Campaign stars a year or two before Kalak's death. Modified Black Flames, that results in Farcluun and Abalache-Re each getting info from Sielba's lab, and Farcluun nabbing Sielba's living vortex. In the ensuing battle both dragons are apparently killed, and the 'heroes' keep going on to Raam (coming from Urik with a raamish templar).
What actually happened was Farcluun trapped Abalache-Re in a time-lapse bubble, cutting her off from the outside world for an indeterminate amount of time. He escaped, and headed off to round up a huge elf horde (I decided that Farcluun is actually an Elf or Half-Elf as his name is kinda athasian elfy-like).
When the Party gets to Raam, things are kinda hectic as news of the SQ's 'death' has spread (the templars no longer receive their spells), resulting in full blown civil war. Merchants vs Nobles vs Revolutionaries vs Elves with all kinds caught between. Eventually Farcluun shows up at the head of a horde, laying siege to the city and trying to capture it and make a true elf city.
Meanwhile M'ke uses their good connection with Urik and Draj (see dune trader) to get armis from both cities to head on over and help support M'ke in taking over the city under the trade lord. Draj just wants stability in Raam while Hamanu wants a puppet state (again see dune trader and veiled alliance). Draj's army arrives first and engages the elf horde. Then the Urikites arrive.
Hamanu doesn't want to share.
It turns into a big conflict with Urikite army vs Draji army vs Farcluun's horde with raamish revolutionaries caushing trouble for all.
The elves are the fist to break away, outmatched by 3 professional armies (Raam's army wasn't destroyed like in the prism pentad). Eventually it turns into Hamanu's army supporting M'ke (with the aim of putting M'ke on top subservient to urik) versus the Draji army supporting Maraxes and the raamish "rebels" (see will and the way, veiled alliance, dune trader: basically all the liberals). Eventually Urik's army is spent, M'ke is thrown oout of the city and Maraxes is crowned Great Vizier and the new Raamish government has strong ties to Draj. Unlike in Tyr though, nothing much has changed. There's stability (ie, martial law) and people are getting fed, but Maraxes is no alruistic good guy. He wants power and aims to hold on to it.
Returning to Tyr, Agis never buys Sadira. As a result he never winds up as part of the conspiracy. Sadira, Ktandeo, Neeva and Rikus wind up enlisting the aid of Nok (with Ktandeo alive, Nok agrees to actually help and not simply provide the spear). Tithian and Agis still know something is up when Tithian's slaves escape, so they're watching for something. When the rebels strike and chase Kalak into the ziggurut, Agis and Tithian follow. In the ruckus Nok and Ktaneo are killed by Kalak, but with the timely arrival of Agis and Tithian they provide the momentum to off the would-be dragon. Tithian is crowned King, the slaves are freed, etc. Agis never develops a relationship with Sadira. Sadira claims Ktandeo's cane and Nok's orb. both of which are actually built around 2 Orbs of Kalid-Ma. A third orb is found in Kalak's treasury. She begins to fall under the sway of the consciousness of the old sorcerer-monarch's fragmented spirit.
Urik, having just lost a war with Raam/Draj, is unable to send a legion to conquer Tyr. Farcluun, however, still at the head of his elf horde (think mongols), sees Tyr as a city-state ripe for the taking.
Tyr musters the crimson legion, but fights off Farcluun's elves instead. Rikus is given the belt of renk and scourge of rkard by kled, just as normal. Having kept the heartwood spear (as nok was dead there was nobody to return it to), he gives the spear to Neeva and uses the Scourge in the final battle. Rikus is killed by Farcluun in combat (while the scourge is excellent against champs, farcluun's not a champ, so Rikus doesn't have the full advantage. neeva, with the heartwood spear, manages to drive off Farcluun, rally the legion, and Farcluun's horde disappears into the south. Neeva is given the Scourge and put in charge of Tyr's army. Instead of developing a relationship with Caelum, she instead winds up with Agis, eventually giving birth to the heir he always wanted the following year.
