Sadly I have noticed many of the LG websites are no longer up and running.
Hope this isn't a harbinger of its slow demise, after all some Greyhawk is better then no Greyhawk at all.
Look forward to hearing from all you LG players out there.
Just curious...
Sadly I have noticed many of the LG websites are no longer up and running.
Hope this isn't a harbinger of its slow demise, after all some Greyhawk is better then no Greyhawk at all.
Look forward to hearing from all you LG players out there.
hhhmm...while many of the addresses have changed I don't think any region, aside from Sea Barons, with a page is actually inactive. At least not in case of Europe as recent GenCon Uk demonstrated, having visiting players at least from Naerie (Scandinavia), Adri (Austria/Germany), Sunndi (Benelux), Ekbir (France). Don't know if anyone from Lordship of the Isles (Spain) was there but even they seem to be putting out their first regional soon.
The one page which is dead and buried is www.living-greyhawk.com after it's functions were overtaken by WOTC's own page.
S.H, the guy from Naerie
So it seems to be doing ok in the south, though I can't compare it from previous years.
Some regional websites were hosted by living-greyhawk.com, but that domain is gone. Some of those regional websites already moved to a new webspace, some of them didn't find a new home yet.
There will be even a new region starting in 2006: Zeif. They haven't a homepage yet...
Frank Roters
Innspa/Adri Triad
Worried when I tried some of my links (old I guess) and found page not found.
Hopefully the pages will stay at the their new sites for awhile.
Btw anyone know a page that has a list of the current sites or do I have to google each one?
Thanks in advance.
Glad to hear everybody
Worried when I tried some of my links (old I guess) and found page not found.
Hopefully the pages will stay at the their new sites for awhile.
Btw anyone know a page that has a list of the current sites or do I have to google each one?
Thanks in advance.
I believe Pale has most up to date addresses: http://www.theocracyofthepale.com/gamerules/lgcs/ch10.html
S.H, the guy from Naerie
Being on the Bandit Kingdoms Triad, I can tell you that Living Greyhawk recently ran a convention in Oklahoma (BKConQueso) that seated well over 100 tables. We had an interactive that saw participation by about 120 players as well. The Bandit Kingdoms is quite alive and well. We have about 1 con a month that hosts LG games and we're still putting out modules.
Unfortunately, due to some technical difficulties, our website is inaccessible after the last webmaster has been unable to supply us with the login information. Once we do get it, our POC plans to update it. One of the best ways for us to stay in contact these days however is to use the Yahoo! groups. I believe the Living Greyhawk main group has over 1,500 members, which is a fairly large group and there are hundreds of others, for things as specific as meta-organizations to things as broad as regional and meta-regional information.
To fill you in on a few of the plots that have taken place by 595, here's a bit of a review from our area and surrounding regions. The Lesser Boneheart Cranzer was apparently in absentia for about four years and now it seems he's returned with a vengeance. In the meantime, the Bandit Kingdoms has tried its damnedest to shed the shackles of the Old One. Boss Renfus of Stoink has negotiated a treaty with Dimre, Prince Zeech of Redhand has been acting more independently, General Hok has rallied the Warfields and retaken the city of Hallorn from Lesser Boneheart Aundurach, and Lord Mortoth of Rookroost was assassinated by Graf Demmel Tadurinal, a priest of Iuz who promptly allied Rookroost with Xavendra of Groskopf; this last event was foreshadowed by an ominous mass-killing of ravens in the Peak in 592. So it's give and take.
In other regions, Furyondy has invaded the Horned Lands and puts ever-continuing pressure on the mostly-reclaimed Shield Lands to be agree to annexation. The Duchy of Tenh was laid to waste (again) this time not by barbarians, but by creatures from the ethereal plane led by the ethergauntsl however, the creatures were driven off and the Flan have returned although the Pale has already annexed much of the remaining land. Iuz has strangely been turning a blind eye to much of what goes on in his Material Plane empire, however, it was recently discovered that it was so he could concentrate on the capture of Torremor from Pazuzu, his rival, in hopes of gaining greater power.
There are also some core plots involving Rary and his quest for the Scorpion Crown. The Scarlet Brotherhood is up to their usual tricks of assination and political maneuverings. The North Kingdom has solidified their power but there has been news of dark powers manipulating events in the region from the ruins of Rauxes.
That's a brief summary without giving away any spoilers to those that might be players in the campaign.
