RELIGIOUS/IMMORTAL/PHILOSOPHICAL ASPECTS
>>The Immortal Rohindartha
USE
>>The "deanimation" ability of Rohindartha's clerics
USE
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>>Intelligent undead with regard to Rohindartha's clerics
( if deanimation is used )
ALLOW CALMING
Rothindartha can be like the Mystaran version of Buddhism. Though I am
far from well-versed in the beliefs of a Buddhist, I have been reading up on Japanese
history, and inclusion of this religion first from Sind to MCHINA, and then from MCHINA to
MJAPAN would be very accurrate.
As for MJAPAN, they would have been some form of animists (along the
lines of the Shinto religion), probably worshipping a pantheon of Immortals who are
aliases for current Immortals (though not a Sun-Goddess, Ixion falls very similar to a
Japanese creator goddess).
Rohindartha could be the second type of religion which makes up the whole conglomerate
that far eastern religion seems to be.
Estlor
I would require some lenghty ritual to calm an intelligent undead. If that is included I'd
say allow it, otherwise, no.
Andre Martins
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>>Fairies/Seelie court as MChinese pantheon of "Gods" ( Celestial Court )
USE
I've been thinking about this one and I believe drakes would be perfect in MChina. Their
original form is draconic, they can shapeshift to human (or elfish or dwarven) form at
will. Besides, PCA1 tells us they have started fighting law so that no other Blackmoor,
with their destructive power, could ever rise again. Most of them have forgotten their
origns, but those in MChina haven't.
Drakes should form a secret society, dedicated to destroy any blackmorian artifact
discovered in Skothar and to prevent MChina to rise as a world power. And they account for
part of the pantheon. The occasional finding of blackmorian devices could explain why the
fairies are more interested in MChina than in the nations in Brun.
Andre Martins
But be sure to do some research for appropriate Chinese names.
David Knott
Use with modifications - many of the types listed in, for instance, PC1 are far too
Western, but if we treat them as a template to build off of, modifying for cultural
variances, then we would not only have an excellent MChinese Celestial Court, but also the
basis for the MJapanese kami. They might even have contact with Oberon and Titania's
Seelie Court as 'our esteemed Imperial cousins in the distant barbarian lands,' and treat
them as distant near-equals.
Scott
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>>"Super-race" incarnating into important MChinese figures
NOT USE
However, there's nothing to say that individual MChinese heroes couldn't be secretly
Celestial Court Folk/kami/Immortal avatars/heroes who later became Immortals/mystic beings
in human form/heroes who were later taken by the Immortals as Titans or the like. After
all, in all the history and legend MChina's likely to have, it'd be surprising if most of
these hadn't happened at one time or another.
Scott
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THE BARBARIANS OF MORIENT
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>>Gabriele's excellent discourses on them
( I strongly suggest we use this one )
USE ( The only unanimous vote received )
This seems very well thought out and should be used. From reading the
Complete Barbarian's Handbook, one should keep in mind that barbarians typically fear
wizard spells as bad omens ('bad magicks'). Shaman, on the other hand, are openly
welcomed.
Estlor
With slight modifications - for instance, that the barbarian humanoids aren't necessarily
evil, just barbaric - akin to the real steppe tribesmen or the humanoids of the Broken
Lands. I also recommend that whoever ends up developing them do some sincere research into
the various steppe tribes of Asia - there's a lot of interesting distinctions and details
there just waiting to be used.
Scott
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>>The "Hairy Red Thing"
USE
Neutral on this one, but I do think that we should have some unique Eastern humanoids
(kappa, tengu, oni?) descended of the Beastmen, and this one sounds about as good as any,
I suppose.
Scott
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>>Jennite Horsemen barbarians from Steppes of Jen
USE
NATURE OF MORIENTAL DRAGONS
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>>More traditional oriental Dragons as emperors of MChina
USE
it's not real, but common people think it's true! [regarding the whole of MChina being a
dragon]
Gabriele
I think that oriental dragons need some place in Mystara, and if you
let the regular dragons in that would jepordize the placement of Oriental dragons.
And as for the MCHINA beign a dragon, well, that could use a little
tuning for use. It could be something similar to Ulimwengu, where the land is the only
thing the Karimari worship, and some (perhaps powerful artifact, like the one that created
the seers of Yavdlom) has embued the land with the "dragon" nature.
Estlor
Yes, but only metaphorically - people refer to the land as if it was a dragon, more
specifically as if it it were an extension of the Emperor. Place names based on
parts of a dragon's body are moderately common, and the weather and social climate
can be seen as the dragon's temper - 'The Emperor smiles on us today' if it is sunny and
pleasant, or 'the Dragon is rumbling' if the populace is growing frustrated of an
overbearing governor.