While Tithian and Agis work on discovering hte Dark Lens and trying to find ways to destroy the dragon, Sadira, rather than going the route of the Pristine Tower, instead tries to find the remaining Orbs of kalid-ma, likely resulting in the rebirth of the lost monarch. The dwarves of kled, while still allied to Tyr, are not as close. Tithian schemes for power, Agis tries to mediate, Neeva leads the army, and Sadira drifts closer and closer to absolute corruption.
That's about all so far. There's more, but not in any form to present at the moment. Thought it would make for an entertaining read different from 100% PrC threads.
nic
BTW- it's not just 100% PrC's- I have also posted a pretty sick psionic power on my spells, psionics, and items thread.
For a while. no one was posting PrC's- but now all of a sudden they are coming out of the woodwork (and I have had my hand in that cookie jar too :D .
Anyway...This alternitative Athas is really cool- and I am glad the Agis is alive- I always thought it would have been cooler if he was confirmed to still be alive- vs. wondering if he lived through those really angry giants!
The party successful quested to resurrect Taraskir, The Lion King.
The return of Irikos, The Left Hand of Rajaat.
Both were accidentally bonded to Vortices as a end result of my version of Dregoth Ascending and now have a small following of templars.
*I agree on the PrC thing. Waaaay to many PrC threads floating out there lately. There needs to be a few more fluff threads than crunch ones.
*I agree on the PrC thing. Waaaay to many PrC threads floating out there lately. There needs to be a few more fluff threads than crunch ones.
I'm working on my Rajaat story some more, so expect some new fluff from me soon.
As far as the alternatives of my Athas:
Kalak isn't a champion.
Most of the Pentad will happen only if the PCs want it to happen. All of the NPCs in those books will come into play once the PCs decide to go that route, however those NPCs will just be helping, they won't be the main focus.
Irikos is going to come back eventually.
No matter what the PCs do, Dregoth will probably succeed in his plans for DA (I always wanted a world with little to no divine magic). It's just a matter of the damage level which will depend on what the PCs did.
If Andropinis still gets imprissioned in the Black, he will eventually be released, but he will have a change of heart and won't be the same Andropinis we all know and love (he will probably be worse actually).
The Thri-kreen race owns it's sole dominance of power over the planet to the Zik-chil, which are just what is left of the Nature Benders, mutated into the Zik-chil by the Nature Masters as a punishment.
Most of the rest of Athas is a barren waste land, the only prominent places of inhabitance are both poles and the Crimson Savahnna that surrounds the South Pole. The North Pole I have an idea for in my head, but it hasn't been fleshed out yet.
When the Messenger crashes, it will have two Nature Masters and a Nature Bender (in disguise) aboard from the Green Age. The Nature Bender will eventually waken the remaining Benders that are found under Cleft Rock from PP III. Haven't decided the master goal for them yet.
The Order will be dominated by three seperate groups that all fight for power over the entire Order. One will think that combining magic with psionics is sacrilage and wants to work on stopping this from occuring as much as it does. The opposite side of that wants to use magic and psionics together as an ultimate force and are presently pretty close to taking over the Order temporarily. The Neutral group in the middle strives for ultimate balance. They will work with the other side to get it into power if the other has become power entrenched, or oppose both to get itself into power. This has sorta of a Jedi vs. Sith meets the Grey Council feel. I need to come up with better names for each group though that aren't so much a ripoff and cheesy.
I think that is it, or at least covers the majority of it. Eventually I want to turn Athas into a sole psionic dominant world, no arcane or divine magic, but that is down the road.
Actually there is more, but the rest I want to keep just in my head for now and not give any of those secrets away.
1) Kalid-Ma was female, not male. The whole fight between a half-transformed Kalid-Ma and Kalak/Hamanu/Borys happened, but the thing Borys and the rest fought was quasi-real like the creations of a shades spell. Thakok-An's interference with his mistress's spell caused a backlash that produced a situation like the original Ravenloft material described, only no Ravenloft. Until recently, Kalid-Ma was trapped in a demi-plane in the Black until a bunch of traveler's that were sucked into the demiplane managed to kill Thakok-An and inadvertantly free her.
