I have been contemplating using various rules from Unearthed Arcana in my next Dark Sun game. I was wondering if anyone else had used the rules and what experiences they had with them.
I've used the basis of the paragon classes from UA in order to make DS specific paragons for the all of the core DS races found in athas.orgs 3.5 rules as well as some other creatures from Terrors of Athas.
I'm also considering on using the spell point table found in UA to replace the power point table in the XPH. I feel that manifesterS, specifically wilders and psions, get way to many power points.
I'm also considering on using the spell point table found in UA to replace the power point table in the XPH. I feel that manifester, specifically wilders and psions, get way to many power points.
Does anyone actually use the spell-point variant for spellcasters?
Also I'm considering using both Wound/Vitality points and Armor as DR, does anyone have any experience with those?
Action Points
Armor as Dr/Def
Classed Based Def Bonus
Vitality/Wound Points
Racial Paragons (modified human to grant manifest instead of caster levels)
All-in-all the armor/dr rules and vitality/Wound points has made combat VERY deadly. Haveing 1d8+12+2d6(psionic weapon)+5d6(disolving weapon) go strait to wound points can kinda ruin your day (note this is what my character has done to major NPCs
)basically if you do the vp/wp system you NEED to do the armor = dr system or else you will wind up with a high character mortaility rate, and as we discovered the class base defence bonus helps balance out the loss of AC from the armor=dr rules and it works better for dark sun as now there is not such a penalty to character not wearing armor beyond the lack of dr
I am also going to try and use the Incantation rules, mostly for druidic/elemental type magic.
Fnordbear, I like your idea about using the various rules together. I have used the vilatity/wound point system before but not with the other rules. I think combining them would help eliminate the problems that I was having. Question, did you use the armor bonus replaces class defense, did they stack, or did you use the better of the two?
Zardnaar, I have never used the variant druid. Since Diplomacy is no longer a class skill anyways, what skill do you have them replace with Intimidate? Do you have them loose hide and move silently?
Sysane, good job on the racial paragon classes. Do allowing them in a campaign significantly alter it? Do npc's typically have levels in these classes? I would like to know more.
Thank's everybody for your comments so far.
Sysane, good job on the racial paragon classes. Do allowing them in a campaign significantly alter it? Do npc's typically have levels in these classes? I would like to know more.
I haven't play tested them much. I have a mul PC in the game I DM and he has three levels in mul paragon. It doesn't seem to unbalance much in the game. I plan on using the ones from ToA as NPC later on once I wrap up Dregoth Ascending.
I feel that manifesterS, specifically wilders and psions, get way to many power points.
I unnderstand the feeling but i was just wondering if you knew that atleast Psions have the exact amount of "Power" as wizards of the same level on a base scale, that is with out the bonus points. on a spell slot to points conversion they have the same ammount of fire power its just that the psion has the freedom to use the power for what he wants when he wants and that just for completeness the scorcer has more atual power then either the wizard or psion
I have been contemplating using various rules from Unearthed Arcana in my next Dark Sun game. I was wondering if anyone else had used the rules and what experiences they had with them.
I use a wide assortment of the UA rules throughout my Dark Sun, to provide a gamesystem hint of the exotic, and to tailor my Dark Sun campaigns to what I personally feel they should be like -- in an effort to meld mechanics with what my view of the setting's flavor should be (rather than making the flavor be forced into mechanics that don't necessarily balance out right).
Class Defense
Armor as DR
Spellpoints
Action Points
These have all worked very well for us. We used to use Vitality/Wounds but we found the high mortality rate got ridiculous at higher levels. When a level 16 character gets whacked because he rolled a 1 on a Fort save after getting a 65 damage critical hit landed on him... it becomes unfun.
Everything else has worked very well for us. If for no other reason, environment prevents anything heavier than light armors and armor would be thick only in the most vital areas. Hence class defense and armor as DR. Spell points because our cleric player just couldn't grasp memorizing spells per day :P And action points because they're fun
-X
These have all worked very well for us. We used to use Vitality/Wounds but we found the high mortality rate got ridiculous at higher levels. When a level 16 character gets whacked because he rolled a 1 on a Fort save after getting a 65 damage critical hit landed on him... it becomes unfun.
I'm curious about that, because honestly, I've not run into it, and I use Wounds/Vitality. You are aware that in that system, criticals don't get multiplied damage modifiers, right? Now I do understand that there's some scaling up on weapons and spell damage that needs to be addressed, right now, I look at how it was done in the Star Wars RPG, compare the weapon damages, and adjust the damages accordingly. Spells/powers are a little more difficult, but after a while you get a feel for it.
