Anyway has anyone here thought about creating a few epic spells that aern't Dragon/Avangion metamorphosis spells? Perhaps update the spells in Dragon Kings. I was also thinking of designing an epic Psionic feat. The following Forgotten Realms books also have some interesting epic spells in them.
Players Guide to Faerun
Lost Empires of Faerun
Dragons of Faerun
Lost Empires in particular is interesting and applicable to Athas as the book had the Mythal seed in it which in effect allows you to create a massive spell ward over a geographic area. In FR several elven cities have Mythals along with Waterdeep and Silverymoon and in Dragons of Faerun they have one covering the entire planet. There are several examples in Athas of effectivly Mythals that in 3.5 rules can only be duplicated with the epic spellcasting feat. The Dragons wards around Ur Draxa, and there must be some sort of effect that allows Saragar to exist rather than dry up lke the rest of Athas. Players Guide to Faerun has Proctivs Move Mountain which would be easily modified for Rajaats flying pyramid in Wind Riders of the Jagged Cliffs. Some bright spark even managed to post Karsus's Avatar spell in one of the FR boards or Epic Level Handbook boards which updated the 2nd ed level 12 spell that allowed a caster to strip the divine power off a god.
Has anyone here run an epic Athasian game? Most of the creatures in the ELH aern't really suitable for Athas and theres been very few published adventures supporting epic level play- all the ones I can think of have been in Dungeon magazine(apart from the one in the ELH which is really hard for level 21 PCs).
The Quicksilver Hourglass (level 30 kill a demigod)
The Stormlords Keep (level 21)
And I think the final adventure of the Age of Worms Adventure path could have the PCs ht level 21 but isn't really a true epic adventure although once again you get to fight a demigod. Neither of the above adventures can really be run on Athas without a very heavy rewrite. How can a non spellcaster/psion keep up on Athas as they're either dead if the come across an epic Defiler (Timestop+forcecage+acid fog) or they have to use magic/psionics themselves. An epic fighter can't even grapple a monster due to stupidly high grapple scores high CR critters have (collossal scorpion). Mr Epic Fighter needs a ring of Freedom of Movement. The perfect DS epic party- maybe have a rogue in there somewhere.
1 Druid (tank, summon stuff)
1 Cleric (healer, tank, etc)
1 Templar (tank)
1 Defiler/Preserver
We had an epic game where a party of level 21-22 PCs can easily fight their way through a dozen or so giants each with 10 levels of Fighter/Blackguard for example- that was the Stormlords Keep adventure.
Finally the ELH has rules from progressing from level 20 to 21. Does Athas.org support the earn enough xp to get to level 21 level up or do they prefer the go on a quest in order to make the jump to epic play. What Athasian monsters are epic? Dragons, Avangions, probably Spirit of the Land sure, and maybe Nightmare Beast and Pyreen but even they seem to be CR 15-20 or so rather than true epic. Primal Elementals from the ELH work but are CR 35 IIRC. You can level up/advance non epic critters but a level 24/CR 24 NPC Psion isn't quite as scary as a 600+hp dedicated Epic monster such as a demon lord, dragon, and most CR 21-30 critters in the Epic Level Handbook.
Thanks for the list of books with good epic spell examples. I've been trying to write a few and noted the same thing you did about how easy it is to really temporarily boost stats.
For example, unless I greatly misunderstand the rules, it seems that it would be easy for Oronis to get some 120 templars together for 20 minutes, and boost his int for something ridiculous like +60 points or so, for a 15 day period. So if he took a few epic feats (Multispell and Automatic Quicken x3), he could rattle off Quickened meteor swarms until the Carru come home. And he'd only have to gather his people together for the ritual every Drajan week -- every 15 days.
Am I mistaken?
I don't represent everyone on Athas.org, but I would surmise from past conversations that everyone on the Overcouncil would go for the earn your own experience points thing. We aren't big on the leave Athas to go to other planes to gain your XPs thing, if that's what you meant by leaving to go on a quest.
Thanks for the list of books with good epic spell examples. I've been trying to write a few and noted the same thing you did about how easy it is to really temporarily boost stats.
For example, unless I greatly misunderstand the rules, it seems that it would be easy for Oronis to get some 120 templars together for 20 minutes, and boost his int for something ridiculous like +60 points or so, for a 15 day period. So if he took a few epic feats (Multispell and Automatic Quicken x3), he could rattle off Quickened meteor swarms until the Carru come home. And he'd only have to gather his people together for the ritual every Drajan week -- every 15 days.
Am I mistaken?
No you're not. Thats some of the least abusive things you can do.
What I'm finding suprisingly difficult is trying to create an epic spell by which Oronis and Daskinor seal their territories off from scrying and teleportation. I'm about to throw up my hands and make artifacts for that.
One wacky thing I noticed is that a wizard can get the LIFE seed and the heal seed if they just invest 24 ranks in knowledge (religion) which is even a class skill.
That means that if he wanted to, Oronis could develop an epic resurrection spell powerful enough to bring back creatures that have been dead for a long time. (27 DC for 200 years, and add +1 DC for every additional 10 years). A spell powerful enough to bring back a critter 4450 years old (say a Pixie) might take up almost every templar and wizard in Kurn and New Kurn as participants, but he could do it -- and restore dead races to life, if given just a lump of their remains.
Trouble is that phrase "restore Athas to the Green Age" is marvelously ambiguous, and depends on how expansively you read it. But for those that see Oronis as guilt-stricken over his participation in genocide, well, the restoration of at least one race would be within his grasp. And I'm not rightly sure where the story goes if trolls and gnomes and such started popping up in the Kurn area. Besides, if Oronis had access to such a spell, then arguably he'd have retrieved Korgunard's thigh-bone from Pakk, and raised Korgunard and maybe Nerad as well if something remained of him.
I've also noted that a cleric/wizard needs only epic spellcasting to get two whole sets of epic spells, while a cerebremancer type needs to blow two feats if he's to manifest epic spells and epic psi powers. Given that magic and psionics are supposed to combine in the epic levels in psionic enchantment, that separation seems just wrong.
That is the only place where I am in favor of magic/psionics transparency. Also, the metamorphisis seed that is being created has intorduced something that might be nice for others to use. It has a duration of instantaneous. This means... no dispeling. Sure, this raises the DC, but SK's should be able to mitigate that.
For example, unless I greatly misunderstand the rules, it seems that it would be easy for Oronis to get some 120 templars together for 20 minutes, and boost his int for something ridiculous like +60 points or so, for a 15 day period. So if he took a few epic feats (Multispell and Automatic Quicken x3), he could rattle off Quickened meteor swarms until the Carru come home. And he'd only have to gather his people together for the ritual every Drajan week -- every 15 days.
This is good and indeed non-abusive.
On the spell front I've only ever made 2 epic spells for DS, one is pretty specific to an in-game situation and wasn't a great use of the epic spell rules anyway while the other is an Epic Nondetection spell - basically just makes it impossible for anyone save another S-K (if that) to divine the caster; I think the CL check to penetrate it is something like 55.
As for opponents, at that level almost all of the baddies I threw at the PCs were either hordes of relatively low-level creatures that pose enough of a threat to the PCs (and especially their allies) that they can't be ignored, but that really can't do a whole lot to the PCs either, or else epic-level NPCs. I had several epic and near-epic level NPCs that had messed with the PCs on and off throughout the campaign, and in most cases they only remained a threat because the PCs never prevented them from escaping. There's also a couple Order members that were after one of the PCs, and there was a "finale" (of sorts) encounter with the Dragon that was extremely fun.
