In 2ed dragons had to swallow all their obsidian orbs when they transform, right? As well as swallowing them and letting them pass through to activate them in the first place.
Well here is the thing they were between 1 and 20 inches in diameter..... and I don't know about you all .... but from what I know of human anatomy.... even a 1 inch orb that is swallowed is going to give massive problems going through the digestive track.
Aren't we glad that Darksun players are normally rather intelligent and a bit older. Can you imagine some dumb kid going to the hospital to remove a 1 to 2 inch orb that they swallowed..... if they were able to in the first place.
I actually have several obsidian orbs at home (including a 50mm, aprox 2 inch, one I just got finally delivered) and was looking at it while working on epic defiler spells, and it hit me...... how the heck are they swallowing these things???
It is actually pretty freaky that defilers can actually do that once they hit their 20's..... makes me wonder how they are able to swallow it, let alone get it to come back out.
Just so you know, I have obsidian as it is one of my favorite stones/glasses..... it was actually one of the reasons that drew me to darksun.... the fact that they used so much obsidian for things in the game and novels.
:D
A snake can swallow fairly large creatures, so I would assume the reptilian shape brought about from the dragon metamorphosis would allow the advanced being to swallow the orbs.
actually that is the point.... they started doing this at level 21 in 2ed and they were still almost identical to humans at that point. The only change was the increase in weight for the most part.
um...they're high-level wizard/psionicists? It's MAGIC. I mean, they summon horrors from unknown dimensions and suck "the life energy" out of things, and what you're confused about is how they can swallow big obsidian orbs? Duuuuude...
:D
yeah but swallowing them is not the biggest problem...... it is "passing" them.... those things would get lodged in the valves between your seperate poortions of the digestive track and the intestines.
and I want to know why they are focussing magic and psionics on changing themselves in that way......
But yea, swallowing marbles can be bad. One of the reasons I like to start with an orb slightly larger than a child would normally have available to him, plus, that the first stage of development only requires a single Orb, and it doesn't necessarily need to be swallowed - just carried. Like the staves and canes that have an obsidian orb which the Sorcerer-Kings carry with them.
lets say they are required to swallow the first orb, which we've decided would be pretty tough for a typical human... well.. I can think of a variety of ways to aleviate any problem there... one.. simply enlarge myself magically or psionically for the hours necesary to 'pass' the orb through.. two.. telepathically shunt my pain onto a slave... i'm a defiler, a bad guy, I wouldn't mind the least about doing that..
after all, in a magic/psion univers.. there are many avenues to ... cheat annoyances :P
I am aware there are plenty of ways around it .... I just find it unnerving that they were putting their mind to it..... and how the heck did they figure it out to begin with.....
I would hate to be the one trying to figure out how to activate it the first time. (remember in 2ed you could not use them till they were activated, by passing them through you, they can have them on staves and canes but they have to be activated first.....)
here is the other thing.... if I have an orb that has been "passed through me" I am pretty sure there is nothing that I can do to clean it enough to actually ever touch it again to use it.... let alone swallow it again when I cast the next defiler metamorphosis spell. I would be forever at level 21, as I would not swallow the orb again.
I would hate to be the one trying to figure out how to activate it the first time. (remember in 2ed you could not use them till they were activated, by passing them through you, they can have them on staves and canes but they have to be activated first.....)
here is the other thing.... if I have an orb that has been "passed through me" I am pretty sure there is nothing that I can do to clean it enough to actually ever touch it again to use it.... let alone swallow it again when I cast the next defiler metamorphosis spell. I would be forever at level 21, as I would not swallow the orb again.
That's just gross dude!!!
I would hate to be the one trying to figure out how to activate it the first time. (remember in 2ed you could not use them till they were activated, by passing them through you, they can have them on staves and canes but they have to be activated first.....)
here is the other thing.... if I have an orb that has been "passed through me" I am pretty sure there is nothing that I can do to clean it enough to actually ever touch it again to use it.... let alone swallow it again when I cast the next defiler metamorphosis spell. I would be forever at level 21, as I would not swallow the orb again.
They're called Defilers for a reason.
They're called Defilers for a reason.
That's kinda wrong too! :D
here is the other thing.... if I have an orb that has been "passed through me" I am pretty sure there is nothing that I can do to clean it enough to actually ever touch it again to use it.... let alone swallow it again when I cast the next defiler metamorphosis spell. I would be forever at level 21, as I would not swallow the orb again.
A simple prestidigitation spell can clean the orb thoroughly.
