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Athas without Rajaat

Post/Author/DateTime Post
#1
Mulhull
Apr 20, 2007 0:45:06 Rajaat was first mentioned in the Crimson Legion Novel, and Borys the Dragon was one of his champions. He isn't mentioned anywhere in the Original Dark Sun boxed set. I asked Troy Denning what his inspiration was for him and he just said he thought the champions needed a leader, etc.

The name also sounds Arabian and seems more suited to an Al-Quadim character than one on Athas.

You can use him to explain why the world was defiled, or not. Doesn't the original boxed set just say that defilers became too numerous and too greedy? It even gives an explanation of how Tectuctilay became SK of Draj.

I like the idea of Rajaat, in most ways but it does put some limits on Athas. The sorceror kings were meant to just be psion/defilers, and by saying they were champions of Rajaat kind of puts limits on how many you can have. I wonder if any non-champion non-lens enhanced dark sun character could even live long enough to attain 20th level in both psion and defiler classes. There's that 2E Dragon Farclun, but I don't know how old he is.
#2
Kamelion
Apr 20, 2007 6:41:08 Athas without Rajaat? Fine by me. Sometimes I get very tired of the fleshy-headed pumpkin boy. He's a wholly over-used element of the setting. Heck, in my games there isn't even a Dragon - he's just a myth - let alone an ubercool First Sorcerar...
#3
zombiegleemax
Apr 20, 2007 12:53:32 I like the original setting. Dark Sun was more fun when there was a mystery. Everything was going fine, then all of a sudden, this group of peple from the city of Tyr start killing off thousands of years old SK like they were Star Trek extras.
#4
xlorepdarkhelm_dup
Apr 20, 2007 17:08:22
Athas without Rajaat? Fine by me. Sometimes I get very tired of the fleshy-headed pumpkin boy. He's a wholly over-used element of the setting. Heck, in my games there isn't even a Dragon - he's just a myth - let alone an ubercool First Sorcerar...

In my games, they exist. The characters don't know they do, and the Dragon's considered a myth (there's even a new myth claiming that the mythical dragon was killed, but considering the dragon was a myth to begin with, it becomes harder to accept that this mythical creature somehow was slain), while Rajaat's not even a word they've ever heard.
#5
elonarc
Apr 21, 2007 5:14:33
I like the original setting. Dark Sun was more fun when there was a mystery. Everything was going fine, then all of a sudden, this group of peple from the city of Tyr start killing off thousands of years old SK like they were Star Trek extras.

THANK YOU!
#6
squidfur-
Apr 21, 2007 17:52:59
Everything was going fine, then all of a sudden, this group of peple from the city of Tyr start killing off thousands of years old SK like they were Star Trek extras.

Well, Rajaat had always told them not to wear the RED shirts.
#7
greyorm
Apr 21, 2007 18:39:22 Honestly, yes, Athas is a sight more cool without Rajaat. He's always seemed to be too...stereotypical an element to belong in Athas. "Big evil bad guy behind the evil legions of the world." Bleh. DS was supposed to get away from standard fantasy tropes, but there one is, central and imposing, influencing the rest of the setting by just existing.

At this point, I've pretty much decided to simply ignore most everything that came out after the first boxed set that relates to the history of the world. Athas became very...boring, almost sterile in an exploration/wonder sense, once the "official" history and such became known.

I believe those were things that should have remained mysteries, because the secrets of the setting and its lost past were an integral part of the feel and allure of the original setting.
#8
ravengraygem
Apr 23, 2007 14:55:36 I use Rajaat in my version of Athas as well. But then, my version reduces Athas to a mere continent on a large world. My Rajaat was indirectly responsible for the fall of a major empire, fiendish & undead invasions, and the death/absorbtion of numerous gods at the hands of their divine peers.

So already, I'm way off the track as far as canon goes.
#9
elondir
Apr 25, 2007 9:22:46 I actually agree. The first boxed set had a nitty-gritty, primal, post-apocalyptic feel whereas the second, and also the lifeshaped items, had more of an eco-freak feel. I liked the setting way more before I read the Prism Pentad, which I feel was poorly written, had one-dimensional characters, and didn't suspend disbelief for me (a bunch of sorcerer kings who have spent thousands of years warring with each other over scarce resources, working together as an NPC party? It just didn't fit.) Although I DO like the expanded maps in the second boxed set. The Dead Lands intrigue me.

At least my campaign had finished before I read the books, and before the second boxed set came out (after Dragon Kings though). We had conquered five city states (Tyr + others, don't remember which ones) and then after becoming an avangion, an earth elemental, a 30th-level gladiator, and a 30th-level thief, took wing on rocs across the Sea of Silt and fought the dragon (who didn't have a name yet). The Cerulean Storm never formed, Rajaat was never thought of, the PRistine Tower wasn't either (although it's a pretty cool place), Tithian went down shortly after Kalak, and Ur Draxa was left to its own slow inevitable decline, although most of the kaisharga died in the battle vs the dragon. Borys played it smart and used hit and run after taking an initial beating; the party was pretty powerful though, and eventually beat him on the third all-out fight (which included a clone of the dragon under mental domination by the main dragon).

Rule #1: don't update the timeline to inlcude events from novels, especially if a huge chunk of campaign infrastructure (in this case sorcerer-kings and Borys) bites the dust causing a major shift in feel. On a side note, my FR is set in 1356, not 1370. The Time of Troubles will never happen, nor will all those world-shaking events from the past few years like Shade Enclave and the Dracorage.
#10
pringles
Apr 25, 2007 14:45:20 I also dont use thing from the Prism Pentad. The event of that series of novel never happened in my game. And I think it's way better like this.

