PS3E - Ch. 4: Entropic Blow - Downloaded from the Wizards Community, all coding removed by Solauren

PS3E - Ch. 4: Entropic Blow

Post/Author/DateTime Post
#1
zombiegleemax
Jul 29, 2003 11:05:11 I hope I'm not seeming nit-picky or anything, but after reading through the Fourth Chapter that has been released by the wonderful Planescape 3e Team (and a great job you have done), I have come to an issue that I think either I need clarifying on, or else I believe this to maybe be a little inaccurate.

The issue I have is with the feat Entropic Blow, a Doomguard feat, I will post the content of this feat, just so people don't have to dig through their copies of this chapter to look at it:

from www.planewalker.com:
Entropic Blow [General, Fighter]
Most Sinkers sooner or later learn how to bring entropy to their enemy with a single blow, making Doomguard members some of the most feared warriors in the multiverse.
Faction: Doomguard.
Prerequisites: Power Attack, base attack bonus +4 or higher, Str 15+.
Benefit: Once per day you can declare a single melee attack of yours to be an entropic blow. If the attack hits, the entropic blow inflicts 1d4 temporary Constitution damage in addition to normal damage. Against inanimate objects or creatures with no Constitution score, the entropic blow simply inflicts 1d4 force damage in addition to the normal damage of such an attack.
Special: You can gain this feat multiple times. Each time you take this feat, you gain an additional entropic blow a day.

Now, what I personally find a little odd is the relatively high STR prequisit for the feat, & possibly the fact that one must be a fighter to perform this action.

My understanding is that the doomguard, although a majority are fighters, not neccessarily all are fighters. The idea of entropy, is obviously that everything decays, & this feat is one that is basing off of this idea that absolutely everything decays into a more focused idea - forcing that decay to happen instantly through a well-placed attack. Now, why I have issues with this feat, is because not all of the doomguard are going to be fighters. Although you may have a majority of fighters, you are going to have people of all classes & walks of life coming together on this fatalistic philosophy, many of which would be adventurers, & many would be looking to force this philosophy into instant practice.

I understand the need to make the attack, but not neccessarily why strength would be the stat that determins the ability to hit a person where they are going to suffer from a good loss of constitution. Basing it off of STR, it seems to me that this feat is implying if you've learned this philosophy, & you just hit someone hard enough, you are going to force the concept of ultimate decay onto a person in a physical manner.

I personally believe that this is more of a well-placed attack, than a hard-hitting one. An attack that hits a person in a particular location in a manner that really tears them up, making a wound that is particually difficult to cure or to repair, & causing a good portion of physical fatigue, such as understanding where to hit a person in an organ or sensative part that will really wound them.

Unless the feat is truly one that is determined by "how hard" you hit an opponent, & coming from somewhat magical qualities due to the philosophy, I think that the required stat to this feat would be more of an intelligence - understanding your enemy, & understanding how to cause them to degrade physically through a well-placed attack.

Anyway, I'm sorry for rambling. This is just my personal stance on this feat, & how I think it works. If it works in another manner, or I am just plain being stupid, please tell me - thank you!

Once again - great job on the 3e Releases thus far!
#2
Shemeska_the_Marauder
Jul 29, 2003 12:53:11 The way I understood it was that you don't need to be a fighter to get the feat, it's both a general and fighter feat. Which means anyone can pick it up if they meet the requirements, but also that it can be picked up as a fighter bonus feat. Much like power attack is both a general feat and a fighter feat (on the list of bonus feats available to fighters).
#3
christuschristus
Jul 29, 2003 12:55:26 You don't need to be a fighter to take the feat. The fighter designation up top means that a fighter can take it as a bonus feat.

I don't see it as a big deal that a fighter-type is going to be the sort to take this feat. We've tried to expand the abilities of the factions to make them useful for a variety of classes. While factions still have some "signature" abilities, not everything is going to be open to everyone. We've used the same logic for the PrCs.

Beyond that, hopefully Julian (the Doomguard writer) pokes his head in to address specifics.
#4
zombiegleemax
Jul 29, 2003 13:29:14
Originally posted by Shemeska the Marauder
The way I understood it was that you don't need to be a fighter to get the feat, it's both a general and fighter feat. Which means anyone can pick it up if they meet the requirements, but also that it can be picked up as a fighter bonus feat. Much like power attack is both a general feat and a fighter feat (on the list of bonus feats available to fighters).

