So, I thought I'd be interesting to hear the major 'selling points' for Greyhawk.
Why should someone choose this world over another?
What interesting things could they expect?
If you had to sell Greyhawk to newbees through an infomercial of sorts then, what would you say?
Why settle for any other setting? Greyhawk is the original AD&D world, spanning all three and a half editions. What are you looking for in a setting? Greyhawk has it all!
Magic
Greyhawk is a place where ancient magic meets modern spellcraft. From magic swords to fireballs to major artifacts, if it can be cast, created or cursed, Greyhawk has it.
Monsters
You want creatures? Greyhawk has every environment and enough monsters to fill them. Greyahwk has all the staples; orcs and dragons and vampires and more. Greyhawk also is home to some unique beasts like the Bullywug, Gibberling and Animus.
Character Races
Greyhawk supports all the standard races but that's not all! We have over a half dozen human sub-races. Plus another original, Greyhawk has DROW!
Deities
For those who like clerics, Greyhawk has around 190 deities and demigods to choose from, many of which you can find in your own Players Handbook.
Adventure Storylines and History
Greyhawk has a few millenia of history to draw its stories upon. In this world your heroes will contend with an evil demi-god ruled nation, a secret society of elitist monks, a fractured kingdom once ruled by an undead Overking or a traitorous Arch Mage ruling from the desert. From political campaigns to dungeon crawls to exploration, Greyhawk is the place to be!
Now you may be asking, "What do I need to get started?"
Well for 30% off at amazon.com, you can get the Living Greyhawk Gazetteer which contains all the information you need to run this setting. It includes a poster sized map.
Is that all? NO!
If you already have the Players Handbook, Dungeon Master Guide and Monster Manual you are set. Greyhawk is Wizards of the Coasts' default setting. This means nearly any product you buy will work comfortably with Greyhawk.
Some will say Greyhawk is a dead setting. Wrong! For joining Greyhawk today we will also throw in the RPGA's Living Greyhawk Campaign where you can play with people across the world There is also Dungeon Magazine and Dragon Magazine which support new Greyhawk material from regional feats to prestige classes.
Is that not enough? Okay you twisted my arm.
I will also throw in the best fansite:
www.canonfire.com
The best source for fan-produced material and information on the net.
Thank you for reading. All lines are open.
Even if you go with another published D&D world, odds are it's still filled with Greyhawkian monsters, spells and character archetypes, so why not just go with the original, where these things all make the most sense and truly belong?
In other words, Greyhawk is D&D, and vice-versa.
What better selling point could there be?
If what has been said isn't enough then tell them The Woodsman told ya so!
So sayeth the Woodsman!!
Very little of it is unique, and that is generally irrelevant.
Just because the campaign was that of one of the creators of the game, and what most forget is for the most part is isn't, as much was changed for publication, what remains is that don't get that creator as DM, so you are still left with your own efforts. Indeed, that is technically a logical fallacy in debate, assuming that something is superior simply because of its age.
Likewise most of the other points are logical fallacies of one stripe or other, being appeals to authority, or assertions of superiority, and what not, all without real foundation.
What is really relevant is something very simple.
Why are you buying a campaign setting?
In almost all cases it is because you don't have time to create one of your own. (Sometimes it is because you are just looking for inspiration to create your own, or as background to explain something you found in another product that references the setting.)
And if that is the case, you need to ask how much of a setting you want to buy.
And continuing our assumptions and questions, the next is how much you care about support or the influence of others on what you develop.
If you want a campaign that has a very nice outline with significant room for personal additions and expansions, then Greyhawk is one of the best. It has a nice body of support material without being overly detailed.
If you want a campaign with tons of detail, with most of the corners explored and defined, then Greyhawk is not for you.
If you want a campaign with tons of online fan material for you to rummage through and annex as you will for personal use, then Greyhawk is one of the best. It has a number of very prolific fan sites, some of them with material by writers of the LGG.
If you want a campaign with a friendly online community, where variants are welcome, and different editions and eras of the setting co-exist in mutually supportive harmony, forget it. Greyhawk has some of the most obnoxious and divided fans in existence. All too many of them are more than willing to sneer at and mock you for the "sin" of not hating a particular author, or for trying to add some "option" to your game, or for "changing" some minor element. If you don't have a thick skin, forget about talking with people online about Greyhawk.
There are a few other elements, but those are the most important. Pick Greyhawk because it has just the level of development you like, and you can fit in or ignore the online community. Beyond that there is no particular reason to choose Greyhawk over any other campaign.