-Theo Judd
BK Triad - Plots
More to follow in the next few days on www.onnwal.org.uk
Last week at MACE, in High Point, NC, the Fire Giant King, Brodde teleported an army of 2000 giants from neighboring Geoff into Shiboleth, the second largest city in Gran March, and proceeded to wreak havoc. Commandant Magnus Vrianian, faced with the choice of letting the city fend for itself or diverting one of his armies from the front at Gorna, personally led a group of heroes to retake the city. The 17th Battle was nigh obliterated but the counterattack was remarkably successful. The giants' escape route was cut off and King Brodde himeself was slain on the steps of the Blinding Spire of Pholtus.
Yes, there are plenty of naysayers and LG-haters on this board but believe me, the campaign is more vibrant today than it's ever been.
Good times...
Last week at MACE, in High Point, NC, the Fire Giant King, Brodde teleported an army of 2000 giants from neighboring Geoff into Shiboleth
The massed armies of Geoff , Gran March, the Yeomanry, and Keoland march on the city of Gorna for a final (?) epic battle to retake the city.
Last week at MACE, in High Point, NC, the Fire Giant King, Brodde teleported an army of 2000 giants from neighboring Geoff into Shiboleth...King Brodde himeself was slain on the steps of the Blinding Spire of Pholtus.
Glad you enjoyed But my question is WHY?
King Brodde committed suicide and threw away 2000 giants, even if he occupied Shiboleth, what does that gain the Fire Giant King, obviously he can't hold it...especially with Gorna threatened.
I enjoy a good bash fest every so often but there has to be some strategic thinking on the part of the giants after all they took the western duchies.
Giant doesn't always mean mindless stupidity and destruction.
So what was the plan...Why?
Granted I am a fossil, who still plays 2nd ed. even then I felt teleport, with its safeguards was open to abuse, why build expensive stone walls if someone can just "pop" in. This was handled through the "knowledge" clause but even that wasn't enough and I believe "on the fly" defenses appeared in the GH material, such as wards and icor drenched stones so that castles actually have some defensive purpose.
So I ask the 3rd ed crowd has Teleport become "mass teleport" or no "knowledge" restriction, if so why build defensive castles at all?
If King Brodde has a means to teleport 2000 giants at a time, forget Shiboleth, he could send an army into every capital in succession to decapitate the crowned heads of the Flanaess. That is ofcourse if he could survive the waves of assassins from every nation, and powerful organisations who would want it for themselves.
Hail Overlord King Brodde, absolute ruler of the Flanaess.
Glad you enjoyed But my question is WHY?
King Brodde committed suicide and threw away 2000 giants, even if he occupied Shiboleth, what does that gain the Fire Giant King, obviously he can't hold it...especially with Gorna threatened.
I enjoy a good bash fest every so often but there has to be some strategic thinking on the part of the giants after all they took the western duchies.
Giant doesn't always mean mindless stupidity and destruction.
So what was the plan...Why?
The nature of my post was informative rather than to generate discussion but I believe I can answer your question.
In the interactive teaser, it was implied that this was, in fact, a suicide mission brought on by some sort of past failure on the part of King Brodde and most if not all of the giant leadership present at the battle. Fire Giants are Lawful Evil and are, generally speaking of course, bound by some sort of code of honor; some more so than others, some apparently to the point that they're willing to sacrifice their lives to atone for a past dishonor. The post in which the King Brodde makes this abundantly clear is available on the Gran March Yahoo Group.
Additionally, in the giants' minds, this was far from being a pointless venture. The idea was to draw the Army of Retribution away from the front at Gorna on the eve of the assault, allowing the giants time to further fortify their position.
I apologize for not making the reasoning behind the events clear in my original posting but I wasn't aware I'd get jumped for not doing so. I've lurked on this board for many years and I should have learned by now.
(And yes, it was a ripping good bashfest!)
Happy Gaming.
On my part, a pet peeve of mine is the lack of rationale by "monsters" while some "just because I say so" DM reasoning is fine too much just throws me out of the experience into a bad lazy movie "come on" mentality. For a big event connected to a major shake up like FtA war, personally I need some sort of plausible reason behind the why and how.
Just me ;)
Thanks for the explaination, now we can get to the real fun, picking it apart.
Experts to your corners, wait for the bell :D
You'd probably want to teleport someplace hidden, otherwise you'd risk being attacked while your forces were divided.
Once 9th level spells come into play all sorts of things are possible, many of which really call into question the whole geopolitical situation of a fantasy campaign.
Once 9th level spells come into play all sorts of things are possible, many of which really call into question the whole geopolitical situation of a fantasy campaign.
