Avangion vs Dragon - Downloaded from the Wizards Community, all coding removed by Solauren

Avangion vs Dragon

Post/Author/DateTime Post
#1
Mulhull
Aug 21, 2006 4:01:01 What do you think is more powerful

Someone said Dragon because he can drain the life from the avangion to power a fireball spell, but when Dragon Kings was written 10th level and only 10th level spells do life draining damage to animals (there is also a spell in it to push defiling damage away from the caster) and even then it's 1d6 per dragon level over 20.

As for the fireball, the avangion has a built in globe of invulnerability which it would hit and would be nullified by.
#2
zombiegleemax
Aug 21, 2006 4:44:44 At lower stages of metamorphosis, I feel dragon's have a distinct edge. Later on, I think there is near parity. High level avangions are more mobile, and will tend to be superior with psionics due to the rather large boost they get from wisdom. On the other hand, high level dragons have a very potent breath weapon.

Thye both have such power, and such a broad spectrum of powers, that trying to predicting which would win in a fight is futile.
#3
megatherion
Aug 21, 2006 7:51:58
Thye both have such power, and such a broad spectrum of powers, that trying to predicting which would win in a fight is futile.

Not futile but very simple; it all comes down to who wins the initiative check.
#4
zombiegleemax
Aug 21, 2006 8:55:29 IfI think it highly unlikely that one would gain such total surprise over another to have it come down to iniative.
#5
xlorepdarkhelm_dup
Aug 24, 2006 12:22:05 Transferring my post from the old forums on this:

What do you think is more powerful

Someone said Dragon because he can drain the life from the avangion to power a fireball spell, but when Dragon Kings was written 10th level and only 10th level spells do life draining damage to animals (there is also a spell in it to push defiling damage away from the caster) and even then it's 1d6 per dragon level over 20.

As for the fireball, the avangion has a built in globe of invulnerability which it would hit and would be nullified by.

I would say it depends on the scenario. If all other things are equal, that is, they have the same levels in the same classes before starting on the process; if they are at the same spell-stage in the metamorphosis, and have equal levels in dragon or avangion respectively, then:

The dragon metamorphosis tends to be a linear progression. Each stage roughly equates to to the same overall amount of improvements/increases in the dragon, each stage being about the same amount of changes from the previous, as it is from the next. As such, the dragon metamorphosis is pretty evenly distributed throughout the whole process.

The avangion metamorphosis tends to be an exponential progression. This progression is weighted heavier at the end, and lighter at the beginning, across the stages. So the transition from stage 1 to stage 2 is not nearly as impressive as from stage-9 to stage-10. The first half of the metamorphosis tends to provide very minor changes compared to the last half of the metamorphosis.

That said, a stage-10 dragon and a stage-10 avangions, with all other things being equal or equivalent about the character, are an even match. With the differences in the transformation progressions, this means that stage-1 -> stage-9, the avangion is at a disadvantage at different degrees. Avangions kind of have to hide from their dragon counterparts, or else they are pretty fragile and easy to eliminate.

Once at stage-10, they become evenly matched. The dragon has immense and impressive physical capabilities, attacks, and is a force of incredible destruction. They are able to absorb incredible levels of punishment, due to their much larger size, their increased number of hit points, and their armored scales. On the flip-side, while the avangion becomes like a delicate, fragile creature physically, the avangion has increased abilities to just simply avoid most damage -- better abilities to deflect damage, and simply avoid being hit. The avangion also becomes stronger psionically, and that compensates for their otherwise fragile physical forms. They have an almost limitless supply of power to draw upon, and can fight on battlegrounds that dragons otherwise would be at a serious disadvantage (let's see how great and powerful a dragon's spell capabilities are on salt flats, or obsidian plains, where there is no living beings to steal their power from). I like the notion that an avangion has nothng to fear from a dragon's life-draining ability, which makes them even more of a proverbial fly in the dragon's ointment.

