Treasure in Darksun - Downloaded from the Wizards Community, all coding removed by Solauren

Treasure in Darksun

Post/Author/DateTime Post
#1
dregonflyus
Jan 27, 2006 18:42:12 A quick question for Athas.org.

In 2nd ed they had a seperate table for the value of gems that was different from the DMG because of the rarity of gems and the different value of the currency of Darksun.

Do I follow the tables (3-3, 3-4, 3-5, 3-6, 3-7) in the 3.5 DM's Guide (pg 51-56) for rewarding treasure in Darksun campaigns?

Or is there some rule (official or fluff) somewhere (like the equipment chapter in DA 3.5 for weapon material cost) that I have missed that I could use to convert the tables in the 3.5 DMG (coins, gems, art objects) to the actual value in Darksun?
#2
ruhl-than_sage
Jan 27, 2006 21:03:06 I think the official stance is to convert the value of gems from gp to cp. Gems are still relatively common on athas. If it isn't than WOW! obsidian would be far too expensive a material to craft weapons out of.
#3
kalthandrix
Jan 28, 2006 0:52:46
I think the official stance is to convert the value of gems from gp to cp. Gems are still relatively common on athas. If it isn't than WOW! obsidian would be far too expensive a material to craft weapons out of.

But is obsidian really a gem stone? NIMO- So would it really be more expensive? The only reason obsidian is considered a semi-valuable stone in the 'real' is due to most people not living in a volcanic region- but Athas has several areas that do not suffer this lack so I do not think supply would be a driving factor in the pricing scale for obsidina in Athas.
#4
jon_oracle_of_athas
Jan 28, 2006 2:59:30
Do I follow the tables (3-3, 3-4, 3-5, 3-6, 3-7) in the 3.5 DM's Guide (pg 51-56) for rewarding treasure in Darksun campaigns?

Simply change the value from gold pieces to ceramic pieces. There are no replacement tables.
#5
zombiegleemax
Jan 28, 2006 4:26:48
But is obsidian really a gem stone? NIMO- So would it really be more expensive? The only reason obsidian is considered a semi-valuable stone in the 'real' is due to most people not living in a volcanic region- but Athas has several areas that do not suffer this lack so I do not think supply would be a driving factor in the pricing scale for obsidina in Athas.

Obsidian is clearly a special case: the cos will represent the difficulty of digging, transporting and processing it untill it becames a good base material for weapon and magic items...

Near the Deadlands the raw obsidian will litterally cost his weight in soil (like salt in a salt flat)
#6
ruhl-than_sage
Jan 28, 2006 7:02:39
Obsidian is clearly a special case: the cos will represent the difficulty of digging, transporting and processing it untill it becames a good base material for weapon and magic items...

Near the Deadlands the raw obsidian will litterally cost his weight in soil (like salt in a salt flat)

Good point. Both obsidian and salt are much more common and easily aquired on Athas than in euroupe during the middle ages (the traditional real world analog for D&D campaigns).
#7
dregonflyus
Jan 28, 2006 8:14:22
Simply change the value from gold pieces to ceramic pieces. There are no replacement tables.

Jon,
That seems simple enough but if metal weapons retain their normal value in Darksun then why would a gold bracelet or a mirror w/ a silver frame found in some ruin be converted to cp value as well?

So I should convert everything down into cp (including gems), and keep metal objects at their normal value as stated in the DS3.5?
#8
zombiegleemax
Jan 28, 2006 8:25:05
Jon,
That seems simple enough but if metal weapons retain their normal value in Darksun then why would a gold bracelet or a mirror w/ a silver frame found in some ruin be converted to cp value as well?

So I should convert everything down into cp (including gems), and keep metal objects at their normal value as stated in the DS3.5?

That is true but if you did your wealth by level would be off. If I rolled a gold bracelet it would become a gold pinky ring. If I rolled a silver mirror it would become a small metal pin or a mirror in a chitten shell.
#9
jon_oracle_of_athas
Jan 29, 2006 4:06:02
That seems simple enough but if metal weapons retain their normal value in Darksun then why would a gold bracelet or a mirror w/ a silver frame found in some ruin be converted to cp value as well?So I should convert everything down into cp (including gems), and keep metal objects at their normal value as stated in the DS3.5?
Yes and no. Yes - Metal items' value is not converted to Cp, as stated in DS3.5. No - you should do as Elonarc proposes, otherwise you could throw the treasure level in your campaign out of balance - giving out too much treasure.
#10
huntercc
Jan 29, 2006 10:31:19
...you should do as Elonarc proposes,...

