* * * Wizards Community Thread * * * -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- Thread : Charm Person spell querry Started at 10-19-04 01:27 PM by avenger2003 Visit at http://forums.gleemax.com/showthread.php?t=325166 -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- [Post 1] Author : avenger2003 Date : 10-19-04 01:27 PM Thread Title : Charm Person spell querry Hi all, a question came up at the table last week regarding the casting of a Charm Person. Situation: The PC Mage lurks in the shadows with the intent of casting Charm Person on the headman of a local village as he goes to his office. The man has no reason to suspect anything is wrong. The Mage waits until the man has passed him but still within range and casts. The question here is, does the target have to see the caster for a Charm spell to work? My concern is that he'll try to cast through doors as long as he saw the target enter. This question also applies to others spells such as Suggestion. Please share your thoughts on this, Thanks! -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- [Post 2] Author : Thailfi Date : 10-20-04 01:20 AM Ah! Charm Person! The most abused spell in the 1e/2e universe. First of all, no, the target need not be able to see the caster. The only requirement is that the caster needs to be able to see the target. Second of all, this spell only forces the target to view the target as a trusted friend. Would you stand by while one of your trusted friends killed another trusted friend? What would the majority of people give up to help a trusted friend? -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- [Post 3] Author : RobertFisher Date : 10-20-04 12:37 PM The caster must be able to see the victim, but the victim doesn't have to see the caster. I've always wondered whether the victim knows he's had a spell cast on him. This is how I tend to play it: If the victim observes the caster's hand-waving & incantation, the victim will know the caster cast a spell. The victim might be able to deduce what spell was cast, but it's a guess at best. (Although if the victim knows the same spell, I might give a chance of recognizing it.) If the victim fails his saving throw against a charm person, he just sort of rationalizes & dismisses the fact that the caster just cast a spell. An SEP field kind of effect. After all, why would my (now) good friend cast a spell on me? If the victim makes his saving throw...I've played it two ways. 1. The victim doesn't know he was the target of the spell unless the caster made it blatantly obvious. 2. The saving throw represents a struggle of will that the victim is conscious of. This awareness may not extend to knowing what spell was cast or who cast it, but knowing you were the target of a spell often goes hand-in-hand with other evidence. (I just saw Bob casting a spell.) -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- [Post 4] Author : avenger2003 Date : 10-20-04 01:17 PM Hmmm, you both make interesting points. I personally would figure that the Mage would have to be seen by the target, otherwise, how would he know he's a friend? Imagine casting the spell and another person walks by and benefits from the spell! I'd follow this approach as it: a) requires risk on the part of the caster (please fail that Save!) and b) this would prevent any future abuse of Charm spells. I've always felt that these spells have the most potential for abuse. But then again, how many people play an Enchanter over either a generalist or Invoker? Any comments and suggestions are very appreciated. -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- [Post 5] Author : Thailfi Date : 10-20-04 11:11 PM I would imagine that the victim would not know he is the caster's friend until they actually meet. Just like the old Philter of Love potion. The victim doesn't know they are in love until they actually see the new object of their affection. The Headman isn't going to start doing things for the mage until the mage actually comes out and asks for them and if the headman is an honorable man, he would not do anything illegal (or anything that would abuse his power) to assist his new best friend. The spell mechanics only allow for the victim to recognize that he has been influenced if he makes a saving throw or the spell wears off. I play a female elf enchantress once. I picked the wrong time to roll her up because the DM had a dungeon prepared for the new characters that focused heavily on undead. Needless to say, she didn't last long. -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- Downloaded from Wizards Community (http://forums.gleemax.com) at 05-10-08 08:16 AM.