That is the only place where I am in favor of magic/psionics transparency. Also, the metamorphisis seed that is being created has intorduced something that might be nice for others to use. It has a duration of instantaneous. This means... no dispeling. Sure, this raises the DC, but SK's should be able to mitigate that.
Would it be abusive if Oronis used extra templar casters to mitigate the spell DC down to 10 or to 2, reducing development costs? :D I couldn't find a minimum spellcraft DC, but the ones in the book don't go below 27.
Would it be abusive if Oronis used extra templar casters to mitigate the spell DC down to 10 or to 2, reducing development costs? :D I couldn't find a minimum spellcraft DC, but the ones in the book don't go below 27.
The epic spell rules are meant to be exploited to their fullest, which isn't the same thing as min/maxing the non-epic rules. Doing it, taking advantage of it, and benefiting from it are applauded in this instance (unless you exploit a loophole).
Still, I do not know if what you're proposing is allowed by the epic spell rules themselves. I suggest you contact Seker (check the athas.org Staff section if you don't have his email) for pointers, as he's versed in the epic spell rules.
The epic spell rules are meant to be exploited to their fullest, which isn't the same thing as min/maxing the non-epic rules. Doing it, taking advantage of it, and benefiting from it are applauded in this instance (unless you exploit a loophole).
Really? So if he used this fortify & armor seeds to do just about every boost that a Fortify can do like that, regularly, with his templars, that's OK? Every save, every type of stacking bonus, lasting 15-75 days at a shot ...
What about permanent (+5 inherent) bonuses to his bodyguards and other top followers? Once he goes through the effort to do something like that for himself, why not spread the wealth? I take it that all inherent bonuses max at +5, even ones with the armor seed? Or does the inherent bonus limitation only apply to the fortify seed? Could you make a permanent version of the epic mage armor spell, giving a permanent +20 set of mage armor?
Even if inherent bonus applies, seems you could give +5 armor bonus, then +5 deflection, +5 insight, +5 luck ...
At what point does it become abusive?
What about the conjure seed? I'm not that comfortable with permanently conjuring adamantine with no xp cost. With a DC of 21, x5 permenant = 105, mitigated down to 5 or 27 or whatever with enough templar co-casters ... and he can conjure 20 square feet of adamantine. That's got to be abusive, neh?
Hmm. Maybe conjured adamantine, even if permanent, could be dispelled. Maybe detect magic could show it to be conjured. Is that enough of a downside?
If you can conjure adamantine, seems that the animate seed could do some serious mischief. Start with an animated colossal adamantine spiked chain, and then add hit dice until you run out of Spellcraft points. :D
How do you distinguish simple min-maxing from exploiting a loophole?
Thanks!
-brax
What I'm finding suprisingly difficult is trying to create an epic spell by which Oronis and Daskinor seal their territories off from scrying and teleportation. I'm about to throw up my hands and make artifacts for that.
I could make one for you, just give me some guidelines (final DC and stuff).
Bruno, what about a long-duration epic spell that wards a large area, indicating to its caster the entry in the area of any specified type of innanimate substance or object. Useful to spot people carrying artifacts. I guess Daskinor would be pretty scared somebody would come equipped with the Gnasher, Scorcher, or Scourge.
Oronis would ward off the whole valley where New Kurn is (Oronha valley). Daskinor would protect the whole Dim Islands and Eldaarich especially as described in "Wisdom of the Storm Coast."
Probably a total of three spells. One spell (which both Oronis and Dask would use) diverts Teleportation into a containment area.
Oronis would use a spell that causes anyone scrying into Oronha valley to see something quite different.
Daskinor would use a spell that would subject to telepathic attack anyone who tries to scry or to use telepathic communication across the boundary of the warded area.
I wonder if the contact seed could be jiggled to make some sort of epic metafaculty that would allow an SK to offload concentration on an epic spell to a group of minions, who could then trade off.
Final DC's 50. That Mythal seed that Zardnaar's talking about sounds perfectly relevant but sadly there's an IP issue.
Oronis would ward off the whole valley where New Kurn is (Oronha valley). Daskinor would protect the whole Dim Islands and Eldaarich especially as described in "Wisdom of the Storm Coast."
Probably a total of three spells. One spell (which both Oronis and Dask would use) diverts Teleportation into a containment area.
Oronis would use a spell that causes anyone scrying into Oronha valley to see something quite different.
Daskinor would use a spell that would subject to telepathic attack anyone who tries to scry or to use telepathic communication across the boundary of the warded area.
I can't post the Mythal seed here but can post an epic spell incorporating the Mythal seed. DC 50 huh.
There's probably a range limit, a radius, in which the participants need to be present to take part as mitigating factors. Something like that.
... picturing a stadium of spherical concentric cages ... :D
I looked at coopt concentration and even solicit psycrystal to figure out if an epic caster could offload concentration of an epic power over to minions. But turns out even if that could work, there's a short duration on those powers.
I wonder if the contact seed could be jiggled to make some sort of epic metafaculty that would allow an SK to offload concentration on an epic spell to a group of minions, who could then trade off.
Epic Powers don't requite it. Just make them permentant, and then place wards and triggers to let you know when and if the spells are despelled.
Daskinor seems to fit the bill. How about that other Champion as well, not to name him?
There is potential for lots of powerful epic powers. I made one myself, Seker has it now, called epic schism. Its basically as powerful as the 2E split personality, and follows the rules for the 3E schism, but scaled into the epic.
Epic Powers don't requite it. Just make them permentant, and then place wards and triggers to let you know when and if the spells are despelled.
Yup - between adding an epic contingency to "re-cast" a spell, as well as increasing the dispel DC (+2 Spellcraft DC per +1 effective caster level to avoid dispels, IIRC), you can make just about any epic spell you want that'll effectively last forever...assuming you can get enough mitigating factors to bring the DC down to a do-able level, of course.
But as pointed out, that's just another use for templars.
There is potential for lots of powerful epic powers. I made one myself, Seker has it now, called epic schism. Its basically as powerful as the 2E split personality, and follows the rules for the 3E schism, but scaled into the epic.
Nice, I have made epic inertial armor, psionic kinetic control, subjective reality (epic reality revision, if you will), and time travel (the ones the Mind Lords did). I'm trying to make the one the Order uses to locate epic manifesters. And the ones Brax wants, but they gotta wait until FFN is finished...
Can you make an artifact detector epic spell? Nibenay can sense artifacts that come into his city, in the Hawke novels. Detects power level - minor or major - and perhaps location.
Pennarin is your epic manifester feat homebrew?
Its a variant found in the Epic Level Handbook, page 102.
Here's what I have on my side, DCs and creation formulas to be determined later:
Epic Simulacrum
Illusion (Shadow)
Spellcraft DC: ??
Components: V, S, M, XP
Casting time: 12 hours
Range: 0 ft.
Effect: One duplicate creature
Duration: Instanteneous
Saving Throw: None
Spell Resistance: No
To Develop: ??
As simulacrum, except the duplicate has the full levels or Hit Dice of the real creature. Furthermore, upon its death the duplicate does not revert to the material from which it was initially created, but becomes inert, and if made of flesh is susceptible to decay. The dead body has no special properties that the real creature’s corpse might have and a speak with dead spell fails automatically in the case of a duplicate of a living being.
Epic Schism
Telepathy [Mind-Affecting]
Psicraft DC: ??
Display: Auditory and visual
Manifesting time: 1 standard action
Range: Personal
Duration: 1 round/level (D)
To Develop: ??
