* * * Wizards Community Thread * * * -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- Thread : AD&D character concept - "Spellsword" Started at 04-17-07 10:26 AM by hilmarsson_g Visit at http://forums.gleemax.com/showthread.php?t=830817 -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- [Post 1] Author : hilmarsson_g Date : 04-17-07 10:26 AM Thread Title : AD&D character concept - "Spellsword" This is a Fighter kit I've been working on. It feels far from complete, as I worry about balancing the character out. Any feedback / suggestions would be appreciated. ------------------------------ Spellblade Prime Requisites: Strength, (13) Wisdom, (13) Fighter Exp. Level (3) Alignment: Any (neutrality is uncommon) Experience Bonus: None (normal fighter experience table, but with 10% more experience growth required per level) Hit Dice: 1d6+1 per level up to 9th level. Starting with 10th level, +1 hit points per level, and Constitution adjustments no longer apply. Maximum Level: 20th Armor: Any; however, anything heavier than chainmail and any type of shield will disable the "Spellsword" ability. Weapons: Any; however, non-longbladed weapons (including daggers) will disable the "Spellsword" ability. Special Abilities: Spellsword (as detailed below) Description: The Spellblade is a specialized fighter who has dedicated much of her life to protecting and preserving the ways of the arcane. Fighters and mercenaries are often recruited by mages and their apprentices to protect them on their journies, or safe-guard magical relics from thieves. Some of these protectors manage to garner their client's trust, and may spend several years or more within the same environment. Such a fighter may eventually work to incorporate the wisdom she inherits from her mystical influences into her swordplay, allowing a myriad of magical effects to be imbued into her weapon. (Character Background Note: A fighter who wishes to specialize as a Spellblade must be of third level of experience with a deep history of exposure to magic.) Kit Features: * May use "Spellsword" ability once per day for every 4 levels of experience. (starting with three charges at initial level) Spellsword is a unique sword skill which allows the fighter to channel magical energies into her weapon through various auras. Depending on the fighter's level, different auras may be chosen at her discretion: * White Aura - acts as Light as cast upon the sword itself. Duration: 6 turns. Can be used at initial level. (Note: Light grants the weapon a +1 bonus versus undead and creatures of darkness.) * Purple Aura - infuses a single charge of Dispel Magic. Duration: 2 hours, until attack. The spell's effectivity functions at half the fighter's experience level, as assumed to be that of a mage. (round down to the lowest even number for uneven levels) Gained at level 6. (Note: Dispel Magic grants the weapon a +1 bonus versus mages and magical creatures.) * Red Aura - infuses a single charge of Striking. Duration of charge: 2 hours, until attack. Gained at level 9. * Green Aura - acts as Dispel Evil against applicible foes; grants the sword a +1 enchantment against foes not affected by Dispel Evil. Duration: 1d4 turns. (Conversely, evil Spellblades will have a "Dispel Good" effect.) Gained at level 16. (Note: The effect of any aura can be detected with Detect Magic or other similar spells in play. Anyone with a Wisdom score of 14 or higher, or magical lore, may successfully observe the effect of an aura, as well.) (Note 2: Weapons infused with a spell charge may only be unleashed by the wielder, otherwise the charge fizzles out once the weapon leaves the fighter's hands.) * Once the fighter has reached the 18th level of experience, multiple auras may be stacked upon a single weapon. Otherwise, charging the sword with another aura will replace the one it is currently infused with. * The Spellblade gains an additional -1 bonus to saving throws vs. Magic Wands and Rod / Staff / Spell at levels 3, 7 and 13. Penalties: * The Spellsword ability is restricted to longblade weapons only -- no blunt, ranged or other non-bladed weapons may be infused with this ability. Daggers, shields and any armor other than leather, scale or chainmail also disable the use of Spellsword. However, the character may still equip any of these items and act as an otherwise normal fighter. *With each Spellsword charge, the fighter must roll a 1d20 to determine whether or not 1 point of temporary wisdom loss is suffered as a result of chanting the spell. Compare the fighter's current experience level minus the minimum damage of the weapon in hand. (i.e., 1 if the weapon's dmg. is 1d6) If the roll is of this