Secular Authority as Feat - Downloaded from the Wizards Community, all coding removed by Solauren

Secular Authority as Feat

Post/Author/DateTime Post
#1
bengeldorn
Jan 03, 2006 19:54:46 Based on the discussion of this thread (basically this part ) I've thought about how Secular Authority could look like as a feat. I know most of you won't like it, but the problem with Secualar Authority as it is now is, that it has the mechanics of the 3rd ed. bard's bardic music class feature (see the link above). This is a attempt to fullfill the criterias of the ability and make it 3.5 compatible. So when you take a look at this feat, try to take a look at the mechanics (DCs, check modes, etc...). I know there is room for improvement, and maybe you can help to improve it.

Secular Authority
You are a servant of a city-state to keep the law or request properties of the city.
Benefit: You can use the diplomacy skill within your city-state, as dicribed below, to request properties of the city and it's inhabitants, order inquiries, or call justice within your city-state. Secular authority can be used once per day per every four levels you attained (but see Special).
Accuse (DC = opposed check): You can have a subject imprisoned, awaiting the gathering of evidence against him by making an opposed Diplomacy check. For every point exceed the opposing check you can have the subject imprisoned for one day. If you loose the check, you can't accuse the same person for this day.
Intrude (DC = opposed check): You can search the home, person or possessions of a slave, person, freeman or noble by making a opposing Diplomacy check with affect person or the owner of the slave. If you loose the opposed check, you can't use your Secular Authority against the affected person for this day.
Judge (DC = opposed check): You can judge a suspect. Depending on how many points you exceed the opposed check you can set fines, prison sentence, or death sentence (see table below). You can also decide to judge something else, that is within the law.
#2
bengeldorn
Jan 13, 2006 6:39:52 I thought I should explain what my thoughts about this feat have been.

I tried to take another PoV for secular authority. With it's current rules it isn't (IMHO) in line with the rules of v3.5 (see link above for argumentations). The easiest way to meet the requirement by flavour and rules, was IMO to make secular as feat. I was somekind inspired by the mechanics of the Stunning Fist feat and they way it improves with the monk class. Additionally, I thought it would be a good idea that using secular authority would require a successfull diplomacy check (by DC or an opposed one). I realy liked the idea of the opposed diplomacy checks, because IMO some are "more difficult to judge" than others and I thought this is a good way to show this. In addition I added the "spend more attempt to improve one check"-mechanic. The reason for this was that I thought, that if a templar really wants to "judge" someone or "get" something he should be able to get it, but it takes him more effort than usuall. So by spending one (or more) of his daily allotment of his secular authority would increase his chances to get what he desires.

All this led to the rough pattern, which needs some improvement.
Here are some questions I have (maybe you have some others too).
Every additional use of secular authority for one use provides a +5 bonus on the diplomacy check. Is this ok or is it to high?
There are many conditional modifiars representet in the table, that increase a check or the opposed check. Are they ok, too high, or maybe even to low?
Some features of the secular authority have a fix DC. Is the DC ok? What should the DC be?
Any other questions you could have.

In addition to this I want to add two feats that would be intresting if, secular authority is used as a feat (or even if it still would a class feature only)

Extra Secular Authortiy
You can to make more decissions than usual.
Prerequisite: Secular authority.
Benefit: Each time you take this feat, you can use your secular authority ability two more times per day then normal.
Special:: You can gain Extra Secular Authority multiple times. Its effect stack. Each time you take the feat, you can use your secular authority ability two additional times per day.

Improved Secular Authority
Your word counts more than it usually does.
Prerequisite: Secular authority.
Benefit: You get a +4 bonus on all diplomacy checks made with secular authority.
#3
brun01
Jan 13, 2006 10:07:43 Good job, Bengeldorn, but I just think it would just be a lot simpler to use the same mechanics as the bardic music and create a feat that made Diplomacy a class skill....

The other two are very interesting! We made a similar feat on our website...
#4
bengeldorn
Jan 13, 2006 12:10:18
Good job, Bengeldorn, but I just think it would just be a lot simpler to use the same mechanics as the bardic music and create a feat that made Diplomacy a class skill....

Well as I allready stated before, the bardic music system works by ranks and class level. Creating a feat that would make Diplomacy a class skill still wouldn't change anything. Although I allready said this before I do it again so you can see what I mean.

As far as I understand it, secular authority should provide following aspects
Should be a class feature of the templar class.
The power of secular authority should be increasable without taking levels in the templer class.
Should follow the rules of D&D v3.5.
Should be balanced.

Current Secular Authority
Uses the bardic music system of 3.0 (not 3.5)
Is a class feature of the templer class.
Power increases by ranks in diplomacy not class levels
At least one level as templar or a PrC, that grants secular authority, must be taken.

My problem with the current rules is that is uses a 3.0-mechanic which was changed with the 3.5 release. IMO point 3 and point 4 aren't fullfilled.
Changing the mechanic to 3.5, point 3 and 4 are fullfilled, but point 2 isn't. Well this is one of four and can be fixed by a feat. I don't think a feat, that uses the mechanics of bardic music, would be a good idea (AFAIK there is no feat that grants bardic music), so I looked up other mechanics and I liked the Stunning Fist mechanic. Its a feat and a class feature. It's more powerfull as a class feature than it is as a feat. That's why I tried to change the mechanics accoridng to the Stunning Fist mechanic. In addition I preffered opposing checks for this ability as IMO fits better. The only thing I don't know yet is point 4. But this can be fixed by adjusting DCs and modifiers.

