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FR Would have made a better Living Setting

Post/Author/DateTime Post
#1
zombiegleemax
Jul 12, 2003 11:02:15 Last night as I drifted off to sleep, this thought crossed my mind.

The thoroughly detailed and canonized nature of the Forgotten Realms makes it a much more likely candidate for a Living setting, moreso than Greyhawk...in my opinion.
Since all the books(novels and game supplements) are considered canon, it would seem easier to maintain a standard.

In contrast, Greyhawk contains less overwhelming detail (thank god) than the Realms, which leaves several holes to be filled by the RPGA. That would not have been an issue with the Realms, but anyhow...

What are your thoughts on this?

I doubt such a change would ever occur, but here's to idle pondering anyway.
#2
Argon
Jul 12, 2003 14:16:36 Well, their is a Living FR game it's just set in Ravens Bluff (The Living City). Any how I don't know if FR as a whole would of made a better Living game than GH but it definately has many more resources to pull from. But I like to think of it this way. If FR had become the Living Game than what would be left of Greyhawk.
After all some of the regional sites are very well done and even they do not have the level of placid detail the Realms have ( not that I mind detail but FR has more crap than quality material).
In the end we can create alot on our own and if Greyhawk is revived from it's sealed vault I only hope that quality products are produced for it. I don't need filler products like WOTC has for the Forgotten Realms.
#3
zombiegleemax
Jul 12, 2003 15:10:14
Originally posted by Argon
I don't need filler products like WOTC has for the Forgotten Realms.

Don't get me wrong, I don't want that at all either. As I've stated in other posts, I'd hate for GH to become as detailed as FR.
#4
zombiegleemax
Jul 14, 2003 4:26:38 Too muck detail can be worst than too little detail in a settleing.
#5
zombiegleemax
Jul 14, 2003 5:11:40 Its all a matter of preference, but how does too much market detail ruin your own personal home game since ultimately, its you who chooses what background material to use, what to scrap, and what is just too cool to pass up using? If (though its so unlikely as to barely even be worth thinking at all) WOTC all the sudden produced the 'Complete 101 Volume Encyclopedia of Almost Everything You Ever Wanted To Know About Greyhawk', would that ruin your existing campaign? It may tarnish your opinion of published products, but the setting itself is in the hands of those who play it. I know more groups who game in radically altered versions of WOTC's (and TSR's older) settings than in the base settings.

Sorry, just getting irritated at the rather lame jibs at FR that are constantly cropping up in the GH forums. You want to gripe about FR, take it to their forums. You want to gripe about GH, then this is the place for it (and no, I'm not flaming or badmouthing anyone since, I personally don't care for FR as a whole though there are still some good juicy morsels to be found if you dig enough). Producing an abundance of quality work that developes and fleshes out a particular setting only means that now you have more accessible resources for when the unexpected crops up in your game.

If your capable of making up stuff on your own, fine. Not everyone is as skilled at that. Teleports and such are a DM's worst nightmare. I was glad that I had access to detailed 'Fluffy' settings when my PCs decided to throw their own curve balls with carefully manipulated visits to the local libraries to learn about 'foreign lands' and then decide in between adventures to 'pop on over for a visit'. Barsaive from Earthdawn (a very detailed setting) and some of the MERP books (Far Harad and other areas not covered by the Tokein Trilogy, all of which were very, very detailed) saved my butt from agonizing over such things as winging it with consitency. Detailing a setting merely presents you with more options that you can easily ignore if you so choose. It doesn't ruin a setting. Ruining a setting is entirely in your hands at your own gaming table.

Back to the topic at hand however, I think that with GH being far less developed, it made for a far more likely canditate for the RPGA. It wasn't discontinued or not supported in favor of FR for any other reason than its not as profitable. Argue it all you want, but its the truth. With a setting that WOTC was producing products for, the RPGA would have had to jump through hoops to keep up with new products, releases, alterations from novel lines, and keeping their own timeline up to date. With the semi-inactive status of GH, the RPGA (which is slightly more limited in its nature due to cumbersome factors of communication and organization) had a viable amount of freedom with letting things run in their own pacing. That just isn't possible with an active product line like FR. Within only a few months, the 'Living Realms' and the Forgotten Realms product line would have begun to diverge. Within a few years (as in now), the divergence would have been too much to be feasible.