Long live the first box

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
#1 Mulhull Apr 20, 2007 0:45:06	Rajaat was first mentioned in the Crimson Legion Novel, and Borys the Dragon was one of his champions. He isn't mentioned anywhere in the Original Dark Sun boxed set. I asked Troy Denning what his inspiration was for him and he just said he thought the champions needed a leader, etc. The name also sounds Arabian and seems more suited to an Al-Quadim character than one on Athas. You can use him to explain why the world was defiled, or not. Doesn't the original boxed set just say that defilers became too numerous and too greedy? It even gives an explanation of how Tectuctilay became SK of Draj. I like the idea of Rajaat, in most ways but it does put some limits on Athas. The sorceror kings were meant to just be psion/defilers, and by saying they were champions of Rajaat kind of puts limits on how many you can have. I wonder if any non-champion non-lens enhanced dark sun character could even live long enough to attain 20th level in both psion and defiler classes. There's that 2E Dragon Farclun, but I don't know how old he is.
#2 Kamelion Apr 20, 2007 6:41:08	Athas without Rajaat? Fine by me. Sometimes I get very tired of the fleshy-headed pumpkin boy. He's a wholly over-used element of the setting. Heck, in my games there isn't even a Dragon - he's just a myth - let alone an ubercool First Sorcerar...
#3 zombiegleemax Apr 20, 2007 12:53:32	I like the original setting. Dark Sun was more fun when there was a mystery. Everything was going fine, then all of a sudden, this group of peple from the city of Tyr start killing off thousands of years old SK like they were Star Trek extras.
#4 xlorepdarkhelm_dup Apr 20, 2007 17:08:22	Athas without Rajaat? Fine by me. Sometimes I get very tired of the fleshy-headed pumpkin boy. He's a wholly over-used element of the setting. Heck, in my games there isn't even a Dragon - he's just a myth - let alone an ubercool First Sorcerar... In my games, they exist. The characters don't know they do, and the Dragon's considered a myth (there's even a new myth claiming that the mythical dragon was killed, but considering the dragon was a myth to begin with, it becomes harder to accept that this mythical creature somehow was slain), while Rajaat's not even a word they've ever heard.
#5 elonarc Apr 21, 2007 5:14:33	I like the original setting. Dark Sun was more fun when there was a mystery. Everything was going fine, then all of a sudden, this group of peple from the city of Tyr start killing off thousands of years old SK like they were Star Trek extras. THANK YOU!
#6 squidfur- Apr 21, 2007 17:52:59	Everything was going fine, then all of a sudden, this group of peple from the city of Tyr start killing off thousands of years old SK like they were Star Trek extras. Well, Rajaat had always told them not to wear the RED shirts.
#7 greyorm Apr 21, 2007 18:39:22	Honestly, yes, Athas is a sight more cool without Rajaat. He's always seemed to be too...stereotypical an element to belong in Athas. "Big evil bad guy behind the evil legions of the world." Bleh. DS was supposed to get away from standard fantasy tropes, but there one is, central and imposing, influencing the rest of the setting by just existing. At this point, I've pretty much decided to simply ignore most everything that came out after the first boxed set that relates to the history of the world. Athas became very...boring, almost sterile in an exploration/wonder sense, once the "official" history and such became known. I believe those were things that should have remained mysteries, because the secrets of the setting and its lost past were an integral part of the feel and allure of the original setting.
#8 ravengraygem Apr 23, 2007 14:55:36	I use Rajaat in my version of Athas as well. But then, my version reduces Athas to a mere continent on a large world. My Rajaat was indirectly responsible for the fall of a major empire, fiendish & undead invasions, and the death/absorbtion of numerous gods at the hands of their divine peers. So already, I'm way off the track as far as canon goes.
#9 elondir Apr 25, 2007 9:22:46	I actually agree. The first boxed set had a nitty-gritty, primal, post-apocalyptic feel whereas the second, and also the lifeshaped items, had more of an eco-freak feel. I liked the setting way more before I read the Prism Pentad, which I feel was poorly written, had one-dimensional characters, and didn't suspend disbelief for me (a bunch of sorcerer kings who have spent thousands of years warring with each other over scarce resources, working together as an NPC party? It just didn't fit.) Although I DO like the expanded maps in the second boxed set. The Dead Lands intrigue me. At least my campaign had finished before I read the books, and before the second boxed set came out (after Dragon Kings though). We had conquered five city states (Tyr + others, don't remember which ones) and then after becoming an avangion, an earth elemental, a 30th-level gladiator, and a 30th-level thief, took wing on rocs across the Sea of Silt and fought the dragon (who didn't have a name yet). The Cerulean Storm never formed, Rajaat was never thought of, the PRistine Tower wasn't either (although it's a pretty cool place), Tithian went down shortly after Kalak, and Ur Draxa was left to its own slow inevitable decline, although most of the kaisharga died in the battle vs the dragon. Borys played it smart and used hit and run after taking an initial beating; the party was pretty powerful though, and eventually beat him on the third all-out fight (which included a clone of the dragon under mental domination by the main dragon). Rule #1: don't update the timeline to inlcude events from novels, especially if a huge chunk of campaign infrastructure (in this case sorcerer-kings and Borys) bites the dust causing a major shift in feel. On a side note, my FR is set in 1356, not 1370. The Time of Troubles will never happen, nor will all those world-shaking events from the past few years like Shade Enclave and the Dracorage.
#10 pringles Apr 25, 2007 14:45:20	I also dont use thing from the Prism Pentad. The event of that series of novel never happened in my game. And I think it's way better like this. Long live the first box