Well, that and I like it. :D
I disagree with everything that has been said.
So you're denying my statement that much of the D&D game as we know it today was designed with Greyhawk in mind?
Where's your proof of that? I can point to numerous examples in the rulebooks running from the 1970s all the way up to 2004. What have you got for counter evidence?
My "proof" is very simple.
First, the poliferation of other game settings, and the ability of the applicable incarnations of the rules to support them.
Second, the fact that the current rules were incompatible with the basic demographics of Greyhawk, as demonstrated in the Greyhawk Gazzetteer. (The 32 page one, not the full LGG.)
Third, the change of Cuthber to having the sphere of Vengeance, completly forgetting about Trithereon.
Fourth, the overall theme of the rules, being less humanocentric, more magic intensive, faster advancement with more campaign cycling, and more, all shifting away from the themes of the setting.
Fifth, the lack of published support for the setting since 2nd ed, and particular in D20/3E/3.5.
Sixth, the dramatic changes between the original home Greyhawk campaign and the original published version, not to mention subsequent versions.
All of this, and lots of little bits, clearly show that the rules were never intended to be hardwired into the setting, or even to support one setting over, or better, than another.
But I'd love to see your proof. I'm curious as to what rule in the game has Greyhawk in mind over anything else.
But I'd love to see your proof. I'm curious as to what rule in the game has Greyhawk in mind over anything else.
Spells. Mordenkainen's X, Bigby's Y, etc. There are no Elminster or Strahd Von Zarovich spells in the PHB.
Monsters. Most of the "core" game monsters were used in Greyhawk first and designed with it in mind, like the drow and so on. Unless I'm mistaken, no monsters created with other campaign worlds in mind are in the MM. No draconians there.
Magic items. The Hand and Eye and other Greyhawk items have been in the rules for ages. There are no artifacts from other worlds.
Dieties. All the PHB ones are from Greyhawk. None are from other worlds.
The overall tone of the game. The same sources that influenced Gygax in the creation of the D&D style and tone are the same as the ones that shaped Greyhawk: Howard, Leiber, Vance, Moorcock, Lovecraft, etc. Greyhawk feels like this "default" D&D. Other worlds define their identities based on how they differ from it.
First, the poliferation of other game settings, and the ability of the applicable incarnations of the rules to support them.
Other settings don't have anything to do with the fact that Greyhawk was first and most of the D&D monsters, spells and magic items were designed with it in mind.
Second, the fact that the current rules were incompatible with the basic demographics of Greyhawk, as demonstrated in the Greyhawk Gazzetteer. (The 32 page one, not the full LGG.)
Who cares? That suppliment is a misbegotton peice of trash, anyway. The LGG is the real deal.
Third, the change of Cuthber to having the sphere of Vengeance, completly forgetting about Trithereon.
Irrelevent. More than one god can share the same domain. Xerbo and Procan are one example. Wee Jas and Nerull are another.
Fourth, the overall theme of the rules, being less humanocentric, more magic intensive, faster advancement with more campaign cycling, and more, all shifting away from the themes of the setting.
How fast characters advance and how long campaigns last are metagame issues, not part of the setting.
Fifth, the lack of published support for the setting since 2nd ed, and particular in D20/3E/3.5.
Irrelevent. Doesn't change the fact that the game is designed with Greyhawk in mind.
Sixth, the dramatic changes between the original home Greyhawk campaign and the original published version, not to mention subsequent versions.
Irrelevent at this point. If Gygax's Greyhawk, TSR's Greyhawk and WotC's Greyhawk weren't all obviously variations on the same theme, they would not be recognizable as such.
Originally posted by Yamo
Spells. Mordenkainen's X, Bigby's Y, etc. There are no Elminster or Strahd Von Zarovich spells in the PHB.
The spells were added after the original core rules had already been established. This shows that the game was not designed for Greyhawk, though that campaign has affected the design.
Monsters. Most of the "core" game monsters were used in Greyhawk first and designed with it in mind, like the drow and so on. Unless I'm mistaken, no monsters created with other campaign worlds in mind are in the MM. No draconians there.
You are very mistaken.
There are the Aranea from Mystara, the Gauth from Forgotten Realms, the Aasimar from Planescape, the Arcane from Spelljammer, and many more.
Magic items. The Hand and Eye and other Greyhawk items have been in the rules for ages. There are no artifacts from other worlds.
Like the Moaning Diamond, the Shadowstaff, and the Shield of Prator?
Once again, this is incorrect.