Which is the reason that 9th level spells should happen very rarely and these could be adventures into themselves. Collecting two artifacts and doing a lengthy ritual for, let's say True Resurrection, would be one nice way to achieve it instead of high level guy coming over with teleportation spell and just casting it because he always has that 25000gp on his pocket.
This is also my fear that when high level LG starts, there might be temptation for Circle to allow these high level tables to have unnecessary say on what happens in the various meta-regions. When the day comes that high level LG completely screw over things in my meta-region (Oh look, we killed Reydrich/Xavener/etc.) is the day I stop doing playing and writing for Living Greyhawk.
Rant on high level campaign starts:
Look people, I know you won that race to retirement and you are powerful and all, good for you. Now could you please learn to let go of your characters at some point? Level cap does not mean that Circle is out to get you. Doing high level modules will just take resources away from the main campaign and nobody actually forced you to play majority of the modules with a single character.
Yes, they did say they would go to level 20 when the campaign started but that was 5 years ago! Things change, so now you have to stop when you reach level 16.
And after high level campaign? What's next? There will be people screaming for epic level stuff (I can bet you 100$ for you that) once first people reach level 20, even if that takes until campaign year 12 to happen.
Rant ends:
S.H, the guy from Naerie
A 17th level wizard can cast teleportation circle, a 9th level spell that would last for 170 minutes, almost 3 hours. As long as you could march 2,000 giants one by one through it in that amount of time, it's doable.
You'd probably want to teleport someplace hidden, otherwise you'd risk being attacked while your forces were divided.
Once 9th level spells come into play all sorts of things are possible, many of which really call into question the whole geopolitical situation of a fantasy campaign.
Good call on the teleportation circle. I've since talked to one of the co-authors of the BI and that was the spell the giants used to get to Shiboleth.
In my personal Greyhawk game, I assume high level spells are like nuclear weapons; people don't use them lightly for fear of attracting the attention of other high level entities. Mordenkainen and the circle for example.
In Greyhawk everyone has the twin cataclysms as an example of why a magical arms race could be a bad idea.
Good call on the teleportation circle. I've since talked to one of the co-authors of the BI and that was the spell the giants used to get to Shiboleth.
Interesting. This raises, of course, a few more questions (who was the mage involved? / where did 2000 giants manage to stay hidden till they were all assembled / etc..) but the most intriguing part IMO is what this implies for the size of the circle created by the spell
And that's why the Silent Ones are running about spoiling everyone's fun like the police at the end of Monty Python and the Holy Grail, trying to lock away all the toys in the Tower of Silence.
As well they should!
Someone needs to keep these silly Sheldomar heroes under control.
:P
Interesting. This raises, of course, a few more questions (who was the mage involved? / where did 2000 giants manage to stay hidden till they were all assembled / etc..) but the most intriguing part IMO is what this implies for the size of the circle created by the spell
The circle is 5-ft radius, big enough for a large creature, but it's not clear what would happen with a huge size creature. The spell description just says it teleports those who stand in it, so I'm guessing that limits it to one or two creatures max at a time.
If they were well disciplined and RAN through, 6 a round, it would still take over thirty mintutes to get all 2,000 across. You'd definitely want to be out of sight, or you'd just be asking for a dispel magic.
The circle is 5-ft radius, big enough for a large creature, but it's not clear what would happen with a huge size creature. The spell description just says it teleports those who stand in it, so I'm guessing that limits it to one or two creatures max at a time.
If they were well disciplined and RAN through, 6 a round, it would still take over thirty mintutes to get all 2,000 across. You'd definitely want to be out of sight, or you'd just be asking for a dispel magic.
Given most L-size humanoid creatures occupy a 10x10 ft. space, even a simple troll wouldn't "fit" completely inside.
According to the SRD: "You create a circle .. that teleports .. any creature who stands on it". Notice they say "on" and not "in". Thus, I wonder if a H-size being could use it just by putting down one foot on it.
That's the part that really intrigues me because, if it's true, then size limitation doesn't apply anymore to that spell. In short, as long as a part of your body touches it, you are teleported.
And you're right, the description implies you just have to touch it, that's why I was saying two could go in at a time, if they ran shoulder to shoulder.
Giant mage: "Oh great Jarl - I bring before you a circle of teleportation!"
Giant jarl: "Wonderful, how does it work?"
Giant mage: "Well you just have to step inside this tiny, tiny little circle..."
Giant jarl: "I'm seeing a design flaw here..."
Giant mage: "Um...yes...did I mention it was a prototype...?"
