What are the favored weapons for armies of each city state?
Now what i've read in the FIRST boxed set, i can see that they use things which aren't presented in the "DS3" (i'm assumign they still each equip their soldiers differently because i saw the "draj sword" because it originated in draj...but any help is appreciated). Now, perhaps you could help clear this up for me.
Thanks
Here are some of my initial thoughts
Gulg: Various Bows and Arrows, Spears, Javelins, Daggers, Clubs, Datchi Clubs
Favored Materials: Bone and Wood (Agafari)
Urik: Long Swords, Bastard Swords, Two-Handed Swords, Short Swords, Crossbows, Mauls, Polearms, Lances
Favored Materials: Obsidian and Steel
Draj: Might Composite Long Bows, Macahuitals, Great Macahuitals, Javelins
Favored Materials: Obsidian and Wood
Second note...what's the diff between a "draj sword" and a longsword?
itf
The Armies of Nibenany are said to favor a weapon called a "gouge," a wicked-looking contraption that looks like a "combat shovel."
...described and stated in DS3 as a dragon paw, I think.
Tyr - obsidian and iron (as they have the mine).
Balic. Various polearms/pikes
Tyr. Roman Legions/Balic influences.
Urik. Babylon/anything goes
etc.
I personally tend to expand on this to mirror Greek and early Roman weaponry. I have some elite Balican phalanx units use longer lances similar to the Greek sarissa and carry rounded wooden shields and the short, erdlu-bone stabbing sword. Other non-phalanx units typically have a larger rectangular shield (similar to Roman shields and seen on page 33 of Veiled Alliance), the twelve-foot lances, and the stabbing swords. Balic doesn't tend to use archers, but does make use of light javelin skirmishers, crodlu cavalry, and sometimes chariots.
...described and stated in DS3 as a dragon paw, I think.
...described and stated in DS3 as a gouge, sorry Penn ;) .
The gouge is described in the original article in Dragon 185 as being used by the slave-armies of Nibenay.
Th crusher, described in the same article, is made from the cachava plant, which is native of the Ivory Plain. The weapon is also described as being used by 'troops', who are to be from Nibenay's armies as the gulgan warriors would not in my opinion use a weapon as the crusher.
I totally forgot about the crusher! What a cool weapon and an original ideal! I remember reading that crushers were most effective when deployed in a line. It is difficult to imagine an array of crusher's deployed on an open field (I think that they'd kick up too much dust), I could imagine an archer and someone armed with a crusher holding off scores of soldiers in a narrow canyon.
Also, I remember reading that the Armies of Nibenay were much more suited to orthodox, open-field battles, while Gulg's Armies were adept at jungle warfare, hit-and-run, guerilla tactics. I would imagine Gulgian units being almost completely eclectic, with a variety of weapons and armor between each individual (although they would favor small, hand-held weapons to long polearms). Nibenese units on the other hand, would probably have standardized weapons, armor and even uniforms.
It is interesting to imagine the two armies circling each other and trying to draw the other into terrain that would give them an advantage.
itf
When I think of Gulg weapns I think of the American Indian weapons- spears, bows, axes, knives, hammers. No formation and formal 'battlefield' more the raiding and harassing attacks that are designed to use smaller forces in quick leathal attacks that fade away before orginized resistance.
Nibenay I would see adapting hsi fighting force to counter his closest rival. He would not really use mounts (no good if you cannot charge into the trees), but using heavy infantry fighting in small box or square formations with shield and long spear in front and archer in the middle. Several box formation (each of no more then 100) would be close to one another to provide support yet still mobile.
Urik I think would use a mixture of medium infantry supported by light and heavy calavery troops mounted on battle trained crodlu or kanks. Of course there is alway Hamanu's personal guard- the 100 half-giants that could be used to create a breech in any opponents line.
Assegai- 1d8/X3 P/S weapon. Something like that martial weapon.
So kal sage you guys want to make a blow gun could be modeled after the modern ones a bit range increment would be 30 or 40 feet made of all wood of course. The darts would be 6 inches (US measurement) causing no more that 1D4 probably more like 1D3 in damage and used solely with injected poisons.