As schism, except that the mind splits into one more independent part for every 10 manifester levels. As such a 22nd-level psion would be able to split his mind into 4 distinct parts. Your second mind manifests powers as if your manifester level were six lower than it is. Each additionnal mind manifests powers as a manifester four levels lower than the precedent mind. So in the example above, the psion’s four minds could manifest powers as 22nd-level, 16th-level, 12th-level and 8th-level manifesters, respectively.
Its a variant found in the Epic Level Handbook, page 102.
Wow its been so long since I've looked at the ELH in any serious way I had forgotten about it.Its been 3+ years since I've read that book cover to cover.
That means an epic telepath could create an epic power that gave Permanent Improved Invisibility, for DC 49 without mitigators. If you did not mind taking 11 minutes to cast the thing, you could trim it down to DC 29 with no xp burn and no co-casters.
For 10 DC more you could add delude seed factors to make the target not detectable by scent, and for another 10 you could add inaudibility, except then I think your target would start to get awfully lonely after a few years :D
Dominate a couple of rogues, and send them running around under Permanent Improved Invisibility, doing your dirty work. That seems fairly powerful. Lots of suprise attacks, particularly if they work together. The Telepath could use the compell seed to create something to dominate the rogues, and use the contact seed to link the rogues' minds together so they could work together silently. Three epic powers with a fairly long-term power effect, and out of those, only the dominate's likely to require mitigating factors such as XPs or co-casters. Bribe a few Draji templars, and you might pick your own rogues out of the sacrifice pool.
With a city to run, it becomes an issue to find the time and space to make things happen. If you need to run a city, it doesn’t allow much time for magical pursuits, or psionic pursuits. Furthermore, I think it is fairly obvious that the SK’s don’t really fully understand what they are, and are scared of possible negative ramifications of their changes.
Also, it is hard to advance if everyone else who is like you are watching to make sure that you don’t advance too much and don’t get too far ahead. Plus there was the Dragon to pay of every year. With this setup, it becomes hard to do things, and hard to make a lot of the fantastic stuff happen.
That said, there may be a Cold War type agreement between SK’s that “you don’t and I won’t.” I won’t create a team of super assassins to send places and kill of you and your top templars if you don’t.
This doesn’t mean that they haven’t done things to protect their cities, as this seems to be something permissible. However, we don’t have flying cities or magical defensive shields or magical conduits to the plane of water or anything else we might expect from a Netherese or Eberoni type setting. The SK’s may have some grand things in the works, but couldn’t do them because of the “restrictions” placed on them.
Also, non-SK epic casters and manifesters don’t want too much attention, so they would keep their powers small, and stay under the radar. Of course, in other areas that exist in the world that don’t have the same type of population (SK’s) that there may be some more interesting things afoot.
With a city to run, it becomes an issue to find the time and space to make things happen. If you need to run a city, it doesn’t allow much time for magical pursuits, or psionic pursuits.
I don't think that the Shadow King would agree with you... :P
First off you've got Wish, Limited Wish, Bend Reality and Reality Revision - between all of those and the Champion's ability to store up XP from life energy, giving inherent attribute bonuses to their favorite stooges isn't really an issue - make the stooge go and round up enough slaves to pay for the XP, the S-K sucks 'em dry, and voila, you've got yourself a happy High Defiler. Attributes aside, a carefully-worded Wish could theoretically make any spell permanent...and it's not like a super-genius S-K with years to think about the wording (not to mention that even the Permanency spell says something like "...even other spells can be made permanent with research"). In fact, most anything you can create with the epic spell rules can be done with a pre-existing spell or power and metamagic/psionic feats.
Another thing to think about is the "cost-for-effect" ratio - if you're dumping 500k Gp into creating a permanent Improved Invisibility spell, is it actually worth that money or would it be cheaper to go with a different method? For as little as 72,000 Gp and 2880 XP you could make a Ring of Greater Invisibility, which unlike the epic spell can pop back up as many times as necessary if dispelled or otherwise negated. Sure, in the long run it'd be cheaper to make the epic spell, but unless you plan on slapping the spell onto as many of your rogues as possible is it really worth the money? Also, as long as you didn't need more than a couple rogues at a time invisible for more than 24 hours, you could just use Persistent Spell with Greater Invisibility and not spend a single Gp or XP.
Along a similar vein, although a bunch of perma-invis rogues with insane attribute scores and AC's out the wazoo would make for a great hit squad, who the heck are you sending 'em against that necessitates that sort of firepower? If it's an S-K they're all going to die anyway, and if it's just about anyone else why couldn't you just hire 50 normal assassins and assume that at least 1 of them will make it past the target's guards, traps, etc. and do the job. Definitely a lot cheaper, *especially* if, say, you just drop a 10,000 cermaic piece contract on the target's head and let the killers sort it out for themselves.
Now that I'm done rambling, my point is this - epic spells are great as a way for PCs (with a lot of money and time on their hands) to do some really nifty things, but otherwise their primary use is as a *plot device* - Keep The BBEG Alive So He Can Return In Act 2, Provide A Reasonable Explanation As To Why Nibenay Knows The PCs Walked Into His City With The Scorcher, etc.
Another thing to think about is the "cost-for-effect" ratio - if you're dumping 500k Gp into creating a permanent Improved Invisibility spell, is it actually worth that money or would it be cheaper to go with a different method? For as little as 72,000 Gp and 2880 XP you could make a Ring of Greater Invisibility, which unlike the epic spell can pop back up as many times as necessary if dispelled or otherwise negated. Sure, in the long run it'd be cheaper to make the epic spell, but unless you plan on slapping the spell onto as many of your rogues as possible is it really worth the money?
Agreed; obviously it's not worth the money unless you're planning to slap the spell on as many of your rogues as possible. That's why I was talking about shopping at the Drajan sacrifice cages and using some epic domination to gather a lot of rogues.
Domination isn't the only way to go for followers either. One could buy all sorts of loyalty with a Life Extension spell, or other permenant applications of the fortify seed. Five-point ability bonus with no XP cost. Sure, champions can use the obsidian to defer that cost, but somehow I don't think Oronis would use his obsidian globes so glibly, and that's who I'm trying to develop here.
With those booster spells, it's a simple matter to spend 11 minutes to cast them and gather oodles of co-casters, mitigating the DC down, which reduces the price of development.
Mitigate permanent improved invisibility down to a 27 DC, and the price drops down to 243,000 gp.
Furthermore it might be piggybacked onto something we know SKs can already do -- disguise themselves. Maybe the invisibility is just one application of a permanent disguise power, since it's the same delude seed.
Has anyone fully worked out bunches of these epic spells and powers? I'd appreciate links, particularly to epic psionic powers. I don't need idea stubs; I need to see more fully developed examples.
Good point about the expendatures going back into the economy, although I think that's more a matter of "badly written rules" than anything else - what the heck is the spell designer buying that costs so dang much, where are they buying it from, and what are they doing with whatever they bought? It's one thing to say that the 2000 you spent on your +1 magic sword went into some expensive ingredients and a gold hilt, but it's a totally different matter when you're spending a filthy-rich noble's entire yearly budget in less than 30 days. *shrug*
Since you requested it, I'm going to post the 2 epic spells (other than the Shadow Archon metamorphosis one I did) I've done so far:
Abjuration
Spellcraft DC: 66
Components: V, S
Casting Time: 10 minutes
Range: Personal or touch
Duration: 24 hours
Saving Throw: Will Negates (harmless, object)
Spell Resistance: Yes (harmless, object)
To Develop: 576,000cp (on Athas); 12 days; 23,040 XP. Seed: conceal (17). Factors: blocks divination (+6), increase duration to 24 hours (+15), gain +19 on caster level checks to resist detection by divination effects (+38). Mitigating Factors: Increase casting time to 10 minutes (-10).
