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The Laws of Sigil

Post/Author/DateTime Post
#1
ohtar_turinson
Apr 06, 2007 19:23:39 The question came up in my game about how exactly the political and legal system of Sigil works, and that in turn spawned this piece of writing. I'd like some view on what I've overlooked (though I intentionally made this a very, very biased bit of writing).

An excerpt from Free Leaguer Oraniano di Terrasus's pamphlet "Blood, Money and Fear: the Corrupt State of Sigilian Politics" (WARNING: This text is banned by order of Factol Sarin of the Harmonium)

The laws of Sigil are of a sort seldom seen, for there is no ruler in the standard sense. The Bladed Queen passes down decrees, perhaps, or makes her displeasure known through more concrete means, but she does not pass laws in the way that the Lord of a city would. The law and politics of the city are thus the law and politics of the factions and of the very wealthy.

How can there be courts, or laws passed though? The Harmonium enforces laws. The Fraternity of Order passes judgments. The Mercykillers carry out sentences. But under what authority do they do these things?

It seems clear that the rare decisions reached in the Hall of Speakers are but proclamations of the agreement of the factions, and thus effective law. These rare moments of agreement, combined with such ancient standards as a prohibition against murder and thievery form the basis of the sets of precedent that make up the so called laws of the City of Doors. This complex series of judgments and decisions passed down from prior times are what the Fraternity of Order references. The punishments are meted out by the Red Death, at the whims of the alleged "justice" of that faction.

The remainder of law is what people believe to be law, what the Harmonium chooses to enforce and what the wealthy decide to observe. Without a central government, the laws are what you can enforce.

In private matters, things become more complex. Once again, precedent is the key, and the Fraternity of Order's ritualistic and obsessive accounting of transactions within the courts come together with the Fated's vast records, where such contracts and agreements are kept, allowing for the trade of services and goods to be generally painless. The individual's personal means and power once again are the primary means of insurance.

Of course, the factions are also a large part of ensuring that such things as contracts are obeyed. Since open war between the factions is banned, there is incentive to honor contracts-failing to honor a contract with someone of another factions will result in punishment by that faction (if your faction chooses not to defend you), by your factions (if your faction decides to appease the other faction) or by the legal system (since this is the most apparently neutral system). Fear of open violence between factions encourages the use of the courts.

The way that each faction acts as a nation unto itself leaves those bereft of an organized faction-the Clueless, the Anarchists and the Indeps-in a difficult position. Unless they themselves have great personal wealth or power, there is no recourse. They have no faction to fall back to. Only the mercy of the courts will save them, but without a great deal of money or the backing of a faction, the Triad of Order has no incentive to treat these individuals with any degree of fairness, except for a love of law itself. Thus, oftentimes, a faction member might be let free in order to maintain the peace, while another man in the same predicament might be left to the tender ministrations of the Mercykillers and the Harmonium.

So money and fear of war are the law of Sigil, and the common man is left to rot.
#2
ripvanwormer
Apr 06, 2007 22:12:29 I agree with some of this, but I don't agree that Sigil has "no central government." The Hall of Speakers is the central government - essentially a parliament without a chief executive, the seat of authority beneath the Lady - and laws can be passed there by simple majority. If the Xaositects want to make trouble by obstructing every law, they need the cooperation of seven of the other factions represented there in order to do so. Likewise, if the Harmonium wants to go crazy getting all of their code made law in Sigil, they need a majority on their side as well.

Sigil has real laws, not just so "so-called" ones; it's not an anarchy by any means, although Chaos is strong there. If the Harmonium decides not to enforce some of the laws and enough of the other factions disagree, they can be censured or worse. Each faction is powerful, but not a nation or government on to itself. They're all bound by the law of Sigil, as passed by their voting delegates at the Hall of Speakers.

I agree that common law and precedent are going to be very important when judges make decisions in the City Court; not every law has to be established by the Hall of Speakers.
#3
ohtar_turinson
Apr 07, 2007 9:27:07 Hm... maybe I'm still too influenced by the course on Ancient Roman Law that I took last semester. I was thinking of the Roman Senate for the Hall of Speakers- when they pass a resolution, it might as well be a law.