D'oh! You are absolutely correct. For some reason, that "General", which was there & bolded, was completely oblivious to me. I'm sorry, nevermind that aspect of the issue.

I suppose my only question to the issue would be the STR prereq. Like I said, maybe it's just my misunderstanding or reading-into of the concept, but I think it would be an INT prereq for an issue of placing a well-put blow into a spot that would make the opponent suffer con damage, or maybe a WIS prereq, as you have to be "attuned" to the understanding of the universal concept of decay so much before you can perform the action.

Thanks for the replies!
#5
alien_rope_burn
Jul 29, 2003 19:51:18
Originally posted by Orias
D'oh! You are absolutely correct. For some reason, that "General", which was there & bolded, was completely oblivious to me. I'm sorry, nevermind that aspect of the issue.

I suppose my only question to the issue would be the STR prereq. Like I said, maybe it's just my misunderstanding or reading-into of the concept, but I think it would be an INT prereq for an issue of placing a well-put blow into a spot that would make the opponent suffer con damage, or maybe a WIS prereq, as you have to be "attuned" to the understanding of the universal concept of decay so much before you can perform the action.

Thanks for the replies!

Being the author of said feat...

I have no idea where the Str prereq came from. It's not on my version of the feat. It must have been added somewhere when I wasn't paying attention.

Granted, Power Attack means you have to have Str 13+, but... beats me. I don't get why it's there either.
#6
zombiegleemax
Jul 30, 2003 0:35:55 So is the only prereq BAB +4?
#7
catland93
Jul 30, 2003 11:46:14 and the improved entropic blow?
#8
alien_rope_burn
Jul 30, 2003 15:19:23
Originally posted by Orias
So is the only prereq BAB +4?

Uh... no.

Essentially, I don't think it should be considered the final version as of yet.

Improved Entropic Blow is in the document itself.
#9
zombiegleemax
Jul 30, 2003 23:27:18 Ah, ok. Well, thanks for your work on the release of that chapter, & any other work you have done. I put my input above, thinking that the feat may be related to the INT or WIS stat, but that's just how I am interpreting the ability.