As the nondetection spell (protects against divinations, including detect spells and the like), except that a caster of a divination spell must succeed on a caster level check against a DC of 30 + the caster level of the spellcaster who cast Epic Nondetection. If cast on a creature, this spell also wards any gear carried by the creature as well as the creature itself.
It seems to me that the biggest reason that SK’s don’t do a lot of what they “could” do with the epic rules (besides the fact that they began as 2ed people) is that they had a different focus.
..........
I share that opinion too. The SKs seem very involved in the affairs of their kingdoms, compared to other uber beings from other settings. Plus, there aren't CR30 magic users attempting to overthrow them every five years, like in FR.
These guys haven't had much high-level threats over their reigns, people, creatures, and organizations seem to leave the city-states alone. Even the Order does so.
There are few exceptions, like the time they killed Dregoth.
(BTW: If any of my players happen to read this thread, CLOSE YOUR BROWSER WINDOW NOW or I'm docking you 10 class levels. :P)
Fake Identity
Transmutation
Spellcraft DC: 66
Components: V, S
Casting Time: 10 minutes (see description)
Range: Clone touched (see description)
Duration: Permanent (D)
Saving Throw: Fortitude Negates (harmless)
Spell Resistance: Yes (harmless)
To Develop: 576,000cp (on Athas); 12 days; 23,040 XP. Seed: transform (21). Factors: Specific individual (+25), change creature type (+5), keep all supernatural abilities and previous creature type abilities (ad-hoc; +50), +10 on caster level check to beat foe’s dispel effect (+20), contingent on trigger (when caster’s soul arrives in a new body created by the Clone spell; +25), dismissible by caster (+2). Mitigating Factors: Specific target (-2), backlash 18d6 (-18), burn 4,000 XP (-40), preparation time 1 year (-12).
To prepare for this spell, the caster must first create a clone of himself (using the spell of the same name), which must then be preserved through the use of other magic. Over the following year, the caster must mentally create an entire history for the individual, while simultaneously using polymorph and similar spells to physically change the body in-step with the imagined history, changing the clone’s physical appearance to that of a baby and progressively increasing its age as the imagined history is “written.” Although the physical changes require only brief amounts of time to complete over the course of the year, the imagined history is a non-stop process that takes up much of the caster’s waking thoughts. The created identity can even be of a different race than the caster, although the race must be similar in size and shape to the original.
At the end of the year the spell is cast upon the clone, and uses up an Epic spell slot until its activation, which occurs when the owner’s spirit is transferred into the cloned body (as per the clone spell description). At that time, Fake Identity activates, permanently transmuting the caster’s new body to that of the imagined individual. This transformation changes the caster’s creature type (if desired), although any supernatural abilities or creature type abilities can be transferred to the new body as well (creature-type abilities become supernatural or extraordinary abilities, as appropriate). All ability scores (physical as well as mental) remain the same, although the caster can reduce physical ability scores if they so wish, and any other “minor” physical changes desired can be included (physical deformities, apparent age, etc.). As with most transmutation effects, the caster retains all of their old mental abilities, skills, memories, etc.
Beyond the obvious physical changes, Fake Identity even changes the character’s spirit enough that they are no longer detectable with divination spells, powers and effects that target their old identity – only those specifically targeting the new, imagined identity will work on the character, and even then they will reveal aspects of the new identity when applicable (such as if diving the character’s background). Even a True Seeing spell will not pierce the transformation; until Fake Identity is dismissed or dispelled (resisted at an additional +10 to the caster’s caster level for purposes of resisting dispel effects), the character is effectively this new persona.
Note that, even though they are no longer detectable as their old selves, they still retain all of their old memories and can differentiate between those memories and the new, imagined memories of their Fake Identity.
Although your mitigated PII is only 243,000....that's still 243,000 more expensive than 0, which is what a Persistent Greater Invis would give you for a handful of subjects.
Good point about the expendatures going back into the economy, although I think that's more a matter of "badly written rules" than anything else - what the heck is the spell designer buying that costs so dang much, where are they buying it from, and what are they doing with whatever they bought? It's one thing to say that the 2000 you spent on your +1 magic sword went into some expensive ingredients and a gold hilt, but it's a totally different matter when you're spending a filthy-rich noble's entire yearly budget in less than 30 days. *shrug*
Paying for experimentation subjects, perhaps? :D Perhaps you need to hire a thousand scribes to do calculations and recordings, sketches, of the strange forces that you unleash with your preparations. That would be roughly analogous to the Manhattan project, which isn't such a bad analogy. (Someone with lots of time to blow might calculate what the spellcraft DC of a 250 kiloton warhead... ;) )
But seriously, I think we should have a few, like some in Dragon Kings, that had a military application. Probably most epic spell developed occurred during the preserver jihad and the cleansing wars. It's much easier to blow through a whole noble's estate after you just pillaged it, a long way from home. Think about how filthy rich Julius Caesar got in Gaul, where he killed 1/3 and enslaved another 1/3 of the population. And he's remembered for bringing *order* to that region. Imagine someone who really did loot down to the root. Ceasar said submit or die; those who submitted were stripped naked and humilliated as slaves. But the champions were more like Hitler than like Caesar, and would have taken the skin after the coat. And with 1500 years there's a lot of down time between attacks.
We're going to see some epic detection spells like the one Keltis used near Saragar. Hard to exterminate a race if you can't find it.
DK had spells that let you impersonate or discredit a nation's ruler.
Another DK spell let you Conjuring loads of magical weapons for your troops. Hard to do with the epic rules, but we can get close with conjured adamantine.
Kaliedescope
Illusion (Figment)
Spellcraft DC:
Components: V, S
Casting Time: Standard Action
Range: 300 feet
Target/Area: 60 foot radius around one target individual.
Duration: 20 hours
Saving Throw: None
Spell Resistance: No
To Develop: 873000 cp; 34920 XP. Seed: delude (DC 14); standard action (+20); 64 total images (+63).
Several illusory duplicates of the target individual and all of the target's allies pop into being, making it difficult for the target's enemies to
know which target to attack. This spell generates 64 total images which are distributed evenly between the target and his allies, affecting each ally as if by the Mirror Image spell. The figments disappear when struck, or when the spell expires.
Not worth the cost, you might say. Well, it depends what you're up against. This kind of specialty spell or power ... if it's something you're going to use again and again for 1500 years, then you might as well blow that loot on the spell. After all, there's always another city, more loot.
How do you suppose Keltis fought the lizard-men, who are amphibious, and lived underwater? I don't think he was responsible for drying up the sea; at least we aren't developing him that way. He'd need some spells to get his men access to his foes. Mass underwater stuff. Not even worth statting up today, mind you, but he'd still have it. You don't forget your epic spells and powers.
What about Aarakocra? How do you send humans out to exterminate Aarakocra? I suspect Lalali-puy, aka Inenek, the 11th champion & "aarakocra scourge," has some epic spells or powers that enable a whole unit of humans to fly.
Could also be that the templar signets are mass-created through an epic spell. When you're ruling a state for thousands of years, making them individually would be even more costly, and you don't want to turn something like that over to another spellcaster!