Sorry, but please stop taking frustrations out on FR (its already bad enough without them, but that's just my opinion). Cheap shots at FR aren't going to bring GH out of its semi active status. LAstly, if you don't want GH developed or detailed, you really have already gotten your wish. One book. Minimum detail. The rest is for you to develope on your own ;). Personally, I like detail. I use what fluff I want, and eat the rest of the fluffy cotton candy bits for snacks while gaming.
#6
zombiegleemax
Jul 14, 2003 11:04:02
Originally posted by Mach2.5
Sorry, just getting irritated at the rather lame jibs at FR that are constantly cropping up in the GH forums. You want to gripe about FR, take it to their forums.

Sorry, but please stop taking frustrations out on FR (its already bad enough without them, but that's just my opinion). Cheap shots at FR aren't going to bring GH out of its semi active status. LAstly, if you don't want GH developed or detailed, you really have already gotten your wish. One book. Minimum detail. The rest is for you to develope on your own ;). Personally, I like detail. I use what fluff I want, and eat the rest of the fluffy cotton candy bits for snacks while gaming.

Sorry if that is how the point of my post came across.
It wasn't meant as a shot at FR, or as a means to bring GH out of its "semi-active status". With that in mind, I'm not looking for anyone to really detail the setting more, but if they did, I doubt it would effect my game that much.
It was merely an idle musing and an opinion.

I don't hate FR. I've posted on this board and the FR board regarding my opinions of the setting.

Heh, there was an interesting post on the FR board the other day. Someone was complaining about how GH has gotten all the attention since the new edition came out...
#7
zombiegleemax
Jul 14, 2003 12:19:14
Heh, there was an interesting post on the FR board the other day. Someone was complaining about how GH has gotten all the attention since the new edition came out...

Thats a riot! See, everyone is united in their feelings of neglect ;)

