* * * Wizards Community Thread * * * -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- Thread : Most underused creature Started at 03-19-07 05:40 PM by havard Visit at http://forums.gleemax.com/showthread.php?t=812308 -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- [Post 1] Author : havard Date : 03-19-07 05:40 PM Thread Title : Most underused creature What is the least used Mystaran creature? Håvard -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- [Post 2] Author : tjedge1 Date : 03-19-07 05:52 PM Thread Title : Re: Most underused creature Wow. That is a really tough one. I think the Magen are. I never hear anybody ever using them and I haven't seen a module use them either. But they really are pretty cool. I even thought about converting to the Marvel Superheroes RPG as a villian group. But still nobody ever uses them. Or are they just not very Mystaran. Other than that, maybe the Pachyderm thing. I don't have my books on me right now, but it's the elephant guy. -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- [Post 3] Author : Traianus Decius Aureus Date : 03-19-07 05:53 PM Thread Title : Re: Most underused creature The Bubble. Maybe I'll create a pseudo-natural fiendish bubble that may make the life of some 3rd lvl party mildly difficult. :gel: -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- [Post 4] Author : Cthulhudrew Date : 03-19-07 07:03 PM Thread Title : Re: Most underused creature I was going to say the Decapus, so it's kind of funny that Traianus mentions another Silver Princess creature. Got to agree with Tjedge, though- the magen are awesome. I love those guys. Have a long term story in mind for a group of magen that I've been working with for years- I'd actually started doing a comic with them (had one page of it drawn and inked), and wasn't quite satisfied with it, but I've worked on the story for ages now. -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- [Post 5] Author : Shane Date : 03-19-07 07:31 PM Thread Title : Re: Most underused creature Ooh, Cthulhudrew, would you scan and post the first page of the Magen comic, even if you're not satisfied with it? Is the story set in a specific place on Mystara? Travis -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- [Post 6] Author : Shane Date : 03-19-07 07:44 PM Thread Title : Re: Most underused creature As far as most underused creature...I say the phygorax. Undead fish (and contagious ones at that) are seldom seen. I imagine the transformation of a party member into a phygorax might look kinda funny. Travis -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- [Post 7] Author : stanles Date : 03-19-07 08:13 PM Thread Title : Re: Most underused creature Wow. That is a really tough one. I think the Magen are. I never hear anybody ever using them and I haven't seen a module use them either. apart from Castle Amber? -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- [Post 8] Author : Cthulhudrew Date : 03-19-07 09:28 PM Thread Title : Re: Most underused creature Ooh, Cthulhudrew, would you scan and post the first page of the Magen comic, even if you're not satisfied with it? I'd like that, but I don't have a scanner. That was actually the original goal- to put the series online. I keep hoping to get myself a scanner/printer but other necessities always seem to take precedence. My neighbor has a scanner, though, I'll see if I can borrow his. Is the story set in a specific place on Mystara? Yes. In Glantri. apart from Castle Amber? Also in Mark of Amber. -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- [Post 9] Author : tjedge1 Date : 03-19-07 09:37 PM Thread Title : Re: Most underused creature apart from Castle Amber? You know I keep hearing about this module, and it seems to be the most popular I have never actually seen. Time to go to E-Bay and see if I can find it. EDIT: Ok, now that I've seen it I recognize it, but I never owned it. Time to make a purchase. A must have since everyone always mentions it. -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- [Post 10] Author : stanles Date : 03-19-07 10:07 PM Thread Title : Re: Most underused creature You know I keep hearing about this module, and it seems to be the most popular I have never actually seen. Time to go to E-Bay and see if I can find it. EDIT: Ok, now that I've seen it I recognize it, but I never owned it. Time to make a purchase. A must have since everyone always mentions it. it definitely a classic -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- [Post 11] Author : JTrithen Date : 03-19-07 10:42 PM Thread Title : Re: Most underused creature X2, Castle Amber -- definitely a nostalgiac module that I like. My different players never got past the indoor garden, though, out of the 3 or so times I DM'd it. And most of my players, who are not big RPG buffs anyway in general, equate the name of the module with distate. (Sorry, don't mean to hijack the thread... :) ).... 