Epic Nondetection
Abjuration
Spellcraft DC: 66
Components: V, S
Casting Time: 10 minutes
Range: Personal or touch
Duration: 24 hours
Saving Throw: Will Negates (harmless, object)
Spell Resistance: Yes (harmless, object)
To Develop: 576,000cp (on Athas); 12 days; 23,040 XP. Seed: conceal (17). Factors: blocks divination (+6), increase duration to 24 hours (+15), gain +19 on caster level checks to resist detection by divination effects (+38). Mitigating Factors: Increase casting time to 10 minutes (-10).
As the nondetection spell (protects against divinations, including detect spells and the like), except that a caster of a divination spell must succeed on a caster level check against a DC of 30 + the caster level of the spellcaster who cast Epic Nondetection. If cast on a creature, this spell also wards any gear carried by the creature as well as the creature itself.
Yes --- seems like every SK would really want something like this. Wonder why the duration is so short on that seed -- maybe since it's lumped with invisibility. I guess I picked the wrong seed with delude for epic invisibility, but delude does say that it can be used to conceal a creature. I guess that means making it look like something else? They should have said disguise or something.
Here's what I have:
[INDENT]Hamanu’s Storm of Icy Death: The casting requires the caster to lose his psionic focus and spend XX power points.
Casting time of X rounds or minutes.
Creates a storm over the area in X minutes. Storm moves horizontaly or vertically at X speed, in direction of choice.
Allows for a magical attack against one or more targets below the area of the storm. The magical attack is a powerful cold attack. Either inflicts very high amount of cold damage or incases the target in a block of ice, in which case the target is considered in stasis (either becomes comatose/suspended animation as if affected by the Sequester, Temporal Stasis, or Imprisonment spell). The block of ice is supernatural and only tows if the light of the crimson sun shines for a week on it. The target dies if encased for X number of days in it.
High spell penetration bonus (+12 or more).
Boosts a single (or a very few) psionic power of the caster into a far more potent power (higher save DC, increased limit to augmentation, or power is affected as if by Intensify Spell). (See the XPH spell Mental Pinnacle for an example of a spell that grants psionic power use. In this case, power is boosted only and must already be present.)
Can, like the Udoroot, make 2 attacks per round through the storm: a magical cold attack and use of the boosted psionic power, both on same target.
Storm doubles as a scrying sensor.[/INDENT]
Deadrise Turning
Necromancy [Evil]
Spellcraft DC: 26
Components: V, S, Ritual
Casting Time: 1 week
Range: Touch
Target: Intelligent undead creature
Duration: 2 months
Saving Throw: Special
Spell Resistance: No
To Develop: 234,000 Cp; 5 days; 9,360 XP. Seed: animate dead (DC 23), heal (DC 25), ward (DC 14). Factors: increase undead generated to 60 HD (+40 DC), increase negative levels gained to 10 (+24 DC), increase duration to 2 months (+12 DC), increase area of effect to 320' radius (+20). Mitigating factors: thinking zombie (-10 DC), increase casting time to 1 week (-34 DC), burn 1,000 XP (-10 DC), three additional casters contributing 6th-level spell slots (-33 DC), five additional casters contributing 5th-level spell slots (-45 DC).
When this spell is cast, all undead within a 320-ft.-radius spherical emanation centered on the target become immune to turning attempts for the duration of the spell. But this is not the most dangerous ability of this spell. Its truely evil aspect is that when characters attempt to turn undead under the protection of this spell, they are stricken by a powerful surge of negative energy. This energy deals 10 negative levels upon a character attempting the turning (Fort DC 26; half). Anyone slain from the negative levels instantly rises as a thinking zombie (see Terrors of the Dead Lands). The undead created this way are controlled by the target of the spell, which sends a single short command of twenty-five words or less to them at the moment of their creation, as a free action. A maximum of 60 HD worth of undead creatures can be created and controlled this way (these HD are added to the maximum number of HD worth of undead creatures the target can control per caster level, if it has levels in a spellcasting class).
XP Cost: 10,000 XP.
All valid points, but in the end what I guess I'm saying is just that the capability to use the Epic spell rules "abusively" or to otherwise create ridiculously powerful spells doesn't necessarily mean that an S-K, who ("in that reality") doesn't metagame, would do it.
Yes, they'd develop anti-divination as well as uber-divination Epic spells, spells that specifically assist them in wiping out their race, etc. But to make a bunch of assassins with permanent invisibility and ability scores of 40, although powerful, just doesn't sound like something that a Champion would ever have thought about, decided "hey, that's a great idea!" and gone ahead and created it. It's a great idea to use against a small number of targets, but just imagine an army of invisible, super-powerful warriors trying to fight a war of attrition...it'd be a horrible clusterf*ck. Once the Champions became S-K's and had to worry about other things, like their fellow ex-Champions and a rampaging Dragon, *then* those types of spells might have come to mind....but each S-K would also be smart enough to think "hey, if I just had this idea, I bet that some of the others' did as well" leading up to a Cold War type situation. The big thing here, however, is that an S-K would be more concerned with protecting themselves than with destroying the others; so before creating this Uber-Assassin spell, they'd develop an Anti-Uber-Assassin spell. And once one of them has done that, odds are a spy will report it to another S-K, and the next thing you know you've got a bunch of S-K's that are protected from Uber-Assassin's that probably were never "created" in the first place.
...which leaves us with Epic spells as plot devices and as a way to allow a DM to say "He's a Sorcerer-King, of course he knows what you're doing" while actually having rules to back it up as well as a feasible explanation as to why they would have used those rules to those ends.
How's that work for ya? ;)
Brax -
All valid points, but in the end what I guess I'm saying is just that the capability to use the Epic spell rules "abusively" or to otherwise create ridiculously powerful spells doesn't necessarily mean that an S-K, who ("in that reality") doesn't metagame, would do it.
Once the Champions became S-K's and had to worry about other things, like their fellow ex-Champions and a rampaging Dragon, *then* those types of spells might have come to mind....but each S-K would also be smart enough to think "hey, if I just had this idea, I bet that some of the others' did as well" leading up to a Cold War type situation. The big thing here, however, is that an S-K would be more concerned with protecting themselves than with destroying the others; so before creating this Uber-Assassin spell, they'd develop an Anti-Uber-Assassin spell. And once one of them has done that, odds are a spy will report it to another S-K, and the next thing you know you've got a bunch of S-K's that are protected from Uber-Assassin's that probably were never "created" in the first place.
Wisdom of the Drylanders has been out for several years, and while some of the points have been hotly argued, I don't recall anyone ever objecting to Daskinor's "stalkers."
Obviously once you send out invisible attackers to other city-states, that would cause the escalation that you speak of. But if Dask keeps his stalkers within the Dim Lands, it's not going to cause an arms race. If he just sends them to Kurn, then it just starts an arms race with Kurn; these two are called "lost cities" for a reason.
You don't need a special anti uber assassin spell to fight these guys. You just need varieties of detect invisibility and dispel magic. And any SK that doesn't have those isn't much of an SK.
Ability scores of 40 would not be permanent, since inherent bonus maxes out at 5. I never proposed combining permanent improved invisibility with other bonuses.
Cool spell, Penn, and thanks for sharing. One suggestion: never use the word "week" in a Dark Sun rules description. Use days. Week means a number of different things in Dark Sun. 15 days in Draj and in the WJ, 6 days in Nibenay, etc. Other sources have posited "weeks" of 10 days (Urik, Abbey) and 5 days. Daskinor's even got a week of seven days, since he's obsessed with the number seven, but obviously that one's not going to catch on. ;)
Like your icy breath storm! I love that short story.