value or less, then her wisdom will not be drained. If the fighter's wisdom falls below 13, then she will be unable to utilize her Spellsword ability until she recovers. Drained wisdom recovers at a rate of 1 point per 24 hours, between rests, or by a restoration spell. At 18th level, wisdom checks are no longer necessary. *Calling upon the Spellsword feat requires the fighter to focus her energies for 1d2+1 rounds. During this time, she may move around freely, but cannot perform any other actions while concentrating. If attacked or otherwise interrupted, there will be a 40% chance of spell interruption. At 13th level, the chance of spell interruption decreases to 30%. At 18th level, 20%. -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- [Post 2] Author : Agathokles Date : 04-17-07 03:21 PM Thread Title : Re: AD&D character concept - "Spellsword" Hit Dice: 1d6+1 per level up to 9th level. Starting with 10th level, +1 hit points per level, and Constitution adjustments no longer apply. Fighter usually have d10 Hit Dice. If you have the character take the kit after 3rd level, then he/she would have 2d10+some d6 + some more HP, which is quite unusual in AD&D (2e, I'm assuming). Also, what would happen to PCs who take the kit after 3rd level, or drop the kit? Considering the other penalties you're giving (XP, limited armor to use the skills, etc.), I'd say you could still let the fighter use his standard HD. Also, there are a few points where discontinuity could be avoided. E.g., rather than simply having the fighter take the kit at 3rd level, I'd allow PCs to take the kit at 1st level, with a single use a day (2 at second level). Also, durations might be based on level (e.g., 1 turn per level above the minimum needed to use that aura). OTOH, allowing the fighter to combine all auras at 18th level, but none below seems not very balanced -- you might allow a progression like this (it's just a rough idea, of course): level bonus 1 --- 1st aura, 1 use/day 2 --- 2 uses/day 3 --- ST +1 bonus 4 --- 3 uses/day 5 --- 2nd aura 6 --- 4 uses/day 7 --- ST +1 bonus 8 --- 5 uses/day 9 --- 3rd aura 10 --- stack 2 auras 12 --- 6 uses/day 14 --- 4th aura 16 --- stack 3 auras 18 --- 7 uses/day 20 --- stack all 4 auras -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- [Post 3] Author : hilmarsson_g Date : 04-18-07 01:14 AM Thread Title : Re: AD&D character concept - "Spellsword" Fighter usually have d10 Hit Dice. If you have the character take the kit after 3rd level, then he/she would have 2d10+some d6 + some more HP, which is quite unusual in AD&D (2e, I'm assuming). Also, what would happen to PCs who take the kit after 3rd level, or drop the kit? First-edition, actually. The standard Fighter HD is only 1d8. I slightly decreased it because the character has slightly less experience in melee combat. (given the exposure to, and practice of, magical arts) That, and I felt it was an important area to penalize, considering that the kit is otherwise recieving all fighter benefits coupled with the spellsword ability. Also, there are a few points where discontinuity could be avoided. E.g., rather than simply having the fighter take the kit at 3rd level, I'd allow PCs to take the kit at 1st level, with a single use a day (2 at second level). Well, the problem is that the fighter would need a significant amount of experience beforehand, having a deep involvement as a guard or temple knight. A first-level character wouldn't really make sense. The ability to utilize this sort of "pseudo-magic" could only result from experience and practice within an arcane environment, which should amount to being at least third-level. Also, durations might be based on level (e.g., 1 turn per level above the minimum needed to use that aura). I like this idea. I think I'll try to re-work this a bit and see what I can come up with. Your suggestion below also sounds good. Thanks for the feedback. :) EDIT: Okay, I went ahead and made some changes. Let me know what you think. (these are just page scans, since it's easier than formatting it for the forum) http://img172.imageshack.us/img172/8874/1175454792863mo7.jpg http://img251.imageshack.us/img251/3417/page1wt2.gif http://img251.imageshack.us/img251/2563/page2th8.gif -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- [Post 4] Author : Agathokles Date : 04-18-07 06:15 AM Thread Title : Re: AD&D character concept - "Spellsword" First-edition, actually. The standard Fighter HD is only 1d8. Oh, in this case I can't tell whether my ideas are actually balanced -- I didn't know 1e had kits, so I assumed 2e... GP -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- [Post 5] Author : hilmarsson_g Date : 04-18-07 07:09 AM Thread Title : Re: AD&D character concept - "Spellsword" Oh, in this case I can't tell whether my ideas are actually balanced -- I didn't know 1e had kits, so I assumed 2e... GP They aren't really "kits," per se. The manuals refer to them as "character options." The paladin, for example, is a "character option" for fighters -- not a stand-alone class. -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- [Post 6] Author : emeriliath Date : 04-18-07 12:45 PM Thread Title : Re: AD&D character concept - "Spellsword" Fighters in first edition (AD&D) do have d10 hit dice. What happens if the character changes at say 9th level? Does he gain all of the powers of someone who has been a spellsword for 6 levels already? Perhaps this should be a dual-class. You need to be a fighter for a minimum three levels, and then you drop the fighter and your new class (1st level) is a spellsword. It seems like you are giving a number of abilities, without too much downside. For instance, a cavalier's code of conduct, a paladin's lawful good attitude, both the ranger and paladin's ability to lose their class with evil actions, etc. I would suggest some downsides to help balance the class. -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- [Post 7] Author : Agathokles Date : 04-18-07 05:14 PM Thread Title : Re: AD&D character concept - "Spellsword" They aren't really "kits," per se. The manuals refer to them as "character options." The paladin, for example, is a "character option" for fighters -- not a stand-alone class. In AD&D 1e? I thought it was a subclass of Fighter in the PHB and of Cavalier in UA, but really I'm not that familiar with 1e. As you put it, it seems more like the character options of OD&D Fighters -- who can become Paladins or Avengers at higher levels. -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- [Post 8] Author : Agathokles Date : 04-18-07 05:19 PM Thread Title : Re: AD&D character concept - "Spellsword" It seems like you are giving a number of abilities, without too much downside. For instance, a cavalier's code of conduct, a paladin's lawful good attitude, both the ranger and paladin's ability to lose their class with evil actions, etc. I would suggest some downsides to help balance the class. I think the weapon and armor limits are already quite significant, and this class doesn't give e.g. the excessive to hit bonuses of Cavaliers. Also, the abilities provided are quite minor -- compare to a Paladin, for example -- considering that they can fail, and are limited to a few uses per day. -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- [Post 9] Author : hilmarsson_g Date : 04-19-07 07:58 AM Thread Title : Re: AD&D character concept - "Spellsword" Fighters in first edition (AD&D) do have d10 hit dice. I'm going by what "Rules Cyclopedia" states: http://img134.imageshack.us/img134/931/image1dq0.jpg I might have mistook OD&D for 1E. This book is really confusing sometimes. What happens if the character changes at say 9th level? Does he gain all of the powers of someone who has been a spellsword for 6 levels already? Class changes don't occur. At least, not in my campaigns. (unless certain requisites are met) Specialized classes definitely would not be permitted to class-change. Ever. I would suggest some downsides to help balance the class. Indeed. I'm trying to work out more penalties, but I'm not sure which areas to work on at the moment. For now, I'm trying to reduce the class' likeness to the fighter, as it otherwise has all fighter benefits with a nice set of abilities tacked on. Seems too flexible. -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- [Post 10] Author : emeriliath Date : 04-19-07 11:53 AM Thread Title : Re: AD&D character concept - "Spellsword" When my group designs things, I usually try to remind myself (or them) to keep it balanced, because it's easy to forget. After play with it has begun, sometimes it's harder to fix. I was suggesting the class change (i.e. dual-classed), as a way to handle the problem of a high level fighter (say 10th) changing to the spellsword. Currently, it looks like he gets all of the powers of a 10th level spellsword (even though he's brand new with these abilities), and all the hit points of a fighter. That avoids any limiting factor in hp. At a higher level (like above), the armor restrictions really are practically meaningless. Most characters find a way to get bracers of defense by then anyway. I really didn't see much of a limit on weapons either. Long swords are one of the best weapons in the game, and he can use missile weapons whenever he wants. It does sound like an interesting type of character and could be