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White Robe Necromancer

Post/Author/DateTime Post
#1
baron_the_curse
Sep 17, 2003 20:00:25 A White Robe Abjurer can drop the schools Transmutation, Illusion, and Enchantment. Now there are no restrictions stating that the aforementioned White Robe can’t learn Necromancy spells of the highest levels! In Tales of the Lance the White Robe wizards could only learn Necromancy spells of up to 3rd Level, no higher at the risk of being banned. With this new prestige class there’s nothing standing in the way of an Abjurer White Robe with the powers of Necromancy as his second most powerful spells. Now, I’ve stated before that aside from raising the dead and other Necromantic spells with the “evil” description the school of Necromancy itself is no longer evil in 3rd Edition D&D. But Dragonlance is another matter it seems. So my question is why was this allow to happen, why not ban Necromancy altogether for the White Robes?
#2
coyote_skyheart
Sep 17, 2003 20:34:12 The only reason I can possibly think of is to preserve the ability of white-robes to cast counterspells on necromancy, which requires memorization of a necromantic spell and the feat improved counterspell. This could be a powerful tool for white-robes to oppose true necromancers.

Also, at the risk of sounding flip, white robes are good alignment and the vast majority of necromancy spells wouldn't, well, be "nice". Be my undead slave...I don't lose my good alignment.... no....
#3
daedavias_dup
Sep 17, 2003 20:47:46
Originally posted by Coyote Skyheart
The only reason I can possibly think of is to preserve the ability of white-robes to cast counterspells on necromancy, which requires memorization of a necromantic spell and the feat improved counterspell. This could be a powerful tool for white-robes to oppose true necromancers.

Also, at the risk of sounding flip, white robes are good alignment and the vast majority of necromancy spells wouldn't, well, be "nice". Be my undead slave...I don't lose my good alignment.... no....

Actually, if they have the secret Magic of Resistance they can counterspell any spell.
#4
baron_the_curse
Sep 17, 2003 22:00:11
Originally posted by Coyote Skyheart
The only reason I can possibly think of is to preserve the ability of white-robes to cast counterspells on necromancy, which requires memorization of a necromantic spell and the feat improved counterspell. This could be a powerful tool for white-robes to oppose true necromancers.

Also, at the risk of sounding flip, white robes are good alignment and the vast majority of necromancy spells wouldn't, well, be "nice". Be my undead slave...I don't lose my good alignment.... no....

Exactly, the majority of spells wouldn’t be appropriate. Remember I’m not saying that they should be Necromancers; I’m just stating that following to the letter the WoHS prestige class it leaves open Necromancy as a valid school for White Robes.
#5
coyote_skyheart
Sep 17, 2003 22:03:13 No it doesn't let them counter any spell, it says "gains the benefit of the improved counterspell feat" and a competence bonus to dispel checks. The improved counterspell feat requires you use a spell of the same school in a counterspell.
#6
daedavias_dup
Sep 17, 2003 22:12:57
Originally posted by Coyote Skyheart
No it doesn't let them counter any spell, it says "gains the benefit of the improved counterspell feat" and a competence bonus to dispel checks. The improved counterspell feat requires you use a spell of the same school in a counterspell.

Crap, that's right.
#7
cam_banks
Sep 18, 2003 8:44:59
Originally posted by Daedavias
Crap, that's right.

It's all good, though - White Robes get dispel magic while none of the others do.

Cheers,
Cam
#8
baron_the_curse
Sep 18, 2003 17:30:16
Originally posted by Cam Banks
It's all good, though - White Robes get dispel magic while none of the others do.

Cheers,
Cam

Really, are you sure? The other Orders have to give up Abjuration at some point? I have to take a look at my book again.
#9
carteeg
Sep 18, 2003 18:57:42 Is it possible for a Wizard of High Sorcery to specialize in a school not belonging to their robe? I figure that just means they don't get the enhanced specialization (just like the generalist) when they take the prestige class, but that's just my two gold (plus tax).
#10
zombiegleemax
Sep 18, 2003 19:47:44 Well, not how the book describes it. The book says that Wizards must pick their prohibited schools from the four schools of the other Robes. it doesn't make any note of a exception for Divination. I know what it says in the PHB but I think I'd let my players pick Divination as a prohibited school.
#11
cam_banks
Sep 19, 2003 0:01:58
Originally posted by L33t Angel
Well, not how the book describes it. The book says that Wizards must pick their prohibited schools from the four schools of the other Robes. it doesn't make any note of a exception for Divination. I know what it says in the PHB but I think I'd let my players pick Divination as a prohibited school.

Nobody can take divination as a prohibited school. The Wizard of High Sorcery's specialization rules comply with those in the PHB.

Cheers,
Cam
#12
daedavias_dup
Sep 19, 2003 10:54:43
Originally posted by Cam Banks
Nobody can take divination as a prohibited school. The Wizard of High Sorcery's specialization rules comply with those in the PHB.

Cheers,
Cam

I made is allowable for Divination to be chosen as an enhanced specialization school to be given up. However, it is a very complicated thing to do. First, one of the spells per level gained in your spellbook must be a divination spell. This is until you are able to cast 2nd level divination spells as if you are a fourth level wizard. So if a wizard were to try to become a Red Robe focused in Transmutation, they could select Necromancy and Enchantment as their first banned schools. Then, for every level of wizard that they gain they can choose one spell to add to their spellbook, and the other MUST be a divination spell. When they reach the level appropriate for taking the WoHS prestige class, they can choose the Divination school as their banned school. If they don't do this first, they can do this when they take their first level of the class. Should they do so, they must put a divination spell into their spellbook per level, for four levels. As an additional cost, they must pay the cost to scribe the spell into their spellbook.

