* * * Wizards Community Thread * * * -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- Thread : Running 1st Edition AD&D Started at 03-06-07 12:47 PM by Morgen Visit at http://forums.gleemax.com/showthread.php?t=804140 -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- [Post 1] Author : Morgen Date : 03-06-07 12:47 PM Thread Title : Running 1st Edition AD&D Hey all, I've recently taken it upon myself to get some games going in the classic AD&D rule set and I'm curious just what I should be either watching out for, or absolutely need to do before I run any given adventure. It'll be a kind of test to see exactly what we can do with the rules as none of us hae ever played with that system. Suggestions on how to run things? -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- [Post 2] Author : tenacious_kev Date : 03-06-07 05:10 PM Thread Title : Re: Running 1st Edition AD&D The 1st edition system is alot different then the d20 system. Go over the attacking and hitting system, and also the armor class system. The DM I play 1st edition has a screen that has all the rules on it, attacking chart, saves, it would be smart to print these out because you'll be using them alot. You really need the Monster attack party member chart to. Just have fun with it, and if theres no rule you can find for something, but there is in 3rd use it. Also when play, for experience we add the amount we get from the encounters, the EXP value from any magic item we find, and 1exp for every gold piece. -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- [Post 3] Author : RobertFisher Date : 03-06-07 09:56 PM Thread Title : Re: Running 1st Edition AD&D Although my I used to think... (http://robert.infogami.com/Classic_D&D:_I_used_to_think...) is written with classic D&D in mind, many of the ideas apply to AD&D as well. Likewise, On thief skills (http://robert.infogami.com/On_thief_skills_in_classic_D&D). And, while I'm at it, the index (http://robert.infogami.com/Classic_D&D) of my classic D&D & other RPG musings. When a player wants his character to try something, encourage the the players to argue why the character should succeed. Always be willing to discuss & accept input from the players when making your judgments. Let them succeed at anything without a roll if you think there isn't a significant chance of failure. Especially when they have plenty of time. If you think there is a significant chance of failure, & there isn't a rule to use, just consider the PC's ability scores, class, level, background, & current conditions & come up with a percent chance of success. Make the player roll d% against that. If there is a rule, feel free to likewise apply modifiers based the specifics of the PC & the current situation. If there is a chance of failure, give them a chance to back out once you've let them know what the chance is. (Or given them a hint at what the PC thinks the chance of success is.) Try to always give the players ample chance to decide their fate. Ideally, when the dice are rolled, if the dice are rolled, the PCs have done all they can to shift the odds in their favor & are making a calculated risk. The spot, search, & knowledge checks of 3e are seldom needed. If something is spottable, include it in your description. (Though you don't need to highlight it. You can wait until they examine it more closely to disclose details.) If the PCs search an area, they generally should find things without a roll. (Things intentionally well concealed/camoflaged--like secret doors--being the exception rather than the rule.) If a PC should know something, tell the player. Feel free to ignore weapon v. armor adjustments, weapon speeds, or other fiddly bits. Gygax himself did/does. In fact, it wouldn't be crazy to use Osric (http://www.knights-n-knaves.com/osric/) as a guide for a subset to start with. Clerics are closer to Templars or Hospitalars than clerics. Paladins are closer to Charlemagne's knights than Templars. Think of classes as really broad skills. One game may make me list spear, sword, shield, dagger, armor-proficiency, punching, kicking, &c. as separate skills on my character sheet. Another game might render the same character as just: melee-combat, armor-proficiency, & brawling. Fighter includes all that & more. & I guess my biggest bit of advice--when evaluating any game: If something seems silly to you, remember that someone (probably more than one someone) thought it was good enough to make it into print. Consider why that might be. How do you have to change your point of view to make it not seem silly? Visit Dragonsfoot (or one of the other "grognard" hang-outs online) if you need help with that. Or even here. Well, that's the advice that comes off the top of my head right now. To paraphrase someone more eloquent than myself: I didn't have time to write less. It's all based on my own experience, of course. YMMV. Good luck! -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- [Post 4] Author : Morgen Date : 03-07-07 12:19 AM Thread Title : Re: Running 1st Edition AD&D Thanks for the tips. I'm reading my DMG at the moment and hopefully should be able to get something working here in a week or two. -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- [Post 5] Author : RobertFisher Date : 03-07-07 05:25 PM Thread Title : Re: Running 1st Edition AD&D Here's another tidbit I was just reminded of while re-reading the Risus Companion. (Risus is "a universal comedy" RPG, but the Companion has a ton of stuff that, I think, will make you a better GM for any game.) A roll doesn't always have to be to determine between success & failure. Even if success will be automatic, you can call for a roll to decide the degree of success. Thanks for the tips. I'm