Keep on the Borderlands novel - Downloaded from the Wizards Community, all coding removed by Solauren

Keep on the Borderlands novel

Post/Author/DateTime Post
#1
zombiegleemax
Apr 21, 2006 15:53:14 Was looking through the products section, and came across a novel entitled "Keep on the Borderlands". Is this related to the old B2 module? And if so does it add anything new? And is it worth getting?
#2
maddog
Apr 21, 2006 16:13:53 That link goes to the Living Greyhawk Gazetteer.
#3
zombiegleemax
Apr 21, 2006 16:22:31
That link goes to the Living Greyhawk Gazetteer.

Ooops. Corrrected. :embarrass
#4
Cthulhudrew
Apr 21, 2006 16:22:48 The novelization of "The Keep on the Borderlands" is set in Greyhawk, not Mystara. It, along with a couple of other novels (Descent Into the Depths of the Earth, Against the Giants, Queen of the Demonweb Pits, The Temple of Elemental Evil, The Tomb of Horrors, and White Plume Mountain) were novels based on the classic series of modules. Most of those featured the same characters and story ideas (Paul Kidd's Justiciar), though I don't think Keep is one of those.

In any case, as I noted, they are all set on Oerth, and bear no connection with the Mystara version- just the modules.

[EDIT]There are a couple of reviews of it on Amazon, here
#5
gawain_viii
Apr 21, 2006 17:24:33 I'll keep my coments to myself. If I posted my thoughts I'd probably be banned from the boards, lol... So just pretend that I'm posting: "*** **** *** **** **** ***** ****** ******** **** ***!"

Roger
#6
zombiegleemax
Apr 22, 2006 1:56:15
The novelization of "The Keep on the Borderlands" is set in Greyhawk, not Mystara. It, along with a couple of other novels (Descent Into the Depths of the Earth, Against the Giants, Queen of the Demonweb Pits, The Temple of Elemental Evil, The Tomb of Horrors, and White Plume Mountain) were novels based on the classic series of modules. Most of those featured the same characters and story ideas (Paul Kidd's Justiciar), though I don't think Keep is one of those.

In any case, as I noted, they are all set on Oerth, and bear no connection with the Mystara version- just the modules.

Is Lolth an Oerthian goddess? I suspected she is from Toril (Forgotten Realms), with all the R.A.Salvatore stuff, Menzoberranzan, Drittz and so on...
So...what the hell is doing Queen of the Demonweb Pits in Grayhawk?
#7
Cthulhudrew
Apr 22, 2006 3:24:33 She's originally from Oerth/Greyhawk. The module series beginning with G1-3: Against the Giants (Steading of the Hill Giant Chief, Glacial Rift of the Frost Giant Jarl, and Hall of the Fire Giant King) led directly into the D1-3 series of modules (Descent Into the Depths of the Earth, Shrine of the Kuo-Toa, and Vault of the Drow), and then into Q1: Queen of the Demonweb Pits. The drow were first introduced in this series, as the instigators of the Giantish attacks, and ultimately the PCs ended up journeying to the Demonweb Pits to confront Lolth herself (and slay her).

The original modules, IIRC, were not explicitly placed in Greyhawk, but when they were later collected into "super modules," they were. In any case, even before being explicitly set in Greyhawk, the modules (along with most of the other AD&D modules) provided the backdrop to the world of Oerth, and were incorporated into it (much the way the D&D modules provided setting information and were incorporated into Mystara). Forgotten Realms came after this, and the drow were inserted into that setting (along with Lolth). The popularity of the character of Drizzt in R.A. Salvatore's novels for FR have led to a major upsurge in the popularity of the drow race (which, frankly, were pretty much always popular villains), and the perception that has resulted is that they originated on Toril, not Oerth. This is also undoubtedly due to the larger visibility that FR has over Greyhawk- via novels, product support, etc.

The drow as originally presented were somewhat different from the drow as they developed on Toril as well- much more Chaotic Evil, rather than the Neutral Evil bent that they are now depicted as.

Bottom line, though- as most Greyhawk fanatics will be quick to tell you- is that the drow came from Oerth first, Toril (and other settings) second.

Of course, we Mystarans avoid the whole something-or-other match by not having drow at all on our world.

("Something-or-other match" in this case being a substitute for the phrase that the automatic censors bleeped out in one of my earlier messages. ;) )
#8
zombiegleemax
Apr 22, 2006 9:32:45
I'll keep my coments to myself. If I posted my thoughts I'd probably be banned from the boards, lol... So just pretend that I'm posting: "*** **** *** **** **** ***** ****** ******** **** ***!"

Roger

Perhaps I shouldn't have mentioned it.
#9
havard
Apr 22, 2006 9:52:03
Is Lolth an Oerthian goddess? I suspected she is from Toril (Forgotten Realms), with all the R.A.Salvatore stuff, Menzoberranzan, Drittz and so on...
So...what the hell is doing Queen of the Demonweb Pits in Grayhawk?

RA Salvatore's first novels were written for Greyhawk, but then changed to the Forgotten Realms.

Håvard
#10
havard
Apr 22, 2006 9:53:45
In any case, as I noted, they are all set on Oerth, and bear no connection with the Mystara version- just the modules.

