* * * Wizards Community Thread * * * -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- Thread : Old school with a small group Started at 04-28-07 10:23 PM by Killerdragon Visit at http://forums.gleemax.com/showthread.php?t=837910 -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- [Post 1] Author : Killerdragon Date : 04-28-07 10:23 PM Thread Title : Old school with a small group My Group plays old school 2nd edition Adnd.my problem is that through certain circumstances, my group has dwindled to 4 core players with some floaters here and there. so with one dm'ing that leave 3 player characters what old module or adventures are out there for small groups? i find ones set for 4-8 player with 35 levels total, with my small group that means they have to be around 10th level and that just takes out all the fun Help -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- [Post 2] Author : ozbirthrightfan Date : 04-28-07 10:58 PM Thread Title : Re: Old school with a small group Just give the PCs some NPC hangers on, or full-time henchmen. Alternatively just cut back the number of monsters a bit. Don't write off a whole adventure just because there are only 3 PCs - improvise! -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- [Post 3] Author : Black_Arrows Date : 04-30-07 03:07 AM Thread Title : Re: Old school with a small group Hay it's good to find the "old School guys on here! I became a DM in 1982. So the old way is the one I love. You are right about the players getting harder to find. Here is one of the things I have done to help with this. First each of my players has developed a background on there PC over the years of playing. Some have brothers, sisters, and some followers or helpers that want to learn to be just like them. So we bring them into the game. I may be down to three players some of the time but most of them run two pc's each and I have one that runs three. Before you start letting this happen you need to talk to your players and tell them what you want. I don't let my magic user that has been playing with me for many years bring in a new magic user and give it all the stuff it needs. It must be treated as a new person showing up to play. Also let’s say I have a magic user and two fighter class PC's that is the core of the group. If one of them will run a second PC then it must be a healer class. I have a group of three others and myself that was started in 1983. We are called the Black Arrows. I have had many others come and go over the years. Right now I am lucky because I have five and each of the five has two or more PC's and can play them each as an independent PC. So if the thief is doing something in one room and the same guy running the thief is running the pally in a different room the pally doesn’t know what the thief is doing. This took a little time to get everyone doing this. But now all my players do a great job. Also if one person is playing more then one PC they now have there own sign language they can use between them and I have found this is a bonus that helps in speeding up the game some. The fighter looks at his magic user sister and gives her a sign. As he throws his axe at the guard she cast a silence spell on him. It's good to see I'm not the only one with the shortage of "old School" players. If anyone has more to add that will help me with my lack of bodies around the table let me know. -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- [Post 4] Author : longlivelavey Date : 04-30-07 04:32 AM Thread Title : Re: Old school with a small group Do to space constraints, I am currently running 4 characters through "U1 - The Sinister Secret of Saltmarsh". This module recommends playing with 5-10 characters of 1st-3rd level, so what I've done is adjusted the module so that it works using a small party of 4 1st-3rd level characters instead. If another character should leave, I would allow for an NPC, or two, to join the ranks. I think it all boils down to, "Can the players handle it?" longlivelavey -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- [Post 5] Author : Killerdragon Date : 04-30-07 03:34 PM Thread Title : Re: Old school with a small group These are all fine suggestions.. let me address some of these points #1)NPC's: I am a fairly inexperienced DM and i have enough trouble running things with out having to remember to make sure John smith #1 went. But i can work on that #2) Multiple PC's:I think that is a great fall back plan, but i know that as a player part of the fun is developing a character and like focusing on that.Multiple is hard to do #3)Adjusting the Module: I think that is also a great idea,But doesn't always work For example, I am currently running the beholder arcana series (Eye of pain,Eye of doom,Eye to Eye,I Tyrant" How do you scale back an adventure designed to be very dangerous? If i had a larger group I'd kill of one or two, but with three people I can't do that. I might use the the NPC idea and kill them off (Red shirt phenomenom #1) these have been very helpful keep them coming -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- [Post 6] Author : Llwch Date : 04-30-07 11:01 PM Thread Title : Re: Old school with a small group #1)NPC's: I am a fairly inexperienced DM and i have enough trouble running things with out having to remember to make sure John smith #1 went. But i can work on that And it often doesn't get easier. I've been playing & DMing