Thanks, Zardnar! I need an epic psionic power that will divert any teleportation into or out of the designated area (44 mile radius) into a specific holding cell, separating all living creatures from non-living gear. (E.g. Daskinor casts this spell centered in the city of Eldaarich. You try to teleport yourself and your companions from Azeth's Rest to Fort Holz. Failing your will save, you find yourself naked inside an Eldaarish holding cell surrounded by guards. Your nonliving gear teleported to a different location that Daskinor designated.). It can't be a contingent spell, since it's got to run continuously. It might need regular re-casting.
Going back to Dragon Kings for Epic spells:
DISRUPTION. Disrupts the magical link between templars and their sorcerer-kings. Perhaps this is sort of the reverse of some epic spell that SKs use to establish that connection in the first place, either to the templars or to the signets
STORM LEGION. RIFT (I know we have a non-epic version of these now, but the DK idea was to have epic spells for enhancing whole armies. Kind of obvious this sort of thing would be around given what I said above about the cleansing wars. MOTIVE + OPPORTUNITY to make epic war spells was very high during the preserver jihad and during the cleansing wars. This sort of spell made up a significant number of the proto-epic spells in Dragon Kings.
- ENCHANTED ARMAMENTS,
- JUST SOVEREIGN,
- MAGICAL MINIONS,
- MASQUERADE,
- MASS FANATICISM,
- ROLLING ROAD.
I could appreciate someone arguing that such spells aren't worth our development time, especially since epic level spell rules are controversial and might be revised, pulling the rug from under us. Add also the additional problem that the epic rules aren't open-content.
But I don't think anyone can mount credible argument that such spells do not exist. Dragon Kings stares us in the face.
...at this point I'm not really sure what I'm even arguing about, let alone if I'm for or against it.
I could appreciate someone arguing that such spells aren't worth our development time, especially since epic level spell rules are controversial and might be revised, pulling the rug from under us. Add also the additional problem that the epic rules aren't open-content.
But I don't think anyone can mount credible argument that such spells do not exist. Dragon Kings stares us in the face.
Actually, the Epic spell rules *are* OGL, or at least are listed in the hypertext SRD, so until a revision happens or they're taken off of that site I can't argue against making a bunch of Dragon King (or otherwise) -inspired epic spells. It's more the time and effort (not to mention arguing with others as to whether or not you used the seeds correctly...) that's the problem as epic spells, at least for ones where you start with a description and create the spell based on that description. It's easy enough to give someone a simple bonus of some sort, but when you start combining multiple effects into the same spell it can get rough.
Although I don't have time to do it at the moment, I'm pretty sure that the spell you're looking for is going to be a nightmare, and the Spellcraft DC will be so high it'll require a ton of mitigating factors.
EDIT: Damn, too late!!!
Giving power to your own minions so they can carry out your orders isn't exactly what I'd call "sharing." Templars come to mind.
Come on Brax - how is it not sharing - they have the powers, they control access to the power, and they dole out the amounts of power that they want to their templars - ie in the form of spells. It is mentioned in several books that the SKs are misers when it came to actually dealing out spell power to their minions - and yes, I know about the templars because that is the major example that is given in the books. The spell power they give to the templars, as far as we know, costs them nothing because it comes directly through the Living Vortexes - so why was there never hordes of high level templars states out or mentioned in the books? The answer is because as I have said, the SKs do not give out the power for fear of creating potential rivals or threats to themselves.
As for the Epic rules being OCG - I see it has been covered.
I think that there are many Epic spells in existance - you are right that the Dragon Kings books kind of paves the way for that - I have redone several of the spells listed in there that were my favority - the enchant armaments and masquerade being two off you your list that I have doen along with (cannot recall the exact name) but the spell that allows you to move an army via a magical portal that involves a glass disk, and a non-epic defiler regeneration - there may have been one or two more I did , but I did not post most of them because I was under the assumption that the Epic peeps had done them or were in the process of doing so.
1) City defense (wards, barriers, unseen servants and spies, protection against scrying, etc.)
2) Metamorphosis (duh)
3) Battlefield control (troop movement, epic mass invis, large scale firestorms, rift, mass polymorph (mass frog comes to mind), etc.)
Other than this, I don't see the SK's having the ability to invest time into anything else. Plus, I don't think the SK's have as much understanding of themselves as we think they do. I think that they are still discovering what they are and how they can use that to there advantage. They are the first of a new type of being, and who knows exactly what they have done to themselves.
I will share it with you when I get'er done.
Unless the epic rules mention you actually need to develop each spell yourself. If not, then this would be a lot more interesting if every Champion shared maybe a dozen epic spells in common. They each developped their own since, or stole them, or won them as booty in conflicts against other epic spellcasters. Hamanu could have ransacked Sielba's library of epic spells before he called the Dragon in...
The Mythal seed is much cheaper and would work just as well IIRC, Kal. No need for that pesky x5 permanency thing.
It is not OGC. For those who are unware, that factor colors everything done at Athas.org.
The Mythal seed is much cheaper and would work just as well IIRC, Kal. No need for that pesky x5 permanency thing.
If the Mythal seed was OGC then I would use it - but it is a FR item. [edit - Penn already mentioned this]. While I could use it for my materail (since I am not designing this for anyone but myself really - I like to stick with OGC material that way I can post it and all people have have access to the material I use to construct my stuff from.
I came up with a better and more interesting way of having it last for a King's Age before it needed to be renewed - it also covers and a pretty big area (cylinder) - radius of 7.76 miles and is 11.64 miles tall.
Come on Brax - how is it not sharing - they have the powers, they control access to the power, and they dole out the amounts of power that they want to their templars - ie in the form of spells. It is mentioned in several books that the SKs are misers when it came to actually dealing out spell power to their minions - and yes, I know about the templars because that is the major example that is given in the books. The spell power they give to the templars, as far as we know, costs them nothing because it comes directly through the Living Vortexes - so why was there never hordes of high level templars states out or mentioned in the books? The answer is because as I have said, the SKs do not give out the power for fear of creating potential rivals or threats to themselves.
Yes, templars were one example of what you call sharing in the books, and the spells I just listed in DK were another example of what you call sharing. Sure, they are misers, and yet they still have systems in place for what you call sharing. What we call it isn't important to me so long as we agree that they have templars, and that they have other systems whereby they vest power and/or authority in various servants to carry out their will. If they didn't do this, they would not be kings. Lalali-puy is the one that seems least interested in delegating, and it's no surprise to see she has the smallest city.
I think that there are many Epic spells in existance - you are right that the Dragon Kings books kind of paves the way for that
My point was not that DK paved the wal for a lot of epic spells, but that DK paved the way for a lot of epic spells that involve enhancing your subordinates. That's why I listed those particular spells rather than all the DK epic spells.
- I have redone several of the spells listed in there that were my favority - the enchant armaments and masquerade being two off you your list that I have doen along with (cannot recall the exact name)
Would love to see that one.
but the spell that allows you to move an army via a magical portal that involves a glass disk
,
I don't recall that one. The only thing like that I recall from 2e was wormhole, the psionic power, and that's been redone as teleportation circle, a 9th level spell and power. (the fact that I don't recall something doesn't mean that it wasn't there; please fill me in!)and a non-epic defiler regeneration - there may have been one or two more I did , but I did not post most of them because I was under the assumption that the Epic peeps had done them or were in the process of doing so
Well as always I'd love to see your work, Kal!
