* * * Wizards Community Thread * * * -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- Thread : old modules aquired. need help Started at 02-24-04 12:31 PM by rizzard Visit at http://forums.gleemax.com/showthread.php?t=188421 -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- [Post 1] Author : rizzard Date : 02-24-04 12:31 PM Thread Title : old modules aquired. need help hey evedry one i just scored some old school modules near mint D3. S1, C1, S3, C2, A2 there great looking , i want to run them any one got suggestions on converting the old stuff to new rules. never done it before i dont have the old rules and enjoy the new ones. i'm very familiar with the 2e rule set. :inlove: :mymy: :teach: -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- [Post 2] Author : diaglo Date : 02-24-04 01:03 PM yes they are easily adaptable to 2edADnD. do you have the Core Rules CD or the Expansion? also around 1989 or so they released a conversion document in Dragon and Dungeon magazines. see if you can find that. -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- [Post 3] Author : rizzard Date : 02-24-04 01:15 PM thats good to know but i was leaning more toward converion to 3e :behold: :behold: :behold: :behold: :behold: :behold: :behold: :behold: -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- [Post 4] Author : kgiggles Date : 02-24-04 01:59 PM Originally posted by rizzard thats good to know but i was leaning more toward converion to 3e :behold: :behold: :behold: :behold: :behold: :behold: :behold: :behold: It shouldn`t be too hard to do. In fact if you don`t want to do them yourself check out Enworld.com, they have a conversions section. I usually take a gander over there check out the module I`m going to convert and then kind of use it as a template for my own conversion. And then with some I find the conversion to my liking and just use that. As for my advice for converting stuff, there`s really no easy quick fix, but once you get a little experience it starts to become second nature. You need to really know the 3rd edition rules. Learning the differences between an orc from the ancient 1st and 2nd edition games to the 3rd edition version is no big deal. But on the other hand some of the higher level stuff is tough to convert, so you just have to do your best. One thing that you do gain from converting modules is a good understanding of 3.0+, and a very thorough examination of the module you`re about to take your PCs on. I`ve found that the couple times I have converted modules I was way more comfortable runnig them, which helped out with game flow a lot, I was more than familiar with the material and that is rewarding for your players. I almost forgot, don`t worry about not knowing 1st edition, it`s so similar to the 2nd edition. It wasn`t a drastic change, except that certain classes no longer existed (i.e. assassins, monks, etc) others changed (i.e. bard,etc.). If you get a conversion that is one you are not familiar with like a 1st edition assassin, just make him a ftr/rog or just a rogue. Good Luck!!!!:) -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- [Post 5] Author : WizzyBlackmore Date : 02-25-04 09:36 PM I don't think they convert well....better give them to me!!!:angel: :angel: -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- [Post 6] Author : Twilight_Knight Date : 02-26-04 12:52 AM You're not going to like this, but I think the best way to learn how to convert pre-3E to 3/3.5E is by trial and error. Yes there are numerous web sites that have downloadable conversions for many of the more popular adventures and you may want to consult those for reference, but I prefer the following as it worked for me... You'll find that what was a fair challenge to a party of adventurers in 2E may not be in the newer addition. I would say, first go to your local game store and procur (buy, borrow, steal, lol) a copy of "The Sunless Citadel." It is a pretty good low-level adventure and it uses goblins, hobgoblins, kobolds, lesser undead, & bugbears. It's encounters aren't overly deadly, so players will have some time to get up to speed on 3E if it's new to them. It should help you learn what is/is not a fair challenge for your group. Another way to learn is to select an old, low-level module, I recommend "Keep on the Borderlands," and modify it to fit the newer rules. Since it is introductory, if you "accidentally" kill your players, they'll be more forgiving for the death of a 1st or 2nd level character rather than a 5th or 6th. Also, it is relatively long, with many encounters with varying types of creatures. I assure you that by the time the players get to the end, you'll have a very learned idea the power relationship between 3E and previous editions. You should be able to convert with the "Pros." -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- [Post 7] Author : Hiryu Date : 02-26-04 02:50 AM Why would you buy vintage modules and then want to convert them to 3E is beyond me. I'll say you wasted your money on a good product just to turn it into crap. If it is 3E you want, you should go to the appropriate board for it. -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- [Post 8] Author : Twilight_Knight Date : 02-26-04 10:21 AM Originally posted by Hiryu Why would you buy vintage modules and then want to convert them to 3E is beyond me. I'll say you wasted your money on a good product just to turn it into crap. If it is 3E you want, you should go to the appropriate board for it. I don't understand this. Whether or not you think the mechanics of 3E is good or bad, that does not have any bearing on the quality of a module. There