Besides the fact that GH is still a fan favorite, it is the *FIRST* campaign setting. GH should have its own Board, if for no other reason than being an ICON.
When folks sign in, they will see it: they will not have to go all the way to the bottom board and then to a separate file.
It is all about Advertising.
Putting it on the front page, lets folks know that GH is alive and well...and still being used.
I think this is our last option.
Thoughts???
anyway, I would love to see greyhawk have its own subset of boards like the FR does.
Smite thee!
That was chonjurer!
He said it on the second page of the Foundations Thread Doxxie started!!!
Anyhow, I think this is something to push for; if more people like the suggestion.
Halber
An anology.
A "File": A whole Kobold Tribe.
A "Board": A Prismatic Wyrm.
Let's go for the real challenge!
So, surely most of the D&D forums are Greyhawk forums? Or am I missing something (which I suspect I am).
Originally posted by nemarsde
I just wondered across this forum, and was a little confused. I'm playing in a Greyhawk campaign at the moment and afaik, it's the official D&D setting now, since 3E.
So, surely most of the D&D forums are Greyhawk forums? Or am I missing something (which I suspect I am).
Many long-time fans feel Greyhawk, despite being the "default" setting for 3E DnD, has recieved the short end of the stick as far as development and publicity go.
And with this sentiment, I agree. For example, do you play with the Living Greyhawk Gazeteer or Return to the Temple of Elemental Evil module (192 and 190 pages, respectively)? These are, in my opinion, the only products which actually support Greyhawk as a unique and different campaign world. What does the Forgotten Realms currently have on the market? The FRCS book, Faiths and Pantheons, Races of Faerun, Unapproachable East, Magic of Faerun, City of the Spider Queen, Silver Marches, Lords of Darkness, the FRCS Monstrous Compendium, and the Pool of Radiance module--a whopping total of 1,810 pages of material! 383 pages versus 1,810!?!?
WotC has paid lip-service to Greyhawk, but as far as true development goes, they've left GH by the wayside as they flood the market with FR products. Greyhawk has been, in the past, a vibrant and compelling world and WotC, for whatever reason, is currently content to let it languish.
I personally think Greyhawk has been developed a lot since 3E. Greyhawk is the default campaign setting after all. Take any of the character class books, for example. Most of the PrCs in those books were designed specifically for Greyhawk.
Admittedly, there hasn't been much meta-development of Greyhawk; historical, geographical, socio-political, etc. But isn't this because of Living Greyhawk?
Originally posted by nemarsde
Admittedly, there hasn't been much meta-development of Greyhawk; historical, geographical, socio-political, etc. But isn't this because of Living Greyhawk?
That is exactly why! It was as if the rule books were designed with Living Greyhawk in mind and then utilized for FR. I don't see that changing in the near future. Even novels based on Greyhawk are drying up.
So either check in on the Living Greyhawk website, or take the base material and develop your own stories, 'cause unless there is a radical realignment of the stars, Greyhawk will remain in the official background.
Originally posted by nemarsde
Most of the PrCs in those books were designed specifically for Greyhawk.
Name two...
I'll even help you out by naming one for you, 'The Knight Protector of the Great Kingdom'.
Anyhow, back on topic, it would be great if the Greyhawk board were placed in a more...ahem...conspicuous location. It might get more posts, more publicity, and as a result become more popular. Who knows...
Originally posted by Huron
So either check in on the Living Greyhawk website, or take the base material and develop your own stories, 'cause unless there is a radical realignment of the stars, Greyhawk will remain in the official background.
But what I mean is, I use Living Greyhawk web sites for reference material. Living Greyhawk is constantly updated. It's always being developed, more so than FR or OA.
Hasn't it been set up to be developed by the customers? If so, is Living Greyhawk in the 'official background'?
Originally posted by Qual-Kehk
Fist of Hextor is another...Temple Raider of Olidammara...
From Sword & Fist alone (as an example).
Drunken Master
Fist of Hextor
Ghostwalker
Knight Protector of the Great Kingdom
Halfling Outrider
Master Samurai
Ninja of the Crescent Moon
Order of the Bow Initiate
Ravager
Red Avenger
None of these Greyhawk PrCs would easily fit into the campaign setting I GM (Known World of Mystara) without some alteration to each PrC's background material.
I see what you're saying (its a board after all . . . ok bad jokes asside)
What I am talking about is the fact that WofTC are not exerting much energy in developing and promoting Greyhawk. It's on the companies back burner, so to speak.
As for how the fans take to it, some people like to get new developments and information about a world through official products (I liken it to reading a neverending book). However, given that there have not been many official products, some players are feeling as if Greyhawk is being left out or underappreciated. I subscribed to this feeling for a long time, but finally saw things differently.
I think your point is a good one. Greyhawk is constantly being developed and new source material appears all the time and if people want new or more detailed information, then that is the place to go.
Who said it was unconscious to begin with?
If you want to use the Greyhawk setting, and if you want to see more people using the setting, then get a group together and run a Greyhawk campaign. Pester whoever you can as constantly as you can until they finally give in and start to play. Then make it as good as you can so that when they start their next campaign, they use Greyhawk.
Nothing else is needed, particularly not more pseudo-Greyhawk prestige classes, magic items, modules, spells, and whatever else, that uses the Greyhawk name, but fails to capture the Greyhawk spirit.