2) Ur-Draxa had a sister city on the far side of the Sea of Silt, as well as numerous spies spread thoughout the Tablelands. With the destruction of Ur Draxa and the loss of their master a number of these spies, some of whom were templars, have banded together into a small but growing cult that worships the Dragon and seeks his return.
3) Andropinis, despite being trapped in the Black, has found a way to reliably grant spells to those of his templars. Only those with levels in the Shadow Templar prc can actually communicate with their king, though, and these have become the core of Andropinis's new Hidden Templarate. The Hidden Templarate, while highly secretive, is tasked with retaking control of Balic in preparation for Andropinis's self-proclaimed return.
4) Azetuk fell victim to a epic version of magic jar cast by Tec. prior to his death in the middle of FY 19. Although no one yet knows it aside from his favored templars, Tec. has returned power in Azetuk's body.
5) A new pterran village has been founded on east of the Ringing Mountains, about 20 miles SSE of Tyr.
6) The leadership of Draj's Veiled Alliance has been exterminated. New leadership has arisen, and they are suspicious of the boy-king's abilities.
7) Leadership of Balic's Veiled Alliance has changed hands, and the new leader is an agressive half-elf psychic warrior/wizard who wants to take over the city as the power behind House Wavir's throne.
8)The merchent lord of Celik was killed in FY 17, and a thri-kreen psion and his druid mate have been elected the new "first" of the city.
More to come
1) Kalid-Ma was female, not male. The whole fight between a half-transformed Kalid-Ma and Kalak/Hamanu/Borys happened, but the thing Borys and the rest fought was quasi-real like the creations of a shades spell. Thakok-An's interference with his mistress's spell caused a backlash that produced a situation like the original Ravenloft material described, only no Ravenloft. Until recently, Kalid-Ma was trapped in a demi-plane in the Black until a bunch of traveler's that were sucked into the demiplane managed to kill Thakok-An and inadvertantly free her.
Good way of doing it if you don't want to involve Ravenloft. I unfortunately *do* want to involve Ravenloft, muwhahahhahaha!
I think I am going to change Kalid-ma to female too.
actually i have tons of notes. being in korea has drawn out the writing.
ultimately sadira disappears (because of looking for the other two orbs she obsesses about). Tithian gets his grips on the dark lens and is made into a dragon and a true sorcerer-king by the grateful borys. Of course right about now is when Agis and his group (Neeva, Caelum and a few other people mostly home-brewed, including a rain cleric/shadow wizard conned by rajaat) attack the collected sorcerer-kings and free rajaat. hijinks ensue. End result: all sorcerer-kings apparently die. Andy gets trapped in the black (he escapes years later, infected with a fragment clone of rajaat's desires, and begins his own little cleansing war, leading his armies of maenads). Tec dies. Borys does too. In the end, the storm is created (a manifestation of rajaat's power). Actually, rajaat gets split in three. His power (the storm), his essence (trapped again in the hollow), and his body. His body is destroyed by Hamanu, who sucks life and transforms into the uber-dragon, diving into athas with rajaat's remains as per RaFoaDK. As for tithian, well.
In the tumult and what goes down (leading to Rajaat's essence getting put back into the hollow and his power manifesting as the cerulean storm (more a hurricane, with ur draxa at the eye), Tithian and the dark lens vanish, merging with the storm. Tithian becomes the new will to Rajaat's power, but trapped within the manifestation of the storm. He has the dark lens with him though, and plots to return to Athas. The surviving Dead Lords of Ur Draxa seize power.
The "heroes" run away from ur draxa, beliving everything is spiffy. Agis leads tyr into stability.
Hamanu's structure keps Urik strong and powerful.
Atzetuk is raised up as the boy-king and Tionica is hidden away.
Maraxes continues ruling Raam as a traditional city-state with a not-so-powerful non-sorcerer-monarch.