Yeah, that's the price to pay to get Divination as your focused specialization banned school...

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
#1 baron_the_curse Sep 17, 2003 20:00:25	A White Robe Abjurer can drop the schools Transmutation, Illusion, and Enchantment. Now there are no restrictions stating that the aforementioned White Robe can’t learn Necromancy spells of the highest levels! In Tales of the Lance the White Robe wizards could only learn Necromancy spells of up to 3rd Level, no higher at the risk of being banned. With this new prestige class there’s nothing standing in the way of an Abjurer White Robe with the powers of Necromancy as his second most powerful spells. Now, I’ve stated before that aside from raising the dead and other Necromantic spells with the “evil” description the school of Necromancy itself is no longer evil in 3rd Edition D&D. But Dragonlance is another matter it seems. So my question is why was this allow to happen, why not ban Necromancy altogether for the White Robes?
#2 coyote_skyheart Sep 17, 2003 20:34:12	The only reason I can possibly think of is to preserve the ability of white-robes to cast counterspells on necromancy, which requires memorization of a necromantic spell and the feat improved counterspell. This could be a powerful tool for white-robes to oppose true necromancers. Also, at the risk of sounding flip, white robes are good alignment and the vast majority of necromancy spells wouldn't, well, be "nice". Be my undead slave...I don't lose my good alignment.... no....
#3 daedavias_dup Sep 17, 2003 20:47:46	Originally posted by Coyote Skyheart The only reason I can possibly think of is to preserve the ability of white-robes to cast counterspells on necromancy, which requires memorization of a necromantic spell and the feat improved counterspell. This could be a powerful tool for white-robes to oppose true necromancers. Also, at the risk of sounding flip, white robes are good alignment and the vast majority of necromancy spells wouldn't, well, be "nice". Be my undead slave...I don't lose my good alignment.... no.... Actually, if they have the secret Magic of Resistance they can counterspell any spell.
#4 baron_the_curse Sep 17, 2003 22:00:11	Originally posted by Coyote Skyheart The only reason I can possibly think of is to preserve the ability of white-robes to cast counterspells on necromancy, which requires memorization of a necromantic spell and the feat improved counterspell. This could be a powerful tool for white-robes to oppose true necromancers. Also, at the risk of sounding flip, white robes are good alignment and the vast majority of necromancy spells wouldn't, well, be "nice". Be my undead slave...I don't lose my good alignment.... no.... Exactly, the majority of spells wouldn’t be appropriate. Remember I’m not saying that they should be Necromancers; I’m just stating that following to the letter the WoHS prestige class it leaves open Necromancy as a valid school for White Robes.
#5 coyote_skyheart Sep 17, 2003 22:03:13	No it doesn't let them counter any spell, it says "gains the benefit of the improved counterspell feat" and a competence bonus to dispel checks. The improved counterspell feat requires you use a spell of the same school in a counterspell.
#6 daedavias_dup Sep 17, 2003 22:12:57	Originally posted by Coyote Skyheart No it doesn't let them counter any spell, it says "gains the benefit of the improved counterspell feat" and a competence bonus to dispel checks. The improved counterspell feat requires you use a spell of the same school in a counterspell. Crap, that's right.
#7 cam_banks Sep 18, 2003 8:44:59	Originally posted by Daedavias Crap, that's right. It's all good, though - White Robes get dispel magic while none of the others do. Cheers, Cam
#8 baron_the_curse Sep 18, 2003 17:30:16	Originally posted by Cam Banks It's all good, though - White Robes get dispel magic while none of the others do. Cheers, Cam Really, are you sure? The other Orders have to give up Abjuration at some point? I have to take a look at my book again.
#9 carteeg Sep 18, 2003 18:57:42	Is it possible for a Wizard of High Sorcery to specialize in a school not belonging to their robe? I figure that just means they don't get the enhanced specialization (just like the generalist) when they take the prestige class, but that's just my two gold (plus tax).
#10 zombiegleemax Sep 18, 2003 19:47:44	Well, not how the book describes it. The book says that Wizards must pick their prohibited schools from the four schools of the other Robes. it doesn't make any note of a exception for Divination. I know what it says in the PHB but I think I'd let my players pick Divination as a prohibited school.
#11 cam_banks Sep 19, 2003 0:01:58	Originally posted by L33t Angel Well, not how the book describes it. The book says that Wizards must pick their prohibited schools from the four schools of the other Robes. it doesn't make any note of a exception for Divination. I know what it says in the PHB but I think I'd let my players pick Divination as a prohibited school. Nobody can take divination as a prohibited school. The Wizard of High Sorcery's specialization rules comply with those in the PHB. Cheers, Cam
#12 daedavias_dup Sep 19, 2003 10:54:43	Originally posted by Cam Banks Nobody can take divination as a prohibited school. The Wizard of High Sorcery's specialization rules comply with those in the PHB. Cheers, Cam I made is allowable for Divination to be chosen as an enhanced specialization school to be given up. However, it is a very complicated thing to do. First, one of the spells per level gained in your spellbook must be a divination spell. This is until you are able to cast 2nd level divination spells as if you are a fourth level wizard. So if a wizard were to try to become a Red Robe focused in Transmutation, they could select Necromancy and Enchantment as their first banned schools. Then, for every level of wizard that they gain they can choose one spell to add to their spellbook, and the other MUST be a divination spell. When they reach the level appropriate for taking the WoHS prestige class, they can choose the Divination school as their banned school. If they don't do this first, they can do this when they take their first level of the class. Should they do so, they must put a divination spell into their spellbook per level, for four levels. As an additional cost, they must pay the cost to scribe the spell into their spellbook. Yeah, that's the price to pay to get Divination as your focused specialization banned school...