However, it should be noted that the current "artifacts" section of the DMG is extremely light. For a real comparison you would need to look at older books. But if you do, particularly the Book of Artifacts, you will note that all too many of them are not from Greyhawk. Further, a good number of Greyhawk artifacts had their backgrounds stripped from the setting and made generic.
Dieties. All the PHB ones are from Greyhawk. None are from other worlds.
Because Greyhawk is the "proper noun generator" for the rules.
But as I noted, they dramatically changed one deity (Cuthbert) in order to fit him in. That sounds more like making the setting fit the rules than the rules fit the setting.
Oh, and the demi-human deities were originally generic and not Greyhawk specific.
The overall tone of the game. The same sources that influenced Gygax in the creation of the D&D style and tone are the same as the ones that shaped Greyhawk: Howard, Leiber, Vance, Moorcock, Lovecraft, etc. Greyhawk feels like this "default" D&D. Other worlds define their identities based on how they differ from it.
The tone of the game has shifted significantly from those as the various editions of the game have come out. The best evidence of this is the lack of a bibliography listing those as sources of information and inspiration.
You are also making two unproven assumptions:
1. That the authors of D20 D&D did in fact read those as inspiration.
2. That the authors of other D&D worlds did not read those as inspiration.
(Note: I happen to support reading such. In the Greytalk chat a few weeks ago I said that nobody should even consider writing any RPG supplement, Greyhawk in particular, unless they had read at least 100 books and stories from the list in the DMG1. Others felt that to be a bit excessive. Of course, I am a self-acknowledged snob when it comes to quality of gaming materials.)
Other settings don't have anything to do with the fact that Greyhawk was first and most of the D&D monsters, spells and magic items were designed with it in mind.
Again, that is the unproven assumption. Particularly since the campaign they were designed for is not the one available for purchase.
Who cares? That suppliment is a misbegotton peice of trash, anyway. The LGG is the real deal.
That supplement is the core product, produced in accordance with the base core rules. That you consider it so poorly is evidence that the core rules are no longer compatible with the setting.
Irrelevent. More than one god can share the same domain. Xerbo and Procan are one example. Wee Jas and Nerull are another.
But changing the spheres of influence of a deity is relevant.
How fast characters advance and how long campaigns last are metagame issues, not part of the setting.
Not according to Gary Gygax on how a game should be run.
Irrelevent. Doesn't change the fact that the game is designed with Greyhawk in mind.
But you have still failed to establish that.
Irrelevent at this point. If Gygax's Greyhawk, TSR's Greyhawk and WotC's Greyhawk weren't all obviously variations on the same theme, they would not be recognizable as such.
Far from irrelevant, it is the heart of the issue.
If the game was designed for a setting, it is a setting that was a home game only, and never released in that form to the public. And if you read some of the descriptions of his home game, it is obvious that it is only vaguely recognizable as what people are playing. At least I have never heard of Odin and Thor showing up in the published Greyhawk, or people traipsing off to Barsoom, or any similar adventures and exploits.
The game today was not designed with Greyhawk in mind. Greyhawk has been used to support it, and as a source for certain names, spells, and items used in the rules. But it is no longer an absolute and integral part of the rules. All of those names could be deleted without it affecting the rules in the least.
Unfortunately this argument has probably convinced the aformentioned priest to go elsewhere. You say you like Greyhawk, samwise? So does everyone here I would assume. We are all obnoxious and divided? You've painted yourself with the same brush and not just with that statement, believe me.
The difference between Greyhawk and other settings is how much official development the setting has, and whether that is what you are looking for.
For me, this is what keeps me in Greyhawk over the other settings I have looked into. Birthright, Mystara, Planescape, and Spelljammer all require more work to fill in certain holes, or are overdeveloped in certain areas I don't want to have to alter. I like all of them, and have used them, but my main focus remains on Greyhawk because of those differences.
If you want to be involved in the online Greyhawk community you need to have a thick skin. The fact that you are so outraged and how you have expressed it is evidence of that. Nothing I said should turn anyone away from Greyhawk. Nor should a discussion of the history and setting do that. If the campaign can not stand a little critical self-evaluation then it is has issues that should warn people off from it. I think Greyhawk can take it.
The campaign I run can stand up to anyone and anything. It has merit and a quality of its own, without recourse to comparison or appeals to a presumed superiority of age.
But again, feel free to choose Greyhawk, or not to choose Greyhawk, for your own reasons. In the end, it stands on its own, and needs no big claims to show its worth.
When one begins countering another's statements with quotes it is baiting the other into a debate which then usually leads to an entailing arguement.