used as an organization for a campaign (with the wizard's guild). I like the idea of a code of conduct, not necessarily involving combat. Maybe the spellsword Must protect wizards or the guild. Perhaps he Must take orders from guild wizards. Just some thoughts. -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- [Post 11] Author : hilmarsson_g Date : 04-19-07 12:36 PM Thread Title : Re: AD&D character concept - "Spellsword" When my group designs things, I usually try to remind myself (or them) to keep it balanced, because it's easy to forget. After play with it has begun, sometimes it's harder to fix. I was suggesting the class change (i.e. dual-classed), as a way to handle the problem of a high level fighter (say 10th) changing to the spellsword. Currently, it looks like he gets all of the powers of a 10th level spellsword (even though he's brand new with these abilities), and all the hit points of a fighter. That avoids any limiting factor in hp. At a higher level (like above), the armor restrictions really are practically meaningless. Most characters find a way to get bracers of defense by then anyway. I really didn't see much of a limit on weapons either. Long swords are one of the best weapons in the game, and he can use missile weapons whenever he wants. It does sound like an interesting type of character and could be used as an organization for a campaign (with the wizard's guild). I like the idea of a code of conduct, not necessarily involving combat. Maybe the spellsword Must protect wizards or the guild. Perhaps he Must take orders from guild wizards. Just some thoughts. I like these ideas. I'm definitely going to re-work it a bit more. So what you're proposing with the class-change is that the character remains a fighter up until third-level, and then the specialized class may be adopted from there? Considering that the HP rolls seem a bit low, I think this may help to counter that. (although, I do need to rework them) I think I may change the hit dice to 1d6+1 per level up to 9th, and then 1d2 HP 10th level and up. This is considering the slight bonus gained from having a 1d8 hit die up until third-level, so it evens out fairly well. As for the ethos, I think that makes sense. I was planning on working this in, but haven't gotten around to it yet. The character's personality is a more difficult area to work with than its abilities and attributes. I suppose a requisite to being a spellblade is that the fighter will have to serve under a temple or guild, sort of like the paladin would. Whatever philosophy is practiced by that group, the fighter is restricted to following. (this would tie-in with the fighter's alignment, of course) -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- [Post 12] Author : havard Date : 04-19-07 12:55 PM Thread Title : Re: AD&D character concept - "Spellsword" I'm going by what "Rules Cyclopedia" states: I might have mistook OD&D for 1E. This book is really confusing sometimes. I wouldnt say the RC is confusing, but terminology can be. The game you are playing is OD&D or Classic D&D and not AD&D. If you find the RC confusing, check out the BECMI boxed sets, Basic, Expert, Companion, Masters and Immortals rules which although spread through 5 boxed sets explain the rules better. Fighters do indeed use d8s in Classic, whereas they use d10 in AD&D 1e and 2e and D&D3E -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- [Post 13] Author : RobertFisher Date : 04-19-07 01:21 PM Thread Title : Re: AD&D character concept - "Spellsword" I might have mistook OD&D for 1E. This book is really confusing sometimes. You may find this (http://web.fisher.cx/robert/rpg/dnd-id/) helpful in understanding the basics of what editions of the game there were. "OD&D", for me, means the orginal game c. 1973. Some people used "OD&D" to refer to the entire "D&D" line prior to 2000. Which I call "classic D&D" (after the fashion at Dragonsfoot & on some later TSR products). "1E" means "AD&D1e". (Sometimes called "OAD&D".) Classic D&D & AD&D coexisting for a long time. The Rules Cyclopedia is classic D&D, not AD&D. (In fact, you'll find conversion notes for AD&D2e in the back of the RC.) In classic D&D, Fighters used d8 for their HD. In AD&D, they used d10. -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- [Post 14] Author : Higmorton Date : 04-28-07 05:12 PM Thread Title : Re: AD&D character concept - "Spellsword" I think this kit wouldbe better for a multi-classes, fighter/mage. giving the kit the ability to channel magical spells into the blade. -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- Downloaded from Wizards Community (http://forums.gleemax.com) at 05-10-08 08:21 AM.