* * * Wizards Community Thread * * * -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- Thread : Keep on the Borderlands Started at 04-26-04 05:48 PM by James McMurray Visit at http://forums.gleemax.com/showthread.php?t=228414 -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- [Post 1] Author : James McMurray Date : 04-26-04 05:48 PM Thread Title : Keep on the Borderlands I'm about to run a 3.5 update of this adventure. I'll be making a few changes to make it meld in with the campaign a bit more, but they will primarily be NPC changes in the Keep and with the mad hermit. Any ideas on what to do to make this old classic memorable for my players (a bunch of jaded old gamers of which at least one of them is likely to have played or ran KotB back in the day)? -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- [Post 2] Author : rogueattorney Date : 04-26-04 06:35 PM Keep on the Borderland is my all time favorite module. I've run it 10+ times, and it is always a blast. My suggestions: 1. Fill in the blanks. The module essentially gives you a bare-bones setting. The whys and wherefores of its existance is left up to you. Figure out why the characters are there and what motivations they might have for going to the Caves. Give them reasons to fight the Lizard Men, to look for the Elf that got lost in the swamp, and to seek out the Mad Hermit. 2. Don't think for a minute that it's a simple hack 'n slash adventure. The various beasties in the Caves are meant to be played against each other. Re-read the sections on tribal alliances. The Keep is meant to be a place where a lot goes on. Get the characters involved in the goings on. 3. Play the monsters smart. Don't have them sitting static in their rooms waiting for the players to come and get them. When their homes are being invaded they will summon the reinforcements. They will put up a running battle. They know the caves better than the characters and will double around and get them from behind. If the characters aren't stealthy, the monsters will ambush them. The characters should never, ever feel safe in the Caves. I have no idea how the relative powers of the monsters will compare to 3e characters. In OD&D, the module was designed to be exceedingly deadly to 1-3 level characters. After losing multiple characters in the Keep, my most recent group figured out that hiring many retainers was their key to survival. Which was not an accident. The big section in the module on hiring help isn't in there just to take up space. R.A. -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- [Post 3] Author : kengar Date : 04-28-04 03:36 PM Originally posted by rogueattorney Keep on the Borderland is my all time favorite module. I've run it 10+ times, and it is always a blast. My suggestions: 1. Fill in the blanks. The module essentially gives you a bare-bones setting. The whys and wherefores of its existance is left up to you. Figure out why the characters are there and what motivations they might have for going to the Caves. Give them reasons to fight the Lizard Men, to look for the Elf that got lost in the swamp, and to seek out the Mad Hermit. 2. Don't think for a minute that it's a simple hack 'n slash adventure. The various beasties in the Caves are meant to be played against each other. Re-read the sections on tribal alliances. The Keep is meant to be a place where a lot goes on. Get the characters involved in the goings on. 3. Play the monsters smart. Don't have them sitting static in their rooms waiting for the players to come and get them. When their homes are being invaded they will summon the reinforcements. They will put up a running battle. They know the caves better than the characters and will double around and get them from behind. If the characters aren't stealthy, the monsters will ambush them. The characters should never, ever feel safe in the Caves. I have no idea how the relative powers of the monsters will compare to 3e characters. In OD&D, the module was designed to be exceedingly deadly to 1-3 level characters. After losing multiple characters in the Keep, my most recent group figured out that hiring many retainers was their key to survival. Which was not an accident. The big section in the module on hiring help isn't in there just to take up space. R.A. You've inspired me to use B2 for my "nostalgia" session I'm going to run for my brothers next month. We're all taking a trip up to Ohio for a dedication ceremony for our late grandfather, and I've convinced them (nearly ;) ) to let me run a one-shot Moldvay for them back at the hotel one PM. :D -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- [Post 4] Author : James McMurray Date : 04-28-04 05:23 PM Thanks for the input RA. I've already got some political info drummed up for the various tribes in the caves. I had to make major changes to the temple area to fit the no-religions campaign, but it looks like