* * * Wizards Community Thread * * * -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- Thread : for those who remember moldvay/cook and mentzger~~ Started at 12-24-05 01:46 AM by TasunkaWitko Visit at http://forums.gleemax.com/showthread.php?t=557975 -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- [Post 1] Author : TasunkaWitko Date : 12-24-05 01:46 AM Thread Title : for those who remember moldvay/cook and mentzger~~ would anyone care to make a listing as to the major game differences between these two editions, specifically as regarding basic and expert rules? thanks in advance! :cool: -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- [Post 2] Author : weasel fierce Date : 12-24-05 03:39 AM Saving throws are a bit different, with Moldvay (IIRC) having better saves. Thief skills are also higher in Moldvay, as it was not written for 36 level advancement. The main rules difference I can recall is magic user spells. In Moldvay, you automatically add new spells to your spellbook as you gain levels (equal to the number of additional spells you can memorize) but you cannot learn spells from other sources. Mentzer works as we know it from later versions. -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- [Post 3] Author : TasunkaWitko Date : 12-25-05 07:28 AM weasel - thanks for the reply. i did notice the difference re: the magic user spells, and it has always been a point of confusion for me, mostly because i ahve never really played a magic user (except as an elf). in any case, thanks again! :cool: -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- [Post 4] Author : weasel fierce Date : 01-22-06 10:18 PM Not sure if you're still subscribed to this thread, but today, I was reading over my Moldvay set, for some info on an upcoming game, and I noticed a couple of other things: In Moldvay, a thief can use any weapon. In Mentzer, he cant use two handed melee weapons. Also, the "spear vs charge" and "lance charge" abilities are traits of the weapon, that anyone can use (provided they can use the weapon). In Mentzer, they are abilities of the fighter, elf and dwarf class (halflings cant use lances, but can use the spear) Also, Moldvay covers unarmed combat (1D2 damage), which Im not sure if Mentzer ever does. -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- [Post 5] Author : TasunkaWitko Date : 01-22-06 10:45 PM weasel - thanks for the reply...yep, i am still subscribed! i've finally got the missing and ldestroyed pieces of my collection together, so i've been doing a lot of reading. it's all jumbled together now, but i remember mentzer writing about unarmed combat in either the companion or masters rules. i think it was the one where he expanded the classes out a little to more-closely match ADD. in any case, i appreciate the reply - thanks! -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- [Post 6] Author : caeruleus Date : 01-22-06 11:47 PM Also, Moldvay covers unarmed combat (1D2 damage), which Im not sure if Mentzer ever does. IIRC, Mentzer does cover unarmed combat, but it's in the Companion Set. -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- [Post 7] Author : Edgewaters Date : 01-30-06 10:43 AM In addition to some of the differences noted above, I thought I would compile a list of differences between BECM as expressed in the RC and the Moldvay edition. Many but not all of the differences are also present in Mentzer: -combat works slightly differently; in particular, movement during combat. In Moldvay, meleed combatants may only move as a Fighting Withdrawal or Retreat, in the RC, one can move up to 1/3 normal speed (ie encounter speed) and attack regardless of whether one is meleed or not. -there's no mention in Moldvay of being allowed to transfer spells from scrolls into one's spellbook, or copying spells from another's spellbook, although read magic allows one to cast spells found on scrolls and allows one to read another's spellbook (and presumably cast spells from it too - though whether it is cast like a scroll, or memorized, is not specified). Spellbooks are also different - in the RC, a caster's spellbook can contain all kinds of spells that have been picked up from scrolls or other spellbooks or research; in Moldvay, a spellbook is limited to the number of spells a caster "can know" (ie one first level spell at first level). This implies that Moldvay casters can only know a limited number of spells, and would cast spells they don't know (from another spellbook, for instance) as if they were using a scroll. In the RC it's just a matter of memorizing spells in the morning rather than "knowing" them. Also, characters in the RC appear to be able to gain spells automatically when they reach a new level after a certain point; in Moldvay, they must be taught new spells, or, after Name level, research them independantly. Another difference is that in the RC a spellcaster starts with 2 spells in his spellbook (ie read magic and something else). -there are minor differences in how some spells work (eg magic missile; in Moldvay the duration is 1 turn, implying that the missiles can be retained for that time, in the RC the duration is 1 round, implying they must be shot when cast - despite the fact the description says the missiles hover until he causes them to shoot) -The RC features rules for "partial targets". This is not the same as cover - a partial target is a target who is only exposed for part of a round, as when running past an opening for instance. -A day of rest in the RC heals 1hp, in Moldvay it heals 1d3hp. -Variable weapon damage is optional in Moldvay; if it's not used, all weapons do 1d6 damage. -Morale is used for a wider range of circumstances in the RC, for instance, it is used to check whether monsters will give pursuit to a fleeing party, or whether they continue to do so. In the RC version of combat it is first checked when a monster takes damage (even 1hp), in Moldvay it is first checked either when one monster is killed or when half the monsters are incapacitated. -Most humanoid monsters in Moldvay have a damage that is independant of weapons (eg, a gnoll in Moldvay does 2d4 damage or by weapon+1, in the RC it only has by weapon+1). -In Moldvay, all of a character's spells are memorized with a night's rest and 1 turn of studying. In the RC, they must rest and study for 1 hour. -Reversible spells can only be memorized by Chaotics in Moldvay, or by Neutrals who choose to only use reversed versions. In the RC, Lawfuls can use reversed forms and Chaotics can use the regular form, in certain circumstances. There are alot of other minor differences, or areas where the wording is more open to interpretation in one version compared to the other. -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- [Post 8] Author : Kheldren Date : 02-15-06 05:13 AM There was also re-working of the statisitc effects slightly (to charisma bonuses iirc) and opening a door went from rolling under a number to rolling and adding your stat bonus to get over a number. -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- Downloaded from Wizards Community (http://forums.gleemax.com) at 05-10-08 08:18 AM.