Avangion Build - Downloaded from the Wizards Community, all coding removed by Solauren

Avangion Build

Post/Author/DateTime Post
#1
zombiegleemax
Feb 24, 2006 10:42:59 True, this type of thread is usually more at place in the Char Op boards, but I figured I'd get more flavor and useful advice here (as opposed to just raw number crunch). To lay out a few houserules/variations/etc being used here ahead of time.

Cerbremancer change: Psionic-Familiar. We felt the first level ability of the arcane heirophant (To combine your familiar and companion) was a nifty idea and perfectly at home in other classes. So we added such things to the Cerbremance (For Psi-Familiar).

We do allow the Precocious Apprentice Feat from Complete Arcane.

We houserule that Familiars, Psi-Crystals, Companions etc all advance based on your casting ability, not your pure class (IE a Mage 3, Psi 3, Cerbremancer 10 has a Psionic-Familiar with the powers of level 13 Mage and Psion).

We also worked and assumed that the requirements for the Avangion are like that of the Dragon (24 Ranks Arcana and Psionic knowledge, 2 Meta Spell, 2 Meta Psionic, Great Fortitude, 9th level spells, 6th level powers, Preserver Metamorphis 1 Spell.

Now for the build I have so far. I'm currently looking at Preserver 1/Psion 3/Cerbremancer 10/Restorationist 1/Human Paragon 3
My Stats are (at level 18) Str 10, Dex 16, Con 18, Int 21, Wis 16, Cha 12

The Feats I've taken in the build are: Precocious Apprentice (Human), Path Dexter (Lvl 1), PsiCrystal Affinity (Psion), Improved Familiar (Lvl 3), (Open Lvl 6 feat), Craft Wonderous Item (Lvl 9), Great Fortitude (Lvl 12), Unconditional Power (Human Paragon), (Open MetaPsionic Feat, Lvl 15), (Open Metamagic Feat, Lvl 18), (Open Metamagic Feat, Lvl 21).

Was planning on a Tigone for my familiar.

Now that leaves levels 19-21 open, all of which need to be caster levels in order to meet the Avangion Requirements. I have no idea what to pick for these levels and how to run with them. Which is where my questions lie, suggestions? The Obvious choice is to just continue with Restorationist, netting 4th level potion fruits and a talk to plant ability. But I thoud I'd see if anyone else had other ideas that popped out.

I also have no idea for what to take as my 6th level feat (pondering Leadership, but I almost ALWAYS take leadership, thought I might avoid running to characters for a change, specially since this character follows a Thrallherd)

And with that out of the way, the character concept is a bit of a borrow from Brazen Gambit ideas. The character is from Kurn, though doesn't currently know it. He's a consumate Cautious wait and see, almost "coward" in approach. Not that he is a coward, just that he's more concerned about surviving and reaching his end goal (where he feels he can do something worthwhile). He has a block on his memories, he doesn't know about Kurn, or about the Avangion Metamorphisis, or Oronis. Only that something great and good will come about if he can become a powerful enough perserver and mindbender. OOG explanation: He has his mind blocked till he hits level 21, when he'll be able to remember Kurn, Oronis and the Avangion's path).
#2
ruhl-than_sage
Feb 24, 2006 20:45:22
We houserule that Familiars, Psi-Crystals, Companions etc all advance based on your casting ability, not your pure class (IE a Mage 3, Psi 3, Cerbremancer 10 has a Psionic-Familiar with the powers of level 13 Mage and Psion).

OK, I'll repeat this again. Psicrystals powers are not based on a single class. They are a feat, not a class feature. It says on page 20 of the XPH and I quote:

"Psicrystal abilities are based abilities are based on the owner's levels in psionic classes. Levels from other classes do not count toward the owner's level for purposes of psicrystal abilities."

So any class that grants even a single manifester level, or requires psionic powers to enter will increase the power of your psicrystal at every level, as will Soulknife.
#3
zombiegleemax
Feb 25, 2006 8:28:30 And so we remove the word PsiCrystal and still have the point I was trying to make...
#4
ruhl-than_sage
Feb 25, 2006 8:36:45
And so we remove the word PsiCrystal and still have the point I was trying to make...

Sorry, I understand that that wasn't the point of your post. I'm just frustrated at the fact that no one seems to catch that. Even some of the people who are "experts" on psionic didn't know that, until I pointed it out to them. I bet half the people on the CO boards are mixed up about it.

Loremaster is a good PrC if you qualify, I would take Practiced Caster as your 6th level feat.
#5
zombiegleemax
Mar 03, 2006 12:53:50
True, this type of thread is usually more at place in the Char Op boards, but I figured I'd get more flavor and useful advice here (as opposed to just raw number crunch). To lay out a few houserules/variations/etc being used here ahead of time.

