHATIAN FOLLOWERS OF AIR I will start my description of the Five Paths of Old Alphatian Magick (and I will try to be concise): GENERAL GAME RULES 1. The Paths are exclusive: no PC of NPC mage may follow two paths (in that respect, they are similar to Glantri Crafts). 2. They are quite arcane; it is VERY difficult to find a true practitioner (about a 1% of Alphatian mage population). Most Followers of Air, Fire, Earth and Water just content themselves with practising Elementalism of the Element related to their chosen Sphere (Elementalism in Alphatia follows the rules of Glantri Elementalism Craft from GAZ3 or GKoM with one exception: there are no restrictions in the number of 5th Circle practitioners, although they are very rare -less than one per Alphatian Kingdom in the average). 3. It is possible to start practising Elementalism and then switching to (or combining) the True Path of the related Element (after all, it is a progression from the study of an emanation of the Spheres -the Elemental planes- to th Spheres themselves); in fact, most Alphatians do it. 4. Technically, there is no restriction to the race or species of the practitioner: he might be human, elf, monster wokan; Alphatian, Ylari, Glantrian... Nevertheless, the Paths are considered the most arcane and ancestral lore of Old Alphatia. Convincing an Alphatian Archmage of teaching a compatriote would be difficult, much harder to a foreigner! 5. Like Glantrian crafts, Paths are measured in terms of "circles"; each path has 4 circles and each circle has a single related ability. Besides reaching a minimum Experience Level, characters must allot a number of XP (which are lost) to master the ability. They must the pass a INT check and spend some weeks in training. If the check is failed, the XP are lost for good. ABILITY LEVEL MINIMUM EXPERIENCE LEVEL XP COST TRAINING WEEKS 1 5 2500 4 2 9 5500 8 3 15 12000 16 4 25 30000 35 ____________________________________________________________________________ ___________ THE PATH OF AIR: THELEMICS 1. Followers of Air try to master the power of thought: for them, to think is to believe. This may be done through everyday low magic, but their craft assures them greater control and understanding in the world of ideas, feelings and perceptions. 2. This might be seen as the "official" Alphatian Path. Well, now that most knowledge of the Paths has been lost, most practitioners continue to be Followers of Air (about 90% of today followers of Crafts). They have been greatly changed in their ideas after the war that brought an end to Old Alphatia. Most of them have taken to contemplative life and spend much of their lives meditating upon the world and the structure of ideas. In Old Alphatia, Followers of Air would build cloisters in high peaks and cloud cities, impossible to reach by normal means. There are some cloisters, most of them in ruins, in Mystaran Alphatia, but they are kept by ordinary elementalists, without any knowledge of the True Path. It is rumored to still exist one cloister where a handful of True Followers practise their teachings... if somebody could reach them... 3. These are the powers of the Path: LEVEL 1: ORIENTATION The novice Thelemic is taught to meditate on the order of the spheres and the ideas, so that he may rid his mind from mundane distractions and focus the true power of his thought. Application of this power is mandatory before trying any other Thelemic magic. The Thelemic must spend a number of rounds in meditation (without any disturbance) equal to the minimum level to practice his most powerful ability or spell (this is, a 5th Lvl Thelemic of the 1st Circle should spend 5 rounds, but a 7th level one should spend 7). This state last for a number of turns equal to his level and can be accomplished but once per day for each Path level the character has. Orientation requires absence of strong noises, a good night's rest and absence of major discomfort. Powerful Thelemics may orientate themselves in terrible situations, like torture, but that requires a saving throw vs. Breath Weapon. To accomplish orientation, the character must pass both an INT and WIS check. Once orientated, he could only be dragged from that state by direct physical damage, but it is possible to avoid it by making a Saving Throw vs. Breat Weapon. Benefits: besides being able of initiating other Thelemic powers, characters under meditation gain: +2 bonus to every roll they should make involving concentration or self control. +2 bonus against any attemp of mind-control or influence. -2 to save against any spell cast by them involving the mind (illusions, charms, emotions...) LEVEL 2: DISCERNING OF TRUTH This power may be used as many times per day as Path levels the character has. The Thelemic automatically disbelieves any illusion or phantasm in his background (visual or otherwise), as well as magically-induced emotions or desires. He may try to dispel them utterly, so that they also stop hindering his. To accomplish it, he rolls agaisnt the caster as per the chances of a successful Dispel Magic (even if the Thelemic does not know that spell). LEVEL3: ARTIFICIAL ELEMENT (EGREGORUM) Usable as many times per week as Path levels the character has; this powerful ability allows the Thelemic to create an idea, emotion or desire and link it to a place or person. It may be as specific or as abstract as the mage wishes (from "hatred" or "fear" to "desire to read" or "a compulsion to kill Stefan Karameikos"). People enetering the area (or being a direct subject to the incantation) must save vs. spell at -4 or be unable to resist the compulsion. Those who save may choose to resist, but will find great stress in doing so (-2 to every roll). In order to fix an Egregorum, the mage must "capture" the desired emotion from a convenient place: that is, anywhere where at least 1000 people are experiencing that emotion or thought. He might "accumulate" emotions by visiting different locales where people experience the same feeling (EG, five different temples of Ixion to create an Egregorum of "devotion towards Ixion", or 500 happy couples to capture "lust"). He must spend an hour at each site in incantation and use an expensive vessel (10000 gp value) to capture the emotion. Then, back at the desired place or person (which must be willing or restrained), he spends a full day in magical procedures, which culminate in the shattering of the vessel. The Egregorum or "Artificial Element" is then permanently fixed and may only be wished away or dispelled by a caster of a higher level than the Thelemic. LEVEL 4: TRUE WILL The ultimate power of Thelemics is finding out that spellcasting is a mere crutch for the powers of will. By reaching the highest level of power, the caster (4 times per week) may trascend the need of memorizing spells and using hand-gestures, words and magical tools (if using AD&D). In fact, each spell slot the character possesses is like a Wish spell of the adequate level (that is, a 1st lvl wish could duplicate any 1st lvl spell or any effect with a power comparable to a 1st lvl spell; a 5th lvl"wish", like any spell of 5th lvl or under). A Wish follows the normal rules. This power is very great, for it lets a mage trascend the limitations of his daily spell choice, but it has its risks: each usage of the power may run for a day... but every time the magic-user uses 10 spell levels of "wishing magic", he must pass a saving throw vs. spells (at -1 for each 10 after ther first) or become hopelessly mad from the experience of pure power (the DM takes the character as an NPC, unless the player agrees to make a fine and difficult role--playing job). As the "spells" do not need gestures or words, the caster may invoke his power while gagged, tied or underwater, etc. 4. Penalties: Besides the standard penalty for an Elementalist (if the character was one of such before initiating himself into the Path), Thelemics become quite self centered and may fall into lapses of deep distraction and absent-mindedness. Every time that they engage into an activity considered "routine" or "boring" (like waiting for someone at a pub table, walking down an apparently empty corridor or standing guard), the DM may deem oportune to have the character make both a WIS check and a Saving Throw vs. spell. If any of them fails, the character lapses into mental divagation and may commit serious negligences. Besides, Thelemics reaching the 3rd Circle become so deeply involved in continuous and divergent speculation that they suffer a permanent -1 penalty to initiative. - -------------------------------------------- I will follow with the other Paths; give me some feedback, please. Andrés *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 28 Feb 1999 20:40:44 EST From: Arminath@aol.com Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - MYSTARA: D&D In a message dated 2/28/99 3:14:48 AM Eastern Standard Time, geckoes@ozemail.com.au writes: << Has anyone looked at or bought the new D&D Boxed set? Does it have anything at all to do with Mystara? >> It's out? I thought it wasn't due to be released till April??? Jim *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 28 Feb 1999 21:15:49 -0500 (EST) From: Kevin Turner Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - MYSTARA: D&D On Sun, 28 Feb 1999 Arminath@aol.com wrote: > << Has anyone looked at or bought the new D&D Boxed set? Does it have > anything at all to do with Mystara? >> > > It's out? I thought it wasn't due to be released till April??? I hadn't heard anything about it at all. Is this OD&D, or AD&D3, or what? - --Frobozz-- *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 28 Feb 1999 21:42:28 -0500 (EST) From: SteelAngel Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - AD&D SITES IN MYSTARA On Mon, 1 Mar 1999, Jonathan Nolan, Barrister & Solicitor, FTIA wrote: > > ORIENTAL ADVENTURES > Ochalea is a Japanese Oriental Adventures setting. > Kara-Tur is placed above the Savage Coast within Hule You're AD&D settings list is sooooo Brun-centric. MOrient is on Skothar. Ethan *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 28 Feb 1999 23:06:58 EST From: Arminath@aol.com Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - MYSTARA: D&D In a message dated 2/28/99 9:23:57 PM Eastern Standard Time, sg96d355@drexel.edu writes: << I hadn't heard anything about it at all. Is this OD&D, or AD&D3, or what? >> Not ADD3 (that'll be in 2 years tops IMNSHO). I suppose I'll buy all the 2nd Edition stuff I can so I don't support the new system, especially if they move from a class/level system to the "much heralded" skills systems clone of every other game out there now. I hate it when some bean counter takes something good and turns it into a clone of the current fad. *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 28 Feb 1999 23:00:49 -0700 From: "Leroy Van Camp III" Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - D&D Arminath@aol.com meandered fecklessly... > Not ADD3 (that'll be in 2 years tops IMNSHO). I suppose I'll buy all the 2nd > Edition stuff I can so I don't support the new system, especially if they move > from a class/level system to the "much heralded" skills systems > clone of every other game out there now. I hate it when some bean counter > takes something good and turns it into a clone of the current fad. While I am not necessarily advocating the conversion of AD&D to a skill based system (which doesn't really matter, since the chances of that happening are about nil), I have a hard time defining something used in around 75% of systems a fad. Were not talking something that was made up last week or a year or two ago. Personally, I find the list of things that make class-based better than skill based to be short. Very short. Leroy Van Camp III malacoda@lesbois.com ICQ #20039817 "Let's show this prehistoric bitch how we do things downtown." Dr. Venkmen, Ghostbusters *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ End of mystara-digest V1999 #105 ******************************** *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara' as the body of the message. mystara-digest Monday, March 1 1999 Volume 1999 : Number 106 Mystara is a trademark of TSR Inc. All Rights Reserved. The following topics are covered in this digest: Re: [MYSTARA] - AD&D SITES IN MYSTARA Re: [MYSTARA] - [MYSTARA] locations [MYSTARA] - Mystara FAQ v5.6 Re: [MYSTARA] - Weapon mastery [MYSTARA] - Re: ALPHATIAN FOLLOWERS OF AIR [MYSTARA] - Re: Mystara FAQ v5.6 Re: [MYSTARA] - Re: Mystara FAQ v5.6 Re: [MYSTARA] - Re: Mystara FAQ v5.6 Re: [MYSTARA] - AD&D SITES IN MYSTARA Re: [MYSTARA] - Re: Mystara FAQ v5.6 Re: [MYSTARA] - AD&D SITES IN MYSTARA ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Mon, 1 Mar 1999 17:43:37 +1100 (EST) From: "Jonathan Nolan, Barrister & Solicitor, FTIA" Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - AD&D SITES IN MYSTARA > > > > ORIENTAL ADVENTURES > > Ochalea is a Japanese Oriental Adventures setting. > > Kara-Tur is placed above the Savage Coast within Hule > > You're AD&D settings list is sooooo Brun-centric. Your not You're > > MOrient is on Skothar. > > > Ethan 1. they are not "my" AD&D settings. they are the ones people have sent to me. and my own AD&D Mystara campaign is the whole world with entire other settings as bits of the planet beyond the Known World. also looking at the list of stuff people sent in to me, how is Bral's Rock orbiting the same sun Brun-centric? Tomb of Horrors in Malpheggi swamp? Al-Qadim in the far west? Ochalea as OA Japan? Lendore Isle in the middle of the seas? Having the capital of Hule be a Sorceror-King city from Athas? 2. whatever (M)Orient is. and why would it be on Skothar? why not Brun? why not on an entirely new continent? why not on one of the moons? 3. Brun is where people seem to play. must be due to the fact that gee I dunno maybe 85% of all the published material is set there? duh. *** If you have to take a leak, pee out of the tent, not into it. *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 1 Mar 1999 19:51:37 +1100 (EST) From: "Jonathan Nolan, Barrister & Solicitor, FTIA" Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - [MYSTARA] locations > I never saw much about where people were placing old AD&D modules in > Mystara. I liked this idea, and I'd like to compile a list of possible > locations for 1st edition AD&D modules, but moved into Mystara. > > Let me see your ideas. > > --Frobozz-- Others from Tim Fung: * Night Below below Mirros, * Undermountain under Altan Tepes all the way to Darokin, so Underdark is above the Hollow World rock shell. *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 01 Mar 1999 10:08:47 CET From: "Herve Musseau" Subject: [MYSTARA] - Mystara FAQ v5.6 Mystara FAQ version 5.6 by Hervé Musseau The latest version of this document can be found at http://www.geocities.com/TimesSquare/Lair/8932/Mystara/mystfaq.txt Q: What is Mystara? A: Mystara is an imaginary world created by TSR as a campaign world for roleplaying games using the rules of Dungeons and Dragons. Q: What is a roleplaying game? A: Roleplaying games are games in which people play the role of imaginary fantastic characters like warriors or wizards and try to complete an adventure under the guidance of a game master. Q: I never heard of Mystara, but I know a setting called the Known World which looks pretty the same. What's the difference? A: Mystara got a name as a world only recently; before that, it was often referred to as the Known World, although Mystara is more than just the Known World. Q: So, what's Mystara? The Known World and what else? A: Mystara is basically composed of 2 main parts, the Outer World and the Hollow World, plus 2 moons, and some other exotic settings. Q: A Hollow World? A: Yes. Mystara, unlike our earth, is hollow, an empty sphere. It has an internal sun that lights the interior world, making it inhabitable. It holds old civilizations that are now extinct on the Outer World, placed there by the Immortals with strong magic preventing them from evolving much or dying away. The only entrances to the Hollow World are through underground passages between the two worlds, and through the holes that stand in place of the north and south poles. Q: And the Outer World? A: The Outer World is mostly like our Earth. It comprises: * the Known World (now called Old World), where the most civilized countries are located, * Alphatia (only before AC 1009), * the Savage Coast and Hule, * the southern continent, called Davania, * the eastern continent, called Skothar. Q: Why is Alphatia part of Mystara only up to AC 1009? A: Because Alphatia, which is a large continent east of the Known World, sank into the ocean in AC 1009, at the end of the major event called Wrath of the Immortals. It is now a floating continent located in the Hollow World. Q: What exactly is Wrath of the Immortals? A: Wrath of the Immortals (or WotI) is a great campaign that TSR published to update the Known World. It deals with the Great War that involves the major countries of Mystara and that was caused by the Immortals to obtain control of the Nucleus of the Spheres, a powerful artifact located under Glantri. At the end of the war, Alphatia sinks, Glantri and Thyatis have suffered dramatically from the conflict and three new powers enter the political scene of Mystara: the Heldannic Territories, the Hagiarchy of Hule and the "revamped" Kingdom of Karameikos. Q: On the continental map published in the Master DM's book, there are some empires I've never read anything about in other products and on the list, like the Empire of Dorphin IV or the Empire of the Great Khan. Do they exist? Where can I find information about these? A: The map in the Master set is wrong, wrong, wrong! In the series of articles written by Bruce Heard in Dragon Magazine, the first in the series (Dragon #153) explains this all. The map was the was released by a very imaginative Thyatian, and wrongly accepted for the truth. There is no Empire of Dorphin IV, no Empire of the Great Khan, etc. Also, as you probably guessed, the size of the Thyatian Empire was largely exagerated on this map... Q: I've already heard from the Known World, and from the Hollow World too, but never as Mystara. What does all this mean? A: This is because Mystara is a very old world, one of the oldest created by TSR, and, as TSR grew, so did Mystara. All of these product lines are revelant to Mystara: * Mystara, of course, * the Known World and most stuff that were made for D&D (as opposed to AD&D) like these old good modules B and X, or the Gazetteers, * the Hollow World, * Red Steel/the Savage Coast, * Blackmoor. Also, some products bearing the label First Quest are related to Mystara. Q: Blackmoor? I know a Blackmoor, but it's part of Greyhawk, isn't it? A: Blackmoor was, like Greyhawk, the campaign world of one of TSR's founder, Dave Arneson. It was later placed in both Greyhawk and the Known World (as a past kingdom in the later), effectively making three Blackmoors exist. It seems there is no further relation between the two Blackmoors of Mystara and Greyhawk, however, although some people made the assumption; on the other hand, Judge's Guild's Blackmoor likely has much in common with Mystara's, as the DA series for the Known World was also written by Dave Arneson (so that JG First Fantasy Campaign is considered Mystara-relevant). Q: Where is it located? A: Blackmoor was a techno-magical kingdom that blew itself up a few millenia ago. The event shifted the planet's axis and Blackmoor is now the north pole. Sources are contradictory as to where Blackmoor stands; some place it on Brun, some on Skothar. Arguments in favor of Brun are the position of the Inn Between the Worlds and the Nucleus of the Sphere, and the fact that the Known World stands there; this is the solution proposed in some Gazetteers. Arguments in favor of Skothar are its sort of canonical status, and the feeling that all civilizations should not systamatically come from the Known World; this is the solution proposed in the Hollow World box. Note that, if you consider the Hollow World solution to be the truth in your campaign, the map in the box does have a typo : the names of Blackmoor and Thonia have been reversed (Blackmoor was north of the Empire of Thonia according to all other sources). Bruce Heard's opinion on this matter : << Blackmoor -- the travelling legend. If there were archaeologist on Mystara, they would have a devil of time figuring where the darn place was really located. Officially, it's supposed to be up there by the Thonian Marches. Unfortunately, conflicting info has crept into several products, getting in the way of the Thonian theory. The best thing is to assume evidence of Blackmoor's presence elsewhere is the result of later colonizations and outposts. Other communities were also magically displaced (such as a certain ancient tavern in the Broken Lands of the Known World). Definitely a messy development of the World of Mystara! :) >> So officially the answer is Skothar. Q: Ok, and now what's Red Steel? A: Red Steel is a setting that is part of Mystara (west of the Known World), although it was released as a stand-alone setting. Q: I have a player of the Church of Karameikos, and I whant to give him an Immortal, I suppose that it's a church with many Immortals (like the Greek / Latin church) but in Gaz 1 I dind't find any list of Inmortals... A: These are the immortals of the Church of Karameikos, as told by Bruce Heard in an old Dragon Magazine: Asterius (Eternal of Thought), Leader Kagyar (Eternal of Matter) Ilsundal (Hierarch of Thought) Valerias (Hierarch of Matter) Vanya (Empyreal of Time). Also, although Chardastes is a native Traladaran Immortal, he is venerated through the auspices of the Church of Karameikos, not the Church of Traladara. This is extrapolated from info in B1-9 In Search of Adventure. The Immortals of the Church of Traladara are: Halav Petra Zirchev. Q: You spoke of Immortals, what are they? Are they Gods? A: Mystara has a different pantheon when compared to other D&D settings. Most notably, it has no gods, but beings called Immortals. Immortals are mortals who, through their deeds, have reached a higher status granting them more power than mere mortals. Basically, however, Immortals are not very different from Gods of other settings. Q: Is Jaggar von Drachenfelds the Star Dragon? A: No. According to Bruce Heard's article in Dragon #170 http://www.tsrinc.com/periodicals/dragon/backissues/170jun91/170FromHatchlingTo.txt he became the Star Dragon for a brief period but relinquished the title for absolution. Q: Also you mentionned something about D&D not being AD&D. What does that mean? A: Mystara was the world designed to be used with the rules of D&D (often called OD&D to better distinct it from AD&D and from the generic term D&D which could mean both; OD&D stands for Old D&D or Original D&D - note that some few people call it BD&D for Basic D&D to distinguish it from even older rules). It appeared in the old boxed rules: the Expert box, the Companion box and the Master box. Most of the earlier modules designed for D&D were set in this world. Recently, however, Mystara has been converted to AD&D (along with Red Steel), but many people who play in Mystara do it with the old rules (or their reedition, Rules Cyclopedia). Q: When I read stuff about Mystara I keep seeing acronyms I cannot understand like WotI or PWA. What do they mean? A: There is a list of Mystara relevant acronyms at http://www.geocities.com/TimesSquare/Lair/8932/Mystara/acronyms.html Q: I heard that the Mystara line was cancelled. Is this true? A: It is unfortunately true. And Red Steel is cancelled too. Some novels pertaining to Mystara may be released as part of the First Quest line, and modules may be part of the Odyssey line. AFAIK, there is no such products in preparation however, though Wizards of the Coast (which bought TSR) has expressed its willingness to publish material for dead worlds, but never namely mentioned Mystara. Keep faith. Joshuan's Almanach was the last product of Mystara (to be precise the novel "The Black Vessel" has been released after, and to be even more precise it deals with the Savage Coast) and the Savages Baronies the last of Red Steel (except for online exclusives). Q: But I saw in TSR's 97 preview that there would be Red Steel modules released as online exclusive. What does this mean? A: TSR has released these modules for free on its site of MPGN at ftp://ftp.mpgn.com and http://www.tsrinc.com. Q: So, if TSR has dropped the line, how can I get new material for Mystara? A: There are many people on the web who love Mystara and have taken upon themselves to keep Mystara alive (and well alive). There is a mailing list dedicated to Mystara (MML) where people discuss together about it, exchanging ideas, points of view, and more. To subscribe, send e-mail to majordomo@mpgn.com. In the body, have the single line: subscribe Mystara-L . It has 224 people, as of end April 98. Not quite a billion served, but we're getting there. As a comparison, there are 395 people on the Realms list, TSR's flagship world (source : Leroy Van Camp, MML admin). There is also the TSR Mystara Message Board (MMB) at http://tsronline.wizards.com:80/mb/system/addnewuser.shtml where discussion revolves mostly around alternate Mystaras. There are also many pages around the net dedicated to Mystara, sometimes with lots of interesting materials. Some of these pages are organized into a Webring, check http://www.geocities.com/TimesSquare/Dungeon/2967/mystring.html for info about the Mystara webring. Now more than ever you should express your views on how Mystara should be brought back at http://CWSpot.com/Mystara/SaveMystara or join the SaveMystara Writer's Group whose goal is to get as many adventures and articles to the periodicals as we can. Q: Where can I find the old messages of the Mystara mailing list? A: The digests are collected at ftp://ftp.mpgn.com/Gaming/ADND/Worlds/Mystara/MailingListArchive/ and the oldest ones (prior to 1998) can be found at ftp://ftp.io.com/pub/mailing-lists/mystara-digest/ However for your convenience the most interesting aricles the list has come up with are collected and sorted on Shawn's page at http://www.geocities.com/TimesSquare/5304/ Q: Where can I find the old messages of the Mystara message board? A: There is no archiving of the board. However for your convenience the most interesting aricles the board has come up with are collected and sorted on Shawn's page at http://www.geocities.com/TimesSquare/5304/prodlist.html Q: Where can I find a complete list of the material published for Mystara? A: The most complete lists to my knowledge is at http://www.geocities.com/TimesSquare/5304/prodlist.html It includes rulebooks and modules published by TSR, Mystara-relevant Judge Guild supplements, a list of various magazine #s that contain adventures, rules or world description pertaining to Mystara, novels, TSR net resources, and Clark Ashton Smith stories related to Averoigne. All of these are ranked according to compatibility with Mystara (explicit, implicit, compatible, etc.) and the type of product (campaign source, rules supplement, adventure, etc.). Q: And where can I buy those products? A: Since the Mystara line is out of print, it is difficult to find them. If you're lucky you can find them in any shop that sells RPG stuff, or buy second-hand books. Some places where you can find Mystara stuff on the web: http://www.dragontrove.com/listing.html http://www.titan-games.com/ http://www.rpgspot.com/main.htm http://www.hitpointe.com http://www.eskimo.com/~darkh/ http://www.ida.net/users/groverm/sleeping.dragon/sdh.html http://www.djhobby.com/catalog/index.html http://www.sagesguild.com/ http://www.crazyegors.com/ the newsgroup rec.games.frp.marketplace and I got a special page for all Mystara books at Amazon.com: http://www.geocities.com/TimesSquare/Lair/8932/amazon.html Q: Where can I find the FAQ for the Mystara mailing list? A: Check at http://www.lesbois.com/members/malacoda/mmlfaq.htm . AFAIK there is no plain text version of this FAQ. _____________________________________________________________ Herve Musseau Homepage: http://www.geocities.com/TimesSquare/Lair/8932/ Net Almanac: http://www.geocities.com/TimesSquare/Lair/9037/ ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 1 Mar 1999 10:55:05 +0100 (MET) From: Agathokles Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Weapon mastery On Sun, 28 Feb 1999, Geoff Gander wrote: > Bungo wrote: > > >I was wondering... does anyone of you use the *real* weapon mastery rules? > >We (our group) think they do ridicously high amounts of damage, so we came > >up with something different. It's pretty simple, but it's been playtested > >for a while now (5 years more or less), so I can tell you it works. > > > > This is one way to do it. To tell you the truth, my group uses the Weapon > Mastery rules "as is", and we've never found that the damage is too high. > Of course, I also use Weapon Mastery for intelligent monsters, so that > evens out the balance a bit, as per the Rc... > > Geoff > I used Weapon Mastery when I was playing oD&D, but when I tried to play the duel with the avengers in CM1, it took hours! No one was able to score an hit, as all blows were deflected. I think that Weapon Mastery works well for low-level characters (1st to 9th level), but not for Companion level campaigns. Giampaolo Agosta *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 01 Mar 1999 21:02:27 +1100 From: stan Subject: [MYSTARA] - Re: ALPHATIAN FOLLOWERS OF AIR Andrés you should consider looking at the MMB, at the moment people are discussing creating Alphatian paths in the same way you have. >I will start my description of the Five Paths of Old Alphatian Magick (and >I will try to be concise): stan http://www.geocities.com/TimesSquare/5304 *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 1 Mar 1999 21:24:38 +1100 (EST) From: "Jonathan Nolan, Barrister & Solicitor, FTIA" Subject: [MYSTARA] - Re: Mystara FAQ v5.6 This is not a flame at Herve Musseau, but a FAQ should be a FAQ so I have drawn my red pen. So, in editor mode: > Q: What is Mystara? > A: Mystara is an imaginary world created by TSR as a campaign world for > roleplaying games using the rules of Dungeons and Dragons. why not use the summary from Black Vessel, minus the misleading bit about "the gods"? plus there are non-TSR games rules used to run the world. TSR didn't do Mystara many favours - seems a shame to do them one as a freebie. > Q: What exactly is Wrath of the Immortals? > A: Wrath of the Immortals (or WotI) is a great campaign that TSR > published "a great campaign" is an editorial comment, not a factual statement suitable for a faq. > Q: I've already heard from the Known World, and from the Hollow World this is presumably a language thing but in English that should be heard OF the Known World and heard OF the Hollow World. Reads better. > Q: Blackmoor? I know a Blackmoor, but it's part of Greyhawk, isn't it? > A: Blackmoor was, like Greyhawk, the campaign world of one of TSR's > founder, Dave Arneson. It was later placed in both Greyhawk and the > Known > World (as a past kingdom in the later), effectively making three > Blackmoors > exist. It seems there is no further relation between the two Blackmoors If Blackmoor is to be mentioned in this way, shouldn't the real, adult, real world reason be given - the legal battle between Dave Arneson and the megalomaniacal Gygax? There is no sensible "in-game" reason and otherwise poor readers may spend wasted hours trying to work out why there are so many Blackmoors. Also there was a Blackmoor original D&D booklet, that is the real D&D source of the setting. > So officially the answer is Skothar. Unless we play and own DA1-4 in which case the answer is sort of the broken lands and is pretty much irrelevant anyway. > Q: You spoke of Immortals, what are they? Are they Gods? > A: Mystara has a different pantheon when compared to other D&D settings. > Most notably, it has no gods, but beings called Immortals. Immortals are > mortals who, through their deeds, have reached a higher status granting > them more power than mere mortals. Basically, however, Immortals are not > very different from Gods of other settings. this directly contradicted by the beloved "canon" sources. Case in point: Averoigne priests and ahem "City of the Gods". > Q: Is Jaggar von Drachenfelds the Star Dragon? this is nonensical and clique-ish unless explained. > A: Mystara was the world designed to be used with the rules of D&D > (often > called OD&D to better distinct it from AD&D and from the generic term > D&D > which could mean both; OD&D stands for Old D&D or Original D&D - note > that > some few people call it BD&D for Basic D&D to distinguish it from even > older rules). > It appeared in the old boxed rules: the Expert box, the Companion box > and > the Master box. Most of the earlier modules designed for D&D were set in > this world. Recently, however, Mystara has been converted to AD&D (along > with Red Steel), but many people who play in Mystara do it with the old > rules (or their reedition, Rules Cyclopedia). If we just abandoned all the nomenclature we could devote valuable space to eg FAQ entries on the Beastman Wars, Mystara's history, Radiance... > Q: When I read stuff about Mystara I keep seeing acronyms I cannot > understand like WotI or PWA. What do they mean? > A: There is a list of Mystara relevant acronyms at > http://www.geocities.com/TimesSquare/Lair/8932/Mystara/acronyms.html or perhaps we could dispense with acronyms altogether, or cite the full name the first time then abbreviate sensibly afterwards. subcultural language isolates rather than unites. - -------------------------------------------------------------------- * * Jonathan Nolan FTIA - International Law practice call 618 89310176 * * - -------------------------------------------------------------------- Mystara/RPG Netbooks: www.physics.adelaide.edu.au/~ksimpson/netbooks.html *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 01 Mar 1999 07:22:32 -0500 From: Jerry Hovenanian Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Re: Mystara FAQ v5.6 "Jonathan Nolan, Barrister & Solicitor, FTIA" wrote: > > Q: When I read stuff about Mystara I keep seeing acronyms I cannot > > understand like WotI or PWA. What do they mean? > > A: There is a list of Mystara relevant acronyms at > > http://www.geocities.com/TimesSquare/Lair/8932/Mystara/acronyms.html > > or perhaps we could dispense with acronyms altogether, or cite the full > name the first time then abbreviate sensibly afterwards. subcultural > language isolates rather than unites. > I disagree. When one learns them, they become part of our Mystara culture and they are not hard to learn....just ask on the list. When someone asks an acronym question...it is usually answered very quickly. But maybe in the " Welcome to the mystara-l mailing list" note one gets when they join...there should be a link to the above list of acronyms used on the list. As for the FAQ....no where in it does it state what the acronym "FAQ" stands for :) -- Jerry Hovenanian clumsydwarf@hotmail.com *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 1 Mar 1999 07:27:53 -0500 (EST) From: Mischa E Gelman Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Re: Mystara FAQ v5.6 > many Blackmoors. Also there was a Blackmoor original D&D booklet, that is > the real D&D source of the setting. Never heard of this. Does anyone have more info? I know of the Judges Guild production and the DA series, but not anything else. > > So officially the answer is Skothar. > > Unless we play and own DA1-4 in which case the answer is sort of the > broken lands and is pretty much irrelevant anyway. DA1-4 never mentions the original location of Blackmoor - the inn could easily have been moved away with the destruction. Or at least this answer seems more reasonable to me than the idea that the Thonians rebuilt their entire civilization on a whole 'nother continent. The 'officially' part might not be a good idea in the FAQ though, as this can be argued. - - Mischa We have created two myths in the 1980s. One is that you need to be smart to be an investment banker. That's wrong. Finance is easy. Myth number two is that investment bankers somehow create value. They don't. They shuffle around value other people have created. It's a parasitical industry. - a Wall Streeter, 1986 *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 1 Mar 1999 10:17:24 -0500 (EST) From: SteelAngel Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - AD&D SITES IN MYSTARA On Mon, 1 Mar 1999, Jonathan Nolan, Barrister & Solicitor, FTIA wrote: > sun Brun-centric? Tomb of Horrors in Malpheggi swamp? Al-Qadim in the far > west? Ochalea as OA Japan? Lendore Isle in the middle of the seas? Having > the capital of Hule be a Sorceror-King city from Athas? You've just mentioned a whole level of Brun-centric-ness. I don't get it. Why is Brun so popular? There is a whole damn undiscovered/untouched continent (skothar) that realistically noone has done too much with. There is more to Mystara than Brun. There is a whole WORLD. > 3. Brun is where people seem to play. must be due to the fact that gee I > dunno maybe 85% of all the published material is set there? duh. Well, gee, i dunno. Maybe as the keepers of Mystara, we should actually expand on the concept of the "known world"?? Or is that too different an idea? Brun is boring. It's overdone. Ethan - -- Ethan Deneault - PH/MU '99 www.wpi.edu/~eand - wpi.flame Quote Archive. *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 1 Mar 1999 10:24:26 -0500 (EST) From: SteelAngel Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Re: Mystara FAQ v5.6 On Mon, 1 Mar 1999, Jonathan Nolan, Barrister & Solicitor, FTIA wrote: > why not use the summary from Black Vessel, minus the misleading bit about > "the gods"? plus there are non-TSR games rules used to run the world. TSR > didn't do Mystara many favours - seems a shame to do them one as a > freebie. But the campaign world was created by TSR :) Credit where credit is due. > "a great campaign" is an editorial comment, not a factual statement > suitable for a faq. "Great" IMNSHO means "large" or "great of scale" > Unless we play and own DA1-4 in which case the answer is sort of the > broken lands and is pretty much irrelevant anyway. Sort of. But lets not be Brun-centric here :) > or perhaps we could dispense with acronyms altogether, or cite the full > name the first time then abbreviate sensibly afterwards. subcultural > language isolates rather than unites. Would you rather write out PWA as Poor Wizard's Almanac, when most people know what you are talking about? Remember, a lot of us here have most, if not all the D&D books. I don't think using acronyms splinters the community. It's not like some people are speaking Ebonics, yo. Ethan :) - -- Ethan Deneault - PH/MU '99 www.wpi.edu/~eand - wpi.flame Quote Archive. *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 1 Mar 1999 16:33:42 +0100 (MET) From: =?iso-8859-1?Q?H=E5vard_R=F8nne_Faanes?= Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - AD&D SITES IN MYSTARA On Mon, 1 Mar 1999, SteelAngel wrote: > On Mon, 1 Mar 1999, Jonathan Nolan, Barrister & Solicitor, FTIA wrote: > I don't get it. Why is Brun so popular? There is a whole damn > undiscovered/untouched continent (skothar) that realistically noone has > done too much with. There is more to Mystara than Brun. There is a whole > WORLD. > > > 3. Brun is where people seem to play. must be due to the fact that gee I > > dunno maybe 85% of all the published material is set there? duh. > > Well, gee, i dunno. Maybe as the keepers of Mystara, we should actually > expand on the concept of the "known world"?? Or is that too different an > idea? hey, Ethan, be nice huh? :) Ofcourse, I agree that developing the unknown parts of Mystara is a good idea though. > Brun is boring. It's overdone. I dont really think you believe this. Brun is, like Jonathan said, where 99% of the published material is set. Is Glantri, Alfheim and the Savage Coast boring? Hĺvard Haavard R. Faanes (hoc@nvg.ntnu.no) http://www.nvg.ntnu.no/~hoc "Remember, there are no stupid questions, just stupid people." -Mr Garrison, South Park. *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ End of mystara-digest V1999 #106 ******************************** *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara' as the body of the message. mystara-digest Monday, March 1 1999 Volume 1999 : Number 107 Mystara is a trademark of TSR Inc. All Rights Reserved. The following topics are covered in this digest: Re: [MYSTARA] - AD&D SITES IN MYSTARA Re: [MYSTARA] - Re: Mystara FAQ v5.6 Re: [MYSTARA] - AD&D SITES IN MYSTARA Re: [MYSTARA] - Re: Mystara FAQ v5.6 Re: [MYSTARA] - Re: Mystara FAQ v5.6 Re: [MYSTARA] - A journey to the past Re: [MYSTARA] - MYSTARA: D&D [MYSTARA] - Re: Mystara FAQ v5.6 Re: [MYSTARA] - MYSTARA: D&D Re: [MYSTARA] - D&D Re: [MYSTARA] - Off Topic: AD&D 3rd Edition or RUNEQUEST? Re: [MYSTARA] - AD&D SITES IN MYSTARA Re: [MYSTARA] - Off Topic: AD&D 3rd Edition or RUNEQUEST? Re: [MYSTARA] - AD&D SITES IN MYSTARA Re: [MYSTARA] - Off Topic: AD&D 3rd Edition or RUNEQUEST? ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Tue, 2 Mar 1999 02:47:36 +1100 (EST) From: "Jonathan Nolan, Barrister & Solicitor, FTIA" Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - AD&D SITES IN MYSTARA > Well, gee, i dunno. Maybe as the keepers of Mystara, we should actually > expand on the concept of the "known world"?? Or is that too different an > idea? > > Brun is boring. It's overdone. > > Ethan > I must confess, I don't see myself as a keeper of Mystara. Mystara deserved better than it got from the Gygax era of TSR and better than it got from Wizards of the Coast, but equally we should avoid the error of casting down one control freak architecture to replace it with another with even less legitimacy. For some people, Mystara is Karameikos and that's it. For others, it's Ierendi or the Isle of Dread. But there is no real common ground except love of a setting even when the setting is radically altered in each campaign (as it should be). It's about hallucination by consensus, but a dreamer who opts out doesn't somehow sacrifice their rights. All TSR ever did was sell a corner of our own imagination back to us. I would suggest that 'Brun' as it was eventually called is more popular because it is more familiar and because there is a nostalgic association for older gamers with the modules set there. King Stephen/Stephan is a familiar figure from some people's childhood and adolescence. - -------------------------------------------------------------------- * * Jonathan Nolan FTIA - International Law practice call 618 89310176 * * - -------------------------------------------------------------------- Mystara/RPG Netbooks: www.physics.adelaide.edu.au/~ksimpson/netbooks.html *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 2 Mar 1999 02:51:52 +1100 (EST) From: "Jonathan Nolan, Barrister & Solicitor, FTIA" Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Re: Mystara FAQ v5.6 > Would you rather write out PWA as Poor Wizard's Almanac, when most people > know what you are talking about? Remember, a lot of us here have most, if > not all the D&D books. Yes, I do as a matter of fact. Or am I part of "us" ? I spent a few hours cruising all these Mystara sites, and there must be some reasons why some of them that have enormous potential are either not on the list at all or have reservations about it. Inclusionism good, babblespeak bad. I understand the acronyms, but the longer Mystara is out of print, the fewer people will when they first encounter them... Also what if a third party is to read some key list digest and then has to look up another document to translate from listese to english? I know some people just don't bother. Which is a shame and not our fault of course but nevertheless for the sake of a few more letters seems a bit silly not to make the effort. Unlike Forgettable Rorts they won't be bombarded in Dragon Magazine of reminders of what we are discussing... :) - -------------------------------------------------------------------- * * Jonathan Nolan FTIA - International Law practice call 618 89310176 * * - -------------------------------------------------------------------- Mystara/RPG Netbooks: www.physics.adelaide.edu.au/~ksimpson/netbooks.html *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 1 Mar 1999 10:58:59 -0500 (EST) From: SteelAngel Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - AD&D SITES IN MYSTARA On Mon, 1 Mar 1999, [iso-8859-1] Hĺvard Rřnne Faanes wrote: > hey, Ethan, be nice huh? :) > Ofcourse, I agree that developing the unknown parts of Mystara is a good > idea though. Its necessary. Mystara should be developed :) > 99% of the published material is set. Is Glantri, Alfheim and the Savage > Coast boring? No, but realistically, it seems that there is already TOOO much on Brun. Ethan - -- Ethan Deneault - PH/MU '99 www.wpi.edu/~eand - wpi.flame Quote Archive. *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 1 Mar 1999 11:10:20 -0500 (EST) From: SteelAngel Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Re: Mystara FAQ v5.6 On Tue, 2 Mar 1999, Jonathan Nolan, Barrister & Solicitor, FTIA wrote: > Yes, I do as a matter of fact. Or am I part of "us" ? I would most certainly hope so :) > babblespeak bad. I understand the acronyms, but the longer Mystara is out > of print, the fewer people will when they first encounter them... I dunno. The only really important acronyms are PWA, JA, WoTI, and maybe CoM. I don't think that they are too hard to figure out. (With the exception of JA. But I just consider that an almanac anyway, grouped together with Poor Wizards 1-3. ) > people just don't bother. Which is a shame and not our fault of course but > nevertheless for the sake of a few more letters seems a bit silly not to > make the effort. I see your point. But you can't completely eliminate acronyms from listspeak. Its that much easier to write WoTI than "the Wrath of the Immortals boxed set" Ethan - -- Ethan Deneault - PH/MU '99 www.wpi.edu/~eand - wpi.flame Quote Archive. *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 2 Mar 1999 03:25:48 +1100 (EST) From: "Jonathan Nolan, Barrister & Solicitor, FTIA" Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Re: Mystara FAQ v5.6 > I see your point. But you can't completely eliminate acronyms from > listspeak. Its that much easier to write WoTI than "the Wrath of the > Immortals boxed set" > > > Ethan couldn't resist: WotI ICETTT* Wrath of the Immortals, BOTOH** AFAIK*** given the size of the readership CWJ**** TMSOIF?***** etc.etc. (and yes I am a prat sometimes.) :) * is certainly easier to type than ** but on the other hand *** as far as I know **** can't we just ***** can't remember what this one was, sorry. guess I really am a prat! - -------------------------------------------------------------------- * * Jonathan Nolan FTIA - International Law practice call 618 89310176 * * - -------------------------------------------------------------------- Mystara/RPG Netbooks: www.physics.adelaide.edu.au/~ksimpson/netbooks.html *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 1 Mar 1999 17:44:28 +0100 (MET) From: =?iso-8859-1?Q?H=E5vard_R=F8nne_Faanes?= Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - A journey to the past On Fri, 26 Feb 1999, Jacob Skytte wrote: > In my plans for an upcoming campaign I've been delving into the > subjects of time travel. Based on the DA1-4 (or at least 1-3) I mean > to let my hapless PC's experience Blackmoor, get them familiar with > the setting and then blow it all up!!! Yes, I want them to be present > during the Great Rain of Fire, the Planetshift or whatever. In fact > I'd love to let my PC's contribute significantly to the causes of the > catastrophe. Then I plan to subject them to a modified version of the > events described in the Wrath of the Immortals boxed set; hopefully > corresponding to their experiences in the past (literally) and > focusing on the people, places, and items they've encountered in the > Blackmoor era. This sounds interesting. > Right now I'm in the planning stages and would love to hear any ideas > or comments from people on the list. I've downloaded a Blackmoor > Gazetteer from someone's homepage (if you're reading this; thanks, it > seems very helpful) for starters. You are probably referring to zimriel's blackmoor found at: http://home.earthlink.net/~zimriel/Blackmoor/ Some comments that you may wanna consider: There were no Orcs, goblins, trolls and the like arent around at this time. They are the descendants of the Beastmen, so I suggest that you replace the goblinoids mentioned with Beastmen. You can use the same statistics, but change the descriptions slightly. The DA adventures are set long before the destruction of Blackmoor. At the time of the destruction, Blackmoor has developed a high technological society. I'd recommend reading James Mishler(mystaros)'s timeline. Its not official, but it has some excellent ideas about Blackmoor in it. It can be found here: http://www.geocities.com/TimesSquare/5304/ageblack.html Hĺvard Haavard R. Faanes (hoc@nvg.ntnu.no) http://www.nvg.ntnu.no/~hoc "Remember, there are no stupid questions, just stupid people." -Mr Garrison, South Park. *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 1 Mar 1999 17:59:07 +0100 (MET) From: =?iso-8859-1?Q?H=E5vard_R=F8nne_Faanes?= Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - MYSTARA: D&D On Sun, 28 Feb 1999, Jonathan Nolan, Barrister & Solicitor, FTIA wrote: > Has anyone looked at or bought the new D&D Boxed set? Does it have > anything at all to do with Mystara? I havent actually looked at it, but from what i hear, the new D&D is just a simplified version of AD&D which has nothing to do with either Mystara or the Old D&D game. Hĺvard Haavard R. Faanes (hoc@nvg.ntnu.no) http://www.nvg.ntnu.no/~hoc "Remember, there are no stupid questions, just stupid people." -Mr Garrison, South Park. *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 01 Mar 1999 18:39:36 CET From: "Herve Musseau" Subject: [MYSTARA] - Re: Mystara FAQ v5.6 From: "Jonathan Nolan, Barrister & Solicitor, FTIA" <> Oh, I know editor mode. I'm the editor of the Mystaran Almanac. << > Q: What is Mystara? > A: Mystara is an imaginary world created by TSR as a campaign world for > roleplaying games using the rules of Dungeons and Dragons. why not use the summary from Black Vessel, minus the misleading bit about "the gods"? >> Because I don't like much quoting a TSR source with no approval from TSR. Besides, if there are cuts to do, why should I decide what stays and what's out? Quoting what I like and leaving the rest out doesn't appeal to me. Thus I prefer to make up my own text. <> But they created Mystara anyway - whatever grudge you or anyone holds against TSR shouldn't make us forget that if they didn't create it in the first place we wouldn't be there discussing it. As Steelangel wrote, "But the campaign world was created by TSR :) Credit where credit is due." <<> Q: What exactly is Wrath of the Immortals? > A: Wrath of the Immortals (or WotI) is a great campaign that TSR > published "a great campaign" is an editorial comment, not a factual statement suitable for a faq.>> Maybe it is a personal remark more than a factual statement. Is it mandatory for the FAQ to be 100% factual though? <<> Q: I've already heard from the Known World, and from the Hollow World this is presumably a language thing but in English that should be heard OF the Known World and heard OF the Hollow World. Reads better.>> okay. <<> Q: Blackmoor? I know a Blackmoor, but it's part of Greyhawk, isn't it? > A: Blackmoor was, like Greyhawk, the campaign world of one of TSR's > founder, Dave Arneson. It was later placed in both Greyhawk and the > Known > World (as a past kingdom in the later), effectively making three > Blackmoors > exist. It seems there is no further relation between the two Blackmoors If Blackmoor is to be mentioned in this way, shouldn't the real, adult, real world reason be given - the legal battle between Dave Arneson and the megalomaniacal Gygax? >> I don't want to get into that sort of argument, which probably interest very few people anyway as it's not game-related. Besides, you are taking sides. <> I doubt many people will "waste hours" working it out. Those few that noticed and are interested may very well develop their own in-game connections if they wish to (some have been proposed on the list at some point). Most will just not care, and the fact that the two have the same name and have some common background will never come to the foreground. Only people who have a deep knowledge of the game, the various worlds, and the gaming industry (and thus don't read the FAQ) will show any interest in this, IMO. <> Yes I know, I do have that (rare) booklet. That is the one Blackmoor that I refer to as the earlier/original Blackmoor (when saying it was later placed [...] it implies it was something else earlier). Note: for anyone who's interested, that booklet isn't of much relevance except to Mystara collectors. It contains early D&D rules, and a module/campaign setting placed in Blackmoor that is an earlier version of "the City of the Frog" that Dave Arneson later reworked into the DA2 module (also OOP, but a bit easier to get and definetely less expansive, not to mention more complete). <<> So officially the answer is Skothar. Unless we play and own DA1-4 in which case the answer is sort of the broken lands and is pretty much irrelevant anyway.>> I disagree with you; the official location IS Skothar. Like I mention in the FAQ though, canon is (and it's not the only such occurence) self-contradicting, so if you prefer to have it in Brun as it is suggested in various references, well it's your campaign. Many people do place it there, anyway; but it isn't the official location. <<> Q: You spoke of Immortals, what are they? Are they Gods? > A: Mystara has a different pantheon when compared to other D&D settings. > Most notably, it has no gods, but beings called Immortals. Immortals are > mortals who, through their deeds, have reached a higher status granting > them more power than mere mortals. Basically, however, Immortals are not > very different from Gods of other settings. this directly contradicted by the beloved "canon" sources. Case in point: Averoigne priests and ahem "City of the Gods".>> What contradicts what? Do you mean that by saying there is no god on Mystara I contradict those elements you mention? If so, then, well, there is actually no contradiction. The Averoignese priests, IIRC, we don't know what powers they worship (I'm not even sure whether we know if they receive spells from them); they could actually worship Immortals (this has been suggested on the list). Besides, the word used, be it "god", "immortal", or "power" is not important here; what matters is the fact that the deities of Mystara are not the same as deities of other game worlds, not having the same abilities, powers, rules, or ascension rules [I for one believe that the Mystarans call them Immortals and don't have another word, but if someone from another world came to Mystara and used a comprehend language spell it would translate as god or power. A word is just a word put on a concept. The concept here is that of deity, superior being. Whether it's called god or immortal or toto [French word used to replace a name] is irrelevant. The Mystarans don't call them Immortals anyway since they dont speak English but Thaytian, Alphatian, etc.] BTW I realize I should mention Powers in addition to Gods in the FAQ. <<> Q: Is Jaggar von Drachenfelds the Star Dragon? this is nonensical and clique-ish unless explained.>> It is a question that pops up fro time to time on the list. Thus it has its place in the FAQ IMO. If newbies (to Mystara) don't understand what it's all about, they can just ignore it, or ask about it. However many Mystara fans, even old timers, may not know the answer to that question, especially since few own the Dragon mag where the answer (from Bruce Heard) originally appears. <<> A: Mystara was the world designed to be used with the rules of D&D > (often > called OD&D to better distinct it from AD&D and from the generic term > D&D > which could mean both; OD&D stands for Old D&D or Original D&D - note > that > some few people call it BD&D for Basic D&D to distinguish it from even > older rules). > It appeared in the old boxed rules: the Expert box, the Companion box > and > the Master box. Most of the earlier modules designed for D&D were set in > this world. Recently, however, Mystara has been converted to AD&D (along > with Red Steel), but many people who play in Mystara do it with the old > rules (or their reedition, Rules Cyclopedia). If we just abandoned all the nomenclature we could devote valuable space to eg FAQ entries on the Beastman Wars, Mystara's history, Radiance...>> I think that "nomenclature" stuff also has its place in the FAQ, as people constantly ask about it. However, the FAQ is never an exhaustive work, and I add to it when I see questions pop up that deserve to be included, or when people suggest things that should be added to it. So feel free to propose to add to it (it should remain a FAQ though, not a book about Mystara). I agree that the Radiance should be mentioned in the FAQ. Rad's fate too. Thanks for the reminder. <<> Q: When I read stuff about Mystara I keep seeing acronyms I cannot > understand like WotI or PWA. What do they mean? > A: There is a list of Mystara relevant acronyms at > http://www.geocities.com/TimesSquare/Lair/8932/Mystara/acronyms.html or perhaps we could dispense with acronyms altogether, or cite the full name the first time then abbreviate sensibly afterwards. subcultural language isolates rather than unites. >> Hmm, I guess you haven't been discussing about Mystara long enough to propose that. Believe me, I'm on this list since it started, I've worked on 3 net-almanacs, and rarely will I write a common Mystaran word in its entirety! It's too long! Nobody will follow you on that. However, people generally use only well-known acronyms without warning (those that are in the list I made, maybe), but otherwise write a word in its entirety many times before they start using a new acronym. If you follow the thread where it first appeared in, you shouldn't be lost. No, the only problem with acronyms is for newbies. That is why I made a list, refered to in the FAQ. Newbies will probably read the FAQ when it shows up the first time after they join the list (they should, it's made for them!), which should help them. Ideally, the FAQ should be sent by the list-server when you sub-scribe [misspelled on purpose], along with the list FAQ; could that be done Leroy? ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 01 Mar 1999 10:51:43 -0800 From: Dave Keyser Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - MYSTARA: D&D Hĺvard Rřnne Faanes wrote: > On Sun, 28 Feb 1999, Jonathan Nolan, Barrister & Solicitor, FTIA wrote: > > > Has anyone looked at or bought the new D&D Boxed set? Does it have > > anything at all to do with Mystara? > > I havent actually looked at it, but from what i hear, the new D&D is just > a simplified version of AD&D which has nothing to do with either Mystara > or the Old D&D game. > > Hĺvard That is correct, I thumbed through the two printed adventures, the Minotaur Lord adventure and the Wyvern adventure. The setting reminds me of ThunderRift, the PCs live in an unspecified Vale, fairly isolated and holding a few small communities. Very generic, nothing suggests Mystara, but it could easily be squeezed in someplace. Dave *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 1 Mar 1999 14:45:11 EST From: Arminath@aol.com Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - D&D In a message dated 3/1/99 1:05:24 AM Eastern Standard Time, malacoda@lesbois.com writes: << While I am not necessarily advocating the conversion of AD&D to a skill based system (which doesn't really matter, since the chances of that happening are about nil), I have a hard time defining something used in around 75% of systems a fad. Were not talking something that was made up last week or a year or two ago. Personally, I find the list of things that make class-based better than skill based to be short. Very short. >> I remember when this new game called "D&D" came out in the late 70's. Not long after the market was flooded with clones when it started taking off and a trend was born. Jump to the 90's and look at the current trend: skills-based systems. I'm not saying that one system is better than the other, but our game is based around classes and levels. D&D was a breakthrough in design and to change the very system and still call it D&D is a horrendous (IMNSHO) way to make a quick buck. And about that "chances of it happening are about nil", businesses follow market trends. The new skills-based D&D is already being worked on and the days of our once innovative game are numbered until it just becomes another skills-clone. But enough of this, I don't want to get off the thread too far. *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 1 Mar 1999 14:00:12 -0600 From: "James Ruhland" Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Off Topic: AD&D 3rd Edition or RUNEQUEST? > Personally, I find the list of things that make class-based > better than skill based to be short. Very short. > > The new skills-based D&D is already being > worked on and the days of our once innovative game are numbered until it just > becomes another skills-clone. > Sorry to break it to both of you, but AD&D 2nd Edition is already a skills-based game. Over the last decade not a year has gone by without at least a dozen (and usually more) new skills being generated. The only thing that has *not* proliferated is the number of skills a character can learn (skill slots available have remained the same). In the begining there were no skills. Things were role-played (or roll-played), the player describing what he wanted to do and the DM deciding how effective/successful the character was, sometimes rolling after deciding (on the fly, arbitrarily) a % (or whatever) chance of success. Having the right skill was an advantage and way to develop the character a bit. Then in D&D and AD&D skills were introduced, mainly for things it was nice to have mechanics for, layed out and described. Now there are skills for everything, and subskills for all of that (Ettiquitte {Getting along with Grandma} cha), and if you don't have the skill you're penalized in effect. Things are getting out of hand. If I wanted to play RUNEQUEST or DANGEROUS JOURNEYS, that's what I'd play. *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 1 Mar 1999 15:31:58 -0500 (EST) From: au998@freenet.carleton.ca (Geoff Gander) Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - AD&D SITES IN MYSTARA Jonathan wrote: Since I am also a promoter of Mystara beyond the Known World (ie: southeastern Brun), I'll add my own comments and clarifications: >1. they are not "my" AD&D settings. they are the ones people have sent to >me. I think Ethan was implying that your collection of alternate Mystaras was Brun-centric - not necessarily that those alternate worlds were your own creation. Regardless, you can't control what people send you, so IMO it's really a moot point, and serves nothing to debate this particular point. >Tomb of Horrors in Malpheggi swamp? If we're talking about the Malpheggi Swamp southwest of Darokin, then that is Brun - the other Malpheggi Swamp is in the Hollow World - darned confusing that they'd use the same name twice, but anyhow... >Al-Qadim in the far west? How far west? If it's in the Sind Desert, then it's Brun. >Ochalea as OA Japan? Although Ochalea is not part of Brun, the fact that it is part of Thyatis (and therefore considered part of the Known World), probably makes people group this island (erroneously or not) with Brun. >Having the capital of Hule be a Sorceror-King city from Athas? Again, Hule is on Brun - basically if it involves Hule, the Savage Coast, the Known World, Norwold, or anything published under Mystara by TSR - it's Brun. They just didn't release anything "official" dealing with anything beyond that continent (not counting Alphatia, or the Hollow World). I'm not trying to needle you, Jonathan, but basically what Ethan is saying (and I agree with him on many counts) is that a tremendous amount of material has gone towards detailling one small part of Mystara (ie: the Known World), while the rest is, well, empty. There's so much space out there to develop, that no one who comes up with a neat new culture (ie: the Red Wizards being imported to Mystara) should really feel obligated to place it on Brun. Why not Davania or Skothar? Those two continents are huge; I see no reason why they can't house sophisticated civilizations of their own - we could even have severla "Known Worlds" coexisting on one planet. :) I (and others) found the general focus on this one rather small portion of the world to be a case of "not seeing the big picture". I just happen to think that we should be working on developing the other regions, that's all. >2. whatever (M)Orient is. and why would it be on Skothar? why not Brun? >why not on an entirely new continent? why not on one of the moons? Actually there is a very good reason for this. Perhaps Jenni could clear this up (Jenni?). But failing that, I think the impetus came from the Master's Level OD&D set, which showed an oriental-style empire on Skothar. The MOrient group decided that, since most of the established cultures of Mystara are almost overwhelmingly European, and Asian-based counterpart should be established. Since Skothar correspond to Asia about 150 million years ago, why not turn that into an Asian-dominated continent, with neat nations and new twists? >3. Brun is where people seem to play. must be due to the fact that gee I dunno maybe 85% of all the published material is set there? duh. You're correct on several counts here. I do know a fellow who has a campaign set in Davania, and my own campaign will be heading there eventually, and from thence to Skothar in search of Blackmoor. I think the sheer volume of Brun-based material does encourage playing there (and let's face it - it's better to play in Mystara than not at all), but enough basic info was provided by TSR about northern Davania and western Skothar (and more info generated by MMLers and available on websites) to make it a fairly easy task to set adventures and campaigns in those areas, too. I guess Ethan was trying to draw attention to the fact that there is far more to Mystara than Brun. Hope this clarifies things, Geoff - -- Geoff Gander, BA 97 Cartographer/Game Designer/Government Peon Part-Time High Priest, Ottawa Chapter of the Church of Y'hog au998@freenet.carleton.ca *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 1 Mar 1999 15:59:06 -0500 (EST) From: SteelAngel Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Off Topic: AD&D 3rd Edition or RUNEQUEST? On Mon, 1 Mar 1999, James Ruhland wrote: > Then in D&D and AD&D skills were introduced, mainly for things it was nice > to have mechanics for, layed out and described. The oD&D skill system is actually very nicely designed. it doesn't/shouldn't control the game, but it allows for a more well-rounded character, which makes for better role-playing. Ethan *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 1 Mar 1999 16:03:07 -0500 (EST) From: SteelAngel Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - AD&D SITES IN MYSTARA On Mon, 1 Mar 1999, Geoff Gander wrote: > enough basic info was provided by TSR about northern Davania and western Southern Davania too :) > areas, too. I guess Ethan was trying to draw attention to the fact > that there is far more to Mystara than Brun. yep :) Ethan *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 1 Mar 1999 15:38:14 -0600 From: "James Ruhland" Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Off Topic: AD&D 3rd Edition or RUNEQUEST? > > The oD&D skill system is actually very nicely designed. it > doesn't/shouldn't control the game, but it allows for a more well-rounded > character, which makes for better role-playing. > Yah, I like the D&D system. I wasn't/aren't arguing that skills should be eliminated. I think they add to the game. But emphasis on "add to", not "are" the game. *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ End of mystara-digest V1999 #107 ******************************** *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara' as the body of the message. mystara-digest Tuesday, March 2 1999 Volume 1999 : Number 108 Mystara is a trademark of TSR Inc. All Rights Reserved. The following topics are covered in this digest: Re: [MYSTARA] - Re: Mystara FAQ v5.6 [MYSTARA] - Dragon Magazine List v.4 RE: [MYSTARA] - Slow travel Re: [MYSTARA] - Re: Mystara FAQ v5.6 Re: [MYSTARA] - Slow travel Re: [MYSTARA] - MYSTARA: D&D [MYSTARA] - SHEESH! Re: [MYSTARA] - Re: Mystara FAQ v5.6 Re: [MYSTARA] - Slow travel Re: [MYSTARA] - Slow travel Re: [MYSTARA] - AD&D SITES IN MYSTARA Re: [MYSTARA] - Slow travel Re: [MYSTARA] - AD&D SITES IN MYSTARA Re: [MYSTARA] - D&D Re: [MYSTARA] - AD&D SITES IN MYSTARA [MYSTARA] - Re: Mystara FAQ v5.6 [MYSTARA] - Web Page Update [MYSTARA] - Re: Web Page Update Re: [MYSTARA] - D&D [MYSTARA] - And so it begins... ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Mon, 01 Mar 1999 22:02:24 +0100 From: Fabrizio Paoli Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Re: Mystara FAQ v5.6 At 21.24 01/03/99 +1100, Jonathan Nolan, Barrister & Solicitor, FTIA wrote: >> Q: What exactly is Wrath of the Immortals? >> A: Wrath of the Immortals (or WotI) is a great campaign that TSR >> published > >"a great campaign" is an editorial comment, not a factual statement >suitable for a faq. I think that here "great" means "long lasting" and "of great scale". >> Q: Is Jaggar von Drachenfelds the Star Dragon? > >this is nonensical and clique-ish unless explained. This is a questions that pops up often on the MML. IIRC it was me to prompt Herve to add it to the FAQ. Probably we should add also something about Rad's fate and Teldon's fate. ************** Fabrizio Paoli brizio@gdr.net Home Page: http://www.geocities.com/TimesSquare/Dungeon/4560 ************** *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 01 Mar 1999 22:18:21 +0100 From: Fabrizio Paoli Subject: [MYSTARA] - Dragon Magazine List v.4 List of Dragon Magazine containing Mystara Stuff v.4 (Original list is by Daniel Boese, later additions by Fabrizio Paoli, Glenn Sprigg and Shawn Stanley) A quick list of the Dragon Magazines which mention Mystara: The first column is the issue #, the second which part of the Princess Ark saga (if any) it contains, and the 3rd the subject of whatever's in it. 148 - "Around the World in 36 Levels" 153 1 1964: Nyxmir 11, 1965: Alphamir 15, Sulamir 10, 25, Sudmir 3, 25, 26, Vertmir 1, 4 154 2 1965: Vertmir 7, 17, 18, Tsalmir 8, 11, 18 155 3 1965: Tsalmir 19-Andrumir 11 156 4 1965: Andrumir 12, 24, 26, 28, Cyprimir 1 157 5 1965: Cyprimir 10, 16, 18-21, 24, 25 (Vulture Peninsula) 158 6 1965: Hastmir 4, 6-8, 16, 17, 25 (Vulture Peninsula/ N'djatwa) - The Mightiest of Dragons 160 7 1965: Hastmir 26-Eimir 15 (Myoshima/The Second Moon) - Up, Away and Beyond 161 8 1965: Eimir 16-18, 22-26, Burymir 1-5, 12, 19, 26, Nyxmir 5, 12, 15, 16, 19, 21-25 (Trench of Ka/White Peninsula, monster: Vulcanian sloth) 162 9 1965: Nyxmir 26, 28, Amphmir 3, 5, 7-12, 16-18, 22 (Oostdok trade houses) 163 10 1965: Amphimir 23-26, 28, 1966: Alphamir 15, 19-25 (monster: night dragon) 164 11 2000 Alphamir 26-28, Sulamir 1-25 (hero: Haldemar of Haaken (mage), hero: Talasar Ecbashur (cleric), monster: sky wyrm) 165 12 2000: Sulamir 26, Sudmir 17, 19, 20, 25, 26 (Isle of Dawn, hero: Myojo Katamura (fighter), hero: Abovombe (fighter), hero: Nabonidus Raman (mage) ) 166 13 2000: Vertmir 11, 13, 15, 16, 28, Tsalmir 1-5 (Kingdom of Emerond) 167 14 2000: Tsalmir 8-12 (Thothian enchantment, heroine: Ashari Sunlil (thief), hero: Tarias of Arogansa (fighter), hero: Leo of Le Nerviens (gnome), hero: Ramissur Zumrulim (mage) ) 168 15 2000: Tsalmir 12, 16, 17, 20-22 (Deck plans) 169 16 2000: Tsalmir 23-26, 28, Andrumir 4, 8, 12, 14-19 (Kingdom of Sind) 170 17 2000: Cyprimir 12, 18. 24-28 (Yavdlom Divinarchy, map errata: Kingdom of Sind)-(life cycle of dragons in OD&D) 171 18 2000: Hastmir 1, 3-5, 10, 16-18, 24 (Savage Coast, Slagovich, seed of cinnabar, cinnabryl) - Who's Who Among Dragons (dragon kingdoms of the Known World)-(review: B11, B12, DDA1, DDA2) 172 19 2000: Hastmir 25-28, Eimir 1 (essence of cinnabar, cinnabryl, Hule) 173 20 2000: Eimir 5 (Hule) 174 21 2000: Eimir 7-10 (monster: errant soul, The Savage Baronies) 175 22 2000: Eimir 12-15, 22 (The Savage Coast, Almarron, Gargona, Guadalante, Saragon) 176 23 2000: Eimir 24, 25, 28, Burymir 1, 3-5, 8 (Claw Peninsula) 177 24 2000: Burymir 14-18, 20 (Confederated Kingdom of Robrenn) (review: Rules Cyclopedia) 178 25 2000: Burymir 23-28 (Kingdom of Eusedria) 179 26 2000: Burymir 28, 2001: Nyxmir 1-3, 6-10 (Kingdom of Renardy) 180 27 2000: Nyxmir 18-20, 22, 23 (Kingdom of Bellayne, Limbo) 181 28 2000: Nyxmir 24-28, Amphimir 1-5 (Kingdom of Bellayne) 182 29 - (miscellany) 183 30 2001: Amphimir 11, 13-15 (Lands of the Great Magus, Magocracy of Herath) 184 31 - (miscellany) 185 32 2001: Amphimir 23-25, Alphamir 4, 8-11, 13, 14 (Squamous Kingdoms, Ah'roog City, Kingdom of Ator, Bayou, Kingdom of Cay, Tu'eth City) 186 33 2001: Alphamir 17-21 (Land of Wallera) 187 34 - (retainer costs/fief-holder income) 188 35 2001: Alphamir 25-28, Sulamir 1 (phanatons/Land of Jibaru) 189 - Known World Grimoire (economics/population/food/terrain) 190 - Known World Grimoire (population growth/deforestation/mining) 191 - Grimoire: armies and warfare 192 - Grimoire: manscorpions of Nimmur 193 - Grimoire: castle design/servents/operation 194 - Grimoire: advice 196 - Grimoire: Dark Jungle pantheon/Orc's Head Peninsula 197 - Grimoire: AD&D conversion, misc 199 - Grimoire: heraldry; combat: gunpowder/ballista/siege weapons 200 - lords of the skies/Aeryl/Eshu/Ee'aar - The Color of Magic 206 - "Karameikos, Ho!" 207 - The Magic of Karameikos 216 - Bazaar of the Bizarre (Limited collector's editions of the works of Bargle the infamous) 232 - En Garde! 237 - Campaign Classics: Lupins of the Mystara setting 247 - Rakasta of Mystara *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 1 Mar 1999 14:47:12 -0800 From: "Harvey, Michael" Subject: RE: [MYSTARA] - Slow travel Well, if it were a 2400-mile deep pit, you could just jump in (if you're brave). You'd accelerate on the way down, then decelerate on the way up. Just as your ascent peaks... you come level with a ledge and just step onto it (and avoid the rubber-band effect). Cool elevator! I've forgotten too much calculus to figure out how precisely long that would take, at least without pulling out my books. Luckily I have a computer here so I can compute it using brute force. (my favorite method :-) Let's see, using an acceleration of 9.8m/s/s, that's a straight fall of 1920km (626 seconds) followed by another 626-second ascent, for a total of 21 minutes. They probably wouldn't be in the "hot zone" long enough for it to hurt them... however since they'd achieve a peak velocity of 6.1 km/s as they cross the world shield, I hope the tunnel is a vacuum! (If the crust is a total of 1200 miles thick, so that the fall is only 600 miles to the world shield, then the trip would only take 15 minutes total, with a peak velocity of 4.3 km/sec). Mike *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 1 Mar 1999 17:09:10 -0600 From: "James Ruhland" Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Re: Mystara FAQ v5.6 > > >> Q: What exactly is Wrath of the Immortals? > >> A: Wrath of the Immortals (or WotI) is a great campaign that TSR > >> published > > > Ok, to end this nitpick: Herve, how 'bout replace "great" with "epic". *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 1 Mar 1999 17:19:14 -0600 From: "James Ruhland" Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Slow travel > > Well, if it were a 2400-mile deep pit, you could just jump in (if you're > brave). You'd accelerate on the way down, then decelerate on the way up. > Just as your ascent peaks... you come level with a ledge and just step onto > it (and avoid the rubber-band effect). Cool elevator! > You're forgetting air friction. Either there is air friction, in which case this won't work (well, we're on a fantasy world, so actually it works if you want it to) You'd get part way, reach terminal velocity, then part way back up, and eventually come to rest at midpoint after "yo-yo-ing" back and forth. Or their is no air friction, which means vaccum, which means a harsh suffocating death. A modified Water Breathing spell (would have to be a new but similar spell) might help. > *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 1 Mar 1999 18:42:24 EST From: Mystaros@aol.com Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - MYSTARA: D&D In a message dated 99-03-01 12:01:03 EST, hoc@nvg.ntnu.no writes: << On Sun, 28 Feb 1999, Jonathan Nolan, Barrister & Solicitor, FTIA wrote: > Has anyone looked at or bought the new D&D Boxed set? Does it have > anything at all to do with Mystara? I havent actually looked at it, but from what i hear, the new D&D is just a simplified version of AD&D which has nothing to do with either Mystara or the Old D&D game.>> Exactly. The "NEW" D&D Boxed Set is actually a form of "AD&D LITE", used to introduce new players to the game. It has nothing to do with Classic D&D (from the Cyclopedia). WotC made a deal with Arneson after they bought TSR, which cleared up the whole D&D vs. AD&D situation (TSR had to maintain that D&D and AD&D were seperate and distinct games, otherwise they would have to have payed Dave Arneson the same royalties that he was supposed to get for D&D)... once that situation was resolved, they decided to use the D&D TRADEMARK for the "Intro" version of AD&D... purely a marketing move... Mystaros *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 2 Mar 1999 02:37:10 +0200 (EET) From: Markus Olavi Montola Subject: [MYSTARA] - SHEESH! I just ended a session, during which the Glantrian PC:s attended the Thyatian gladiatorial festivities of the Spring 1004AC. They were on Lord Rheddrian's mission find out who the f*** is playing Helena Ledamiades to provoke revolt and internal clash in Thyatis. They naturally got themselves invited in one of Helena's lavish parties (there is a baron in the group -- not a difficult task), and one of the characters directly went to seducing Helena, ending up making her pregnant!! And for those not remembering the intricacies of WotI, Helena is actually Valerias, a Hierarch of Matter, the Patroness of Love and the lover of Ixion. - Markus P.S. That happens when the players role-play *well* and roll charisma with awesome luck. Each affair lasts only so long, but the child will probably be the first real hint of who Ledamiades actually was -- Rheddrian will of course guess, but will never tell the PC:s. ----------------------------------------------------------------- W A R I S P E A C E F R E E D O M I S S L A V E R Y I G N O R A N C E I S S T R E N G T H ----------------------------------------------------------------- *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 1 Mar 1999 19:44:25 -0500 From: Sharon Dornhoff Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Re: Mystara FAQ v5.6 >Would you rather write out PWA as Poor Wizard's Almanac, when most people >know what you are talking about? Remember, a lot of us here have most, if >not all the D&D books. I don't think using acronyms splinters the >community. It's not like some people are speaking Ebonics, yo. Not to mention that these are GAMERS we're talking about, who'd be curious about the MML! If people can get so used to terminology like "hp", "THAC0", and "AC" that they see abbreviations in their sleep, they can certainly catch on to a few Mystara-related ones, without much brain-strain. :-) *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 1 Mar 1999 20:06:41 EST From: Arminath@aol.com Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Slow travel In a message dated 3/1/99 6:26:48 PM Eastern Standard Time, jruhlconob@sprynet.com writes: << A modified Water Breathing spell (would have to be a new but similar spell) might help. >> Actually a helm enchanted with the Create Air (3rd level MU spell) would keep you from suffocating. Jim *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 1 Mar 1999 19:23:05 -0600 From: "James Ruhland" Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Slow travel > > Actually a helm enchanted with the Create Air (3rd level MU spell) would keep > you from suffocating. > Duh, that's true. I should've thought of that. 8-) Still, though, then you have to assume that the tunnel is a vaccum (for no air friction), which it wouldn't be normally (since the tunnels are below Mystara's atmosphere). However, I could imagine you could enchant such a tunnel as a vaccum (perhaps some kind of effect that keeps the element of air from intruding on the tunnel), or that whoever may have created it could have done so, somehow creating a "pocket" of vaccum where the tunnel is. Then the idea would work as described. *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 1 Mar 1999 20:29:49 -0500 From: Sharon Dornhoff Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - AD&D SITES IN MYSTARA >>2. whatever (M)Orient is. and why would it be on Skothar? why not Brun? >>why not on an entirely new continent? why not on one of the moons? > >Actually there is a very good reason for this. Perhaps Jenni could clear >this up (Jenni?). But failing that, I think the impetus came from the >Master's Level OD&D set, which showed an oriental-style empire on Skothar. >The MOrient group decided that, since most of the established cultures >of Mystara are almost overwhelmingly European, and Asian-based >counterpart should be established. Since Skothar correspond to Asia >about 150 million years ago, why not turn that into an Asian-dominated >continent, with neat nations and new twists? Frankly, there's a couple of respects in which I kinda AGREE with the "Why should the MOrient=Skothar?" argument! Although Skothar does resemble the geological predecessor of Asia, none of the OTHER cultural analogues we've seen on Mystara seem restricted to their "proper" geographic positions, as dictated by IRL Earth's geography. We've already got Tanagoros in eastern Skothar -- corresponding to Africans, the one major IRL human race that did NOT live in Asia! -- as well as Hinterlanders (=Celts) in Davania/South America; more Tanagoros in eastern Vulcania/Australia; and everything from Ethengars (=Mongols), to Hattians (=Germans), to Sindhis (=Dravidians), to Alasiyans (=Arabs), to wallaras (=Australian natives), all crammed together on the map of Brun/North America. Placing ALL the MOriental cultures on Skothar almost seems to imply that Skotharans hadn't the ambition or curiosity to explore the rest of the world, and leave colonies and breakaway groups elsewhere, in the way that the Oltecs, Antalians, or similarly widespread cultures did! Besides, there's one small problem with trying to put all of Asia on Mystara ... namely, that Mystara IS a significantly smaller planet than Earth, with nowhere NEAR as much space for large empires that aren't in direct contact and/or conflict with one another. Had the Earth been as small as Mystara, the Romans and Chinese would've easily been in range of each others' military -- a recipe for culture shock, to rival some of the HW neighbor-nations! -- and the discovery of the Americas (no matter who you think "discovered" them first) would have happened centuries sooner. Even allowing for the risks of long-distance travel, in a world of dragons and sea monsters, you'd still think Skothar would be MUCH too close to the KW region for huge empires to exist there, yet remain completely unknown and culturally isolated/distinct. (As for the Masters' Set map, we already know from VoPA #1 that it's bogus ... although it may yet provide some ideas worth using, of course.) That's why, IMC, I'm using Patera as the focal point for MOriental cultures. The few KW exceptions, like Ethengar or Ochalea, have been influenced by Pateran culture: the Ethies, by their spirit-allies (which are also active on Patera, traveling freely between moon and planet via the Spirit World); and the Ochaleans, by their getting conquered by Myoshimans for a time. This idea of Patera-as-Asia's been developed quite well by other MML-users, and I especially appreciate the "Patera Project" writer's effort in that regard: Kudos for Khompor-Thap, dude! :-) Transfering MAsia to the invisible moon also solves one GLARING problem with giving Skothar too many highly-developed nations, OR a long and complex history that'd be on par with IRL Asia's ... namely, why are there no MOriental nations in the Hollow World boxed set?! (Sure, we can SAY they're on continents other than Iciria ... but the Immortals sure didn't seem to mind mixing-and-matching non-Asian cultures in odd combos -- e.g. Africans next to Neanderthals; Traldar rubbing shoulders with Azcans -- there!) But by removing the MOriental nations from Mystara, and placing them on Patera, I can argue that Patera's now-vanished cultures weren't included, in the Immortals' Hollow World/Hollow Moon preservation plans -- or at least, they weren't until very recently -- and so Asian-style "relict" nations aren't as common in the museum-settings as non-Asian/Pateran cultures are. *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 1 Mar 1999 20:59:45 -0500 From: Sharon Dornhoff Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Slow travel > Still, though, then you have to assume that the tunnel is a vaccum >(for no >air friction), which it wouldn't be normally (since the tunnels are below >Mystara's atmosphere). > However, I could imagine you could enchant such a tunnel as a vaccum >(perhaps some kind of effect that keeps the element of air from intruding >on the tunnel), or that whoever may have created it could have done so, >somehow creating a "pocket" of vaccum where the tunnel is. Then the idea >would work as described. Just be sure you drop straight down into the tunnel, WITHOUT imparting any horizontal motion to your body. Hitting the side of an annelid-tunnel at escape velocity, and then ricocheting back and forth between its walls for the next 1200 miles, ain't gonna be a happy experience, no matter HOW many hp you've got! ;-D *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 1 Mar 1999 21:16:21 -0500 (EST) From: SteelAngel Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - AD&D SITES IN MYSTARA On Mon, 1 Mar 1999, Sharon Dornhoff wrote: > Skothar almost seems to imply that Skotharans hadn't the ambition or > curiosity to explore the rest of the world, and leave colonies and > breakaway groups elsewhere, in the way that the Oltecs, Antalians, or > similarly widespread cultures did! Ahh.. Thus my explaination: Many Oriental cultures were Insular, and didn't want to explore the rest of the world. Also, NONE of Skothar is well known. So we can put anything we want in. Ethan - -- Ethan Deneault - PH/MU '99 www.wpi.edu/~eand - wpi.flame Quote Archive. *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 1 Mar 1999 19:32:45 -0700 From: "Leroy Van Camp III" Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - D&D Arminath@aol.com meandered fecklessly... > I remember when this new game called "D&D" came out in the late 70's. Not > long after the market was flooded with clones when it started taking off and a > trend was born. Jump to the 90's and look at the current trend: skills-based > systems. The trend towards skill-based gaming systems started in the early eighties, wiht games such as Champions and CoC. Some would call it evolution. > The new skills-based D&D is already being > worked on and the days of our once innovative game are numbered until it just > becomes another skills-clone. You say this as if you have inside information. The trend with WotC has been to turn the clock back with AD&D, not forward. A clear example is the upcoming Monk and Assassin classes in the Scarlet Brotherhood supplement for GH. Not kits, classes. Much like the original, from what I have heard. Leroy Van Camp III malacoda@lesbois.com ICQ #20039817 "Let's show this prehistoric bitch how we do things downtown." Dr. Venkmen, Ghostbusters *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 1 Mar 1999 23:07:20 EST From: Demmero@aol.com Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - AD&D SITES IN MYSTARA In messages dated 3/1/99, eand@WPI.EDU writes: << I don't get it. Why is Brun so popular? >> Because Brun IS Mystara. Nearly all the modules and Gazetteers that introduced gamers to the wonderful world of Mystara were set in Brun. Brun is the heart and soul of Mystara. << Brun is boring. It's overdone. >> Your opinion...I disagree. :) << Its necessary. Mystara should be developed :) >> Again, your opinion. Again, I disagree. It's not *necessary*. I'm running a campaign set in Karameikos (in the rather small Barony of Halag, to be more precise), and I have enough adventure ideas to last me years. Some ideas were inspired by published materials, most were my own creations. I *need* nothing more than this barony and perhaps the larger kingdom to run my Mystara campaign. If you'd like to change your wording a bit and say "It's good to develop Mystara more fully," I'd agree with you 100%. Brun HAS been developed extensively, and the more creative types would serve the list well by detailing more of this great game world. To ignore Brun is to ignore Mystara's roots, however, and that's not a good thing. *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 01 Mar 1999 20:39:06 -0800 From: Andrew Theisen Subject: [MYSTARA] - Re: Mystara FAQ v5.6 At 10:39 AM 3/1/99 -0500, "Jonathan Nolan, Barrister & Solicitor, FTIA" wrote: >This is not a flame at Herve Musseau, but a FAQ should be a FAQ so I have >drawn my red pen. So, in editor mode: > >> Q: Blackmoor? I know a Blackmoor, but it's part of Greyhawk, isn't it? >> A: Blackmoor was, like Greyhawk, the campaign world of one of TSR's >> founder, Dave Arneson. It was later placed in both Greyhawk and the >> Known >> World (as a past kingdom in the later), effectively making three >> Blackmoors >> exist. It seems there is no further relation between the two Blackmoors > >If Blackmoor is to be mentioned in this way, shouldn't the real, adult, >real world reason be given - the legal battle between Dave Arneson and the >megalomaniacal Gygax? There is no sensible "in-game" reason and otherwise >poor readers may spend wasted hours trying to work out why there are so >many Blackmoors. Also there was a Blackmoor original D&D booklet, that is >the real D&D source of the setting. Unnecessary usage of space, as I see it. This FAQ is intended for those visitors to the Mystara Mailing List, who presumably have some prior knowledge of the Mystara setting, or at least the OD&D rules that originated the setting. As such, it's purpose is to answer questions commonly posed here on the list, that end up taking a lot of bandwidth much of the time (for example: Is there really an Empire of Dorfin IV?) With the FAQ, new subscribers can be directed to the information without needing to get everyone on the list answering "No, there is no Empire of Dorfin IV". Such is the function of most such FAQs. Any information beyond what is immediately answerable (in your case, the additional info about the legal squabbles) can be further gleaned by inquiry, and (in this particular case) there are so many sides to the issue that a lot of it is speculative in any case. >> So officially the answer is Skothar. > >Unless we play and own DA1-4 in which case the answer is sort of the >broken lands and is pretty much irrelevant anyway. And that is certainly your option to use (I do), but in this case, the "official" TSR answer on things (which many people, in fact, are concerned with) is the one mentioned here in the FAQ. >> Q: Is Jaggar von Drachenfelds the Star Dragon? > >this is nonensical and clique-ish unless explained. Not at all. This question has come up a number of times on the list (again, populated by those with some knowledge and an interest in Mystara), and thus deserves a place here on the FAQ. >> Q: When I read stuff about Mystara I keep seeing acronyms I cannot >> understand like WotI or PWA. What do they mean? >> A: There is a list of Mystara relevant acronyms at >> http://www.geocities.com/TimesSquare/Lair/8932/Mystara/acronyms.html > >or perhaps we could dispense with acronyms altogether, or cite the full >name the first time then abbreviate sensibly afterwards. subcultural >language isolates rather than unites. This response seems rather odd to me. Are you saying everyone here should conform to a set standard of posting here on the list? Andrew "Cthulhudrew" Theisen *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 01 Mar 1999 22:16:34 PST From: "Jennifer Favia" Subject: [MYSTARA] - Web Page Update Hello! Just to let everyone know, I've added a file to my web site. It's a fun little "leaflet" of Mystaran ads! Check it out, if that's your sort of thing! :-) There are three ways to get there: Via the "plain" site, at http://www.geocities.com/TimesSquare/Chasm/4270/nonint. html Directly to the file, at http://www.geocities.com/TimesSquare/Chasm/4270/ads.htm l Or via the Dark Myst Manor site, at the link below (hint: this file's in the library!) Enjoy! Jenn Explore Dark Myst Manor! http://www.geocities.com/TimesSquare/Chasm/4270/ ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 01 Mar 1999 22:19:07 PST From: "Jennifer Favia" Subject: [MYSTARA] - Re: Web Page Update Well, Hotmail did it to me again! (Broke the html links to my site in the previous message.) I'll try again, if it still messes up, please type in the URl manually, Sorry for the trouble! Jenn There are three ways to get there: >Via the "plain" site, at http://www.geocities.com/TimesSquare/Chasm/4270/nonint.html Directly to the file, at http://www.geocities.com/TimesSquare/Chasm/4270/ads.html >Or via the Dark Myst Manor site, at the link below >(hint: this file's in the library!) > >Enjoy! > >Jenn > > >Explore Dark Myst Manor! > http://www.geocities.com/TimesSquare/Chasm/4270/ ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 02 Mar 1999 20:53:00 +1300 From: Richard Vowles Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - D&D Leroy Van Camp III wrote: > The trend towards skill-based gaming systems started in the > early eighties, wiht games such as Champions and CoC. Some would > call it evolution. Skills based games came out at the same time as D&D with DragonQuest for example. DragonQuest was being so successful that TSR bought the company and killed the game. I suggest that the people who are saying that "skills based" know a little more history about gaming before stating this stuff about it being a "fad". There have been a lot more gaming systems based on skills since the beginning of roleplaying than D&D like class/level based system (which IMHO, are seriously flawed). *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 2 Mar 1999 11:51:41 +0100 (CET) From: =?iso-8859-1?Q?H=E5vard_R=F8nne_Faanes?