Gulg and Nibenay have both been conquered by the Sun Wizard (a character that DID make the trip to the Pristine Tower, and used the transformation and the Scorcher and Culer's anti-dragon sword to kill both Nibenay and Lalali-Puy).
Balic descends into trade war.
When he died, kalak's remains were stolen away by Dte Mal Payne, who had been working forever to bring him back. The Ziggurut has stored the energy kalak drained that day. All he needs to do is return in a new body, get back to Tyr, and the stored energy would elevate him fully. The body chosen is Agis. Agis begins acting more and more . . . different. Culminating in a palpatine-esque seizure of power and ultimately Kalak finishing what he started, but this time with popular support in the guise of Agis (who is destroyed, but whose legacy lives on in Neeva and their child/children).
Eventually Hamanu returns to Urik, cleansed of his draconic nature, and rules as the immortal lion of Urik (think city-based spirit of the land).
Atzetuk, in trying to fend off a Raamish invasion (maraxes made the play when word got around of so many monarchs dying), attempts to use Troll Grave Chasm to become a full-on dragon. Instead Tionica (who had been manipulating him) betrays him and instead SHE becomes a dragon, returning to Draj as the new Sorcerer-Queen.
Maraxes fumes in Raam. When Abalache-Re finally got out of her trap beneath Yaramuke she tried the Forest Maker thing in preparation for re-taking her city. Instead she is stopped by some interference and Maraxes manages to steal the power she tried to use for her transformation. While now a dragon, he is a very weak premature one and is not a true sorcerer-king.
Farcluun and his elven hordes eventually drive the order out of Dasaraches and there found his twisted elven empire. He also got his hands on the psionatrix before Pharistes did.
When Tithian gets out of the storm, he returns to Ur Draxa and deposes the dead lords as he is a dragon with the dark lens, and ur draxa is ever so enticing. Plus he's been the storm surrounding it and has gotten to know it quite well. In other words the new "Dragon of Tyr" is tithian.
Sadira finally gets all the orbs and becomes Sadira Kalid-ma, returning Kalidnay from the pocket dimension it had been trapped in and reigning as Sorcerer-Queen.
While Rajaat has been splintered, he is still dangerous, and the prison isn't perfect . . . there's need for mroe sorcerer-kings. After Hamanu's return, he remains the one in a position to lead among the new "sorcerer-kings" and turns those willing to make the life sacrifices into sorcerer-monarchs to help keep rajaat trapped (idea being "sorcerer-monarchs," by virtue of existing, help buttress the prison). While the levies aren't as much or as often, they do exist.
Oh and Daskinor, who had been trapped in a sleep-like torpor for centuries as a fix to his insanity, wakes up and goes on a crusade to impose his orwellian psionic domination over everything. his insanity is a form of mental infection from Rajaat. Kinda like what Andropinis gets. But while Andropinis turns into a mental mini-me of Rajaat and begins to lust after the same goals, Daskinor's tweaked out mind instead snapped and he instead has multiple personalities and is just very very unstable and attmepting to impose order on his own mind by imposing order on the entire known world.
Oronis might just disapear, barricade New Kurn, or be compelled into madness by a psionic infection from Daskinor. Either way, the Kurnish are out of the picture for the most part.
And Dregoth returns to the surface, and following his failed plan, Transforms the ruins of old Giustenal into a new nightmare city from whence he strikes out and does his best to re-make athas in his image.
He also makes deals with the deadlands, bringing their attention to the northern living fleshies.
Gretch learns of Dregoth's godhood spell and the effect it had on him and decides a similar epic spell just might help with his stunted development.
The kreen invade, with the first line of defense being evil Farcluun's nascent elven horde empire based at Dasaraches.
The Order, splintered almost beyond repair, waits and watches.
The githyanki incursion isn't exactly a failure, and the heretic followers of Trinth wind up on Athas, resulting in what is effectively a githyanki city-state threatening the Cresent Empire (think strangely unified Nibenay/Gulg). and Dregoth.
