I, Strahd (A question concerning a book) - Downloaded from the Wizards Community, all coding removed by Solauren

I, Strahd (A question concerning a book)

Post/Author/DateTime Post
#1
calebcc
Sep 21, 2006 19:46:08 Is the book I, Strahd considered 'canon' in Ravenloft, or is it not? thanks.
#2
zombiegleemax
Sep 22, 2006 6:41:26 Yes. But you have to take it with a pinch of salt about its accuracy as Strahd wrote it, so it's obviously going to paint him in a good light.
#3
zombiegleemax
Sep 22, 2006 15:28:37 It is 'cannon'. But it is also Strahd's self-promoting propaganda. It does have to have some basis in reality though.

After all Strahd being such a self-depreciating fellow would never write a history that paints him in a better light.

I would read A Vampire in the Mists to get another vision of the Master of Barovia. The important thing is never to underestimate his intellect. He trusts no one so his paranoia causes him to have contingencies for almost every situation (even the ones he doesn't foresee).

#4
rotipher
Sep 24, 2006 13:34:28 There's a good deal of denial at work in his autobiographical recounting of events, too, IMHO. Strahd's true feelings about his seminal AoUD are so very twisted and conflicted, it's quite unlikely that he even remembers precisely how it happened: his various accounts contradict one another so heavily, propaganda and disinformation probably don't suffice to explain the diversions.

Strahd professes his "perfect love" for Tatyana one minute and hounds her knowing it'll only get her killed the next; he contemptuously burns Sergei's poems in a novel, yet lies weeping atop his murdered brother's sarcophagus in a module. The guy's mind does NOT run on all cylinders, where his fall from grace is concerned.

(Sorry, Strahd, but there's no way in hell that she actually kissed you back.)
#5
zombiegleemax
Sep 24, 2006 14:44:38
propaganda and disinformation probably don't suffice to explain

Sorry, Strahd, but there's no way in hell that she actually kissed you back.

I realize that this was of course his version of events, but I believe that she did. When you look at how she reacted to everything that was going on around her at that time, it looks like she was (temporarily) under the influence of a dominate effect. She kissed him back because she was under his magical compulsion (vampire's supernatural ability) to do so.
#6
calebcc
Sep 24, 2006 15:28:45
There's a good deal of denial at work in his autobiographical recounting of events, too, IMHO. Strahd's true feelings about his seminal AoUD are so very twisted and conflicted, it's quite unlikely that he even remembers precisely how it happened: his various accounts contradict one another so heavily, propaganda and disinformation probably don't suffice to explain the diversions.

Strahd professes his "perfect love" for Tatyana one minute and hounds her knowing it'll only get her killed the next; he contemptuously burns Sergei's poems in a novel, yet lies weeping atop his murdered brother's sarcophagus in a module. The guy's mind does NOT run on all cylinders, where his fall from grace is concerned.

(Sorry, Strahd, but there's no way in hell that she actually kissed you back.)

Okay, this brings up some questions:

1. What does IMHO mean?

2. What about AoUD?

3. Why couldn't Strahd use Dominate
#7
zombiegleemax
Sep 24, 2006 15:38:52
Okay, this brings up some questions:

1. What does IMHO mean?

2. What about AoUD?

3. Why couldn't Strahd use Dominate

1. "In my humble opionion" (also IMO - "in my opionion)

2. "Act of Ultmate Darkness" - any act where you have a 100% or greater chance of failing a powers check because it's so evil

3. Good question, I agree with Vallyrah in saying he probably did use dominate.
#8
humanbing
Sep 24, 2006 17:44:39 Strahd's own accounts omit any sort of secondary physical company he may have kept. In Vampire of the Mists it's clear that he keeps mistress vampiress slaves in his castle, and also hints that he has sexual relations with a female lycanthrope who stays with him.