Cerbremancer change: Psionic-Familiar. We felt the first level ability of the arcane heirophant (To combine your familiar and companion) was a nifty idea and perfectly at home in other classes. So we added such things to the Cerbremance (For Psi-Familiar).

We do allow the Precocious Apprentice Feat from Complete Arcane.

We houserule that Familiars, Psi-Crystals, Companions etc all advance based on your casting ability, not your pure class (IE a Mage 3, Psi 3, Cerbremancer 10 has a Psionic-Familiar with the powers of level 13 Mage and Psion).

We also worked and assumed that the requirements for the Avangion are like that of the Dragon (24 Ranks Arcana and Psionic knowledge, 2 Meta Spell, 2 Meta Psionic, Great Fortitude, 9th level spells, 6th level powers, Preserver Metamorphis 1 Spell.

Now for the build I have so far. I'm currently looking at Preserver 1/Psion 3/Cerbremancer 10/Restorationist 1/Human Paragon 3
My Stats are (at level 18) Str 10, Dex 16, Con 18, Int 21, Wis 16, Cha 12

The Feats I've taken in the build are: Precocious Apprentice (Human), Path Dexter (Lvl 1), PsiCrystal Affinity (Psion), Improved Familiar (Lvl 3), (Open Lvl 6 feat), Craft Wonderous Item (Lvl 9), Great Fortitude (Lvl 12), Unconditional Power (Human Paragon), (Open MetaPsionic Feat, Lvl 15), (Open Metamagic Feat, Lvl 18), (Open Metamagic Feat, Lvl 21).

Was planning on a Tigone for my familiar.

Now that leaves levels 19-21 open, all of which need to be caster levels in order to meet the Avangion Requirements. I have no idea what to pick for these levels and how to run with them. Which is where my questions lie, suggestions? The Obvious choice is to just continue with Restorationist, netting 4th level potion fruits and a talk to plant ability. But I thoud I'd see if anyone else had other ideas that popped out.

If you allow and have access to the Mind Mage prestige class from Dragon Magazine, I'd go with 10 levels of that as soon as eligible instead of completing cebremancer right away and then use cebremancer as your fill class to get the +1 / +1. MM doesn't give a +1 to both every level, but it more than makes up for it in abilities. Might take you an extra 2 or three levels to qualify for avangion, but you'll be significantly better off.