The whole idea of these changes was to cause change . . . only to wind up in a situation similar to before. The more things change, the more they stay the same. The bad guys keep on winning, and while some things are a little better, overall it's just the same, just with new make-up. With plenty of opportunities for adventure and horror and situations that seem like they'll make a difference but get washed away by the windborne sand and time.
nic
2) Ur-Draxa had a sister city on the far side of the Sea of Silt, as well as numerous spies spread thoughout the Tablelands. With the destruction of Ur Draxa and the loss of their master a number of these spies, some of whom were templars, have banded together into a small but growing cult that worships the Dragon and seeks his return.
Funny, in my campaign I have it that the surviving Dragon Warrior's from Ur-Draxa fled from their Iron Citadel to another citadel located on the otherside of the Cerulean Storm.
See the Obsidian Citadel on my Sundered Regions map under my signature.
The halfling stories told to Rajaat were all myths. Athas never had a Blue Age. The sun was never blue. Halflings were not the progenators of the other races. Nature-master and life-shapers never existed either.
Rajaat belived all of these tales, however. He exterminated all other pyreen during the war against the preservers and the Cleansing Wars. The Cleansing Wars were more successful than in the official version. Tari, lizard men, pterrans, ssurans and some other races were all wiped out.
I also changed the history of the Cleansing Wars a bit. Kobolds, gnomes, wemics and other creatures never existed on Athas. I replaced them with other beings who were exterminated.
None of the events of the Novels took place so Kalak is still alive along with the other sorcerer kings of the first boxed set. I think Kalak might have to die eventually to give the PCs a city to operate from without having to worry about a sorcerer king. This would have to be years of game-time into the campaign, though.
I would not use the Order as written. It would be far weaker and less important. It's goals would be for personal gain via psionics rather than a dedication to psionic purity.
Overall, I think the published adventures were too optimistic in theme. I don't picture Athasians setting out to make the world better. Brute survival would be the early goal. Later, personal enrichment and power would be the focus. I think most Athasians would be inured to a harsh, generally evil, world and would not think that changing it would be a realistic goal.
Good way of doing it if you don't want to involve Ravenloft. I unfortunately *do* want to involve Ravenloft, muwhahahhahaha!
I think I am going to change Kalid-ma to female too.
For some reason Kalid-Ma has become associated with the cover picture for Dragon #110 and Kelly Hu in the Scorpion King. Way too good to pass up
Oh and Daskinor, who had been trapped in a sleep-like torpor for centuries as a fix to his insanity, wakes up and goes on a crusade to impose his orwellian psionic domination over everything. his insanity is a form of mental infection from Rajaat.
And Dregoth returns to the surface, and following his failed plan, Transforms the ruins of old Giustenal into a new nightmare city from whence he strikes out and does his best to re-make athas in his image.
[steal] :D
Remember Vecna Lives!? Vecna sealed the Gods off of the prime material (no Gods!) and tried to subjugate Oerth (Greyhawk). Well, my players failed miserably during the final battle (all but two died out of 7). Iuz was able to slow down Vecna but not defeat him. Iuz died as well. Vecna wins!
That's right - my Dark Sun is the post-Vecna apocalypse! After he essentially made war with the entire world destroying large portions. Heroes emerged and defeated Vecna but not before most of civilization was lost. The war was followed by several thousand years of barbarism.
The canon version of Dark Sun history picks it up from there.
This is my first post after lurking for 3 years. DMed Dark Sun way back in 1992/93 when it was first released. Started playing and Dming in 1981. Yes, I am old!
Dunsel
Well my original thought was a possible melding setting with a slight leaning towards Darksun to throw some nice loops to those players familiar with Darksun.
rough ideas:
The demons invade again: the silithid on one front, Illiden and his forces on another.