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
#1 zombiegleemax Jul 29, 2003 11:05:11	I hope I'm not seeming nit-picky or anything, but after reading through the Fourth Chapter that has been released by the wonderful Planescape 3e Team (and a great job you have done), I have come to an issue that I think either I need clarifying on, or else I believe this to maybe be a little inaccurate. The issue I have is with the feat Entropic Blow, a Doomguard feat, I will post the content of this feat, just so people don't have to dig through their copies of this chapter to look at it: from www.planewalker.com: Entropic Blow [General, Fighter] Most Sinkers sooner or later learn how to bring entropy to their enemy with a single blow, making Doomguard members some of the most feared warriors in the multiverse. Faction: Doomguard. Prerequisites: Power Attack, base attack bonus +4 or higher, Str 15+. Benefit: Once per day you can declare a single melee attack of yours to be an entropic blow. If the attack hits, the entropic blow inflicts 1d4 temporary Constitution damage in addition to normal damage. Against inanimate objects or creatures with no Constitution score, the entropic blow simply inflicts 1d4 force damage in addition to the normal damage of such an attack. Special: You can gain this feat multiple times. Each time you take this feat, you gain an additional entropic blow a day. Now, what I personally find a little odd is the relatively high STR prequisit for the feat, & possibly the fact that one must be a fighter to perform this action. My understanding is that the doomguard, although a majority are fighters, not neccessarily all are fighters. The idea of entropy, is obviously that everything decays, & this feat is one that is basing off of this idea that absolutely everything decays into a more focused idea - forcing that decay to happen instantly through a well-placed attack. Now, why I have issues with this feat, is because not all of the doomguard are going to be fighters. Although you may have a majority of fighters, you are going to have people of all classes & walks of life coming together on this fatalistic philosophy, many of which would be adventurers, & many would be looking to force this philosophy into instant practice. I understand the need to make the attack, but not neccessarily why strength would be the stat that determins the ability to hit a person where they are going to suffer from a good loss of constitution. Basing it off of STR, it seems to me that this feat is implying if you've learned this philosophy, & you just hit someone hard enough, you are going to force the concept of ultimate decay onto a person in a physical manner. I personally believe that this is more of a well-placed attack, than a hard-hitting one. An attack that hits a person in a particular location in a manner that really tears them up, making a wound that is particually difficult to cure or to repair, & causing a good portion of physical fatigue, such as understanding where to hit a person in an organ or sensative part that will really wound them. Unless the feat is truly one that is determined by "how hard" you hit an opponent, & coming from somewhat magical qualities due to the philosophy, I think that the required stat to this feat would be more of an intelligence - understanding your enemy, & understanding how to cause them to degrade physically through a well-placed attack. Anyway, I'm sorry for rambling. This is just my personal stance on this feat, & how I think it works. If it works in another manner, or I am just plain being stupid, please tell me - thank you! Once again - great job on the 3e Releases thus far!
#2 Shemeska_the_Marauder Jul 29, 2003 12:53:11	The way I understood it was that you don't need to be a fighter to get the feat, it's both a general and fighter feat. Which means anyone can pick it up if they meet the requirements, but also that it can be picked up as a fighter bonus feat. Much like power attack is both a general feat and a fighter feat (on the list of bonus feats available to fighters).
#3 christuschristus Jul 29, 2003 12:55:26	You don't need to be a fighter to take the feat. The fighter designation up top means that a fighter can take it as a bonus feat. I don't see it as a big deal that a fighter-type is going to be the sort to take this feat. We've tried to expand the abilities of the factions to make them useful for a variety of classes. While factions still have some "signature" abilities, not everything is going to be open to everyone. We've used the same logic for the PrCs. Beyond that, hopefully Julian (the Doomguard writer) pokes his head in to address specifics.
#4 zombiegleemax Jul 29, 2003 13:29:14	Originally posted by Shemeska the Marauder The way I understood it was that you don't need to be a fighter to get the feat, it's both a general and fighter feat. Which means anyone can pick it up if they meet the requirements, but also that it can be picked up as a fighter bonus feat. Much like power attack is both a general feat and a fighter feat (on the list of bonus feats available to fighters). D'oh! You are absolutely correct. For some reason, that "General", which was there & bolded, was completely oblivious to me. I'm sorry, nevermind that aspect of the issue. I suppose my only question to the issue would be the STR prereq. Like I said, maybe it's just my misunderstanding or reading-into of the concept, but I think it would be an INT prereq for an issue of placing a well-put blow into a spot that would make the opponent suffer con damage, or maybe a WIS prereq, as you have to be "attuned" to the understanding of the universal concept of decay so much before you can perform the action. Thanks for the replies!
#5 alien_rope_burn Jul 29, 2003 19:51:18	Originally posted by Orias D'oh! You are absolutely correct. For some reason, that "General", which was there & bolded, was completely oblivious to me. I'm sorry, nevermind that aspect of the issue. I suppose my only question to the issue would be the STR prereq. Like I said, maybe it's just my misunderstanding or reading-into of the concept, but I think it would be an INT prereq for an issue of placing a well-put blow into a spot that would make the opponent suffer con damage, or maybe a WIS prereq, as you have to be "attuned" to the understanding of the universal concept of decay so much before you can perform the action. Thanks for the replies! Being the author of said feat... I have no idea where the Str prereq came from. It's not on my version of the feat. It must have been added somewhere when I wasn't paying attention. Granted, Power Attack means you have to have Str 13+, but... beats me. I don't get why it's there either.
#6 zombiegleemax Jul 30, 2003 0:35:55	So is the only prereq BAB +4?
#7 catland93 Jul 30, 2003 11:46:14	and the improved entropic blow?
#8 alien_rope_burn Jul 30, 2003 15:19:23	Originally posted by Orias So is the only prereq BAB +4? Uh... no. Essentially, I don't think it should be considered the final version as of yet. Improved Entropic Blow is in the document itself.
#9 zombiegleemax Jul 30, 2003 23:27:18	Ah, ok. Well, thanks for your work on the release of that chapter, & any other work you have done. I put my input above, thinking that the feat may be related to the INT or WIS stat, but that's just how I am interpreting the ability.