When the first sentence of one's ideas can be interpreted as thinking your ideas are superior to others tension immediately moves in and others feel the need to defend their own ideas.
It's alot easier to just state your own.
So far, Yamo and I have not argued about anything. We have disagreed. We are debating the specifics of what we disagree about. We each stated our own positions and have rebutted the positions of the other. That is how a debate works. I am still not seeing how and why this is a problem.
- Katharine Whitehorn, British newspaper columnist.
Greyhawk has the advantage that rulebooks (like Manual of the Planes) acknowledge Greyhawk themes.
Agreeing with Samwise, I think that it would be in the best interest for someone who wanted to start a Greyhawk campaign to flesh out a lot of his or her own ideas or be prepared to hunt down material from many different sources.
If you want to play something that has most of the areas detailed out for you, I would suggest Forgotten Realms. That setting gets a lot of support with a new supplement released about every month or so.
For someone wanting to start from scratch with a setting that is just beginning, try Eberron. It may or may not be exactly what you are looking for but you will be getting in on the ground floor.
Pros: Greyhawk is the default setting and unlike the above argument, the rules are designed around Greyhawk as a default setting for the material, that is the core rules, books with just the D&D logo on them, sans FR, Eberron etc. The setting is s detailed as you like and you develop the world as you see fit. There is not a proliferation of NPCS of high level running around. Even the uber Wizard of the setting is barely out of the 20s and unlike Elminster, you KNOW why he isn't out saving the world.
Greyhawk has a rich adventuring history as the vast majority of published adventures preOGL were written for Greyhawk especially the classics like GDQ, Temple of Elemental Evil and the Slavers series.
It has all the benefits of the Forgotten Realms in that you can find adventures of any type on the main continent from Arabian themes to barbaric survival, to weird sci-fi to gothic fantasy in the lands of Iuz. The flanaess is a continent of diversity with a diverse people.
Less of an investment in support material and you get just the right amount. I mean the Death Knight article in Dragon was AWESOME and the Warduke write up was excellent. Hardby as well. Dungeon modules are in Greyhawk mostly as well. You only need four books to play, the core 3 and one of the Gazeteers depending on the amount of development you want to perform for your campaign. I prefer the 32 pager myself.
Cons: Lack of real support in the core rules outside of the occasional organizational write up. Greyhawk has been "reduced" to magazine articles (which actually amounts to about the same material as the Forgotten Realms get just not as much "in depth" coverage) and internet resources.
Polarization of the D&D fanbase into FR v. Greyhawk. For every Greyhawk thread you find, there is usually some fanboy raving about how the Realms are better. I am a Realms DM, but neither is better in the sense these idiots rave about. On the other side of the coin are Greyhawk fans who whine and whine about FR usurping Greyhawk as the default setting in 2E and essentially in 3E as well.
The rules of 3E occasionally miss the flavour of a Greyhawk campaign with the unified XP chart and magic item purchasitis that players in 3E seem to be developing. At the same time, the higher lethality levels of the game are more indicative of Greyhawk than previous editions. The darker feel as well.
Overall:
Greyhawk has the same amounts of strengths and weaknesses of the FOrgotten Realms, it just depends on your personal DMing style. Some of these weaknesses are the same and so are some of the strengths like diversity in regions and adaptability.
If you are a hands on DM, Greyhawk. If you are a busy person with little time to do a lot of development... Forgotten Realms provides the same things but with less work.
Jason
That's another discussion in and of itself. My friends and I resorted to the use of "smiles" to show we were trying to be good natured on our hockey fantasy board. I will use them liberaly here to show that I am not outraged. :PYou can call this debate but in this format it's an argument.
I think Abysslin was dead on when he pointed out that quoting and counterpointing to bait a debate just becomes an argument. My only disagreement with anything that you said was that we were all divisive and snobish. 
The very nature of your posts was divisive and snobish, apparently to everyone but you. ;) Your assertion that a person has to have thick skin here isn't necessarily true. You don't have to have thick skin if we treat each other with civility 
and not by making broad statements of a negative nature. 
Naturally I think my DM's campaign is tops and some of the ideas I hear on this board are wierd, cool or down right lame, though I've never run anyones campaign ideas down because I felt that way. Do I criticize my own DM? All the time, just ask him. Would I like him to run something else? Sure, just for a change of scenery for me and for him. Will he? No. This board has made him nothing if not more militant about Greyhawk. That's fine, it's his baby. I missed out on his FR campaign (over a decade ago) and he seems to relish me having missed it. Why am I telling you all this? I know he's reading this and I'm hoping to appeal to his good nature.
