( reference : the maps and scales in Dragonlance Adventures and the DLCS ) That makes Krynn tiny by the standards of Earth, or Abeir-Toril, Oerth, Athas etc. for that matter - basically it would be a moon-sized body! I believe this problem, and breakdown in geographic logic, was addressed in the 5th age SAGA maps by tripling all the distances on the map scale. This sensible fix seems to have been retconned in 3rd edition Dragonlance, however. Could anyone in the know tell me what Sovereign Press' position on all of this is?( my personal solution? Simply produce a map for the next major DL release that restores the SAGA distance scale on the map key )
I. The SAGA map scale was a fluke, and has been abandoned by Sov Press, which uses the original scale. Many of the travels of the Companions during the War of the Lance (as showcased in the Atlas of Krynn) don't make sense or would have to be grossly exagerated to fit the SAGA scale.
II. As to Krynn's actual size, let's start with:
Mars: 2,123.25 miles (equatorial radius).
I see Krynn's size as boiling down to one of two things:
1. Krynn is anywhere between the size of Earth's moon to Mars, with a denser core and hence more Earth-like gravity. So Ansalon is really a "normal" size continent on a smaller-than Earth world.
2. Krynn is the size of Earth and the climate bands indicated on Ansalon are due to weird weather effects like a particularly powerful Gulf Stream-type warming effect that unduly warms Ansalon's northern shores. So Ansalon is nothing more than an overly large island (ala Greenland on Earth) or a micro-continent.
From all the available evidence it seems as though Krynn is indeed much smaller than Earth. From the maps we know that Ansalon stretches 960 miles from the northernmost tip of Nordmaar in the north to Icewall Castle in the south. From various sources Krynn's south pole lies either 500 miles beyond Icewall Castle (per the Tales of the Lance boxed set map) or 1,000 miles beyond Icewall Castle (per the Otherlands accessory). From Karen Wynn Fonstad's Atlas of Krynn we can calculate that Krynn's equator is roughly 200 miles north of Ansalon.
So if we take the maximum figures available, from the south pole to the equator Krynn measures:
1,000 + 960 + 200 = 2,160 miles. This Krynnish polar radius approximately equals Mars.
Mars polar radius: 2,109 miles
Earth polar radius: 3,973 miles
A Mars-size Krynn is big enough for me, as that still offers quite a bit of room for adventure. :D
So if we take the maximum figures available, from the south pole to the equator Krynn measures:
1,000 + 960 + 200 = 2,160 miles. This Krynnish polar radius approximately equals Mars.
Mars polar radius: 2,109 miles
Earth polar radius: 3,973 miles
A Mars-size Krynn is big enough for me, as that still offers quite a bit of room for adventure. :D
Your figure of 2,160 miles actually represents a line drawn on the planet's surface from south pole to equator, or 1/4 of the planet's polar circumference. From this figure we can derive a Krynnish polar circumference of 8,640 miles, a polar radius of approx. 1,375 miles, and a polar diameter of approx. 2,750 miles. ( I only used a approximate value of pi to 4 decimal places, since I couldn't find batteries for my long dormant scientific calculator :D ) In comparison Earth's polar diameter is 7,900 miles, Mars is 4,192 miles, and Luna is 2,154 miles.
So if the figures derived from your reading of the DL maps are accurate ( and I believe they are, you've done a good job of interpreting the different sources ) then we have in a descending order:
Earth : 7,900 miles polar diameter
Mars : 4,192 miles polar diameter
*Krynn: 2,750 miles polar diameter ( if the "Otherlands" distance to the South pole is the correct value )
The Moon : 2,154 miles polar diameter
*Krynn: 2,113 miles polar diameter ( if the "Tales of the Lance distance to the South Pole is the correct value )
So Krynn is either modestly larger than Earth's moon, or slightly smaller, depending on which sources you work from. In either case, it is much smaller than Mars, and tiny compared to Earth, or to the Forgotten Realms' world of Abeir-Toril. I'm just curious as to why Weis and Hickman envisioned such a small world, if such was indeed their intention. And also curious as to whether SP feel this "cramped" geographical scale needs some revision.
Hmm ... I knew there was a reason I never became a math teacher ...An Luna-sized Krynn does seem a mite small. Gah, we need a global map to settle Krynn's size issue.
LOL I'm with you on that one... those radius/circumference/diameter rules are pretty much the only high school maths I can still call to mind without causing the grey matter to start leaking out my ears...
An Luna-sized Krynn does seem a mite small. Gah, we need a global map to settle Krynn's size issue.
Just a simply sketched global map, with a scale provided, would be nice. A bit like the basic Abeir-Toril map provided in the FR main book; it doesn't fill in much detail, but it shows the location of all the continental landmasses in both hemispheres, even the ones that the FR developers have said will probably never be developed further. It gives FR players and DMs a nice idea about the sheer size and variety of the world beyond Faerun's borders. A Dragonlance equivalent would be great.
