Like the Entropic blow post I made, I sometimes percieve things in D&D maybe a little weird, or my understanding leaves me to see things in a different way. There are some issues in PS3E that I feel this way on, beyond entropic blow.
I don't want to seem whining, or like I am making attacks on the great work done here, & I certainly hope that I am not being a bother. I am just trying to provide some constructive criticism, & hope that I'm not just annoying. If I am just being a bother, please tell me, otherwise I am just going to post my opinions on the work of PS3E.
Most of what I am taking about is going to be on the feats, & I will post the content of each feat before hand, just to make it clear that we are on the same page.
Annihilating Spell [Metamagic]
Your magic uses Sinker knowledge of pure annihilation to enhance its destructive power, causing fault lines of disintegration to accompany the normal devastation of a given spell.
Faction: Doomguard.
Benefit: This feat is applied to a single spell available to you at the time the feat is taken that deals damage to a single target. When you cast that spell, and if that spell deals damage, it deals 1 temporary Constitution damage per level of the spell. A successful Fort save (DC of the spell) halves the Constitution damage. Against inanimate objects or objects with no Constitution score, the Constitution damage is simply added as force damage.
Special: You can gain this feat multiple times. Each time you take this feat, it applies to a new spell.
This is a very cool feat, a good take on the entropic actions of the Doomguard faction, & applied to magic, which is really awesome. However, I think that this feat may be slightly overpowered. The fact is that there are a slight few spells that essentially deal temporary constitution damage (depending on what source you are dealing with), so this kind of allows the person to fling two spells at once. Although it is cool, the fact that there are no prereqs on this, & that the feat is applied to one spell & acts upond that spell permanently ends up making it something that someone would end up using repeatedly. Think about the sorc doomguard who ends up dealing constant CON damage with all of his fireballs.
Granted, the later you get on in levels, the more & more resistance someone is going to have against attacks that require a FORT save, but that you essentially get it with all spells of one type, you can assume that if you are in a fight & casting a couple spells, that they are going to end up failing a few of those rolls, making this a feat that I see almost absolutely no arcane caster wanting to go without. Even if the target fails, they still lose some CON, no matter what, which makes me believe that this is an overpowered feat.
I think that this spell should probably either be a normal metamagic feat, one that is applied to any spell that deals damage, but an increase in spell height, I think at least by two would be appropriate, or to at least have the spell that is selected for the feat (as the descriptor says now) be forced to be prepared or cast as a level higher.
Just FYI, the wording on the feat's FORT save also needs to be specified.
You have delved into the darkest and most savage parts of your soul, and learned to bring forth your own inner demon.
Regions: The Abyss, Tiefling.
Prerequisites: Str 15+, Cha 15+, any nonlawful, nongood alignment.
Benefit: Once a day you can give in to the deep part of your psyche and become consumed by a terrible primal force. Your body seems to ripple with power as you are fueled by your hatred, granting you extraordinary strength. Add your Charisma modifier to damage rolls and Strength checks. In addition, anyone damaged by your attacks must make a Will save (DC 10 + Charisma modifier + number of times hit in the round) or flee in terror for 1d6 rounds. The effect lasts 1 round for every two Hit Dice, during which time you are unable to cast spells, activate magic equipment, perform any task that requires patience and concentration, or even attempt to dodge attacks (effectively making you flat-footed and giving you a -5 Dex penalty to AC and Reflex saves). If you are knocked unconscious the effect ends immediately, whereas if you are somehow held or dazed the effect continues indefinitely until you are able to act again. You cannot end the effect voluntarily.
Again, very cool feat, but I personally do not see why the prereq requires a 15 STR. It may be just how I am looking at the feat, but I think the feat entirely depends on your perception & actualization of your heritage/culture, & how you percieve yourself & how you are able to express your rage.
I think the WILL save should not include the number of times hit in a round, just as that adds a little bit of speculation. It says to make a WILL save everytime the person with Aspect of Tanar'ri deals, but does the "hit" include the number of times that the target was hit by anyone, or just the person with the feat?
Truly exemplifying a disdain for life, a few dustmen seem to appreciate (as much as they appreciate anything) making victims bring about their own death prematurely.
Faction: Dustmen.
Prerequisites: Death Focus, Spell Focus (Enchantment), Spell Focus (Necromancy), spell caster level 12th+.