= Subject: [MYSTARA] - And so it begins... After a session of Nephilim last weekend, the guy who was GM and I went to grab a burger. Then we started tralking about me starting a new campaign using the SAGA rules. The very next day I wrote about 8 pages of SAGA Red Steel conversions. So, I´m planning on starting a SAGA campaign on the SAVAGE COAST, more specifically, the Savage Baronies. What I am looking for now is advice on: 1) Using the SAGA game. I have been a player in many campaigns using these rules, but any comments are welcome. 2)Using SAGA with Mystara. Has anyone tried it? 3) Setting a campaign on the Savage Coast. 4)Other comments, or ideas? Should anyone be concerned, my GURPS Karameikos campaign is still alive and kicking and that wont change after this. Hĺvard Haavard R. Faanes (hoc@nvg.ntnu.no) http://www.nvg.ntnu.no/~hoc "Remember, there are no stupid questions, just stupid people." -Mr Garrison, South Park. *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ End of mystara-digest V1999 #108 ******************************** *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara' as the body of the message. mystara-digest Tuesday, March 2 1999 Volume 1999 : Number 109 Mystara is a trademark of TSR Inc. All Rights Reserved. The following topics are covered in this digest: Re: [MYSTARA] - A journey to the past [MYSTARA] - House of Glantri, part 1 [MYSTARA] - WEBPAGE Re: [MYSTARA] - SHEESH! Re: [MYSTARA] - AD&D SITES IN MYSTARA [MYSTARA] - MOrient [MYSTARA] - Savage Coast Re: [MYSTARA] - AD&D SITES IN MYSTARA Re: [MYSTARA] - House of Glantri, part 1 Re: [MYSTARA] - Savage Coast Re: [MYSTARA] - Savage Coast [MYSTARA] - What campaigns are any good? Re: [MYSTARA] - Savage Coast Re: [MYSTARA] - SHEESH! Re: [MYSTARA] - What campaigns are any good? [MYSTARA] - OD&D spells Re: [MYSTARA] - MOrient ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Tue, 2 Mar 1999 11:12:05 +0100 From: "Jacob Skytte" Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - A journey to the past Original mail from Jacob: > > In my plans for an upcoming campaign I've been delving into the > > subjects of time travel. Based on the DA1-4 (or at least 1-3) I mean > > to let my hapless PC's experience Blackmoor, get them familiar with > > the setting and then blow it all up!!! Yes, I want them to be present > > during the Great Rain of Fire, the Planetshift or whatever. In fact > > I'd love to let my PC's contribute significantly to the causes of the > > catastrophe. Then I plan to subject them to a modified version of the > > events described in the Wrath of the Immortals boxed set; hopefully > > corresponding to their experiences in the past (literally) and > > focusing on the people, places, and items they've encountered in the > > Blackmoor era. > > This sounds interesting. I've been thinking of ways to tie in the present with the past. For now I've come with some ideas: 1. Have one of the PC's be a descendant of a character from the past. Perhaps even his/her own ancestor (I love paradoxes). 2. Have the timetravelling device be an artifact previously used by an NPC in the Blackmoor era to attain immortality. This would involve the PC's in a quest for immortality; thus introducing them to that concept, and would allow them to jump to a few points in time corresponding to this quest for immortality. > > I've downloaded a Blackmoor Gazetteer from someone's > > homepage (if you're reading this; thanks, it > > seems very helpful) for starters. > > You are probably referring to zimriel's blackmoor found at: > http://home.earthlink.net/~zimriel/Blackmoor/ Yeah, that's the one. Thanks. > Some comments that you may wanna consider: > > There were no Orcs, goblins, trolls and the like arent around at this > time. They are the descendants of the Beastmen, so I suggest that you > replace the goblinoids mentioned with Beastmen. You can use the same > statistics, but change the descriptions slightly. Oh, yeah. I hadn't considered that. Well, it's not that big a problem; I find that the Blackmoor era focuses more on dealings with different cultures of men than the goblinoids. But encounters with Beastmen would be nifty. > The DA adventures are set long before the destruction of Blackmoor. At the > time of the destruction, Blackmoor has developed a high technological > society. I'd recommend reading James Mishler(mystaros)'s timeline. > Its not official, but it has some excellent ideas about Blackmoor in it. > It can be found here: > http://www.geocities.com/TimesSquare/5304/ageblack.html Thanks, it seems helpful as well. Anyway, I have made some decisions regarding the technological advances in Blackmoor. The way I see it the Blackmoorians technology originated with the thefts of technology from the so-called City of the Gods (DA3). Unfortunately the Blackmoorians were unable to duplicate the materials as well as the nano-technology needed to fabricate similar items. However they were able to integrate some of the existing technology with magics as well as develop their own "primitive" versions of the extra-terrestrial (extra-Mystaran ?!?) technology; though of course it was far superior to existing technology. Unfortunately they failed to see the limits of their technology, and their meddling with the reactors of the City of the Gods eventually caused their own destruction. (Some generations later, tieing neatly in with the quest for Immortality mentioned earlier). So how does this sound to you? Blasphemous? Any thoughts or other ideas? Jacob Skytte, Denmark Jacob Skytte Skytte@virgil.ruc.dk *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 2 Mar 1999 14:23:19 +0200 (EET) From: Harri M{ki Subject: [MYSTARA] - House of Glantri, part 1 As i promised, I am now going to detail history of Glantri-family before Lord Alexander. Here is the first part of it. House of Glantri Years in Alasiyan Marches Glantris were an old Thyatian military family. They came to the Alasiyan lands in 621 when Lord Gustavo Glantri was named as military-governor of Western Alasiyan Marches. He was a stern, nearly cruel leader, who centered all power to his own hands. He was an imposing figure, with full beard and a body as fitly and well proportioned as any painter could have painted it. He died in 660 at the age of 64 and was succeeded by his son Lord Konstantius. He was as talented and imposing as his father has been. But he had a difficult temper and he quarrelled with his 3 half-brothers so during his governorship Thyatians began to lose ground increasingly to the Alasiyan nomads. He was not very popular because of his rash judgements and was not mourned when Alasiyans captured and executed him in 675. He was 42 years old. The position of Glantri-family in the area was already so strong that it surprised nobody when Lord Konstantius' half-brother Lord Johannes was named next military governor. He was so talented as his father and half-brother had been in military matters but again very imposing figure. Whereas his father and half-brother were warriors he was a warrior-priest of Vanya and very fanatical for that. During his governorship Vanya's worship spread very fast amongst the Thyatian settlers in the area. He again united the Thyatian side of the war and stopped the advance of the Alasiyan nomads for a while. He died in his bed in 699 at the age of 62. Lord Johannes' son Lord Ericus was not interested in staying in Alasiyan Marches and had went to Thyatis City already in 792. So the next military governor was Lord Gustavo Glantris last remaining son Lord Carlo. He was again not a warrior but a priest of Tarastia. However he had got a military education when he was young. He was not somewhat shorter than his father and half-brothers had been and also already because of his age (47) somewhat plump. He was already balding and used only goatee instead of full beard of his ancestors. Lord Carlo was very stern in his faith, his judgements were extremely harsh and he silenced any opposition with very severe punishments. So it was not very surprising that he was not very popular amongst other nobles and normal people. Lord Carlo took a war against Alasiyan nomads and Alphatian settlers in whole new level. Instead of only defending Thyatian settlements he send his troops in the desert to attack oasis' of nomads and even over the desert to attack Alphatian settlements. His popularity amongst the military began also decrease because of these very tough military expeditions. So when he died un mourned in 711 at the age of 61 everyone was relieved. Tiberio Glantri Lord Carlo's only son Lord Tiberio was only 17 when his father died. Because of his young age he was passed by in the selection of new military governor. There was send a new man from the Isle of Dawn, Lord Pontius Gardius. Lord Tiberio had got a best possible education there was. He spoke already several languages fluently, he was gifted in music, understood arts and so on. He was also very gifted in military matters, he had already taken part in couple of expeditions and had showed his talents. Most of all he was possessed with foresight. He saw instantly that Lord Pontius would led Thyatian troops to military catastrophe and criticized his leadership. This was of no avail because Lord Pontius had some very influential supporters in Thyatis City. During the next years in wars against the Alasiyan nomads Lord Tiberio showed that he was a brilliant general. He led his troops from victory to victory and it was only because of his talents that disaster came only in 728. Lord Tiberio was already before the Battle of Hedjazi sure that Thyatians would lose it. it was only because of his brilliant cavalry operations that even some of the Thyatian troops get away from the battle. When Otto von Drachenfels contacted him after the battle and presented his migration plans, Lord Tiberio immediately realized that this was the right way out of the impossible situation. It was because of his immediate support that the others agreed too. Lord Tiberio would have logical choice for the leadership of the migration after Graf Hans Graustein had rejected the position. Lord Tiberio however realized that Herr Otto was better option. Lord Tiberio was not very imposing, he was inherited his fathers plumpness and was even shorter than Lord Carlo had been, Herr Otto was a head taller than he and looked a noble whereas he looked more like a clerk. When the migration reached Selenica in 729 Lord Tiberio married Herr Otto's sister Griselda. It was his second marriage, he had already in 714 married Lord Cecare Fulvina's cousin Lucrezia. She had however died in childbed when their son Claudio was born in 716. This new marriage made the relations between von Drachenfels's and Glantris even closer than they been earlier. They have been in friendly relations since Herr Otto had in 718 married Lucrezias younger sister Lucia. In Selenica they also met Morphail Gorevitch-Woszlanys migration from Traladaran lands. Lord Tiberio was only one to oppose the joining of the groups. He saw that there was something he didn't like in Morphail and he agreed to be in touch with him only because of the common goal. When the migration arrived in the Highlands in 730 the refugees from the Alasiyan lands separated amongst the scattered southern Flaemish farmers. Lord Tiberio and his followers settled in the forefront against the Flaemish heartlands in the area of modern Hightower. When the skirmishes with the Flaems started nearly immediately Lord Tiberio was adamant, he would not give up his area, he wanted to settle right there where he is. If the Flaems want a war they would get a war. He already saw that this war would got his life, but he believed in faith so strongly that he didn't mind. Lord Tiberio lead the troops of the settlers during the next four years with varying success. He won more battles than he lost, but the victories were usually very costly. He fell in battle in 734 at the age 40. Harri Mäki hihama@uta.fi *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 2 Mar 1999 23:53:25 +1100 (EST) From: "Jonathan Nolan, Barrister & Solicitor, FTIA" Subject: [MYSTARA] - WEBPAGE the webpage in the signature has been updated with a new adventure and the latest version of the Mystara Grimoire etc.etc. Mystara Fthagn - -------------------------------------------------------------------- * * Jonathan Nolan FTIA - International Law practice call 618 89310176 * * - -------------------------------------------------------------------- Mystara/RPG Netbooks: www.physics.adelaide.edu.au/~ksimpson/netbooks.html *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 2 Mar 1999 13:19:20 -0000 From: "Rob" Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - SHEESH! >They naturally got themselves invited in one of Helena's lavish parties >(there is a baron in the group -- not a difficult task), and one of the >characters directly went to seducing Helena, ending up making her >pregnant!! rofl. Given Ixions disposition, I imagine he will be... Most Put Out... Cheerz Rob *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 2 Mar 1999 11:05:28 -0500 (EST) From: SteelAngel Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - AD&D SITES IN MYSTARA On Mon, 1 Mar 1999 Demmero@aol.com wrote: > If you'd like to change your wording a bit and say "It's good to develop > Mystara more fully," I'd agree with you 100%. Brun HAS been developed > extensively, and the more creative types would serve the list well by > detailing more of this great game world. To ignore Brun is to ignore > Mystara's roots, however, and that's not a good thing. Well, my reasons for disagreeing with the "large empires to the west of Glantri" idea is that NOONE HAS EVER HEARD OF THEM! I mean think about it. Hule is the big "evil empire" There isn't anything else otherwise we would have heard snippets of it. But Moving certain empires to Skothar or Davania? Why not? Vulcania has huge Gnomish Empires (or so says Bruce Heard) The Mienians were Davanian too. But Skothar is untouched. My theory is that the Tanagoro and the "MAsians" live together, not quite in harmony, but with contiguous borders. Think bout the cultural fun the developers could have with it! Zulu Tribes and Ancient Chinese government! Ethan - Who is working on an MArt_of_War idea for the Tanagoro Colony in Vulcania. What happens when The Tanagoro and the MAsians intermarry? Hmm.. - -- Ethan Deneault - PH/MU '99 www.wpi.edu/~eand - wpi.flame Quote Archive. *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 2 Mar 1999 17:30:05 +0100 (MET) From: DM Subject: [MYSTARA] - MOrient On Mon, 1 Mar 1999 20:29:49 -0500, Sharon Dornhoff wrote: <> Clearly, you don't know what you're talking about here, Sharon. :) Sorry if I seem to be rudely jumping at your throat here, but I'd like to defend the MOrient project for what my opinion might count. "Everyone's entitled to develop unexplored areas of Mystara provided he/she gets along with the common background offered by old Mystara products" - that's my way of seeing it, and from what I know of the MOrient stuff, they are just doing that. They took a totally undeveloped and I'd say unwanted area of Mystara (like what Davania was) and established some RW cultures which Mystara seemed to lack so far, namely the Far East civilizations. And they did it using some logical sense to explain why they are not widely known and have not conquered Alphatia/clashed with Thyatis, etc. I can assure you their reasons do work IMHO, and now that I am contributing to the project as well, I really hope to bring the stuff so far invented to the attention of the list. <> Nobody said there are big empires in Skothar, mind you. Sure, the Chung Yuan empire is mighty, but small in comparison to Thyatis (more like Hule). And MJapan is not that all-powerful (just like Japan was during the Shogunate). And there are sensibly less people than in RW China and Japan. Add to it that they are insular and a bit xenophobic, surrounded by barbarian tribes that prevent foreigner nations to contact them and that Alphatia has (actually HAD) a VERY GOOD reason to leave it secret, and you'll understand why they are not commonly known in the Old World. <> I do as well, and as I said everyone's entitled his own shot at creating and developing Mystaran races, provided they're reasonably tied to the history of Mystara. Adn that's what I did when I entered the MO group: I tied Ochalea's and Alphatia's history to that of Skothar, finally explaining why Ochalea is an eastern culture and where do the Ethies come from. This all done without negating Myoshima's existance. If you can link them all in a plausible way, why avoiding it? <> MChina is not so old as u might think. Skothar's oldest civilizations are the Jennite and Tanagoro ones, and AFAIK THEY ARE REPRESENTED in the Hollow World. MChina and MJapan simply are not because they did not withstand complete cultural changes... After all RW China existed with the same culture and political power for over a millennium! So, that's everything I wanted to say on the matter. I'd really like the MO group could eventually share with the other Mystarans their work, so this might show you how many efforts have been put behind it :) PS: about the use of acronyms, we use them because they save time and space. You cannot expect us all to refrain from using acronyms, Jonathan: that's one of the perverse effects of the Net. They shorten and ease communication.. to the point of making it a crypted code. Sort of an Alignment Tongue ;) DM *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 1 Mar 1999 10:53:32 -0000 From: "Rob Brooks" Subject: [MYSTARA] - Savage Coast 'llo there all. Continuing my pursuit of knowledge of Mystara I ran across the free download of Red Steel campaign stuff on the TSR page. After reviewing it pretty thoroughly, I really like it. Now I'm wanting to purchase the boxed set to have the maps and all the other goodies. Does anyone out there have it? I was told from my local gaming store I could still order out of print products as long as I have the TSR product number. If anyone out there could send that number my way I'd be very appreciative. Thanks, Rob B. *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 2 Mar 1999 17:50:55 +0100 (CET) From: =?iso-8859-1?Q?H=E5vard_R=F8nne_Faanes?= Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - AD&D SITES IN MYSTARA On Tue, 2 Mar 1999, SteelAngel wrote: > On Mon, 1 Mar 1999 Demmero@aol.com wrote: > > > If you'd like to change your wording a bit and say "It's good to develop > > Mystara more fully," I'd agree with you 100%. Brun HAS been developed > > extensively, and the more creative types would serve the list well by > > detailing more of this great game world. To ignore Brun is to ignore > > Mystara's roots, however, and that's not a good thing. > > Well, my reasons for disagreeing with the "large empires to the west of > Glantri" idea is that NOONE HAS EVER HEARD OF THEM! I mean think about it. > Hule is the big "evil empire" There isn't anything else otherwise we would > have heard snippets of it. Even though great empires arent mentioned in published products, mystarans may have heard of them. But interraction of any large scale seems unlikely. Remember however, that real world China had little interest in interractions with the rest of the world which it considered primitive. Hĺvard Haavard R. Faanes (hoc@nvg.ntnu.no) http://www.nvg.ntnu.no/~hoc "Remember, there are no stupid questions, just stupid people." -Mr Garrison, South Park. *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 2 Mar 1999 11:59:10 -0500 From: Sharon Dornhoff Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - House of Glantri, part 1 >As i promised, I am now going to detail history of Glantri-family before >Lord Alexander. Here is the first part of it. > In case you haven't read the Dragonlord novels, Harri, you might want to check them out too. There's a Thyatian griffon-rider who appears repeatedly in that series, as an agent and ambassador for Emperor Cornelius: one Darius Glantri, a presumed ancestor of Lord Alexander. :-) Nothing Darius does invalidates what you've written here -- the DL series takes place in the early 500s AC, and you've already established the Glantris were a military family of long standing -- but it would probably be a good idea to mention him as the family's first political connection to the Highlands/Glantri. (Especially since he married the Highlands' first Chancellor, Solveig White-Gold!) In fact, Darius Glantri's pivotal role in getting the Highlands back on their feet, after the Dragon Wars ended, might've done a lot to earn his descendent Alexander the respect and loyalty of old Braejr's many factions. Kind of like being the many-times-great-grandchild of Admiral Nelson, in IRL Britain. *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 02 Mar 1999 12:22:47 -0500 From: Bruce Pierpont Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Savage Coast Don't bother. Seriously, the Red Steel books online are better, have more info, and are a lot cheaper, than the paper versions. Unless you really want ($30) that CD I wouldn't bother. Not that the CD doesn't have good music on it, but I'd just print out the online version. Rob Brooks wrote: > > 'llo there all. > > Continuing my pursuit of knowledge of Mystara I ran across the free download > of Red Steel campaign stuff on the TSR page. After reviewing it pretty > thoroughly, I really like it. Now I'm wanting to purchase the boxed set to > have the maps and all the other goodies. Does anyone out there have it? I > was told from my local gaming store I could still order out of print > products as long as I have the TSR product number. If anyone out there could > send that number my way I'd be very appreciative. > > Thanks, > > Rob B. > > *************************************************************************** > To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line > 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 02 Mar 1999 12:24:54 -0500 From: Bruce Pierpont Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Savage Coast Sorry forgot the product number its 2504. And the Savage Baronies supplement is 9500 and cost another $20, comes with another CD, and is included in the online version already. Rob Brooks wrote: > > 'llo there all. > > Continuing my pursuit of knowledge of Mystara I ran across the free download > of Red Steel campaign stuff on the TSR page. After reviewing it pretty > thoroughly, I really like it. Now I'm wanting to purchase the boxed set to > have the maps and all the other goodies. Does anyone out there have it? I > was told from my local gaming store I could still order out of print > products as long as I have the TSR product number. If anyone out there could > send that number my way I'd be very appreciative. > > Thanks, > > Rob B. > > *************************************************************************** > To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line > 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 2 Mar 1999 17:27:25 +0000 From: "Adam Williams" Subject: [MYSTARA] - What campaigns are any good? I'm looking to acquire oD&D campaigns for lower level characters, preferbaly ones that are more than slash-and-burn (i.e. require some thinking and strategy). I think I can get ahold of the following, I'd like some opinions on them though. The Keep on the Borderlands In Search of the Unknown The Lost City The Veiled Society Rahasia Journey to the Rock Castle Caldwell Night's Dark Terror Queen's Harvest Is thier anywhere that campaigns are reviewed or you can at least find out what they are or "were" about? *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 2 Mar 1999 17:41:13 -0000 From: "Rob" Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Savage Coast >'llo there all. > >Continuing my pursuit of knowledge of Mystara I ran across the free download >of Red Steel campaign stuff on the TSR page. After reviewing it pretty >thoroughly, I really like it. Now I'm wanting to purchase the boxed set to >have the maps and all the other goodies. Does anyone out there have it? I >was told from my local gaming store I could still order out of print >products as long as I have the TSR product number. If anyone out there could >send that number my way I'd be very appreciative. > >Thanks, > >Rob B. Wahey! A fellow Rob who loves the Savage Coast... The boxed set is duplicated, very nearly identically, on the TSR website. ie you already have it... However, there is nothing like amassing a collection of expensive paper :-) Well, the number on my Red Steel box is 2504. There is also the Savage Baronies box, which is number 9500. Cheerz Rob *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 2 Mar 1999 19:47:20 +0200 (EET) From: Markus Olavi Montola Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - SHEESH! > >They naturally got themselves invited in one of Helena's lavish parties > >(there is a baron in the group -- not a difficult task), and one of the > >characters directly went to seducing Helena, ending up making her > >pregnant!! > rofl. Yeah, me too. > Given Ixions disposition, I imagine he will be... Most Put Out... Welll... I don't think so. You can't expect a chaotic goddess of love to be monogamic. On the other hand, you also can't expect the Sun Prince to be reasonable... I figured that pregnancy in Mystara is not just plain biological thing, but has an aspect of the Creation within it. So Valerias can't get rid of the child just by abandoning Helena and taking another form -- it is Valerias who is pregnant, not her vessel. I still develop the ideas for what to do with the child. Marvelous opportunities. The first child of Dal-Kher was *khm* done at the very same night of Full Moon, when the Baron of Morlay had tricked nearly every PC to drink wine boosted with a Potion of Lycantrophy. Though Dal-Kher and his (first) wife were only temporally lycantrophic, their child will be not as he (or she, not decided yet) was made by two werewolves. That would make a *nice!* campaign; two children of the same adventuring hero, one of whom is a werewolf made within a magically enchanced environment, and the other being born from Valerias. BTW; do you folks ever handle aspects of love, romance and sex? Can you make PC-NPC -affairs believeable and intimate? - Markus P.S. Dal-Kher Virayana is truly a son of his father. ----------------------------------------------------------------- W A R I S P E A C E F R E E D O M I S S L A V E R Y I G N O R A N C E I S S T R E N G T H ----------------------------------------------------------------- *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 2 Mar 1999 19:50:32 +0200 (EET) From: Markus Olavi Montola Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - What campaigns are any good? These are *my* opinions, and people may even remember that I don't appreciate dungeon crawlings very much unless the y really have a new idea to them. > The Lost City IIRC bad. > The Veiled Society Adequate, by taking the ideas and fleshing them out (by lenghtening the adventure from one session to ten sessions) the Veiled Society can become excellent. > Rahasia Bad. > Journey to the Rock Bad. > Castle Caldwell Though nostalgic, very bad. > Night's Dark Terror Adequate. - Markus ----------------------------------------------------------------- W A R I S P E A C E F R E E D O M I S S L A V E R Y I G N O R A N C E I S S T R E N G T H ----------------------------------------------------------------- *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 2 Mar 1999 20:02:39 +0200 (EET) From: Markus Olavi Montola Subject: [MYSTARA] - OD&D spells Hey, where can I get the OD&D grimoire to Mystara, which I obviously missed. (The one with Well Kept Secret and those) - Markus ----------------------------------------------------------------- W A R I S P E A C E F R E E D O M I S S L A V E R Y I G N O R A N C E I S S T R E N G T H ----------------------------------------------------------------- *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 2 Mar 1999 13:20:37 -0500 From: Sharon Dornhoff Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - MOrient >Clearly, you don't know what you're talking about here, Sharon. :) >Sorry if I seem to be rudely jumping at your throat here, but I'd like to >defend the MOrient project for what my opinion might count. Well, IF the MOrient group would make more of its material available, for the rest of us, maybe I WOULD know what I was talking about!* ;-D Really, I WASN'T trying to say that nobody should use Skothar as MAsia ... just that it seems very much out-of-keeping with the mixed-up, anything-goes "feel" of the rest of Mystara's continents. It's these novel combinations of cultures (Sumerians trading with Spaniards! Ancient Egyptians next to Gaels! And that ol' classic conundrum, Vikings and Arabs living within a few miles of each other!) that give Mystara such entertaining geography/demographics, and declaring that Skothar is somehow exempt from all that melange seems incongruous. It also leaves established countries like Sind, Ethengar and Myoshima as either inexplicable in their current locations, or -- worse, IMHO -- redundant, if everything else MAsian is clumped together in one spot. If the MOrient team has a good explanation for this, then by all means ... let us know why Skothar's different! But don't blame me, if I can't anticipate your reasoning: I'm still waiting to hear what you've come up with, to account for Skothar's isolation. Until then, my personal version of Skothar will lean more towards Sub-Saharan Africa, albeit with a few incongruous nations (like the MRussians) thrown in; that's who lives there, according to both the HW boxed set's migration maps and the PWA history of the Minaeans. [* - Hey, if baiting ol' DM is the only way to get the MOrient material posted, it'll be worth my getting flamed about it! There's a method to my madness, tee hee hee.... ;-D] >"Everyone's entitled to develop unexplored areas of Mystara provided he/she >gets along with the common background offered by old Mystara products" - Did I say the MOrient team couldn't do this? Did I say ANYONE couldn't? No, I just said that there's some clear problems with transposing all of Asia onto Skothar, WITHOUT doing some hefty explaining as to why nobody's ever even heard of these nations -- much closer, geographically, than IRL East Asia is to Europe -- before. Even in the Dark Ages, most Europeans had heard of China -- even if they weren't so clear on the concept of where it was, exactly ;-) -- and most of Brun's nations are more Rennaisance, than medieval. At the very least, the 'Thadders would know about a Skotharan "Asia" ... and even if they kept the actual trade routes secret, so as to retain a monopoly on Eastern commodities, they'd surely choose to brag up "silken robes from the Emperor of the Jade Throne's highest court!" all the time, the better to hype their exotic wares. I'm not saying your group couldn't have found a way to account for the exident lack of information exchange or trade, between East and West; I'm just saying I'll have to see it, to believe it. So if you want to convince me, post your explanation and let me know what IS "going on". Otherwise, I can only go by what I know of Mystara's geography, as published in "canon" materials ... and THAT tells me it's pretty unlikely that there'd be TWO Asias in the Mystara setting: one on Patera (to which canon attests) and another one on Skothar. We've already got Myoshima and its neighbor-nations, plus Ochalea and Ethengar and whatever else we might've added to our home campaigns; how many Japans or Chinas or Mongolias could we possibly NEED, in a single game-setting...? When you've fought one ninja-clan or renegade chuang lung, you've fought 'em all, IMHO, so let's not make excess work for ourselves if TSR's already done a chunk of it for us. ;-) >And that's what I did when I entered the MO group: I tied >Ochalea's and Alphatia's history to that of Skothar, finally explaining why >Ochalea is an eastern culture and where do the Ethies come from. This all >done without negating Myoshima's existance. >If you can link them all in a plausible way, why avoiding it? Because I don't NEED a Skothar Japan for my games: I've got Myoshima. If I want samurai IMC, they'll be fuzzy ones. :-D Meanwhile, Skothar gives me a place for other, even more-neglected cultures, like those of Africa, South America, or the Pacific. I'd rather develop a culture that's totally missing from Mystara, than something I've already got TSR's version of. (Unless it's meant as a joke, like Renardy and Bellayne basically were, in the PA stories ... in which case, I wouldn't mind including a "Gulliver's Travels"-style parody of, say, Thyatis, on some obscure island or another. ;-D) ><with giving Skothar too many highly-developed nations, OR a long and >complex history that'd be on par with IRL Asia's ... namely, why are there >no MOriental nations in the Hollow World boxed set?!>> > >MChina is not so old as u might think. Skothar's oldest civilizations are >the Jennite and Tanagoro ones, and AFAIK THEY ARE REPRESENTED in the Hollow >World. MChina and MJapan simply are not because they did not withstand >complete cultural changes... After all RW China existed with the same >culture and political power for over a millennium! So where are the hundreds of pre-agricultural Asiatic tribes, that got pushed aside by the MChinese and their ilk? Where are the "warring states" MChinese, from before their empire was consolidated? Where are the Ainu, the Hmong, and the hundreds of other agricultural/migrant/archaic societies which preceded the rise of monolithic civilization in IRL Asia? Even if the MOrient hasn't been civilized for long, there still had to have been people who preceded those nations ... and they've got as much right to a place in the Hollow World setting, in which to follow "the old ways", as do the Neathar. So either the Immortals have a long-standing grudge against indigenous MAsiatics, or there's some other reason why they didn't rate a single spot on the main HW continent. Don't get me wrong. I DID like the material I read on the MOrient group's webpage, and may yet use those ideas in my games ... perhaps as an adjacent plane of existence that NACE is trying to colonize, or as part of Patera. But Mystara's only so big -- a problem I'VE become super-conscious of, in trying to stock my own (tiny, like IRL Luna) HM setting WITHOUT overpopulating it...! -- and it'll be tough enough, just fitting ONE version of each of the many, many IRL civilizations I'd like to include, on the map. If deporting as many cultures as seem compatible with Myoshima to the invisible moon helps relieve the Outer World's "congestion", IMC, then that's what I'll continue to do. *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ End of mystara-digest V1999 #109 ******************************** *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara' as the body of the message. mystara-digest Tuesday, March 2 1999 Volume 1999 : Number 110 Mystara is a trademark of TSR Inc. All Rights Reserved. The following topics are covered in this digest: Re: [MYSTARA] - AD&D SITES IN MYSTARA Re: [MYSTARA] - What campaigns are any good? Re: [MYSTARA] - A journey to the past Re: [MYSTARA] - What campaigns are any good? Re: [MYSTARA] - Savage Coast Re: [MYSTARA] - SHEESH! Re: [MYSTARA] - And so it begins... RE: [MYSTARA] - What campaigns are any good? Re: [MYSTARA] - AD&D SITES IN MYSTARA RE: [MYSTARA] - What campaigns are any good? Re: [MYSTARA] - What campaigns are any good? Re: [MYSTARA] - What campaigns are any good? Re: [MYSTARA] - AD&D SITES IN MYSTARA Re: [MYSTARA] - What campaigns are any good? Re: [MYSTARA] - Savage Coast Re: [MYSTARA] - What campaigns are any good? ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Tue, 2 Mar 1999 13:23:07 -0500 (EST) From: SteelAngel Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - AD&D SITES IN MYSTARA On Tue, 2 Mar 1999, [iso-8859-1] Hĺvard Rřnne Faanes wrote: > unlikely. Remember however, that real world China had little interest in > interractions with the rest of the world which it considered primitive. But MArco Polo (a Darokinian Merchant) should have decided to go visit the Hyborean Chinese :) Ethan - -- Ethan Deneault - PH/MU '99 www.wpi.edu/~eand - wpi.flame Quote Archive. *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 2 Mar 1999 13:27:02 -0500 (EST) From: SteelAngel Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - What campaigns are any good? On Tue, 2 Mar 1999, Markus Olavi Montola wrote: > > The Lost City > > IIRC bad. I disagree. The Lost City is one of my favorite adventures. You just need a DM who is willing to work with the Cycindians, and not make it a dungeon crawl. > > Rahasia > > Bad. Again, I don't think it is that bad. A dungeon Crawl, yes. And a long one. BUT it's VERY good for lower level characters. Lots of puzzles. Lots of Role-play. > > Journey to the Rock > > Bad. yep. > > Castle Caldwell > > Though nostalgic, very bad. Ech.. Even nostalgia can't save this one. Poor Poor Poor.. Owah Tagoo Siam! - -- Ethan Deneault - PH/MU '99 www.wpi.edu/~eand - wpi.flame Quote Archive. *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 2 Mar 1999 13:50:19 -0500 From: Sharon Dornhoff Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - A journey to the past >I've been thinking of ways to tie in the present with the past. For >now I've come with some ideas: >1. Have one of the PC's be a descendant of a character from the past. >Perhaps even his/her own ancestor (I love paradoxes). >2. Have the timetravelling device be an artifact previously used by >an NPC in the Blackmoor era to attain immortality. This would involve >the PC's in a quest for immortality; thus introducing them to that >concept, and would allow them to jump to a few points in time >corresponding to this quest for immortality. Here's a couple more: - - One PC could be the reincarnation of a Blackmoor-era NPC. If the PC is a heroic sort, Odin might have arranged for his/her return ... and perhaps, even for the character's meeting his/her previous identity. The reincarnated PC could look just like the previous incarnation -- making for some amusing cases of mistaken identity! ;-) -- or the previous "self" might be of a totally different appearance, race and/or gender, yet retain the same personality and talents. - - Likewise, the chief Blackmoor-era villain for the adventure could be an earlier incarnation of the PC party's nemesis. Hel brought him/her back to life in the KW era, as a reward for the many deaths he/she caused in the distant past. You can even do this with a villain whom the PC party's already killed off, in the modern era, and whom they THOUGHT they'd never have to confront again! - - Shortly before this time-travel adventure takes place, you could let the PCs discover an old Blackmoor artifact ("artifact" in the archeological sense, not a magic item), such as a long-buried shield with King Uther's personal crest on it. This same shield then turns up, all new and shiny, somewhere in the course of their visit to the past. >> Orcs, goblins, trolls and the like aren't around at this >> time. They are the descendants of the Beastmen, so I suggest that you >> replace the goblinoids mentioned with Beastmen. You can use the same >> statistics, but change the descriptions slightly. > >Oh, yeah. I hadn't considered that. Well, it's not that big a >problem; I find that the Blackmoor era focuses more on dealings with >different cultures of men than the goblinoids. But encounters with >Beastmen would be nifty. I've reconciled this, by saying that terms like "orc", "troll", "goblin" and so on were originally the names of individual Beastman TRIBES, not races. These tribes started out just as genetically-varied as the HW Beastmen, but once the humanoid genome stabilized, each one developed into a different modern-day breed of humanoid. So, Blackmoor-era NPCs might tell the PCs "There's fifty kobolds chasing us!", causing the players to relax ... only to have 50 enormous Beastmen -- who just happen to be from the "Kobold" tribe ;-) -- come charging out of the woods! >Thanks, it seems helpful as well. Anyway, I have made some decisions >regarding the technological advances in Blackmoor. The way I see it >the Blackmoorians technology originated with the thefts of technology >from the so-called City of the Gods (DA3). > >Unfortunately the Blackmoorians were unable to duplicate the >materials as well as the nano-technology needed to fabricate similar >items. However they were able to integrate some of the existing >technology with magics as well as develop their own "primitive" >versions of the extra-terrestrial (extra-Mystaran ?!?) technology; though >of course it was far superior to existing technology. Unfortunately they >failed to see the limits of their technology, and their meddling with the >reactors of the City of the Gods eventually caused their own >destruction. (Some generations later, tieing neatly in with the quest >for Immortality mentioned earlier). > >So how does this sound to you? Blasphemous? Any thoughts or other >ideas? I think it's a pretty good summary of what happened, going by the information in the Blackmoor modules. Personally, I've never cared for those modules -- too many of their "named" NPCs seem overpowered, dull and/or trite, to me -- so my campaign's scenario for Blackmoor runs a little differently. (Check out the "Outer Moon timeline", Pt. 1, from my Hollow Moon posts to Stan's Archive, if you want to read an alternate GRoF.) But I could only get away with this IMC by ignoring the DA modules, so it's probably not compatible with your own time-travel plans. *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 2 Mar 1999 14:14:20 -0500 From: Sharon Dornhoff Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - What campaigns are any good? >On Tue, 2 Mar 1999, Markus Olavi Montola wrote: > >> > The Lost City >> >> IIRC bad. > >I disagree. The Lost City is one of my favorite adventures. You just need >a DM who is willing to work with the Cycindians, and not make it a dungeon >crawl. I second that opinion. B4 is a pretty good adventure -- certainly, it's more plausible and complete than the previous ones in the B-series! ;-) -- but more to the point, it's a mini-setting you can expand upon, in your own campaign. Or, if you can wait for the Cynidicea Team to present its ideas, you might see lots o' new material on the Lost City here on the MML! (Any progress, guys...? :-D) >> > Rahasia >> >> Bad. > >Again, I don't think it is that bad. A dungeon Crawl, yes. And a long one. >BUT it's VERY good for lower level characters. Lots of puzzles. Lots of >Role-play. Actually, Rahasia WAS bad. (:-P) It's not got much to do with Mystara, either: the elves you're supposed to rescue don't act much like Alfheimers (since when do Alfheim elves marry, to be it evil magic-users or otherwise?), and the various villains' magic seems foreign to the setting. OTOH, you could run it as a stand-alone, non-Mystaran adventure, if you're trying to introduce some AD&Ders to the simplicity (and quirks) of the oD&D rules. >> > Journey to the Rock >> >> Bad. > >yep. Yep again. :-) >> > Castle Caldwell >> >> Though nostalgic, very bad. > >Ech.. Even nostalgia can't save this one. Poor Poor Poor.. Owah Tagoo >Siam! Haven't read it ... and the previous comments make me glad I haven't. :-) About Night's Dark Terror: I think it's a FANTASTIC module! It's practically a whole campaign in itself; about 90% of the Karameikos Gaz was derived, directly or second-hand, from B10's contents; and you can easily cut it up into a number of smaller adventures, not related to one another, if you don't want to tackle the whole shebang. I've run the "Siege of Sukiskyn" chapter as an isolated event, in six different campaigns -- some oD&D, some AD&D -- and it's always given players a thrill, being the ones defending their "lair" from invaders for a change! Too bad it's so hard to find copies of N.D.T., nowadays ... but if you can, snap it up on sight: you WON'T regret it! *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 2 Mar 1999 19:13:48 -0000 From: "Rob" Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Savage Coast >Don't bother. Seriously, the Red Steel books online are better, have >more info, and are a lot cheaper, than the paper versions. Unless you >really want ($30) that CD I wouldn't bother. Not that the CD doesn't >have good music on it, but I'd just print out the online version. Yeek! The less said about that CD the better :) >Rob Brooks wrote: >> >> 'llo there all. >> >> Continuing my pursuit of knowledge of Mystara I ran across the free download >> of Red Steel campaign stuff on the TSR page. After reviewing it pretty >> thoroughly, I really like it. Now I'm wanting to purchase the boxed set to >> have the maps and all the other goodies. Does anyone out there have it? I >> was told from my local gaming store I could still order out of print >> products as long as I have the TSR product number. If anyone out there could >> send that number my way I'd be very appreciative. >> >> Thanks, >> >> Rob B. >> >> *************************************************************************** >> To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line >> 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. >*************************************************************************** >To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line >'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. > *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 2 Mar 1999 19:16:44 -0000 From: "Rob" Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - SHEESH! >BTW; do you folks ever handle aspects of love, romance and sex? Can you >make PC-NPC -affairs believeable and intimate? Mmm. Generally No - at least, it isnt roleplayed in all its detail. On the other hand, IMC there is a PC who is married to an NPC - and although we dont normally go on about it in game sessions he does do a lot for his wife... he even gave her a wish spell once when it was offered to him. "Do you know what true love is? Sacrifice...." Cheerz Rob *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 03 Mar 1999 08:21:38 +1300 From: Richard Vowles Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - And so it begins... Hĺvard Rřnne Faanes wrote: > 3) Setting a campaign on the Savage Coast. If you haven't already, try reading the book "The Black Vessel". Gives a good overview of what life in the Savage Baronies could be like. *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 2 Mar 1999 11:35:44 -0800 From: "Harvey, Michael" Subject: RE: [MYSTARA] - What campaigns are any good? Sharon wrote: > Too bad it's so hard to find copies of N.D.T., nowadays ... > but if you can, snap it up on sight: you WON'T regret it! There's a copy over at Aaron's Out of Print Games, if you're willing to pay the price (cough, cough)... http://members.aol.com/aleeder454/ Mike *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 02 Mar 1999 11:41:34 -0800 From: "Jenni