Planescape Tarot Deck? - Downloaded from the Wizards Community, all coding removed by Solauren

Planescape Tarot Deck?

Post/Author/DateTime Post
#1
zombiegleemax
Sep 27, 2007 2:42:03 There have been more inane and less appropriate Tarot decks before (such as Harry Potter and H.P. Lovecraft mythos). No such Tarot deck exists to my knowledge, but seriously, why not? I love the Planescape setting, as it's far richer than most other and contains a wealth of meaning pertaining to belief and power. Tarot cards contain a similarly deep thread of symbolic meaning. Just think of the parallel assosciations that can be drawn! Is anyone here familiar with Tarot cards? Just consider the possibilities:

Major Arcana:

0 The Fool - The Nameless One? Factol Karan?
1 The Magician - An Ultroloth? Ignus?
2 The High Priestess - The Lady of Pain? Fall-From-Grace?
3 The Empress - Erin Montgomery?
4 The Emperor - Primus
5 The Hierophant - Factol Hashkar
6 The Lovers - Deva and Succubus
7 The Chariot - A Githyanki Astral ship
8 Strength -
9 The Hermit - Lothar (a.k.a. Master of Bones)? A Terithran?
10. Wheel of Fortune - Xaositects? Githzerai? Slaadi? Rule-of-Three?
11. Justice - Alisohn Nilesia
12. The Hanged Man - poor berk at Petitioner's Square?
13. Death - Factol Skall
14. Temperance - Rilmani? Factol Rhys?
15. The Devil - Graz'zt (fits best, but there are many other possibilities)
16. The Tower - The Wasting Tower (in the Gray Waste)
17. The Star -
18. The Moon -
19. The Sun - Apollo?
20. Judgement - Trumpet Archon
21. The World - The Multiverse? Sigil?

Now for some ideas about the Minor Arcana:

King of Cups: Factol Ambar
Queen of Cups: Jeena Ealy?
Knight of Cups: Bariaur
Page of Cups: Annah
9 of Cups: Djinni?
8 of Cups: Factol Terrance?
7 of Cups: Fell
4 of Cups: Factol Lhar
2 of Cups: Fensir twins

King of Pentacles: Factol Duke Rowan Darkwood (duh)
Queen of Pentacles: Factol Erin Montgomery?
Knight of Pentacles: Harmonium Measure? Reave?
Page of Pentacles: Formian warrior?
10 of Pentacles: Civic Festhall?
9 of Pentacles: Lady Zadara or Shemeshka
8 of Pentacles: Dabus?
7 of Pentacles: Scene in Bytopia? Utadas Tensar?
6 of Pentacles: A'kin the friendly fiend
5 of Pentacles: The Gatehouse?
4 of Pentacles: Merkhant? Tso?
3 of Pentacles: Keepers?
2 of Pentacles: Chameleon?

King of Swords: Factol Sarin
Queen of Swords: Factol Pentar
Knight of Swords: Order of the Planes-Millitant?
Page of Swords: Tarsheeva Longreach
10 of Swords: Slain Bodak? (Armory?)
9 of Swords: Autochon the Bell-ringer?
8 of Swords: Marilith constricting a ranger (8 swords in total)
7 of Swords: Berringe or were-rats?
6 of Swords: Charon or Marenoloth ferrying passengers into the Styx
5 of Swords: Khaasta or Reave
2 of Swords: Dispossessed? Bladeling?

King of Wands: Harys?
Queen of Wands: Factol Darius
Knight of Wands: Factol Karan?
Page of Wands: Morte? "Sly" Nye? Kylee?
10 of Wands: Darnoc (Taker NPC)
9 of Wands: Godsmen? (Great Foundry?)
8 of Wands: Ciphers? Great Gymnasium?
6 of Wands: Aasimar paladin?
5 of Wands: Blood War skirmish?
3 of Wands: Kesto Brighteyes in the Astral
2 of Wands: Genasi Sorceror

What do you guys think? Anyone have any other ideas?
#2
bob_the_efreet
Sep 27, 2007 2:54:35
19. The Sun - Apollo?