Most of what I said was based off of reading through the PSCS, where they talk about how "anyone can speak at the Hall of Speakers" which makes it seem, to me, like it's more a public debate hall than a center of government. They mention the legal capacity of the place only in passing, and as a place of perpetual deadlock.

You're right that the city has real laws- I went a little overboard there. I was trying to emphasize that it doesn't have laws in the sense that the Modern USA does- for the most part, in my understanding, these aren't laws passed by a house of representatives. They're written down by the Guvners, but it's from long use for the most part.

I tried to address why the factions do follow the laws- I see nothing anywhere to indicate that they have procedure as complex as censure. Rather, it seems to me, they follow the rules because the Factols are intelligent. They know that if they start violating the laws, it will mean fighting in the streets and either the anihilation of a faction acting singly by the other factions or intervention by the Lady to end the fighting. I think Faction War supports this- everything is kept in check until the Factols vanish or are killed, and then all hell breaks loose.

I guess one thing my model doesn't really support is the great political power of Rowan Darkwood and Erin Montgomery. They're both powerful speakers in one way or another, which would count for more if either a) they have a real, solid political system which works under modern mechanics or b) there are a great number of unaligned people in Sigil. If it's A, that's the only indication ever given that the political system works that way. B is rejected outright in some of the books (which always struck me as odd).

Oh, and I left out the fated tax collectors. Huh. Oops.

I'm going to keep refining this. Maybe I'll write something as a Guvner next.
#4
zombiegleemax
Apr 07, 2007 13:40:32 I think your question comes down to the very good question of what the legitimate source of authority is in Sigil.

In America and other republics, authority is granted by the social contract: the government is empowered to make and enforce laws, such as collecting taxes, and in return you are entitled to the use of certain public works and the protection of various rights and privileges. It claims a certain territory, which is a separate question entirely, but generally these days agreed upon between the various nations. If you enter its territory, you are subject to its laws by threat of force (criminal prosecution leading to various penalties). If you choose to reside in its territory, you must make a more explicit acceptance of its social contract: begin paying taxes and agree that its laws as they stand are sufficiently just, the rights it reserves to you and itself sufficiently well-founded.

In a monarchy, authority is theoretically based on divine right: the god(s) picked this person to rule, and thus it is right to obey them. Variants include right of conquest, or simply authoritarian rule by force. Rights for others come from the same source; a monarch who depends on divine revelation for his authority must admit rights the clergy declare are possessed by others, and a ruler by force of arms must prepare to defend that claim.

In an anarchy, authority is rejected. Rights are limitless.

Sigil, pre-FW, strikes me as something of an oligarchy: power is shared among a few who possess the capability of collecting and organizing resources capable of performing large public works. If you choose to reside in Sigil, you at least implicitly accept the authority of this oligarchy: you agree to pay taxes to the Fated, submit to laws passed by the Hall of Speakers, and so forth. The authority is granted by the social contract, in a sense. It does have the glaring flaw that there does not seem to be a theory of rights; if you want to call a Sigilian law unjust, you must do so based on a theory of rights obtained elsewhere, and need to be very sure of your theory, so routes to object to a law seem to be nonexistent. That's a severe problem.

Post-FW Sigil has clearer authority. The dabus are now active in the courts, and since the Lady of Pain rules by what is in essence divine right, force of arms, and right of property combined, and the dabus are her servants, the judiciary's rulings on laws become her clear input into the system. If they ever declare a law passed by Sigil's council unjust, or a punishment meted out by the Sodkillers to be unwarranted, that would start laying the groundwork for a theory of rights. If they declare that a tax the Fated want to collect is within their authority, that would legitimize that tax. You'll eventually develop a body of precedent that would constitute the Lady's will for the city and guide future legal actions.
#5
zombiegleemax
Apr 08, 2007 17:48:16 You have as much said it: the "law" exists only at the will of the powerful. The strongest (in this case, the Lady) adjucates supreme authority, in the final sense. It doesn't matter how you dress it up in fancy terms, political maneuvering or economic and social casting... The fundamental thing here is that the weak hand over their rights to others and these others take advantage of this. These are the strong.