Here's a stupid question. I don't have PaDoA or DKs with me, but does the process of swallowing the orb actually require the would be dragon to pass them as well? If not, its just a simple matter of teleporting the orb out of their stomach thru the use the way or magic. Or for those with a more sinister or darker outlook, surgically opening their own bowels and pulling the orb out from their own stomach.
Er, Lyric's methods seem more realistic and feasible, IMHO. Teleporting would actually stop the "passing" process, and the surgery bit is straight out of BoVD, and I can't believe dragons are that insane.
Er, Lyric's methods seem more realistic and feasible, IMHO. Teleporting would actually stop the "passing" process, and the surgery bit is straight out of BoVD, and I can't believe dragons are that insane.
I understand Lyric's method, but my question was if the process actually requires the defilier to "pass" the orb or just merely "swallow" it. If thats not the case, then the teleporting or surgical methods could work. That would seem easier that sitting around and waiting several hours to poop (thats right, I said poop! :P ) it out.
I guess you are right jon, they are called defilers for a reason......
A simple prestidigitation spell can clean the orb thoroughly.
I know you could clean it ..... but psychologically speaking..... there is no way you could clean it "enough" for me to put it back in my mouth
Here's a stupid question. I don't have PaDoA or DKs with me, but does the process of swallowing the orb actually require the would be dragon to pass them as well? If not, its just a simple matter of teleporting the orb out of their stomach thru the use the way or magic. Or for those with a more sinister or darker outlook, surgically opening their own bowels and pulling the orb out from their own stomach.
I understand Lyric's method, but my question was if the process actually requires the defilier to "pass" the orb or just merely "swallow" it. If thats not the case, then the teleporting or surgical methods could work. That would seem easier that sitting around and waiting several hours to poop (yes, I said poop! :P ) it out.
it actually stated in dragon kings that is had to pass through the caster normally to attune it.
that is what I found so messed up.....
I think I would be more willing to cut myself open to get it out and then re swallow it.
it actually stated in dragon kings that is had to pass through the caster normally to attune it.
that is what I found so messed up.....
I think I would be more willing to cut myself open to get it out and then re swallow it.
The orb it's self could be reduced in size by psionics or magic. That would also make it easier to pass thru the defiliers bowels.
yeah logically there are several ways to do it with magic..... but how the heck are they convincing themselves to swallow it a second time????
The rewards of unimaginable power is one thing that comes to mind ;)
The rewards of unimaginable power is one thing that comes to mind ;)
sorry ultimate power is not worth that......
Originally Posted by seker
yeah logically there are several ways to do it with magic..... but how the heck are they convincing themselves to swallow it a second time????
One word: Rajaat.
Jon, Orcale of Athas, we happily announce that you uthered the 1,000,000th instance of the word "Rajaat" on this board!
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sorry ultimate power is not worth that......
Look at all the crazy reality shows out there and the insane things people are willing to do for a few thousand dollars. Its along the same lines for the SK and all would be dragons except its for immortality and power.
and I think jon got the one answer as to why
Unless you want to subscribe to that Rajaat may have inserted a subconscious desire to compel them to complete the metamorphosis at all costs when he first made them his Champions.
"you want me to do WHAT?????"
"do it or we cant keep Rajaat imprisioned"
"only if you all have to too......"
actually I think it was more along the lines of......
"you want me to do WHAT?????"
"do it or we cant keep Rajaat imprisioned"
"only if you all have to too......"
I thought that was the logic for them in jumping Borys all the way to a fully formed dragon and the purpose of the annual levy not the drive behind them becoming dragons themselves.
I thought that was the logic for them in jumping Borys all the way to a fully formed dragon and the purpose of the annual levy not the drive behind them becoming dragons themselves.
that was what I was getting at......
Boryrs - "you want me to do WHAT?????"
"do it or we cant keep Rajaat imprisioned"
Borys "only if you all have to too......"
that was what I was getting at......
Boryrs - "you want me to do WHAT?????"
"do it or we cant keep Rajaat imprisioned"
Borys "only if you all have to too......"
I don't see it that way at all, but I'll concede for lack of wanting to start a pointless debate. :P
keep it up
Don't make me use the Black Knight card.
Keep up the silliness. Maybe we will surpass the Dragonlance board in total number of posts. :P
Everyone knows that DS is better then DL any day of the week- DL has had even more wierd and drastic changes. I am not saying that I dislike Dragonlance- I love the books, but I dislike the RPG of DL.
BTW this is all IMO :D ( I know you guys love the alphabet soup)