'Can't think of an underused monster, off-hand; the phygorax sounds good, though. I guess it would help round out encounters with underwaters zombies and/or velya, if I ever ran an undersea adventure. Oh, wait, the stalwart comes to mind, though I don't particularly like the creature as a race -- quite one-dimensional. I used it in an adventure once, and I think I even had a player use it as a PC, using the PC-series rules. -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- [Post 12] Author : Arcanda Date : 03-20-07 03:56 AM Thread Title : Re: Most underused creature In my Mystara there is a town in the middle of the dark wood of Blackheart (Alphatia). Blackheart is a kingdom of mad wizards, searching for impossible magic. At best, there are no towns, only wizard towers here and therem in the middle of nowhere. There is a wizard that started a long time ago to build his own servants, a couple of magens. After that he created more and more of them. Now they are so much that they have build a town around the wizard's tower, like middle age towns build around a stronghold. The town is called Laujarita, is encircled in a strong wall, and an ancient triangle of towers surround its walls to defend against wood monsters. In topic, now, there are a lot of monsters from Mystara Monstrous Compedium Appendix that I never used, such as the Ash Crawler (too hard to find a place for it, its terrain is too strange!). -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- [Post 13] Author : Agathokles Date : 03-20-07 09:53 AM Thread Title : Re: Most underused creature In topic, now, there are a lot of monsters from Mystara Monstrous Compedium Appendix that I never used, such as the Ash Crawler (too hard to find a place for it, its terrain is too strange!). Indeed the Ash Crawler is pretty underused... did it ever appear somewhere else? -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- [Post 14] Author : Cthulhudrew Date : 03-20-07 10:47 AM Thread Title : Re: Most underused creature Indeed the Ash Crawler is pretty underused... did it ever appear somewhere else? I think it first appeared in CM5: Mystery of the Snow Pearl. -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- [Post 15] Author : LoZompatore Date : 03-20-07 11:31 AM Thread Title : Re: Most underused creature Speaking about famous subraces, I'd say that blue and green dragons are not very famous throughout the whole canon. White, black, red and (of course) gold dragons appear in many adventure modules and also in some Mystaran novels. But blue and green dragons are quite underused. -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- [Post 16] Author : Agathokles Date : 03-20-07 01:08 PM Thread Title : Re: Most underused creature Speaking about famous subraces, I'd say that blue and green dragons are not very famous throughout the whole canon. White, black, red and (of course) gold dragons appear in many adventure modules and also in some Mystaran novels. But blue and green dragons are quite underused. There are at least two blues in Mystaran adventures: Brulefer, of X11 fame, and Dominagon, from Five Coins for a Kingdom. There's also the green Verdilith in the Penhaligon trilogy. A list of known dragons can be found here: http://pandius.com/dragons2.html -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- [Post 17] Author : Arcanda Date : 03-20-07 01:57 PM Thread Title : Re: Most underused creature There are at least two blues in Mystaran adventures: Brulefer, of X11 fame, and Dominagon, from Five Coins for a Kingdom. There's also the green Verdilith in the Penhaligon trilogy. A list of known dragons can be found here: http://pandius.com/dragons2.htmlI also remember a blue in B4 Lost City and in CM2 there is one called Korbundar. P.S.: I think magens are easier to build than golems and should be extremely more common than golems! -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- [Post 18] Author : Agathokles Date : 03-20-07 02:43 PM Thread Title : Re: Most underused creature I also remember a blue in B4 Lost City and in CM2 there is one called Korbundar. Yes, though the one in B4 has a big problem: it can't get out of the room ;) P.S.: I think magens are easier to build than golems and should be extremely more common than golems! OTOH, their building process is a secret of the Ambreville family. However, there are many construct types that are more common than golems. Gargoyles and Living Statues are but two examples. -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- [Post 19] Author : NPC Dave Date : 03-20-07 03:45 PM Thread Title : Re: Most underused creature Magen also appeared in either B11 King's Festival or its sequel B12. I can't remember exactly which one. I used them to good effect in an early campaign of those two modules, although the players were new to D&D so everything was new to them, even the green slime. I think they also appeared in Dungeon Magazine issue #53, the BECMI D&D adventure where you had to help a woman recapture her castle. That one featured the only use of feywing I have ever seen(from the Halfling Gazeteer). I want to use deep glaraunts, but haven't had an opportunity. I have been debating whether to substiute deep glaraunts for kuo-toa in adapting the 2E Night Below set. But while they share insanity, they aren't fish-like and are more powerful than kuo-toa. I have used the seergar(both these and the glaraunts are also from the Halfling gazeteer). What was that shapeshifter race which could take the shape of 13 different types of species per day? They first appeared in the Masters box set, only showed up one of the Master M modules. I got to use one of those guys as the right-hand man to a campaign villain. Using those guys really throws veteran players for a loop, by the end they learned what the guy could do, but at that point they decided he was too dangerous to anger. As one of my players put it, "What if he takes the shape of an insect and flies into my room where I am sleeping, lands on the ceiling above me, and then changes into a whale?" Never used more than a fraction of the creatures from the Mystara Monster Compendium, but I do use the book as a good resource. Has