[Referring to the whol of MChina being a dragon]
Scott
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>>MOriental Dragon Riders
NOT USE
This would definitely seem to be a rather sacreligious idea, if all our other ideas come
about.
Scott
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>>Half-Dragon offspring of emperor
USE
although, I prefer true dragons.
Dragon King gets bored, abdicates to eldest child, goes away and doesn't care anymore.
That he doesn't care thereafter lets us have reigns based on the present Dragon King's
whims (in turn perhaps connected to his age).
Simon Seah
(but only if the emperor is actually a dragon)
Estlor
Very rare, and with human features.
Andre Martins
However, they're extremely rare - one in a generation would be an auspicious sign of
fertility, and many emperors go their whole lives without offspring.
Scott
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>>Dragon blood required for MChinese nobility
USE
I think only the Emperor requires dragon blood, but loyal and worthy
humans could become the remaining lesser nobility for the country.
Estlor
Perhaps not necessarily dragon, but some sort of special lineage
John
That is the law, but it is considered an insult, punishable by death if you are wrong, to
doubt the draconic blood of a rightful noble.
Andre Martins
Probably not for all levels of nobility, but definitely for the emperor.
Scott
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>>Dragon-kin riders
NOT USE
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>>MChina's emperor is SUPPOSED to be a dragon, but no-one knows
USE
if, by supposed, you mean "believed to be mythologically",in the manner that
Egyptians believed their pharoahs to trace lineage all the way to Ra, but they never did
anything to prove this, and people didn't care, then [USE]
Simon Seah
This could bring plenty of good adventures into existance...think of
the trouble a party would have to go through to check to see if the emperor has truly been
replaced by a mage or not. Everyone will think he is a dragon, but there will be no
evidence.
Estlor
I like the idea of a throne that no human may sit on, perhaps an artifact granted by the
Immortal patron of MChina (The Great One?). There have, however, been emperors who were
other races shapeshifted into human form, and even, once, when the humanoid barbarians
overran MChina, a gnoll who usurped the throne and held it for his entire lifespan
(paralleling the real Chinese dynasties of Mongol or other steppe barbarian conquerors).
Scott
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NATION OF MCHINA
>>It's name
Chung-Eun(Central Prime)
>>A Great Wall or alternative lengthy barrier
USE
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>>More magical power than Alphatia
NOT USE
on the condition that the draconian rulers (if we use them) are on par in political
ability and firepower with the Alphatian Council.
Simon Seah
As [much] magical power as Alphatia, but not so much organized.....
Gabriele
There certainly should be a lot of magic in MChina, but not the semi-organized,
wizards-behind-every-door magic of Alphatia. Instead, there are reclusive hermits with
celestial powers, colonies of mysterious magical animals who act like humans and with
great charms and potent secrets, hidden caves and glens where the spirits gather,
mysterious tomes and scrolls that are legacies of the great philosophers of the past,
minor divinations and charms used everyday that are *probably* just folk ritual but nobody
knows for sure... mystical happenings, superstitions, and strange and wonderous sights,
but relatively little organized, public magic.
Scott
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>>Land of Luxury with war under ground
TIE
The available material says too little about that one -- what is meant here?
David Knott
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>>National philosophy of dealing with foreign problems by avoidance
USE
....But could change during WotI events!!
Gabriele
Fits quite well with the real China's outlook at some points in the past.
Scott
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>>It's location
No consensus reached.
I don't have the Master's Map, so I'm not sure where area 10 is. My vote is for the
North & West shores of Tangor Bay, stretching up into the Eastern portion of the
Steppes of Jen. I think this includes part of Area 10, if I understood the posts
correctly. Please interpret this vote as however it fits best, but I think MChina should
definitely have access to the sea.
Patrick
I said this[other] because I think it's more than halfway to the Steppes of Jen, where the
wall between them would be.
David Melik
I don't think it sould be land locked, but also should not have alot of good coast lines.
John
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NATURE OF MCHINESE GREAT WALL
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( these three received the most votes)
Regular wall
Underground wall
Magical wall
The wall should definitely be substantial, and I think above-ground - a huge chasm is
mildly impressive, but the Wall should be impressive because it's man-made. And it should
be physical - humanoids, for instance, who are the ones it's most likely to be erected
against, aren't exactly going to be cowed by mere darkness, and would keep on charging
into a mind-affecting region time and time again until they get through by sheer
stubbornness and persistence, simply because most of them wouldn't understand what was
going on.