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
#1 zombiegleemax Jul 12, 2003 11:02:15	Last night as I drifted off to sleep, this thought crossed my mind. The thoroughly detailed and canonized nature of the Forgotten Realms makes it a much more likely candidate for a Living setting, moreso than Greyhawk...in my opinion. Since all the books(novels and game supplements) are considered canon, it would seem easier to maintain a standard. In contrast, Greyhawk contains less overwhelming detail (thank god) than the Realms, which leaves several holes to be filled by the RPGA. That would not have been an issue with the Realms, but anyhow... What are your thoughts on this? I doubt such a change would ever occur, but here's to idle pondering anyway.
#2 Argon Jul 12, 2003 14:16:36	Well, their is a Living FR game it's just set in Ravens Bluff (The Living City). Any how I don't know if FR as a whole would of made a better Living game than GH but it definately has many more resources to pull from. But I like to think of it this way. If FR had become the Living Game than what would be left of Greyhawk. After all some of the regional sites are very well done and even they do not have the level of placid detail the Realms have ( not that I mind detail but FR has more crap than quality material). In the end we can create alot on our own and if Greyhawk is revived from it's sealed vault I only hope that quality products are produced for it. I don't need filler products like WOTC has for the Forgotten Realms.
#3 zombiegleemax Jul 12, 2003 15:10:14	Originally posted by Argon I don't need filler products like WOTC has for the Forgotten Realms. Don't get me wrong, I don't want that at all either. As I've stated in other posts, I'd hate for GH to become as detailed as FR.
#4 zombiegleemax Jul 14, 2003 4:26:38	Too muck detail can be worst than too little detail in a settleing.
#5 zombiegleemax Jul 14, 2003 5:11:40	Its all a matter of preference, but how does too much market detail ruin your own personal home game since ultimately, its you who chooses what background material to use, what to scrap, and what is just too cool to pass up using? If (though its so unlikely as to barely even be worth thinking at all) WOTC all the sudden produced the 'Complete 101 Volume Encyclopedia of Almost Everything You Ever Wanted To Know About Greyhawk', would that ruin your existing campaign? It may tarnish your opinion of published products, but the setting itself is in the hands of those who play it. I know more groups who game in radically altered versions of WOTC's (and TSR's older) settings than in the base settings. Sorry, just getting irritated at the rather lame jibs at FR that are constantly cropping up in the GH forums. You want to gripe about FR, take it to their forums. You want to gripe about GH, then this is the place for it (and no, I'm not flaming or badmouthing anyone since, I personally don't care for FR as a whole though there are still some good juicy morsels to be found if you dig enough). Producing an abundance of quality work that developes and fleshes out a particular setting only means that now you have more accessible resources for when the unexpected crops up in your game. If your capable of making up stuff on your own, fine. Not everyone is as skilled at that. Teleports and such are a DM's worst nightmare. I was glad that I had access to detailed 'Fluffy' settings when my PCs decided to throw their own curve balls with carefully manipulated visits to the local libraries to learn about 'foreign lands' and then decide in between adventures to 'pop on over for a visit'. Barsaive from Earthdawn (a very detailed setting) and some of the MERP books (Far Harad and other areas not covered by the Tokein Trilogy, all of which were very, very detailed) saved my butt from agonizing over such things as winging it with consitency. Detailing a setting merely presents you with more options that you can easily ignore if you so choose. It doesn't ruin a setting. Ruining a setting is entirely in your hands at your own gaming table. Back to the topic at hand however, I think that with GH being far less developed, it made for a far more likely canditate for the RPGA. It wasn't discontinued or not supported in favor of FR for any other reason than its not as profitable. Argue it all you want, but its the truth. With a setting that WOTC was producing products for, the RPGA would have had to jump through hoops to keep up with new products, releases, alterations from novel lines, and keeping their own timeline up to date. With the semi-inactive status of GH, the RPGA (which is slightly more limited in its nature due to cumbersome factors of communication and organization) had a viable amount of freedom with letting things run in their own pacing. That just isn't possible with an active product line like FR. Within only a few months, the 'Living Realms' and the Forgotten Realms product line would have begun to diverge. Within a few years (as in now), the divergence would have been too much to be feasible. Sorry, but please stop taking frustrations out on FR (its already bad enough without them, but that's just my opinion). Cheap shots at FR aren't going to bring GH out of its semi active status. LAstly, if you don't want GH developed or detailed, you really have already gotten your wish. One book. Minimum detail. The rest is for you to develope on your own ;). Personally, I like detail. I use what fluff I want, and eat the rest of the fluffy cotton candy bits for snacks while gaming.
#6 zombiegleemax Jul 14, 2003 11:04:02	Originally posted by Mach2.5 Sorry, just getting irritated at the rather lame jibs at FR that are constantly cropping up in the GH forums. You want to gripe about FR, take it to their forums. Sorry, but please stop taking frustrations out on FR (its already bad enough without them, but that's just my opinion). Cheap shots at FR aren't going to bring GH out of its semi active status. LAstly, if you don't want GH developed or detailed, you really have already gotten your wish. One book. Minimum detail. The rest is for you to develope on your own ;). Personally, I like detail. I use what fluff I want, and eat the rest of the fluffy cotton candy bits for snacks while gaming. Sorry if that is how the point of my post came across. It wasn't meant as a shot at FR, or as a means to bring GH out of its "semi-active status". With that in mind, I'm not looking for anyone to really detail the setting more, but if they did, I doubt it would effect my game that much. It was merely an idle musing and an opinion. I don't hate FR. I've posted on this board and the FR board regarding my opinions of the setting. Heh, there was an interesting post on the FR board the other day. Someone was complaining about how GH has gotten all the attention since the new edition came out...
#7 zombiegleemax Jul 14, 2003 12:19:14	Heh, there was an interesting post on the FR board the other day. Someone was complaining about how GH has gotten all the attention since the new edition came out... Thats a riot! See, everyone is united in their feelings of neglect ;)