Then again, although romance is often invoked in Ravenloft novels, actual sex is clumsily-handled in general. The novel Tower of Doom has Azalin making sexual advances on a female character, which strikes me as being wrong on so many different levels it's hard to describe.
#9
zombiegleemax
Sep 24, 2006 19:09:44
Strahd's own accounts omit any sort of secondary physical company he may have kept. In Vampire of the Mists it's clear that he keeps mistress vampiress slaves in his castle, and also hints that he has sexual relations with a female lycanthrope who stays with him.

Then again, although romance is often invoked in Ravenloft novels, actual sex is clumsily-handled in general. The novel Tower of Doom has Azalin making sexual advances on a female character, which strikes me as being wrong on so many different levels it's hard to describe.

Where the lycanthrope is concerned, they didn't hint about it, Strahd himself said so (in that novel).

And as far as Azalin is concerned, I have to agree with you. Vampires are one of the only undead to retain mortal "hungers". Liches certain are not one of them. The only thing that I could think of to explain this (besides that the author may have made a mistake) is that he was using it as some kind of a test for someone, and we never got to see how it worked out.
#10
humanbing
Sep 25, 2006 7:05:46 Yes, that's what I thought too. That Azalin might have been using that as a way of psychologically breaking down Jadis before sending her on an important mission. Instead of having any physical cravings himself, he just knows that it's a sensitive issue for living creatures, and there's some shock value if he assaults them on those grounds.

Still, it seems a bit too distasteful for Azalin's modus operandi for me.

Strahd, however, I can totally see in that light. Vampires as you say are quite sensual beings and it's no surprise that Strahd's main longing is to have his heart's desire.

In fact, that is one of his traits that Azalin sees as his greatest weakness - the fact that he's so devoted to one woman's love.
#11
rotipher
Sep 25, 2006 11:18:02 Remember, Azalin routinely tempts his mortal minions into acts of debauched perversity as a means of psychological control. He knew that sex was a weakness of that particular Kargat werepanther, so he exploited that character-flaw, with the same cold dispassion as he might lure another servant into drugs or gluttony or whatever. It was pretty sordid, but probably no more so than, say, building a golem from chopped-up zombie limbs: that lich is way, waaaaay beyond all visceral urges, be they sensual or repellant.

And if Tatyana was dominated, then it wasn't her kissing him back: he was kissing his own domination-power. It's the difference between love-making and ****.
#12
zombiegleemax
Sep 25, 2006 12:08:37 I read the book when it first came out, 10 years ago, and greatly enjoyed it. Arent they going ot be re-releasing it?
#13
zombiegleemax
Sep 25, 2006 12:37:07
And if Tatyana was dominated, then it wasn't her kissing him back: he was kissing his own domination-power. It's the difference between love-making and ****.

I agree with you, completely! I guess I didn’t do a good job of explaining my argument. But, I was referring to Strahd’s version versus to truth. True if she was dominated, then it wasn’t her will to kiss him back. But, I don’t think that Strahd was lying in the sense that he was making it up. He was just putting it in a more favorable light. I think that he put it the way he wanted to remember it. :raincloud
#14
zombiegleemax
Sep 26, 2006 14:38:26 Are those old Ravenloft novels still available?
#15
zombiegleemax
Sep 26, 2006 19:10:12
Are those old Ravenloft novels still available?

They are reprinting them. But I was able to pick them up at Amazon and Ebay.
#16
zombiegleemax
Sep 26, 2006 19:19:00
he contemptuously burns Sergei's poems in a novel, yet lies weeping atop his murdered brother's sarcophagus in a module. The guy's mind does NOT run on all cylinders, where his fall from grace is concerned.

I was wondering what the sources were for this? (I don't disagree, I'm just seeking to expand my knowledge - and memory)
#17
rotipher
Sep 26, 2006 20:45:54 He burned the poems in "Knight of the Black Rose", and could be found crying over Sergei's casket as one of his four possible locations selected by the cards in I6 and "House of Strahd".
#18
orodruin
Sep 27, 2006 1:25:24
He burned the poems in "Knight of the Black Rose", and could be found crying over Sergei's casket as one of his four possible locations selected by the cards in I6 and "House of Strahd".