I think it would work best to stick with Planescape-specific themes, rather than branching into real-world mythos. Also, I'm curious as to how you determined suggestions for the minor arcana. Without knowing that it'd be hard to comment on your ideas or offer some new ones.
#3
da_black_cat_dup
Sep 28, 2007 7:09:08 This is based more on Planescape: Torment than Planescape in general:

00 - the Fool - the Nameless One
01 - the Magician - Morte
02 - the High Priestess - Deionarra
03 - the Empress - the Lady of Pain
04 - the Emperor - Pharod Wormhair
05 - the Hierophant - Hagrimm
06 - the Lovers - Corvus and Katrina or Ignus and Drusilla or The Nameless One and Annah
07 - the Chariot - the Siege Tower
08 - Strength - Coaxmetal
09 - the Hermit - Lothar, Master of Bones
10 - the Wheel of Fortune - the Brothel for Slaking Intellectual Lusts or Ravel's Maze
11 - Justice - the Wizard Construct of the Modron Maze
12 - the Hanged Man - the Private Sensorium
13 - Death - Vhailor
14 - Temperance - Fall-from-Grace or Trias Bound
15 - the Devil - Fhjull Forked-Tongue
16 - the Tower - the Pillar of Skulls
17 - the Star - Curst Gone
18 - the Moon - Carceri
19 - the Sun - Trias Redeemed
20 - Judgement - the Trial of Impulse
21 - the World - the Transcendent One
#4
zombiegleemax
Sep 29, 2007 12:42:43 The Major Arcana can be seen as representing a journey from ignorance (in all its aspects including innocence and luck) to enlightenment. Naturally, designed by mystics to supplement their various practices, the journey is mystical. There are a couple of arcana which are immediately suggestive of aspects of Planescape:

00, the Fool: "The luck of non-thought" is very obviously Cipher. Rhys would make a fine image for this card in deck of recent provenance.
01, the Magician: Well, numerologically, Primus works so well for this one that I would definitely want him.
08, Strength: the usual image is a woman subduing a lion. Sunnis strikes me as a good candidate, though the card is typically considered fire-aspected rather than earth. Factol Lariset (ascended previous Guvner Factol) would be more Sigil-oriented.
10, the Wheel of Fortune: about the randomness and unplanned things. The Xaositects or the Bleak Cabal would seem to be good candidates here.
14, Temperance: I agree with the suggestion of a Rilmani.
16, the Tower: an image of the Ruined Temple, I think. This one is about overturning an established order, so Revolutionary League imagery would asl go well here.
17, the Star: Ishtar, or a map of the City of the Star.
18, the Moon: A lillend on the Infinite Staircase.
21, the World: Yes, I think Sigil itself atop the Spire is the best image here.

Naturally, any Tarot which makes its appearance in-game is sure to avoid depicting the Lady of Pain anywhere. Many groups might have their own versions; for example, in the Thoth Tarot Strength is replaced by Lust, and the card might bear an image of Malcanthet dominating a bound leonal, whereas an Upper-Planar version might have a picture of Talisid himself. The Hanged Man would evoke Odin in any but a deck fastidiously opposed to paying the Norse gods respect; a Lower Planar deck might have an image of Twelvetrees. A look at an Athar version might be interesting. (Indeed, every faction will have its own ideas as to what constitutes a journey to enlightenment.)

Most Tarot traditions give elemental aspects to the four suits -- perhaps these would be useful in assigning imagery to the Minor Arcana. Coins or Pentacles are associated with Earth, Cups with Water, Wands with Air, and Swords wth Fire. Inner-planar imagery could dominate here. Alternatively, these could make the rounds of the four major alignment poles: coins (wealth), earth (gold and gems), and pentacles (magical knowledge) are all associated with the glooms of Hades, greed, and yugoloths. That would assign oppositional Air to Good, though really Elysium is more watery, and Mechanus doesn't strike me as any of the non-metallic elements. Perhaps better is to have Earth become imagery of the maw of the Abyss, with the fiery Swords suit associated to the Nine Hells (probably with the 10 cards progressing through those Hells, and what would the 10th be?), thus assigning Air to Mt. Celestia (I sense imagery of metallic dragons, couatls, and the like) and Water to Chaotic Good, with the flowing lillendi and the wines of Arborea.
#5
da_black_cat_dup
Sep 30, 2007 5:16:08
Coins or Pentacles are associated with Earth, Cups with Water, Wands with Air, and Swords wth Fire.

Wands are often associated with Fire, and Swords with Air.

Alternatively, these could make the rounds of the four major alignment poles: coins (wealth), earth (gold and gems), and pentacles (magical knowledge) are all associated with the glooms of Hades, greed, and yugoloths. That would assign oppositional Air to Good, though really Elysium is more watery, and Mechanus doesn't strike me as any of the non-metallic elements. Perhaps better is to have Earth become imagery of the maw of the Abyss, with the fiery Swords suit associated to the Nine Hells (probably with the 10 cards progressing through those Hells, and what would the 10th be?), thus assigning Air to Mt. Celestia (I sense imagery of metallic dragons, couatls, and the like) and Water to Chaotic Good, with the flowing lillendi and the wines of Arborea.