I know that poison use it the sole province of the bard in DS but because of the simple fact that they hunt so often wouldn’t they have developed this as a weapon/tool?
What do you guys think?
Balic: Long Spear, Heavy Wooden Shield, Bone Slodak
Suggested Feats: Spear Wall, Shield Wall, Phalanx Fighting, and Monkey Grip (Long Spear)
Possible Flavor Elements: Something akin to Greek Hoplites mixed in with Roman Heavy infantry known as the triarii (i believe). Highly skilled with the spear, using it in one hand while they protect themselves with with the spears. Able to form large walls and just have the spear stick out out towards the foolish charger
Draj: (Great) Macahuitl, Zerka (with rope attached, functions like a net when dragging someone)
Suggested Feats: Exotic Weapon Proficiency (Zerka), Power Attack, Far Shot, and Cleave
Possible Flavor Elements: Similar to the Later German Infantry whom almost exclusively used greatswords except with a hint of african style combat. Throw spear, pull sorry bugger there, destroy, and repeat.
Glug: (Composite) Great Bow (Complete Warrior, if not accessible, Longbow), Various Arrows (Races of the Wild), Poison, Stone or Wood Hand Axe, and Agafari Slodak.
Suggested Feats: Exotic Weapon Proficiency (Great Bow), Far Shot, Point Blank Shot, and Shot On the Run
Possible Flavor Elements: Something akin to that of the Native Americans. Hit and Run Tactics. Another additional contribution to their style would be English Longbowmen. Elite archers renowned for their mighty bows and astouning accuracy.
Nibenay: Agafari Long Spears, Gouge, Crusher, and Datchi Club
Suggested Feats: Weapon Focus (Gouge and/or Datchi Club), Power Attack, Cleave, and Exotic Weapon Proficiency (Crusher)
Possible Flavor Elements: Completely and utterly organized. Everything has to be carried out a certain way to provide ultimate support and defeat their primary adversary, Glug, whom has seemingly no need to traditional setup of an army.
Tyr: Iron Battle Axe, Iron Tipped Half-spear, Heavy Wooden Shield; Officers (Formerly Templars): Iron Bastard Swords
Suggested Feats: Sheild Wall, Power Attack, Cleave, Weapon Focus (Battle Axe), Powerful Charge (BAB +1 & medium or larger; +1d8 damage when you charge if you are Medium, +2d6 if you're Large)
Possible Flavor Elements: Something akin to Franko-German Wartactics. Hold true with your spear until it is broken, you throw it, or they get too close for it to be effective. Charge as much as possible, giving it almost the old germanic barbarian roots, giving yourself a powerful attack against foolish foes. Axe and spear are made simply because of ease of construction and conservation with
Raam: Light wooden Shield, Alhulak (bone), Flint Tipped Half Spear
Suggested Feats: None, too much chaos to have a regimented army, and even when the Sorcerer Queen was alive they didn't have a real army.
Possible Flavor Elements: Simple...structureless horde of conscripts
Urik: Macahuitl (One Handed), Impaler (or Heart Pick...yeah), Shortbow, Chitin Buckler, Crusher
Suggested Feats: Dodge, Mobility, Spring attack, Weapon Focus (Macahuitl), Power Attack
Possible Flavor Elements: Made for quick decisive strikes, using environment, stealth, and clever tactics to overpower any opposition. Using Driks are living seige engines and their High Driks wihch are combat juggernauts (rawr). Possible incorperating of Psionics in army (which would be REAL cool). First step, pepper up foes with shortbow, Set up Crushers, pull up some melee weapons, and destroy. Perhaps you have better ideas but i think that would be their description of Urik's Normal light Infantry
Besides Urik, i think that is the main chunk of almost all the other armies. Urik seems to me like it would be the most developed in the military sense. Tyr, it said somewhere that they kept a smaller army, and could defeat larger groups simply through superior weaponry. Nibenay would probably want heavy shields or armor (in this case armor because they want to kill the darn Glugs). They would also want heavy weapons to take out opposition quickly. Balic...i can just see like greece, sending out their army in leather armor, heavy shields, and spears along with short swords. Raam...not even gonna touch that; Glug: native americans all the way. Stay in the trees, shoot those darn nibenay warriors.
