Using the athas.org Thri-Kreen rules (as my new ref-to-be has decided to go via them rather than the most recent Dragon versions, hopefuly the right decision?) i've gotten lost as to what my starting levels are (and are treated as) in what.
The game will have us start as 4th level characters.
So how many class levels am i allowed as an athas.org 'Kreen?
How do i work out my feats/stat points (as a 4th lvler should this be 2/1 respectively at this point?)?
Re how many HD i am...its the 2 racial + class, yes?
What level do i count as for gaining XP on the dmg chart?
I'm sure it should be obvious, hell, i've run 3.5 before, but for some reason i can't see the wood for the trees now.
Help!
Level Adjustment +1: Kreen characters start play as a 2-Hit Die monster without class levels, but in terms of gaining experience, they are treated as 3rd level characters. Kreen with class levels add 3 to their class level for experience purposes.
That is a little ambiguous isn't it?. Here is how I'd apply those rules. I'd have the player make a Kreen "commoner" following the guide lines here:
Racial Hit Dice: Thri-kreen begin play with 2 Hit Dice, giving them 2d8 hit points, a +2 Base Attack Bonus, base saves Fort +0, Ref +3, Will +3, and one starting feat of choice.
Racial Skills: A thri-kreen's monstrous humanoid levels give him skill points equal to 5x(2 + Int modifier).
His class skills are Balance, Climb, Hide, Jump, Listen and Spot. Note that the thri-kreen does not receive the x4 multiplier starting skill points when he takes his first class level.
Racial Profiencies: Thri-kreen are proficient with all simple weapons.
And then apply 2 normal character levels in whatever class(es) the PC was wanting to take. When he/she starts adventuring they would be considered a 5th lvl PC for experience purposes.
It cleary says level adjustment +1.
But then your example only allows for 2 more class levels to be taken, which would only make me 3rd level wouldn't it (and the game i'm to be part of allows for starting level 4th) ? It would be 4HD, but that's not the same thing is it?
I wondered if i might not be looking at 2 levels of monstrous humanoid (the 2HD) AND level adjustment +1, allowing for just 1 more class level in order to make a total character level of 4 (which then seems to tally with the XP part, which otherwise just confuses me).
If that were right i'd count as 4th also for feats and stat-points? Or does that go on HD...?
2HD + 2 Class levels = 4 +1 LA = 5th level for XP purposes.
Your feats & skills & extra ability points are based on your class progression not HD progression (like XP is). You still take your normal skill points at first character class level; i.e. ((2 + INT bonus) * 4)) for a 1st lvl fighter. You still take your feats in a normal progression. You don't get more ability points until 4th character class level.
That's how I'd do it at least. In fact I don't know how else you'd put that together & still make sense. I doubt your DM is going to let you start off with a 6 HD (2HD + 4 class levels) character.
2HD as monstrous humanoid
2HD of class
Thus given that i have 4HD total i do gain both a new feat and new stat point (just found that bit in the monster manual 3.5).
However my effective character level is 5, and this gets used for my xp rewards as well as my level advancement, meaning i start at 10000xp and need 15000xp total for my next level.
Aaaahhh...so really, for '4th level starting characters' my effective character level should be 4th. So i really should start out with being a thri-kreen and having just a single class level, which will mean and ECL of 4, starting at 6000xp and thus being rewarded and treated xp-wise the same as the other pcs, and having a new feat (as i'll be a 3HD character) but not a new stat point yet.
I think that sounds about right now and i've got my head around it straight.
Yes?
Your feats & skills & extra ability points are based on your class progression not HD progression (like XP is). You still take your normal skill points at first character class level; i.e. ((2 + INT bonus) * 4)) for a 1st lvl fighter. You still take your feats in a normal progression. You don't get more ability points until 4th character class level.
Close, but not quite
If you crack open the 3.5 Monster Manual to pages 290 & 291, there's a section that explains this process in detail. Also, pg20 of the athas.org rules says exactly how many skill pts a starting 'Kreen character gets.
- XP progression is based on Racial HD + Class Levels + Level Adjustment (this is the effective character level)
- Feats & Ability Score bonuses are based only on Racial HD + Class Levels
- The athas.org rules pg20 specifies that starting 'Kreen do not get the starting x4 multiplier for skill pts at first class level
You can check this link for a thri-kreen racial class that I put together which might help to simplify things a bit.
I think that sounds about right now and i've got my head around it straight.
Yes?
Looks like you got it! :D
Close, but not quite
If you crack open the 3.5 Monster Manual to pages 290 & 291, there's a section that explains this process in detail. Also, pg20 of the athas.org rules says exactly how many skill pts a starting 'Kreen character gets.
- XP progression is based on Racial HD + Class Levels + Level Adjustment (this is the effective character level)
- Feats & Ability Score bonuses are based only on Racial HD + Class Levels
- The athas.org rules pg20 specifies that starting 'Kreen do not get the starting x4 multiplier for skill pts at first class level
You can check this link for a thri-kreen racial class that I put together which might help to simplify things a bit.
Heh, I quoted the ection above & still missed it.
Actually the athas.org rules look a lot clearer now than i recall them being when i looked at them a short while ago, got a feeling i was maybe looking at and older version of them (or maybe the Dragon version and getting confused between that and athas.org one).
Hey ho, all sorted now.
Well, save for my class of course...*takes a deep breath*