anyone used a huptzeen? -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- [Post 20] Author : Agathokles Date : 03-20-07 03:59 PM Thread Title : Re: Most underused creature Magen also appeared in either B11 King's Festival or its sequel B12. Probably B12. B11 is a short module involving just an orc tribe, an evil priest and a few zombies, IIRC. What was that shapeshifter race which could take the shape of 13 different types of species per day? They first appeared in the Masters box set, only showed up one of the Master M modules. I got to use one of those guys as the right-hand man to a campaign villain. It's the Metamorph. One Metamorph NPC is found in Five Coins for a Kingdom, where it appears as the main villain's main henchman. Never used more than a fraction of the creatures from the Mystara Monster Compendium, but I do use the book as a good resource. Has anyone used a huptzeen? No, but the concept is interesting and could be used. GP -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- [Post 21] Author : Arcanda Date : 03-21-07 03:05 AM Thread Title : Re: Most underused creature The only Metamorph in canon adventure is the villain henchman in 5 coins for a kingdom, as noted, and also NPC Dave used one as villain henchman. Strange! If I remember correctly, they are woodland creatures and appear in Alfheim gaz too, where they have good relationships with elves. I like them so much (as I like all shapeshifters: they are able to surprise PCs!) and I use Metamorphs as often as I can. -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- [Post 22] Author : natewis Date : 03-21-07 08:44 PM Thread Title : Re: Most underused creature I think Fundamentals should be used more as easing low level characters into familiarity with the elemental planes. And I don't think it's ever made an apperance in an adventure? -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- [Post 23] Author : JTrithen Date : 03-22-07 12:36 AM Thread Title : Re: Most underused creature Fundamentals did appear in X8 Drums on Fire Mountain (I think in the 2 or 3-story shaft of the underground complex of the devil swine bad guy). IIRC, there were at least fire fundamentals, not far from lava, which I think was near the bottom of the shaft, and a fire salamander nearby. I think they might have appeared in at least one other module, too. All of the creatures in the Creature Catalog appeared in a module (or modules) at one time or another, because that is where they were collected from (previously published material) for that product. I am not sure where the ashcrawler appeared. -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- [Post 24] Author : gawain_viii Date : 03-22-07 02:47 AM Thread Title : Re: Most underused creature If I have anything to do with it, fundamentals, among other critters, will be more often utilized in the future, as I've included then in the list of wiz/sor familiars for my conversion--along with imps, familiars, the mandrake and others. Roger -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- [Post 25] Author : Agathokles Date : 03-22-07 06:54 AM Thread Title : Re: Most underused creature I think Fundamentals should be used more as easing low level characters into familiarity with the elemental planes. Also, given that many Mystaran wizards are elementalists (e.g., the Secret Crafts in Glantri, but also Alphatian air wizards), Fundamentals are excellent summons for low-level wizards. I allow wizards to use the Conjure Fundamental spell from the Great Net Spellbook in AD&D 2e, for example. GP -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- [Post 26] Author : Cthulhudrew Date : 03-22-07 12:39 PM Thread Title : Re: Most underused creature All of the creatures in the Creature Catalog appeared in a module (or modules) at one time or another, because that is where they were collected from (previously published material) for that product. Not quite all- the Phygorax (previously mentioned) has never appeared in anything I've ever seen, nor the Stalwart (also mentioned). The Sis'thik never appeared in any module either, nor did the Xytars- at least prior to their presentation in the Creature Catalog. A modified version of the Xytar appears in module DA2: City of the Gods as a mount for the Sand Folk (with a different name, too). I think there were one or two others that were original creations for the CC, or modified versions of AD&D monsters (the Shark-kin instead of Sahuagin, the Mesmer instead of the Morkoth, etc.) For the most part, though, most of them had appeared elsewhere. -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- [Post 27] Author : Cthulhudrew Date : 03-22-07 12:41 PM Thread Title : Re: Most underused creature Also, given that many Mystaran wizards are elementalists (e.g., the Secret Crafts in Glantri, but also Alphatian air wizards), Fundamentals are excellent summons for low-level wizards. Hm- they'd probably make good familiars for 3E wizards/sorcerors as well. Hadn't thought of that before! -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- [Post 28] Author : JTrithen Date : 03-22-07 04:43 PM Thread Title : Re: Most underused creature Not quite all- the Phygorax (previously mentioned) has never appeared in anything I've ever seen, nor the Stalwart (also mentioned). The Sis'thik never appeared in any module either, nor did the Xytars- at least prior to their presentation in the Creature Catalog. A modified version of the Xytar appears in module DA2: City of the Gods as a mount for the Sand Folk (with a different name, too). I