I unnderstand the feeling but i was just wondering if you knew that atleast Psions have the exact amount of "Power" as wizards of the same level on a base scale, that is with out the bonus points. on a spell slot to points conversion they have the same ammount of fire power its just that the psion has the freedom to use the power for what he wants when he wants and that just for completeness the scorcer has more atual power then either the wizard or psion
Maybe statistically and on paper, but believe me, they’re not when you apply in the actual game. I understand that manifesters have more flexibility than arcane casters , but they are absolute monsters due to the sheer amount of power points they have. I know what I’m talking about. I've been DMing and playing manifesters for quite a long time.
Maybe statistically and on paper, but believe me, they’re not when you apply in the actual game. I understand that manifesters have more flexibility than arcane casters , but they are absolute monsters due to the sheer amount of power points they have. I know what I’m talking about. I been DMing and playing manifesters for quite a long time.
Oh I’m not disagreeing with you at all i think they are powerful as well and they can put the hurt on more than a wizard can. My post was more just to make sure anyone reading the thread (newbies) would know that they have the same about power if you looks at a strait spells/points.
If you are going to be using class defence bonuses and armour as DR, I would look to the Conan RPG, as it has some excellent rules for just that. We have been using those rules for 4 sessions now and combat is still very deadly and fast paced.
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Good stuff in my opinion. A lot like dnd i almost every aspect except that everythign i smuch more realistic...kinda. I have made a few variations, such as giving a fighter a better defense, the mage a higher hd
Seker has a pretty good system in my opinion.
My system is a mix between these two and dnd and it has defense, epic magic, and massive amounts of my players being confused because it's their first time playing w/ my system and i've been explain it, but my friends like it a lot so it'll work out fine
I'm curious about that, because honestly, I've not run into it, and I use Wounds/Vitality. You are aware that in that system, criticals don't get multiplied damage modifiers, right? Now I do understand that there's some scaling up on weapons and spell damage that needs to be addressed, right now, I look at how it was done in the Star Wars RPG, compare the weapon damages, and adjust the damages accordingly. Spells/powers are a little more difficult, but after a while you get a feel for it.
Decently high level psion + energy ray (fire) + boosted up pretty high. The damage was somewhere between 60 and 70 (I estimated at 65) as when I rolled that 20 and then rolled to confirm, I just shook my head and stated don't roll a 1. Of course he does as I apparently jinxed him. Sucked badly for him, but the group shelled out and made a raise dead scroll. Still, sucked all around. He had full vitality and everything. Just hosed :P
That was the problem we were having though. The damage scaled up to the point where it was a critical hit meant nearly instant death or at the very least disabling. The trouble was, was that after a point I'd crit, they'd always make the stabilization save and just lay there unconcious until the bard or cleric came by and healed them. It became incredibly hard to die unless you rolled a 1 and then you just felt cheated by a die roll.
-X
Decently high level psion + energy ray (fire) + boosted up pretty high. The damage was somewhere between 60 and 70 (I estimated at 65) as when I rolled that 20 and then rolled to confirm, I just shook my head and stated don't roll a 1. Of course he does as I apparently jinxed him. Sucked badly for him, but the group shelled out and made a raise dead scroll. Still, sucked all around. He had full vitality and everything. Just hosed :P
That was the problem we were having though. The damage scaled up to the point where it was a critical hit meant nearly instant death or at the very least disabling. The trouble was, was that after a point I'd crit, they'd always make the stabilization save and just lay there unconcious until the bard or cleric came by and healed them. It became incredibly hard to die unless you rolled a 1 and then you just felt cheated by a die roll.
-X
Ok, yea... like I said, the scaling for spells & powers is based off the D&D hit point system. I'd probably significantly tweak that to make it not quite so bad. If you look at the Star Wars RPG books, you'll see that the damage system for weapons & force powers, etc. don't scale the same way as you'd see in a D&D or d20 Modern system.
Ok, yea... like I said, the scaling for spells & powers is based off the D&D hit point system. I'd probably significantly tweak that to make it not quite so bad. If you look at the Star Wars RPG books, you'll see that the damage system for weapons & force powers, etc. don't scale the same way as you'd see in a D&D or d20 Modern system.
Or you could just say spells and power never deal critical hits, since you still have the same number of vitality points as you would hit points this eliminates the sudden-loss-of-all-wound-points problem.
Or you could just say spells and power never deal critical hits, since you still have the same number of vitality points as you would hit points this eliminates the sudden-loss-of-all-wound-points problem.
That's a good point.