Who wins from that kind of a battle? It would be something epic, something extraordinary, and a matter of who can outlast whom.

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
#1 Mulhull Aug 21, 2006 4:01:01	What do you think is more powerful Someone said Dragon because he can drain the life from the avangion to power a fireball spell, but when Dragon Kings was written 10th level and only 10th level spells do life draining damage to animals (there is also a spell in it to push defiling damage away from the caster) and even then it's 1d6 per dragon level over 20. As for the fireball, the avangion has a built in globe of invulnerability which it would hit and would be nullified by.
#2 zombiegleemax Aug 21, 2006 4:44:44	At lower stages of metamorphosis, I feel dragon's have a distinct edge. Later on, I think there is near parity. High level avangions are more mobile, and will tend to be superior with psionics due to the rather large boost they get from wisdom. On the other hand, high level dragons have a very potent breath weapon. Thye both have such power, and such a broad spectrum of powers, that trying to predicting which would win in a fight is futile.
#3 megatherion Aug 21, 2006 7:51:58	Thye both have such power, and such a broad spectrum of powers, that trying to predicting which would win in a fight is futile. Not futile but very simple; it all comes down to who wins the initiative check.
#4 zombiegleemax Aug 21, 2006 8:55:29	IfI think it highly unlikely that one would gain such total surprise over another to have it come down to iniative.
#5 xlorepdarkhelm_dup Aug 24, 2006 12:22:05	*Transferring my post from the old forums on this:* What do you think is more powerful Someone said Dragon because he can drain the life from the avangion to power a fireball spell, but when Dragon Kings was written 10th level and only 10th level spells do life draining damage to animals (there is also a spell in it to push defiling damage away from the caster) and even then it's 1d6 per dragon level over 20. As for the fireball, the avangion has a built in globe of invulnerability which it would hit and would be nullified by. I would say it depends on the scenario. If all other things are equal, that is, they have the same levels in the same classes before starting on the process; if they are at the same spell-stage in the metamorphosis, and have equal levels in dragon or avangion respectively, then: The dragon metamorphosis tends to be a linear progression. Each stage roughly equates to to the same overall amount of improvements/increases in the dragon, each stage being about the same amount of changes from the previous, as it is from the next. As such, the dragon metamorphosis is pretty evenly distributed throughout the whole process. The avangion metamorphosis tends to be an exponential progression. This progression is weighted heavier at the end, and lighter at the beginning, across the stages. So the transition from stage 1 to stage 2 is not nearly as impressive as from stage-9 to stage-10. The first half of the metamorphosis tends to provide very minor changes compared to the last half of the metamorphosis. That said, a stage-10 dragon and a stage-10 avangions, with all other things being equal or equivalent about the character, are an even match. With the differences in the transformation progressions, this means that stage-1 -> stage-9, the avangion is at a disadvantage at different degrees. Avangions kind of have to hide from their dragon counterparts, or else they are pretty fragile and easy to eliminate. Once at stage-10, they become evenly matched. The dragon has immense and impressive physical capabilities, attacks, and is a force of incredible destruction. They are able to absorb incredible levels of punishment, due to their much larger size, their increased number of hit points, and their armored scales. On the flip-side, while the avangion becomes like a delicate, fragile creature physically, the avangion has increased abilities to just simply avoid most damage -- better abilities to deflect damage, and simply avoid being hit. The avangion also becomes stronger psionically, and that compensates for their otherwise fragile physical forms. They have an almost limitless supply of power to draw upon, and can fight on battlegrounds that dragons otherwise would be at a serious disadvantage (let's see how great and powerful a dragon's spell capabilities are on salt flats, or obsidian plains, where there is no living beings to steal their power from). I like the notion that an avangion has nothng to fear from a dragon's life-draining ability, which makes them even more of a proverbial fly in the dragon's ointment. Who wins from that kind of a battle? It would be something epic, something extraordinary, and a matter of who can outlast whom.