Templar Pros.
1. More Skill points. With 4 skill points/level the Templar is a skill monkey compared to the Cleric and has a decent skill list.
2. Spontaneous Casting. A Templar can cast all of there known spells spontaneously. Not as big of an edge however as Clerics can spontaneously cast heal spells.
3. Better weapons. 2 free martial weapons. Useful for the low level Templar or for a Templar wanting a 2 handed weapon as the Longspear can't be used on foes withen 5'ft. Not overly useful at higher levels though.
4. Secular Authority. Kinda situational but the Cleric gets no class abilities apart from turn undead.
5. Sigil. Not great but its better than nothing.
Templar Cons
1. Weaker at turning undead.
2. Less spells. A cleric can gain access to all spells on the cleric spell list. Partly compensated by the fact most clerics use a handful of spells again and again and again etc.
3. Delayed spell aquisition. A Templar recieves their highest level spell slot a level behind the cleric..
4. Often less spells. Low level Templars while knowing one more spell per spell level than an equivilent level cleric miss out on higher level spells a cleric knows. Often with a single spell+ bonus spell+ domain spell a cleric has 3 spells known that are a level higher than the templar can cast. At every even level a Templar may have a slight edge while at every odd level the cleric is better IMHO.
5.4. No domain granted powers
My PCs have alevel 6 Templar in the party and has only started to be effective now apart from as a support character. They are ok at lower levels but the Cleric in the party was better. However I suspect as the Templar levels up and learns more spells the differences will even out as both classes will probably use alot of the same spells- Divine Power/Favor, Righteous Might, Heal, etc. I've also houseruled that elemental clerics can only cast spells of their element which means the water cleric in the party will be unable to cast Flamestrike for example.
Not all templars need to be played as the evil incarnate agent of an SK.
(although that can be fun too
)Just my 2p
second, the gaming oppertunities provided by templars are great, espeically if you play in the current timeline, as it allows for wonderful exploration. a party in service to a SK need not be evil, and they may be working towards goals that a more "normal" party may not. depending on your play style, it could be a very interesting campaing to have a templar based group (some templars, maybe one of xplore's paladins, and a royal mage) that is working politically within the city. anyway, just a few ideas.
personally, in the city, templars are more flavorful, but the wilderness cries out for clerics. tribes can be made very interesting based on what type of clerics they prefer. the elf tribes in the elves of athas book are a great example, and this can be applied to slave tribes and even merchant houses as well.
just my thoughts, hope it helps
Spontaneous Casting. A Templar can cast all of there known spells spontaneously. Not as big of an edge however as Clerics can spontaneously cast heal spells.
Templars have access to cure spells on their spell list and thus can cast them spontaneously in addition to all their other chosen spells, so I have to disagree.
From a strictly mechanical standpoint, a high level cleric could certainly hold his own in one on one combat with an equal level templar. More importantly however, the templar often has the authority to call upon a wide array of resources to accomplish his goals including lower level templars and many valuable possessions held by people within his (or her) jurisdiction.
To play a templar to its full potential requires a lot more investment in the political aspect than attention to raw digits.
Templars have access to cure spells on their spell list and thus can cast them spontaneously in addition to all their other chosen spells, so I have to disagree.
But they still don't get that many spells. A cleric effectively gets access to all the cure spells whenever they want. A Templar taking a cure spell at each level is drastically reducing the amount of spells known.
But they still don't get that many spells. A cleric effectively gets access to all the cure spells whenever they want. A Templar taking a cure spell at each level is drastically reducing the amount of spells known.
True! Amen! And where the hell are the lightning bolts and flamestrikes?! I say they should get at least one more spell known per level, and make it an aggresive one, since I always thought templars were the 'aggresive priest' style. Why can't they us lightning bolts and flamestrikes as in all the books? Why do we have the Elemental Strike? No fire? Divine Energy? What?! Their spell list is petty and weak. Dump out the utility spells, dump out the defense! Add new aggresive spells! If a templar doesn't fight, he dies by the hand of his king or queen, so where's the aggresive style they would have from that approach? "Hear me, o great one, grant me earthquake and defense, lest I die!" a templar pleads to Hamanu! Not without a reason! Earthquakes! Shield of faith we got, but a cleric 8th lvl spell such as earthquake? No? Why?
Erhmmm.. :D Let's give it another shot. SKs channel elemental energy from somewhere via Dark Lens, right? Right. So. Elemental Strike should in fact deal d10/level elemental energy, right? Right. It deals divine energy. SKs are NOT deivine beings so how is this exactly possible? Ah - you'll say - it's not divine damage but elemental damage, only the effect is divine. I say - then better heed your writings since the flamestrike deals half fire, half divine energy, which is a special type of energy, not subject to resistance. Damn the Elemental strike! Long live the purists! Flamestrike!
Now, we move to Earthquake. It simply has to be added. There is no better spell to cast onto the enemy army marching towards your camp. Templars simply have to have it, just as in the books. Viva la revolution!
Next is the Lightning Bolt. Ok, not the Mage Lightning bolt as such, but some alternative. Call lightning is a good example, but a directed lightning bolt that spiked from the templar's sigil towards the target, as a 2nd or 3rd lvl spell is a better idea. Scorch the unbeliever! Damn the heretic!
I'll come up with more ideas later.
Its true, the DS3 standard templar spell list is lacking Lighting Bolt, even though a templar shoots one in the very first page of the very first DS short story, the one found in the Boxed Set: A Little Knowledge.
Considering they have to select their spells it would be nice if they had a better list to select from
Yeah, that is something that has been bugging me for awhile too.
I fail to see the fuzz about Flame Strike when Elemental Strike is a Flame Strike duplicate that allows a templar to use any form of energy, even electricity. The description should conform with the one in the PHB. Whether the SKs are divine or not is irrelevant, the spell energy channeled is as per the Flame Strike spell.
I don't know where you got the impression that spells granted to templars are channeled through the Dark Lens. Please quote a source.
I don't know where you got the impression that spells granted to templars are channeled through the Dark Lens. Please quote a source.
Umm.. RaFotDK? I know it's a bit ..*wiggle fingers*.. but it's the impression i got from reading that book. Elemental energy->dark lens->SK->templars. I can even quote the exact refference and page but it'll take some page-flipping. If needed say so and I'll do it. If I'm wrong please correct me.
Nevermind the damn elemental strike, it *is* irrelevant, it's just that the damn lightning bolt gives a touch to the templar no other divine spellcasting class has.
Even the damn sigil should have the protection, if the templar is in some of the prestige classes linked to their town (yellow robe for urik, wife of nibenay for nibenay etc.). That electricity protection has been used since chronicles of athas book 1, to recognize a high-level templar no matter what he's dressed like.
Can you at least put that in as, say, d6 electric jolt that hits fingers that touch it with no save? Perhaps at higher levels that same jolt can be cast over greater distances to form an alternate version of the lightning bolt?
I don't know where you got the impression that spells granted to templars are channeled through the Dark Lens. Please quote a source.
Heh, you should read again the infamous and highly unoffical RaFoaDK! :P
I did not think of the Elemental Strike spell. Its all good then. "Lighting bolt" was the term used in the short story, not an actual mention of a spell's name.