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
#1 zombiegleemax Feb 24, 2006 10:42:59	True, this type of thread is usually more at place in the Char Op boards, but I figured I'd get more flavor and useful advice here (as opposed to just raw number crunch). To lay out a few houserules/variations/etc being used here ahead of time. Cerbremancer change: Psionic-Familiar. We felt the first level ability of the arcane heirophant (To combine your familiar and companion) was a nifty idea and perfectly at home in other classes. So we added such things to the Cerbremance (For Psi-Familiar). We do allow the Precocious Apprentice Feat from Complete Arcane. We houserule that Familiars, Psi-Crystals, Companions etc all advance based on your casting ability, not your pure class (IE a Mage 3, Psi 3, Cerbremancer 10 has a Psionic-Familiar with the powers of level 13 Mage and Psion). We also worked and assumed that the requirements for the Avangion are like that of the Dragon (24 Ranks Arcana and Psionic knowledge, 2 Meta Spell, 2 Meta Psionic, Great Fortitude, 9th level spells, 6th level powers, Preserver Metamorphis 1 Spell. Now for the build I have so far. I'm currently looking at Preserver 1/Psion 3/Cerbremancer 10/Restorationist 1/Human Paragon 3 My Stats are (at level 18) Str 10, Dex 16, Con 18, Int 21, Wis 16, Cha 12 The Feats I've taken in the build are: Precocious Apprentice (Human), Path Dexter (Lvl 1), PsiCrystal Affinity (Psion), Improved Familiar (Lvl 3), (Open Lvl 6 feat), Craft Wonderous Item (Lvl 9), Great Fortitude (Lvl 12), Unconditional Power (Human Paragon), (Open MetaPsionic Feat, Lvl 15), (Open Metamagic Feat, Lvl 18), (Open Metamagic Feat, Lvl 21). Was planning on a Tigone for my familiar. Now that leaves levels 19-21 open, all of which need to be caster levels in order to meet the Avangion Requirements. I have no idea what to pick for these levels and how to run with them. Which is where my questions lie, suggestions? The Obvious choice is to just continue with Restorationist, netting 4th level potion fruits and a talk to plant ability. But I thoud I'd see if anyone else had other ideas that popped out. I also have no idea for what to take as my 6th level feat (pondering Leadership, but I almost ALWAYS take leadership, thought I might avoid running to characters for a change, specially since this character follows a Thrallherd) And with that out of the way, the character concept is a bit of a borrow from Brazen Gambit ideas. The character is from Kurn, though doesn't currently know it. He's a consumate Cautious wait and see, almost "coward" in approach. Not that he is a coward, just that he's more concerned about surviving and reaching his end goal (where he feels he can do something worthwhile). He has a block on his memories, he doesn't know about Kurn, or about the Avangion Metamorphisis, or Oronis. Only that something great and good will come about if he can become a powerful enough perserver and mindbender. OOG explanation: He has his mind blocked till he hits level 21, when he'll be able to remember Kurn, Oronis and the Avangion's path).
#2 ruhl-than_sage Feb 24, 2006 20:45:22	We houserule that Familiars, Psi-Crystals, Companions etc all advance based on your casting ability, not your pure class (IE a Mage 3, Psi 3, Cerbremancer 10 has a Psionic-Familiar with the powers of level 13 Mage and Psion). OK, I'll repeat this again. Psicrystals powers are not based on a single class. They are a feat, not a class feature. It says on page 20 of the XPH and I quote: "Psicrystal abilities are based abilities are based on the owner's levels in psionic classes. Levels from other classes do not count toward the owner's level for purposes of psicrystal abilities." So any class that grants even a single manifester level, or requires psionic powers to enter will increase the power of your psicrystal at every level, as will Soulknife.
#3 zombiegleemax Feb 25, 2006 8:28:30	And so we remove the word PsiCrystal and still have the point I was trying to make...
#4 ruhl-than_sage Feb 25, 2006 8:36:45	And so we remove the word PsiCrystal and still have the point I was trying to make... Sorry, I understand that that wasn't the point of your post. I'm just frustrated at the fact that no one seems to catch that. Even some of the people who are "experts" on psionic didn't know that, until I pointed it out to them. I bet half the people on the CO boards are mixed up about it. Loremaster is a good PrC if you qualify, I would take Practiced Caster as your 6th level feat.
#5 zombiegleemax Mar 03, 2006 12:53:50	True, this type of thread is usually more at place in the Char Op boards, but I figured I'd get more flavor and useful advice here (as opposed to just raw number crunch). To lay out a few houserules/variations/etc being used here ahead of time. Cerbremancer change: Psionic-Familiar. We felt the first level ability of the arcane heirophant (To combine your familiar and companion) was a nifty idea and perfectly at home in other classes. So we added such things to the Cerbremance (For Psi-Familiar). We do allow the Precocious Apprentice Feat from Complete Arcane. We houserule that Familiars, Psi-Crystals, Companions etc all advance based on your casting ability, not your pure class (IE a Mage 3, Psi 3, Cerbremancer 10 has a Psionic-Familiar with the powers of level 13 Mage and Psion). We also worked and assumed that the requirements for the Avangion are like that of the Dragon (24 Ranks Arcana and Psionic knowledge, 2 Meta Spell, 2 Meta Psionic, Great Fortitude, 9th level spells, 6th level powers, Preserver Metamorphis 1 Spell. Now for the build I have so far. I'm currently looking at Preserver 1/Psion 3/Cerbremancer 10/Restorationist 1/Human Paragon 3 My Stats are (at level 18) Str 10, Dex 16, Con 18, Int 21, Wis 16, Cha 12 The Feats I've taken in the build are: Precocious Apprentice (Human), Path Dexter (Lvl 1), PsiCrystal Affinity (Psion), Improved Familiar (Lvl 3), (Open Lvl 6 feat), Craft Wonderous Item (Lvl 9), Great Fortitude (Lvl 12), Unconditional Power (Human Paragon), (Open MetaPsionic Feat, Lvl 15), (Open Metamagic Feat, Lvl 18), (Open Metamagic Feat, Lvl 21). Was planning on a Tigone for my familiar. Now that leaves levels 19-21 open, all of which need to be caster levels in order to meet the Avangion Requirements. I have no idea what to pick for these levels and how to run with them. Which is where my questions lie, suggestions? The Obvious choice is to just continue with Restorationist, netting 4th level potion fruits and a talk to plant ability. But I thoud I'd see if anyone else had other ideas that popped out. If you allow and have access to the Mind Mage prestige class from Dragon Magazine, I'd go with 10 levels of that as soon as eligible instead of completing cebremancer right away and then use cebremancer as your fill class to get the +1 / +1. MM doesn't give a +1 to both every level, but it more than makes up for it in abilities. Might take you an extra 2 or three levels to qualify for avangion, but you'll be significantly better off.