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Dark Chronicles

Post/Author/DateTime Post
#1
zombiegleemax
Oct 06, 2005 16:19:40 http://dragonlanceforums.com/forums/showthread.php?t=4487&page=6&pp=10

see page 5 for the Lich story
#2
valharic
Oct 06, 2005 16:44:35 Not following you here? They are discussing Raislin and Fistandantilus, not a lich king. What's your point of directing us to the thread? And what does it have to do with the Dark Chronicles?
#3
zombiegleemax
Oct 06, 2005 18:04:30 they will most likely give back story on Fisty, etc.

Fisty is a lich
#4
valharic
Oct 06, 2005 20:22:30 It's possible, and if so probably in the 3rd book. If you haven't seen it yet, this is what Weis stated on the DL Boards about the DC trilogy.

"Sorry we haven't been more forthcoming. I've been buried in Serenity!

Here's the subjects of the three books:

The first book will recount the never-told story of the heroes and the Hammer of Kharas.

The second book will look at Winter Night from Kitiara's and Lord Soth's viewpoint.

The third book will be the story of Raistlin taking the black robes and working for the Dark Queen in Neraka.

Margaret"
#5
brimstone
Oct 07, 2005 9:53:55
Fisty is a lich

Says who? I certainly don't think Fistandantilus is a lich. That is way to simplified an explination.

He certainly isn't a 3.5 Edition lich...
#6
cam_banks
Oct 07, 2005 11:10:22
Says who? I certainly don't think Fistandantilus is a lich. That is way to simplified an explination.

He certainly isn't a 3.5 Edition lich...

He wasn't one before the Cataclysm, at any rate. And the thing in the basement of Skullcap's not a lich, nor is it really Fistandantilus.

Cheers,
Cam
#7
zombiegleemax
Oct 07, 2005 14:56:57
He wasn't one before the Cataclysm, at any rate. And the thing in the basement of Skullcap's not a lich, nor is it really Fistandantilus.

Cheers,
Cam

Fist is a lich because he uses someone's lifeforce (Raistlin) to survive....
#8
cam_banks
Oct 07, 2005 16:12:53
Fist is a lich because he uses someone's lifeforce (Raistlin) to survive....

If that was all it took, then sure. Of course, that statement would also qualify Fistandantilus to be a wraith, shadow, devourer, vampire, succubus...

Cheers,
Cam
#9
caeruleus
Oct 07, 2005 17:48:52
If that was all it took, then sure. Of course, that statement would also qualify Fistandantilus to be a wraith, shadow, devourer, vampire, succubus...

Cheers,
Cam

Fistandatilus as a succubus... that sends shivers down my spine. (I'll leave the reason for this unstated ;))
#10
darthsylver
Oct 08, 2005 10:38:21 Alright, maybe I am just a little lost but what the heck is the "Dark Chroncles?"
#11
cam_banks
Oct 08, 2005 10:44:55
Alright, maybe I am just a little lost but what the heck is the "Dark Chroncles?"

A new trilogy being written by Tracy and Margaret that looks behind the scenes of Chronicles and covers events and plots that weren't given as much attention in the original trilogy.

Cheers,
Cam
#12
valharic
Oct 08, 2005 11:20:25
Fist is a lich because he uses someone's lifeforce (Raistlin) to survive....

I'd have to disagree with you here. Fist... isn't an undead lich as defined in the D&D rules stealing life force from someone isn't a fulliment of this monster class. Plus he used the Bloodstone to steal an apprentice's lifeforce to prolong his unnaturally long life not lichdom. He may of been quite old but not undead.
#13
brimstone
Oct 10, 2005 16:53:37
Fist is a lich because he uses someone's lifeforce (Raistlin) to survive....

No no no...that makes him a leech, not a lich. ;)
#14
zombiegleemax
Oct 10, 2005 21:34:50 What would you guys be willing to pay for a sealed Beta Booster Pack of 15 cards? You could get a mint PSA 10 or PSA 9 Power 9.
#15
zombiegleemax
Oct 10, 2005 21:36:05 But Fistandantilus is not physically alive during Chronicles
#16
zombiegleemax
Oct 10, 2005 22:53:04 I thought Fistandantalist was a Demilich? And I thought that I could find Demilich in MMII, but now I cant seem to find it anywhere.
#17
zombiegleemax
Oct 11, 2005 10:49:17 In 1st edition there was the demilich of Fisty in Skullcap, and an ancient shadow dragon there as well.
#18
caeruleus
Oct 11, 2005 13:09:05
I thought Fistandantalist was a Demilich? And I thought that I could find Demilich in MMII, but now I cant seem to find it anywhere.