it'll work out. Power level looks to be about right. I'm strating the characters at 2nd level, primarily because we're restriciting ourselves to the expanded psionics handbook and many of the races have to start at an effective level of 2. That makes the various areas just as deadly as they used to be, especially if the party takes a "kick down the door, kill the monster, steal the loot" mentality. -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- [Post 5] Author : Darth_Kjeran Date : 04-30-04 12:00 AM Chello! I've been thinking about doing the same thing. One idea I had was to make the "mad hermit" a NE druid and his mountain lion a companion and not just a "pet". Homebrewed world, Greyhawk or elsewhere? -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- [Post 6] Author : James McMurray Date : 04-30-04 12:59 AM Homebrewed world. My current epic level campaign has the characters attempting to replace the gods of Greyhawk (at the gods' behest). This world is the aftermath of that game, some 150 years later. I'll be going through the old classics, after the Keep is the Slave Lords quadrilogy. I made the mad hermit a telepathic orc. He uses control object to scurry around on wooden spider legs because his clan took his legs before chasing him off. The mountain lion is dominated. If the party makes peaceful contact with him he will offer them items in exchange for destroying his tribe to the last child. He is an item creator and can sometimes be bartered with for items, so its likely they will track him down at some point. Because the campaign word is so fluid (the game that will determine its pantheon hasn't even been finished) the area the players are in is a anti-religious country. The children are tought that the gods no longer exist and that the reason so many people are psionic in the region is that a great savior god stole the power from the gods and gave it to the lesser races. I've got the leader of the Keep set up as a crime lord. The Keep is a hiding place for many wanted criminals. The players haven't decided if they will be evil or not, so I don't know if they'll end up working for him for hire or if he'll have to trick them into plying the hero role and taking out his competition for the sake of glory and good. Obviously that second option pays less. :) -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- [Post 7] Author : kengar Date : 04-30-04 03:09 PM I made the mad hermit a telepathic orc. He uses control object to scurry around on wooden spider legs because his clan took his legs before chasing him off. Great, now that image is in my head! I'm probably gonna have nightmares about that now! ;) EDIT: Here's something I never noticed before. The module mentions the possibility of the Keep havnig Magic Mouths cast near various strategic locations to shout "ALARM!" if any invisible creatures wander nearby. The thing is, in Moldvay/Mentzer Basic at least, there IS no Magic Mouth spell! ;) It's in 1e & Holmes of course, but I just found that funny. -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- [Post 8] Author : James McMurray Date : 04-30-04 03:55 PM I'm hoping that the only character the hermit reveals himself to will have nightmares. :) 3.5 psions have a version of invisibility that is targetted, if you fail your save you cannot sense the psion. IIRC 2e had it as well. It means that the hermit can have only one character (probably the one with the highes charisma) see him. I'll talk to the character via notes and have him reply out loud. :) The thing I find funny is that I don't even know who Moldvoy, Mentzer, and Holmes are. :) -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- [Post 9] Author : James McMurray Date : 05-03-04 02:44 PM Yesterday's session went great. The party egoist's boss and mentor hired them to take 12,500 gold out to meet the hermit and buy a magic item from him. They were all made to sign contracts in blood ensuring that they would not steal the money and would return with the item. The contracts had no magical power, but Nystul's Magic Aura was there in case anyone decided to Detect Magic before signing (they didn't). My group has had bad experiences with Asmodeus' son (the premiere lawyer in Hell's cadre of lawyers) and they are very afraid of contracts, so they didn't even think of breaking it. They went to visit the hermit, and he hid himself from all but one party member, who he talked with. He told them that the price had changed on the tiem, and he wanted his clan to swim in their own blood for having taken his legs (he uses control object to move around on giant wooden spider legs that he crafted himself). They agree, and twice get ambushed by bandits. The first attack the thieves try to kill everyone but get chased away. the second time they make a beeline straight for the party's mounts, including the donkey with the chest of gold strapped to it. Many bandits