I didn't say deserving...all things being relative. But things seldom are.
#6
slashrat
Apr 10, 2007 2:29:03
Post-FW Sigil has clearer authority. The dabus are now active in the courts, and since the Lady of Pain rules by what is in essence divine right, force of arms, and right of property combined, and the dabus are her servants, the judiciary's rulings on laws become her clear input into the system. If they ever declare a law passed by Sigil's council unjust, or a punishment meted out by the Sodkillers to be unwarranted, that would start laying the groundwork for a theory of rights. If they declare that a tax the Fated want to collect is within their authority, that would legitimize that tax. You'll eventually develop a body of precedent that would constitute the Lady's will for the city and guide future legal actions.

This would only be until the dabus contradicts an earlier ruling. Who's going to call the Lady on that?
#7
zombiegleemax
Apr 10, 2007 22:39:15
This would only be until the dabus contradicts an earlier ruling. Who's going to call the Lady on that?

No one has to; the authorities ascribed to her give her the right to change her mind and the laws. You use the latest ruling as the currently-operative legal basis. She authorized fifteen factions, then she told them to get out. Each is the law after the ruling is issued.

However, assuming the Lady (and thus the dabus) to have at least some consistent agenda, contradictions will be rare and presumably serve that consistent purpose under evolving circumstances. Furthermore, as the body of precedent grows, opportunities to alter precedent will most likely arise less frequently, simply because people will adjust their behavior to accord with perceived precedent and cases challenging it will never make it to court to be ruled on.

If there's a high rate of contradictions or senseless rulings, and no coherent body of precedent evolves, Sigil essentially becomes lawless. People would stay if they liked that, and move somewhere that had something like a constitution if they didn't. However, seeing as how the Lady let the Hall of Speakers, Harmonium, Fraternity of Order and Mercykillers all act as governing bodies for as long as she did, she seems to desire some level of order in Sigil. It seems to suit her not to be beholden to a constitution, and to suit her not to have the Blood War rampaging in the streets. All this is seeming... but it's the kind of conclusion that the masses are likely to come to, and thereafter comport themselves accordingly.