Then again, in "Vampire of the Mists", he had Sergei's body walking around as a zombie guard. Just one of the many reasons I hated that particular novel.
#19
Mortepierre
Sep 27, 2006 3:26:48 One doesn't preclude the other.

Just because Strahd necroanimated his fallen brother doesn't mean he can't mourn for him at some point, until his "evil" self reassert himself mere seconds later.

Even the worst criminals can experience regrets once in a great while...

Personally, I think it adds to the dichotomy of the character.
#20
darkor
Sep 27, 2006 7:24:25 Yup! I'm with Mortepierre. But I've wondered if Sherrif Von Zarovich was Sergei. Don't know why... any one had the same idea?
#21
zombiegleemax
Sep 27, 2006 8:34:24 Are the Soth books considered canonical even though Weis and Hickman have denied Soth ever being in Ravenloft?
#22
Mortepierre
Sep 27, 2006 9:56:35 According to TSR, yes they are. T&H may have been jealous but they didn't rule D&D. So, apart from killing the character in one of their novels, they couldn't do squat about it.
#23
zombiegleemax
Oct 03, 2006 21:17:17 I don't remember him writing anything about Inajira in his autobiography...

Could he be hiding something? No way...
#24
zombiegleemax
Oct 04, 2006 8:02:52 Or maybe he didn't know(at the time he actually wrote that section), he could Dominate people. It does describe it as him trying so hard in his own mind to force his will on the univers and make her love him only.
#25
zombiegleemax
Oct 05, 2006 18:44:55
I don't remember him writing anything about Inajira in his autobiography...

Could he be hiding something? No way...

According to my reading it is implied that his deal was with Inajira. I have never read anything that says that it actually was. Please let me know where to look if I am wrong.
#26
The_Jester
Oct 06, 2006 1:06:50
Yup! I'm with Mortepierre. But I've wondered if Sherrif Von Zarovich was Sergei. Don't know why... any one had the same idea?

Actually I have. Wrote a small short story in the Ravenloft fiction netbook (available somewhere on the FoS site) where I go into that and a couple other backgrounds for the sherrif.