Benefit: You may command an individual you have placed under a compulsion effect to perform a self-destructive action. The subject gets another Will save to resist the command at the same DC of the effect. If the target fails the second save, the action is carried out, regardless of its self-destructive nature. Each time the target fails to kill them self somehow, such as surviving an incredibly high fall, they gain an additional save if the duration of the effect has not expired.
Normal: A creature under most compulsion effects will not carry out an obviously self-destructive command.
I don't really understand why one of the prereqs happens to be Necromancy. I can understand enchantment, because you are implementing a strong control over a compulsion effect than not, but in all actuallity, I don't see why a better understanding of death magic has to do with an understanding of trying to control someone in a way which you may convince them to take their lives. If this were a sort of manner by which you are able to supernaturally convince the person of giving up their life-force, then I could see Necromancy, but if you are just asking them to slit their wrists, jump off a bridge, whatever, I see no reason for a person to have a better need of life/death magic.
You know enough about the factions that you can find logical holes in their beliefs that will shake the faith of all but the wisest members.
Faction: Free League.
Prerequisites: Insult Factioneers, Surprise Factioneers, 12 ranks in Knowledge (factions and guilds), Wis 17+, Cha 17+.
Benefit: As a full-round action, you can make a Knowledge (factions and guilds) check (DC 25) to come up with a apparent flaw in the philosophy behind one faction. Shouting the remark allows you to “disenchant” one target member of that faction from their beliefs for a short period. The effect lasts a number of rounds equal to 20 - the target’s Wisdom score, during which time they cannot use any faction-granted spell-like or supernatural abilities. The target may make a Will save (DC 10 + ½ ranks in Knowledge (factions and guilds) + Wisdom modifier) to resist the effect. You may use this ability once an hour, and only on the same target once a day.
This is an especially cool feat, although I don't understand the high WIS requirement, I think finding "loop holes" in faction's beliefs would actually be an INT matter, & not a WIS. That, & the requirement of two 17s for a 9th level character (the first level that you can take this feat) for an ability that you can only use on one person for a couple of rounds is kind of asking a lot of player's stats. I personally would change this feat to being able to be done once or a few times a day & lowering the stat prereqs a little bit.
No, really, I think we're happy that someone's paying attention and taking time to comment. And you should see us in a "room" together, taking all this stuff apart.
Since none of these are mine, I'll leave clarification/counterargument to others for now.
Everything has a weak point – not that most bashers outside of the Doomguard have figured that out yet. Many Sinkers realize this, though, and figure out how to hit even amorphous creatures effectively.
Faction: Doomguard.
Prerequisites: Power Attack, base attack bonus +5 or higher, Wis 13+.
Benefit: Choose one creature type that is normally not subject to critical hits (such as constructs, oozes, plants, or undead). You may now inflict critical hits on these types of creatures with your attacks normally. This does not enable sneak attacks, favored enemy bonuses, or other abilities that do not affect creatures not subject to critical hits.
Special: You can gain this feat multiple times. Each time you take this feat, it applies to another type of creature.
This is an amazingly cool feat, but I question why one would need power attack for this. Power Attack is essentially a fighter swinger in a more wild manner to cause more damage, but having a higher miss chance. This seems like a feat that, again, is about the understanding of how to force & speed decay on things, & I think has nothing to do with Power Attack. If anything, I think improved critical would be more appropriate, or no prereq feat at all.
Annihilating Spell [Metamagic]
... Benefit: This feat is applied to a single spell available to you at the time the feat is taken that deals damage to a single target....
As I understand it... That means that the spell must be a spell that deals damage to ONLY ONE target, such as "Melf's Acid arrow" but not "Fireball" or "Magic Missile" which can potentially affect multiple targets.... am I right? That's an important limiting factor....
Aspect of the Tanar’ri [General]
... during which time you are unable to cast spells, activate magic equipment, perform any task that requires patience and concentration, or even attempt to dodge attacks (effectively making you flat-footed and giving you a -5 Dex penalty to AC and Reflex saves)....
Mmmm... I think the mechanics are a bit flawed here. You only can be flatfooted at the start of combat. Flafooted means that you've not acted yet in the first round of combat. You cannot be flatfooted if you already acted. It'd be easier to understand if that section were reworded as " You lose your DEX bonus to AC". Furthermore, characters with uncanny dodge would retain their DEX bonus to AC when "flatfooted" which, obviusly, is not the intention of the feat.