D&D since I was 11 (don't ask, but I think Reagan was early in his first time back then), and I would call myself a seasoned DM. I still find it a bit of a pain in the butt to keep track of NPCs, partly because that's yet another item I need to track (I use cue cards for NPC maintenance, and take copious notes when DMing, in order to avoid inconsistencies). Best recommendation is to tune the DM to a smaller group, or have hirelings for the PCs (the players basically control the hirelings - to a point - and the DM only intervenes when a player tries to do something that is inherently "out of character" for the hireling). -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- [Post 7] Author : longlivelavey Date : 05-01-07 06:21 AM Thread Title : Re: Old school with a small group These are all fine suggestions.. let me address some of these points #1)NPC's: I am a fairly inexperienced DM and i have enough trouble running things with out having to remember to make sure John smith #1 went. But i can work on that #2) Multiple PC's:I think that is a great fall back plan, but i know that as a player part of the fun is developing a character and like focusing on that.Multiple is hard to do #3)Adjusting the Module: I think that is also a great idea,But doesn't always work For example, I am currently running the beholder arcana series (Eye of pain,Eye of doom,Eye to Eye,I Tyrant" How do you scale back an adventure designed to be very dangerous? If i had a larger group I'd kill of one or two, but with three people I can't do that. I might use the the NPC idea and kill them off (Red shirt phenomenom #1) these have been very helpful keep them coming Based on your responses, I would recommend that you run your campaign using a less powerful adventure. Something like "Palace of the Silver Princess" (http://www.wizards.com/dnd/article.asp?x=dnd/dx20020121x7). While this adventure was designed for 1st edition, it can be used in any 2nd edition campaign without much modification being needed. It's also a great module for beginning DMs and players. longlivelavey -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- [Post 8] Author : RobertFisher Date : 05-01-07 10:30 AM Thread Title : Re: Old school with a small group I've been running B4: The Lost City & X1: The Isle of Dread under the Basic/Expert rules with only three players. Despite the recommendations of those modules, they've been doing fine without me adjusting the modules. Personally, I'm not a big fan of multiple PCs/player & neither is at least one of the players, so we didn't go that route. I suggested hirelings, but they eschewed that. (Except for the ship & crew that they've retained to sail them to/around the Isle of Dread.) Perhaps because it has some of the same problems as multiple PCs/player. I'm also bad about forgetting NPCs, but I tend to leave control of hirelings mostly up to the players. I'm fine with adjusting a module. There are a lot of options for that: Fewer monsters. Fewer hp/HD for the monsters. Lower the HD of the monsters. Give the PCs some family heirloom magic items. But, like I said, for whatever reason that hasn't really been necessary. Perhaps because my players are quick to run when they feel out-matched & then form a plan to shift the odds in their favor or get around that obstacle instead of going through it. -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- [Post 9] Author : Horemheb442 Date : 05-20-07 07:49 PM Thread Title : Re: Old school with a small group Running a single PC is optimum but we usually run two PCs each any more. One of the things we do is try our best to do a direct opposite type, ie: run a fighter (or ranger, paladin, barbarian) and a Mage , run a cleric and a thief, run a LN assassin and a CG fighter and so on. Using this method, two things result; you can tell which one is doing the action most times and it helps keep the two separate in the the RP players mind.:rimshot: -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- [Post 10] Author : True_Atlantean Date : 05-21-07 05:58 AM Thread Title : Re: Old school with a small group I can certainly sympathise with your plight. My players finally rebelled and chose the 3.0 rules set for my newest campaign, even though I'm running the classic modules. One source that I can recommend is the old Book of Lairs. It contains a wealth of mini-adventures that are easily adapted to any party. I use them predominantly as fillers, but can flesh them out as full modules. If you can't track down a copy in print, may I suggest getting a copy from Paizo. Follow the link here (http://paizo.com/search?q=book+of+lairs&what=all&x.x=27&x.y=7) and enjoy. I think you'll find these pdf versions a little cheaper than the alternative and there is no shipping fees. -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- [Post 11] Author : tenacious_kev Date : 05-28-07 09:00 PM Thread Title : Re: Old school with a small group When I DM I dont really like people to have multiple PCs, because you run the risk of a player taking all of the spotlight. Something else you can do is arm your PCs with better magic items and weapons. With my 1st edition group Im co-DMing each character has at least 4 magical items, which changes the tide of most of our fights to us right of the bat. -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- Downloaded from Wizards Community (http://forums.gleemax.com) at 05-10-08 08:21 AM.