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
#1 calebcc Sep 21, 2006 19:46:08	Is the book I, Strahd considered 'canon' in Ravenloft, or is it not? thanks.
#2 zombiegleemax Sep 22, 2006 6:41:26	Yes. But you have to take it with a pinch of salt about its accuracy as Strahd wrote it, so it's obviously going to paint him in a good light.
#3 zombiegleemax Sep 22, 2006 15:28:37	It is 'cannon'. But it is also Strahd's self-promoting propaganda. It does have to have some basis in reality though. After all Strahd being such a self-depreciating fellow would never write a history that paints him in a better light. I would read A Vampire in the Mists to get another vision of the Master of Barovia. The important thing is never to underestimate his intellect. He trusts no one so his paranoia causes him to have contingencies for almost every situation (even the ones he doesn't foresee).
#4 rotipher Sep 24, 2006 13:34:28	There's a good deal of denial at work in his autobiographical recounting of events, too, IMHO. Strahd's true feelings about his seminal AoUD are so very twisted and conflicted, it's quite unlikely that he even remembers precisely how it happened: his various accounts contradict one another so heavily, propaganda and disinformation probably don't suffice to explain the diversions. Strahd professes his "perfect love" for Tatyana one minute and hounds her knowing it'll only get her killed the next; he contemptuously burns Sergei's poems in a novel, yet lies weeping atop his murdered brother's sarcophagus in a module. The guy's mind does NOT run on all cylinders, where his fall from grace is concerned. (Sorry, Strahd, but there's no way in hell that she actually kissed you back.)
#5 zombiegleemax Sep 24, 2006 14:44:38	propaganda and disinformation probably don't suffice to explain Sorry, Strahd, but there's no way in hell that she actually kissed you back. I realize that this was of course his version of events, but I believe that she did. When you look at how she reacted to everything that was going on around her at that time, it looks like she was (temporarily) under the influence of a dominate effect. She kissed him back because she was under his magical compulsion (vampire's supernatural ability) to do so.
#6 calebcc Sep 24, 2006 15:28:45	There's a good deal of denial at work in his autobiographical recounting of events, too, IMHO. Strahd's true feelings about his seminal AoUD are so very twisted and conflicted, it's quite unlikely that he even remembers precisely how it happened: his various accounts contradict one another so heavily, propaganda and disinformation probably don't suffice to explain the diversions. Strahd professes his "perfect love" for Tatyana one minute and hounds her knowing it'll only get her killed the next; he contemptuously burns Sergei's poems in a novel, yet lies weeping atop his murdered brother's sarcophagus in a module. The guy's mind does NOT run on all cylinders, where his fall from grace is concerned. (Sorry, Strahd, but there's no way in hell that she actually kissed you back.) Okay, this brings up some questions: 1. What does IMHO mean? 2. What about AoUD? 3. Why couldn't Strahd use Dominate
#7 zombiegleemax Sep 24, 2006 15:38:52	Okay, this brings up some questions: 1. What does IMHO mean? 2. What about AoUD? 3. Why couldn't Strahd use Dominate 1. "In my humble opionion" (also IMO - "in my opionion) 2. "Act of Ultmate Darkness" - any act where you have a 100% or greater chance of failing a powers check because it's so evil 3. Good question, I agree with Vallyrah in saying he probably did use dominate.
#8 humanbing Sep 24, 2006 17:44:39	Strahd's own accounts omit any sort of secondary physical company he may have kept. In Vampire of the Mists it's clear that he keeps mistress vampiress slaves in his castle, and also hints that he has sexual relations with a female lycanthrope who stays with him. Then again, although romance is often invoked in Ravenloft novels, actual sex is clumsily-handled in general. The novel Tower of Doom has Azalin making sexual advances on a female character, which strikes me as being wrong on so many different levels it's hard to describe.
#9 zombiegleemax Sep 24, 2006 19:09:44	Strahd's own accounts omit any sort of secondary physical company he may have kept. In Vampire of the Mists it's clear that he keeps mistress vampiress slaves in his castle, and also hints that he has sexual relations with a female lycanthrope who stays with him. Then again, although romance is often invoked in Ravenloft novels, actual sex is clumsily-handled in general. The novel Tower of Doom has Azalin making sexual advances on a female character, which strikes me as being wrong on so many different levels it's hard to describe. Where the lycanthrope is concerned, they didn't hint about it, Strahd himself said so (in that novel). And as far as Azalin is concerned, I have to agree with you. Vampires are one of the only undead to retain mortal "hungers". Liches certain are not one of them. The only thing that I could think of to explain this (besides that the author may have made a mistake) is that he was using it as some kind of a test for someone, and we never got to see how it worked out.