:D
P.
Last week at MACE, in High Point, NC, the Fire Giant King, Brodde teleported an army of 2000 giants from neighboring Geoff into Shiboleth, the second largest city in Gran March, and proceeded to wreak havoc. Commandant Magnus Vrianian, faced with the choice of letting the city fend for itself or diverting one of his armies from the front at Gorna, personally led a group of heroes to retake the city. The 17th Battle was nigh obliterated but the counterattack was remarkably successful. The giants' escape route was cut off and King Brodde himeself was slain on the steps of the Blinding Spire of Pholtus.
Yes, there are plenty of naysayers and LG-haters on this board but believe me, the campaign is more vibrant today than it's ever been.
Teleporting entire armis of GIANTS...
Thousands of pixies and satyrs suddenly, remarkably rousing themselves from the oytwood to lay waste to an army of giants.
God-duke owen appearing on his magical white stag and entangling a giant. ENTANGLING. A GIANT. Did the ref at that event forget that exceptionally LARGE and STRONG characters are freakin immune to entangle?
The amry of Keoland showing up and for some reason not laying claim to the newly liberated city, despite the fact that desire for increased control over Sterich and Geoff is the entire reason the giants took over in the first place?
PLEASE
"Vibrant" is not a word I'd use to describe the ever-persistent tripe that comes from the pens of the Geoff triad.
To imply that it was some sort of Deux ex Machina is a bit unfair. The BI was the culmination of literally the entire region's five-year story arc. Over fifty rounds of modules, special missions and interactives... countless thousands of posts on the online RP forums... hundreds of pages of narratives... all have been interwoven over the last five years to reach a crecendo in the last BI and the final mod of Year 5. Literally; I can think of only... well, maybe two or three regional mods over the last five years that didn't tie into the overall plot.
And for the record -- the teleporting giants was a Gran March BI*, the fey army was not drawn from the Oytwood (there are certainly not that many fey on the Prime Material there!), and as to the entangled giant -- well sometimes it's fun to have epic stuff happen in the background of an epic fight, to add drama to a situation. Greyhawk (and D&D in general) is rife with amazing situations, artifacts and events that don't neatly pigeonhole themselves into the flat, technical rules mechanics.
Steve M
* even I am a little surprised that there were 2000 present for the BI -- I expected more like 200, unless they were including the lesser giant-kin (ogres, for example) in that tally as well.
To imply that it was some sort of Deux ex Machina is a bit unfair.
I'm not implying anything, I'm flat out stating it.
A Suloise Keoish noble was made the inheritor of some old faith prophecy so that little problem of the nation being overrun by giants could be neatly forgotten in a properly celtic/gaelic inspired fashion.
Since day one, Geoff has shown their dislike of the canon and the desire to turn Geoff into something it is not. Owen is a keoish noble, a cousin of the current king (we'll just gloss over the whole incest bit...). He is not a flan king (that's what brennin means, folks). He is not the green man. He is not the marshall of the freakin seelie armies. He is a keoish lord.
The failure of keoland to capitalize on the situation is even worse, because it shows incomptence on the part of two triads, one of which I've actually been happy with about 95% of the time. The example set by sterich, being forced back into submission to the throne, having keoish nobles running roughshod around the march squabbling over territory and then the seizure and reassignment of almost 1000 sq miles of their territory to geoff (A nation which, at that point, was completely lost to the giants, it's duke in exile in Gran March!) clearly shows that Keoland has every intention of bringing the vassal states it helps liberate back under the crown's thumb. But no, not Geoff, the duchess's sister, who the triad has clearly shown hates her, shows up and humbly bows before mr and mrs treehugger duke? BAH!
You are right on one count, it was by no means sudden. Had I thought back on all the prior Geoff "development" when I commented on the liberation of gorna interactive, I would've realized that.
"The failure of keoland to capitalize on the situation is even worse"
Since getting into all this would be far too long and involved, all I'm going to say on this matter is that there is a lot of stuff going on at the LG campaign administrative level that has zero to do with the actual storylines of the regions, and that the overall campaign structure places an admittadely-artificial limit of what can and can't happen between regions. Sometimes this works great; at other times it has made glorious messes that require the regions to scramble to come up with passable storyline reasons to account for OOC decrees.
At any rate, your opinion of the various Triads and regions in question has already been clearly telegraphed as written in stone, so trying to explain things (it sounds like you may be misinformed on some issue that have happened over the last five years) would be a waste of virtual breath.