A. M. Merrifield" Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - AD&D SITES IN MYSTARA On Mon, 1 Mar 1999 15:31:58 -0500 (EST) Geoff Gander Wrote: >At some earlier time, Jonathan wrote: >>2. whatever (M)Orient is. and why would it be on Skothar? why not Brun? >>why not on an entirely new continent? why not on one of the moons? > >Actually there is a very good reason for this. Perhaps Jenni could clear >this up (Jenni?). But failing that, I think the impetus came from the >Master's Level OD&D set, which showed an oriental-style empire on Skothar. >The MOrient group decided that, since most of the established cultures >of Mystara are almost overwhelmingly European, and Asian-based >counterpart should be established. Since Skothar correspond to Asia >about 150 million years ago, why not turn that into an Asian-dominated >continent, with neat nations and new twists? To actually answer Jonathan's implied question: The term "MOrient" is used as a shorthand for saying "Mystara-Orient". As Geoff mentioned, some time ago (over a year, maybe even two) several list members started talking about developing an Asian-based counterpart to the largely European based "Known World". Geoff's explanation for 'why' it is on Skothar is fairly accurate. The other reasons were that, based on "canon" sources, no one in the "Known World" has ever heard of the MOrient cultures we were thinking of creating (as well as an MChina and an MJapan, there has been talk of others like an MThialand/Siam and an MBurma, etc.). We felt this could be explained by putting it on Skothar and including a xenophobia(sp?) like Real World China As an aside: Unfortunately, for one reason or another, after the initial burst of creativity, activity among group members died down. Just recently, we started talking again -- but with a much smaller number than we started with (several people just disappeared altogether, others indicated that they had not and still did not have the time to participate). We've gotten quiet again though, so who knows if we'll ever actually produce anything. :-| Jenni - -- Jenni A. M. Merrifield <==> strawberryJAMM Designs strawberry@jamm.com <==> http://www.jamm.com/jamm/ <------------------------------------------------------------------> God created Light. Then Earth, Vegetables, Animals, Man and Woman. Then God started to think: "I should create things I *like*!" And God said: "Let There Be Strawberries!" *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 2 Mar 1999 11:47:12 -0800 From: "Harvey, Michael" Subject: RE: [MYSTARA] - What campaigns are any good? > The Keep on the Borderlands This one is what you make of it. It's always been one of my favorites, partly due to nostalgia, and partly because it has potential. However to make a good module of it the GM will need to put some work into it. As written it is a typical dungeon crawl and the PCs will spend 90% of their time fighting. But if you organize the different factions under the brilliant leadership of the evil priests and then weave a conspiracy to conquer northern Karameikos, complete with spies and assassins, it could be very challenging and interesting. A direct assault on the caves would be suicidal if they were properly organized; subterfuge would be better and more interesting. I also expanded the Keep by placing farmlands and homesteads in the local area, and catacombs and sewers beneath (it was built on old ruins). The Temple of Evil Chaos became a secret cult spread throughout the known world, whose agents dogged the PCs after the assault on the caves. > In Search of the Unknown An illogical dungeon crawl, but with some fun traps and stuff. Jenni made up an interesting story to go with it, but the dungeon itself is still kind of silly. OTOH this is the first module I ever *played* in and it has loads of nostalgia. I definitely want to run it sometime. > The Lost City Like the Keep on the Borderlands, this is set up as a dungeon crawl, but it has lots of potential if you're willing to work with it. The upper dungeon is pretty standard stuff (ie not exciting) but the lower caverns are where things get fun... however they are not described in much detail, so you'd have to make it up yourself. Nevertheless the setup is wonderful and you could easily base an entire campaign here -- and the module *does* contain hints for doing this. (FWIW the setup reminds me of a mix between the Shadow Elves and several Conan stories...) > The Veiled Society > Rahasia > Journey to the Rock > Castle Caldwell > Night's Dark Terror > Queen's Harvest Don't have any of these. :-( > Is thier anywhere that campaigns are reviewed or you can at > least find out what they are or "were" about? You can find two reviews of B2 (one good and one bad) on RPGnet. Also you might check the D&D ratings page at http://www.enteract.com/~aardy/rate/index.html. Here is how players rated the modules you asked about (on a scale of 1-10): 9.5 - Night's Dark Terror 6.9 - Rahasia 6.7 - The Lost City 6.6 - The Keep on the Borderlands 6.6 - The Veiled Society 6.2 - Queen's Harvest 4.8 - Journey to the Rock 4.2 - In Search of the Unknown 3.3 - Castle Caldwell Mike *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 2 Mar 1999 14:54:24 -0500 (EST) From: au998@freenet.carleton.ca (Geoff Gander) Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - What campaigns are any good? > >>On Tue, 2 Mar 1999, Markus Olavi Montola wrote: >> >>> > The Lost City >>> >>> IIRC bad. >> >>I disagree. The Lost City is one of my favorite adventures. You just need >>a DM who is willing to work with the Cycindians, and not make it a dungeon >>crawl. > >I second that opinion. B4 is a pretty good adventure -- certainly, it's >more plausible and complete than the previous ones in the B-series! ;-) -- >but more to the point, it's a mini-setting you can expand upon, in your own >campaign. Or, if you can wait for the Cynidicea Team to present its ideas, >you might see lots o' new material on the Lost City here on the MML! (Any >progress, guys...? :-D) > > >>> > Rahasia >>> >>> Bad. >> >>Again, I don't think it is that bad. A dungeon Crawl, yes. And a long one. >>BUT it's VERY good for lower level characters. Lots of puzzles. Lots of >>Role-play. > >Actually, Rahasia WAS bad. (:-P) It's not got much to do with Mystara, >either: the elves you're supposed to rescue don't act much like Alfheimers >(since when do Alfheim elves marry, to be it evil magic-users or >otherwise?), and the various villains' magic seems foreign to the setting. > >OTOH, you could run it as a stand-alone, non-Mystaran adventure, if you're >trying to introduce some AD&Ders to the simplicity (and quirks) of the oD&D >rules. > > > >>> > Journey to the Rock >>> >>> Bad. >> >>yep. > >Yep again. :-) > >>> > Castle Caldwell >>> >>> Though nostalgic, very bad. >> >>Ech.. Even nostalgia can't save this one. Poor Poor Poor.. Owah Tagoo >>Siam! > >Haven't read it ... and the previous comments make me glad I haven't. :-) > > > > >About Night's Dark Terror: I think it's a FANTASTIC module! It's >practically a whole campaign in itself; about 90% of the Karameikos Gaz was >derived, directly or second-hand, from B10's contents; and you can easily >cut it up into a number of smaller adventures, not related to one another, >if you don't want to tackle the whole shebang. I've run the "Siege of >Sukiskyn" chapter as an isolated event, in six different campaigns -- some >oD&D, some AD&D -- and it's always given players a thrill, being the ones >defending their "lair" from invaders for a change! > >Too bad it's so hard to find copies of N.D.T., nowadays ... but if you can, >snap it up on sight: you WON'T regret it! > > >*************************************************************************** >To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line >'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. > > - -- Geoff Gander, BA 97 Cartographer/Game Designer/Government Peon Part-Time High Priest, Ottawa Chapter of the Church of Y'hog au998@freenet.carleton.ca *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 2 Mar 1999 14:59:48 -0500 (EST) From: au998@freenet.carleton.ca (Geoff Gander) Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - What campaigns are any good? Sharon wrote: >Or, if you can wait for the Cynidicea Team to present its ideas, >you might see lots o' new material on the Lost City here on the MML! (Any >progress, guys...? :-D) *extricates self from pile of papers* We're still working on it - just adding a bit myself.. :-) Geoff - -- Geoff Gander, BA 97 Cartographer/Game Designer/Government Peon Part-Time High Priest, Ottawa Chapter of the Church of Y'hog au998@freenet.carleton.ca *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 2 Mar 1999 15:40:08 -0500 (EST) From: SteelAngel Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - AD&D SITES IN MYSTARA On Tue, 2 Mar 1999, Jenni A. M. Merrifield wrote: > participate). We've gotten quiet again though, so who knows if we'll ever > actually produce anything. :-| Well, it sounds like the Davania team to an extent. There is so much any listmember can do. However, if you need help on MOrient, I'd be willing, since I'm already working on a couple of Oriental derivative civilizations in the "tanagoro" colony in Vulcania :) Ethan - -- Ethan Deneault - PH/MU '99 www.wpi.edu/~eand - wpi.flame Quote Archive. *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 02 Mar 1999 17:06:43 -0500 From: Glen Sprigg Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - What campaigns are any good? Since I have every one of these adventures, I'll give you capsule reviews. Buy all of them if you can; all have good ideas to borrow, even if you don't like the specific adventure. >The Keep on the Borderlands Almost everyone has played this; the quintessential low-level dungeon crawl. If your players haven't played it, they aren't true Mystarans. Highlights include battles with all the basic humanoids (orcs, kobolds, goblins, hobgoblins, gnolls) as well as a temple. Lots of nice Basic-level treasure, too. >In Search of the Unknown The very first ever D&D module, and not a bad one; you have to stock it yourself, which is good practice for aspiring DMs. If you're experienced, though, you might want to add your own twists. Highlights include the room of pools and a teleporting area that is sure to confuse mappers. >The Lost City A misleading title, since the essential part of the adventure is just a dungeon crawl in a pyramid. However, there is enough information to develop the rest of the pyramid as well as the city beneath it. >The Veiled Society A good thinking adventure; not too much fighting, and an excess of combat should have consequences. The adventure takes place in Specularum (or Mirros, if you prefer), and deals with the Karamekian Mafia (the Veiled Society). >Rahasia Probably the best of the basic adventures, a neat mystery to solve. Caution: hack-n-slashers wont like this, because killing everything you run into comes under the heading of Bad Idea. >Journey to the Rock A straightforward adventure with a bit of a moral at the end; three different paths, and some interesting new beasties. >Castle Caldwell This isn't one single adventure; there are five separate adventures in the bundle. Castle Caldwell and its companion adventure, the Dungeons of Terror, are about as basic a dungeon crawl as you're going to find, probably the weakest of all the basic adventures. The Great Escape is excellent, forcing the party to do some thinking as well as fighting. Elwyn's Sanctuary isn't bad. >Night's Dark Terror The best D&D module ever. Donate blood to raise money for this if you have to. It's for PCs with about 5000 XP to start, and takes them on a quest that will lead them to clues about Karameikos' ancient days. Fantastic module. >Queen's Harvest > A good adventure; although it is a sequel to King's Festival, it can be run alone. First the party explores a wizard's lab and runs across some interesting people (everyone, this is where Alexius met Serrah). Then they get to assault a fort filled of fanatical goblins and hobgoblins. A fun adventure, but not one to take lightly. >Is thier anywhere that campaigns are reviewed or you can at least find out what >they are or "were" about? Yes, right here. Hope this helps. Glen *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 02 Mar 1999 17:12:39 -0500 From: Glen Sprigg Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Savage Coast >>Don't bother. Seriously, the Red Steel books online are better, have >>more info, and are a lot cheaper, than the paper versions. Unless you >>really want ($30) that CD I wouldn't bother. Not that the CD doesn't >>have good music on it, but I'd just print out the online version. > >Yeek! The less said about that CD the better :) > I haven't heard the CD from the Red Steel set, since I can't find Red Steel. However, I do have Savage Baronies, and I like the music. I tend in that direction myself in my own compositions, so it gives me something to aspire to. But of course, I'll do it better ;-) Glen *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 2 Mar 1999 17:27:45 -0500 (EST) From: Mischa E Gelman Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - What campaigns are any good? > I'm looking to acquire oD&D campaigns for lower level characters, preferbaly > ones that are more than slash-and-burn (i.e. require some thinking and > strategy). I think I can get ahold of the following, I'd like some opinions > on them though. > > The Keep on the Borderlands Very prone to hack n' slash styles of play, but by playing off the inter-tribe rivalries you might be able to alter it well. Some of the NPCs could also be developed into fairly handy characters plot-wise. In other words, then, it needs some work. > In Search of the Unknown This is what you make of it, since it is DM-stocked. The problem is the room layout - it includes WAY TOO MANY odd rooms for any one building. Takes more work than B2, but I could see it being turned into a decent product by a good DM > The Lost City One of my favorite modules. The presence of Cynidicea and the 3 factions make for great RP opportunities, though you might want to tone down the monster presence a tad. Also, the plotline involving the brothers on the 5th? floor has potential. More useful for the setting than the adventure itself actually, this lends itself to good campaign possibilities IMO. > The Veiled Society One of my least favorite modules, but this might be up your alley. It's a mystery plot, which lends itself to some RP, and utilizes the various clans of Specularum (sp?), another plus. You need to branch off quite a bit from the module itself to make it work I think. > Night's Dark Terror One of the most popular modules, this might be a campaign in itself. I could easily see it lead from a level 2-3 party all the way through the defeat of the Iron Ring, the Gnolls, the Traldar, the Hutaakans and Kartobea - or maybe even the resurgence of the Traldar or Hutaakans if you play your cards right. Fairly heavy on combat, but very workable. > Is there anywhere that campaigns are reviewed or you can at least find > out what they are or "were" about? Daniel Boese (?) wrote up a list of Mystara products a few years back - I don't recall how much editorial commentary it included though. Someone mentioned a survey page and the results for these modules as well, but there are no comments there, just stats. - - Mischa Gelman Pittsburgh, PA I can deal with the losses. It's the losing I can't handle - former Expos coach Tom Runnels *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ End of mystara-digest V1999 #110 ******************************** *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara' as the body of the message. mystara-digest Wednesday, March 3 1999 Volume 1999 : Number 111 Mystara is a trademark of TSR Inc. All Rights Reserved. The following topics are covered in this digest: [MYSTARA] - Dragon Magazine List v.4 Re: [MYSTARA] - AD&D SITES IN MYSTARA Re: [MYSTARA] - What campaigns are any good? Re: [MYSTARA] - SHEESH! [MYSTARA] - Harri! [MYSTARA] - MOrient Team (Was: RE: AD&D SITES IN MYSTARA) [MYSTARA] - Fw: Arbus - the White Avenger Re: [MYSTARA] - SHEESH! [MYSTARA] - Re: Location of Inn Between Worlds Re: [MYSTARA] - A journey to the past Re: [MYSTARA] - MOrient Re: [MYSTARA] - House of Glantri, part 1 Re: [MYSTARA] - Harri! Re: [MYSTARA] - What campaigns are any good? [MYSTARA] - Fanstuff Re: [MYSTARA] - Fanstuff [MYSTARA] - Fun spells ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Tue, 02 Mar 1999 17:22:46 -0800 From: Andrew Theisen Subject: [MYSTARA] - Dragon Magazine List v.4 >At 05:57 AM 3/2/99 -0500, Fabrizio Paoli wrote: > >>List of Dragon Magazine containing Mystara Stuff v.4 >> >>(Original list is by Daniel Boese, later additions by Fabrizio Paoli, >>Glenn Sprigg and Shawn Stanley) > >>232 - En Garde! > >What is this article about? I've never heard of it before. (I thought I had all Mystara related Dragon articles... :( > >Andrew "Cthulhudrew" Theisen > *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 02 Mar 1999 17:29:51 -0800 From: Andrew Theisen Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - AD&D SITES IN MYSTARA At 05:57 AM 3/2/99 -0500, Sharon Dornhoff wrote: > >That's why, IMC, I'm using Patera as the focal point for MOriental >cultures. The few KW exceptions, like Ethengar or Ochalea, have been >influenced by Pateran culture: the Ethies, by their spirit-allies (which >are also active on Patera, traveling freely between moon and planet via the >Spirit World); and the Ochaleans, by their getting conquered by Myoshimans >for a time. This idea of Patera-as-Asia's been developed quite well by >other MML-users, and I especially appreciate the "Patera Project" writer's >effort in that regard: Kudos for Khompor-Thap, dude! :-) That was primarily me, with some assistance from Bruce Heard and Daniel Boese (and some discussion here on the MML). The main thing, as I saw it, was to explain the remarkable coincidence between the Ochalean and Sindhi cultures and certain of those on Patera. As I had it, though, the Ochaleans (the original, pre-Alphatian ones- a topic suggested here on the list) were the cultural influence on the Myoshimans, although, come to think of it, I almost prefer your interpretation of it. It would also help me to get rid of yet another apparent migration between the two worlds... (that timeline is still in gestation, so any and all assistance is appreciated- I've really enjoyed your Hollow Moon articles, btw.) Andrew "Cthulhudrew" Theisen *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 2 Mar 1999 20:28:51 EST From: GlobalFrog@aol.com Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - What campaigns are any good? In a message dated 3/2/99 3:02:44 PM EST, au998@freenet.carleton.ca writes: << Sharon wrote: >Or, if you can wait for the Cynidicea Team to present its ideas, >you might see lots o' new material on the Lost City here on the MML! (Any >progress, guys...? :-D) *extricates self from pile of papers* We're still working on it - just adding a bit myself.. :-) Geoff >> And if any of you have already come up with rules for dealing with drug addiction/withdrawal please send them to GLOBALFROG@AOL.COM...it would make my life a LOT easier as far as getting THAT portion of the "Cynidicea Files" completed. :) One Eye the Dwarf (aka cj) *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 3 Mar 1999 03:47:08 +0200 (EET) From: Markus Olavi Montola Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - SHEESH! > >BTW; do you folks ever handle aspects of love, romance and sex? Can you > >make PC-NPC -affairs believeable and intimate? > Mmm. Generally No - at least, it isnt roleplayed in all its detail. On the > other hand, IMC there is a PC who is married to an NPC - and although we IMC it was actually very much fun as a male player begun to seduce my female NPC, who de facto was seducing him with much more subtlety. I understood the feminine principle of playing hard to catch. :) Aside from being an enlightening experience, I also figured out a couple of ways of puzzling someone trying to seduce you. Like not saying anything, but giving impressions, and finally forcing the opponent to take the first move. Like pretending to be asleep or nearly asleep when the pc enters the bedroom (where he was invited by expressions but not by actual words), and making him decide whether he wants to do something else than sleep. Naturally, as we are not playing an American Movie (tm) but artistic epic fantasy, the editor cut the film in the point when he awakened her, and left the intimate affair to the players' imagination. Besides I would never have had the adjectives to describe how perfectly well Valerias does *it*. > dont normally go on about it in game sessions he does do a lot for his > wife... he even gave her a wish spell once when it was offered to him. Wife is *HARD* to play in a long term, at least for me. The same PC has also a wife (they were made to marry one another by their families), and I constantly move him out of game by delicate moves. Lot easier now that she is first pregnant and then must take care of the child. Krondaharian partriarcality. > "Do you know what true love is? Sacrifice...." I am in a constant temptation to kill PC's loved ones to provoke an emotional response and a strong effect, but that would be unfair in long term, so I try not to. Angst is a great source of story, but not the one to be used within Glantri, IMHO. - Markus P.S. My habit of awarding XP for great role-playing led me to grant a fine 8000xp for the playing. Now as I come to think of it, seducing Valerias should be worth more than that... (If you learn by killing a dragon, you should learn a lot more by seducing a goddess). ----------------------------------------------------------------- W A R I S P E A C E F R E E D O M I S S L A V E R Y I G N O R A N C E I S S T R E N G T H ----------------------------------------------------------------- *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 3 Mar 1999 03:50:41 +0200 (EET) From: Markus Olavi Montola Subject: [MYSTARA] - Harri! Your Ellerovyn was GREAT stuff, but I still have a few things to ask. 1. It would be great and magnificent to have your compiled Glantrian timeline. 2. It would be even fantastic, if you and Jenn would coordinate your Glantri-stuffs. Like having the same ancestors for characters. 3. If you would repost me your Drachenfelses, I would be eternally thankful. - Markus ----------------------------------------------------------------- W A R I S P E A C E F R E E D O M I S S L A V E R Y I G N O R A N C E I S S T R E N G T H ----------------------------------------------------------------- *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 02 Mar 1999 17:25:37 -0800 From: "Jenni A. M. Merrifield" Subject: [MYSTARA] - MOrient Team (Was: RE: AD&D SITES IN MYSTARA) On Tue, 2 Mar 1999 15:40:08 -0500 (EST) SteelAngel Wrote: >On Tue, 2 Mar 1999, Jenni A. M. Merrifield wrote: > >> participate). We've gotten quiet again though, so who knows if we'll ever >> actually produce anything. :-| > >Well, it sounds like the Davania team to an extent. There is so much any >listmember can do. However, if you need help on MOrient, I'd be willing, >since I'm already working on a couple of Oriental derivative civilizations >in the "tanagoro" colony in Vulcania :) I suppose you meant to say "There is ONLY so much any listmember can do." That's it exactly. And to really keep a project like the MOrient going strong there has to be at least ONE person who is willing to take "leadership" of the project, i.e., regularly sending out notices to members, nagging people for updates, collating the decisions, etc. Right now the MOrient team is leaderless. I haven't had the time myself or I would have done it, however, I'm already a "leader" for a few personal Non-Mystara and Non-RPG projects at the moment, and they are even currently suffering delays because I have son to take care of Nathan (at least I haven't returned to work yet!). Heck I have to be honest and admit my own MOrient work is currently stalled (An MOriental Dragon Race who are the Emperors of the MChinese). At least I could give the web page a home, but there hasn't been anything added to it in ages. *sigh* Sorry folks. This rant wasn't precisely on-topic for the list ... although maybe I've put a fire under someone -- or even myself -- to take the MOrient Team under wing. Seeing as I've just finished up one of my major personal Mystara projects (the Jet Black module) perhaps I could try. Anyone else (besides Ethan) who is interested in joinging the MOrient team, feel free to contact me about it. Also, if you want to see what little we have got together so far, check out my Mystara web site: http://www.jamm.com/mystara/ Caio, Jenni - -- Jenni A. M. Merrifield <==> strawberryJAMM Designs strawberry@jamm.com <==> http://www.jamm.com/jamm/ <------------------------------------------------------------------> God created Light. Then Earth, Vegetables, Animals, Man and Woman. Then God started to think: "I should create things I *like*!" And God said: "Let There Be Strawberries!" *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 2 Mar 1999 22:46:38 -0500 From: "DJ Sahlas" Subject: [MYSTARA] - Fw: Arbus - the White Avenger Hello, folks I have to say that I'm really impressed with the contributions to the list, lately. In dusting off some ancient scrolls, I came across the following item, which I now present for your perusal: ARBUS - the white avenger +3 two-handed sword, +5 vs. orcs, undead, and dragons Powers: 1. Can emit light in a 15 foot radius three times per day. 2. May cause all magic within a 20 foot radius to glow three times per day. 3. Can find all invisible and hidden objects and creatures within a 20 foot radius. Extraordinary Power: The user of the white avenger may inflict four times the normal damage on each hit. This power lasts for 1 to 10 rounds when commanded, up to three times per day. Languages: Arbus can speak (and read) goblin, hobgoblin, orcish, gold dragon, common, and magic. Intelligence: 12 Ego: 6 (Will Power: 19) History: Arbus was forged in Blackmoor to serve as a companion blade to the famous White Sword. Unfortunately, it was stolen before it was ever used in Blackmoor by agents of the Empire of Thonia. It was subsequently turned over to a Thonian paladin by a devious emperor with none the wiser to its abduction. The White Avenger obtained its nickname in those days as the great paladin - Sir Galladon of Etheria - used it to smite the hordes of chaos throughout the land. Sir Galladon finally met his match, however, on a trip to the elemental plane of water - where he was defeated by an ambush of several crab-like ice creatures known as hydraxes. The leader hydrax took the blade, and kept it for several hundred years. When a wizard from the prime material plane bound the hydrax to his will, the hydrax finally terminated the arrangement by offering the wizard the sword. The wizard (known as Krios of the Peaks), gave the sword to his gaurd captain Juniper. Time passed, and the wizard died, leaving Juniper to pursue a solo career. This was an age when the earth was entombed in ice - and when the current owner of the sword died, his body and the sword were placed in a cave which was soon inaccesible due to the advancing glaciers. A thousand years passed - and then came the day when a Nithian adventurer looted the tomb and recovered the sword. However, Arbus would not let him wield it, so he sold it to the Nithian sorcerer Kepet Thoth. The wizard had no better luck finding someone to wield the blade, so he kept it stashed away until the day that Nithia was destroyed and her civilization thrown to the four winds. It was merest chance it would seem, then, that a passing Traladaran hero by the name of King Halav should find the blade sticking out of the desert sands of what are now the Emirates of Ylaruam. He used the sword in his campaigns with his two great companions for a few months before it was lost at sea. For well over a millenium Arbus lay covered in mire in the briny deep. Eventually, the sword was found on a treasure hunt by a great Ierendian adventurer. This warrior used the blade to win the kingship of the Ierendian Archipelago. When he was defeated in the annual tournaments by the current King Palfrit, Axel Kars travelled home to his native Darokin. There he gave the sword to his brother - a merchant - in exchange for their ancestral lands. Aster Kars was slain, however, by a group of chaotic shadowelves which he saw on the borders of Alfiem failing to bring news of their presence to any of the proper authorities. The leader shadowelf tried to grasp the White Avenger - and when it burned his hand he dropped it with a curse and cast a powerful dispel magic upon it. This made the weapon fall silent and lose all abilities save the light on command. It also decreased its magical abilities in other ways - though the intent of the evil elf had been to destroy it. Thus the weapon was taken to Glantri, where the shadowelves and the subversive faction known as the Peoples Spell-Casters Company were making tentative steps at an alliance. The sword was given as a token of good faith. When wizards of the P.S.C.C. detected for magic, they received such a powerful glow that they immediately safe- gaurded it against further detection. When the adventurer Bran McGriff smashed the P.S.C.C. with his companions, he was able to take the sword after a routine check by the authorities revealed nothing much. The shadowelves, in the meanwhile, cut all connections with the Principalities. (addendum: to learn about the subsequent history of the White Avenger, if enough interest is shown, the last owner (a Klantyran paladin of the Claymore) may respond, as he lurks on the list) J Sahlas *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 2 Mar 1999 23:47:45 EST From: Arminath@aol.com Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - SHEESH! In a message dated 3/2/99 12:49:06 PM Eastern Standard Time, mmontola@cc.hut.fi writes: << I figured that pregnancy in Mystara is not just plain biological thing, but has an aspect of the Creation within it. So Valerias can't get rid of the child just by abandoning Helena and taking another form -- it is Valerias who is pregnant, not her vessel. I still develop the ideas for what to do with the child. Marvelous opportunities. >> The only snag with this premise is that Immortals cannot have childern. I'd allow the mortal identity to be biologically functional and unless the mortal identity was destroyed, it would be pregnant for the prescribed period, whether in use or not. *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 3 Mar 1999 10:04:12 +0100 From: "Jacob Skytte" Subject: [MYSTARA] - Re: Location of Inn Between Worlds > > > So officially the answer is Skothar. > > > > Unless we play and own DA1-4 in which case the answer is sort of the > > broken lands and is pretty much irrelevant anyway. > > DA1-4 never mentions the original location of Blackmoor - the inn could > easily have been moved away with the destruction. Or at least this answer > seems more reasonable to me than the idea that the Thonians rebuilt their > entire civilization on a whole 'nother continent. The 'officially' part > might not be a good idea in the FAQ though, as this can be argued. The way I saw (read) it in DA1, the Inn had probably been moved around with ice floes (during an ice age), but due to the enchantments cast upon it, it endured it all and eventually ended up in the Broken Lands. Jacob Skytte, Denmark *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 3 Mar 1999 10:22:56 +0100 From: "Jacob Skytte" Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - A journey to the past > >I've been thinking of ways to tie in the present with the past. For > >now I've come with some ideas: > >1. Have one of the PC's be a descendant of a character from the past. > >Perhaps even his/her own ancestor (I love paradoxes). > >2. Have the timetravelling device be an artifact previously used by > >an NPC in the Blackmoor era to attain immortality. This would involve > >the PC's in a quest for immortality; thus introducing them to that > >concept, and would allow them to jump to a few points in time > >corresponding to this quest for immortality. > > Here's a couple more: > > - One PC could be the reincarnation of a Blackmoor-era NPC. If the PC is a > heroic sort, Odin might have arranged for his/her return ... and perhaps, > even for the character's meeting his/her previous identity. The > reincarnated PC could look just like the previous incarnation -- making for > some amusing cases of mistaken identity! ;-) -- or the previous "self" > might be of a totally different appearance, race and/or gender, yet retain > the same personality and talents. Ah yes, mistaken identity scenarios are always fun to spring on PC's. And I haven't done it yet with this particular group, so it won't seem tried. Great idea. Of course it will probably be a rogue rather than a hero; they're usually already up to their neck in all kinds of trouble. > - Likewise, the chief Blackmoor-era villain for the adventure could be an > earlier incarnation of the PC party's nemesis. Hel brought him/her back to > life in the KW era, as a reward for the many deaths he/she caused in the > distant past. You can even do this with a villain whom the PC party's > already killed off, in the modern era, and whom they THOUGHT they'd never > have to confront again! Well, it could be an Immortal powerplay setup; though I've already more or less decided to use NPC's from the City of the Gods as chief villains (Saint Stephen and the Captain). Of course, this villain could be lurking more behind the scenes causing all kinds of trouble for the PC's. > - Shortly before this time-travel adventure takes place, you could let the > PCs discover an old Blackmoor artifact ("artifact" in the archeological > sense, not a magic item), such as a long-buried shield with King Uther's > personal crest on it. This same shield then turns up, all new and shiny, > somewhere in the course of their visit to the past. Nice. > >> Orcs, goblins, trolls and the like aren't around at this > >> time. They are the descendants of the Beastmen, so I suggest that you > >> replace the goblinoids mentioned with Beastmen. You can use the same > >> statistics, but change the descriptions slightly. > > > >Oh, yeah. I hadn't considered that. Well, it's not that big a > >problem; I find that the Blackmoor era focuses more on dealings with > >different cultures of men than the goblinoids. But encounters with > >Beastmen would be nifty. > > I've reconciled this, by saying that terms like "orc", "troll", "goblin" > and so on were originally the names of individual Beastman TRIBES, not > races. These tribes started out just as genetically-varied as the HW > Beastmen, but once the humanoid genome stabilized, each one developed into > a different modern-day breed of humanoid. Yes, well, I've kind of decided not to include humanoids in the adventures, but this is a cool idea; and it also goes to explain the various names, although they've migrated quite a bit from their original tribal lands... Of course all the races of Mystara have been migrating for long periods of time... > So, Blackmoor-era NPCs might tell the PCs "There's fifty kobolds chasing > us!", causing the players to relax ... only to have 50 enormous Beastmen -- > who just happen to be from the "Kobold" tribe ;-) -- come charging out of > the woods! Yeah, imagine the PC's laughing about the puny enemies. "Well, the joke's on you". > >Thanks, it seems helpful as well. Anyway, I have made some decisions > >regarding the technological advances in Blackmoor. The way I see it > >the Blackmoorians technology originated with the thefts of technology > >from the so-called City of the Gods (DA3). > > > >Unfortunately the Blackmoorians were unable to duplicate the > >materials as well as the nano-technology needed to fabricate similar > >items. However they were able to integrate some of the existing > >technology with magics as well as develop their own "primitive" > >versions of the extra-terrestrial (extra-Mystaran ?!?) technology; though > >of course it was far superior to existing technology. Unfortunately they > >failed to see the limits of their technology, and their meddling with the > >reactors of the City of the Gods eventually caused their own > >destruction. (Some generations later, tieing neatly in with the quest > >for Immortality mentioned earlier). > > I think it's a pretty good summary of what happened, going by the > information in the Blackmoor modules. Well, they weren't quite particular on the matter, so I had to make SOME decisions, while trying to stay in context. I'm currently in the process of developing the final incarnation of the City of the Gods, where the Blackmoorians have built a huge metropolis on top of it, but are tinkering with the reactor to provide more power to the growing city. > Personally, I've never cared for those modules -- too many of their "named" > NPCs seem overpowered, dull and/or trite, to me -- so my campaign's > scenario for Blackmoor runs a little differently. Yes, well, most of the NPC's will only be around for the initial adventure, where the PC's will travel to the past, get acquainted with Blackmoor and sack the City of the Gods. They will then travel forward in time to one or two later eras before arriving at the final City of the Gods and "helping along" the destruction of Blackmoor. Jacob Skytte, Denmark *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 03 Mar 1999 10:21:15 CET From: "Herve Musseau" Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - MOrient From: DM <> Hey, maybe the MOrient group could start releasing their work, or at least what's in a presentable format, to the MML? <> I don't know exactly what is that reason why Alphatia would leave it alone, but that's probably a good way of explaining why MOrient has been left alone for all these years: Alphatia stands in between. Sure, there will be some explorers who will go there, but there will be few of them. Some such probably were Thyatians BTW, since that label of "Empire of the Great Khan" on the Master Set needs to come from somewhere! It seems to me that, prior to the last years and the discovery of the HW (which have prompted expeditions there, as well as other expeditions like the Pionneer ship), or more exactly the Thyatian & HK conquest/colonization efforts in DV, the nations of Brun were pretty much OW-centric (plus Alphatia). Even colonization attempts in western Brun were forgotten (the SC baronies). Maybe an effect of magic, that leads people to think that they can make whatever they need by magical creation/alteration or summoning, so they don't need more natural resources? Anyway, between Alphatia to the east, and the Arm of the Immortal's dangerous cape in the west, it would be difficult to establish any reliable trade route with MOrient IMO. BTW Marco, I hope the MOrient team will release its material before next year, so we can use them in the 1017 or 1018 almanac. I already have ideas for them, ideas that James will love (for once!). James, considering what we're doing this year, I'm sure you know where I'm going with that... ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 3 Mar 1999 13:28:17 +0200 (EET) From: Harri M{ki Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - House of Glantri, part 1 On Tue, 2 Mar 1999, Sharon Dornhoff write > In case you haven't read the Dragonlord novels, Harri, you might want to > check them out too. There's a Thyatian griffon-rider who appears > repeatedly in that series, as an agent and ambassador for Emperor > Cornelius: one Darius Glantri, a presumed ancestor of Lord Alexander. :-) > > Nothing Darius does invalidates what you've written here -- the DL series > takes place in the early 500s AC, and you've already established the > Glantris were a military family of long standing -- but it would probably > be a good idea to mention him as the family's first political connection to > the Highlands/Glantri. (Especially since he married the Highlands' first > Chancellor, Solveig White-Gold!) In fact, Darius Glantri's pivotal role in > getting the Highlands back on their feet, after the Dragon Wars ended, > might've done a lot to earn his descendent Alexander the respect and > loyalty of old Braejr's many factions. Kind of like being the > many-times-great-grandchild of Admiral Nelson, in IRL Britain. > I have read only the first part of the Dragonlord novels, so this was totally new to me. This was very interesting, I think that I write/send first rest of my history of Glantri-family and incorporate something of this to it and then write first part again. Harri Mäki hihama@uta.fi *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 3 Mar 1999 13:48:44 +0200 (EET) From: Harri M{ki Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Harri! On Wed, 3 Mar 1999, Markus Olavi Montola wrote: > Your Ellerovyn was GREAT stuff, but I still have a few things to ask. > > 1. It would be great and magnificent to have your compiled Glantrian > timeline. Eventually I will send it, but not until I have posted all what I have in mind for concerning various houses. > 2. It would be even fantastic, if you and Jenn would coordinate your > Glantri-stuffs. Like having the same ancestors for characters. > What Glantri-stuff you exactly mean by that. I thought I haven't done anything that contradicts her material. Harri Mäki hihama@uta.fi *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 3 Mar 1999 13:32:40 +0100 (MET) From: Agathokles Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - What campaigns are any good? > > The Lost City This is a good dungeon crawl plus an underground city setting, though IMO the second part of the pyramid (expert level section) is really bad: there are a lot of illogical monsters, as if the author filled the rooms by rolling on wandering monsters table. > Rahasia Better than the Lost City, but still dungeon crawling. However, it needs more stealth and cunning than brawn, and that is good. About Rahasia not being really "Mystaran": it is true, but it can be used with non-alfheimian elves (I used Vyalia elves, though I had to change some names). > Night's Dark Terror > A great campaign-adventure, with a lot of details on north-eastern Karameikos, Hutaakans, humanoid tribes and the Iron Ring. Giampaolo Agosta *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 3 Mar 1999 14:43:57 +0200 (EET) From: Markus Olavi Montola Subject: [MYSTARA] - Fanstuff > > 2. It would be even fantastic, if you and Jenn would coordinate your > > Glantri-stuffs. Like having the same ancestors for characters. > What Glantri-stuff you exactly mean by that. I thought I haven't done > anything that contradicts her material. Virayanas, particularly. No contradictions, yet, I agree. :) But you haven't included any Virayanas (except Toktai Virayana) in your texts. Are you in sync with the Glantri Timeline? Anyway, nice job that had to be done -- I myself thought it was too much work in the beginning of my campaign, and a couple of time have found that it is a real problem that there's no history at all in the Gaz. - Markus ----------------------------------------------------------------- W A R I S P E A C E F R E E D O M I S S L A V E R Y I G N O R A N C E I S S T R E N G T H ----------------------------------------------------------------- *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 3 Mar 1999 15:42:31 +0200 (EET) From: Harri M{ki Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Fanstuff On Wed, 3 Mar 1999, Markus Olavi Montola wrote: > > Virayanas, particularly. No contradictions, yet, I agree. :) But you > haven't included any Virayanas (except Toktai Virayana) in your texts. If you read my History of Drachenfels's you find there besides Toktai also Birkai Virayana, Jherek Virayana III and Jherek Virayana IV. By the way for everyone else when I in Chapter of Morgaithe von Drachenfels mentioned Etienne d'Ambrevilles return and Charan Erewan being Grandmaster in that time, it should be Jherek Virayana III not Charan Erewan. In my writings about history of elves they not mentioned so often because there wasn't really so much dealings between them. > Are you in sync with the Glantri Timeline? > Basically I am. But I have made some alterations here and there. I had to also decide datings/years for some happenings that were not dated in canon material, for instance year of death for Alexander Glantri, enfeoffment for Nouvelle Averoigne and Klantyre... Harri Mäki hihama@uta.fi *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 3 Mar 1999 10:02:34 EST From: MAESTROPI@aol.com Subject: [MYSTARA] - Fun spells All the recent work on OD&D spells has gotten me going back through all my old campaigns. Among the stacks of papers was one of these old spells. Fourth level Magical Spell Wineform Range: Touch Duration: Permanent Effect: Creates up to 32 gallons of wine This spell causes wine to pour from the casters finger, as if from a bottle or a wineskin. The total amount created cannot exceed 32 gallons. (about one barrel) Casting time varies on complexity. Filling a barrel will take about one round, as the wine flows quickly from the hand. Filling several wineskin could take 10 rounds, and the flow would be briefly paused between skins. Filling the glasses of many guests at a royal banquet could take the maximum time allowable, 12 turns. (2 hours) The wine created must be a single variety. The wine created may then be modified for up to two hours with another wineform. This is how spellcaster winemakers often make fine wines. He creates a simple white or red wine, ages or modifies the flavor, then cast a final wineform to "lock the blend into place." Once locked, it can no longer be modified by wineform spells. The caster may decide what sort of wine is created, within reason. Creation of exotic or rare wines may be disallowed, or require that the caster is very familiar with it, and an intelligence check. Players are welcome to come up with new ways of modifying the wine. Bubbles, increased potency, and no alcoholic content could be an interesting start. This spell was often used in role-playing scenarios, and even used in combat once. Some high powered orcs were chasing the party up a flight of stairs, and mage decided to dump a barrel of red wine upon them. After they fell down the stairs, the party began combat while the mage increased the potency of the wine. After several rounds, the party ignited the 150 proof wine with a thrown torch and fled. That little battle changed the level from 3rd to 4th. *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ End of mystara-digest V1999 #111 ******************************** *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara' as the body of the message. mystara-digest Thursday, March 4 1999 Volume 1999 : Number 112 Mystara is a trademark of TSR Inc. All Rights Reserved. The following topics are covered in this digest: Re: [MYSTARA] - Dragon Magazine List v.4 Re: [MYSTARA] - Harri! [MYSTARA] - Wineform [MYSTARA] - Re: Dragon Magazine List v.4 Re: [MYSTARA] - Wineform Re: [MYSTARA] - Harri! RE: [MYSTARA] - MYSTARA: D&D [MYSTARA] - House of Glantri, parts 1 & 2 [MYSTARA] - Red Hurricane (long-ish) Re: [MYSTARA] - Red Hurricane (long-ish) ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Wed, 3 Mar 1999 16:39:10 +0100 (MET) From: =?iso-8859-1?Q?H=E5vard_R=F8nne_Faanes?= Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Dragon Magazine List v.4 On Tue, 2 Mar 1999, Andrew Theisen wrote: > >>232 - En Garde! > > > >What is this article about? I've never heard of it before. (I thought I > had all Mystara related Dragon articles... :( Fencing schools of the Savage Coast. It is incorporated in the Savage Coast stuff presented on TSRs site. If you havent done so already, go on and download it :) Hĺvard Haavard R. Faanes (hoc@nvg.ntnu.no) http://www.nvg.ntnu.no/~hoc "Remember, there are no stupid questions, just stupid people." -Mr Garrison, South Park. *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 03 Mar 1999 08:40:43 PST From: "Jennifer Favia" Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Harri! Markus Olavi Montola wrote: >2. It would be even fantastic, if you and Jenn would coordinate your > Glantri-stuffs. Like having the same ancestors for characters. Thanks! It's a big complement to be put on par with Harri, who's done so much to flesh out Glantri. I've only really done Krondahar, as far as royal families are concerned, but Harri, you're welcome to them! :-) The files are available at stan's site, or at my web site (go to the "regular site" option for quicker access). Jenn Explore Dark Myst Manor! http://www.geocities.com/TimesSquare/Chasm/4270/ ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 03 Mar 1999 18:48:34 +0100 From: Ezio Pignatelli Subject: [MYSTARA] - Wineform Nice spell! But... doesn-t it look much more like a clerical spell? - -- Ezio Pignatelli - Dipartimento di Astronomia - Padova Tel: +39-49-8293459 - Fax: +39-49-8759840 mailto:pignatelli@pd.astro.it http://leda.pd.astro.it/~epignat - -- *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 04 Mar 1999 07:14:18 +1100 From: stan Subject: [MYSTARA] - Re: Dragon Magazine List v.4 >>>232 - En Garde! >> >>What is this article about? I've never heard of it before. (I thought I >had all Mystara related Dragon articles... :( Well it's on the TSR site so you've got access to it, it's there at http://www.tsr.com/Dragon/Backissues/232aug96/232EnGarde.txt It's about fighting styles on the Savage Coast. stan http://www.geocities.com/TimesSquare/5304 *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 4 Mar 1999 02:08:05 +0200 (EET) From: Markus Olavi Montola Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Wineform > Nice spell! But... doesn-t it look much more like a clerical spell? IMHO Wineform was acceptable, for the difference between clericism and magic should be loosened slightly here. The style is all that matters, and it is very easy to imagine an averoignian mage creating wine out of nowhere. (And IMHO it would be level 2 or 3 spell, with useful side-tactic for clever players). One thing would be to make the wine quite strong (13%-15% alcohol), therefore making it no good for quenching thirst unless diluted by water. Complete Wizard's Handbook describes many spells making me puke, especially Protection from Hunger and Thirst is c*h*e*a*p. - Markus ----------------------------------------------------------------- W A R I S P E A C E F R E E D O M I S S L A V E R Y I G N O R A N C E I S S T R E N G T H ----------------------------------------------------------------- *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 4 Mar 1999 10:46:53 +0200 (EET) From: Harri M{ki Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Harri! On Wed, 3 Mar 1999, Jennifer Favia wrote: > > Markus Olavi Montola wrote: > > >2. It would be even fantastic, if you and Jenn > would coordinate your > > Glantri-stuffs. Like having the same ancestors > for characters. > > Thanks! It's a big complement to be put on par with > Harri, who's done so much to flesh out Glantri. > > I've > only really done Krondahar, as far as royal families > are concerned, but Harri, you're welcome to them! :-) > > The files are available at stan's site, or at my web > site (go to the "regular site" option for quicker > access). > > Jenn I have printed those files for myself and actually changed Jherek Virayana IV's father from Bogdo to Jherek because Jenn had named him already like that in his files. I must add that in my version I take the running number in Jherek Virayana IV as meaning the fourth prince of Krondahar not fourth Jherek in family. I have made same assumption with Vlaardoens, Vanserie is eleventh prince in family and because Juliana is first princess there is no running number after her name yet. Harri Mäki hihama@uta.fi *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 4 Mar 1999 10:00:37 +0100 From: Kristian Kramer Subject: RE: [MYSTARA] - MYSTARA: D&D Mystaros convincingly expressed his feelings about the new 'D&D' system: >Exactly. The "NEW" D&D Boxed Set is actually a form of "AD&D LITE", used to >introduce new players to the game. It has nothing to do with Classic D&D (from >the Cyclopedia). WotC made a deal with Arneson after they bought TSR, which >cleared up the whole D&D vs. AD&D situation (TSR had to maintain that D&D and >AD&D were seperate and distinct games, otherwise they would have to have payed >Dave Arneson the same royalties that he was supposed to get for D&D)... once >that situation was resolved, they decided to use the D&D TRADEMARK for the >"Intro" version of AD&D... purely a marketing move... Unfortunatly you are right, I think. It's all about the money (yeah, I know that's what WotC were up to by buying TSR in the first place), but it's a shame. I have a .PDF-file with a "Dungeons & Dragons fast-play Game" An introduction to the AD&D role-playing game. It's not so good. The adventure is very simple, but maybe good enough for beginning players. A bit like the adventure in the D&D Basic Boxed set (the red one), but I liked that one better (and use it to introduce new players to D&D). Oh, and Arminath is right when he writes : >I suppose I'll buy all the 2nd Edition stuff I can so I don't support the new >system, especially if they move from a class/level system to the >"much heralded" skills systems clone of every other game >out there now. I hate it when some bean counter takes something good >and turns it into a clone of the current fad. I thought about that too (buying all the 2nd Ed. stuff I could find, a bit expensive but worth it in the long run. And no I don't want some skill system, so I'll stick to 2nd Edition. Kristian Kramer "Courage isn't just a matter of not being frightened, you know. .. It's being afraid and doing what you have to do anyway." The Doctor (Planet of the Daleks, 1973) *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 4 Mar 1999 15:20:54 +0200 (EET) From: Harri M{ki Subject: [MYSTARA] - House of Glantri, parts 1 & 2 I added something about Darius Glantri to the part I posted tuesday, so here also that part again. Glantri Years in Alasiyan Marches Glantris were an old Thyatian military family. They came to the Alasiyan lands in 621 when Lord Gustavo Glantri was named as military-governor of Western Alasiyan Marches. He was a stern, nearly cruel leader, who centered all power on his own hands. He was an imposing figure, with full beard and a body as fitly and well proportioned as any painter could have painted it. He died in 660 at the age of 64 and was succeeded by his son Lord Konstantius. He was as talented and imposing as his father has been. But he had a difficult temper and he quarrelled with his 3 half-brothers so during his governorship Thyatians began to lose ground increasingly to the Alasiyan nomads. He was not very popular because of his rash judgements and was not mourned when Alasiyans captured and executed him in 675. He was 42 years old. The position of Glantri-family in the area was already so strong that it surprised nobody when Lord Konstantius' half-brother Lord Johannes was named next military governor. He was so talented as his father and half-brother had been in military matters but again very imposing figure. Whereas his father and half-brother were warriors he was a warrior-priest of Vanya and very fanatical for that. During his governorship Vanya's worship spread very fast amongst the Thyatian settlers in the area. He again united the Thyatian side of the war and stopped the advance of the Alasiyan nomads for a while. He died in his bed in 699 at the age of 62. Lord Johannes' son Lord Ericus was not interested in staying in Alasiyan Marches and had went to Thyatis City already in 792. So the next military governor was Lord Gustavo Glantris last remaining son Lord Carlo. He was again not a warrior but a priest of Tarastia. However he had got a military education when he was young. He was not somewhat shorter than his father and half-brothers had been and also already because of his age (47) somewhat plump. He was already balding and used only goatee instead of full beard of his ancestors. Lord Carlo was very stern in his faith, his judgements were extremely harsh and he silenced any opposition with very severe punishments. So it was not very surprising that he was not very popular amongst other nobles and normal people. Lord Carlo took a war against Alasiyan nomads and Alphatian settlers in whole new level. Instead of only defending Thyatian settlements he send his troops in the desert to attack oasis' of nomads and even over the desert to attack Alphatian settlements. His popularity amongst the military began also decrease because of these very tough military expeditions. So when he died unmourned in 711 at the age of 61 everyone was relieved. Tiberio Glantri Lord Carlo's only son Lord Tiberio was only 17 when his father died. Because of his young age he was passed by in the selection of new military governor. There was send a new man from the Isle of Dawn, Lord Pontius Gardius. Lord Tiberio had got a best possible education there was. He spoke already several languages fluently, he was gifted in music, understood arts and so on. He was also very gifted in military matters, he had already taken part in couple of expeditions and had showed his talents. Most of all he was possessed with foresight. He saw instantly that Lord Pontius would led Thyatian troops to military catastrophe and criticised his leadership. This was of no avail because Lord Pontius had some very influential supporters in Thyatis City. During the next years in wars against the Alasiyan nomads Lord Tiberio showed that he was a brilliant general. He led his troops from victory to victory and it was only because of his talents that disaster came only in 728. Lord Tiberio was already before the Battle of Hedjazi sure that Thyatians would lose it. it was only because of his brilliant cavalry operations that even some of the Thyatian troops get away from the battle. When Otto von Drachenfels contacted him after the battle and presented his migration plan to Highlands, Lord Tiberio immediately realised that this was the right way out of the impossible situation. He also remembered that his ancestor Darius Glantri had went there as an ambassador about 200 hundred years earlier. It was because of his immediate support that the others agreed too. Lord Tiberio would have logical choice for the leadership of the migration after Graf Hans Graustein had rejected the position. Lord Tiberio however realised that Herr Otto was better option. Lord Tiberio was not very imposing, he was inherited his fathers plumpness and was even shorter than Lord Carlo had been, Herr Otto was a head taller than he and looked a noble whereas he looked more like a clerk. When the migration reached Selenica in 729 Lord Tiberio married Herr Otto's sister Griselda. It was his second marriage, he had already in 714 married Lord Cecare Fulvina's cousin Lucrezia. She had however died in childbed when their son Claudio was born in 716. This new marriage made the relations between von Drachenfels's and Glantris even closer than they been earlier. They have been in friendly relations since Herr Otto had in 718 married Lucrezias younger sister Lucia. In Selenica they also met Morphail Gorevitch-Woszlanys migration from Traladaran lands. Lord Tiberio was only one to oppose the joining of the groups. There was something he didn't like in Morphail and he agreed to be in touch with him only because of the common goal. When the migration arrived in the Highlands in 730 the refugees from the Alasiyan lands separated amongst the scattered southern Flaemish farmers. Lord Tiberio and his followers settled in the forefront against the Flaemish heartland in the area of modern Hightower. When the skirmishes with the Flaems started nearly immediately Lord Tiberio was adamant, he would not give up his area, he wanted to settle right there where he is. If the Flaems want a war they would get a war. He already saw that this war would got his life, but he believed in faith so strongly that he didn't mind. Lord Tiberio lead the troops of the settlers during the next four years with varying success. He won more battles than he lost, but the victories were usually very costly. He fell in battle in 734 at the age 40. Claudio Glantri Tiberio's only son Lord Claudio was only 18 when his father died. He was slim, plain youth, who had none of his fathers military abilities. He was as intelligent as his father and much more artistic, but those were not the qualities needed in that time. Luckily he had his fathers old teacher Alexius Steltarius for help. Steltarius was already over 70-years old, but his political abilities were still intact. Before he died in 737 he helped Lord Claudio through the hard times. He realised that Lord Claudio didn't like the fighting, so he advised Lord Claudio to appeal to his ancestors, Darius Glantris, good name amongst the Flaems. This was just the right thing to do and the truce was settled in 736. After that Lord Claudio concentrated his efforts for building home for himself and his stepmother. He began to build Castle Glantri in the place were there is now Hightower. He also took the title of Count Glantri. Castle was finished in 739. After that Lord Claudio spent his time in feasts, celebrations and hunting. His castle became the centre of art circles and scholars amongst the settlers. Years went fast and only disturbance was his stepmother Griselda, who was worried because Lord Claudio didn't get married. In fact she began to worry if he is at all interested in women. Happy years ended in 751 when Lord Claudio's cousin Joachim von Drachenfels married Luise van Agt, a Flaem. Lord Claudio couldn't care less. But he also couldn't stop his supporters for blaming Joachim marriage as a grovelling towards Flaems. This lead rapidly to skirmishes between Flaems and settlers and for other settlers great surprise Joachim took the side of the Flaems. Lord Claudio was very unhappy of this development. In 753 he began to talk about leaving the Highlands and giving his title to his cousin Titus Glantri. His advisers talked him out of this for now. When skirmishes stopped in 756 everybody acknowledged that Joachim von Drachenfels was the best military leader in the highland area. During those five years also Titus Glantri had shown that he had inherited his family's military abilities. Although Lord Claudio was happy when the peace returned, he realised that he couldn't stand the life in the area. He also saw that Titus would be far better ruler in prevailing conditions than he himself could ever be. So in 759 Lord Claudio announced that he gives his position as Count Glantri to his cousin Titus. Couple of weeks later he left Highlands for Thyatis City were he lived amongst artists and scholars as a respected patron until he died in 789 at the age of 73. Titus Glantri Titus was son of Tiberio's younger brother Drusio, who hadn't followed his brother to Highlands but stayed in Thyatis. Titus was born in 722 and was given military training. In 742 he had suddenly decided that his possibilities would be much better in Highlands than in the army of Thyatis. His arrival to Castle Glantri in 743 surprised his cousin Lord Claudio totally. Titus was not very charismatic person, he was short, stout, coarse-features and even ugly. But he was also intelligent, strong-willed, brave, dutiful and industrious. He soon rose one of the closest advisors of his cousin Lord Claudio. It was however a surprise when he was in 751 given a command of the Thyatian troops in the area. During the next 5 years He showed that he is second only to Joachim von Drachenfels in military ability. He also got married in those years. In 754 he married Hedvig Graustein, Hans Graustein's youngest daughter and next year was born their only children, daughter Hadriana. Then in 759 Lord Claudio announced his resignation and Titus Glantri became in the age 37 second Count Glantri. He had anticipated that Lord Claudio would eventually do that. In fact Titus had on purpose told Lord Claudio about life in Thyatis City and so increased his desire to go there. Lord Titus now began to train his army because he realised that the peace could not last long. There were hotheads amongst both the settlers and the Flaems and he wanted to be ready when the fighting would start again. When Joachim von Drachenfels in 761 began to sent envoys to various rulers of the Highlands area for negotiations for building a unified state, Lord Titus was very sceptical from the beginning. He saw differences between various groups more clearly than Joachim. Lord Titus however used the opportunity to better his relations with Joachim, because he realised that together their military talents might be enough against the others if the war should begin. So when Joachim changed his plans in 769 Lord Titus was amongst the first support his plan of military pact between various settler leaders. Still it was only in 776 when they finally convinced Barone Carlo di Sfonti to join them. Di Sfonti who's areas were farthest away from the Flaemish lands was very hard to convince that it would be in his interests to send his troops in the case of war out of his own areas. Joachim von Drachenfels was acknowledged to be supreme leader of the troops in case of war and Lord Titus to be his second-in-command. When the war then came in 784 it didn't surprised anybody. Joachim von Drachenfels and Titus had been provoking the Flaems already for years. Joachim and Titus lead settler troops rapidly to the Flaemish lands and in 785 they arrived to the Flaems' capital Braejr. There Joachim's gout got so bad that he couldn't take part in the battle. Titus lead the troops against the city, but this was not his area. He was brilliant commander in open field but not against fortified city. The Flaems were victorious and the settlers had to retreat south. This defeat was an enormous loss to Titus' reputation. But after that all went well. Next year Joachim von Drachenfels succeeded in negotiation with the elves. And then in 786 arrived Alphatian, Halzunthram. It was only because of Joachim's strong pressure that the others accepted the Alphatian amongst them. Now the alliance was strong enough to push the Flaems to north. The Flaems totally defeated at the Battle of Braastar in 788. Lord Titus stood right next to Joachim when he accepted the surrender of the Flaemish leaders. And then Joachim died. Lord Titus was a loss what to do. He realised that he himself was not a charismatic enough to take a leadership. Viscount Ottone di Sfonti was already over 80-years old and Joachim's son Sigmund had any of his father's qualities. After some talking Titus and Ottone realised that now they must negotiate with the Flaems and the elves about the future. In the negotiation Lord Titus lead the settler side, Ottone was too tired to take part. Council with 5 members (1 Thyatian, 1 Kerendan, 1 Hattian, 1 Flaem and 1 elf) was Titus' proposal, he soon agreed with Don Fernando de Belcadiz's counter-proposition of Council with 8 members (3 Flaems, 2 elves, 1 Thyatian, 1 Kerendan and 1 Hattian). Halzunthram's coup became as total surprise for Lord Titus. He was at first very angry, but soon Halzunthram and Sigmund von Drachenfels talked him and Ottone di Sfonti to their side. Titus was already 66-years old and had began to feel the signs of getting old. So he decided that if they could get a peace at the leadership of Halzunthram, even if he was an Alphatian, that was enough for him. And Halzunthram also promised him status as the first noble in the area as Duke of Glantri, Ottone di Sfonti was made Viscount of Sirecchia. Lord Titus now left a command of his troops to his generals and retired to Castle Glantri. Next year for his great joy his daughter Hadriana came back from Thyatis City were she was sent 19 years earlier for education. He had also with him her 1-year old son, Alexander. Titus was happy for seeing his grandson. Hadriana never mentioned a word about the boys father and Titus was tactful enough not to ask when he saw that Hadriana didn't want to talk about him. When the war was prolonged and Halzunthram demands began to grow, Lord Titus began consider again his alliance with Halzunthram. Also for some reason Hadriana was strongly against the alliance. Titus contacted in 794 Matteo di Sfonti, Ottone's nephew, who was because of Ottone's old age the real leader of the Kerendan faction, and proposed him that they should open secret negotiations with the rebel Flaems. Negotiations went on for nearly two years until in 796 they got an agreement and Thyatians and Kerendans joined the Flaems. Lord Titus again lead his troops to war. But his physics didn't anymore stand the strain. He died in his bed in 797 at the age of 77 for the complications after wounding in the battle. Harri Mäki hihama@uta.fi *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 4 Mar 1999 14:36:39 +0100 (MET) From: DM Subject: [MYSTARA] - Red Hurricane (long-ish) Hi everyone! Do you remember my old post about the Polymar race? I hardly belive you do, but for those of you who're still interested, this post is its proper sequel (the article on the Polymars' history can be found on my site). It details the Red Hurricane, the Polymars' most hated and oldest nemesis, and his incredible secret.. Enjoy! PS: this is based upon the anime "Hurricane Polymar", just in case u were wondering.. DM http://www.geocities.com/TimesSquare/Dungeon/2967 The Red Hurricane As long as evil will threaten Mystara, justice will bear my name... - - Hurricane Polymar's battlecry. History The Red Hurricane has always battled the Polymars, the Invisible People as he calls them, since his birth. Tarin Oregar was the first and most successful Red Hurricane so far, but others followed and have always tried to use the powers of the Polymer Helm to fight evil and treachery and to unmask the polymars' hidden plots. The polymars themselves don't know who or what the Red Hurricane really is, only Novar does and he's not telling them the whole truth. He has only ordered the Group to dispose of this devil by crushing his head or by reducing him to ashes, so that the helm will be destroyed without anybody knowing what it really was. The Polymer Helm is an old Blackmoor relic, a technological device that alters the molecular structure of the wearer making him very similar to polymars, only tougher and swifter. The helm also contains a small but powerful micro-computer which stores a large database where the information gathered so far by all the Red Hurricanes have been accumulated. The wearer need simply to concentrate on the desired information to retrieve it and exploit it. It is a veritable repository of arcane lore, as well as an incredible fighting machine. Furthermore, all its effects are not magical in nature, but physical, and so they are not dispellable. However, due to Mystara's strange physical properties, the Helm has been loosing many of its original powers and today it is a much less depowered version even though it still inspires fear in the hearts of the polymars. Loosing one power each century, it will be completely useless in about a millennium, unless it is taken away from Mystara earlier. Appearance The Polymer Helm appears as a red rounded motorcycle helm with the lower frontal part enclosing and protecting the wearer's chin. It is always shiny and perfectly polished and the material used to make it is a strange kind of metal alloy unknown to any Mystaran smith. It is able to adapt itself to the size of the wearer provided he is no taller than 2 meters (6'10'') and no smaller than 1 meter (3'). By using one of its powers, the wearer is also able to change the Helm's appearance while it is donned, although once removed it immediately regains its normal shape. When one of the powers is activated, a transparent blue glass-like (plexiglass) viewer slids down to cover the eyes; when the power is deactivated, it slids back inside the upper part of the helm. Powers Any being no taller than 2 meters can wear the Helm and become the Red Hurricane. Immediately after it is donned, the Helm establishes a telepathic link with its owner and gives him the basic information about its creation and goals. It also gives the wearer access to the secret passwords to call upon the powers left in the Helm. To use one of the powers the wearer must simply concentrate and utter the comman word: this is considered like casting a spell (it takes one full round to operate, during which the wearer can only dodge or move). All the powers can be used simultaneously. These are the powers left in the helm with the Polymer Points needed to activate them (see below for Polymer Points): Power Name Polymer Points Polymar Vision 1 Polymar Scouter 2 Polymar Change 3 Polymar Illusion 4 Polymar Mole 5 Polymar Torpedo 6 Polymar Sparrowhawk 7 Polymar Skin 8 Polymar Strength 9 Polymar Speed 10 Hurricane 20 * Polymar Vision: the wearer gains a thermal infrared vision that allows him to see quite clearly even in darkness (just like the elves' Infravision). The power requires 1 PP each 3 turns it is activated (consumed immediately after activation and every 3 turns thereafter). * Polymar Scouter: the wearer is able to view through the viewer the true form and physical stats of everyone in a 18 meters (60') radius. The wearer has 90% -1% per creature's HD to view its true form, and can evaluate its Strength, Hit Points and Hit Dices (note: HD, not Levels). The power requires 2 PP each turn it is activated (consumed immediately after activation and with each subsequent turn). * Polymar Change: this power functions just like the first level wizard's spell Alter Self. The wearer can assume the form of another humanoid being, changing his clothes and physical appearance. He can grow up to 30 cms (1') more or shrink up to 1' less than his normal height, increasing or decreasing his bodily weight of up to 30 kilos. He can also alter his apparent age (no restrictions) and his clothes, concealing his objects as well, although they will always remain the same. This is only an illusion, and even though it cannot be dispelled, it can be discovered by touch and by the use of Trueseeing. The power requires 3 PP each turn it is activated (consumed immediately after activation and with each subsequent turn). * Polymar Illusion: using this power, the wearer creates illusory duplicates of himself that move and act mirroring the original character but which can be distinguished from him only by touch (exactly the same of the wizard's Mirror Image spell). The images remain in a 5 meters (15') radius from the wearer and each image disappears if touched. The wearer can create 1d4 images for each 4 Polymer Points spent, and they last only 1 turn (or until touched). There maximum number of images that can be created simultaneously is 20. * Polymar Mole: the wearer's body (with his whole equipment) turns into a mechanical excavator of the same size and can dig his way into the earth at the movement rate of 36 (12) mts/yds per round (the encumbrance rate is the normal one but it does not affect the speed). Until he is in this form, the character cannot use his equipment nor speak, but he senses everything normally (can hear and see with infravision and normal vision) and has all his stats. Since the change is physical and not magical, it cannot be dispelled. This power requires 5 PP to be activated and lasts 1 turn (every other turn another 5 PP must be spent to mantain the power). * Polymar Torpedo: the wearer's body (with his whole equipment) turns into a mechanical submarine of the same size and can swim on and under-water with the movement rate of 36 (12) mts/yds per round (the encumbrance rate is the normal one but it does not affect the speed). Until he is in this form, the character cannot use his equipment nor speak, but he senses everything normally (can hear and see with infravision and normal vision), can breathe underwater and has all his stats. Since the change is physical and not magical, it cannot be dispelled. This power requires 6 PP to be activated and lasts 1 turn (every other turn another 6 PP must be spent to mantain the power). * Polymar Sparrowhawk: the wearer's body (with his whole equipment) turns into a mechanical airplane of the same size and can fly at the rate of 36 (12) mts/yds per round (the encumbrance rate is the normal one but it does not affect the speed). Until he is in this form, the character cannot use his equipment nor speak, but he senses everything normally (can hear and see with infravision and normal vision), and has all his stats. Since the change is physical and not magical, it cannot be dispelled. This power requires 7 PP to be activated and lasts 1 turn (every other turn another 7 PP must be spent to mantain the power). * Polymar Skin: the wearer's skin becomes tougher and more resilient, giving him a base AC of 3. The skin however assumes a strange reddish hue, as if the character was wearing a crimson body suit. This power requires 8 PP to be activated and lasts 1 turn (every other turn another 8 PP must be spent to mantain the power). * Polymar Strength: the helm stimulates the muscles of the wearer's body to increase their volume and power, adding 5 points to the character's Strength (even exceeding the maximum stats for his race). The power is not cumulative (the character cannot activate it twice to double the bonus) but can be combined with other powers and spells. This power requires 9 PP to be activated and lasts 1 turn (every other turn another 9 PP must be spent to mantain the power). * Polymar Speed: the helm stimulates the wearer's polymers, nerves and brain making him more reactive and fast in his actions. The character acts as if he was hastened and gains a bonus of +2 to his Initiative roll and -2 to his Armor Class. The power is not cumulative (the character cannot activate it twice to double the bonuses) but can be combined with other powers and spells. This power requires 10 PP to be activated and lasts 1 turn (every other turn another 10 PP must be spent to mantain the power). * Hurricane: the most awesome power of the Polymer Helm, this allows the wearer to perform an incredible physical deed in a short time. The wearer of the helm has his Strength and Dexterity boosted to 18 (or 19 if they already are 18), his movement doubled (he can also jump at his normal movement rate), his THAC0 reduced by 1 point and he also gains 1 level, with all the bonuses and advantages that come with it. This power is not cumulative but can be combined with others or with other spells. While it is activated, a glowing yellow symbol appears in the middle of the torso and on the back of the character's hands: it is the symbol of the Polymar Helm, a strange mix between the letter "P" and a bird. It requires 20 PP to be activated and lasts for 6 rounds, after which the character must rest for another 6 rounds. During this period he is considered "stunned", but this doesn't prevent him from activating other powers of the helm (save the Hurricane). The Polymer Helm is considered like a +5 magical armor in order to understand what kind of weapons or monsters can damage it. It is totally immune to normal or magical cold based attacks and automatically takes half damage from fire and acid based attacks (another ST vs Fire/Magical Fire or Acid is allowed to reduce the damage to 1/4). Electricity damages it normally. It has 100 Hit Points (encumbrance: 20 coins), and for every point of damage taken there is a cumulative 1% of chances that its powers misfunction (roll each time a power is activated). If reduced to 0 Hp, the helm is destroyed utterly. The Helm can heal itself only if it is donned by somebody, drawing upon his stamina. As long as a living character is wearing the helm, the damage taken by the helm can be repaired at the cost of 1 Hp per Hit Point of the subject through a very special non-magical blending. The process takes 1 turn for every Hp to be repaired, and the wounds produced on the wearer are real, but can be cured both in the normal and magical way. Beware however, that this process is not controllable: once the Helm is being damaged, it automatically enters the repairing mode and starts leaking away the wearer's Hit Points to preserve itself. The only possible way to stop it before it kills the wearer is to remove it from one's head. However, if it is still damaged once it is donned again, it immediately restarts the procedure until it is completely repaired. Polymer Points The Helm works stimulating the polymers of the human body according to the programmed patterns inscribed in the helm's micro-computer. The power source used to cause the alteration of the polymers is a miniaturized auto recharging nuclear battery that also draws upon the mental strength and stamina of the helm wearer to operate. Every time the Helm is used, the battery loses part of its energy, until it runs out. The battery however recharges itself automatically so that it always becomes fully recharged after 24 hours. The Polymer Points (PP) of the Helm are calculated adding the wearer's psyco-physical characteristics to the Base Value as follows: Base PP (50) + Intelligence + Constitution = Total PP. The Polymer Points are regained at the rate of 1 per turn (6/hour) when the helm is not worn and 1 every 2 turns (3/hour) if it is worn and used. Since the process is not magical it cannot be blocked or magically slowed in any way. *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 5 Mar 1999 01:06:57 +1100 (EST) From: "Jonathan Nolan, Barrister & Solicitor, FTIA" Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Red Hurricane (long-ish) > Polymer Points > > The Helm works stimulating the polymers of the human body according to the > programmed patterns inscribed in the helm's micro-computer. The power source > used to cause the alteration of the polymers is a miniaturized auto > recharging nuclear battery that also draws upon the mental strength and > stamina of the helm wearer to operate. Every time the Helm is used, the > battery loses part of its energy, until it runs out. The battery however > recharges itself automatically so that it always becomes fully recharged > after 24 hours. > The Polymer Points (PP) of the Helm are calculated adding the wearer's > psyco-physical characteristics to the Base Value as follows: Base PP (50) + > Intelligence + Constitution = Total PP. > The Polymer Points are regained at the rate of 1 per turn (6/hour) when the > helm is not worn and 1 every 2 turns (3/hour) if it is worn and used. Since > the process is not magical it cannot be blocked or magically slowed in any way. Is there any connection at all between Polymer Points and Radiance? Or between Polymer Points and the Point rating system of Immortals? - -------------------------------------------------------------------- * * Jonathan Nolan FTIA - International Law practice call 618 89310176 * * - -------------------------------------------------------------------- Mystara/RPG Netbooks: www.physics.adelaide.edu.au/~ksimpson/netbooks.html *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ End of mystara-digest V1999 #112 ******************************** *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara' as the body of the message. mystara-digest Friday, March 5 1999 Volume 1999 : Number 113 Mystara is a trademark of TSR Inc. All Rights Reserved. The following topics are covered in this digest: Re: [MYSTARA] - Red Hurricane [MYSTARA] - New Races for NOH First Draft (fwd) Re: [MYSTARA] - AD&D SITES IN MYSTARA [MYSTARA] - WENDAR - Love It Or Leave It [MYSTARA] - RE: Wendar - Love it or leave it Re: [MYSTARA] - RE: Wendar - Love it or leave it [MYSTARA] - DISEASES [MYSTARA] - ELF MAGIC SPELLBOOK ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Thu, 4 Mar 1999 15:32:24 +0100 (MET) From: DM Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Red Hurricane On Fri, 5 Mar 1999 01:06:57 +1100 (EST), "Jonathan Nolan, Barrister & Solicitor, FTIA" wrote: <> No connection at all. The Polymer Helm is a technological device and relies on a micro-auto recharging battery to replenish itself once used. Radiance was not there at that time, and it doesn't use immortal magic. The helm is 100% NON MAGICAL, so it functions also in the Day of Dread and all No Magic zones. Unfortunately Mystara's particular nature makes it decay and lose one of its powers every century. With all the remaining powers and the date of its creation, you might figure how many powers it had at the beginning ;) DM *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 5 Mar 1999 02:04:27 +1100 (EST) From: "Jonathan Nolan, Barrister & Solicitor, FTIA" Subject: [MYSTARA] - New Races for NOH First Draft (fwd) From: Bazza Clarke To: geckoes@ozemail.com.au Subject: New Races for NOH First Draft Jon This is a revised race for my Unitians having been "inspired" by THE INCOMPLETE NETBOOK OF HUMANOIDS, and yes I would like to CONTRIBUTE! YOU KNOW YOU WANT TO ! This is my Unitians/Starians without the ecology/race determination/what may be described as the Bulls..t. This is also the filtered down version, trying to blend in well in the NOH. When Monty gets that chance (hopefully at L21) these races will be a killer, but with some disadvantages to match. For example a strict code of conduct. These races that Monty wants to create are "designed" to hunt and destroy fiends/devil/demons like a human kills a ogre. This is the watered down version of these races. Probably they would best be encountered in ruins or the outer planes. Note: These races are the personification of the RuneQuest rune in humanoid form. These races could be a cross between the Star/Infinity and Unity/Infinity runes. These races presented below are just the Star and Unity runes and their associated powers. Since your Mr Rune Guy your approval of how this is presented, would be nice. These Races just hunt ogres unlike their counterparts. These are the Unitian Nephilim and the Starian Nephilim. The "Nephilim" designation just means "lower", not "cursed", or "sinned". 1st Draft. ================================================ Unitian Nephilim and Starian Nephilim (NOH Race) These races were inspired from my facination with the runes from the RPG RuneQuest. The Unitians are a dark skined race with a metallic skin resembling humans. The Starians are a white skined race with a metallic skin resembling humans. The metal of the skin of the Unitians is a metal called Black Star Metal, thus giving them their black coloured skin. The Starians skin is from a metal called White Star Metal. Both act as normal skin but is extremely resistent to injury, giving the Unitians a natural AC -5 and the Starians an AC 0. They are often mistaken for golems but are a sub-species of humanity. Unitian Nephilim and Starian Nephilim have a set of special powers unique to their being, in addition to their class chosen. Unitian Nephilim have the powers of gravity, mass, time travel, imprisionment. Starian Nephilim have the powers of protection, all-seeing/never surprised, first strike. Unitian Nephilim tend towards warrior classes and Starian Nephilim tend towards the magic using classes Unitian Nephilim and Starian Nephilim tend to be of Good or Lawful alignment. SPECIES: (as a character creation) Str Dex Con Int Wis Chr Age: Ht:(") Wt:(Ibs.) Unitian Nephilim 15-? 3-18 12-? 3-18 3-18 9-18 1-500 65+3d6 160+6d10 Starian Nephilim 9-18 3-18 12-18 15-? 12-? 9-18 1-500 65+3d6 160+6d10 Unitian Nephilim: receive +1 STR, +1 to CON, -1 INT, -1 WIS. Starian Nephilim: receive +1 INT, +1 to WIS, -1 STR, -1 CHR. Both receive PSPs: 3d6 x 10 SPECIES: Level Maxima: War Wiz Cleric Specialist Wiz Specialist War Specialist Cleric Unitian Nephilim U* 9 U*% 9 U*# 15% Starian Nephilim 9 U* U*% U* 12# U*% KEY: U* = unlimited level progression; # = as per fighter but gains spells at 9th level simular to paladin; % = Clerics tend to follow gods whose Area of Control is sympathetic to one or more of their runic powers; Unitian Nephilim Level Racial Abilities Gained 1 One extra WP 2 Gravity Attraction (treat as Psionic Psychokenisis: Telekinesis but attracting only) 3 Increse/Decrese Mass (as per Enlarge spell and Item spell) Increse/Decrese Density effecting objects, person etc 4 Zero Gravity - Fly, Weightlessness 5 Antigravity - reverse gravity (spell Reverse Gravity is one application) 10 Time Travel 15 Imprisionment Specialist Warrior Spheres: Time, Numbers, Combat Clerical Spheres: All, Time, Numbers, Combat, Necromancy, Healing Starian Nephilim Level Racial Abilities Gained 1 Bonus Proficiency: (Player pick one): Alertness, Danger Sense, Sense Danger, or Alertness as per Rod of Alertness) 1 Protection 4%/level, max 88% (treat as Magical Resistence and include Mental Resistance, Psionic/Psychic Resistance) 3 Never Surprised 5 First Strike (increses every 5 levels). Allows 1 extra round of combat before normal combat begins, OR has weapon speed power similar to Short Sword of Quickness and Scimitar of Speed. It strikes in that segment of the round. Can also use spell First Strike from Cerilia (Birthright). 5 Psionic power: All-round vision, 60 yards radius, increses 10 yards/level. Specialist Warrior Spheres: Protection, Divination, Wards Clerical Spheres: All, Protection, Divination, Wards, Necromancy, Healing ================================================ There it is. *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 04 Mar 1999 11:20:58 -0500 (EST) From: Kevin Turner Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - AD&D SITES IN MYSTARA On Sun, 28 Feb 1999, SteelAngel wrote: > You're AD&D settings list is sooooo Brun-centric. > > MOrient is on Skothar. > > > Ethan I have been out of commission for the last few days due to a server crash, but I hardly expected to return to find that my very simple question had sparked a flame-war. I thank Jon for actually answering my question, and to the rest of you who decided that the question wasn't worth answering and was more interesting to flame each other's choices of placement: grow up! I asked a simple question, one that I would actually like answered. If you're not interested in answering, the least you can do is be polite and let others answer. Rather peeved, - --Frobozz-- *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 5 Mar 1999 04:32:38 +1100 (EST) From: "Jonathan Nolan, Barrister & Solicitor, FTIA" Subject: [MYSTARA] - WENDAR - Love It Or Leave It "Wendarian cwuen Wendori - the Green-Elven tongue & the Green Elves" Language also called: Wendarian, the Feynessei tongue, Feynessei Elvish During the long hike from Davania to Brun, some Elves crossed the terrifying Black Peaks. They forsook the march to the northern seas, where Protius would change some Elves to wild merfolk at the behest of other Immortals. In High Elven, these Elves who crossed the Black Peaks to settle a fey kingdom were later called the Wendor or "Those who go back", though it seems that none of them actually returned all the way to the ancestral lands of the South; they just stayed behind in the northern realms when other Elven peoples experienced further displacements during the repeated waves of human and humanoid invasion and settlement. Led by a clan leader called Denethor some of the Wendor eventually did enter the islands of Alphatia. They settled in what was then known as Ossiria, which region they renamed Lindaron, and by the Alphatians they came to be called Green-Elves (in High Elven, "Laegil", plural "Laegelrim"). Concerning the relationship between the Green-Elven and Alfheim tongues, it is stated that "although the dialects of the Feynessei Elves, when they again met their long separated kindred, had so far diverged from Alfheim High Elven as to be hardly intelligible, little study was needed to reveal their kinship as Elf tongues" (from Erenthil's 'Leaves of the Tree: Alfenvolk' at p. 257). By the time that the modern realm of Wendar was settled into its present form, the language spoken there was little more than an accented dialect of Elvish. All that is known of the Wendarian tongue is some thirty words, most of which are found in the Alfheim Blodherien Scrolls. In the words of the great Elf Linguistic scholar Kleinot Erenthil, "Though the comparison of the Feynessei dialects with their own speech greatly interested the loremasters, especially those of Davanian Elvish origin, little is now known of the Feynessei Elvish. The Feynessei Elves had invented no forms of writing, and those who learned this art from the Alfheim Elves wrote in Elven as well as they could". Some of the Alfheim Elves that came to what is now known as Gylharen's Realm escaping the destruction and chaos at the time of the Fall of Nithia circa 500 BC adopted the Wendarian tongue and took names of Feynessei form and style, just like the Davanian Elves had adapted their High Elven names to Common Elven centuries earlier. These Alfheim Elves "wished indeed to become Feynessei folk and to return, as they said, to the simple life natural to the Elves before the invitation of Ilsundal had disturbed it" ('Leaves of the Tree: Alfenvolk' at p. 259). Yet Elven somehow infiltrated into even the Feynessei communities: "By the end of the third century BC, the Feynessei tongues had probably ceased to be spoken in the two regions that had importance at the time of the War of the Beastmen: Traldaria, and the realm that had evolved into Alfheim in the shelter of Canolbarth in northern Darokin. All that survived of them in the annals was a few words and several names of persons and places" ('Leaves of the Tree: Alfenvolk' at p. 257). Nimurodiel Earthwalker the Champion of Ilsundal would only speak the Feynessei tongue even after it had otherwise fallen into disuse in Alfheim; see 'Leaves of the Tree: Alfenvolk' at p. 241. 