I'd say the novel KotB bears some connection with Mystara, although granted this is to a much less degree than even the Return to Module. Still, if one is looking for more sources to steal from... :D

Håvard

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
#1 zombiegleemax Apr 21, 2006 15:53:14	Was looking through the products section, and came across a novel entitled "Keep on the Borderlands". Is this related to the old B2 module? And if so does it add anything new? And is it worth getting?
#2 maddog Apr 21, 2006 16:13:53	That link goes to the Living Greyhawk Gazetteer.
#3 zombiegleemax Apr 21, 2006 16:22:31	That link goes to the Living Greyhawk Gazetteer. Ooops. Corrrected. :embarrass
#4 Cthulhudrew Apr 21, 2006 16:22:48	The novelization of "The Keep on the Borderlands" is set in Greyhawk, not Mystara. It, along with a couple of other novels (Descent Into the Depths of the Earth, Against the Giants, Queen of the Demonweb Pits, The Temple of Elemental Evil, The Tomb of Horrors, and White Plume Mountain) were novels based on the classic series of modules. Most of those featured the same characters and story ideas (Paul Kidd's Justiciar), though I don't think Keep is one of those. In any case, as I noted, they are all set on Oerth, and bear no connection with the Mystara version- just the modules. [EDIT]There are a couple of reviews of it on Amazon, here
#5 gawain_viii Apr 21, 2006 17:24:33	I'll keep my coments to myself. If I posted my thoughts I'd probably be banned from the boards, lol... So just pretend that I'm posting: "* * ** * ** **** *!" Roger
#6 zombiegleemax Apr 22, 2006 1:56:15	The novelization of "The Keep on the Borderlands" is set in Greyhawk, not Mystara. It, along with a couple of other novels (Descent Into the Depths of the Earth, Against the Giants, Queen of the Demonweb Pits, The Temple of Elemental Evil, The Tomb of Horrors, and White Plume Mountain) were novels based on the classic series of modules. Most of those featured the same characters and story ideas (Paul Kidd's Justiciar), though I don't think Keep is one of those. In any case, as I noted, they are all set on Oerth, and bear no connection with the Mystara version- just the modules. Is Lolth an Oerthian goddess? I suspected she is from Toril (Forgotten Realms), with all the R.A.Salvatore stuff, Menzoberranzan, Drittz and so on... So...what the hell is doing Queen of the Demonweb Pits in Grayhawk?
#7 Cthulhudrew Apr 22, 2006 3:24:33	She's originally from Oerth/Greyhawk. The module series beginning with G1-3: Against the Giants (Steading of the Hill Giant Chief, Glacial Rift of the Frost Giant Jarl, and Hall of the Fire Giant King) led directly into the D1-3 series of modules (Descent Into the Depths of the Earth, Shrine of the Kuo-Toa, and Vault of the Drow), and then into Q1: Queen of the Demonweb Pits. The drow were first introduced in this series, as the instigators of the Giantish attacks, and ultimately the PCs ended up journeying to the Demonweb Pits to confront Lolth herself (and slay her). The original modules, IIRC, were not explicitly placed in Greyhawk, but when they were later collected into "super modules," they were. In any case, even before being explicitly set in Greyhawk, the modules (along with most of the other AD&D modules) provided the backdrop to the world of Oerth, and were incorporated into it (much the way the D&D modules provided setting information and were incorporated into Mystara). Forgotten Realms came after this, and the drow were inserted into that setting (along with Lolth). The popularity of the character of Drizzt in R.A. Salvatore's novels for FR have led to a major upsurge in the popularity of the drow race (which, frankly, were pretty much always popular villains), and the perception that has resulted is that they originated on Toril, not Oerth. This is also undoubtedly due to the larger visibility that FR has over Greyhawk- via novels, product support, etc. The drow as originally presented were somewhat different from the drow as they developed on Toril as well- much more Chaotic Evil, rather than the Neutral Evil bent that they are now depicted as. Bottom line, though- as most Greyhawk fanatics will be quick to tell you- is that the drow came from Oerth first, Toril (and other settings) second. Of course, we Mystarans avoid the whole something-or-other match by not having drow at all on our world. ("Something-or-other match" in this case being a substitute for the phrase that the automatic censors bleeped out in one of my earlier messages. ;) )
#8 zombiegleemax Apr 22, 2006 9:32:45	I'll keep my coments to myself. If I posted my thoughts I'd probably be banned from the boards, lol... So just pretend that I'm posting: "* * ** * ** **** *!" Roger Perhaps I shouldn't have mentioned it.
#9 havard Apr 22, 2006 9:52:03	Is Lolth an Oerthian goddess? I suspected she is from Toril (Forgotten Realms), with all the R.A.Salvatore stuff, Menzoberranzan, Drittz and so on... So...what the hell is doing Queen of the Demonweb Pits in Grayhawk? RA Salvatore's first novels were written for Greyhawk, but then changed to the Forgotten Realms. Håvard
#10 havard Apr 22, 2006 9:53:45	In any case, as I noted, they are all set on Oerth, and bear no connection with the Mystara version- just the modules. I'd say the novel KotB bears some connection with Mystara, although granted this is to a much less degree than even the Return to Module. Still, if one is looking for more sources to steal from... :D Håvard