I'd assign Water to Mt. Celestia (calm, peaceful, healing), Earth to Arborea (lacking a Wood element, the four classical elements often attribute plants and greenery to the Earth element), Fire to the Abyss (passion, violence, pain) and Air to Baator (cunning, guile, trickery).
#6
wyvern76
Oct 02, 2007 11:56:13
15. The Devil - Graz'zt (fits best, but there are many other possibilities)

Wouldn't Asmodeus fit best?

Wyvern
#7
zombiegleemax
Oct 02, 2007 20:29:21 Indeed, Graz'zt might be pretty ****** at a Tarot deck that called him a devil. %^)

Of course, "devil" in a polytheistic setting with multiple fiendish races is going to have a different set of connotations than in the monotheistic culture of the real-world Tarot's origins. As a card representing intelligent opposition, original sin, or related concepts, the choice for a Planescape Tarot might be the Ultroloth that rules in the Wasting Tower. Various religions might pick a particular deity of evil to occupy this card in their versions, while faction decks might replace it with some embodiment of the antithesis of their morality -- a Guvner deck (and oh, Guvners' take on randomness and predestination in the use of the Tarot might be an interesting philosophical spiel indeed) might have it occupied by the current Factol of the Xaositects, or simply the Doomguard symbol.
#8
zombiegleemax
Oct 08, 2007 0:34:21 Excellent replies, everyone.

Anyway, about the Devil in a Tarot deck. The Devil represents not the literal devil but bondage to despair, material addiction, ignorance, and a loss of spirituality. Ironically, this sort of temptation is better suited to the tanar'ri (and this tanar'ri prince is particularly appropriate) than baatezu IMHO, despite the semantics.
#9
zombiegleemax
Oct 08, 2007 9:25:44 By the way, are you just jawing about this project, or actually intending to make up such a deck? It could make a nice prop, if we settled on a list of illustrations and you collected the artwork to make them.
#10
friendlyfiend
Oct 08, 2007 10:51:26 Six of pentacles? Too much fame for a humble fiend, I'm sure
#11
vedicdragon
Oct 08, 2007 10:54:31 Seriously, this would be pretty awesome to see.

I would so totally ogle some art by Tony DiTerlizzi or his colleagues.