are killed, but some escape with the chest and the donkey. The party elects not to follow them, instead focusing on completing their mission for the Hermit. I'm not really sure why they did this, but it seems that at least one of the players had the metagamed belief that I did it just so that 2nd level characters would not have that much money. I actually did it as a side plot and figured that they would easily follow the well-laden donkey's tracks back to the bandit camp, mount an assault, and take back their money. Had they done so they would have ended the session at 3rd level instead of 200xp away. :) They instead headed for the caves of Chaos and foolishly mounted a frontal assault on are B. (one of the two Orc tribes). I've changed the race to be called Ur-Gurlock and have different appearances, but the stats are the same. Their assault almost ended in complete party wipeout. Had I not been using a Fate Point system to help make up for the lack of a party healer everyone would have been captured. Them being psions would have probably allowed them to escape from the magically inept tribe pretty easily, as they can break any shackles with a mentally created energy ray. But it didn't some to that, and they did just barely manage to kill all of the orcs (it was down to two characters at that point, one of which had been unconcious and saved himself with a Fate Point). They returned to the hermit, who again only revealed himself to one character. The hermit mind probed to ensure that all of the tribe was dead, then dropped the Dorje (psionic wand) on the ground before disappearing himself). Overall it wasa very fun session. I don't know if the party will try to track down the gold or not, if they do it won't be too hard to find out a few things (they know the dead bandit leader's name so can find out some information, including the general location of his hideout). If they go there it will be a fairly easy task to kill all of the bandits, as at least half of them will be passed out drunk. :) I've made the Keep itself a somewhat seedy area, and the bandits outside are there because their leaders were chased out of the keep for conducting "business" within its walls. The Castellan will take notice if the bandits are wiped out. Outwardly it will be to offer gratitude, but inwardly he will be somewhat upset as the bandits offer a small secondary income for him. Assuming the people who were able to do it consent to work for him from time to time he won't be too conerned, in his position there are always more ways of making money, and he will already have been given his cut of the take from the 12,500gp robbery. Thanks for the input so far folks! Any more ideas? :) -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- [Post 10] Author : James McMurray Date : 05-06-04 07:20 PM I started off by having the town's healer hire the group to take money to the Mad Hermit as payment for an item that was being rafted. The prty otok the money (and were ambushed by the bandit on the way there). They fouhgt of the bandits and met the hermit. The crazy hermit (see above for a description of the crzy orc with wooden spiderlegs) decided that money just wouldn't cut it. He instead demanded that his entire tribe be destroyed (the orcs in area B). The party agreed, and headed back out. The next evening they were attacked by the bandits again and although they fought them of, some bandits did manage to ecpe with the donkey that was carrying the money. The party didn't try to track them down (they were badly hurt and didn't want to wade through archer's arrows to try to reach the bandits). They went to the Caves of Chaos and found h cae they had been told to go to. It was a terrible fight, with the entire tribe there at once, but the party managed to win even though everyone but two characters were knockd unconcisous. They went back to the hermit, got the item, and returned it to the healer to collect their pay. They've learned a bit about the bandits and will probably go try to find them, although I've moved the camp into the northern woods to make it harder to find. I figure that the next time the party returns to the Caves area they will be met at the ntrance of the valley by a scout from the other orc tribe. They have moved into the full orc area (B and C) and want to continue their expansion. They'll hire the characters to wipe out the kobolds, but the tiny tunnels and traps of that area should make for a fun adventure. After they've done that, the remaining tribes will join together more in an effort to wipe out the orcs and their hired help. Its a bare bones idea that will change as the players interact with it. Any ideas on how to make it better from those of you who are familiar with the module? Thanks! James -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- Downloaded from Wizards Community (http://forums.gleemax.com) at 05-10-08 08:20 AM.