Actually I think you got the wrong pikachu ;)
#11
ruhl-than_sage
Jan 29, 2006 11:42:56
Actually I think you got the wrong pikachu ;)

:heehee :D

The conversion to cp is only for non-metal things. If an object would normally contain a large amount of metal, either replace the metal with a more common substance or retain a higher value for it. Gold, Silver, and Copper all have set and easily identified values in the setting. The value of iron is a little more vague, but seems to be worth about the same as it's wieght in silver. Platinum would make an item nearly priceless and Brass and Bronze would likely have value around 150-200% that of ordinary copper. Tin would have value merely for combining with copper as would zinc, but only to those few individuals who actually knew what it was.

I think you really have to use your own judgement when dealing with art objects that are partially or entirely made out of metal, and when dealing with other the material value of non-precious metals. P33KAJ3W's example of shrinking things makes sense as a solution as well.
#12
dregonflyus
Jan 29, 2006 12:18:05 Thanks everyone!

Is it me or does it seem that the Pikachus are takeing over? If needed, I do have a few pokeballs with rock pokemon in them to take care of the little yellow rodents :P
#13
elonarc
Jan 29, 2006 17:00:55 IMAGE(http://www.gokufievel.com/images/pikabattle1.jpg)
#14
dregonflyus
Jan 30, 2006 3:55:56
#15
gilliard_derosan
Jan 30, 2006 8:14:20 Converting to cp is not as problematic as one might think. Yeah, there is the metal value, but I have little trouble slipping in metal goblets, or full stand mirrors that are worth only 2-4 gold relatively. Sure, there is sometimes enough metal to forge 2-3 longswords, but it has been refined so much in the artistic process, that it would be too soft/flawed if formed into weapons, so it retains less of it's "material" value and more of it's artistic value. How often have you seen a bracelet or ring that is bent because too much pressure was put on it? Heck, my wedding is warped to no end because it is very soft. Art objects and ceremonial weapons are not meant to be used in combat. They would fetch less than a normal weapon if based purely on function.

So you can throw that in if your players pull the "But look how much metal is here.. they are trying to rob us.. lets melt it down and make some swords to sell instead".. then you just have the guy appraise the swords, point out that the metal is weak.. (even going to far as to reduce it's hardness and HP), have him slash at some object nearby only to have the sword bend.. then offer even less than what he was offering for the art piece in question, because now it no longer even has artistic value.