is a large number of basic/1E/2E modules that have excellent storylines and themes. I see no reason why it wouldn't be advantageous to use these if possible. For example, I am currently DMing a "classic" (i.e. pre-war) Greyhawk campaign and I've "recycled" old modules and converted them to the 3E format. I am very familiar with GH, but my players were groomed on FR and DL. The campaign is perhaps the best I've ever run. I base that on the involvment factor of the players. They are constantly on the "edge" of their seats and have generated some excellent solutions to the problems. For this reason, I would highly recommend the use of previous edition material. Besides, there isn't nearly the number of modules for 3E as there was for the previous editions. -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- [Post 9] Author : beavis123 Date : 02-26-04 10:23 AM Thread Title : updating I have recently updated Star Frontiers to d20. It took a while, but it's fun. Sure the rules are a little different, but the feeling is there. Old modules can be converted, and yes there is trial and error. but the feeling of those old modules are still there. the main thing is to have fun. it may take a while to convert, but you'll love it. -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- [Post 10] Author : rizzard Date : 02-26-04 11:58 AM i've already played "sunless citadel" and my players have braved several other adventures scince. it's not a waste of money, i have a collection of 1e,2e products and have played through all editions. it's just that i have never converted an adventure from one edition to another is all -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- [Post 11] Author : Wyrmbane Date : 02-26-04 08:33 PM No, I have to agree with Hiryu. Why anyone would want to convert any 1 or 2e product to 3/3.5e is beyond me. Waste of time and money. And the issue isn't over the quality of the earlier editions, it's the lack of quality of the later editions (anything after 2nd). -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- [Post 12] Author : Magespawn Date : 02-26-04 11:16 PM I myself have to agree with Hiryu and Wyrmbane :tiphat: why would you want to convert :confused: a 1st or 2nd Ed. module to 3ed, if 3ed. is such a better system:thumbsdow and has so many better things to offer. I say give the module to someone who can use it with the better gaming system :thumbsup: and go out and buy an over priced 3ed. module.:) -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- [Post 13] Author : Twilight_Knight Date : 02-27-04 01:13 AM damn double post... :mad: :headexplo: -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- [Post 14] Author : Twilight_Knight Date : 02-27-04 01:15 AM Originally posted by Magespawn I myself have to agree with Hiryu and Wyrmbane :tiphat: why would you want to convert :confused: a 1st or 2nd Ed. module to 3ed, if 3ed. is such a better system:thumbsdow and has so many better things to offer. I say give the module to someone who can use it with the better gaming system :thumbsup: and go out and buy an over priced 3ed. module.:) Again, I assert that the game system and the theme of an adventure are two completely different things. 3E has just as many problems as did any of the earlier editions, but it's easier to learn from the ground up. The d20 system in general is easier to learn than the old, sliding THAC0 tables, "golf" score armor class system, etc. That being said, I am an old gamer that goes back to the time when elves were elves and fighters were human (OD&D), so I would rather play 1/2E. Unfortunately, my players prefer 3E so I've adapted, both myself and my modules. Classics like Tomb of Horrors, Slavers, & Keep on the Borderlands can be great fun under any system. If you feel that your time is being wasted because it takes alot of time to covert to 3E then I question your dedication to the art of DMing. Sure, I would love it if WoTC would re-release ALL the original modules in 3E format, but that's not going to happen so we do with what we've got. Originally posted by Wyrmbane the issue isn't over the quality of the earlier editions, it's the lack of quality of the later editions (anything after 2nd). Even more of a reason to recycle old modules. The new modules are poorly writen and lack that certain something that made the old stuff great. -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- [Post 15] Author : Magespawn Date : 02-27-04 01:51 AM The game system can change the theme of an adventure entirely. A challenging adventure with one system becomes a hack-fest with another system. Whether a system is easier to learn or not is moot, as is the problems with earlier versions, what is easier to learn for you might be something I don't care to try based on a hyped up bunch of nothing (the "conversion" manual which turned out to be a cheesey pamphlet). What is a problem to you is not a problem to me. If your players prefer 3e, fine. I don't know anyone personally that prefers 3e, actually, I don't personally know anyone who plays 3e. What is your point? Dedication to DMing has nothing to do with willingness or ability to convert something to a system I care nothing about. Perhaps you're dedication is lacking since you're not converting 3e to 2nd? I'd prefer if they not release any modules in 3e, I'll take mine in 2e. :) I disagree with your response to Wyrmbane, it's all the more reason to bring back 2e. If it wasn't, why is everyone agreeing that 2e modules are better than the newer ones and converting them? I don't want this to digress into a 2e vs 3e battle, because it's pointless. Some people prefer Almond