I love Urik...not sure EXACTLY...but i just have a thing for powerful leaders and military...Karrnath (eberron), Soviet Union...Urik...all similar boat to me. I could imagine his highly disciplined army have nothing to devote to heavy infantry, but light and medium all the way. They wanna keep mobility high, hence comes the calvary. I could see Urik having the only, or the largest (depends on how you would like to run it) Calvary in the world. Driks as generals in the army and big bad Hamanu leading it...Oh yes, definitely cool (he would use a iron greatsword...or flachion...yeah flachion).
That is how i picture it
Urik has four official weapons IIRC, at least according to Rise and Fall of a Dragon King.
All would-be templars of Urik must become proficient in FIVE weapons in order to join the templerate. I'll have to dig out the list, but from what I remember, they are...
sword
spear
sickle
uhh,...ah hell....and of course I can't find the list....
IIRC the other two are the
club
and staff
Gulg and Nibeney I don't see, since their rulers are getting along better, plus it doesn't coincide with my vision of those cities. Balic doesn't seem too likely to go aggressive at this point, as it's ruled by merchant houses. Draj is of course an opportunity, but it wouldn't be much of a war if it assaulted Raam (pretty much its only choice)...plus I want to keep Raam in its current chaotic state until I can run Dregoth Ascending.
Any other ideas would be much appreciated
I remember reading somewhere that Eldaarich's army is bolstered by units of the undead, however, I would imagine that they would also need living, breathing, thinking units as well. I can imagine the "Heartbeat Drums" coordinating a defense of the city, so perhaps drums would play an important role in organizing the army as well.
Kurn used to be an old Elven City, so maybe some of their weapons (longbow) or tactics would reflect that heritage...
itf
Or the Merchant Houses of Balic could set their sites on the hostile takeover of Celik.
How about the Armies of Eldaarich and Kurn? What kind of weapons and strategy would they employ?
Actually, I've had that in a campaign. Of course, I had it that the Army got to the gates of Old Kurn, and when they started fighting, soon they were also fighting each other, ended up more or less defeating themselves, and then retreated back to Eldaaritch.
I remember reading somewhere that Eldaarich's army is bolstered by units of the undead, however, I would imagine that they would also need living, breathing, thinking units as well. I can imagine the "Heartbeat Drums" coordinating a defense of the city, so perhaps drums would play an important role in organizing the army as well.
Kurn used to be an old Elven City, so maybe some of their weapons (longbow) or tactics would reflect that heritage...
itf
I thought it was Eldaaritch that was the "old Elven city". Bah, been a while since I looked it up. I don't really remember Daskinor relying too heavily on Undead tho... Then again, I just don't picture him doing anything remotely like "coordinating" any "war effort" (or at least, not for too long).
The way I have conceptualized the region is that Oronis actually looks out for Daskinor. Not that Oronis backs Daskinor's designs or anything. It is just that Oronis sees what a sick, twisted and lost individual Daskinor has become and he feels like he was headed down the same path at one time. He looks out for Daskinor out of a sense of guilt and obligation (the two were close during the Cleansing Wars...)
I do like the idea of chaos breaking out amongst Eldaarich's ranks and leaving everything in complete anarchy.
I also like the idea of a potential face off between Draj and Eldaarich.
itf
The weapon basically looked as the name implies. It was a normal spear with small barbs on the tip which could become lodged in the flesh and aid (bonus) the welder in bringing down prey/foes with trip attacks.
Actually, when I was asking about Eldaarich and Kurn, I meant "what weapons and tactics do you think their respective armies use?" -I actually wasn't trying to suggest that Eldaarich and Kurn slug it out.
The way I have conceptualized the region is that Oronis actually looks out for Daskinor. Not that Oronis backs Daskinor's designs or anything. It is just that Oronis sees what a sick, twisted and lost individual Daskinor has become and he feels like he was headed down the same path at one time. He looks out for Daskinor out of a sense of guilt and obligation (the two were close during the Cleansing Wars...)