Scott
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NATION OF MJAPAN
>>The nation itself
USE
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>>It's name
Jiku Shiru
But still know by outsider as Zyxl, above assuming we are putting the nation at island of
Zyxl. Also, reading through the possible meaning of the name of Jiku Shiru, one
possibility might be "Know Root" Something to tell people to remember where they
come from.
John
As the one who proposed the name, I'd like to ask for some time so I can find a suitable
name composed entirely of kanji (the imported Chinese characters that convey meaning, not
just sound) - someone else suggested several meanings for Jikushiru, but they tended to
include the infinitive form of a verb, which I'm not sure is entirely appropriate. I'll
get back to you on this as soon as I get back to my kanji dictionary.
Scott
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>>Location
Island of Zyxl
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>>Founded by refugees from MChina
USE
One possibility, the island is settle by one of MChina's huge sea expediations that never
came back. Some historian actually belive this is how Japan got colonized.
John
Not entirely, at least - I think that some refugees would be appropriate, but having taken
a course on Japanese and Chinese history since I proposed this, I think that at most, they
would have founded only one of many uji, or small households/kingdoms that made up the
prehistory of MJapan.
Scott
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>>The island being formed out of a Dragon body
Ambiguous
In mythology I think it should be, if that's what you mean.
David Melik
...Not actually true, but MJapanese believe it
Gabriele
But this could be a common belief by the population
John
Probably as a legend, but it's worth thinking about. It doesn't have to be true, just what
people tell each other.
Scott
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>>The "Hero & (MChinese)Emperor" story as MJapanese history
Ambiguous
I want to at least get this into discussion - at this point I'm not sure whether I like
the idea or not, but it's at least potentially interesting.
Scott
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>>A matriarchal MJapan ( I REALLY like this idea too.. )
USE
assuming that it could be reasonably reconciled with the history of MJapan. If you build
MJapan from scratch, a mother-earth culture might conceivably lead to a matriarchal
society. Somehow they avoid a theological shift to worshipping patriarchal sky gods. Might
shape the content of MJ too much, though.
Simon Seah
If we decide to put MJapan at Zyxl, we should decide what sort of
climate it has. And if we going to have a tropical Zyxl, do we want another more
tradational MJapan.
John
Me too - and looking at actual Japanese history, it wouldn't require much of a change at
the start. (Many of the uji of Japan's prehistory were matriarchal, and there are tales of
a sun priestess-queen of one of the uji who might be connected to the actual Imperial
line...)
Scott
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NATION OF MMYANMAR
>>( Only one idea was presented, so... )
USE
NATION OF MTIBET
>>The nation itself
USE
>>Location
Nentsun Plateau region
GENERAL IDEAS REGARDING SKOTHAR
>>MInuit or MSiberian culture on Nentsun peninsula (Quarik city too.. )
USE
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>>Thonia inhabitted by people with bits of Blackmoor tech.
NOT USE
My major complaint about this is the contradiction it presents with the Blacklore Elves.
"Okay," say the Immortals, "we'll go to the trouble of creating magic items
that duplicate the function of Blackmoor tech but only within this one small valley of the
Hollow World so we can keep the Blacklore Elf culture alive without endangering the world
as Blackmoorian technology did before. Oh, and then we'll just leave such a huge cache of
extremely dangerous gadgets lying around in Thonia that an entire culture could develop
around them."
Scott
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>>Nentsun Plateau harbouring MTibet/MShangri-La hidden by hostile humanoids
USE
That would be a perfect place for the shrine where one or more of the Immortals receive
those who want his/her/its sponsorship for Immortality.
Andre Martins
And, for an ironic twist, MShangri-La is a paradisical city inhabited by peace-loving,
philosophical, friendly humanoids.
Scott
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>>Jennite Sword inhabitted by hositle humanoids
NOT USE
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>>Minean coast inhabitted by pirates & modeled after SE Asia
USE
Pirates from Japan was a huge problem for China, and pirates are still around SE asia
today.
John
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>>Tangor with an MEthiopian culture
USE
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>>MIndochina south and southwest of Tangor bay
USE
Perhaps, in fact, all of MSoutheast Asia could be in that general area and the
surroundings.
I'd also like to add one final suggestion - the Hollow World set maps show a
forested/grassy/jungle area on the southern coast of the Tangor Chain. If we use Zyxl as
MJapan, and any of the areas suggested as MChina, then this region is set up well to be an
MKorea, especialy as Korea was often used as a link between Japan and China in the real
world.
Scott