With magic and demon fire emblazing Northrend from Illiden and the Lichking clashing in battles that shake the foundation of the world. The silithid marching as an unstoppable horde, consuming all before them, preforming preverse alternations on those that do not die to them in battle, creating four armed monstrousities(Thri-kreen), which are individually more cunning and dangerous than the usual silithid but still slave to the hive mind.
In a last desparate act a conclave is gathered around the lake of eternity, a final epic casting begins. The world quakes, continents reshapping as the well of eternity is destroyed for a second time. It's energies and those of the four dragon aspects being used to establish the Grey, cutting the world off from the twisting nether. Furion's, Tyrande's and the Aspects' being the first souls to join and establish the grey. . .
In a now flattened plain, single Pristine Tower of living/petrified wood all that remains of the well and the world tree.
aftermath:
Instantly cut off from arcane magic Illiden withdraws from battle. The silithid hiveminds now directionless fall into a disorganize mass that is easily pushed past a new massive cliff.
Elune is separated from the world, filtered through the grey she is still able to observe and mildly influence, dispite being no longer able to intervine or show any proof that she exists. Fading into legend she becomes a figure similar to a weaker version of 'Fate' to the people of the world who believed in her.
The energies released shake through the other planes as well. The Elemental Plane is shattered, allowing silt, rain, magma, sun to take root. . . The Emerald Dream, no longer watched over by Ysera is awashed by the Nightmare which dilutes itself in the effort, the new Dream becomes more wild, fae, dangerous. . .
Illiden free and away from demonic influence, yet still with their power within him slowly discovers psionics, fulfilling the prophecy of his now missing amber eyes by sharing a 'magic' that stems from within and also standing against(and falling to) Staghelm. . . Healer(Priests) take to this new magic with ease, already used to drawing some amount of power from within themselves. Though former arcanists also make apt students until. . .
Staghelm, having been exiled and cut off from druidic magic when Furion returned wanders the world. The whispers driving him further and further into madness. Finally settling in the swamp of his former Teldrassil he stumbles on defiler magic. Knowing even in his madness that the night elves and indeed the other 'pathetic' races would never accept this magic a plan begins to form. Cloaking himself he makes his way to the cities that have formed in the aftermath and begins to form schools of preserving magic, using teachings similar to the druids, making sure to never teach the 'true' power. Carefully gauging the races and his students he finally settles on the humans, sellecting a few among their number that show 'promise'. . . the cleansing wars begin. . .
after(cleansing wars)math:
The trolls high elves merge and form into being similar to the athasian elves.
Orcs take the themantic place of muls?
That or orcs and humans meld together (allowing the current human strain to better survive the harsh world)
The strange civilization of 'beastheaded giants' living along the vast island chain in the sea of silt, the descendents of the tauren race.
The Thri-kreen the independent evolution of the silithid.
The Naga. . . form into an empire hidden under the silt.
The Lichking, slowly awakening from dormancy becomes a Dregoth-like figure. . .
The druids who were orginally pulled into the nightmare become the 'pyreen' of the world, always half in the dream half out. The rest of the nightelven civilization become more feral, adapting the philosophy of "The Good and the Green(I can't find this article btw, can anyone provide a link?)", reverting a bit to their trollish ancestory growing 'tusks' in the form of saber teeth.
Dragon 110 is a skeleton and a unicorn next to a tree in a magical glen.
http://paizo.com/image/product/magazine_issue/dragon/110/cover_500.jpg
Meant Dungeon 110. 
http://paizo.com/image/product/magazine_issue/dungeon/110/cover_500.jpg
Eh, I guess you could use that. I was going to use it for a new female defiler NPC idea I had.
That's certainly not the way I picture Kalid-ma in human form anyways, course I had to reimage my brain since I'm now considering changing him to female, heh.
For some reason Kalid-Ma has become associated with the cover picture for [Dungeon] #110
That is the drawing of a female, its tough to associate to it a character the DS setting says is a male (i don't give a rat's ass what Ravenloft got wrong in their little forray on other prime worlds).
Of the females Champions, I don't think its Sielba because we know nothing about her appearance, also Lalali-Pui is supposed to be a forest-goddess and that pic is not looking it, so it could be Abalach-Re.