think there were one or two others that were original creations for the CC, or modified versions of AD&D monsters (the Shark-kin instead of Sahuagin, the Mesmer instead of the Morkoth, etc.) For the most part, though, most of them had appeared elsewhere. Oh, good to know. I certainly wasn't speaking on authority -- I was making presumptions, since I recognized most of the creatures from other publications (I have most of the OD&D modules, but do not have many of the CM ones, and the 3 IM modules). Thanks for the clarification! :cool: -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- [Post 29] Author : Arcanda Date : 03-22-07 06:53 PM Thread Title : Re: Most underused creature In my Mystara I use some spell from other settings, if adaptable. So, I use the Dark Sun clerical elemental spells. There is a spell called "conjure minor elemental" or the like. Instead of using it a it is in DS, I use it with a % as conjure elementals (in AD&D 2ed). And an elemental priest aways ha a chance to conjure a fundamental with a minor conjure spell. Elemental spheres are given to priest of certain Immortals, such as fire to Rathanos, Ixion, Halav, Zugzul, etc; elemental water to all undersea Immortals (such as Gorziok, Kallala, Krakkak, etc), Ahmanni Turtlerider, Calithia, etc; air to Minroth, Garal, Pflarr, Rad, Thor; and earth to Urth, -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- [Post 30] Author : tjedge1 Date : 03-28-07 07:57 PM Thread Title : Re: Most underused creature The only Metamorph in canon adventure is the villain henchman in 5 coins for a kingdom, as noted, and also NPC Dave used one as villain henchman. Strange! If I remember correctly, they are woodland creatures and appear in Alfheim gaz too, where they have good relationships with elves. I like them so much (as I like all shapeshifters: they are able to surprise PCs!) and I use Metamorphs as often as I can. One of my players in my current campaign (been on hold a long time, but still planning to be continued) played a Metamorph/Lupin character. Strange mix, but she wanted something that had never been thought of and even though I think it was way too far out, I always give everything a shot and it actually worked by just making it a Lupin with white eyes and limited shapeshifting to canines only. Seemed to work fine. Then she decided to play it as a Paladin. Now that was really strange. And called him Phil. And wanted a whip and katana instead of the usual sword and shield. :looloo: -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- [Post 31] Author : yellowdingo Date : 03-28-07 10:30 PM Thread Title : Re: Most underused creature The Animal herd is the most underused creature...Whadoiwin? Say Slap in the face!!! -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- [Post 32] Author : Gazza555 Date : 03-29-07 09:19 AM Thread Title : Re: Most underused creature Did any of the creatures from the Immortal boxed set turn up in any of the Immortal modules or elsewhere (other than the Rules Cylcopedia)? and limited shapeshifting to canines only. Seemed to work fine. Then she decided to play it as a Paladin. Don't know what rules you're using but a hound archon could work in 3.x If it is 3.x and level adjustments a problem there was an article a few years ago about a prestige class call the 'Infused' which gained different abilities and also changed the characters appearance depending on which good-aligned outsider they were 'infected' by. It would require a minor rewrite for Mystara but the ideas there. Regards Gary -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- [Post 33] Author : havard Date : 03-29-07 03:02 PM Thread Title : Re: Most underused creature Did any of the creatures from the Immortal boxed set turn up in any of the Immortal modules or elsewhere (other than the Rules Cylcopedia)? Some of them have showed up in 3E material if that counts. The Black Ball and the Draeden have both been mentioned. Havard -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- [Post 34] Author : Lost Woodrake Date : 04-08-07 04:28 AM Thread Title : Re: Most underused creature Ah, it's good to be back (almost two years have passed since I was active here. Yikes!)... I always liked the Grey Philosophers, I must say, and thought more use could have been done with them. Cheers, LW -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- [Post 35] Author : Hugin Date : 04-08-07 05:14 PM Thread Title : Re: Most underused creature Ah, it's good to be back (almost two years have passed since I was active here. Yikes!)... Nice to see you back LW! Doesn't take long for two years to slide on by, does it? -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- [Post 36] Author : Lost Woodrake Date : 04-10-07 01:19 AM Thread Title : Re: Most underused creature Doesn't take long for two years to slide on by, does it? Oh dear, it most definitely does... :hides: At least part of it was productive in fantasy-terms, though. I joined a FreeForm fantasy RPG on the net which kinda hooked me (it's called Worlde Arcane, by the way: www.worldearcane.com). Since I do not have an active RPing group for quite a while, it was wonderful to return to gaming! In a sense, I believe that the creative skills I developed here - which are quite a unique trait of the Mystara forums - were extremely helpful for me as a FreeForm writer/player. So I was very grateful for my time here, even when I was absent. :) -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- Downloaded from Wizards Community (http://forums.gleemax.com) at 05-10-08 09:25 AM.