The demilich is in the Epic Level Handbook.
#19
zombiegleemax
Oct 11, 2005 13:48:14 So considering that the demilich is now an epic level monster or encounter, what would Fisty be considered in 3.5?
#20
zombiegleemax
Oct 11, 2005 23:18:31
So considering that the demilich is now an epic level monster or encounter, what would Fisty be considered in 3.5?

Im not sure I understand the question.
#21
valharic
Oct 12, 2005 8:04:13
Im not sure I understand the question.

In the old DL module that was created before any of the novels were ever written...

possible spoiler....

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At the bottom of Skullcap there is a demilich of Fistandantalus. Demiliches back in 1st ed. IIRC were a weaker version of a Lich. I looked up the Demilich in the Epic level book lastnight and it is a CR 29. Many don't consider this, the old module canonical, and the 3.5 version dosen't work considering the module was for 7-9th level characters IIRC.

I would contend that this is some other special guardian that Fisty created. To have it fit the scenario.

The other part of that is with Raistlin traveling back in time and succesfully going through the portal. Fisty was never at Skullcap. Hence he never died there so there is no Lich of Fistandantalus.
#22
zombiegleemax
Oct 12, 2005 10:16:32
In the old DL module that was created before any of the novels were ever written...

.
At the bottom of Skullcap there is a demilich of Fistandantalus. Demiliches back in 1st ed. IIRC were a weaker version of a Lich. I looked up the Demilich in the Epic level book lastnight and it is a CR 29. Many don't consider this, the old module canonical, and the 3.5 version dosen't work considering the module was for 7-9th level characters IIRC.

I would contend that this is some other special guardian that Fisty created. To have it fit the scenario.

The other part of that is with Raistlin traveling back in time and succesfully going through the portal. Fisty was never at Skullcap. Hence he never died there so there is no Lich of Fistandantalus.

Ahh I see, however the DLCS(the first 3.5 campaign book relesed) refers to him as a demilich. But that does sound like a sweet adventure.
#23
brimstone
Oct 12, 2005 18:14:40
In the old DL module that was created before any of the novels were ever written...The other part of that is with Raistlin traveling back in time and succesfully going through the portal. Fisty was never at Skullcap. Hence he never died there so there is no Lich of Fistandantalus.

Well, the Towers of High Sorcery addresses this. What remains in Skullcap is what's known as a Remnant. A remnant is a spectral version of a wizard who is consumed by his own magic. It's a sort of a echo of a dead or "dead" wizard stuck on the material plane. It is far weaker than the wizard was in life, and it's not truly a ghost of said wizard either.

I say "dead" to try and justify Tracy's timeline of events in the Annotated Legends appendix. According to Tracy, Fistandantilus did not die at Skullcap, it was only thought that he did. The blast that almost killed him was so powerful it knocked him through the portal, but left a remnant of Fistandantilus on the material plane. Raistlin did not change the flow of the River of Time until after meeting Caramon in the Abyss.

So, I guess what I'm saying is...if someone went to Skullcap "now" what they would find is a remnant of Raistlin...who is really Fistandantilus anyway, so no one would really know the difference. Maybe that's why when Raistlin is in the Abyss he is himself again? Raistlin got blasted into the Abyss while what part of Fistandantilus's lifeforce he was carrying became the remnant that stayed on the material plane. Just a thought...
#24
zombiegleemax
Oct 12, 2005 20:06:02 makes sense since in the second gen and summer flame raistlin is "himself" again
#25
zombiegleemax
Oct 16, 2005 21:54:08 So did Raistlin loose all of the abilities and spells that he had as Fisty?
#26
aliothefool
Oct 17, 2005 13:48:14 That is a great way to spin it Brimstone! I really like that idea.

Treymordin, my guess would be, he still had the power, since he still was able to face the Dark Queen in the Abyss. Unless you consider that none of the power he used there was of the arcane nature, rather, he solely used his knowledge of the forces of the Abyss to defeat her.

Then again, when he emerges from the Abyss, he no longer has the power, but was that simply because he was stripped by the gods?