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
#1 dregonflyus Jan 27, 2006 18:42:12	A quick question for Athas.org. In 2nd ed they had a seperate table for the value of gems that was different from the DMG because of the rarity of gems and the different value of the currency of Darksun. Do I follow the tables (3-3, 3-4, 3-5, 3-6, 3-7) in the 3.5 DM's Guide (pg 51-56) for rewarding treasure in Darksun campaigns? Or is there some rule (official or fluff) somewhere (like the equipment chapter in DA 3.5 for weapon material cost) that I have missed that I could use to convert the tables in the 3.5 DMG (coins, gems, art objects) to the actual value in Darksun?
#2 ruhl-than_sage Jan 27, 2006 21:03:06	I think the official stance is to convert the value of gems from gp to cp. Gems are still relatively common on athas. If it isn't than WOW! obsidian would be far too expensive a material to craft weapons out of.
#3 kalthandrix Jan 28, 2006 0:52:46	I think the official stance is to convert the value of gems from gp to cp. Gems are still relatively common on athas. If it isn't than WOW! obsidian would be far too expensive a material to craft weapons out of. But is obsidian really a gem stone? NIMO- So would it really be more expensive? The only reason obsidian is considered a semi-valuable stone in the 'real' is due to most people not living in a volcanic region- but Athas has several areas that do not suffer this lack so I do not think supply would be a driving factor in the pricing scale for obsidina in Athas.
#4 jon_oracle_of_athas Jan 28, 2006 2:59:30	Do I follow the tables (3-3, 3-4, 3-5, 3-6, 3-7) in the 3.5 DM's Guide (pg 51-56) for rewarding treasure in Darksun campaigns? Simply change the value from gold pieces to ceramic pieces. There are no replacement tables.
#5 zombiegleemax Jan 28, 2006 4:26:48	But is obsidian really a gem stone? NIMO- So would it really be more expensive? The only reason obsidian is considered a semi-valuable stone in the 'real' is due to most people not living in a volcanic region- but Athas has several areas that do not suffer this lack so I do not think supply would be a driving factor in the pricing scale for obsidina in Athas. Obsidian is clearly a special case: the cos will represent the difficulty of digging, transporting and processing it untill it becames a good base material for weapon and magic items... Near the Deadlands the raw obsidian will litterally cost his weight in soil (like salt in a salt flat)
#6 ruhl-than_sage Jan 28, 2006 7:02:39	Obsidian is clearly a special case: the cos will represent the difficulty of digging, transporting and processing it untill it becames a good base material for weapon and magic items... Near the Deadlands the raw obsidian will litterally cost his weight in soil (like salt in a salt flat) Good point. Both obsidian and salt are much more common and easily aquired on Athas than in euroupe during the middle ages (the traditional real world analog for D&D campaigns).
#7 dregonflyus Jan 28, 2006 8:14:22	Simply change the value from gold pieces to ceramic pieces. There are no replacement tables. Jon, That seems simple enough but if metal weapons retain their normal value in Darksun then why would a gold bracelet or a mirror w/ a silver frame found in some ruin be converted to cp value as well? So I should convert everything down into cp (including gems), and keep metal objects at their normal value as stated in the DS3.5?
#8 zombiegleemax Jan 28, 2006 8:25:05	Jon, That seems simple enough but if metal weapons retain their normal value in Darksun then why would a gold bracelet or a mirror w/ a silver frame found in some ruin be converted to cp value as well? So I should convert everything down into cp (including gems), and keep metal objects at their normal value as stated in the DS3.5? That is true but if you did your wealth by level would be off. If I rolled a gold bracelet it would become a gold pinky ring. If I rolled a silver mirror it would become a small metal pin or a mirror in a chitten shell.
#9 jon_oracle_of_athas Jan 29, 2006 4:06:02	That seems simple enough but if metal weapons retain their normal value in Darksun then why would a gold bracelet or a mirror w/ a silver frame found in some ruin be converted to cp value as well?So I should convert everything down into cp (including gems), and keep metal objects at their normal value as stated in the DS3.5? Yes and no. Yes - Metal items' value is not converted to Cp, as stated in DS3.5. No - you should do as Elonarc proposes, otherwise you could throw the treasure level in your campaign out of balance - giving out too much treasure.
#10 huntercc Jan 29, 2006 10:31:19	...you should do as Elonarc proposes,... Actually I think you got the wrong pikachu ;)
#11 ruhl-than_sage Jan 29, 2006 11:42:56	Actually I think you got the wrong pikachu ;) :heehee :D The conversion to cp is only for non-metal things. If an object would normally contain a large amount of metal, either replace the metal with a more common substance or retain a higher value for it. Gold, Silver, and Copper all have set and easily identified values in the setting. The value of iron is a little more vague, but seems to be worth about the same as it's wieght in silver. Platinum would make an item nearly priceless and Brass and Bronze would likely have value around 150-200% that of ordinary copper. Tin would have value merely for combining with copper as would zinc, but only to those few individuals who actually knew what it was. I think you really have to use your own judgement when dealing with art objects that are partially or entirely made out of metal, and when dealing with other the material value of non-precious metals. P33KAJ3W's example of shrinking things makes sense as a solution as well.
#12 dregonflyus Jan 29, 2006 12:18:05	Thanks everyone! Is it me or does it seem that the Pikachus are takeing over? If needed, I do have a few pokeballs with rock pokemon in them to take care of the little yellow rodents :P
#13 elonarc Jan 29, 2006 17:00:55
#14 dregonflyus Jan 30, 2006 3:55:56
#15 gilliard_derosan Jan 30, 2006 8:14:20	Converting to cp is not as problematic as one might think. Yeah, there is the metal value, but I have little trouble slipping in metal goblets, or full stand mirrors that are worth only 2-4 gold relatively. Sure, there is sometimes enough metal to forge 2-3 longswords, but it has been refined so much in the artistic process, that it would be too soft/flawed if formed into weapons, so it retains less of it's "material" value and more of it's artistic value. How often have you seen a bracelet or ring that is bent because too much pressure was put on it? Heck, my wedding is warped to no end because it is very soft. Art objects and ceremonial weapons are not meant to be used in combat. They would fetch less than a normal weapon if based purely on function. So you can throw that in if your players pull the "But look how much metal is here.. they are trying to rob us.. lets melt it down and make some swords to sell instead".. then you just have the guy appraise the swords, point out that the metal is weak.. (even going to far as to reduce it's hardness and HP), have him slash at some object nearby only to have the sword bend.. then offer even less than what he was offering for the art piece in question, because now it no longer even has artistic value.