That is the drawing of a female, its tough to associate to it a character the DS setting says is a male (i don't give a rat's ass what Ravenloft got wrong in their little forray on other prime worlds).
Damn are we in a bad mood today.
The female mix up is present in Merchant House of Amketch too, just FYI.
Damn are we in a bad mood today.
The female mix up is present in Merchant House of Amketch too, just FYI.
Bad mood aside, sorry Nyt :P, Dune Traders also says the current Oba is but one of a long line of Gulg leaders, and that was a definite error from that book. A gender error like that in Merchant House of Amketch, or Irikos' orc-slaying in Books of Artifact, are but many. But you know all that.
I see its clearly an error, like many others do, while many people see it as a weird sex-change thing, I can't fathom why. Maybe trying too hard to make all inconsistencies work? Some inconsistencies are just errors.
I see its clearly an error, like many others do, while many people see it as a weird sex-change thing, I can't fathom why. Maybe trying too hard to make all inconsistencies work? Some inconsistencies are just errors.
Sure, but I was just pointing out that it's not just an RL error.
If people want to use the error to their advantage to spice up their campaigns some, more power to them. I just changed Kalid-ma's gender because I wanted another female SM around, and wasn't bringing Sielba back anytime soon.
If people want to use the error to their advantage to spice up their campaigns some, more power to them. I just changed Kalid-ma's gender because I wanted another female SM around, and wasn't bringing Sielba back anytime soon.
Ahh, that's just me: I make all my comments in the optic of officialdom, because I don't have a campaign of my own (thus can't use homebrew stuff, and not much point to making my own) that would make me want to modify certain setting details.
Less power to me. :D
That is the drawing of a female, its tough to associate to it a character the DS setting says is a male (i don't give a rat's ass what Ravenloft got wrong in their little forray on other prime worlds).
I meant just in my little mind Penn
Of the females Champions, I don't think its Sielba because we know nothing about her appearance, also Lalali-Pui is supposed to be a forest-goddess and that pic is not looking it, so it could be Abalach-Re.
In RaFoaDK Sielba is described as a redhead. Actually, I don't think the picture itself is even supposed to depict a sorcerer-queen. It's title is just "Dark Sun Witch". The caption in Dungeon 110 is what described it as a sorcerer-queen, and to the inconsistancies of DS even more
I meant just in my little mind Penn
I hear ya!
In RaFoaDK Sielba is described as a redhead. Actually, I don't think the picture itself is even supposed to depict a sorcerer-queen. It's title is just "Dark Sun Witch". The caption in Dungeon 110 is what described it as a sorcerer-queen, and to the inconsistancies of DS even more
We can't expect James Ryman to call his paintings in any Dark Sun way, just like Brom.
Saying the woman is a SK is, IMO, solely based on the room she's in (looks like a palace), the big item she has (not portable, so she's not a wizard on the run), and her look and the items she wears (its very rich, and there is lots of metal and jade, far too much for her to be anything less than a SK).
As such I'd say she is an SK, but everything we see of her is an illusion, like all SKs shroud themselves in.
Its an easy thing to change you appearance or even your gender when you are an epic level wizard. I personally have no problem with Kalid-ma being a man some of the time and a woman some of the time. Maybe he got board of being male and decided to change genders for a few hundred years and then decided, aww f--k it I'm a man. :D
Hey, nothing's to stop us from saying Rajaat chose an hermaphrodite as a Champion. The sorcerous powers of Kalid-Ma allowed him to express male or female sex at will, through illusions. A male-looking Kaild-Ma would appear as a twin of its female-looking self. It could also achieve its original hermaphrodite look at will.
That I would buy as an answer to the inconsistencies. Just saying he likes to appear male and then female for the fun of it is the kind of thing an immortal Champion gets bored with in the first hundred years. Saying he's hermaphrodite and expresses, through sorcery, the unexpressed sexual characteristcs of his body is more believable (i.e. a real-world hermaphrodite given an hologram generator could conceivably learn to like doing this, and appreciate the feeling of steping in the shoes of sexes it can never trully know or exprerience).