Sounds like a Tootsie Roll Pop question: The world may never know...
#27
zombiegleemax
Oct 17, 2005 21:01:15 looks like someone already wrote a Dark Chronicles

http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/images/1881374718/ref=dp_image_0/104-4924605-0403113?%5Fencoding=UTF8&n=507846&s=books

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
#1 zombiegleemax Oct 06, 2005 16:19:40	http://dragonlanceforums.com/forums/showthread.php?t=4487&page=6&pp=10 see page 5 for the Lich story
#2 valharic Oct 06, 2005 16:44:35	Not following you here? They are discussing Raislin and Fistandantilus, not a lich king. What's your point of directing us to the thread? And what does it have to do with the Dark Chronicles?
#3 zombiegleemax Oct 06, 2005 18:04:30	they will most likely give back story on Fisty, etc. Fisty is a lich
#4 valharic Oct 06, 2005 20:22:30	It's possible, and if so probably in the 3rd book. If you haven't seen it yet, this is what Weis stated on the DL Boards about the DC trilogy. "Sorry we haven't been more forthcoming. I've been buried in Serenity! Here's the subjects of the three books: The first book will recount the never-told story of the heroes and the Hammer of Kharas. The second book will look at Winter Night from Kitiara's and Lord Soth's viewpoint. The third book will be the story of Raistlin taking the black robes and working for the Dark Queen in Neraka. Margaret"
#5 brimstone Oct 07, 2005 9:53:55	Fisty is a lich Says who? I certainly don't think Fistandantilus is a lich. That is way to simplified an explination. He certainly isn't a 3.5 Edition lich...
#6 cam_banks Oct 07, 2005 11:10:22	Says who? I certainly don't think Fistandantilus is a lich. That is way to simplified an explination. He certainly isn't a 3.5 Edition lich... He wasn't one before the Cataclysm, at any rate. And the thing in the basement of Skullcap's not a lich, nor is it really Fistandantilus. Cheers, Cam
#7 zombiegleemax Oct 07, 2005 14:56:57	He wasn't one before the Cataclysm, at any rate. And the thing in the basement of Skullcap's not a lich, nor is it really Fistandantilus. Cheers, Cam Fist is a lich because he uses someone's lifeforce (Raistlin) to survive....
#8 cam_banks Oct 07, 2005 16:12:53	Fist is a lich because he uses someone's lifeforce (Raistlin) to survive.... If that was all it took, then sure. Of course, that statement would also qualify Fistandantilus to be a wraith, shadow, devourer, vampire, succubus... Cheers, Cam
#9 caeruleus Oct 07, 2005 17:48:52	If that was all it took, then sure. Of course, that statement would also qualify Fistandantilus to be a wraith, shadow, devourer, vampire, succubus... Cheers, Cam Fistandatilus as a succubus... that sends shivers down my spine. (I'll leave the reason for this unstated ;))
#10 darthsylver Oct 08, 2005 10:38:21	Alright, maybe I am just a little lost but what the heck is the "Dark Chroncles?"
#11 cam_banks Oct 08, 2005 10:44:55	Alright, maybe I am just a little lost but what the heck is the "Dark Chroncles?" A new trilogy being written by Tracy and Margaret that looks behind the scenes of Chronicles and covers events and plots that weren't given as much attention in the original trilogy. Cheers, Cam
#12 valharic Oct 08, 2005 11:20:25	Fist is a lich because he uses someone's lifeforce (Raistlin) to survive.... I'd have to disagree with you here. Fist... isn't an undead lich as defined in the D&D rules stealing life force from someone isn't a fulliment of this monster class. Plus he used the Bloodstone to steal an apprentice's lifeforce to prolong his unnaturally long life not lichdom. He may of been quite old but not undead.
#13 brimstone Oct 10, 2005 16:53:37	Fist is a lich because he uses someone's lifeforce (Raistlin) to survive.... No no no...that makes him a leech, not a lich. ;)
#14 zombiegleemax Oct 10, 2005 21:34:50	What would you guys be willing to pay for a sealed Beta Booster Pack of 15 cards? You could get a mint PSA 10 or PSA 9 Power 9.
#15 zombiegleemax Oct 10, 2005 21:36:05	But Fistandantilus is not physically alive during Chronicles
#16 zombiegleemax Oct 10, 2005 22:53:04	I thought Fistandantalist was a Demilich? And I thought that I could find Demilich in MMII, but now I cant seem to find it anywhere.
#17 zombiegleemax Oct 11, 2005 10:49:17	In 1st edition there was the demilich of Fisty in Skullcap, and an ancient shadow dragon there as well.
#18 caeruleus Oct 11, 2005 13:09:05	I thought Fistandantalist was a Demilich? And I thought that I could find Demilich in MMII, but now I cant seem to find it anywhere. The demilich is in the Epic Level Handbook.