reading my DMG at the moment and hopefully should be able to get something working here in a week or two. Let us know how it goes! -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- [Post 6] Author : Morgen Date : 03-09-07 01:48 PM Thread Title : Re: Running 1st Edition AD&D Well from reading the book it looks like I should start off the party in a small town with some ruins nearby and let them to exploring for cash and prizes. What kinds of monsters are decent against the 1st level adventurer in AD&D? Is there a CR system or anything? -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- [Post 7] Author : rogueattorney Date : 03-09-07 02:20 PM Thread Title : Re: Running 1st Edition AD&D Well from reading the book it looks like I should start off the party in a small town with some ruins nearby and let them to exploring for cash and prizes. What kinds of monsters are decent against the 1st level adventurer in AD&D? Is there a CR system or anything? There's no formal CR system, per se. Look to the 1st level Wandering Monster chart for a good indication of what monsters and in what quantity low-level adventurers should encounter. You might want to check out these fora for a little more active 1e discussion... http://www.dragonsfoot.org/forums/ http://www.knights-n-knaves.com/phpbb/index.php -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- [Post 8] Author : RobertFisher Date : 03-09-07 05:28 PM Thread Title : Re: Running 1st Edition AD&D Rogueattorney has it right. The wandering monster tables are the 1e version of CR. If you have the Monster Manual II it has tables that include monsters from the itself & the Fiend Folio. Rather than trying to customize encounters to the PCs, I try to place encounters based on location. Would that monster be there? I do try to follow the "dungeon level" concept too. An area--dungeon level or not--has a general danger level. It's a overall thing, though. Individual encounters may be more or less dangerous than the area's level, but most of the encounters should fit the level. There's so many variables, however, you never really know. What you may have thought wouldn't challenge the PCs at all might nearly kill them, & vice versa. I may also fudge based on the PCs a little bit on-the-fly. Increase the size of a weaker monster group to make them more of a challenge or decrease the size of a stronger monster group. Use 1-4 hp/HD to make a stronger monster weaker or 4-8 hp/HD to beef up a weaker one. Most importantly, I want to make sure that the players have a fair chance to avoid or flee from an encounter if things don't go well. In short, don't worry about it too much. Fudge on-the-fly as needed. Try to be fair, but don't be afraid to let them die if they're foolish. (Incidentally, I found I had to do the same when running 3e. CR, in my experience, really isn't any better than eyeballing the monster's HD & special abilities.) I also think it's a good idea to do post mortems. Especially after the PCs faced a defeat. Talk about what they could've done differently that might have changed the outcome. Edit: Also, look for old modules at second-hand bookstores. (Or check out the "where to buy" sticky thread here.) They are often quite affordable & can give you practical ideas to steal. Look for old issues of Dungeon magazine too. Edit^2: And check out Dragonsfoot for free 1e modules! Or the free WotC previous edition downloads mentioned in the "AD&D 1st edition Items - Help" thread. -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- [Post 9] Author : SamualT Barronsword Date : 03-09-07 05:46 PM Thread Title : Re: Running 1st Edition AD&D What kinds of monsters are decent against the 1st level adventurer in AD&D? From the 1st ed. Monster Manual, I'd say... Orcs (abt. 1 per PC), skeletons (abt. 1 per PC), kobolds (abt. 1.5 per PC), humans (bandits - abt. 1.5 per PC), goblins (abt. 1.5 per PC), giant rats (abt. 2 per PC), killer frogs (abt. 1 per PC), Ghoul (abt. 1 per 3 PCs), Hobgoblin (about 1 per 2 PC's), giant lizard (abt. 1 per 3 PC's), Ogre (1 per party of 4 or more), large spider (abt. 1 or 2 per encounter), stirge (abt. 1 per PC), wolf (abt. .5 per PC), zombie (abt. 1 per PC). A few simple traps, covered pits, 10 ft. deep with some spikes at the bottom, stuf like that. -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- [Post 10] Author : True_Atlantean Date : 03-13-07 07:16 AM Thread Title : Re: Running 1st Edition AD&D In many ways first edition and second edition relied on common-sense. After trying to work out some reason for CR's, I've given up. I've often thrown up hands in frustration and have finally used what always worked in previous editions - common sense. Look at the PC's, get a rough idea of what they are capable of doing and use their own track record to discern how they would probably react. Are they the sort of group that uses a recce followed by ambush or an elaborate set-up to achieve their goals? Do they prefer the stand-and-fight (or even yell-and-charge)? This will drastically alter the percieved challenge rating of any encounter. The lists provided have been great, I've taken the one from the last post and I'll use it in my next game. However, it is your game and no-one knows it better than you and the players. It is always worth experimenting because the players always have the (incredibly refreshing) habit of surprising you. The average player is an innovative soul and using simple tables to distill mathematical formulae from role-playing is always going to fall short of the mark. Have fun and let us know how it all turns out. -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- Downloaded from Wizards Community (http://forums.gleemax.com) at 05-10-08 08:21 AM.