Hey, nothing's to stop us from saying Rajaat chose an hermaphrodite as a Champion. The sorcerous powers of Kalid-Ma allowed him to express male or female sex at will, through illusions. A male-looking Kaild-Ma would appear as a twin of its female-looking self. It could also achieve its original hermaphrodite look at will.
That I would buy as an answer to the inconsistencies. Just saying he likes to appear male and then female for the fun of it is the kind of thing an immortal Champion gets bored with in the first hundred years. Saying he's hermaphrodite and expresses, through sorcery, the unexpressed sexual characteristcs of his body is more believable (i.e. a real-world hermaphrodite given an hologram generator could conceivably learn to like doing this, and appreciate the feeling of steping in the shoes of sexes it can never trully know or exprerience).
Thats treading on Book of Vile Darkness territory if you ask me
Thats treading on Book of Vile Darkness territory if you ask me
Probably. Its sad it would fall in that category, considering albinos, dwarves and hermaphrodites are acknowledged parts of society now.
Just saying he likes to appear male and then female for the fun of it is the kind of thing an immortal Champion gets bored with in the first hundred years.
I hate to be a jacka$$, but your name-sake champion does just that in RaFoaDK. :D
I hate to be a jacka$$, but your name-sake champion does just that in RaFoaDK. :D
I don't recall that, been a while since I read up on him.
Still, we don't know if he does that every day of his life, or if he only enjoys that kind of pleasure while in the company of other Champions, a rare event.
I hate to be a jacka$$, but your name-sake champion does just that in RaFoaDK. :D
Sorry Squidfur, but the only thing Pennarin does in RaFoaDK is die a quick and aimless death at Rajaat's hand. Now if you're thinking about Hamanu, you're totally right ;)
Sorry Squidfur, but the only thing Pennarin does in RaFoaDK is die a quick and aimless death at Rajaat's hand. Now if you're thinking about Hamanu, you're totally right ;)
Hee hee
That's some good times right there, but I've got to point out that Pennarin does indeed do the cross gender thing, before rushing into a "quick and aimless death at Rajaat's hand". When Hamanu (who by the way, never involves himself with Penn's transvestite tendencies) drinks of the other Champions' blood, he is confronted with a flame haired woman. This woman, he believes at first to be Sielba, but upon drinking "her" blood it is revealed that it IS instead Pennarin - a MAN!!!
Hee hee
I seriously need to reread the cup scene.
Hee hee
When Hamanu (who by the way, never involves himself with Penn's transvestite tendencies) drinks of the other Champions' blood, he is confronted with a flame haired woman. This woman, he believes at first to be Sielba, but upon drinking "her" blood it is revealed that it IS instead Pennarin - a MAN!!!
Let me re-read that. As I recall it, Hamanu drank Sielba's cup, then drank Pennarin's (it goes into Pennarin fighting the big-eye race), then another unnamed champion. Might have got the order wrong.then to excerpt....(p185-186)
"My second goblet came from the hand of the flame-haired woman, but the name I drank was Pennarin..."
The first cup Hamanu drinks of is Sacha's.
then to excerpt....(p185-186)
"My second goblet came from the hand of the flame-haired woman, but the name I drank was Pennarin..."
"When your right, your right. And you, your always right!" :D I'd say down periscope, but we're not in a Winnabago
then to excerpt....(p185-186)
"My second goblet came from the hand of the flame-haired woman, but the name I drank was Pennarin..."
Huh. I thought your argument would have come from an exotic sentence somewhere, but this is simple to understand...
The name from the blood was Pennarin, but the cup came from Sielba, because the Champions were passing the cups around: Sacha's to Gallard, Gallard's to Hamanu, Hamanu's to Inenek, etc., until Sielba passed the cup she held to Hamanu, and that cup held the blood of Pennarin.
:surrender