'Leaves of the Tree: Alfenvolk' at pp. 252-253 suggests that the name Canolbarth itself may be altered from Wendarian Calórandorin, "Valley of Golden Leaves (or golden light)", or the even older Barath-Calindórandorin "Vale of the Land of the Holy Singers (Cal-Lindar = Bard-Priestess)". According to a footnote in the fragmentary Greywroth Scroll, our only source for colloquial spoken Feynessei, not only "Canolbarth" and its variants but also the names Altan Canolrhon, Amiroth, Treant, Actaeon and Nimurodiel are probably of Feynessei origin, adapted to a more commonly spoken form of Elven speech. Clearly the relatively archaic and insular Wendarian customs and speech were not well-suited to trade and interaction with other races. There is not much we can say about the structure of Wendarian. Very little grammar can be extracted from the few words we have. An Elven-style umlaut-plural is seen in uruc ("Orc") pl. yruc (Elvish orch, yrch). This umlaut must have developed independently of the Elven umlaut on the other side of the Black Peaks (there is no trace of umlaut in High Elven and the Elves of modern Davania, languages that evolved from Common Elvish after the separation of the Wendor from the other Elves. In "Lindioia", the name the Wendor had for themselves, a descendant of the old Primitive Ilsundial Era plural ending -ioi is still present. Does the ending -rhon of Altan Canolrhon indicate genitive plural, cognate with and identical to the corresponding High Elven ending? This would give the name the plausible meaning *"mountain [or fortress] of trees". Canol "tree" could be as in High Elven, but this language has no genitive endings. WENDARIAN WORD-LIST with etymological notes alm "elm-tree" aerd "holding, enclosed area" *only known from two usages - Nimuraerdoth, an old form of the name for *the region of Drenagoth and Wendar, and Yruchaerd, an early form of the *Common Tongue word Orchard, in its original meaning of "enclosed place *the Orcs seek" beorn "man" Altan "moated fortress, mountain" *probably to be compared to Elven ("Davanian Elvish") Altan - - *"a city (built above ground)", derived *from the stem TAN "make, do" (LR:362); *the basic meaning may be simply "something rising up, *construction" (compare High Elven LAN "building, house", ELAN "treehouse, *home" and ELTAN "treefortress, treekeeper"). andorin, -andorin "valley, vale" cogn "bow" cwenda "Elf" Danas "Green-Elves, Wendor" *It seems unlikely that the Wendor would have called *themselves by such a name. They people still called themselves by *the old clan-name Lindai [= High Elven Lindar], which had taken the *form Lindioia in their tongue. Danas is probably a memory of a Traldar *or Nithian word for the Elves and kindred of Wendar. dar, -dar "land, realm, great valley, encircled" *suspected cognate of andorin. Dun-Amiraclincorion "Blackmoor, Darkness at the Rising of the Sun" *the second meaning given is the literal one, but this title is only *ever applied to Blackmoor the Lost. dunna "black" ealc "swan" edel "Elder, High Elf" *Derived from a stem !LED, defined as "Star-folk" garma "wolf" gemaet "stronghold, settlement, group of dwellings" gnolda "one of the wise folk, Hutaakan" *an interesting possibility for an origin of the Common *Tongue "Gnoll", adding fuel to the hypothesis that there was either *much confusion between the origins of the Children of Pflarr and the *Beastmen or a real link of some kind known to the Elves of antiquity... hrassa "precipice" Lindi "The Singers" *what the Wendor called themselves, a cognate of High Elven Lindar *The reference was to their love of song and saga Lindon - region in eastern Alphatia where the Green-Elves settled, *formerly called Ossiria Lindorandorin "Vale of the Land of the Singers" Lorandorin "Valley of Gold (golden light)" lygn "pale" *Primitive form given as lugni "blue". meord "fine rain" obhytlhon "Hin, halfling, peck" scella, sciella "shade, screen" (prob. noun) snaets "spear-head, point, gore, triangle" spariel "white, wool" spenna "cloud" swarn "perverse, obstructive, hard to deal with" uruc (pl. yruc) "Orc, Beastman" Utum "The First, Ixion" *A clearly non-Elfish word, Utum has every sign of being from the dawn *language of the human race. Further evidence of very early contact *between Elves of the Ilsundial Era during Ilsundal's epiphanic travels *and the nascent human communities. Wendar "The Valley of the Elves" *from the originally foreign term for the Green Elves given to them by *their kin from elsewhere. Original Elf explorers and traders renewing *contact with what we now call Wendar called the place the Green Elves *had settled Cwendya-Dar, later shortened to Cwendar, "valley of the *elves". In such a manner did the less numerous Green Elves suffer *to lose their own complex and lyrical names for place and moiety. *** - -Jonathan - -------------------------------------------------------------------- * * Jonathan Nolan FTIA - International Law practice call 618 89310176 * * - -------------------------------------------------------------------- Mystara/RPG Netbooks: www.physics.adelaide.edu.au/~ksimpson/netbooks.html *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 4 Mar 1999 21:36:02 -0500 (EST) From: au998@freenet.carleton.ca (Geoff Gander) Subject: [MYSTARA] - RE: Wendar - Love it or leave it Jon, This is very impressive! I had a good read in going over your scholarly tale, and in locating the telltale Tolkienseque influences (Ossiria=Ossiriand, etc.) ;-). All this is of course in keeping with the general feel I think Wendar and Denagoth have - a little piece of Middle Earth in Mystara. Well done! Geoff PS - Any chance we can see some more elvish lingo? - -- Geoff Gander, BA 97 Cartographer/Game Designer/Government Peon Part-Time High Priest, Ottawa Chapter of the Church of Y'hog au998@freenet.carleton.ca *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 5 Mar 1999 14:43:12 +1100 (EST) From: "Jonathan Nolan, Barrister & Solicitor, FTIA" Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - RE: Wendar - Love it or leave it > Geoff > > PS - Any chance we can see some more elvish lingo? I'm afraid so... I am working on all the languages at present, from the TSR sources, mainly proper names and illustrations, as well as Tolkien and old english / old french / arabic / demotic and so on... The Elven speech is the easiest because of Tolkien and the real world sources he used. - -------------------------------------------------------------------- * * Jonathan Nolan FTIA - International Law practice call 618 89310176 * * - -------------------------------------------------------------------- Mystara/RPG Netbooks: www.physics.adelaide.edu.au/~ksimpson/netbooks.html *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 5 Mar 1999 16:06:20 +1100 (EST) From: "Jonathan Nolan, Barrister & Solicitor, FTIA" Subject: [MYSTARA] - DISEASES De Principia Codiceque Physiologica Mystarae Diseases - -Compiled by Cullpoppy the Healer of the Street of Dreams, Mirros "He that can smile at death, as we know him; who can flourish in the midst of diseases that kill off whole peoples. Oh, if such a one was to come from God, and not the Devil, what a force for good might he not be in this world of ours." Bram Stoker, Dracula Disease Name Symptoms Cure Prognosis Contagion First Encountered Bloodfire Inflammation of the Brain [fever], Coma within 10 hours None Con check or die, then half-Con check or die Highly Infectious Bloodfire was originally a disease of the Broken Lands but in the last generation it has migrated to the increasingly foetid waterways of Glantri City. Dodo 'Flu Sneezing, Runny nose, Aches & Pains, Headache Potion made from Alphatian oranges Fever & stunned for 1-6 days Mildly infectious This complaint is mentioned in the fanciful tales of travellers entering a "World Within". Supposedly the travellers entered into a hollow world, where this 'Flu strain had killed all of the local people on a floating landmass. For this reason that landmass was shunned. Fungoid Plague Turns humanoids into grey sludge Cure Disease AND Remove Curse AND Drider/Arachnotaur Blood potion Death in 2-4 days Highly Infectious Tunnels of the Underground where ordure and ooze lifeforms are combined often breed this bacillus. Ghol Chiem Infection Skin turns bright green Red Lilly Flowers Coma in 12 hrs Death in 24 hrs Non-infectious This disease is a creation of the lesser Immortal Kyuss, originally released in Thyatian territories it was later spread to the Savage Coast and Davania where locals had no resistance to it at all and it caused widespread depopulation. Great Brunian Plague Buboes, Rashes Lancing boils, feeding patient Rotting Fruit Crippling weakness *25% Fatality Highly Infectious This legendary disease has never returned again with the ferocity it once possessed but there at least a handful of fatalities from it a year in the Known World and occasional pandemic outbreaks within a realm. Invirmenitis Eyebrows become white, Voice deepens, Extreme paranoia Ovason's Mixture (unique potion) Permanent insanity if untreated Highly Infectious This disease is unknown save amongst the sky sailors who attempted to break the Known World records for high altitude flight. It is still not known where this peculiar infection originated. Klenda Virus Flesh rots in 2-4 minutes, Agony Cure Disease at Level 5 or above Death in 2-4 minutes Infectious This "super-leprosy" strain is confined to certain of the Isles in the Dread Archipelago. Lazar's Disease "Is this the face they rejoiced to see ?" Rotting Skin, Blindness, Stench Cure Disease, Cure Blindness, Remove Curse Debilitation, Death in 2 years Non-infectious Lazar's Disease is uncommon but known throughout Mystara. Contraction of the diease is directly linked to poor personal hygiene. Lightwave Sickness Permanent loss of Strength [caused by prolonged periods of invisibility for creatures not naturally invisible] Limited Wish Loss of 1-2 points of Str PERMANENTLY Non-infectious Lightwave Sickness is rare, virtually unknown outside spellcasting communities. Metallitis Destroys all metal it contacts in 2-4 rounds None Destroys Metal Objects Infectious This disease was first encountered following an earthquake in Wendar. After the tremor, a pocket of foul air was released from underground carrying the spores of this infection. Movellitis Yellow foam forms on surface of golem [only affects Golems and other animates] None known Disintegration in 30hrs Highly Infectious Movellitis is believed to originate in Sind. It spread from the cities along the river systems westwards before emerging into the Known World. Muto Plague Turns humanoids into Lesser Broken Ones None known Permanent shapechange to Broken One Infectious This infection originated in Klantyre, and is almost unknown beyond that principality. Mysteronitis Undeath - return after death None known Undeath akin to being a Thinking Zombie Infectious Mysteronitis is very rare but known throughout the world. Neurotrope X Parkinsonian jitters, Forgetfulness, Black inflamed veins, Swollen glands Golem Dust Death in 1-2 days, Permanent nerve damage even if patient survives Non-infectious This virus was released deliberately after its creation by the Priest Fangolior of Darokin. Radiance Poisoning Weakness, nausea, lesions on the skin. Heal spell OR Cure Disease AND Neutralise Poison Saving throw versus spells or lose 1d4 hp per hour until death occurs. [Extremely high probability of cancer occuring in the last 2 stages of life.] Non-infectious Almost unknown except for some mysterious cases in and around Glantri City. Spectrox Toxaemia High Fever for 24-48 hrs, Purple blotches, Vomiting Potion made from milk of a Queen Mobat Death in 48-72 hrs Non-infectious Uncommon but known worldwide Tanogoro Pox Fatal bloodclots Potion made from Marigolds and Honey Death in 3-10 minutes Infectious Restricted to Skothar, but spreading as contact with the rest of the world increases. Tanogoro Pox seems to strike only in wet monsoonal conditions. Thrin-Atrus Fungus White furry growth on limb joints, paralysis [Only affects Insectoids] Potion made from Purple Worm eyelets Death in 10-100 hours Highly infectious to other insectoids A disease of the Underground tunnels. Varga Sickness Turns humanoids into Varga plants Cure Disease AND Remove Curse Become a Varga Plant - similar to Evil Treant Highly Infectious Found wherever the evil Varga are found as it is carried in their sap, saliva and pollen. Venom Plague Bright green veinous lesions on upper body and face, skin becomes snake-like Remove Curse AND Cure Disease with Jimson Root potions regularly Death in 10-20 hours 10% chance of dead rising as a Ju-Ju Zombie. A creation of Kyuss, lesser Immortal of corruption and Entropy. Worldwide distribution but very rare. Yellow Musk Sickness Turns humanoids into Yellow Musk Zombies Cure Disease AND Remove Curse Become a Yellow Musk Zombie Infectious Found wherever Yellow Musk Creepers are found. - -Jonathan - -------------------------------------------------------------------- * * Jonathan Nolan FTIA - International Law practice call 618 89310176 * * - -------------------------------------------------------------------- Mystara/RPG Netbooks: www.physics.adelaide.edu.au/~ksimpson/netbooks.html *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 5 Mar 1999 21:51:38 +1100 (EST) From: "Jonathan Nolan, Barrister & Solicitor, FTIA" Subject: [MYSTARA] - ELF MAGIC SPELLBOOK THE ELFSTONE SCROLLS - ELF MAGIC SPELLBOOK level spell name school range area save casting time (segments unless otherwise noted) components - V.erbal / S.omatic / M.aterial duration description LEVEL 1 SPELLS 1 Detect Defilement Divination 10ft/lvl Special Nil 1 VS 1rd/lvl Detect Defilement allows an Elf Mage to detect the presence of any Black Magician or Bad Magic tainted area within the range of the spell. Detection of Defilement gives a lock on the direction and intensity of Defilement. 1 Distillation Alter/Ench Touch 1 keg Nil 1 turn VSM Instant This spell distils a gallon of raw alcohol from appropriate ingredients. Quality not guaranteed. 1 Fermentation Alter/Ench Touch 1 keg Nil 1 turn VSM Instant This spell distils a gallon of beer or mead from appropriate ingredients. Quality not guaranteed. 1 Find the Stray Elf / Divination line of sight 1 figure Neg 1 S Instant The Elf Mage uses this magical enhancement of sight to detect a disguised Shadow Elf or a Black Magician pretending to be a good or neutral spellcaster. It detects a Shadow Elf of any type or alignment or for a non-Shadow Elf will only work on a spellcaster, and only to the extent of saying if a spellcaster is evil in alignment. A negative result from the spell whether because the target resists or because they are not a Shadow Elf or a Black Magician returns a "not a Shadow Elf or Black Magician" result. 1 Protection From Defilement Elf / Abjuration Touch 1 figure Nil 1 VSM 2rd/lvl Protects from Black Magicians as for Protection from Evil. Material component is a circle of rose thorns. 1 Sting Alteration 40ft 1 creature Neg. 1 S Instant Creates nonpermanent stinging injury to one figure within range. If somehow directed at the eyes the victim can be temporarily blinded. 1 Treacle Evoc/Summ 10ft/lvl 10sq. ft. N/A 1 VS 1rd/lvl Treacle conjures a sticky slick of molasses-like sugary liquid. This liquid reduces movement in contact with it by an amount equal to the caster's level. The treacle substance also has a chance of attracting a wandering monster or local giant insect population of 20%. SECOND LEVEL SPELLS 2 Black Magician Ward Elf / Abjuration Touch 10ft/lvl Neg 2 VSM Instant Creates a specialised Elf Mage Wizard Mark that prevents any Black Magician or Black Magician-like being from entering the area of the spell effect, whether or not the Black Magician Ward is visible to them. Material components are squid ink, emerald dust and bone used to create the warding. 2 Compost Alteration Touch 10cu.ft/lvl Nil 2 VSM Instant Turns a Bad Magic tainted area back into ordinary terrain, albeit without any plant life. Material component is a bag of rubbish and waste. 2 Dark Mirror Abjur/Alter 10ft/lvl 10ft/lvl R Neg 2 VSM 1rd/lvl Dark Mirror allows the caster to instantly turn back any form of magical darkness on the creator of the effect. Material components of this spell are a small mirror and a candle. 2 Dowsing Elf / Divination 10ft/lvl Special Nil 2 VSM 1rd/lvl Allows the Elf Mage to find the nearest source of water, be it a groundspring, waterskin or buried river. The spell in no way helps the Elf Mage obtain the water. Material component is a pair of sticks. 2 Firestaff Evocation 0 1 staff N/A 2 VSM 1rd/lvl Firestaff creates a ball of blue fire at either tip of a quarterstaff, wizard's staff or similar item or weapon. In addition to its normal damage if any, the item then inflicts a further 2d4 hits of magical fire damage in combat. Once cast the spell cannot be ended before the limit of its duration and the ensorcelled item can be passed to another figure to be wielded. Material components for this spell are the item or weapon, a pinch of iron filings and a piece of phosphorous. 2 Frostfire Alteration 10yds/lvl Special Special 2 VSM 2 turns/lvl Frostfire alters the nature of a fire so that it "burns" with cold equal but opposite to its heat - it will inflict the same damage bu as freezing not burning effects. The caster may also simply use this spell to negate fire damage and substitute for it cold light. Magical fires may be only affected if the spell creating them is of a level that it is possible for the caster to theoretically use. Material components of this spell are a sliver of Ivory and a 10gp Crystal. 2 Ice Darts Alter/Elem 18'+1/lvl special Nil 1 VM Instant This spell is the same as magic missile (W1), except that it fires darts made of ice and they do 1d6 damage per dart. The caster gains an additional dart for every two extra levels gained above first. 2 Icestaff Evocation 0 1 staff N/A 2 VSM 1rd/lvl Icestaff creates a ball of green spiked blue ice at either tip of a quarterstaff, wizard's staff or similar item or weapon. In addition to its normal damage if any, the item then inflicts a further 2d4 hits of magical freezing damage in combat . Once cast the spell cannot be ended before the limit of its duration and the ensorcelled item can be passed to another figure to be wielded. Material components for this spell are the item or weapon, a pinch of snow and a pinch of diamond dust. 2 Invading Eyes Evoc/Conj 20yds/lvl Special Nil 2 VS 1rd/lvl Invading Eyes conjures into being twelve misty, ghostly versions of the caster's own eyeballs. The twelve magical eyes float off in whatever direction the caster directs them within the range of the spell. The eyes drift in a rough mass within a ten foot cubic or spherical area, and in doing so transfer the caster's normal sense of sight with all bonuses or penalties thereof to the remote location where the Invading Eyes are. Nothing can be done through the eyes other than observe unless the caster has an innate monstrous gaze power or a hypnotic gaze-based power or skill. Anyone affected by such an effect transmitted through the eyes can save at a bonus of +4 versus whatever effect it is and if they do not normally receive a saving throw they may save versus spells as normal to resist such a gaze attack. 2 Sand Message Elf / Evocation Special Special Nil 2 VS 1rd/lvl With this spell an Elf Mage writes a message of up to 66 words length in the sand or dirt at his or her feet. As he or she then rubs out the writing it will travel across the ground as a ripple of sand or soil to appear at the feet of one nominated figure within range. Anyone within sight of the message will have a chance of seeing and reading it provided they understand the diagram or alphabet and language in which it is written. 2 Stinging Touch Alte/Ench Caster NA NA 1 VS 1rd+1rd/Level Gives the caster fingertip claws equipped with sting glands able to pump debilitating Poison (PHB p.140) into a target on a successful hit. THIRD LEVEL SPELLS 3 Beast Mastery I Elf/Conj/Summ Special 30yds NA 3 VSM 2rds+1rd/Level This major variant of Monster Summoning I summons a single 2 HD ordinary monster from the local area of the same alignment as the caster or of Neutral alignment if unintelligent. The creature has a 5% chance of remaining with the caster at the end of the battle for which it was summoned, +5% per point of Charisma above 15 the caster has. Material components of this spell are a zebra skin and a crystal ball. 3 Blood-Red Beams Conj/Evoc/Summ 0 20ft/lvl Nil 3 VS 1rd/lvl Blood-Red Beams fires twelve ruby beams of energy from the caster in a circle around the Wizard. The beams illuminate and colour everything they touch in terms of the latent heat of the object, so that anyone in visual range sees a "false colour" picture of the surroundings - as well as any otherwise not obvious objects and figures. Anyone trying to detect objects or people in the area of effect must make a Wisdom check to correctly identify their target against the swirling ripple of colours. 3 Mental Sacrifice Elf / True Element 0 Self Nil 3 VS 1rd/lvl This metamagical and metapsionic spell allows the caster to sacrifice spells learned in exchange for a like number of points of PSPs useable as if a Psionicist of the same level as the caster. Total levels of spells sacrificed for the day gives the points of Psi gained for the duration of the spell effect. If Psi is lost greater than the caster's normal Psi the caster must make a system shock roll at the end of the spell effect or die of shock immediately. If the caster does not normally have or use PSPs then the loss must not exceed 30. 3 Mzilst Ssin'urn Olath* Shadow Elf/Summ 60yds. Special Nil 3 VSM 1 rd/lvl This Shadow Elf spell (*"Most Beautiful Dark") summons an indescribable entity from a dimension of pure darkness and despair. The creature resembles a slimy blob of black tar-like substance, with ten stout tentacles that flail and surge languidly. It will attack whomever it is directed to by the caster. The entity is roughly 12' diameter, and each tentacle is approximately 10' long. The Mzilst Ssin'urn Olath monster obediently remains for as long as the spell endures, after which it melts into shadows and vanishes from Mystara. Material components of the spell are a blob of pitch, a drop of the caster's blood and a dried blink dog eyeball. The caster must remain within spell range or the monster goes mad, attacking indiscriminately. Mzilst Ssin'urn Olath Monster Movement 10 Alignment CE Attack: 10 Tentacles - 1-4 each THAC0 18 Int Low AC 2 HD 3+3 / 25 hp Psionics Nil SA Nil SD Immune to nonmagical blunt weapons 3 Shoot Elf / Evocation Touch 1 cutting Nil 3 VSM Instant Creates a half-size version of whatever plant a cutting is taken from. Once the cutting grows to the half-size shoot, it must be tended as normal or it will die. Material components are the cutting of the plant to be affected and 1hp of the caster's blood. 3 Upwelling Elf / Alteration Touch Special Nil 3 VSM Instant Imitating the action of tree roots, and thus doing no violence to the land, this spell causes a puddle of water to form at the caster's feet by drawing water from the soil or rock. 1 wineskin of water is produced per four levels of the caster. Material component is powdered diamond to sketch out the outline of the pool of water. 3 Wrath of the Black Pearl Sea/Alter/Conj 18'+1/lvl special Nil 1 VM Instant This spell is the same as magic missile (W1), except that it fires small black pearls doing 1d10 damage per pearl. The caster gains an additional dart for every two extra levels gained. FOURTH LEVEL SPELLS 4 Beast Mastery II Elf/Conj/Summ Special 30yds NA 3 VSM 2rds+1rd/Level This major variant of Monster Summoning II summons a single 3 HD ordinary monster from the local area of the same alignment as the caster or of Neutral alignment if unintelligent. The creature has a 5% chance of remaining with the caster at the end of the battle for which it was summoned, +5% per point of Charisma above 15 the caster has. Material components of this spell are a zebra skin and a crystal ball. 4 Muck Elf / Alteration Touch 10Ibs./lvl Nil 4 VSM Permanent Turns solid waste of all kinds into a pliable feculent fertiliser. 4 Protect The Intellect Evocation Touch 1 figure Special 4 VS 1rd/lvl This spell shields one being from telepathy, mental blasts and the like. Any such attack, whether or not it emanates from a spell, monster power or item, is subject to a resistance roll by the recipient of this spell. The recipient can evade all effects of the mental attack if they succeed a check equal to their Constitution - 5. 4 Radar Divination 10ft/lvl 100ft/lvl Nil 7 VSM 1rd/lvl Allows the caster to pick up "blips" where living beings are, with size of blip determined by HD. In addition, all traps are detected with 75% accuracy as to location and nature. Material component is a crystal cone with which the caster sweeps the area searched. 4 Rockfall Elf/Alter/Summ 10ft/lvl 10ft/lvl Halves 5 VSM 1rd/lvl Causes a shower of small but heavy rocks to fall from the sky on top of an area. All figures within the area except the caster must save vs. spells or suffer 4d6 damage per round from crushing rocks, sharp spikes of stone and the like. A successful save halves damage. Material component is a handful of pebbles hurled into the air and a tiny hammer used to direct the striking of the rocks onto the target. 4 Rootstaff Evoc/Alter 10ft/lvl 1 staff Neg 4 VSM 1rd/lvl This spell causes one wand, rod, staff, quarterstaff or spear, whether or magical or not, to grow roots that pull the item or weapon to the ground and make it take root on the spot as if a similalry-size rose bush or tree. Thorns erupt along the length of the item for the duration of the spell, making it impossible to use. If the item is left alone until the spell expires, it returns to normal. If any attempt is made to free the transformed item from the soil, sand, rock or stone it has rooted in, the item must save versus crushing blow or shrivel into dust. Items survivng being uprooted DO NOT turn back into their original form at the end of the spell's duration, becoming a thorned, leafy version of their original nature. Typically, this adds one to any damage they inflict as weapons, but makes them clumsier, inflicting an intiative penalty of 5 on their users. Material component is a rose thorn, pressed into the caster's flesh during spellcasting. 4 Summon Carriage Alter/Ench 10' Special Nil 4 VSM 1hr/lvl This spell creates a carriage suitable for four human sized or 6 demi-human sized characters. Depending on the allignment of the characters the coach and beasts will appear differently. Good aligned characters will create a carriage of gold and pearl pulled by a pair of unicorns. A neutral character will create a carriage of wood and iron pulled by two black horses. Evil characters will create a carriage of bone pulled by a pair of skeletal steeds. The carriage moves at steeds maximum rate regardless of terrain. The components needed for this spell are a pumpkin seed and a pair of mice which are not destroyed by the casting of the spell. FIFTH LEVEL SPELLS 5 Beast Mastery III Elf/Conj/Summ Special 30yds NA 3 VSM 2rds+1rd/Level This major variant of Monster Summoning III summons a single 4 HD ordinary monster from the local area of the same alignment as the caster or of Neutral alignment if unintelligent. The creature has a 5% chance of remaining with the caster at the end of the battle for which it was summoned, +5% per point of Charisma above 15 the caster has. Material components of this spell are a zebra skin and a crystal ball. 5 Clay Form Elf/Alter Caster Special NA 5 VS 1rd/lvl This spell requires the Elf Mage to tap into their primal rage and suppressed feelings of hatred for the despoilers of the Land, whilst chanting "feat of clay... feat of clay... feat of clay...". After this is done, the caster becomes an intelligent and spellcasting Clay Golem, with HD equal to their own and with the full mental attributes of the caster's normal form. Carried items are all either buried within the clay body or worn as normal if possible. Whereas a true Clay Golem has a 1% cumulative chance of going berzerk, the same chance applies to an Elf Mage in Clay Form, but it is the chance of the Elf Mage involuntarily reverting to normal form. 5 Heal Land Elf / Alteration Touch Special Nil 5 VSM Permanent Heal Land restores all ecological damage suffered by an area of land due to Black Magician magic or Wildmagic, provided only that the Black Magician or Wild Mage was of equal or less level (or combined levels if dual or multiclass) to the Elf Mage attempting the Heal Land spell. Material component is a crystal ball used as a power focus for a vision of how the land should be. 5 Monkey Nuts Conjuration Special Special Nil 1 VSM 12rds When cast on up to twelve nuts, this spell turns one of the nuts into a White Ape (treat as white-furred Carnivorous Ape, cf MM) per round for 12 rounds. Anyone eating one of the nuts before such a change is turned into a White Ape for 1-12 turns, with a 5% chance that this change will be permanent with respect to physical statistics. At the conclusion of the spell duration all surviving Apes turn back into nuts. Dead Apes turn into crushed nuts. Material component of this spell is 12 nuts of any variety edible by the caster. 5 Thornbush Arrows Alteration Touch 5 thorns/lvl Nil 1 round VSM 1 round This spell turns previously collected rose petals and rose thorns from a particular bush into +4 arrows that may each be directed at a different target which the thorns will fly off and attack. The launch of the thorns is effected through the use of a Phoenix Feather as a wand, which is consumed in the spell. The thorns can only hit a target in the caster's line of sight, and cannot home in on a fleeing or evading target. SIXTH LEVEL SPELLS 6 Beast Mastery IV Elf/Conj/Summ Special 30yds NA 3 VSM 2rds+1rd/Level This major variant of Monster Summoning IV summons a single 5 HD ordinary monster from the local area of the same alignment as the caster or of Neutral alignment if unintelligent. The creature has a 5% chance of remaining with the caster at the end of the battle for which it was summoned, +5% per point of Charisma above 15 the caster has. Material components of this spell are a zebra skin and a crystal ball. 6 Shandi's Equilibrium Abjuration Caster Self NA 6 VSM 1 round This powerful spell allows a spellcaster to take as many successful hits in a single round as they possess unused spells for the day. Each spell slot so used is lost as though the spellcaster had cast a spell. No damage is taken from any attack that is absorbed in this manner. Material components are a 1000gp emerald, a drop of the caster's blood, a leaf and a handful of water. SEVENTH LEVEL SPELLS 7 Beast Mastery V Elf/Conj/Summ Special 30yds NA 3 VSM 2rds+1rd/Level This major variant of Monster Summoning V summons a single 6 HD ordinary monster from the local area of the same alignment as the caster or of Neutral alignment if unintelligent. The creature has a 5% chance of remaining with the caster at the end of the battle for which it was summoned, +5% per point of Charisma above 15 the caster has. Material components of this spell are a zebra skin and a crystal ball. 7 Channelling Alter, Meta Self Self Nil 1 turn VS 1turn/lvl When cast, this spell draws upon extra magical energy to make the next spell cast more efficient and powerful. For every 5 levels of the caster the following effects occur: CHANNELLING EFFECTS: * +1 per die of damage (maximum of +3); * -1 on saving throws; * +50% on range and duration; * -5% on target's magic resistance. 7 Create Elfstone Elf Touch 1 jewel Nil 1 week per spell VSM Permanent With this dweomer, the Elven crafters and jewelsmiths create the Sylmarien, or Elfstones. An Elfstone is a magical crystal of great beauty that can hold within it Elf Magic or just simple enchantments to enhance its beauty. The simplest of the Elfstones take one week to forge and have nothing more held within them than continual light, to provide a blaze of colour and illumination. However, the Clans now make Elfstones on occasion to hold much more powerful spells. ELFSTONE MANUFACTURE COSTS: Base Cost: 50,000gp being: Components: 25,000gp of powdered gemstones, 25,000gp of powdered rosewood Cost of placing spells permanently within the jewel: Spells that function automatically: continual light, levitation, dancing lights 10,000gp per Level of spell, eg Dancing Lights would cost 10,000gp Spells that are useable once per day by the holder of the Elfstone 27,000gp per Level of spell plus 5,500gp of powdered Moonstone Spells that are useable once per week by the holder of the Elfstone 15,400gp per Level of spell plus 2,700gp of powdered Polymar Spells that are useable once from the Elfstone by the holder and then lost 12,000gp per Level of spell plus 1,000gp of powdered Black Opal Cost of Jewel Smithy ("Sylmarienya-Quendyol-Imythal") All reuseable Anvil 25,000gp Blackfire Forge 75,000gp Thus, Minimum cost of Sylmarien = 170,000gp 7 Crystal Form Alter/Necro Caster Special NA 5 VS 1rd/lvl This spell requires the caster to tap into their primal joy and suppressed feelings of love for the Land, whilst chanting "clarity... clarity... clarity...". After this is done, the caster becomes an intelligent and spellcasting Crystal Ooze, with HD equal to their own and with the mental attributes of the caster's normal form. Carried items are all buried within the Ooze body or worn as normal if possible. The caster's items and weapons are all immune to the normal effects of the Ooze form although all others suffer the appropriate damage. The caster gains an initiative bonus of 2 when in this form due to the form's fluidity and snake-like reflexes. 7 Eldaril's Tree Shield Elf/Ench Touch Special Nil 7 VSM 1 turn/lvl This spell allows an Elf Mage to enchant a tree so that it has AC 0, the barrier abilities of a castle's normal stone wall, and the ability to resist spells of the caster. Anyone in its branches or behind its trunk also has the protection of the equivalent of a castle wall and the spell saving throw of the caster. 7 Improved Muck Elf / Alteration Touch 11 Ibs./lvl Nil 7 VSM Permanent Turns waste of any kind into a pliable feculent fertiliser. If used on crops the crops' yield will be doubled per 40Ibs. of Muck spread on them at the appropriate time. In addition, ordinary fruit crops have a 10% chance of producing magic potion fruit of a random kind when fertilised with 50Ibs. of Improved Muck. 7 Starblade Alteration 0 Special Nil 10 VSM 1rd/lvl Turns any normal edged weapon into a magical black version of the same weapon, able to be used by the caster or any other creature it is given to. Within the blackness of the weapon stars and other celestial lights are seen as if the weapon's blade is actually a slice of the night sky. Whatever weapon this spell is cast on is consumed by this spell. The Starblade can parry Meteor spells, Magic Missiles and magical arrow spells as well as destroying one magical Wall spell effect per round. A bonus on all saves vs. Alteration magic of +3 is conferred on the wielder and in addition the wielder can launch a Magic Missile, a Melf's Minute Meteors and a Fireball once each from the blade during the spell effect duration. All these spells are treated as if cast by a Wizard of the user's level if indeed the user is not a Wizard. Only Dispel Magic, Disintegrate or a Limited Wish or better can destroy the blade which is otherwise indestructible. The weapon is only able to be handled by its hilt and guard - the blade is all edges and inflicts its hits on anyone touching the blade surface. Material component in addition to the weapon is a tiny sword. EIGHTH LEVEL SPELLS 8 Beast Mastery VI Elf/Conj/Summ Special 30yds NA 3 VSM 2rds+1rd/Level This major variant of Monster Summoning VI summons a single 7 HD ordinary monster from the local area of the same alignment as the caster or of Neutral alignment if unintelligent. The creature has a 5% chance of remaining with the caster at the end of the battle for which it was summoned, +5% per point of Charisma above 15 the caster has. Material components of this spell are a zebra skin and a crystal ball. 8 Kiss of the Nereid Conj/Summ Touch 1 figure Special 1 S Instant When the kiss is bestowed, the victim must roll a successful saving throw versus breath weapon, with a -2 penalty, or die instantly as if drowned. If he doesn't drown, he or she finds total ecstasy. NINTH LEVEL SPELLS 9 Beast Mastery VII Elf/Conj/Summ Special 30yds NA 3 VSM 2rds+1rd/Level This major variant of Monster Summoning VII summons a single 8 HD ordinary monster from the local area of the same alignment as the caster or of Neutral alignment if unintelligent. The creature has a 5% chance of remaining with the caster at the end of the battle for which it was summoned, +5% per point of Charisma above 15 the caster has. Material components of this spell are a zebra skin and a crystal ball. 9 Circle of Life Elf/ /Abjuration Special Special Special 9 VS 4 rounds This spell allows an Elf Mage to attune to the local environment and obtain vast amounts of power for use in spellcasting. Once this spell is used, for as long as it endures, all further spells cast do not count as castings for the purposes of determining how many spells are usable by the Elf Mage that day. In addition, all nonmagical damage suffered by the Elf Mage is minimised - doing only as many hits as there are dice in its normal damage. The local flora may be affected by this spell permanently - roll once per round on the following chart: CIRCLE OF LIFE EFFECTS (d12) ROLL: EFFECTS: 1 One local tree immediately grows to twice normal size 2 A new species of creeping vine appears in the local area 3 Magic Bean effect 4 Wand of Wonder effect 5 Magic Potion Fruit vine appears and takes root 6 1000ft area bathed in strange green glow for 1d6 turns 7 Elf Mage's hair turns curly (if already curly, turns straight) 8 All plants in the area put forth some sort of edible fruit or berry 9 Muck spell effect affects all rubbish in a 1000ft area around caster 10 Black Magician Ward forms at caster's feet 11 All Undead within 100ft radius of caster turned 12 Improved Muck spell effect affects all rubbish in a 1000ft area around caster LEVEL TEN - SPELLS OF LEGEND 10 Faerie Sleep Evoc/Charm 0 100ft/lvl R sphere Nil 5 VSM Special Faerie Sleep puts every living being in the area other than the caster into a magical cataleptic sleep, a dreamless trance. Nothing and none can awaken any of the sleepers, who do not age, with the exception of the chaste kiss of a virgin. Strange cobweb-like strands form over each affected being, preserving them from harm and the effects of animals, plants and other spells. In this way a strange sort of immortality might be conferred. Even the caster may only lift this spell effect only during a one day period on the anniversary of the casting of the spell each year. JENNAERE BROWNLEAVES ELF SCHOOL OF MAGIC [Founder] AC 881 - 1244 Born in Alfheim / Adventures in Alfheim and the Hulean confederacy "Jennaere is a flighty Elf girl who normally dresses in whatever is hip for a human of Glantri City. After the death of her friend Zaldorin she dresses in darker clothes and more traditional Elf clothes and ornaments. She also wears a silver beetle brooch she was given by Wexley, a heroic Shadow Elf who fought with her against his misguided brethren. Her magic is based on the spells she researched herself and discovered in ancient ruins deep underground. The evil Necromancer is our enemy not because we are so different from him but because he carries out what we see as perversions of life magic. Shadow Elf mages who follow the evil and twisted path of their magic given to them by Aztlanteotl are also our blood enemies. These spellcasters are what we consider to be Black Magicians. A good Necromancer would not be a Black Magician unless he or she had turned to the darkside." The logic of the Elf School of Magic is that the Elves of Alfheim after their brief diaspora and their adventures agaisnt the Shadow Elves and Dark Elves evolved a secret and powerful set of spells based on reverence for life. Although they are not totally bound by their lore as is a Preserver of Athas they are at least as reverential to the land. Opposing them are the evil destructive Necromancers and the evil Shadow Elves. Shadow Elves who are not evil can and do practice Elf Magic of course, although even non-evil Necromancers are unable to access any Elf Magic spells. Elf Magic is contained in a series of jewelled tomes and scrolls held by the Lorekeeper of Elf Magic in the Elven School of Magic in Alfheim Town. During the diaspora these tomes and scrolls were kept by Zaldorin Korenn, Jennaere's fellow researcher into the newly codified Elf Magic. He was killed during a battle in Oenkmar but the books were saved by Jennaere and are used to start the new School. Prior to 1016 Jennaere and Zaldorin are the only source of Elf Magic as defined anywhere on the planet. Spells shared between Elf Magic and other Schools maybe accessible through the other Schools. - -------------------------------------------------------------------- * * Jonathan Nolan FTIA - International Law practice call 618 89310176 * * - -------------------------------------------------------------------- Mystara/RPG Netbooks: www.physics.adelaide.edu.au/~ksimpson/netbooks.html *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ End of mystara-digest V1999 #113 ******************************** *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara' as the body of the message. mystara-digest Friday, March 5 1999 Volume 1999 : Number 114 Mystara is a trademark of TSR Inc. All Rights Reserved. The following topics are covered in this digest: [MYSTARA] - Continent names Re: [MYSTARA] - Wineform Re: [MYSTARA] - Continent names Re: [MYSTARA] - Continent names Re: [MYSTARA] - RE: Wendar - Love it or leave it Re: [MYSTARA] - Continent names [MYSTARA] - Re: - Continent names Re: [MYSTARA] - RE: Wendar - Love it or leave it [MYSTARA] - Elven Language Re: [MYSTARA] - M-Orient (LONG) Re: [MYSTARA] - MOrient Team (Was: RE: AD&D SITES IN MYSTARA) Re: [MYSTARA] - MOrient Re: [MYSTARA] - MOrient Re: [MYSTARA] - Re: - Continent names Re: [MYSTARA] - RE: Wendar - Love it or leave it ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Fri, 5 Mar 1999 08:57:40 -0500 (EST) From: au998@freenet.carleton.ca (Geoff Gander) Subject: [MYSTARA] - Continent names Hey all! Anyone wondered where the names "Brun", "Davania", and "Skothar" originated? Do you think they were derivations of old Blackmoorian words (as Blackmoor was a world power)? Or something else? Geoff - -- Geoff Gander, BA 97 Cartographer/Game Designer/Government Peon Part-Time High Priest, Ottawa Chapter of the Church of Y'hog au998@freenet.carleton.ca *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 5 Mar 1999 09:03:16 EST From: MAESTROPI@aol.com Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Wineform << (And IMHO it would be level 2 or 3 spell, with useful side-tactic for clever players). >> I had originally (and reluctantly) assigned it as a 3rd level spell. Little things made me worry, but I figured it would match the level assignments of the other form spells. What exactly makes clothform 4th level, but wineform lower? Wineform seems like a more useful spell to me, with possibilities of enchantment to make a whole "batch" of potions. Then there's the possibility of making a poisoned batch. (one thing I was worried about in paticular was a mage drinking a glass from a "batch" in front of an npc, then later modifying it to become poisonous. He drank it himself, so others that witnessed it could obviously see that there was nothing wrong with it.) *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 5 Mar 1999 15:07:14 +0100 (CET) From: =?iso-8859-1?Q?H=E5vard_R=F8nne_Faanes?= Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Continent names On Fri, 5 Mar 1999, Geoff Gander wrote: > Anyone wondered where the names "Brun", "Davania", and "Skothar" > originated? Do you think they were derivations of old Blackmoorian words > (as Blackmoor was a world power)? Or something else? That is one possiblitity. They could also be Nithian-era names, possibly Thyatified. Maps made by Nithian explorers could have been left in the Hinterlands and brought back to Brun by the Thyatian ex-slaves. Hĺvard Haavard R. Faanes (hoc@nvg.ntnu.no) http://www.nvg.ntnu.no/~hoc "Remember, there are no stupid questions, just stupid people." -Mr Garrison, South Park. *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 5 Mar 1999 15:57:04 +0100 (MET) From: Agathokles Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Continent names On Fri, 5 Mar 1999, [iso-8859-1] Hĺvard Rřnne Faanes wrote: > On Fri, 5 Mar 1999, Geoff Gander wrote: > > > Anyone wondered where the names "Brun", "Davania", and "Skothar" > > originated? Do you think they were derivations of old Blackmoorian words > > (as Blackmoor was a world power)? Or something else? > > That is one possiblitity. They could also be Nithian-era names, possibly > Thyatified. Maps made by Nithian explorers could have been left in the > Hinterlands and brought back to Brun by the Thyatian ex-slaves. > "Davania" sounds like a thyatian name (or a thyatified one), based on the idea that Thyatian should be MLatin. On the other hand, Brun and Skothar don't look like Latin words. It should be considered also that knowledge of Skothar could come from Alphatia, instead of Nithia. Giampaolo Agosta *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 5 Mar 1999 17:42:22 +0100 From: "=?ISO-8859-1?Q?Andr=E9s_Piquer_Otero?=" Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - RE: Wendar - Love it or leave it > > PS - Any chance we can see some more elvish lingo? > > I'm afraid so... I am working on all the languages at present, from the > TSR sources, mainly proper names and illustrations, as well as Tolkien and > old english / old french / arabic / demotic and so on... > > The Elven speech is the easiest because of Tolkien and the real world > sources he used. If you care to search the Linguistic section of a search engine like Yahoo, you will find quite a few pages on Fantasy-languages grammar (like Tolkien Quenya, Star Trek Klingon...). There is even a page with a TTF version of Tolkien Elven runes to download (although I do not have the URL). In my project of Alphatian magic, I am taking some trouble to work on Alphatian (both Old and New). I am using a mix-and-match of Hebrew, Aramaic and Akkadian. I think that this makes sense, as Ylari (RW Arabic) may be interpreted as Oltec-Nithian influenced by Alphatian during the time of colonizing of Alysia Andrés *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 5 Mar 1999 17:51:48 +0100 From: "=?ISO-8859-1?Q?Andr=E9s_Piquer_Otero?=" Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Continent names > "Davania" sounds like a thyatian name (or a thyatified one), based on the > idea that Thyatian should be MLatin. On the other hand, Brun and Skothar > don't look like Latin words. It should be considered also that knowledge > of Skothar could come from Alphatia, instead of Nithia. > SKOTHAR: I propose this ethimology: SHE-KOTHARATU (in Old -cultivated Alphatian, Shekotharah in Modern Alphatian, Skothar as pronounced by Thyatian speakers). SHE = Concerning, belonging to.... KOTHARAT= "the Immortal Lady", an Alphatian name for Tarastia, the patron of the Jennites. As the Alphatians knew of Skothar population through contact with Jennites, they name the continent as "The (Land) belonging to Tarastia". Just an idea, Andrés *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 5 Mar 1999 18:07:51 +0100 From: "Jacob Skytte" Subject: [MYSTARA] - Re: - Continent names > Anyone wondered where the names "Brun", "Davania", and "Skothar" > originated? Do you think they were derivations of old Blackmoorian words > (as Blackmoor was a world power)? Or something else? Of course, the names could also come from the different migrating cultures, giving a lot of options; such as the elves, the hin (how about that, the hin naming a continent...), or any of a number of civilizations. Explorers would also be likely, since you have to realize the fact that you are on an actual continent to name it... The question is who explored the waters first ?!? Perhaps we need to develop a number of famous Mystaran explorers, the likes of Columbus, Marco Polo, or their ilk. Jacob, Denmark Jacob Skytte Skytte@virgil.ruc.dk *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 05 Mar 1999 12:19:30 -0500 (EST) From: the Wizard of Frobozz Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - RE: Wendar - Love it or leave it On Fri, 5 Mar 1999, =?ISO-8859-1?Q?Andr=E9s_Piquer_Otero?