All this Epic talk has got the juices going again and I will brush off the dust from some of the Epic spells I have converted and give them another look - I will try and post them soon, but I know one or two need tweeking to make them work right.
i remember that spell, put an army in a glass disc -- break when needed. great stuff
Yeap
Thats the one.After looking at my conversion of the enchanted armaments, I realize that I did not have this one right at all (I do not know what I was thinking when I did some of the things I did) - so I will revise it and post it and some of the other ones soon.
Thanks, Zardnar! I need an epic psionic power that will divert any teleportation into or out of the designated area (44 mile radius) into a specific holding cell, separating all living creatures from non-living gear. (E.g. Daskinor casts this spell centered in the city of Eldaarich. You try to teleport yourself and your companions from Azeth's Rest to Fort Holz. Failing your will save, you find yourself naked inside an Eldaarish holding cell surrounded by guards. Your nonliving gear teleported to a different location that Daskinor designated.). It can't be a contingent spell, since it's got to run continuously. It might need regular re-casting.
44 miles could be pushing it but I'll se what I can do. Not sure about the teleporting someone naked into a holding cell. 44 mile ward that prevents teleporting easy. Todays Thursday here, have work tomorrow and DnD Saturday so I'll see if I can get a basic version up on Sunday.
Armaments for the Cleansers
Transmutation
Spellcraft DC: 65
Components: V, S
Casting Time: 10 minutes
Range: 900 ft.
Targets: All weapons and ammunition in a 900-ft.-radius burst, centered on you
Duration: 20 hours (D)
Saving Throw: Will negates (harmless)
Spell Resistance: Yes (harmless)
To Develop: 585000 cp, 12 days, 23400 XP; Seed: Fortify (DC 17); +8 total enhancement bonus (+14), provide an epic weapon ability (ad-hoc: +15), adjustable dread ability at time of casting (ad-hoc: +5), dismissible by caster (+2), change from touch to 20-ft. radius area (+10), increase range to 900 feet (+4), increase area to 900-ft. radius (+176); Mitigating Factors: increase casting time by 9 minutes (-18), fifteen additional casters providing 4th-level spell slots (-105), five additional casters providing 6th-level spell slots (-55).
Upon completion of this ritual all weapons and ammunition, excluding natural weapons, become +1 dread weapons, the dread target creature type being determined at the time of casting. Natural weapons within the radius gain a +8 enhancement bonus.
As a standard action the caster can dismiss the effects of this spell on either a single weapon or on all weapons affected by the original casting.
---------------
I specifically didn't include any XP cost nor make it a permanent spell, as I'm guessing that if a spell like this was commonly used by the Champions then any racial force opposing them that was aware of this spell's existance would try and dispel it ASAP, not to mention that a lot of the enchanted weapons will likely be lost and/or taken by the enemy during the fight - all told it's much more "cost efficient" to just cast this spell on as many of your troops as possible prior to each battle than to worry about keeping track of epic-level weapons. The dismissable duration was put in there as an emergency measure "just in case" - for a +2 DC modifier it's worth it, since who knows what crazy plan your opponents might come up with to use this spell to their advantage more than it benefits your own forces.
Someone (er...multiple people actually, I think) mentioned epic spells to enchant the weapons of their armies. Got me thinkin'....here ya go:
Armaments for the Cleansers
Transmutation
Spellcraft DC: 65
Components: V, S
Casting Time: 10 minutes
Range: 900 ft.
Targets: All weapons and ammunition in a 900-ft.-radius burst, centered on you
Duration: 20 hours (D)
Saving Throw: Will negates (harmless)
Spell Resistance: Yes (harmless)
To Develop: 585000 cp, 12 days, 23400 XP; Seed: Fortify (DC 17); +8 total enhancement bonus (+14), provide an epic weapon ability (ad-hoc: +15), adjustable dread ability at time of casting (ad-hoc: +5), dismissible by caster (+2), change from touch to 20-ft. radius area (+10), increase range to 900 feet (+4), increase area to 900-ft. radius (+176); Mitigating Factors: increase casting time by 9 minutes (-18), fifteen additional casters providing 4th-level spell slots (-105), five additional casters providing 6th-level spell slots (-55).
Upon completion of this ritual all weapons and ammunition, excluding natural weapons, become +1 dread weapons, the dread target creature type being determined at the time of casting. Natural weapons within the radius gain a +8 enhancement bonus.
As a standard action the caster can dismiss the effects of this spell on either a single weapon or on all weapons affected by the original casting.
---------------
I specifically didn't include any XP cost nor make it a permanent spell, as I'm guessing that if a spell like this was commonly used by the Champions then any racial force opposing them that was aware of this spell's existance would try and dispel it ASAP, not to mention that a lot of the enchanted weapons will likely be lost and/or taken by the enemy during the fight - all told it's much more "cost efficient" to just cast this spell on as many of your troops as possible prior to each battle than to worry about keeping track of epic-level weapons. The dismissable duration was put in there as an emergency measure "just in case" - for a +2 DC modifier it's worth it, since who knows what crazy plan your opponents might come up with to use this spell to their advantage more than it benefits your own forces.
Cool!
I'd get rid of the casting time adjustable dread focus, since all available evidence shows that cleansing war armies followed a single champion and only went after one race. The only possible exception is that Abbey has Sielba wiping out the "sprites" while the WC says she killed pterrans ...
I'd get rid of the casting time adjustable dread focus, since all available evidence shows that cleansing war armies followed a single champion and only went after one race. The only possible exception is that Abbey has Sielba wiping out the "sprites" while the WC says she killed pterrans ...
Actually, the reason I put that in there was because of the chance that a particular Champion, although facing their chosen race, might meet a "mixed group" consisting of multiple races. I can see that as a tactic someone might use to prevent spells such as this, and of course there are certain races that are prone to sticking together anyway.
The other reason is that, although each Champion targeted a specific race, there's no reason to assume that they would never come into contact with the army of a differing race. Should that happen they'd want use of this spell, so why not add it into the basic spell design to begin with?
Actually, the reason I put that in there was because of the chance that a particular Champion, although facing their chosen race, might meet a "mixed group" consisting of multiple races. I can see that as a tactic someone might use to prevent spells such as this, and of course there are certain races that are prone to sticking together anyway.
The other reason is that, although each Champion targeted a specific race, there's no reason to assume that they would never come into contact with the army of a differing race. Should that happen they'd want use of this spell, so why not add it into the basic spell design to begin with?
There's always a chance, but I really think they would not spend that much time and effort premeditating going after other races like that.
Champions were not a united group. Look at all the power they had, and the war still wasn't over after 1500 years. Champions were hanging up their laurels and retiring to cities when their race died. They were focused on their enemy. Rajaat didn't want them more organized and coordinated because part of the point was to get the human race wiped out too.
I'm hearing more and more of people talking as if the Rajaat's champions were some sort of orchestrated war machine, and that the cleansing war armies were all true believers in Rajaat's supposed cause of wiping out non-humans, and that just doesn't fit the story at all. There's not a shred of story to support that, and there's considerable to show the opposite -- that these were disorganized, arrogant, quarrelsome Champions that dispised and distrusted each other as much as anyone else.
But other than that, I like your spell. A couple more ones I've been tweaking:
Lightning Sphere
Metacreation
Psicraft DC: 59
Components: vi
Casting Time: standard action
Range: 300 ft.
Area: 40 foot diameter sphere.
Duration: 20 rounds
Saving Throw: No
Psionic Resistance: No
To Develop: 531000 cp; 21240 XP. Seeds: energy DC 19; animate DC 25; metacreation discipline (-5); (+59); standard action (+20);
You create an animated hollow globe that emanates electric energy. The outside of the wall sends forth waves of acidic energy, dealing 2d4 points of energy damage to creatures within 10 feet and 1d4 points of energy damage to those past 10 feet but within 20 feet. The sphere deals this damage when it appears and in each round that a creature enters or remains in the area.