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
#1 zombiegleemax Sep 27, 2007 2:42:03	There have been more inane and less appropriate Tarot decks before (such as Harry Potter and H.P. Lovecraft mythos). No such Tarot deck exists to my knowledge, but seriously, why not? I love the Planescape setting, as it's far richer than most other and contains a wealth of meaning pertaining to belief and power. Tarot cards contain a similarly deep thread of symbolic meaning. Just think of the parallel assosciations that can be drawn! Is anyone here familiar with Tarot cards? Just consider the possibilities: Major Arcana: 0 The Fool - The Nameless One? Factol Karan? 1 The Magician - An Ultroloth? Ignus? 2 The High Priestess - The Lady of Pain? Fall-From-Grace? 3 The Empress - Erin Montgomery? 4 The Emperor - Primus 5 The Hierophant - Factol Hashkar 6 The Lovers - Deva and Succubus 7 The Chariot - A Githyanki Astral ship 8 Strength - 9 The Hermit - Lothar (a.k.a. Master of Bones)? A Terithran? 10. Wheel of Fortune - Xaositects? Githzerai? Slaadi? Rule-of-Three? 11. Justice - Alisohn Nilesia 12. The Hanged Man - poor berk at Petitioner's Square? 13. Death - Factol Skall 14. Temperance - Rilmani? Factol Rhys? 15. The Devil - Graz'zt (fits best, but there are many other possibilities) 16. The Tower - The Wasting Tower (in the Gray Waste) 17. The Star - 18. The Moon - 19. The Sun - Apollo? 20. Judgement - Trumpet Archon 21. The World - The Multiverse? Sigil? Now for some ideas about the Minor Arcana: King of Cups: Factol Ambar Queen of Cups: Jeena Ealy? Knight of Cups: Bariaur Page of Cups: Annah 9 of Cups: Djinni? 8 of Cups: Factol Terrance? 7 of Cups: Fell 4 of Cups: Factol Lhar 2 of Cups: Fensir twins King of Pentacles: Factol Duke Rowan Darkwood (duh) Queen of Pentacles: Factol Erin Montgomery? Knight of Pentacles: Harmonium Measure? Reave? Page of Pentacles: Formian warrior? 10 of Pentacles: Civic Festhall? 9 of Pentacles: Lady Zadara or Shemeshka 8 of Pentacles: Dabus? 7 of Pentacles: Scene in Bytopia? Utadas Tensar? 6 of Pentacles: A'kin the friendly fiend 5 of Pentacles: The Gatehouse? 4 of Pentacles: Merkhant? Tso? 3 of Pentacles: Keepers? 2 of Pentacles: Chameleon? King of Swords: Factol Sarin Queen of Swords: Factol Pentar Knight of Swords: Order of the Planes-Millitant? Page of Swords: Tarsheeva Longreach 10 of Swords: Slain Bodak? (Armory?) 9 of Swords: Autochon the Bell-ringer? 8 of Swords: Marilith constricting a ranger (8 swords in total) 7 of Swords: Berringe or were-rats? 6 of Swords: Charon or Marenoloth ferrying passengers into the Styx 5 of Swords: Khaasta or Reave 2 of Swords: Dispossessed? Bladeling? King of Wands: Harys? Queen of Wands: Factol Darius Knight of Wands: Factol Karan? Page of Wands: Morte? "Sly" Nye? Kylee? 10 of Wands: Darnoc (Taker NPC) 9 of Wands: Godsmen? (Great Foundry?) 8 of Wands: Ciphers? Great Gymnasium? 6 of Wands: Aasimar paladin? 5 of Wands: Blood War skirmish? 3 of Wands: Kesto Brighteyes in the Astral 2 of Wands: Genasi Sorceror What do you guys think? Anyone have any other ideas?
#2 bob_the_efreet Sep 27, 2007 2:54:35	19. The Sun - Apollo? I think it would work best to stick with Planescape-specific themes, rather than branching into real-world mythos. Also, I'm curious as to how you determined suggestions for the minor arcana. Without knowing that it'd be hard to comment on your ideas or offer some new ones.
#3 da_black_cat_dup Sep 28, 2007 7:09:08	This is based more on Planescape: Torment than Planescape in general: 00 - the Fool - the Nameless One 01 - the Magician - Morte 02 - the High Priestess - Deionarra 03 - the Empress - the Lady of Pain 04 - the Emperor - Pharod Wormhair 05 - the Hierophant - Hagrimm 06 - the Lovers - Corvus and Katrina or Ignus and Drusilla or The Nameless One and Annah 07 - the Chariot - the Siege Tower 08 - Strength - Coaxmetal 09 - the Hermit - Lothar, Master of Bones 10 - the Wheel of Fortune - the Brothel for Slaking Intellectual Lusts or Ravel's Maze 11 - Justice - the Wizard Construct of the Modron Maze 12 - the Hanged Man - the Private Sensorium 13 - Death - Vhailor 14 - Temperance - Fall-from-Grace or Trias Bound 15 - the Devil - Fhjull Forked-Tongue 16 - the Tower - the Pillar of Skulls 17 - the Star - Curst Gone 18 - the Moon - Carceri 19 - the Sun - Trias Redeemed 20 - Judgement - the Trial of Impulse 21 - the World - the Transcendent One
#4 zombiegleemax Sep 29, 2007 12:42:43	The Major Arcana can be seen as representing a journey from ignorance (in all its aspects including innocence and luck) to enlightenment. Naturally, designed by mystics to supplement their various practices, the journey is mystical. There are a couple of arcana which are immediately suggestive of aspects of Planescape: 00, the Fool: "The luck of non-thought" is very obviously Cipher. Rhys would make a fine image for this card in deck of recent provenance. 01, the Magician: Well, numerologically, Primus works so well for this one that I would definitely want him. 08, Strength: the usual image is a woman subduing a lion. Sunnis strikes me as a good candidate, though the card is typically considered fire-aspected rather than earth. Factol Lariset (ascended previous Guvner Factol) would be more Sigil-oriented. 10, the Wheel of Fortune: about the randomness and unplanned things. The Xaositects or the Bleak Cabal would seem to be good candidates here. 14, Temperance: I agree with the suggestion of a Rilmani. 