= wrote: > In my project of Alphatian magic, I am taking some trouble to work on > Alphatian (both Old and New). I am using a mix-and-match of Hebrew, Aramaic > and Akkadian. I think that this makes sense, as Ylari (RW Arabic) may be > interpreted as Oltec-Nithian influenced by Alphatian during the time of > colonizing of Alysia > > Andrés Wow. You folks sure are putting a lot of time and effort into some really creative stuff. You have my respect for doing your homework so well. I'd love to see some more samples of what you've accomplished. I'm a slight bibliophile with heavy leanings toward evolution of languages, so what you are doing interests me greatly. Especially in light of the fact that you're doing this for a place that never really existed to have languages in the first place! - --Frobozz-- ________________________________________________________ "Evil powers disappear demons worry when the Wizard is near." --Black Sabbath *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 05 Mar 1999 09:26:54 PST From: "Jennifer Favia" Subject: [MYSTARA] - Elven Language Excellent work so far, Jonathan! I am making up some elven words as well, mainly clan names for my expanded Elven Clans of Mystara. I will certainly use your work as a point of reference! Jenn Explore Dark Myst Manor! http://www.geocities.com/TimesSquare/Chasm/4270/ ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 05 Mar 1999 18:33:27 +0100 From: DM Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - M-Orient (LONG) On Tue, 2 Mar 1999 13:20:37 -0500, Sharon Dornhoff wrote: <> Oh well, if it depended on me, I'd have posted the whole stuff some months ago already. You see, the problem (from what I've understood since my addition to the team) is that there isn't a central leader who coordinates the efforts of the collaborators, setting datelines, issuing orders, and the like. And this means we're all left to ourselves, and since many of us have already many other pressing matters, we tend to forget to work on the Morient. And so much of the stuff is still in draft form and very loose ideas. If I might use a neologism: "We lack a central Ganderization." ;) <> Uhmm, well, there are combinations of cultures in Skothar as well: you've got Chinese and Tanagoro, Malaysians and Mineans, Alphatians and Jennites, barbarian humanoids with an eastern flavour and secluded woodland races, and even a new branch of the fairy folk (the Celestial Court) and new races! I do think this is pretty in-tone with Mystara's flavour of mixing RW cultures and fantasy ones in small spaces. << It also leaves established countries like Sind, Ethengar and Myoshima as either inexplicable in their current locations, or -- worse, IMHO -- redundant, if everything else MAsian is clumped together in one spot.>> Well, Sind is India, and Morient hasn't got India, while Ethengar, well, yes, it's pretty similar to Jennites, but hey, we didn't invent the Jennites, right? After all, they must come from somewhere: we have simply chosen the place. As for Myoshima, I tend to think THEY have been influenced by Mystarans, not the other way round. I suppose it's a question of points of view. Choose what u like best ;) <> Skothar's no more different than Davania. Why didn't anybody explore Davania? If you allow Davania to exist undetailed, why not having Skothar being the same? Alphatians have mapped it, but they didn't want to share their knowledge with the Old World (this is due to an old Alphatian prophecy, you see..). And I don't see many Thyatians prone to risk incurring in the Alphatians' wrath by entering their territorial waters without being invited.. << But don't blame me, if I can't anticipate your reasoning: I'm still waiting to hear what you've come up with, to account for Skothar's isolation. Until then, my personal version of Skothar will lean more towards Sub-Saharan Africa, albeit with a few incongruous nations (like the MRussians) thrown in; that's who lives there, according to both the HW boxed set's migration maps and the PWA history of the Minaeans.>> We did respect canon material, but expanded on it. Actually we also tried to give plausible explanations for certain names (i.e. Zyxl is the thyatian version of Jikushiru). I am not blaming you for not knowing something you were _not supposed to know_ (I'd be a fool if I did that). I only wanted to tell you all that there's something good in the MO project, IMHO. Unfortunately we're not well organized. As for African cultures, I've always thought they're on Davania (Arypt and Addakian deserts..), but anyway.. I'd really like to present the list with our material, but unfortunately I don't know if I'm allowed to.. I guess Andrés or John Yu (older members) should decide on this.. <<[* - Hey, if baiting ol' DM is the only way to get the MOrient material posted, it'll be worth my getting flamed about it! There's a method to my madness, tee hee hee.... ;-D]>> I am REALLY SORRY, Sharon, if I angered you. I didn't want to, believe me. I hate causing strifes and flamewars in this or in other lists, and this surely wasn't my intention. I could never start a flame with nice women like those found on this list ;) Say what: why don't we all flame somebody else together to settle our disputes? Randomly choosing a name.. mmmmh.. Gordon McCormick: you're a loserkobold! How's this for a flamewar start? ;p *(patting Gordon on the shoulder)* <> No, no, obviously you didn't.. but.. <> No well.. *sniff* ok, sorry, my fault.. *hiding behind the screen* :) <> Well, I can make you a list of the M-Orient nations we want to develop: Esterhold (Alphatian colony + Jennites, already fleshed out) M-Bhutan (no name yet, land of enlightnement, humans + dragons + tryclops) M-China (Chung Yuan, Empire) M-Ethiopia (Tanagoro homeland) M-Korea (no name yet, jennite descendants, many druids) M-Japan (Jikushiru, Shogunate, M-ainu + chung yuans emigrants) M-Malaysia + M-Indochina (no name yet, piratical raiders and farmers, not united) M-Manchuria (no name yet, tribes of tanagoro, noids, rakasta and demi-ogres) M-Mongolia (Steppes of Jen, Tribal alliance of Jennites) M-Myanmar (no name yet, Kingdom, mystical culture of pagoda dwellers) M-Nepal (no name yet, land of isolated giant clans) M-Siberia (no name, independent clans of Thonians and noids, Qaurik city maybe) M-Thailand (unnamed Kingdom, jennite+chung yuan breed, traders of drugs and farmers) M-Tibet (no name yet, human and humanoid clans) Minaea (Greek pirates' city-states, from PWA) Thonia (remnants of the Thonian empire, now barbaric -up for grabs) There's also a forest with ewok-like beings somewhere, and I've planned introducing also the Tryclop race, reclusive beings who seek out Blackmoor relics and guard them in the city of Sanctuary, built atop the highest peaks of M-Bhutan. I know this doesn't explain much, but I don't know how much I can give away, so.. sorry! :) <> Listen Sharon: we didn't even know of the Shadowelves until Gaz5 mentioned them, even though so many adventurers went underground during those years. Does this mean they were not there? No, of course. It only means that TSR hadn't covered them up yet. Same applies with Thothia: until DotE, we completely ignored the existance of Thothia, save what was later written in M5 (even the Thadders didn't mention Thothia in their gaz). Heck, we didn't even know the Heldann Freeholds were in fact the Heldannic Territories until Bruce told us in the VotPA series! And that's way after the publishing of all the other gaz! See what I'm trying to say? ;) <> But this wouldn't be the first time: there still are two Moldavian cultures (Boldavia and Traladara), two Mongolian cultures (Ethengar and Jennites), two celtic cultures (Hinterlands and Robrenn, and maybe western IoD as well). And if you're willing to believe the existance of hot Ylaruam and the frozen Northern Lands bordering each other, I'd say you can easily believe there are Asian cultures both on the Moon and on Mystara. ;) << We've already got Myoshima and its neighbor-nations, plus Ochalea and Ethengar and whatever else we might've added to our home campaigns; how many Japans or Chinas or Mongolias could we possibly NEED, in a single game-setting...?>> One with a plausible story, maybe? And besides, Ochalea is a mixed chinese-japanese setting IMO.. <> So, we could say: once you've seen a mad wizard, you've seen them all, right? Then why are there so many NPC "clones" overall Mystara? We already got Xanathon (X4), who cares about Xilochtli or the Master of Hule? We already got Alphaks (M1), who cares about Thanatos or Orcus? We already had the Shadowlord (X11), so who cares about Moorkroft Elvenbane?.. etc.. Well, we're doing it just in case people are not "tired of" having Asian cultures around. And besides, I think it's easier to get to Skothar than going to an invisible moon.. could you agree with me at least on this? ;) <> Africa: you got the Tanagoro (which are an ethnic group, made of different cultures). South America: you got the Azcans, Oltecs and Atruaghin Children. Pacific, I agree, is not present, however. What about using those areas labeled "Sea Kingdoms" in Master set? << I'd rather develop a culture that's totally missing from Mystara, than something I've already got TSR's version of.>> Sure, that's what I'd do as well. Unfortunately I don't think Myoshima is really "developed" (Andrew is still working on it, but Andrew is not a TSR guy, or is he?). And besides, I think the M-O group is trying to do its best to come up with fantasy twists of RW cultures (such as the dragon emperor, the celestial/fairy court, the noid crossbreeds and a plausible version of RW Buddha). <<(Unless it's meant as a joke, like Renardy and Bellayne basically were, in the PA stories ... in which case, I wouldn't mind including a "Gulliver's Travels"-style parody of, say, Thyatis, on some obscure island or another. ;-D)>> Personally I liked Bellayne and Renardy. But then again: did you know there were so many rakasta and lupin spread all around the world before Bruce told you in his Dragon Articles? And apparently this is something that's quite common to the Old World explorers, yet they failed to mention this in all gazetteers and even in the PWA.. See what I mean? <> Uhmm, probably the Mchinese assimilated them or drove them in nearby territories (Mthailand, MManchuria and MTibet could host them). Not sure here yet.. << Where are the "warring states" MChinese, from before their empire was consolidated?>> The history is a bit different. Mchinese do not originate on Skothar in our view.. and in their homeland (Alphatian continent) there were in fact different states fighting each other. << Where are the Ainu, the Hmong, and the hundreds of other agricultural/migrant/archaic societies which preceded the rise of monolithic civilization in IRL Asia?>> Ainu still live in Jikushiru. Hmong, IIRC, have been driven into M-Thailand. << Even if the MOrient hasn't been civilized for long, there still had to have been people who preceded those nations ... and they've got as much right to a place in the Hollow World setting, in which to follow "the old ways", as do the Neathar. So either the Immortals have a long-standing grudge against indigenous MAsiatics, or there's some other reason why they didn't rate a single spot on the main HW continent.>> Have u forgotten there are still other 2 continents not developed in the HW? Some of them might live in Aerical.. TSR hadn't the time to develop Mystara as it did with FR, so it's easy to answer this way, Sharon. :) <> Oh, please, Sharon! That's what TSR DID with Mystara from the very beginning! Look at the Old World: Ethengar, Norsemen, Ylari and Renaissance Darokinians all within a week's ride from each other!! If they did this to the Old World, we have all the rights to place some forgotten oriental setting in the (UNDETAILED -I'd stress this) Far East (melding it with the already standing material, mind you). << If deporting as many cultures as seem compatible with Myoshima to the invisible moon helps relieve the Outer World's "congestion", IMC, then that's what I'll continue to do.>> It's already too much congested, Sharon: we cannot possibly relieve pressure by transporting cultures to other worlds. So let's abuse it! ;) And besides, even our earth is choke full with different cultures: but hey, that's reality, so why not in fantasy? Again, Sharon, don't take this as a personal flame. As Matthew Levy's quote said: Peace, ok? *Big Hug* :) You, Gordon, on the other hand, are allowed to take it as a personal flame. And no, no hug for you.. ;p DM (who's thinking on posting to the MML his long history behind the M-Chinese migrations..) *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 05 Mar 1999 18:33:57 +0100 From: DM Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - MOrient Team (Was: RE: AD&D SITES IN MYSTARA) On Tue, 02 Mar 1999 17:25:37 -0800, "Jenni A. M. Merrifield" wrote: << And to really keep a project like the MOrient going strong there has to be at least ONE person who is willing to take "leadership" of the project, i.e., regularly sending out notices to members, nagging people for updates, collating the decisions, etc. Right now the MOrient team is leaderless. I haven't had the time myself or I would have done it, however, I'm already a "leader" for a few personal Non-Mystara and Non-RPG projects at the moment, and they are even currently suffering delays because I have son to take care of Nathan (at least I haven't returned to work yet!).>> I understand 100% your situation, Jenni (no, not in the sense I've got a child to raise as well! ;)): but this is how life goes. We don't get payed to write for Mystara, so we have to do it in our free time. I don't think we have to apologize for that: after all, it's only a pasttime! A family is much more important, as is a job or an education. << Heck I have to be honest and admit my own MOrient work is currently stalled (An MOriental Dragon Race who are the Emperors of the MChinese).>> Fortunately I DID progress in my field, creating the Tryclop (Trinetra) race and history (and even some NPCs like Sanshjiama, their "father").. unfortunately, since I did it in collaboration with a friend of mine, it's written in Italian. Guess I'd have to translate those 8 pages in english now.. ;) As usual, time is what is lacking. But I prefer spending my time actively playing in than writing for Mystara as long as I can.. << Caio, Jenni>> Uhmm, well, "caio" to you as well, Jenni... whatever that might mean.. ;) DM *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 05 Mar 1999 18:34:22 +0100 From: DM Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - MOrient On Wed, 03 Mar 1999 10:21:15 CET, "Herve Musseau" wrote: <> Yeah, sure. Problem is: everything we have is not in a .. err.. shall I say "presentable form". Just to make you a comparison: do you remember, Hervé, the draft file about HW events you and Thorf wrote last year? Well, more or less the way we've arranged the stuff. IT's a bit difficult to present that to a ML.. ;) <> There's an old prophecy about Chung Yuan that scared Alphatia very much. Now that Alphatia is gone, Chung Yuan will probably be contacted by enterprising Thadders who have now reached as far as Aegos. <> Thyatian explorers were in fact convinced, IMHO, by Jennite tribesmen that all Skothar (or all that part of Skothar) was under their rule, and the exlorer wrongly assumed they had a government similar to that of the Ethies. Easy enough. <> No, I simply think the OW people are used to think they're the center of the world and what lies beyond, well, is not so much interesting as the Old World itself. A great majority is as much insular as Chung Yuanese. And we must also take into consideration that many other colonies abroad DO NOT want to be discovered (Colony of the Horn, IIRC). <> Very true. Geography doesn't work on Chung Yuanese's side. As it was with real China (else Columbus would have never tried another route) :) <> If you say so, at this point, I think we might better talk a little bit. I for my part can tell you what we have agreed so far to do, then you'll tell me what you're planning for the almanac, and we'll see if we might be able to introduce Chung Yuan in a decent way in AC1017 almanac.. DM *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 05 Mar 1999 12:54:44 -0500 (EST) From: the Wizard of Frobozz Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - MOrient My God, DM, but that was one of the longest messages I've ever seen. Not to say it wasn't extremely informative. :) For myself, I try to shy away from the M-world, R-world comparison stuff as much as possible. I know it's extremely difficult, given that the real world is our only frame of reference. But I still like to try not to make the comparisons. For a few reasons: it saves on the trouble of having to explain how all of these apparently incompatible cultures sprang to life, and allows me to have my own interpretations which have nothing to do with how our world evolved. Perhaps I'm just lazy, but I like to be able to craft my own histories rather than cobble together a mesh of real world cultures. Please don't mistake this for poo-pooing your work. Au contraire, I have a lot of respect for people who take the time and effort to make their game world a cohesive and workable environment. - --Frobozz-- ________________________________________________________ "Evil powers disappear demons worry when the Wizard is near." --Black Sabbath *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 6 Mar 1999 05:08:52 +1100 (EST) From: "Jonathan Nolan, Barrister & Solicitor, FTIA" Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Re: - Continent names > explored the waters first ?!? Perhaps we need to develop a number of > famous Mystaran explorers, the likes of Columbus, Marco Polo, or > their ilk. The continents could also well be named for mythological events - like Europa and Asia on earth, with aetiological myths explaining how the name was given. For the Elven languages I am using old european languages, in which the continent names of Mystara, not to mention "Mystara" are wildly out of place except for Brun... Skothar could be named for a star, in the same way America (al'Mereq) was... doesn't establish what language that is in though yet. Alphatian and Elven tongues both make sense to sepnd time on as they are both languages wrapped up with spellcasting, but I think some of the names in Mystara will have to remain as "loanwords" from extraplanar sources or from myths now almost forgotten. - -------------------------------------------------------------------- * * Jonathan Nolan FTIA - International Law practice call 618 89310176 * * - -------------------------------------------------------------------- Mystara/RPG Netbooks: www.physics.adelaide.edu.au/~ksimpson/netbooks.html *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 6 Mar 1999 05:11:34 +1100 (EST) From: "Jonathan Nolan, Barrister & Solicitor, FTIA" Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - RE: Wendar - Love it or leave it > light of the fact that you're doing this for a place that never really > existed to have languages in the first place! > 'never really existed' ???? :) *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ End of mystara-digest V1999 #114 ******************************** *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara' as the body of the message. mystara-digest Friday, March 5 1999 Volume 1999 : Number 115 Mystara is a trademark of TSR Inc. All Rights Reserved. The following topics are covered in this digest: [MYSTARA] - M-Orient - so when did the Mystaran Papacy establish itself? Re: [MYSTARA] - MOrient Re: [MYSTARA] - M-Orient - so when did the Mystaran Papacy establish itself? Re: [MYSTARA] - M-Orient - so when did the Mystaran Papacy establish itself? [MYSTARA] - Continent Names Re: [MYSTARA] - Re: - Continent names Re: [MYSTARA] - M-Orient - so when did the Mystaran Papacy establish itself? Re: [MYSTARA] - Continent Names Re: [MYSTARA] - Re: - Continent names Re: [MYSTARA] - RE: Wendar - Love it or leave it Re: [MYSTARA] - Re: - Continent names [MYSTARA] - MOrient [MYSTARA] - Re: - Continent names RE: [MYSTARA] - Re: - Continent names Re: [MYSTARA] - M-Orient (LONG) Re: [MYSTARA] - Re: - Continent names [MYSTARA] - Inhabitants of Ar Re: [MYSTARA] - DISEASES Re: [MYSTARA] - Re: - Continent names Re: [MYSTARA] - Continent names Re: [MYSTARA] - Continent Names Re: [MYSTARA] - Inhabitants of Ar Re: [MYSTARA] - Inhabitants of Ar Re: [MYSTARA] - Re: - Continent names Re: [MYSTARA] - Wineform Re: [MYSTARA] - M-Orient (LONG) ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Sat, 6 Mar 1999 05:19:54 +1100 (EST) From: "Jonathan Nolan, Barrister & Solicitor, FTIA" Subject: [MYSTARA] - M-Orient - so when did the Mystaran Papacy establish itself? Why can't contributors just mail what they've done to the list? None of the stuff is any more or less official than anyone else's anyway. And why have a 'project' which from the sounds of it is exclusionist by its very nature? If people don't like bits of it they'll just hit DEL in any event, plus the creator can receive further encouragement and thoughts from everyone else. This is sounding a bit like the Al-Qadim list in this respect, where an essentially off-list 'project' was constantly referred to but never seen... If someone wants to crank out an OA Japan for Mystara why wouldn't they either put it on their website or just mail it to the list ab initio? I am having some difficulty apprehending the utility or efficiency of a leaderless off-list project which diverts attention from the list's own ability to dialogue and critique the very same topic. Or something. :) - -------------------------------------------------------------------- * * Jonathan Nolan FTIA - International Law practice call 618 89310176 * * - -------------------------------------------------------------------- Mystara/RPG Netbooks: www.physics.adelaide.edu.au/~ksimpson/netbooks.html *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 5 Mar 1999 12:26:30 -0600 From: "James Ruhland" Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - MOrient Just to sound off on a tangent (since that is what I do best), Mystara really isn't horribly small (ok, it's a UPP size 6 unlike Earth's size 8, but no biggie). The only reason it *seems* congested is because so much (the "Known World" portion of Mystara, as extended) is crouded into so small a portion of it. Lets be "Brun Centric" for a second. even counting the portions of Brun TSR did detail (KW, Sind/Great Waste, Hule, Thang. Pen, Savage Coast, Norwold, Denagoth plus Wendar, that tiny Elven realm from CM7 "Tree of Life"), about half of Brun is still "unknown territory." If you used the same "country scale" they used for the KW, you could crowd a whole M-Orient into Brun itself (not that I'm advocating the M-Orient folks do that, mind you). However, on the scale they're probably considering, it might be wise to "spin off" some of the M-Orient nations to other continents (near Izondia and the Pelatan shield, the cape of fire, etc). Looking at the map of Skothar from the HW set, it looks like Jennites (hey, why not make some of these nomads M-Turkic like in central asia, instead of all M-Mongol. Perhaps cultural drift/mixing as happened elsewhere?) Anyhow, it looks like the Jennites occupy a big swath of Skothar (from the "steppes of Jen" near Esterhold to the "Jennite Sword" near the eastern end of the continent). This seems to leave little but mountains for other nations (with the exception of the Minaean Coast, Thonia, and the Tangoro around the Gulf and Bay of Tangor). Crowding the huge, comprehensive (nice job, btw! Only thing missing IMO is an M-Phillipines) list of M-Orient nations into that area and it does start to look like the deplorably congested KW portion of Mystara. Just some ramblings. Pay them no mind if you don't like them. Mystara needs more archipelagos, by the way. Doesn't really have anything to do with the current discussion, I guess. But just something that came to mind. *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 5 Mar 1999 12:33:39 -0600 From: "James Ruhland" Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - M-Orient - so when did the Mystaran Papacy establish itself? > Why can't contributors just mail what they've done to the list? None of > the stuff is any more or less official than anyone else's anyway. And why > have a 'project' which from the sounds of it is exclusionist by its very > nature? > Anyone can join and participate in the various "projects" if they are interested (except loud prima-donnas like yours truely). They aren't exclusionist. The reason for having a "project" is so that those who *do* want to participate can cooperate, pool their efforts, but not crowd the list in general with a lot of mails that some people won't be interested in (that happens anyhow, I guess, but this cuts down on the volume). If you're interested in participating in either the M-Orient, or M-Davania, or Almanac, or any of the other various ongoing projects/groups (some may have slipped my mind), just say so, and I'm sure they'd welcome you. Geoff Gander has a list of the various ongoing things that he posts periodically, as a way of telling folks what is out there and inviting them to join/participate if they are interested. Perhaps it is time you posted it again, Geoff. 8-) > If someone wants to crank out an OA Japan for Mystara why wouldn't they > either put it on their website or just mail it to the list ab initio? > I'm sure all this will go on a website or websites eventually, if they haven't already (and IIRC, some stuff is already up there). Would be helpful to post pertinant URL(s) from time to time, though. *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 5 Mar 1999 12:35:51 -0600 From: "James Ruhland" Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - M-Orient - so when did the Mystaran Papacy establish itself? > > > Anyone can join and participate in the various "projects" if they are > interested (except loud prima-donnas like yours truely). > Grrrr. . .it just occured to me that the above might be taken the wrong way. When I said "yours truely" I was, of course, refering to myself. *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 5 Mar 1999 13:46:31 EST From: Ambreville@aol.com Subject: [MYSTARA] - Continent Names <<"Davania" sounds like a thyatian name (or a thyatified one), based on the idea that Thyatian should be MLatin. On the other hand, Brun and Skothar don't look like Latin words. It should be considered also that knowledge of Skothar could come from Alphatia, instead of Nithia.>> [Giampaolo] To be accurate, Thyatian names ought to be derived more from ancient Greek than Latin, since Thyatis was intended to be inspired from Byzantium. I don't recall exactly how these names came about. I *think* Aaron Allston came up with Davania, Skothar, and all the continent names in the HW; and I came up with Brun. (It's been awhile...) :o) Bruce Heard *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 05 Mar 1999 11:04:07 PST From: "Jennifer Favia" Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Re: - Continent names >Skothar could be named for a star, in the same way America (al'Mereq) >was... doesn't establish what language that is in though yet. Off-topic, but I thought America was named for Amerigo Vespucci, who explored or "found" (whatever) the mainland. Jenn ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 5 Mar 1999 14:57:01 -0500 (EST) From: SteelAngel Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - M-Orient - so when did the Mystaran Papacy establish itself? On Sat, 6 Mar 1999, Jonathan Nolan, Barrister & Solicitor, FTIA wrote: > have a 'project' which from the sounds of it is exclusionist by its very > nature? Project means that the particular Skothar that the team creates is coherent. Not just a random i dea that is not interrelational with anyone else's. The davania project details lands in davania that help to create a whole interrelated continent. members who are not on the team are not bound by the stricture of making sure that every person's work jives with everyone else's. Ethan *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 5 Mar 1999 15:00:23 -0500 (EST) From: SteelAngel Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Continent Names On Fri, 5 Mar 1999 Ambreville@aol.com wrote: > I don't recall exactly how these names came about. I *think* Aaron Allston > came up with Davania, Skothar, and all the continent names in the HW; and I > came up with Brun. (It's been awhile...) :o) Speaking do that. Why do the HW continents all sound so wonky? Suridal? Iciria? Yeesh. They sound more like elven names :) Ethan - Off to Prague in 5 min. *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 5 Mar 1999 21:11:19 +0100 From: "=?ISO-8859-1?Q?Andr=E9s_Piquer_Otero?=" Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Re: - Continent names > > > > Off-topic, but I thought America was named for Amerigo Vespucci, who > explored or "found" (whatever) the mainland. > > Jenn Slight correction: he was its first cartographer (Columbus was the first to reach the mainland, too). Back in topic: Davania sounds quite Greek, so I find two options: 1. Take it as Milenian, perhaps related to a legendary hero). 2. Take it as Byzantium-RWThyatian, and connect it with the name of one of the first explorers and mappers of the Hinterlands and Adakkian: "Terra Davanica" = Davania? Perhaps the explorer was called Davanus or Daunus (quite similar to the RW Danaus). Andrés *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 05 Mar 1999 15:35:57 -0500 (EST) From: the Wizard of Frobozz Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - RE: Wendar - Love it or leave it On Sat, 6 Mar 1999, Jonathan Nolan, Barrister & Solicitor, FTIA wrote: > > light of the fact that you're doing this for a place that never really > > existed to have languages in the first place! > > > > 'never really existed' ???? > > :) Well, never was a physical place. How's that? Of course it exists in our minds and hearts. :) - --Frobozz-- ________________________________________________________ "Evil powers disappear demons worry when the Wizard is near." --Black Sabbath *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 05 Mar 1999 15:41:52 -0500 (EST) From: the Wizard of Frobozz Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Re: - Continent names On Fri, 5 Mar 1999, Jennifer Favia wrote: > >Skothar could be named for a star, in the same way America (al'Mereq) > >was... doesn't establish what language that is in though yet. > > Off-topic, but I thought America was named for Amerigo Vespucci, who > explored or "found" (whatever) the mainland. > > Jenn As far as I remember from US history, you're right, Jenn. Of course, he found SOUTH America, but who's counting? - --Frobozz-- ________________________________________________________ "Evil powers disappear demons worry when the Wizard is near." --Black Sabbath *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 5 Mar 1999 23:36:27 +0200 From: =?iso-8859-1?Q?=E0=E9=EC=EF_=F9=E7=ED?= Subject: [MYSTARA] - MOrient > For myself, I try to shy away from the M-world, R-world comparison stuff as much as possible. I know it's extremely difficult, given that the real world is our only frame of reference. But I still like to try not to make the comparisons. For a few reasons: it saves on the trouble of having to explain how all of these apparently incompatible cultures sprang to life, and allows me to have my own interpretations which have nothing to do with how our world evolved. Perhaps I'm just lazy, but I like to be able to craft my own histories rather than cobble together a mesh of real world cultures. > Right on Frobozz! I never understood why people have to analogue everything to RW. it became quite an obsession on what mystaran culture goes with what RW one. I think this stifles imagination. I know its hard work but the stuff I find realy interesting are those that are totaly new or INSPIRED by RW and enriched with new stuff. you CAN make new cultures. even if you have something that reminds you of a real people or place you are never bound to mimic that same RW people or place. take the Darine and Traldaran cultures that Jenn developed. they are of course inspired by RW but (and I hope Im not misteaken here) most of the charectaristics of those cultures are made up. same should be with all cultures, history and geography on Mystara. hmm, that will be all... *casting "protection from FLAMES" and changing to gasious form* Morphail (Ohad Shaham) "and all the while as vampires feed- I bleed..." /the Pixies *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 5 Mar 1999 23:46:36 +0200 From: =?iso-8859-1?Q?=E0=E9=EC=EF_=F9=E7=ED?= Subject: [MYSTARA] - Re: - Continent names > For the Elven languages I am using old european languages, in which the continent names of Mystara, not to mention "Mystara" are wildly out of place except for Brun... > Ever thought about how come Mystarans gave a name to there planet? I mean even on our planet we call it "The earth" as in "the ground" and we call our star "the sun". in Hebrew this is much worse as it translates "the ball of land/ground". and to think we KNOW that ours is just one of many planets and Mystarans dont... Why should a Mystaran ever need to use the name "Mystara?" he\she wont say "all over Mystara" or the prittiest girl in Mystara" or "I just traveled to the inner side of Mystara" he\she would just say "world". Morphail (Ohad Shaham) "and all the while as vampires feed- I bleed..." /the Pixies *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 5 Mar 1999 14:09:16 -0800 From: "Harvey, Michael" Subject: RE: [MYSTARA] - Re: - Continent names > Ever thought about how come Mystarans gave a name to there planet? Maybe it was the Alphatians that named it. They *were* coming from another world, so Mystara to them was new and different. If humans travelled to another planet and settled there, I doubt they'd call it Earth or Ground. They'd come up with some other name that was descriptive of it in some way. Of course that raises the question: why would the Alphatians call it Mystara? They had both magic and immortals on the Alphatian homeworld, so there wasn't really anything new or mysterious. However we have not exhausted all our options yet! The Blackmoorians also came from another world. And their homeworld probably did NOT have either magic or immortals, since they were a technological race! So arriving on mystara which was full of magic and weird creatures, and having immortal gods, they would certainly see it as mysterious and strange. So my vote is that Mystara was named by the space travellers who founded Blackmoor. (Of course if you don't like either of those explanations, you could say that the word "mystara" actually *meant* "the ground" in the ancient and forgotten Nithian language.) Mike *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 5 Mar 1999 16:04:15 -0600 From: "James Ruhland" Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - M-Orient (LONG) > > There's also a forest with ewok-like beings somewhere, > Oh, goodie! The perfect place to send my M-Daleks! 8-)~ *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 5 Mar 1999 17:11:57 -0500 From: Sharon Dornhoff Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Re: - Continent names >Ever thought about how come Mystarans gave a name to there planet? >I mean even on our planet we call it "The earth" as in "the ground" and we >call our star "the sun". in Hebrew this is much worse as it translates >"the ball of land/ground". >and to think we KNOW that ours is just one of many planets and Mystarans >dont... Presumably, "Mystara" is the word which Immortals use to discuss the planet. Mortal followers would have picked up the term from them. This is probably the only way to explain why the moons -- Matera and Patera -- have matching names (meaning "Mother" and "Father", respectively) ... even though the latter moon is invisible to Mystarans and thus, shouldn't have an "official" name at all! *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 5 Mar 1999 22:40:57 +0100 From: "Jamuga Khan" Subject: [MYSTARA] - Inhabitants of Ar > 3) They don't automatically regain altitude, but the Ar-dudes (was going > to write "Areans" but might confuse with others having similar appelations. > Back to my regularly scheduled screed, already in progress) the Ar-dudes > use whatever methods they have on hand to "tow" each islet back up to the > proper altitude (which would follow, if they can move the islands to the > Yanniev islands). To give the inhabitants of (Floating) Ar a name led me by far too deep into the unpleasant parts of my people. So I have decided to call them "Arans" with their "Aran" life-style. Can you all live with that? Jamuga Khan "Hear and obey, because the Mighty Khan's word is law." *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 5 Mar 1999 17:18:12 -0500 From: Sharon Dornhoff Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - DISEASES An interesting (not to mention icky!) assortment of diseases there, Jonathan. It could've maybe gone a little lighter, on references to AD&D monsters -- not many of the pure-oD&D list members would know what a "yellow musk creeper" is -- but I'm sure there's some nifty adventure plotlines which could be derived from these pathogens. :-) Anybody remember that list of diseases from the old "Trail Map" products? It had things like mummy rot and lycanthropy, as well as a number of serious and not-so-serious nonmagical ailments, and the parts of the world where they're common. *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 5 Mar 1999 17:21:08 -0500 From: Sharon Dornhoff Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Re: - Continent names >> Anyone wondered where the names "Brun", "Davania", and "Skothar" >> originated? Do you think they were derivations of old Blackmoorian words >> (as Blackmoor was a world power)? Or something else? > >Of course, the names could also come from the different migrating >cultures, giving a lot of options; such as the elves, the hin (how >about that, the hin naming a continent...), or any of a number of >civilizations. OTOH, they could've been words that the joker whom Haldemaar says "doctored" the Masters' Set map -- the Thyatian who'd named countries for his dog, his mistress, and an orc's armpit, among other things ;-D -- came up with off the top of his head! *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 05 Mar 1999 17:24:29 -0500 From: Jeff Daly Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Continent names Pretty neat idea. I have always considered Skothar to be a bastardization of Skandahar...the viking-like raiders from the age of Blackmoor. Andrés Piquer Otero wrote: > > "Davania" sounds like a thyatian name (or a thyatified one), based on the > > idea that Thyatian should be MLatin. On the other hand, Brun and Skothar > > don't look like Latin words. It should be considered also that knowledge > > of Skothar could come from Alphatia, instead of Nithia. > > > > SKOTHAR: I propose this ethimology: SHE-KOTHARATU (in Old -cultivated > Alphatian, Shekotharah in Modern Alphatian, Skothar as pronounced by > Thyatian speakers). > > SHE = Concerning, belonging to.... > KOTHARAT= "the Immortal Lady", an Alphatian name for Tarastia, the patron > of the Jennites. As the Alphatians knew of Skothar population through > contact with Jennites, they name the continent as "The (Land) belonging to > Tarastia". > > Just an idea, > > Andrés > *************************************************************************** > To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line > 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 05 Mar 1999 17:27:40 -0500 From: Jeff Daly Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Continent Names > > I don't recall exactly how these names came about. I *think* Aaron Allston > came up with Davania, Skothar, and all the continent names in the HW; and I > came up with Brun. (It's been awhile...) :o) > > Bruce Heard Bruce, I absolutely LOVE these insights. I never even imagined the 3 continent names may have come from 2 different people. I always assumed you did all 3... *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 05 Mar 1999 17:30:06 -0500 From: Jeff Daly Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Inhabitants of Ar I can live with it. Heck, I think it is difficult to talk about "Ar" without breaking into piratespeak already! Jamuga Khan wrote: > > 3) They don't automatically regain altitude, but the Ar-dudes (was going > > to write "Areans" but might confuse with others having similar > appelations. > > Back to my regularly scheduled screed, already in progress) the Ar-dudes > > use whatever methods they have on hand to "tow" each islet back up to the > > proper altitude (which would follow, if they can move the islands to the > > Yanniev islands). > > To give the inhabitants of (Floating) Ar a name led me by far too > deep into the unpleasant parts of my people. So I have decided > to call them "Arans" with their "Aran" life-style. > > Can you all live with that? > > Jamuga Khan > > "Hear and obey, because the Mighty Khan's word is law." > *************************************************************************** > To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line > 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 5 Mar 1999 16:49:47 -0600 From: "James Ruhland" Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Inhabitants of Ar > > I can live with it. Heck, I think it is difficult to talk about "Ar" without > breaking into piratespeak already! > Gives a new meaning to the word "landlubber," too. "Avast, ye ground-dwelling slubs! Yer money, or yer life! Ar!" *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 5 Mar 1999 18:05:17 -0500 (EST) From: au998@freenet.carleton.ca (Geoff Gander) Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Re: - Continent names Jenn wrote: >Off-topic, but I thought America was named for Amerigo Vespucci, who >explored or "found" (whatever) the mainland. That's what I thought, as well. Geoff - -- Geoff Gander, BA 97 Cartographer/Game Designer/Government Peon Part-Time High Priest, Ottawa Chapter of the Church of Y'hog au998@freenet.carleton.ca *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 6 Mar 1999 01:42:54 +0200 (EET) From: Markus Olavi Montola Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Wineform > What exactly makes clothform 4th level, but wineform lower? Wineform seems Can't recall whats clothform... - Markus ----------------------------------------------------------------- W A R I S P E A C E F R E E D O M I S S L A V E R Y I G N O R A N C E I S S T R E N G T H ----------------------------------------------------------------- *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 5 Mar 1999 20:29:50 -0500 From: Sharon Dornhoff Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - M-Orient (LONG) >Oh well, if it depended on me, I'd have posted the whole stuff some months >ago already. < Glad to hear it! So how CAN we convince you to do so, even if it's only in little dribs and drabs when you find the time? Despite the impression I might have (unintentionally, I swear!) given you, that I'm against an MOrient, I DO want to see this stuff -- perhaps, even, to install some on Patera -- and I'm sure I'm not the only one who's interested. >If I might use a neologism: "We lack a central Ganderization." ;)< LOL! Maybe that's what this list needs: a half-dozen more Geoffs, to juggle all the projects. ;-D >Uhmm, well, there are combinations of cultures in Skothar as well: you've >got Chinese and Tanagoro, Malaysians and Mineans, Alphatians and Jennites, >barbarian humanoids with an eastern flavour and secluded woodland races, >and even a new branch of the fairy folk (the Celestial Court) and new >races! I do think this is pretty in-tone with Mystara's flavour of mixing >RW cultures and fantasy ones in small spaces.< Okay, this is sounding more like what I'd been thinking of, in terms of what Mystara's regions ought to look like. I admit, when I looked at the Skothar map the MOrient team had come up with, and saw only ONE teensy little chunk of MEthiopia in the midst of a 99% Asiatic continent, I'd feared the plan was to make an MAsia that corresponded so closely to IRL, any elves or dwarves or Tanagoros who lived there would have no choice but to wield katanas and write kanji. But if the "Asia" theme isn't played up so much, allowing room for other elements, then it's a bit more in keeping with the Mystara I've always pictured. The OW is mostly European, but with far-flung tidbits of Asia (Ethengar, Ylaruam, Sind), nonhuman "alien" cultures (elves, dwarves, shadow elves), and the New World (Atruaghin lands), thrown in. The Savage Coast is likewise a mostly-Spanish/Latin American area, but it's also got chunks of northern Europe (Robrenn, Eusdria, Bellayne & Renardy), Eastern Europe (the City-States), Ottoman Turkey (Hule), the ancient Middle East (Nimmur & Herath) and even Texas (guess) scattered throughout its collage. If this MO-Skothar is designed as a fantasy-rich, diverse place that just happens to have an Asian "feel" to it, rather than a textbook rehash of the historical Far East without any surprises to offer, that's MUCH more interesting than what I'd feared ... i.e. that you were just pasting the old Oriental Adventures rules onto a spare continent Mystara'd had sitting around doing nothing. >Well, Sind is India, and Morient hasn't got India, while Ethengar, well, >yes, it's pretty similar to Jennites, but hey, we didn't invent the >Jennites, right? Nope, you didn't ... although it's probably exaggerating the similarities between Mongols and Scythians, if you say they're hard to tell apart. I do see some problems in having an MNepal and MTibet exist, in such a total isolation from Sindhi influences, though. ><let us know why Skothar's different!