#19 zombiegleemax Oct 11, 2005 13:48:14	So considering that the demilich is now an epic level monster or encounter, what would Fisty be considered in 3.5?
#20 zombiegleemax Oct 11, 2005 23:18:31	So considering that the demilich is now an epic level monster or encounter, what would Fisty be considered in 3.5? Im not sure I understand the question.
#21 valharic Oct 12, 2005 8:04:13	Im not sure I understand the question. In the old DL module that was created before any of the novels were ever written... possible spoiler.... . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . At the bottom of Skullcap there is a demilich of Fistandantalus. Demiliches back in 1st ed. IIRC were a weaker version of a Lich. I looked up the Demilich in the Epic level book lastnight and it is a CR 29. Many don't consider this, the old module canonical, and the 3.5 version dosen't work considering the module was for 7-9th level characters IIRC. I would contend that this is some other special guardian that Fisty created. To have it fit the scenario. The other part of that is with Raistlin traveling back in time and succesfully going through the portal. Fisty was never at Skullcap. Hence he never died there so there is no Lich of Fistandantalus.
#22 zombiegleemax Oct 12, 2005 10:16:32	In the old DL module that was created before any of the novels were ever written... . At the bottom of Skullcap there is a demilich of Fistandantalus. Demiliches back in 1st ed. IIRC were a weaker version of a Lich. I looked up the Demilich in the Epic level book lastnight and it is a CR 29. Many don't consider this, the old module canonical, and the 3.5 version dosen't work considering the module was for 7-9th level characters IIRC. I would contend that this is some other special guardian that Fisty created. To have it fit the scenario. The other part of that is with Raistlin traveling back in time and succesfully going through the portal. Fisty was never at Skullcap. Hence he never died there so there is no Lich of Fistandantalus. Ahh I see, however the DLCS(the first 3.5 campaign book relesed) refers to him as a demilich. But that does sound like a sweet adventure.
#23 brimstone Oct 12, 2005 18:14:40	In the old DL module that was created before any of the novels were ever written...The other part of that is with Raistlin traveling back in time and succesfully going through the portal. Fisty was never at Skullcap. Hence he never died there so there is no Lich of Fistandantalus. Well, the Towers of High Sorcery addresses this. What remains in Skullcap is what's known as a Remnant. A remnant is a spectral version of a wizard who is consumed by his own magic. It's a sort of a echo of a dead or "dead" wizard stuck on the material plane. It is far weaker than the wizard was in life, and it's not truly a ghost of said wizard either. I say "dead" to try and justify Tracy's timeline of events in the Annotated Legends appendix. According to Tracy, Fistandantilus did not die at Skullcap, it was only thought that he did. The blast that almost killed him was so powerful it knocked him through the portal, but left a remnant of Fistandantilus on the material plane. Raistlin did not change the flow of the River of Time until after meeting Caramon in the Abyss. So, I guess what I'm saying is...if someone went to Skullcap "now" what they would find is a remnant of Raistlin...who is really Fistandantilus anyway, so no one would really know the difference. Maybe that's why when Raistlin is in the Abyss he is himself again? Raistlin got blasted into the Abyss while what part of Fistandantilus's lifeforce he was carrying became the remnant that stayed on the material plane. Just a thought...
#24 zombiegleemax Oct 12, 2005 20:06:02	makes sense since in the second gen and summer flame raistlin is "himself" again
#25 zombiegleemax Oct 16, 2005 21:54:08	So did Raistlin loose all of the abilities and spells that he had as Fisty?
#26 aliothefool Oct 17, 2005 13:48:14	That is a great way to spin it Brimstone! I really like that idea. Treymordin, my guess would be, he still had the power, since he still was able to face the Dark Queen in the Abyss. Unless you consider that none of the power he used there was of the arcane nature, rather, he solely used his knowledge of the forces of the Abyss to defeat her. Then again, when he emerges from the Abyss, he no longer has the power, but was that simply because he was stripped by the gods? Sounds like a Tootsie Roll Pop question: The world may never know...
#27 zombiegleemax Oct 17, 2005 21:01:15	looks like someone already wrote a Dark Chronicles http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/images/1881374718/ref=dp_image_0/104-4924605-0403113?%5Fencoding=UTF8&n=507846&s=books