16, the Tower: an image of the Ruined Temple, I think. This one is about overturning an established order, so Revolutionary League imagery would asl go well here. 17, the Star: Ishtar, or a map of the City of the Star. 18, the Moon: A lillend on the Infinite Staircase. 21, the World: Yes, I think Sigil itself atop the Spire is the best image here. Naturally, any Tarot which makes its appearance in-game is sure to avoid depicting the Lady of Pain anywhere. Many groups might have their own versions; for example, in the Thoth Tarot Strength is replaced by Lust, and the card might bear an image of Malcanthet dominating a bound leonal, whereas an Upper-Planar version might have a picture of Talisid himself. The Hanged Man would evoke Odin in any but a deck fastidiously opposed to paying the Norse gods respect; a Lower Planar deck might have an image of Twelvetrees. A look at an Athar version might be interesting. (Indeed, every faction will have its own ideas as to what constitutes a journey to enlightenment.) Most Tarot traditions give elemental aspects to the four suits -- perhaps these would be useful in assigning imagery to the Minor Arcana. Coins or Pentacles are associated with Earth, Cups with Water, Wands with Air, and Swords wth Fire. Inner-planar imagery could dominate here. Alternatively, these could make the rounds of the four major alignment poles: coins (wealth), earth (gold and gems), and pentacles (magical knowledge) are all associated with the glooms of Hades, greed, and yugoloths. That would assign oppositional Air to Good, though really Elysium is more watery, and Mechanus doesn't strike me as any of the non-metallic elements. Perhaps better is to have Earth become imagery of the maw of the Abyss, with the fiery Swords suit associated to the Nine Hells (probably with the 10 cards progressing through those Hells, and what would the 10th be?), thus assigning Air to Mt. Celestia (I sense imagery of metallic dragons, couatls, and the like) and Water to Chaotic Good, with the flowing lillendi and the wines of Arborea.
#5 da_black_cat_dup Sep 30, 2007 5:16:08	Coins or Pentacles are associated with Earth, Cups with Water, Wands with Air, and Swords wth Fire. Wands are often associated with Fire, and Swords with Air. Alternatively, these could make the rounds of the four major alignment poles: coins (wealth), earth (gold and gems), and pentacles (magical knowledge) are all associated with the glooms of Hades, greed, and yugoloths. That would assign oppositional Air to Good, though really Elysium is more watery, and Mechanus doesn't strike me as any of the non-metallic elements. Perhaps better is to have Earth become imagery of the maw of the Abyss, with the fiery Swords suit associated to the Nine Hells (probably with the 10 cards progressing through those Hells, and what would the 10th be?), thus assigning Air to Mt. Celestia (I sense imagery of metallic dragons, couatls, and the like) and Water to Chaotic Good, with the flowing lillendi and the wines of Arborea. I'd assign Water to Mt. Celestia (calm, peaceful, healing), Earth to Arborea (lacking a Wood element, the four classical elements often attribute plants and greenery to the Earth element), Fire to the Abyss (passion, violence, pain) and Air to Baator (cunning, guile, trickery).
#6 wyvern76 Oct 02, 2007 11:56:13	15. The Devil - Graz'zt (fits best, but there are many other possibilities) Wouldn't Asmodeus fit best? Wyvern
#7 zombiegleemax Oct 02, 2007 20:29:21	Indeed, Graz'zt might be pretty ****** at a Tarot deck that called him a devil. %^) Of course, "devil" in a polytheistic setting with multiple fiendish races is going to have a different set of connotations than in the monotheistic culture of the real-world Tarot's origins. As a card representing intelligent opposition, original sin, or related concepts, the choice for a Planescape Tarot might be the Ultroloth that rules in the Wasting Tower. Various religions might pick a particular deity of evil to occupy this card in their versions, while faction decks might replace it with some embodiment of the antithesis of their morality -- a Guvner deck (and oh, Guvners' take on randomness and predestination in the use of the Tarot might be an interesting philosophical spiel indeed) might have it occupied by the current Factol of the Xaositects, or simply the Doomguard symbol.
#8 zombiegleemax Oct 08, 2007 0:34:21	Excellent replies, everyone. Anyway, about the Devil in a Tarot deck. The Devil represents not the literal devil but bondage to despair, material addiction, ignorance, and a loss of spirituality. Ironically, this sort of temptation is better suited to the tanar'ri (and this tanar'ri prince is particularly appropriate) than baatezu IMHO, despite the semantics.
#9 zombiegleemax Oct 08, 2007 9:25:44	By the way, are you just jawing about this project, or actually intending to make up such a deck? It could make a nice prop, if we settled on a list of illustrations and you collected the artwork to make them.
#10 friendlyfiend Oct 08, 2007 10:51:26	Six of pentacles? Too much fame for a humble fiend, I'm sure
#11 vedicdragon Oct 08, 2007 10:54:31	Seriously, this would be pretty awesome to see. I would so totally ogle some art by Tony DiTerlizzi or his colleagues.