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
#1 ohtar_turinson Apr 06, 2007 19:23:39	The question came up in my game about how exactly the political and legal system of Sigil works, and that in turn spawned this piece of writing. I'd like some view on what I've overlooked (though I intentionally made this a very, very biased bit of writing). An excerpt from Free Leaguer Oraniano di Terrasus's pamphlet "Blood, Money and Fear: the Corrupt State of Sigilian Politics" (WARNING: This text is banned by order of Factol Sarin of the Harmonium) The laws of Sigil are of a sort seldom seen, for there is no ruler in the standard sense. The Bladed Queen passes down decrees, perhaps, or makes her displeasure known through more concrete means, but she does not pass laws in the way that the Lord of a city would. The law and politics of the city are thus the law and politics of the factions and of the very wealthy. How can there be courts, or laws passed though? The Harmonium enforces laws. The Fraternity of Order passes judgments. The Mercykillers carry out sentences. But under what authority do they do these things? It seems clear that the rare decisions reached in the Hall of Speakers are but proclamations of the agreement of the factions, and thus effective law. These rare moments of agreement, combined with such ancient standards as a prohibition against murder and thievery form the basis of the sets of precedent that make up the so called laws of the City of Doors. This complex series of judgments and decisions passed down from prior times are what the Fraternity of Order references. The punishments are meted out by the Red Death, at the whims of the alleged "justice" of that faction. The remainder of law is what people believe to be law, what the Harmonium chooses to enforce and what the wealthy decide to observe. Without a central government, the laws are what you can enforce. In private matters, things become more complex. Once again, precedent is the key, and the Fraternity of Order's ritualistic and obsessive accounting of transactions within the courts come together with the Fated's vast records, where such contracts and agreements are kept, allowing for the trade of services and goods to be generally painless. The individual's personal means and power once again are the primary means of insurance. Of course, the factions are also a large part of ensuring that such things as contracts are obeyed. Since open war between the factions is banned, there is incentive to honor contracts-failing to honor a contract with someone of another factions will result in punishment by that faction (if your faction chooses not to defend you), by your factions (if your faction decides to appease the other faction) or by the legal system (since this is the most apparently neutral system). Fear of open violence between factions encourages the use of the courts. The way that each faction acts as a nation unto itself leaves those bereft of an organized faction-the Clueless, the Anarchists and the Indeps-in a difficult position. Unless they themselves have great personal wealth or power, there is no recourse. They have no faction to fall back to. Only the mercy of the courts will save them, but without a great deal of money or the backing of a faction, the Triad of Order has no incentive to treat these individuals with any degree of fairness, except for a love of law itself. Thus, oftentimes, a faction member might be let free in order to maintain the peace, while another man in the same predicament might be left to the tender ministrations of the Mercykillers and the Harmonium. So money and fear of war are the law of Sigil, and the common man is left to rot.
#2 ripvanwormer Apr 06, 2007 22:12:29	I agree with some of this, but I don't agree that Sigil has "no central government." The Hall of Speakers is the central government - essentially a parliament without a chief executive, the seat of authority beneath the Lady - and laws can be passed there by simple majority. If the Xaositects want to make trouble by obstructing every law, they need the cooperation of seven of the other factions represented there in order to do so. Likewise, if the Harmonium wants to go crazy getting all of their code made law in Sigil, they need a majority on their side as well. Sigil has real laws, not just so "so-called" ones; it's not an anarchy by any means, although Chaos is strong there. If the Harmonium decides not to enforce some of the laws and enough of the other factions disagree, they can be censured or worse. Each faction is powerful, but not a nation or government on to itself. They're all bound by the law of Sigil, as passed by their voting delegates at the Hall of Speakers. I agree that common law and precedent are going to be very important when judges make decisions in the City Court; not every law has to be established by the Hall of Speakers.
#3 ohtar_turinson Apr 07, 2007 9:27:07	Hm... maybe I'm still too influenced by the course on Ancient Roman Law that I took last semester. I was thinking of the Roman Senate for the Hall of Speakers- when they pass a resolution, it might as well be a law. Most of what I said was based off of reading through the PSCS, where they talk about how "anyone can speak at the Hall of Speakers" which makes it seem, to me, like it's more a public debate hall than a center of government. They mention the legal capacity of the place only in passing, and as a place of perpetual deadlock. You're right that the city has real laws- I went a little overboard there. I was trying to emphasize that it doesn't have laws in the sense that the Modern USA does- for the most part, in my understanding, these aren't laws passed by a house of representatives. They're written down by the Guvners, but it's from long use for the most part. I tried to address why the factions do follow the laws- I see nothing anywhere to indicate that they have procedure as complex as censure. Rather, it seems to me, they follow the rules because the Factols are intelligent. They know that if they start violating the laws, it will mean fighting in the streets and either the anihilation of a faction acting singly by the other factions or intervention by the Lady to end the fighting. I think Faction War supports this- everything is kept in check until the Factols vanish or are killed, and then all hell breaks loose. I guess one thing my model doesn't really support is the great political power of Rowan Darkwood and Erin Montgomery. They're both powerful speakers in one way or another, which would count for more if either a) they have a real, solid political system which works under modern mechanics or b) there are a great number of unaligned people in Sigil. If it's A, that's the only indication ever given that the political system works that way. B is rejected outright in some of the books (which always struck me as odd). Oh, and I left out the fated tax collectors. Huh. Oops. I'm going to keep refining this. Maybe I'll write something as a Guvner next.