In addition, if a creature enters or passes through one of the globe's walls, then it takes 2d6 +20 damage. The sphere does double damage to undead creatures.
As a colossal animated object, the lightning sphere moves at a speed of 50 feet/round. If it successfully rolls over a creature as a trample action, then the creature is forced to pass through the wall.
Once a creature passes through the wall of the sphere once, unless the creature can move at the speed that the sphere is moving, without touching the ground, then the creature will probably be forced to move through the sphere again in order to exit the sphere.
Since the object has no weight, it can move up or down in silt or water.
Black Chain
Metacreation
Psicraft DC: 58
Components: vi
Casting Time: standard action
Range: 300 ft.
Area: 40 foot long chain
Duration: 40 rounds
Saving Throw: No
Psionic Resistance: No
To Develop: 522000 cp; 20880 XP. Seeds: conjure DC 21; metacreation discipline (-5); animate DC 25; metacreation discipline (-5); (+58); standard action (+20); +100% duration (+2);
You draw an adamantine chain from shadowstuff and animate it to fight for you. The chain has hardness 40. As a free action, the chain can roll itself into a wheel shape, and while in wheel shape can roll at a speed of 50 feet/round. In other respects, treat the chain as a colossal animated object, 40 feet long and 6 inches foot wide, with a reach of 30 feet. When the duration expires, the chain fades away into shadow.
Epic Animal Affinity
Psychometabolism
Psicraft DC: 27
Components: vi
Casting Time: 11 minutes
Range: 0
Area: 20 foot radius, centered on yourself
Duration: 15 days
Saving Throw: No
Psionic Resistance: No
To Develop: 243000 cp; 9720 XP. Seed: fortify DC 17; 42 total enhancement bonus (+82); ad hoc manifesting time choice (+9); (+27); 11 minutes (-20); touch to area (20 ft. radius) (+10); duration +1400% (+28); 33 co-manifesters (2nd level power) (-99);
You forge a psychometabolic affinity between all willing persons within the area of affect, and an idealized animal form. Each willing recipient within the area of effect receives an epic enhancement bonus that lasts 15 days. you manifest this power, you must choose whether to enhance one ability score (Strength, Dexterity, Constitution, Intelligence, Wisdom, or Charisma), natural armor, or any one kind of saving throw (fortitude, reflex, or will). The power grants a +42 enhancement bonus to the ability score you choose, adding the usual benefits provided by a high ability bonus. Alternately, you may choose to enhance the recipients' natural armor to 42. If you choose to increase the ability that some of the recipients use to manifest powers and/or to cast spells, this power will provide these recipients with the benefit of an increased ability score long enough to gain bonus power points for a high ability score, once they rest sufficient to recover power points. The save DCs of your powers also increase for the duration of this power.
And this one I quit part of the way through, because although it followes the epic rules smoothly enough, I realized that adjudicating this would be an absolute nightmare for the DM:
Animate Gear
Metacreation
Psicraft DC: 68
Components: vi
Casting Time: standard action
Range: 300 ft.
Area: up to 100 cubic feet
Duration: 40 rounds
Saving Throw: No
Psionic Resistance: No
To Develop: 612000 cp; 24480 XP. Seed: animate DC 25; metacreation discipline (-5); animating attended objects (+10); (+68); standard action (+20); change from target to area (20 ft burst) (+10); add 80 cubic feet (+8);
This power lets you animate all non-living gear within range, your opponent's armor, weapons …
naw.
There's always a chance, but I really think they would not spend that much time and effort premeditating going after other races like that.
Champions were not a united group. Look at all the power they had, and the war still wasn't over after 1500 years. Champions were hanging up their laurels and retiring to cities when their race died. They were focused on their enemy. Rajaat didn't want them more organized and coordinated because part of the point was to get the human race wiped out too.
I'm hearing more and more of people talking as if the Rajaat's champions were some sort of orchestrated war machine, and that the cleansing war armies were all true believers in Rajaat's supposed cause of wiping out non-humans, and that just doesn't fit the story at all. There's not a shred of story to support that, and there's considerable to show the opposite -- that these were disorganized, arrogant, quarrelsome Champions that dispised and distrusted each other as much as anyone else.
My justification has nothing to do with the Champions even having contact with, let alone helping out, any of the other Champions. It just comes down to the simple laws of probability - at some point in time, a Champion's army is going to run into opposing forces that will want to fight them, and that isn't of their chosen Cleansing race. Given that, why make your spell so specific as to be ineffective against those enemies when, for just a little more time, money and Spellcraft, you could vary it?
A simple, and probably common, instance of this would be human-versus-human: sooner or later, probably during the early years of the war, odds are there would be communities of humans that would side with some of the humanoid races and stand against their "fellow man." Champions run into a mixed group like this, cast this spell with Dread (human) and Dread (elf or whatever) on two different sections of their army, give the order to "mix ranks and attack your chosen enemy," and then they wade off into battle. Once the majority of the opposing human forces have been destroyed, the Champion then dismisses the dread (human) weapons as 1) there's no longer a need for them and 2) by now the enemy would have probably started picking up some of these weapons for use against the Champion's own forces.
Other than that, I like the spells you made...although I'm not sure what the chain one is for. What was the intended use you had in mind, just something to hit and/or trample opponents to death with?
Pretty much, yes. A colossal animated object is only 10 CR, like the biggest astral cconstruct, but I think that the adamantine 40/0 resistance makes it considerably tougher than that, plus adamantine can hurt a lot of things that other stuff can't touch. What do you think -- is it worth the epic slot?
Yes, although if you're treating it as a construct I think the DR drops back down to 10/adamantine or something - I'm not positive how that works, but it gets kludgey when dealing with objects-made-creature. Maybe not though since you're not giving it life...you should definitely give it HP though, as well as other stats (does the animate seed state what the BAB and such is for animated objects?). Figure out the damage it'll do with an attack, maybe state that it uses Trample rules if it rolls over someone (and note the Ref DC and damage, etc.), as well as any other applicable rules. I can see the item being used as a defensive shield of sorts, for instance, so maybe note that it can act as a tower shield...just stuff like that so the spell "sounds official" and doesn't leave a ton of room for interpretation; the more specific you get with the description of a rule/spell/item/etc the less likely someone is going to abuse it and the more likely they'll see it's value and use it in the first place.
Yes, although if you're treating it as a construct I think the DR drops back down to 10/adamantine or something - I'm not positive how that works, but it gets kludgey when dealing with objects-made-creature. Maybe not though since you're not giving it life...you should definitely give it HP though, as well as other stats (does the animate seed state what the BAB and such is for animated objects?). Figure out the damage it'll do with an attack, maybe state that it uses Trample rules if it rolls over someone (and note the Ref DC and damage, etc.), as well as any other applicable rules. I can see the item being used as a defensive shield of sorts, for instance, so maybe note that it can act as a tower shield...just stuff like that so the spell "sounds official" and doesn't leave a ton of room for interpretation; the more specific you get with the description of a rule/spell/item/etc the less likely someone is going to abuse it and the more likely they'll see it's value and use it in the first place.
The hit points and such are all in the monster manual's colossal animated object description that I cited. But you are right about listing attack strategies for it, like Trample.
The hit points and such are all in the monster manual's colossal animated object description that I cited. But you are right about listing attack strategies for it, like Trample.
Ah, whoops...forgot that there were generic stats for animated objects.