Just play.
We all have different visions of what our games should be like, which is the nice thing about Greyhawk IMHO. It isn't so detailed that you can't make it your own.
Just keep in mind that although we all have our opinions on how a world such as Greyhawk should be developed, this does not make our opinions definitive or the "be all end all" of what should happen with the setting's future.
Like Samwise said, just go out and play. Since I started running Greyhawk games, I have made it the favorite setting of most of the people who play with me.
Originally posted by Anuminas
What exactly ~is~ the Greyhawk spirit, in your opinion?
We all have different visions of what our games should be like, which is the nice thing about Greyhawk IMHO. It isn't so detailed that you can't make it your own.
Just keep in mind that although we all have our opinions on how a world such as Greyhawk should be developed, this does not make our opinions definitive or the "be all end all" of what should happen with the setting's future.
Like Samwise said, just go out and play. Since I started running Greyhawk games, I have made it the favorite setting of most of the people who play with me.
The Greyhawk spirit is partly what you said, that it's not detailed so much that you can't make it your own, and that everyone has their own opinions on how it should be developed. The rest is that Greyhawk doesn't lock itself into any of the "traditional" plot lines. That doesn't mean they can't be used, in many cases they should be, just that by not making them part of the basic background, it leaves you the freedom to avoid them completely. Other settings are so dependant on things like the usual, poorly presented, Good vs. Evil shtick, that any individual character of the setting is lost in the haze of trite, hackneyed stereotypes.
Originally posted by Samwise
Other settings are so dependant on things like the usual, poorly presented, Good vs. Evil shtick, that any individual character of the setting is lost in the haze of trite, hackneyed stereotypes.
I can definitely see that in reference to Forgotten Realms, at least if you play the setting as it comes. FR has always seemed to overwhelm characters, or story progression independent of what is by the books.
I guess that is what I enjoy so much about Greyhawk...
I don't feel at all hampered by story ideas in the books, because there is still enough left undefined that I can be creative.
In that respect, I see it as the most adaptive of the published campaign settings. Bland? Nah. Only if the DM running it makes it so.
I've also always seen Greyhawk as a more realistic, gritty, and dangerous setting. Anyone else portray it that way?
I've also always seen Greyhawk as a more realistic, gritty, and dangerous setting. Anyone else portray it that way?
I always DM it that way, though I also don't see it as particularly low-magic, which also seems to be used to describe Greyhawk pretty often. There simply isn't another campaign world with a demigod ruling his own empire, which necessitates a gritty realism, in my mind...
In the last Greyhawk campaign I ran, fourteen PCs started out at 8th level. A year-and-a-half later, five were still alive (though two "retired"), at roughly 19th or 20th level each. In one adventure, I believe four out of nine PCs died simply in the traps below the great wyrm's lair--the survivors were seriously debating quitting and going back, but they were afraid every single one of them would get killed trying to hobble back out the "secret" entrance...
Originally posted by Qual-Kehk
Fist of Hextor is another...Temple Raider of Olidammara...
You're confused. I understand. It's easy and can happen to anyone. But they are not Greyhawk PrC's. They're generica. Just because they use the name of Greyhawk god doesn't make them Greyhawk.
Temple Raider indeed...
In fact, I barely classify the Knight Protector of the GK as a Greyhawk PrC and the only reason I do so is because it at least DOES ground itself in GH lore, even if that lore was partly made up for the PrC.
The Fists and Temple Raiders are silly, unimaginative page filler PrC's that use the 'core' setting to show you all how it's done. Bleh, waste of paper. They don't even reflect the gods attitudes properly.
Originally posted by Huron
nemarsde,
I see what you're saying (its a board after all . . . ok bad jokes asside)
What I am talking about is the fact that WofTC are not exerting much energy in developing and promoting Greyhawk. It's on the companies back burner, so to speak.
Well, they're certainly not publishing the hardback Greyhawk Campaign Setting, for example. But it seems to me that as the default D&D 3E setting, any material that isn't specific to FR or OA is designed specifically for Greyhawk. Even all those adventure modules. So, I suppose WotC aren't really neglecting it, but then they aren't really utilising it either.
I think this is because of Living Greyhawk though. They can't exactly interfere with that, otherwise it won't be a setting developed by the customers any more. But Living Greyhawk's a good on-line resource anyway, even if it isn't developed by WotC.
Anyway, what I'm getting at is, is this topic a perceived problem for Greyhawk players, or is it a perceived problem for Greyhawk collectors?
As for this forum, I agree it should be added to the top-level of the D&D message board because there isn't a setting forum there at the moment.
If I want to discuss how the Shadowdancer PrC fits into the Greyhawk setting, how they're regarded by others, for example, there isn't a forum for it. (Except DMG or D&D General, neither of which are setting orientated.)
Originally posted by Delglath
You're confused. I understand. It's easy and can happen to anyone. But they are not Greyhawk PrC's. They're generica. Just because they use the name of Greyhawk god doesn't make them Greyhawk.
The only reason I mention them is because I have adapted them to be a bit less generic for my games. The Fist of Hextor most notably I have used once or twice against a PC playing a cleric of Heironeous. Correct you are though, they are generic, but not in my game. :D