#4 zombiegleemax Apr 07, 2007 13:40:32	I think your question comes down to the very good question of what the legitimate source of authority is in Sigil. In America and other republics, authority is granted by the social contract: the government is empowered to make and enforce laws, such as collecting taxes, and in return you are entitled to the use of certain public works and the protection of various rights and privileges. It claims a certain territory, which is a separate question entirely, but generally these days agreed upon between the various nations. If you enter its territory, you are subject to its laws by threat of force (criminal prosecution leading to various penalties). If you choose to reside in its territory, you must make a more explicit acceptance of its social contract: begin paying taxes and agree that its laws as they stand are sufficiently just, the rights it reserves to you and itself sufficiently well-founded. In a monarchy, authority is theoretically based on divine right: the god(s) picked this person to rule, and thus it is right to obey them. Variants include right of conquest, or simply authoritarian rule by force. Rights for others come from the same source; a monarch who depends on divine revelation for his authority must admit rights the clergy declare are possessed by others, and a ruler by force of arms must prepare to defend that claim. In an anarchy, authority is rejected. Rights are limitless. Sigil, pre-FW, strikes me as something of an oligarchy: power is shared among a few who possess the capability of collecting and organizing resources capable of performing large public works. If you choose to reside in Sigil, you at least implicitly accept the authority of this oligarchy: you agree to pay taxes to the Fated, submit to laws passed by the Hall of Speakers, and so forth. The authority is granted by the social contract, in a sense. It does have the glaring flaw that there does not seem to be a theory of rights; if you want to call a Sigilian law unjust, you must do so based on a theory of rights obtained elsewhere, and need to be very sure of your theory, so routes to object to a law seem to be nonexistent. That's a severe problem. Post-FW Sigil has clearer authority. The dabus are now active in the courts, and since the Lady of Pain rules by what is in essence divine right, force of arms, and right of property combined, and the dabus are her servants, the judiciary's rulings on laws become her clear input into the system. If they ever declare a law passed by Sigil's council unjust, or a punishment meted out by the Sodkillers to be unwarranted, that would start laying the groundwork for a theory of rights. If they declare that a tax the Fated want to collect is within their authority, that would legitimize that tax. You'll eventually develop a body of precedent that would constitute the Lady's will for the city and guide future legal actions.
#5 zombiegleemax Apr 08, 2007 17:48:16	You have as much said it: the "law" exists only at the will of the powerful. The strongest (in this case, the Lady) adjucates supreme authority, in the final sense. It doesn't matter how you dress it up in fancy terms, political maneuvering or economic and social casting... The fundamental thing here is that the weak hand over their rights to others and these others take advantage of this. These are the strong. I didn't say deserving...all things being relative. But things seldom are.
#6 slashrat Apr 10, 2007 2:29:03	Post-FW Sigil has clearer authority. The dabus are now active in the courts, and since the Lady of Pain rules by what is in essence divine right, force of arms, and right of property combined, and the dabus are her servants, the judiciary's rulings on laws become her clear input into the system. If they ever declare a law passed by Sigil's council unjust, or a punishment meted out by the Sodkillers to be unwarranted, that would start laying the groundwork for a theory of rights. If they declare that a tax the Fated want to collect is within their authority, that would legitimize that tax. You'll eventually develop a body of precedent that would constitute the Lady's will for the city and guide future legal actions. This would only be until the dabus contradicts an earlier ruling. Who's going to call the Lady on that?
#7 zombiegleemax Apr 10, 2007 22:39:15	This would only be until the dabus contradicts an earlier ruling. Who's going to call the Lady on that? No one has to; the authorities ascribed to her give her the right to change her mind and the laws. You use the latest ruling as the currently-operative legal basis. She authorized fifteen factions, then she told them to get out. Each is the law after the ruling is issued. However, assuming the Lady (and thus the dabus) to have at least some consistent agenda, contradictions will be rare and presumably serve that consistent purpose under evolving circumstances. Furthermore, as the body of precedent grows, opportunities to alter precedent will most likely arise less frequently, simply because people will adjust their behavior to accord with perceived precedent and cases challenging it will never make it to court to be ruled on. If there's a high rate of contradictions or senseless rulings, and no coherent body of precedent evolves, Sigil essentially becomes lawless. People would stay if they liked that, and move somewhere that had something like a constitution if they didn't. However, seeing as how the Lady let the Hall of Speakers, Harmonium, Fraternity of Order and Mercykillers all act as governing bodies for as long as she did, she seems to desire some level of order in Sigil. It seems to suit her not to be beholden to a constitution, and to suit her not to have the Blood War rampaging in the streets. All this is seeming... but it's the kind of conclusion that the masses are likely to come to, and thereafter comport themselves accordingly.