>> > >Skothar's no more different than Davania. Why didn't anybody explore >Davania? If you allow Davania to exist undetailed, why not having Skothar >being the same? Actually, Davania HAS been explored many times; its history is repeatedly linked to that of the Old World, if you look at the backstories of Thyatis or the Milenians. And the fact that there's an open-water route to all of Skothar's southern coastline -- something which, by IRL geography, would have demanded a trip around the entire African continent (!) to reach China from Europe -- makes the Alphatians not quite as impermeable a barrier as you seem to think. Remember that with magic for a navigational aid, there's no reason for Mystaran shipping to stick to the coastlines, like IRL merchant ships had to. But you've already said MO-Skothar won't be a "monoculture" of purely Asiatic nations, so I'll concede the point that it's not so "different" after all. >As for African cultures, I've always thought they're on Davania (Arypt and >Addakian deserts..), but anyway.. Well, we know there's some Tanagoros on the Vulcanian Peninsula. But remember that it's mostly races of non-humans who've prevailed on the southern continent, and most of those -- e.g. elves, N'djatwa, hin, nagpas - -- don't correspond closely to any specific IRL culture. ><<[* - Hey, if baiting ol' DM is the only way to get the MOrient material >posted, it'll be worth my getting flamed about it! There's a method to my >madness, tee hee hee.... ;-D]>> > >I am REALLY SORRY, Sharon, if I angered you. I didn't want to, believe me. Hey, I wasn't angry, I was teasing! If I gave the impression I was mad, I apologize for that. Frankly, if I'm genuinely offended about something, I'll probably sign off the list for a few days until I cool off. If it sounds like I'm blowing off steam, OTOH, I'm generally just trying to get a rise out of people and provoke more speculation on a subject. Kinda like Korotiku's pranks, in a way.... ***folds up her eight legs and prays Yehm won't take offense, for her using his improper, "human" name on the MML ;-D*** No hard feelings, OK...? :-) >Say what: why don't we all flame somebody else together to settle our >disputes? Randomly choosing a name.. mmmmh.. Gordon McCormick: you're a >loserkobold! How's this for a flamewar start? ;p *(patting Gordon on the >shoulder)* LOL! But isn't "loser kobold" repeating yourself... unless you happen to be insulting Prince Kol, that is? :-) >Well, I can make you a list of the M-Orient nations we want to develop: Oh cool, some real info! Hey everybody: my "evil scheme" worked ... he's telling us about it!!! ***prepares to cheerfully nitpick DM's ideas** >Esterhold (Alphatian colony + Jennites, already fleshed out) >M-Bhutan (no name yet, land of enlightnement, humans + dragons + tryclops) Wasn't Khompor-Thap supposed to have covered this culture, pretty well? >M-China (Chung Yuan, Empire) Nice name ... and I love Jenn's idea of having Oriental dragons on the throne! Can't wait to hear how -- or if -- those are related to the "Western" versions from the NoD, BTW. >M-Ethiopia (Tanagoro homeland) Actually, I was going to put an MEthiopia on the Vulcanian Peninsula, to be next-door neighbors/rivals of the MPersians I'm developing for the HM project. But that would've been back in the late Nithian era, so they could have easily evolved into something different, by the present day. Or I could up the magic-level of the V.P. Tangorans, and make it more like the mythic/biblical Sheba, if you've already got IRL Ethiopia sewn up. Hmmmm.... >M-Korea (no name yet, jennite descendants, many druids) Makes sense and sounds interesting. >M-Japan (Jikushiru, Shogunate, M-ainu + chung yuans emigrants) Are you sure that's the best era of Japanese history to choose...? IIRC, Zyxl was mentioned as one of the places Gombar and Suma'a trade with, and IRL Shogunate Nihon wasn't exactly friendly to foreign traders. (Not that that's an insurmountable discrepancy, or anything. I was just thinking that we could keep the redundancy down, between Myoshima and Jikushiru, if the latter were going through a more turbulant period than the former. This would also allow for a far more varied range of adventuring opportunities, between the two M-Japans, than if they're both at the same stage of history.) >M-Malaysia + M-Indochina (no name yet, piratical raiders and farmers, not >united) Again, I think this region is already covered on Patera. It's not that a little bit of cultural parallelism isn't reconcileable, given how often we've already seen that sort of thing on Mystara; it's just that, as an evolutionary biologist, I have real trouble suspending my disbelief, when there's THAT much "convergent evolution" going on between two independently-arising species ... or societies. >M-Mongolia (Steppes of Jen, Tribal alliance of Jennites) Maybe here's another place where we could use a "time jump", to make things differ between the two versions of a country. If the Ethies are Mongols -- i.e. the ones whom Genghiz led -- then the Jennite steppe-tribes might correspond to Huns, Alans, or other Turkic nomads, who weren't anywhere near as organized as the Great Hordes. >M-Myanmar (no name yet, Kingdom, mystical culture of pagoda dwellers) I've seen this on the MOrient website. It's cool. :-) >M-Nepal (no name yet, land of isolated giant clans) I've already got an MNepal in the works, for the HM setting. It's called Vedal, and its actual origin is on Brun: it's a legendary "lost mumlyket" of Sind, that vanished to Matera from the region where Gunjab, Peshmir and Sablestone are now. (IRL Nepal is a lot more Indian than Chinese, IMHO.) Its inhabitants are 99% human, yet they got sent to the nocturnal museum-setting, anyway ... as an evil Immortals' "hunting preserve" for night-stalking bhuts (who'd nearly died out in the Sindhi anti-shapeshifter pogroms of 451 AC). But those giants do sound interesting. Come to think of it, I don't think anyone's done a history for giants of Mystara yet! (Correct me if I'm wrong.) >M-Siberia (no name, independent clans of Thonians and noids, Qaurik city >maybe) I placed the MRussians on Skothar's northern coast just a few days ago, after an MML comment got me to thinking about them. I made them a lost colony of Ostlanders and their Traladaran thralls, who've melded into a single, Halav-worshipping culture (the "righteous king" is a VERY powerful ideal, for Russians), and who used to trade with Frislanders but are now looking for new markets. And I figured I'd put the Quariks' nomadic ancestors, before the Firelords - -- renegade Flaems or Magians exiled for their sicko magic rites, perhaps...? -- took over and "civilized" them, in the HM as well, since it's so darn cold there. :-) >M-Thailand (unnamed Kingdom, jennite+chung yuan breed, traders of drugs >and farmers) >M-Tibet (no name yet, human and humanoid clans) Wasn't there a reference to a Tibet-style kingdom in the Black Mountains somewhere...? >Minaea (Greek pirates' city-states, from PWA) >Thonia (remnants of the Thonian empire, now barbaric -up for grabs) > >There's also a forest with ewok-like beings somewhere AAAUUUGH! No, no, no! Here, I was almost sold on the MO idea ... but not EWOKS! Please, noooooo!!! ;-) > and I've planned >introducing also the Tryclop race, reclusive beings who seek out Blackmoor >relics and guard them in the city of Sanctuary, built atop the highest >peaks of M-Bhutan. If they've got three eyes, maybe there's an IRL Oriental name you could give them. There are probably three-eyed oni, or some similar creatures, in Asian mythology. >Listen Sharon: we didn't even know of the Shadowelves until Gaz5 mentioned >them, even though so many adventurers went underground during those years. >Does this mean they were not there? No, of course. It only means that TSR >hadn't covered them up yet. >Same applies with Thothia: until DotE, we completely ignored the existance >of Thothia, save what was later written in M5 (even the Thadders didn't >mention Thothia in their gaz). Heck, we didn't even know the Heldann >Freeholds were in fact the Heldannic Territories until Bruce told us in the >VotPA series! And that's way after the publishing of all the other gaz! See >what I'm trying to say? ;) Okay, okay. Point taken. :-) I guess it's just the Hollow World thing that's holding me up -- that, and the redundancy (which I still don't like) -- about all this. I just don't see why, if the Immortals felt free to mix-and-match cultures ranging from Tanagoros to Nithians to Milenians to Brute-men, on the main continent's southern hemisphere, and from lizard men to Antalians to Kogolors to Azcans to Neathar tribes, in the north, they wouldn't have put MAsiatics (apart from the Jennites, who'd needed immense plains -- largely absent from the other three continents, from the look of things -- to roam upon) in those lands, too. And placing all of them together, on the same alternate continent -- arguing, perhaps, that the Oriental Immortals have cut a deal with Ka & Co. to keep one all to themselves -- seems like a recipe for mayhem, given that a culture which caused another Asiatic culture's extinction might later end up adjacent to its old enemies, who've not (thanks to the SoP) forgiven or forgotten. >But this wouldn't be the first time: there still are two Moldavian cultures >(Boldavia and Traladara), two Mongolian cultures (Ethengar and Jennites), >two celtic cultures (Hinterlands and Robrenn, and maybe western IoD as >well). And if you're willing to believe the existance of hot Ylaruam and >the frozen Northern Lands bordering each other, I'd say you can easily >believe there are Asian cultures both on the Moon and on Mystara. ;) Asian cultures, yes. The SAME Asian culture, spontaneously arisen on two totally different worlds where even the day/night cycle's not at all comparable...? I doubt it, even if Immortals/spirits WERE directing their evolution. Remember, even Aztanteotl couldn't convert the Schattenalfen entirely to the Azcan culture he's so obsessed with: they're still pretty elf-like, apart from their architecture; they speak elvish, not Azcan/Oltec, and disdain tlachtli and human sacrifice. Besides, there's a BIG difference between having two Slavic or steppe or Celtic cultures -- each of which encompassed literally dozens of distinctive groups, IRL -- and two carbon-copy Japanese Shogunates. >Ochalea is a mixed chinese-japanese setting IMO. I've made it straight Cantonese, IMC. Mixing up Japanese and Chinese culture is done waaaaay too often in fantasy games. ><'em all, IMHO, so let's not make excess work for ourselves if TSR's already >done a chunk of it for us. ;-)>> > >So, we could say: once you've seen a mad wizard, you've seen them all, >right? There's a difference between saying two different wizards can go mad and cause trouble, and saying that two different countries can develop EXACTLY in parallel to one another, with no differences whatsoever, regardless of their physical environment, climate, neighbors, history, or even (in the Pateran rakastas' case) species. There's more than one insane person IRL, but you can't claim that there've EVER been two identical societies, in the real world, that arose independently of each other. Even Sind and Shadjapur won't be PERFECTLY the same, because Sind has been free to evolve and change, in the centuries since the Shadjapuri were sent to the Hollow World. Otherwise, if ALL it took to keep two separate cultures in precise lock-step with one another was Immortal (or DM) fiat, why would the HW setting have needed an SoP, to preserve/freeze its societies...? Ka & Co could've just told the priests of a society to keep things exactly as they were, and that'd suffice. >And besides, I think it's easier to get to Skothar than >going to an invisible moon.. could you agree with me at least on this? ;) Quite true. But I thought you'd been arguing that it WAS incredibly hard to get to Skothar ... after all, the HKs actually made it to the moons, first! ;-) Getting PCs into odd places is a matter of dungeon master ingenuity. Keeping two societies from coming into contact, when they're sooooo close and accessible to one another, should demand a bit more than a "deus ex machina" explanation. ><cultures, like those of Africa, South America, or the Pacific. >> > >Africa: you got the Tanagoro (which are an ethnic group, made of different >cultures). But virtually none of them are developed, beyond the "villagers who herd cattle" level. In fact, the only one that IS developed -- Yavdlom -- is a fantastic, prophet-ruled culture (albeit with Haitian accents ;-D) rather than an IRL African one. And I'm hoping to cover an awful lot of the exciting ones, as I ransack my university's library on the subject: there's cultures in that part of the world -- e.g. Xhosa, !Kung San, Dahomey, ancient Great Zimbabwe -- which my players have barely even heard of, so they'll genuinely be in for some surprises (which would not be the case in an MJapan, I might add ;-D). >South America: you got the Azcans, Oltecs and Atruaghin >Children. Slightly more developed, but there's still lots of specific SA cultures -- from the Yanomami to imperial Incas (who weren't NEARLY as wussy as the HW Oltecs!) -- to be explored. >Pacific, I agree, is not present, however. What about using those >areas labeled "Sea Kingdoms" in Master set? Good thinking! If I weren't knee-deep in the Hollow Moon right now, I might write this up. :-) >And besides, I think the M-O group is trying to do its >best to come up with fantasy twists of RW cultures (such as the dragon >emperor, the celestial/fairy court, the noid crossbreeds and a plausible >version of RW Buddha). Now, THIS sounds interesting! Okay, I'm back to liking the idea ... but dang it, I'm NOT gonna put Ewoks on my Asian Patera! No, no, NO!!!! :-D >Personally I liked Bellayne and Renardy. But then again: did you know there >were so many rakasta and lupin spread all around the world before Bruce >told you in his Dragon Articles? And apparently this is something that's >quite common to the Old World explorers, yet they failed to mention this in >all gazetteers and even in the PWA.. See what I mean? Frankly, I think Gaz3 set the precedent for all these duplicate, cut-and-pasted cultures, by giving us a kind of Mystara-in-miniature. Far beyond even what the ol' X1 map implied, it set the standard that you could stick just about ANY two cultures next to each other in a small geographic area, on this particular world, and expect 'em to behave themselves. ;-) Still, if Bruce had written up Bellayne and Renardy entirely straight -- no gags about cats' behavior, or wine-making contests, or cats and dogs/English and French as sporting rivals -- do you really think it would've gone over well? You can get away with having more than one version of a culture in your game setting, provided that they're presented as having a distinctly different "style" (e.g. New Averoigne is magic-heavy and intrigue/lycanthropy-ridden; Renardy is swashbuckling and very tongue-in-cheek). But if the ONLY difference between the two locales had been that Renardois have a little fur on their faces, I don't think players would get much enjoyment out of having two of these lands, that they couldn't just as easily get out of one. >The history is a bit different. Mchinese do not originate on Skothar in our >view.. and in their homeland (Alphatian continent) there were in fact >different states fighting each other. < Then some should be in the Hollow World. That was my point. >Have u forgotten there are still other 2 continents not developed in the >HW? Some of them might live in Aerical.. TSR hadn't the time to develop >Mystara as it did with FR, so it's easy to answer this way, Sharon. :) Again, sticking all endangered Asiatics on the same continent -- knowing that they're likely to be joined by the very people who'd wiped them out, in time -- sounds like a sure formula for conflict. It's like putting the Nithians and Malpheggi lizard men in the same region: it guarantees they'll go to war and makes the SoP work needlessly hard, to prevent a second extirpation. Scattering introduced races among strangers, whom they have no ingrained grudges against, is a much wiser strategy; that's probably why we've seen so much pairing up of previously-unrelated cultures in the HW, already. >Oh, please, Sharon! That's what TSR DID with Mystara from the very >beginning! Look at the Old World: Ethengar, Norsemen, Ylari and Renaissance >Darokinians all within a week's ride from each other!! All the more reason not to exacerbate the problem. On Brun -- based on IRL mainland Europe, which has always been a bit "congested" with cultures and languages; getting invaded wholesale from the north, east and south every couple of centuries does that to a continent ;-) -- it's something we've learned to live with. But if we get soooo determined to squeeze dozens more cultures onto Mystara's landscape, that it means squashing a huge realm like China down to a mere sliver of its former self, we wouldn't be doing them justice. >Again, Sharon, don't take this as a personal flame. As Matthew Levy's quote >said: Peace, ok? *Big Hug* :) Peace still, DM. Maybe we aren't in agreement here, but we were never really "fighting". *Big Hug Back Atcha* :-) >You, Gordon, on the other hand, are allowed to take it as a personal flame. >And no, no hug for you.. ;p ***gives Gordon small hug so he won't feel left out*** *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ End of mystara-digest V1999 #115 ******************************** *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara' as the body of the message. mystara-digest Saturday, March 6 1999 Volume 1999 : Number 116 Mystara is a trademark of TSR Inc. All Rights Reserved. The following topics are covered in this digest: Re: [MYSTARA] - MOrient Re: [MYSTARA] - Inhabitants of Ar [MYSTARA] - Climate change and Nithia Re: [MYSTARA] - Inhabitants of Ar Re: [MYSTARA] - M-Orient (LONG) [MYSTARA] - more tolkienesque elf stuff (long) ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Fri, 5 Mar 1999 20:34:16 -0500 From: Sharon Dornhoff Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - MOrient >Mystara needs more archipelagos, by the way. Doesn't really have anything >to do with the current discussion, I guess. But just something that came to >mind. Well, IIRC you can't even see the Thanegioths on the world-map: the scale's too big. Even Hattias is just barely visible. So you can probably stick an archipelago anyplace that's not already been mapped as open water, on other Mystara-maps, and nobody will mind. ;-) There is an MPhillipines on Patera, if I'm not mistaken. *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 5 Mar 1999 20:42:14 -0500 From: Sharon Dornhoff Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Inhabitants of Ar >To give the inhabitants of (Floating) Ar a name led me by far too >deep into the unpleasant parts of my people. So I have decided >to call them "Arans" with their "Aran" life-style. > >Can you all live with that? > > > > > Jamuga Khan Er... actually, that name's been taken. It's the name of the ancient IoD web-city that the aranea (i.e. "folk of Aran") came from. Aran -- rhymes with "Iran", I assume, given the Middle Eastern feel of the region (Thothia) it's near -- is featured in module M5: Talons Of Night. Maybe they could be the "Ar-phatians".... ;-D *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 5 Mar 1999 21:33:40 -0500 From: Sharon Dornhoff Subject: [MYSTARA] - Climate change and Nithia I was flipping through the Nithian HWR, yesterday, and I hit upon a bit of a puzzle: If the Alasiyan Desert is supposed to be so hot, because renegade fire elementals broke loose during Nithia's fall and are camping out in the part of the Plane of Fire that lies parallel to it... then why didn't ancient Nithia have a temperate climate, BEFORE the Empire collapsed? Judging by its lattitude and the adjacent realms' climates, the Alasiyan Basin should've been a COLD desert -- a bit like the IRL Gobi, perhaps, complete with icy winds and an occasional snowfall in the wintertime -- until those elementals started heating up the land. And THAT supposedly didn't happen, until AFTER the Nithian Empire was falling apart! So how come the HW Nithians weren't given a temperate zone, to live in; and how come their clothes and houses -- unchanged since Mystara, or so the SoP ensures -- aren't suited for colder conditions than the HW desert's unending heat? The most likely explanation that's occurred to me, so far, is that Mystara actually went through a warm spell, between 2200 BC (when the Antalians were thriving in Norwold) and 1700 BC (when volcanism and the Broken Lands device sent temperatures into a tailspin). This warming trend could have been what kicked off the first permnanent settlements along the River Nithia -- rather like the dawn of agriculture coincided with the beginning of our current interglacial period, on Earth -- and it led them to adopt a way of life that was suited to a warmer climate than would normally be present in Ylaruam, in the absence of magical/elemental intervention. Later, as the climate steadily cooled down over the course of the 1600s BC, the Nithian civilization -- which hadn't ever coped with frigid winters, before! -- sought to stave off the chill through the ambitious development of fire-magics, covert alliances with fire elementals, and increased appeals to a specific Immortal of fire (Rathanos). Indeed, Rathanos might have previously been of limited importance to their pantheon. Once fire became the key to reversing the dreaded cooling-trend, however, Rathanos' priesthood -- along with the nascent Magian Fire Worshippers, a cult of magic-users with a similar reverence for flame -- gained much greater authority, eventually dominating all of Nithia. This not only explains why a fire-cult could be so successful in a desert culture -- who, after all, would SEEM to have far more reason to cherish water, than fire! -- but it may also account for why the Nithians launched so many colonization efforts south of their own lands (something which the IRL Egyptians never felt any need to do). The Traldar, Thothian, and Savage Coast expeditions might each have been attempts to found a new, warmer place for the Nithians to relocate to, should the plan to reverse their homeland's climate-change through fire-magics prove a failure. The plan did not fail, however: the fire elementals' intervention heated up the Alasiyan Basin again, to a temperature which the Nithians found liveable; and they would continue to do so, even after the Nithian Empire collapsed. So, does anyone else think this might work, to account for both Nithia's fire-fetish, AND its colonization efforts....? Or am I barking up the wrong tree here? *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 5 Mar 1999 23:18:01 EST From: Arminath@aol.com Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - Inhabitants of Ar How about calling them "Ar-ans" or "Ar-ens"? Sounds pretty good to me! Jim *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 05 Mar 1999 23:44:27 -0800 From: Andrew Theisen Subject: Re: [MYSTARA] - M-Orient (LONG) At 01:11 PM 3/5/99 -0500, DM wrote: > >But this wouldn't be the first time: there still are two Moldavian cultures >(Boldavia and Traladara), two Mongolian cultures (Ethengar and Jennites), Just a minor correction. The Ethengars are based on the Mongol hordes, but the Jennites are based on the Scythians. The Scythians are a sort of Slavic (eastern european) horse culture and lived in a period preceding that most commonly associated with the Mongols by some 1500 years or so (at least- don't recall the exact dates). The Scythians probably had some influence on the Mongol culture though, given their proximity (that's my theory, anyway. Not entirely sure if it's supported by documentation anywhere, though). The Scythians also probably influenced the Celtic/Gallic cultures of Europe, as well. Andrew "Cthulhudrew" Theisen *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 6 Mar 1999 19:42:24 +1100 (EST) From: "Jonathan Nolan, Barrister & Solicitor, FTIA" Subject: [MYSTARA] - more tolkienesque elf stuff (long) ELHEIMARIN AR ELAS-CWENYARIN EDAR Of the Elven Peoples and their Tongue "Undu ar alpelinor Surinen tumboras ilyen Inicaithe tironapen Gayan arne hinatan- Mearasilarin mealaste inumwe O rilhelm an lairgetar an quessen silan olwe" "Down the airy mountain Through the rushy glen We daren't go a-hunting For fear of little men- Good folk bright folk trooping all together With red cap, green coat and white owl feather" Alfheim as it is called in the Common Tongue is a place at once ancient and separate from the other centres of government of the peoples of the realms of Mystara and yet at the same time still a living vibrant hub for administration and trade. So it is that first the goldseekers of Darokin and then more erudite and spiritual souls sought the wisdom of the Elves of Alfheim and their knowledge of the past. When this attempt to learn the story of the past ages began, loremasters discovered many amazing things about the Elvish languages, not the least being the deep relationship between Elven tongues and the spoken syllables of magic. Only the Dragontongues, chief amongst them Old Wyrmish, have a longer history of use as incantations, and indeed the more romantic of the non-Elven students of the Elas-Cwenya see the whole of Elvish speech as more or less some form of magic. It is clear from what the Elves have revealed to the non-Elf loremasters that at different times in their long lives and longer history the language spoken by different groups of Elven people has been used as a political weapon and a means of separating ideologies amongst their clans. To this day, the relatively tolerant and inclusive (by Elven standards) Alfheimers have adopted Common Speech syntax, whereas Callarii and Wendarin eschew anything that smacks of non-Elven culture. The correct name in the Elves' own language for that speech is Sindariel-Cwenya, roughly translatable as "Jewel of the Tree of Life". Sindariel-Cwenya is often shortened to either Sinariel or Cwen, or in Common Speech dialects, Elven or Elfish. The speech of Alfheim is a form of true High Elven. ALFHEIM GLOSSARY High Elf Language to Common Speech Common phrases encountered in the Tome of Sinariel Records: Aengmor - - "Ironblack" - no doubt this began as a description of their stygian realm, before later simply meaning "home" for the Shadow Elves. Alevar - - from Alcarivar or Alcarivalas, both meaning "Glorious, High" - clearly little more than a title, not a name. The name of the Second King of Alfheim will probably never be definitively known now. Alfheim - - a translation and transliteration from the Tengwar name fr the Elf settlements within the Canolbarth forest. "Canolbarth" itself has several etymologies, the one favoured by the Alfheimers is "Protecting Hand" or "Hand Shield", either a reference to the acts of the founding heroes or a description of the powers and nature of the Trees of Life. As for Alfheim, it is clear enough that the ancient Nithian word Alwar, and its cognates Aelw and Alvo were used to describe the Elves of Alfheim. These words are not native to the languages they are found in and could well be nothing more than ancient Neathar attempts to pronounce the Elvish "Elas". "-Heim" in Common Speech is cognate to the -dor or -dar used by the Elf races and is itself originally of Elvish origin, as the title "heilmar" or "original home". The names used amongst Elves alone for the realm of 'Alfheim' are Elheimar, "Elfhome", Sindasienmar, "Sweet Realm of the Elves" or Andor, "Gateway Place". 'Andor' is taken to refer to Alfheim's position as a gateway for Elves and Men travelling the realms of the Known World (Erenthil's 'Leaves of the Tree: Alfenvolk' at p. 108). Arpenril - - The Red Arrow. This is an ancient title now forming the common name of an Elf Clan of Alfheim. Celedryl , cel- away from, edryl - either a contraction of Eldarin, the ancestral Elven Immortals and Heroes, or from eledaryl - ele (elf) daryl (lands). The latter is more likely making the name "[He leads] Away from Elven Lands". Possibly a reference to the breaks under Celedryls reign between different Elven clans. Chevall - - a mysterious word, referring to some form of Elven centaur-like being found in the Canolbarth and now beyond. Keilnot Erenthil suggests in his 'Leaves of the Tree: Alfenvolk' (at pp. 113-114) that the Elven love of dissembling in writings means that Chevall simply means "tall folk", a reference to the height of these beings. Orumdas Wayclearer wrote in her treatise on the Folk of the Canolbarth "Oeirnelas" that the Chevall is a protector of horses, firstborn of the race that gave the Elves their peerless war-steeds. She makes "Chevall" a cognate of the older "Cehir-Vealasir" or "Weaponless Hero-Warriors" - shapeshifters who fought in the Elven cause against both Moorkroft and the Darokin at different times. Den-Ar-Goth, Denagoth, Denargoth, Drenagodor - - realm of the Shadow Lord, literally "Darkness and Despair" or "dark land of despair". It seems the original form may well have been Drenagodor, which lost its descriptive final syllable marking it as a land or physical place and instead became called after its dominant feature - the dark misery perpetrated by its ruler the Shadow Lord. Doriath, from Dor (land) ie (belonging to) and ath (contraction of athar) - "Exalted One belonging to the Land" - a fitting name for the king. Elas - - a word used for elves, by elves and non-elves. It is formed in almost a cheeky way by contractign the root words for Elf with that for leaf or pointy-eared, -las. Erewan, from ere- lonely and (c)wan, a contraction of Cwenya - means simply "The Lonely Elves". Fenmoor, Feanmor - - ancient Elvish name for Blackmoor. Ironically it is the "mor" or "moor" that means "black" or "dark" in Elvish speech. The name is said by the loremasters to refer to the scorched field that legend speaks of as the heart of Blackmoor's greatness. Such fragmentary entries in the lorebooks are confusing to say the least. Grunalf: here for once we see Common Speech loan-words returning to their Elvish forebear tongue. Grun is a late word for green or leafy, alf as has been noted is the common designation for an elf or "alf". The original Sinariel-Cwenya designation of this clan is Laigrenelas. Rafiel, from Ra/Re The Sun and Feal, Oath given, Lol, Oath broken. Hence - Oath to the Sun given then broken, a reference to the separate destiny of the darkness-dwellers. When the Shadow Elves occupied Alfheim, those who made a new compact were more able to stride in the sun and came to be known by friend and enemy alike as Rafelir, to distinguish them from the truly accursed and evil-minded Shadow Elves who made ready to destroy the forest, known as the Lolthir. Taragin, from Tar- ruler and the root Ag or Aeg meaning chilling, frosty or cold. Hence the Ruler of the Cold, a reference to an earlier era when Elves required two Clanmasters, one for the summer months of foraging and one for the harsher and more dangerous times of infertile winter. A famous Elf named Taragin was the pre-Rafielite Guardian of Alfheim, Taragin Oakbranch. *** It is so typical of the graceful, canny and sophisticated Elf-races that their simplest and most common words and names can occupy so much effort and debate as to their provenance and meanings. Some words in the glossary below are followed by a Common Speech translation and by a further word in a Cwenya tongue. This last word is a Low Elven or Common Elvish equivalent, used colloquially by people such as commonly encountered Elven adventurers or mercenaries. Words noted with a (root) entry are roots for verbial constructions or polysyllabic Elvish utterances. For instance the verb root alac, from alacir "rushing" can be used as 'dialacoras ealmornei ohtan' - 'the warrior rushes under the cover of the elm tree branches' or in set expressions such as 'quessenalcir' or 'quessenalque' - 'the rushing of wings'. *** NUMBERS: 1 Er 2 Ut 3 Hi 4 La 5 In 6 Ma 7 Od 8 Ul 9 Lo 10 Ac 11 Te 12 Mi The numerative system is base tne for common trade and base twelve for priesthoods and wizards usually. CALENDAR All months when not described with their name are created by adding astan to the number: Erastan, Utastan, Histan ('a' dropped when a double vowel is caused), Lastan, Inastan, Mastan, Odastan, Ulastan, Lostan, Acastan, Testan, Mistan. Elves in contact with the other races often use the other races' names for the months. SPELLBOOKS Elven spellbooks frequently use poetical forms of all numeration, so that a simple entry in a human spellbook describing a third-level spell and its effects becomes a beautifully illuminated full-page song relating to the numerology and myths surrounding the spell. It is reasonably common for various cryptic usages to replace normal numbers - eplo 'after-9" for 10 for example. Additions are linked by 'cor' so for example 5 added to 6 is 'in-cor-ma-lin' or just 'incorma'. A aglos n. snowthorn agnor n. frostfire aha n. rage ai inj. alas! ai aina adjective holy ainulinde n. Music of the Spheres Ainudur collective noun, plural - The Immortals aire adjective holy aiya n. Priest Al n. Air alcar n. glory aglar alcarin adjective glorious alcarinque n. the glorious, a star aldaron n. lord of trees alac- - rushing (root) See also "alqua". "alag" in Oldest Sinariel. Almar n. Home Tree alqua n. swan alpha alta n. bright light galad ambar n. world ampa n. hook an con. for anar n. sun anor anca n. jaws carach ancalima n. great light giver andave adv. greatly ando n. gate annon andu- adjective western annu- andune n. west annun anduril n. flame of the west anfauglir n. jaws of thirst anga n. iron ang, aeng Angmar n. the Ironwood Tree, grown extensively by the Forester Elves. anna n. gift anto n. mouth carach ar connective. and , sometimes written or spoken as '-a-' arandur n. "king's servant", champion or even knight aratar n. the exalted one athar arda n. region arth are n. sunlight arpe n. spearpoint arpenya n. arrowhead, sometimes said "arpen" for arrow art n. craftwork artano n. high smith ascar adjective impetuous, rushing asta n. month plural astar astaer n. magic eastra, lasatar at- adjective double -ad atalante n. the downfallen, used usually of the lost peoples and kingdoms of the dread archipelago atan n. fathers of men plural atani dreadain aure n. daylight calan avari n. the unwilling, slave, bond-servant avathar n. the shadows B Barmorunglir n. The Constrainer (Thanatos) bathor n guard, guardian, shield beleg adjective mighty meleg belethil n. divine radiance bril adj. glittering, sparkling brilthor n. glittering torrent C cait- v. root to lie cal(a)-, cali- n. light calan calacirya n. cleft of light calim n. light calma n. lamp calar cam n. hand camlost adv. empty handed carac n. fang carch carne adjective red plural carni caran cehirsente n. warhorse plural cehirsentir; cuhorse, coohorsir cehth- gerund/n. helpless, without cel- adv. away from Cermie n. Planting Season Cerveth certa n. letter or rune plural certar certh -cil n. person cil, khil v.root to follow cirya n. cleft or ravine cirith coimas n. Elven travelling rations Aladas coire n. stirring echuir colindo n. bearer cor- n. round or circle cor coranar n. solar year (sun round) corma n. ring cor corollaire n. green mound - a hill, usually grassy, on which are often found fairie rings and so on. cul- adjective golden red curumo n. man of skill curunir D -dacil n. victor dar n. tongue (body part or meaning a language or physical sounds) den n. shadow Den n. The Shadow Den-Hirion n. The Shadow Lord denagulwath n. horror of night shadow ("night's dark terrors") -dil n. friend or lover -dore, -dor n. land or earth dor duir n. oak drus, durus, daros, dyr E ear n. sea aear earen n. great sea aearon Eargul n. Sea of Dread ehtele n. well, spring eithel Eldar n. Immortal, one of the gods or Immortals sympathetic to the Elven races. plural Eldarin or Edhel ele-, elen- n. elf elen n. star plural eleni, elenion el elerinan n. star crowned elmiriel n. elf-stone elye pronoun. even thou emerlan n shepherd (of any beast or mobile plant) emerwen n. shepherdess en- adv. again, re- -en adjective great -on end(e)-, -ende n. middle- endea n. middle enderi n. plural middle days, a calendar month as opposed to a strict measure of days Endore, Endor n. Mystara Ennor Engwar n. "the Sickly", humans enquie n. week plural enqueier entulesse n. the return envinyatar n. renewer epesse n. aftername erchamion adjective one handed ere- lonely, separate, singular eressea n. lonely isle Eru n. Old One, God Erusen n. children of the Gods - all life everywhere of whatever shape or power esse n. name et adv. out of F fal- n. foam fal- falas- n. coast falas falma n. foaming wave fana root. veil fana n. veiled plural fanar fan fanya n. white cloud fan feaen n. oath-giver fean n. field firimar n.plural mortals for- right hand direction formen n. north (right hand region) forod G gaya n. awe, dread gaeraeth adjective dreaded, dreadful also written - gereth as in Gereth Minar, "Dread Tower" goth n. despair gul n. terror, undeath gwath, wath, waith n. shadow H halla adjective tall hal- hantalle n. thanksgiving haranye n. last year of a century harma n. treasure heil n. the closest helm n. hat, cap or helmet, also skull or cavity (archaic) -her n. lord -hir Herenastar n. A Guild or College of Wizards heru n. lord hir hilde n. heir plural hildi hir- v.root to find hirilonde n. haven finder, Ranger Duinharvar hisie n. mist hith hisilome n. land of mist Hisime n. Misty Blotmath Hithuirhon hrive n. winter, rhiw huine n. gloom fuigne hwesta n. breeze hyar- adjective left hand direction hyarmen n. south keharad I iart. the e(n) -ie n. thing of, belonging to iluve n. all of something, every- ilya adjective each plural ilye, all imbe pre. between Imbeor n. Time Imbra -ime adjective -able, -y -ui -in adjective -ious, -en -en -ir adjective, numerous, many isil n. moon, lunar, moonlight ithil Isilya n. Moon Orithil Matera Iastaron asj. Sun Ixion J No naturally occurring J-words appear in pure High Elven. However, during the time of the Fall of Nithia, considerable mixing of Elves and others occurred, with the result that G and I cognates from other languages were introduced. J-words here are words truly written Gi, which is the homophone for the J- sound in Common Speech. jon -n. child gion Jor- n. leader of a warband, "awe-inspring" Gior K kar- raised up, as of a tumulus, fortress or person elevated in rank kano n. commander kemen n. earth khelek n. ice, glass heledh Khemroth n. Matter kyerme n. prayer L laire n. summer, second season of The Solar Year laer lairen n. green (colour) laigren lait- v.root to praise eglerio lalaith n. laughter lambe n. tongue naith lant v.root to fall lanta n. fall lanthir lamath n. waterfall of echoing voices lasse n. leaf plural lassi las(s) lasse-lanta n. leaf-fall, fourth season of The Solar Year laure adjective golden color laurea n. like gold plural laurie lav- v.root to lick leuca n. snake lyg -li- adjective many linaewen n. lake of birds same lind(e)- n. song linn linta adjective swift plural linte lirinen adv. in song lisse adjective sweet -lo pre. from, out of loa n. growth loende n. midyear lol n. wolfshead, oathbreaker loloth n. the common bramble; flower of treachery, so simply "treachery" lome n. shadow, gloom, night fuin lomea adjective gloomy lomelindi n. dusk-singer (as of twilight singing birds, by implication those who work in twilight) lomion n. son of twilight londe n. haven, place of safety or safekeeping lore n. dream losse n. fallen snow loss lote n. flower loth Lotesse n. Autumn Lothron luine adjective blue luin lugnor lumbule n. darkness duath lumenne n. an hour luva n. bow -lva pronoun. our -lye pronoun. thou M ma- n. hand -ma adjective made object macar n. swordsman vagor maika adjective sharp maeg mal root for gold mal- malin adjective golden mallen malta n. gold man int.pronoun. who? mar- v.root to abide -mar n. dwelling -mar or bar mar n. home marde n. hall mealas n. glossy (as of a leaf), good health melda n. friend melidilrhon meldarin pl.n. friends, company melid- n. loyalty, adj. protective men-, -men n. region of menel n. heaven, sky menel Menelmacar n. Ilsundal the Hero; Menelvagor the Wendarian hero Menelurya n. The Heavens, abode of the Old Ones / Gods Ormenel met pronoun. us two metta n. ending mettare n. last day of year mi pre. in min-,minar,... n. tower minasar (stornghold keep), baerud (prison tower) mir n. jewel mir miriel adj. jewel-like, adv. sparkling miruvore n. ambrosia of the Immortals, also mead, miruvor mor n. figurative and actual darkness Morduin n. Entropy mordunastar n. black magic Morgul-Elas n. Shadow-Elf morna adjective black mor- mornie n. darkness N -n prn I -n na- v. root to be nainie n. lament namarie intj. farewell nan n. valley nan nar root for red or hot like the sun naur Narie n. Mid-Year Norui Narquelie n. Halloween or Harvest Time Narbeleth Narsil n. smithy (red, golden and white) flames Narvinye n. After-Yule Narwain -nde n. land or region -n(n) Nenime n. Endwinter or Solmath Ninui -nil n. friend or lover nin pronoun. for me anim -nna pre. to, upon, on na noldo n. High Elf plural noldor nole n. lore, knowledge gul -nore, -nor n. land, country dor norie n. country dor nu pre. under di- numor n. west hulan nuquerna adjective reversed nwalme n. torment -nya pronoun. my O oi(o) adv. everlasting ui oiale adv. everlasting ohtar n. warrior same olwe n. owl oma n. voice omentie n. hour of meeting or(o)- adjective high, lofty ore n. heart (soul, inner mind) orne n. tree galadh ornemalin n. a kind of tree mallorn ortan- v.root to lift up, uplift osto n. fortress os(t) otso n. seven odo P palan- adv. abroad palan- palantir n. far sighted, almost exclusively used as the name for Crystal Ball items. parma n. book pel- v. root to go around pele n. fence , blockade or barrier pel pella pre. beyond pelleirlas n. hymen, and so also figurative maidenhead Pelori n.plural Mountain wall (of Darokin/Karameikos usually) Q NOTE: all qu- words are alternatively spelled with a cw- replacing the qu-. The exact fashion of how or when this substitution occurs is unclear, although Eastern Elves almost always use the qu- form and others use either to suit the style of their speech or writing. quant- v. root to fill quelie n. waning -beleth quelle n. fading firith quende n. speaker plural quendi querna adjective turned quesse n. feather quiyendi-imlhas - "it can't be helped" - exclamation or "ah well" type statement. R rama n. wing plural ramar ramba n. wall ran rauko n. demon lit. "rager" or "burner" oraug Raurond n. Energy Rarondir, Ra, Radir re n. day, sunset to sunset aura rembre n. mesh or net rem -riel n. female -riel -ril n. flame -ril (r) Ringare n. Midwinter or Yule Giritanrhon ro- adjective above- romen n. east amrun rond n. vaulted roof -rya pronoun. her S sanga n. a throng of folk, a crowd thanga -sen n.plural children senta n. child, spawn, scion sehelien n. wisdom in foreign ways shelin serke n. blood sereg Sesair n. Thought si adv. now sil root having to do with white, shining or the white ash of the hottest forge sil v. root to shine Silmar-Sinariel n. an elf crystal only Feadiel clan members could make long ago silmarien n. "a jewel of Feadiel" silme n. starlight Sinariel-Cwenya n. High-Elven speech Sinariel-Tengwar n. High-Elvish in its written form Sinariel n. Alfheim Elf speech Sinda n. an Alfheim Elf, plural sindar sindarinwa adjective belonging to or relating to Alfheim Elven singhron n. a gathering, a court thinga, thing sinome adv. in this place -sse suffix. in or inside sule n. spirit or wind gwae Sulime n. Thaw, Spring Rethe Gwaeron surinen adv. in the wind, archaically used in poetic forms as 'floating softly' T -t adjective two -ad tain n. white-coloured taniquetil n. high white peak tar- n. royalty ar -tar n. the one who tarcil n. royal one Danad tari n. queen akai, baeraenthiel tarienna adv. royally Tarion n. love that causes strife; sometimes used poetically to describe the Radiance. see Valanya tarma n. crown tasare n. willow tathar taure n. forest taur taurea adjective forested te pronoun. them tehta n. mark plural tehtar taith telco n. stem telcontar n. strider, ranger telluma n. dome plural tellumar Telmehtar n. Ilsundal the Hero, see Menelmacar tema n. series plural temar tengwa n. letter, sigil, glyph plural tengwar tiw tenna pre. until tie n. road, path plural tier -til n. peak -dil tinco n. metal able to smithed (generic) tindome n. twilight, morning uial tintal- v.root to sparkle or glitter tintalle n. "kindling-spark" gelthiniol tinwe n. spark gil tir root having to do with looking tir tirhion n. a great watch tower or towering stronghold tirhon n. searcher, lookout Tuile n. first flowering season of hedge plants, similar to fifth month Ethuil tuilere n. spring day tumbale n. deep valley imlad tumbo n. valley tum tup- v. root to cover tur n. lord tur tyelle n. grade or ranking plural tyeller U u- adv. not u- umbar n. fate undome n. twilight, evening aduial undomiel n. evenstar und(u)- adv. down ung n. slime ungwe n. spider web unotime adjective numberless, without number unque n. hollow ure n. heat Urime n. Harvest-Time Urui utmelien v. I am come, I am here, I have arrived "Ho! Laeaslas!" utuvien v. I have found -uva adv. will, indicates future V -va pre. of, made of val(i), vala n. "angelic" power - the power of a hero on the path to Immortality balan Valanya n. sexual and romantic love as a force Orbelain Valarauko n. demon of might Fiend vani- v.root to pass away vanimar n. lost home vanimelda n. lost friend vanwa adjective lost var root having to do with height varda n. the exalted Varga n. The Varga, a race of evil intelligent plants ve pre. as vealtar n. literally "measurer", more normally, oath warrior or hero. vealas vilya n. air, sky vinye adjective new, beginning wain Viresse n. third month or Astron Gwirith voron- n. steadfast W waer n. arrow war, wear, arwa war n. wanderer warg n. wolf warluo n. the cry of the wolf; a howl wen n. maiden wil n. urge, inspiration, boundless wilwarin n. butterfly wynn n. friend, as in formal ally and companion; wine, win, wyn Y -ya n. -like yanta n. bridge yassen adv. wherein Yavannie n. seventh month or Halimath Ivanneth yave n. fruit yavie n. autumn, third season of The Solar Year iavas yaviere n. autumn day yen n. 144 solar years plural yeni -yes pronoun. it han yesta n. beginning yestare n. first day of the year yulda n. draught of liquid plural yuldar yulma n. cup WENDOR GLOSSARY Green Elf Language to Common Speech alm "elm-tree", Altan "moated fortress, mountain" bae "fire, spark" [as in naked flame] beorn "man", cogn "bow" cwenda "Elf" Danas "Green-Elves, Wendor" den "high, upper" Dun-Amiraclincorion "Blackmoor, Darkness at the Rising of the Sun" dunna "black" ealc "swan" edel "Elder, High Elf" Elas-Cwenya "Leaves of the Tree" - the Elven Peoples eosren "dawn" Essuria - bastardised form of Ossiria? Or a similarly named closer kingdom? garma "wolf" gemaet "stronghold, settlement, group of dwellings" gneold "years without number" gneoldarin "the ancient ones" gnolda "one of the wise folk, Hutaakan", plural gnoldarin hrassa "precipice" hu "lowly" lasa, laes "ear" las "leaf", plural elas "leaves" Lignaerin - Shadowelves, lit "Pales" Lindon - region in eastern Alphatia formerly called Ossiria Lindorandorin "Vale of the Land of the Singers" Lorandorin "Valley of Gold (golden light)" lygn "pale" meadlhas "wisdom" mealion "friend" melidiel "forethinker, anticipator" meord "fine rain" mabdenlas "human" [literally "lacking the upper ear"] mari "rock, hard earth, clay" miriel "stone, gemstone, jewel" mirn "ore" myathriel - elfsilver, "mithril" mornel "diminished Elf, younger child, undead Elf" naenarre "darkening, covered" obhytlhon "Hin, halfling, peck" raelerin " ri "victory" Iric "Warlord" scella, sciella "shade, screen" (prob. noun) snaets "spear-head, point, gore, triangle" spariel "white, wool" spenna "cloud" swarn "perverse, obstructive, hard to deal with" uruc (plural yruc) "Orc, Beastman" Ulmornion Dun-Gastrhon "The Shadow-Lord" Utum "The First, Ixion" Wend "valley" - -------------------------------------------------------------------- * * Jonathan Nolan FTIA - International Law practice call 618 89310176 * * - -------------------------------------------------------------------- Mystara/RPG Netbooks: www.physics.adelaide.edu.au/~ksimpson/netbooks.html *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara-l' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ End of mystara-digest V1999 #116 ******************************** *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe mystara' as the body of the message.