A Suloise Keoish noble was made the inheritor of some old faith prophecy so that little problem of the nation being overrun by giants could be neatly forgotten in a properly celtic/gaelic inspired fashion.
Since day one, Geoff has shown their dislike of the canon and the desire to turn Geoff into something it is not. Owen is a keoish noble, a cousin of the current king (we'll just gloss over the whole incest bit...). He is not a flan king (that's what brennin means, folks). He is not the green man. He is not the marshall of the freakin seelie armies. He is a keoish lord.
Just to play devil's advocate here, but since when did being a Suloise Keoish lord (is he pure blood?) disqualify you from being the green man or the rest of the fey stuff? Even if we assume that all Keoish are alike and wouldn't normally have anything to do with this Old Faith stuff, I'd have thought allying with a power to get your birthright back would be an admirably pragmatic Suloise/Keoish attitude.
Further, given the number of Flan in Geoff, is it really that unlikely that they wouldn't have their own titles for the Grand Duke (hence Brennin)? Or that he wouldn't use them and/or have gone a bit native? Or is it that unrealistic that they tried to portray Geoff as having a unique identity to Keoland?
And it's not as if noble cousins didn't/don't marry in the real world...
Also - given that the problem of the giants was only solved after 5 years of plot - that's hardly "forgetting" it. They dealt with it head on for 5 years and then brought the plot arc to and end. I don't know if I'd have done it quite the same way, but it's not as if they swept it under the carpet.
The failure of keoland to capitalize on the situation is even worse......But no, not Geoff, the duchess's sister, who the triad has clearly shown hates her, shows up and humbly bows before mr and mrs treehugger duke? BAH!
I read that prose piece where the regent meets the grand duke. The alternative to bowing was starting a war with Geoff (given that the two armies were facing off), which though the Keoish might have won on the field, would mean that they'd be occupying Geoff and keeping down a hostile populace (which we should all now know is not an easy thing to do - no matter how much hubris you bring to the table).
Just because Jessa made a show of (very probably insincere) respect once, doesn't mean that she's going to roll over and allow Geoff to go on its merry way. The regent seems to be a wily woman and there's many ways to skin a cat or bring an unruly vassal into line. Geoff's going to need money, trade and materials to rebuild. Keoland (provided the Marchers and the Sterish are on side) has its hand on the economic throat of Geoff. All it needs to to do is apply some gentle pressure. "Need a loan to rebuild your defences/infrastucture/economy/country, cuz? Sure - just restate your oaths of fealty and homage to the Throne of the Lion and we'll discuss the terms of repayment (in the form of service of Gyri troops under the banner of the motherland)."
While I am not a full fan of how the LG Geoff Triad has portrayed the people and culture of Geoff, in fact choosing a significantly more Keoish (not Suel) culture for them in the material I've developed, there is nothing overtly outrageous, or even more than marginally twitchy, in their presentation of Geoff and Owen.
Basically, my biggest criticism is "That's not the way I (would) have done it."
So yes, I think Owen should have been more Keoish (again, not Suel) than portrayed. But that's not overwhelming.
No, I don't think Owen is an actual cousin (one parent a sibling of a parent) of Kimbertos. I think the term refers to a general relationship, not an immediate one. They both have Rhola in their family trees.
Of course on that it should be noted the true confusion in the canon material. Sterich was founded by Keoland in combination with the ruling family of Geoff in -232 CY. Of course Geoff didn't exist until 316 CY, so that's quite a trick. More, the ruling family of Geoff changed in 504 CY. So it is even a better trick to figure out if they meant Sterich was founded with the old ruling family or the new ruling family. And of course, the original ruling family would have obviously (in my concept) have been strongly Rhola Suel, but there is nothing to indicate what the new ruling family's heritage was.
Then there is the issue of the meeting of the sisters.
If one looks into the background, one will find that Kimbertos made some rather significant promises to Owen. Personal promises, cousin to cousin, Lawful Good Ranger to close friend who had already been abandoned once, regarding help against the giants.
Just because his daughter has some lingering issues with her sister doesn't mean she can't also have enough loyalty to her father's memory to keep his promises for him.
Geoff was already back under the banner of the Lion Throne. It had been for more than three years. Jessa was merely redeeming her father's word.
Take some time, read the full body of background posts the Geoff Triad has available on their site, not to mention the ones the Keoland Triad has available in recent years, and get a better idea of what has happened. Even if it isn't the story you would have done, it is still an excellent story. And not even I'm that arrogant to refuse to acknowledge a good story just because it isn't the one I would have written.