#10 humanbing Sep 25, 2006 7:05:46	Yes, that's what I thought too. That Azalin might have been using that as a way of psychologically breaking down Jadis before sending her on an important mission. Instead of having any physical cravings himself, he just knows that it's a sensitive issue for living creatures, and there's some shock value if he assaults them on those grounds. Still, it seems a bit too distasteful for Azalin's modus operandi for me. Strahd, however, I can totally see in that light. Vampires as you say are quite sensual beings and it's no surprise that Strahd's main longing is to have his heart's desire. In fact, that is one of his traits that Azalin sees as his greatest weakness - the fact that he's so devoted to one woman's love.
#11 rotipher Sep 25, 2006 11:18:02	Remember, Azalin routinely tempts his mortal minions into acts of debauched perversity as a means of psychological control. He knew that sex was a weakness of that particular Kargat werepanther, so he exploited that character-flaw, with the same cold dispassion as he might lure another servant into drugs or gluttony or whatever. It was pretty sordid, but probably no more so than, say, building a golem from chopped-up zombie limbs: that lich is way, waaaaay beyond all visceral urges, be they sensual or repellant. And if Tatyana was dominated, then it wasn't her kissing him back: he was kissing his own domination-power. It's the difference between love-making and ****.
#12 zombiegleemax Sep 25, 2006 12:08:37	I read the book when it first came out, 10 years ago, and greatly enjoyed it. Arent they going ot be re-releasing it?
#13 zombiegleemax Sep 25, 2006 12:37:07	And if Tatyana was dominated, then it wasn't her kissing him back: he was kissing his own domination-power. It's the difference between love-making and **. I agree with you, completely!** I guess I didn’t do a good job of explaining my argument. But, I was referring to Strahd’s version versus to truth. True if she was dominated, then it wasn’t her will to kiss him back. But, I don’t think that Strahd was lying in the sense that he was making it up. He was just putting it in a more favorable light. I think that he put it the way he wanted to remember it. :raincloud
#14 zombiegleemax Sep 26, 2006 14:38:26	Are those old Ravenloft novels still available?
#15 zombiegleemax Sep 26, 2006 19:10:12	Are those old Ravenloft novels still available? They are reprinting them. But I was able to pick them up at Amazon and Ebay.
#16 zombiegleemax Sep 26, 2006 19:19:00	he contemptuously burns Sergei's poems in a novel, yet lies weeping atop his murdered brother's sarcophagus in a module. The guy's mind does NOT run on all cylinders, where his fall from grace is concerned. I was wondering what the sources were for this? (I don't disagree, I'm just seeking to expand my knowledge - and memory)
#17 rotipher Sep 26, 2006 20:45:54	He burned the poems in "Knight of the Black Rose", and could be found crying over Sergei's casket as one of his four possible locations selected by the cards in I6 and "House of Strahd".
#18 orodruin Sep 27, 2006 1:25:24	He burned the poems in "Knight of the Black Rose", and could be found crying over Sergei's casket as one of his four possible locations selected by the cards in I6 and "House of Strahd". Then again, in "Vampire of the Mists", he had Sergei's body walking around as a zombie guard. Just one of the many reasons I hated that particular novel.
#19 Mortepierre Sep 27, 2006 3:26:48	One doesn't preclude the other. Just because Strahd necroanimated his fallen brother doesn't mean he can't mourn for him at some point, until his "evil" self reassert himself mere seconds later. Even the worst criminals can experience regrets once in a great while... Personally, I think it adds to the dichotomy of the character.
#20 darkor Sep 27, 2006 7:24:25	Yup! I'm with Mortepierre. But I've wondered if Sherrif Von Zarovich was Sergei. Don't know why... any one had the same idea?
#21 zombiegleemax Sep 27, 2006 8:34:24	Are the Soth books considered canonical even though Weis and Hickman have denied Soth ever being in Ravenloft?
#22 Mortepierre Sep 27, 2006 9:56:35	According to TSR, yes they are. T&H may have been jealous but they didn't rule D&D. So, apart from killing the character in one of their novels, they couldn't do squat about it.
#23 zombiegleemax Oct 03, 2006 21:17:17	I don't remember him writing anything about Inajira in his autobiography... Could he be hiding something? No way...
#24 zombiegleemax Oct 04, 2006 8:02:52	Or maybe he didn't know(at the time he actually wrote that section), he could Dominate people. It does describe it as him trying so hard in his own mind to force his will on the univers and make her love him only.
#25 zombiegleemax Oct 05, 2006 18:44:55	I don't remember him writing anything about Inajira in his autobiography... Could he be hiding something? No way... According to my reading it is implied that his deal was with Inajira. I have never read anything that says that it actually was. Please let me know where to look if I am wrong.
#26 The_Jester Oct 06, 2006 1:06:50	Yup! I'm with Mortepierre. But I've wondered if Sherrif Von Zarovich was Sergei. Don't know why... any one had the same idea? Actually I have. Wrote a small short story in the Ravenloft fiction netbook (available somewhere on the FoS site) where I go into that and a couple other backgrounds for the sherrif.