And he have tell that early WotC tell that it give 4- 8 continets of Krynn.Just a simply sketched global map, with a scale provided, would be nice. A bit like the basic Abeir-Toril map provided in the FR main book; it doesn't fill in much detail, but it shows the location of all the continental landmasses in both hemispheres, even the ones that the FR developers have said will probably never be developed further. It gives FR players and DMs a nice idea about the sheer size and variety of the world beyond Faerun's borders. A Dragonlance equivalent would be great.
A fully fleshed-out global map would be golden, but I doubt we'll ever see such a map (probably a good thing). I agree with you totally that a bare-bones global map showing existing/known areas in detail and everything else as outlines (or even just hazy white/gray "unknowns") would finally settle the Krynn size issue. I know there's a pseudo-global map in the Otherlands accessory ... but that map doesn't seem to jive well with the Dragonlance Campaign Setting's description of Krynn containing five major continents. Even counting the land beneath Krynn's south pole as an continent (Icereach/Chorane), that still leaves us with just three major continents; Ansalon, Taladas and Icereach/Chorane.
On the plus side, Sov Press did say that there was eventually (next year or two) going to be a maps product. Perhaps we can hope for a small world map inset to come along with the product.
But hey we don't know for sure if our reality is their reality. Kryn realy could be flat.
PS: I've alweays thought it was cool how Ansalon was in the Southern Hemisphere on Krynn, because North was hot and South was cold! Although, if they're in the Southern Hemisphere, wouldn't it be hot during the winter and cold during the summer?
PS: I've alweays thought it was cool how Ansalon was in the Southern Hemisphere on Krynn, because North was hot and South was cold! Although, if they're in the Southern Hemisphere, wouldn't it be hot during the winter and cold during the summer?
No, but your summer and your winter would be at opposite times from those in the northern hemispheres. I'm originally from New Zealand, which celebrates Christmas in the middle of summer and Easter in spring. Never seemed odd to me, though.
Cheers,
Cam
Based on what i Know, Ansalon is only the size of Australlia, right?
Here's a repost of something I said over on Dragonlance.com:
I'm no cartographer, so take these area measurements with a grain of salt ...
As near as I can figure, Abanasinia covers ~ 6,200 square miles. It's population is 197,016 which means its population density is about 32 people per square mile.
Ansalon we know is 1,320 miles east-west and 960 miles north-south. If it were perfectly rectangular with no appreciable water masses located within, we'd have a land area of 1,267,200 square miles. Of course, it's not this easy. Based on my rough calculations approximately 375,000 square miles (30%) of the previous figure is water, which leaves us with a land area of roughly 892,200 square miles. This means Ansalon has an average density of 4.4 people per square mile.
So Abanasinia accounts for 0.7 % of Ansalon's land area yet holds 5% of its population, and is over 7 times more densely populated than the continental average. Abanasinia is slightly smaller than Israel in area ... or in between Connecticut and New Jersey in size.
Ansalon's 892,200 square miles compares to landmasses on Earth as follows:
Land area
Greenland: 840,000 square miles.
Australia: 2,896,000 square miles.
As you can see, Ansalon is no where near the size of Australia.
Someone like me, whom loves the Pre-Cataclysm era of Krynn, when I see the map of Ansalon set before the Cataclysm, I get the picture of Australlia for some reason.
I stand corrected.
Someone like me, whom loves the Pre-Cataclysm era of Krynn, when I see the map of Ansalon set before the Cataclysm, I get the picture of Australlia for some reason.
Pre-Cat Ansalon does resemble Australia in its general outline, it's even got a semi-large island off its southeast coast (ala Tasmania).
Pre-Cat Ansalon does resemble Australia in its general outline, it's even got a semi-large island off its southeast coast (ala Tasmania).
Post-Cataclysm Ansalon differs from Australia in that it has huge chunks of its internal area missing, and replaced with inland seas, waterways and other things that generally reduce overall surface area.
Cheers,
Cam
Post-Cataclysm Ansalon differs from Australia in that it has huge chunks of its internal area missing, and replaced with inland seas, waterways and other things that generally reduce overall surface area.
Cheers,
Cam
True, though even if it were a solid block of land it'd still be less than half of Australia's land area.
No, but your summer and your winter would be at opposite times from those in the northern hemispheres. I'm originally from New Zealand, which celebrates Christmas in the middle of summer and Easter in spring. Never seemed odd to me, though.
Having experienced both, let me tell you that a Summer Xmas is far better than a bleak, cold, northern one.
:D
(Plus it means your Xmas holiday coincide nicely with your summer hols)
True, though even if it were a solid block of land it'd still be less than half of Australia's land area.
Keep in mind that Australia has is a very dry continent, and a large proportion of its land is unsuitable for agriculture. Ansalon, even after its many cataclysms, seems to have substantial amount of arable land.
[i]
Keep in mind that Australia has is a very dry continent, and a large proportion of its land is unsuitable for agriculture. Ansalon, even after its many cataclysms, seems to have substantial amount of arable land.
Well, we're (at least I am not) talking about arable land area. I'm talking total land area, a category where Ansalon is much much smaller than Australia.