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
#1 bengeldorn Jan 03, 2006 19:54:46	Based on the discussion of this thread (basically this part ) I've thought about how Secular Authority could look like as a feat. I know most of you won't like it, but the problem with Secualar Authority as it is now is, that it has the mechanics of the 3rd ed. bard's bardic music class feature (see the link above). This is a attempt to fullfill the criterias of the ability and make it 3.5 compatible. So when you take a look at this feat, try to take a look at the mechanics (DCs, check modes, etc...). I know there is room for improvement, and maybe you can help to improve it. Secular Authority You are a servant of a city-state to keep the law or request properties of the city. Benefit: You can use the diplomacy skill within your city-state, as dicribed below, to request properties of the city and it's inhabitants, order inquiries, or call justice within your city-state. Secular authority can be used once per day per every four levels you attained (but see Special). Accuse (DC = opposed check): You can have a subject imprisoned, awaiting the gathering of evidence against him by making an opposed Diplomacy check. For every point exceed the opposing check you can have the subject imprisoned for one day. If you loose the check, you can't accuse the same person for this day. Intrude (DC = opposed check): You can search the home, person or possessions of a slave, person, freeman or noble by making a opposing Diplomacy check with affect person or the owner of the slave. If you loose the opposed check, you can't use your Secular Authority against the affected person for this day. Judge (DC = opposed check): You can judge a suspect. Depending on how many points you exceed the opposed check you can set fines, prison sentence, or death sentence (see table below). You can also decide to judge something else, that is within the law.
#2 bengeldorn Jan 13, 2006 6:39:52	I thought I should explain what my thoughts about this feat have been. I tried to take another PoV for secular authority. With it's current rules it isn't (IMHO) in line with the rules of v3.5 (see link above for argumentations). The easiest way to meet the requirement by flavour and rules, was IMO to make secular as feat. I was somekind inspired by the mechanics of the Stunning Fist feat and they way it improves with the monk class. Additionally, I thought it would be a good idea that using secular authority would require a successfull diplomacy check (by DC or an opposed one). I realy liked the idea of the opposed diplomacy checks, because IMO some are "more difficult to judge" than others and I thought this is a good way to show this. In addition I added the "spend more attempt to improve one check"-mechanic. The reason for this was that I thought, that if a templar really wants to "judge" someone or "get" something he should be able to get it, but it takes him more effort than usuall. So by spending one (or more) of his daily allotment of his secular authority would increase his chances to get what he desires. All this led to the rough pattern, which needs some improvement. Here are some questions I have (maybe you have some others too). Every additional use of secular authority for one use provides a +5 bonus on the diplomacy check. Is this ok or is it to high? There are many conditional modifiars representet in the table, that increase a check or the opposed check. Are they ok, too high, or maybe even to low? Some features of the secular authority have a fix DC. Is the DC ok? What should the DC be? Any other questions you could have. In addition to this I want to add two feats that would be intresting if, secular authority is used as a feat (or even if it still would a class feature only) Extra Secular Authortiy You can to make more decissions than usual. Prerequisite: Secular authority. Benefit: Each time you take this feat, you can use your secular authority ability two more times per day then normal. Special:: You can gain Extra Secular Authority multiple times. Its effect stack. Each time you take the feat, you can use your secular authority ability two additional times per day. Improved Secular Authority Your word counts more than it usually does. Prerequisite: Secular authority. Benefit: You get a +4 bonus on all diplomacy checks made with secular authority.
#3 brun01 Jan 13, 2006 10:07:43	Good job, Bengeldorn, but I just think it would just be a lot simpler to use the same mechanics as the bardic music and create a feat that made Diplomacy a class skill.... The other two are very interesting! We made a similar feat on our website...
#4 bengeldorn Jan 13, 2006 12:10:18	Good job, Bengeldorn, but I just think it would just be a lot simpler to use the same mechanics as the bardic music and create a feat that made Diplomacy a class skill.... Well as I allready stated before, the bardic music system works by ranks and class level. Creating a feat that would make Diplomacy a class skill still wouldn't change anything. Although I allready said this before I do it again so you can see what I mean. As far as I understand it, secular authority should provide following aspects Should be a class feature of the templar class. The power of secular authority should be increasable without taking levels in the templer class. Should follow the rules of D&D v3.5. Should be balanced. Current Secular Authority Uses the bardic music system of 3.0 (not 3.5) Is a class feature of the templer class. Power increases by ranks in diplomacy not class levels At least one level as templar or a PrC, that grants secular authority, must be taken. My problem with the current rules is that is uses a 3.0-mechanic which was changed with the 3.5 release. IMO point 3 and point 4 aren't fullfilled. Changing the mechanic to 3.5, point 3 and 4 are fullfilled, but point 2 isn't. Well this is one of four and can be fixed by a feat. I don't think a feat, that uses the mechanics of bardic music, would be a good idea (AFAIK there is no feat that grants bardic music), so I looked up other mechanics and I liked the Stunning Fist mechanic. Its a feat and a class feature. It's more powerfull as a class feature than it is as a feat. That's why I tried to change the mechanics accoridng to the Stunning Fist mechanic. In addition I preffered opposing checks for this ability as IMO fits better. The only thing I don't know yet is point 4. But this can be fixed by adjusting DCs and modifiers.