I know we'll always come back to Greyhawk, because it's home. 
I apologize ahead of time to those with an extreme case of Torilophobia. Hopefully I didn't penetrate your thin skin. 
Having said that I do agree with your point that Greyhawk is easily molded into what a DM (with time on his hands) really wants. FR is perfect for someone who wants all the work done for them. But in the end you're still doing alot of work in FR because not only do you have to track down and buy all of their stuff you have to read it too and remember it all.
Sure you can ignore all of the extras they've published for FR but in the end you'd have a world as bare bones as GH. One experienced FR gamer will ruin that campaign in a hurry as he picks apart the DM's version of Toril. Dropping a rock on that characters head will end that pretty quickly though. 
In the end, can't we all just get along?
If you think Greyhawk fans are all happy, happy, joy, joy, then wouldn't a better response be just to express support for those views that I disagreed with. And rather than just disagree with my disagreement, notice how some have been phrased.
As for me, apparently you aren't aware, but I have very thick skin. If you don't agree with me that is your loss, as I am certainly always right about anything Greyhawk. I know because I asked and I told myself I was. :D
As for the other issue of FR vs. GH, I think your comments, and others, have very much proved my point that the only real difference between the settings is the amount of available material.
Both have history.
Both have their own monsters, spells, items, and NPCs.
Both have whatever else you want to cite.
They just have different degrees of development.
Which is what should decide which version you want to play.
Oh, and if it makes everyone happy, Traveller fans are actually worse than Greyhawk fans.
It seems you enjoy debate. I don't see any debating going on here. Baiting, perhaps. I believe I'll prowl deeper waters.
Oh yeah...
:D 
:DOh my.
chatdemon plays Greyhawk!
Chicks dig me.
Be like chatdemon, play Greyhawk.
:D :D :D :D
The very fact that this thread "what's cool about greyhawk" quickly devolved into arguments about the nuances of the setting is the very evidence that the setting is superior.
Huh? Let me explain.
Greyhawk is whatever you want it to be.
Your characters are the heroes. Mordenkainen, Tenser, Vecna and the rest are just background material, easily ignored. No worries about the published exploits of Drizzt, Raistlin or Van Richten interfering in your character's adventures.
Your DM is the lord of the setting. Sure, guys like Gygax, Moore, Sargent, Holian and Mona have provided lots of detail and ideas, but in the end, the material is open ended enough to give your DM control over the setting. Settings like Forgotten Realms, Dragonlance and Ravenloft are defined by the story heavy adventures and novels. Greyhawk is defined by the DM, with the adventures being fairly story-light and the novels few and far between.
There's a lot of Greyhawk material out there, but it doesn't back you into a creative corner. The setting is yours to develop in whatever way you like. The "generic" fantasy nature of the setting also allows for a huge variety of plots and stories.
Mystara possibly rivals Greyhawk in these regards, but Greyhawk has two big advantages over that setting:
1. It's still in print (however sporadically, Mystara otoh is gone.)
2. Its presence in the core books provides both an immediate familiarity among new players ("Woah! Mordenkainen! I know that guy from the PHB!") as well as a supplemental source of material and ideas that need very little modification to be used.
No two Greyhawk fans will agree on what the setting is and what's good about it. Just visit a few of the Greyhawk forums around the net and you'll find myriad opinions and arguments, but IMO this has led to the vitality of the Greyhawk community over the years. 100 people saying the same thing doesn't provide much in the way of new ideas, but 100 people all doing different things leads to a great variety of ideas and material to choose from.
Actually, I found the responses very helpful and wasn't turned off at all by the discussions (in fact I found myself intrigued all the more by this setting from these posts -ideas exchanged, new info, etc.)
So thanks for all of the helpful responses, and that wonderful humorous 'infomercial- styled' post at the beginning of this thread.
I believe that the debateble nature of the world, combined with a landscape that leaves many places undiscovered and questions unanswered, really provides the flexiblity I'm looking for in a setting.
I read some other discussions of Greyhawk which spoke of it as a rather dark setting; another person describing its atmosphere as one of 'hopelessness"
That got me even more interested.
Plus- there's so much supplimental fan material online!
So I took the plunge and picked up the living Greyhawk Gazeteer...
As my players stared at the map while I described the general features of the setting, they made such exclamations as "Oooohh...who's Iuz?!" and "What's Bone March?"
Yep, thanks again- needless to say I think we're going to have a ball in this world...
Jason