Actually, I have had it where a group of Oronis' Templars are helping keep Daskinor's sanity is check as much as possible, while hiding within his midst, healing and helping where they could. Oronis both worries about, and fears (as well as fears for) Daskinor. The shattered mind there has the potential of throwing a monkeywrench in everything Oronis is trying to achieve, while at the same time, like you, I think that Oronis may see Daskinor havig gone down a path Oronis may have seen himself once on.
I do like the idea of chaos breaking out amongst Eldaarich's ranks and leaving everything in complete anarchy.
I also like the idea of a potential face off between Draj and Eldaarich.
itf
Agreed. Could be interesting.
Might be a little late in the conversation for this, but IMC I had the warriors/hunters of Gulg use a weapon called a "Gulgan barbed spear".
The weapon basically looked as the name implies. It was a normal spear with small barbs on the tip which could become lodged in the flesh and aid (bonus) the welder in bringing down prey/foes with trip attacks.
Isn't that what the zerka basically is Sysane ;)
I have been following this thread pretty closely becasue it will be a great aid to me, and I hope WolfHeart, in writing up entries for the NPC Guide. So please keep the ideas coming. I have been looking through the Ivory Triangle box set, the VA, and CSoT books to give me ideas of the weapons they would have based upon what they have- So Tyr would have a higher amount of iron weapons while Urik would most likely use obsidian. Just an FYI for those of you looking for and coming up with ideas.
Isn't that what the zerka basically is Sysane ;)
It is and it isn't. The barded spear is meant to be a melee weapon, not thrown. :P ;)
It is and it isn't. The barded spear is meant to be a melee weapon, not thrown. :P ;)
COOL a barded spear!!! What does it do? Kill bards? Is a bard strapped to it? Can you use poison with it?
[slap self] Sorry. I lost control there for a second. :D
Barbed weapons- That should be a feature that you could 'add' to a weapon like adding spikes to armor (when it is made). What would be a good price +1/2 base weapon cost? Double original cost? Interesting...
COOL a barded spear!!! What does it do? Kill bards? Is a bard strapped to it? Can you use poison with it?
He's here all week ladies and gents! Try the roast z'tal...
Also, I just wanted to note that when considering Urik's military capabilities its also important to consider House Stel's troops. If any merchant house were able to effectively wage war it would be House Stel. And they also seem the most likely to violate the part of the merchant code that forbids allegiance to any sorcerer-king.
Tyr's military is much more diversly equiped than anyother with a huge number of different exotic weapons employed by the large number of ex-gladiators serving in the crimson legion.
Exotic Weapons Dmg (S) Dmg (M) Critical Weight Type
One-Handed Melee Weapons
Juka 1d3 1d4 18-20/X2 2 lb. Slashing
Klaraka 1d6 1d8 X3 8 lb. Slashing
Two-Handed Melee Weapons
Bone dancer 1d6/1d6 1d8/1d8 X2 12 lb. Bludgeoning
Bone dancer: A primitive ancestor to the cahulak, the bone dancer consists of two massive mace-like animal thigh bones joined by a 5-foot rope. You may fight as if fighting with two weapons, but if you do, you incur all the normal attack penalties associated with fighting with a light off-hand weapon (see Two-weapon fighting, PHB Chapter 8). A creature using a double weapon in one hand, such as a half-giant using a set of bone dancers, can’t use it as a double weapon. Because the bone dancer can wrap around an enemy’s leg or other limb, you can make trip attacks with it. If you are tripped during your own trip attempt, you can drop the bone dancer to avoid being tripped. If you strike at an opponent 10 ft. away, you cannot use the bone dancer as a double weapon unless you possess natural reach.
Juka: The Juka or head-blade is the sacred dagger used by experienced Judaga and nobles to take their trophy. The slightly incurved bone blade has a grove carved in the center where molten metal was poured and shaped in a super sharp curve. A row of sharpened “teeth” of either obsidian or claws on the opposite side of the blade near the shaft can help saw off the head when the hunter comes across a particular tough spine.
Klaraka: The Klaraka or K’lar’s claw is a massive cleaver-like blade the length of a short sword. It is carved directly in the dark claw of the massive bear and its long handle is usually adorned with fur, hide and chips of teeth. It is considered a sacred weapon to the Bear-clan-brothers who ritualistically hunt the K’lar for honor and the cleansing of their spirits.