Joy, some like Mounds. To each his own. I have the PH and DMG for 3e, got them as soon as they came out. After reading them a few times, and working some things out, I decided I'll stick with my oldie but goodie version. IMO, the control wasn't in the hands of the DM, and that wasn't a system I wanted to play in. There were other issues I have, but it doesn't matter. I don't play it, never will. My choice, same as yours to adapt to your gamers. To get back to the question of the topic originator (which has nothing to do with which system is better or worse), 1e is almost the same as 2e. You might be able to figure out things with the "Conversion Manual", if any still survive. I've heard that there actually is a hard cover manual for 3e that provides the guidelines to convert 2e to 3e, but I've not seen it myself (haven't bothered to look either). You might have better luck asking around on one of the 3e boards. Most people here (it seems) don't play with the new rules. -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- [Post 16] Author : Twilight_Knight Date : 02-27-04 02:27 AM Originally posted by Magespawn I don't want this to digress into a 2e vs 3e battle, because it's pointless. Some people prefer Almond Joy, some like Mounds. To each his own. I have the PH and DMG for 3e, got them as soon as they came out. After reading them a few times, and working some things out, I decided I'll stick with my oldie but goodie version. I agree that 1/2E vs 3E is pointless, but since we all agree that the older modules are "better" then wouldn't it make sense to adapt them to 3E if that is your edition of choice? I'm not saying to go monster by monster and substitute. Rather take the story and customize it for your game. It would be just like generating your own adventure. but with the benefit of having the outline already created for you. Let's face it, some of the plots, themes, and encounters from 1/2E are great and should be shared with newer gamers, even if they do play 3E. We shouldn't "punish" new gamers simply because they were born fifteen or twenty years too late for the "golden age" of D&D. -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- [Post 17] Author : beavis123 Date : 02-27-04 06:46 AM Thread Title : good point take the best parts of the older modules and update them. it would fun to see new gamers handle the situatons. it would alot of fun. I am glad I am not the only one here who hasn't turned into "an old fuddy-duddy". -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- [Post 18] Author : kgiggles Date : 02-27-04 10:32 AM When I buy a module I`m not buying a system (1.0-3.0), I`m buying a good story/adventure not some stats. Who cares what you convert it to. I don`t understand why some of you are saying it`s stupid to buy old modules and update them to 3.0, what`s wrong with that?:confused: Keith -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- [Post 19] Author : rizzard Date : 02-27-04 12:32 PM thanks kgiggles. if you guys are gonna get your panties all wet over this minute and ultimately retarded discussion, then you should think of reorganizing your priorities in life. :behold: I began converting the "tomb of horrors" and it's not that hard at all so far it retains the same feeling. just a little tedious. since all the monster traps and othe statistical info are being renovated for 3e there is no real cross edition balance issues. And even if i wasn't to convert the module the typography and structural layout of the 1e modules are so bad that i would have to make pages of notes and paraphrases any way, plus i'm running a 3e campaing and none of my players are familiar with the old rules. it's easier to convert a module then to convert every ones characters take away all the feats they've earned and make them study new rules for just one or two adventures. like i said earlier i've played all editions, and have found the new rules to be the most enjoyable and streamlined version. it's what design is about learning from mistakes and making changes that work and still retain the basic qualities and aspects of the game.i love the old stuff to but i doubt i will play them again. -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- [Post 20] Author : Wyrmbane Date : 02-27-04 08:49 PM It's not a question of converting or not converting. Somewhere that got lost. If you read the posts from those of us who don't play the newer version(s), you'll see the tongue in cheek humor. Anyway, if you want to convert something, fine. If not, fine. I'd still appreciate it if you're playing the newer version(s) you stop grabbing the older modules. They're getting darn hard to find for those of us who don't play the newer verison(s). :) -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- [Post 21] Author : Edgewaters Date : 02-27-04 09:03 PM Originally posted by Wyrmbane It's not a question of converting or not converting. Somewhere that got lost. If you read the posts from those of us who don't play the newer version(s), you'll see the tongue in cheek humor. Anyway, if you want to convert something, fine. If not, fine. I'd still appreciate it if you're playing the newer version(s) you stop grabbing the older modules. They're getting darn hard to find for those of us who don't play the newer verison(s). :) Yes I have a hard time fathoming why so many of the new 3e gamers feel the need to do this. Is there something about their game that lacks character that they need to borrow it from previous editions? -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- Downloaded from Wizards Community (http://forums.gleemax.com) at 05-10-08 08:19 AM.