Don't you think that a -5 penalty is a bit exaggerate? It's the penalty for inanimated objects, and HELPLESS characters.... And furthermore.... Some powergamers can perfectly say:
"Mmmm... your raging tiefling doesn't attempt to dodge any attack... Ha ha! Your opponent coup de graces you!....."
"WTF? No! you cannot do that!"....
"Why not? you won't even try to dodge the attack... and by the way... which was your AC & REF save penalty?"
" huh... -5 ... "
"What a coincidence! Like if you had DEX ZERO, and if you have DEX ZERO... you are helpless! And you can be coup de grace'd!!!"
"NOOOOOO!!!!!"
I suppose you got the idea...
Originally posted by Orias
Oh yeah, I suppose you couldn't put Annihilating Magic on Fireball, but I still think it's a little bit overpowered
Annihilating Spell should have an level slot "cost", as any metamagic feat does. As it is, you could stick it onto polar ray and do 8 Con damage in addition to the normal effect.
Come to think of it, I'd make it so that the Con damage replaces the normal effect of the spell. That way the slot cost could be left at +0... Just brainstorming here, haven't thought this out.
BTW, I don't think this forum is the best place for discussing PS3E... why not try at the bone-box rattler, or that newsletter that was going around?
I completely agree that Knowledge (Local) for Greyhawk is totally different than Knowledge (Local) for Waterdeep, so why not continue that same logic to Knowledge (Local) for Sigil? The Knowledge (Local) applies to legends, personalities, inhabitants, laws, customs, traditions, and humanoids. Since factions and guilds would be the driving force behind the politics of Sigil, this seems no different to me than a Knowledge (Local) check for a Prime city where the driving politcal forces are the local thieves' guild, a cabal of wizards, the church, merchants guild, the productive dwarf community, etc.
If there needs to be a difference, I would sincerely like to know why. Thanks!
Forensics [General]
You can learn details from the remains of a creature or construct, gaining an impression how it was killed or destroyed.
Faction: Doomguard, Sons of Mercy, Harmonium.
Prerequisite: Wis 13+.
Benefit: You gain a +2 bonus on all Search checks and Spot checks.
In theory, I guess anyone could learn this feat, but to keep with the flavor of the setting, I think that the Doomguard, who like watching and at times promoting entropy, would simply have so much exposure to these types of incidents would simply be a natural.
The idea behind adding the Sons of Mercy and Harmonium was to view this as a matter of criminal investigation. They could create formal schools of training where investigators could go to the scene of a crime and collect evidence as a way of enforcing law by finding criminals.
Below I have outlined some ways to further open a can of worms with regards to investigations.
Synergy: If you have 5 or more ranks in Knoledge (Arcana), you get a +2 bonus when investigating the detruction of constructs.
If you have 5 or more ranks in Knowledge (Architecture and engineering), you get a +2 bonus when investigating the destruction of buildings, aqueducts, bridges, and fortifications.
If you have 5 or more ranks in Knowledge (Dungeoneering), you get a +2 bonus when investigating the death of abberations and oozes or the destrcution of caverns and tunnels.
If you have 5 or more ranks in Knowledge (Local), you get a +2 bonus when investigating the death of humans and humanoids (including races like elves, dwarves, etc.).
If you have 5 or more ranks in Knowledge (Nature), you get a +2 bonus when investigating the death of animals, fey, giants, monstrous humanoids, plants, and vermin.
If you have 5 or more ranks in Knowledge (Planes), you get a +2 bonus when investigating the death of elementals and exemplars.
If you have 5 or more ranks in Knowledge (Religion), you get a +2 bonus when investigating the destruction of undead.
Entropic Smite [General, Fighter]
Most Sinkers know how to bring entropy to their enemy with a single blow, making the Doomguard some of the most feared warriors in the multiverse.
Faction: Doomguard.
Prerequisite: Str 13+, Power Attack, Improved Sunder, base attack bonus +4 or higher.
Benefit: You gain the smite power, the supernatural ability to make a single melee attack with a +4 bonus on attack rollsand a bonus on damage rolls equal to your effective character level (ECL) (if you hit). You must declare the smite before making the attack. This attack is effective against creatures normally immune to critical hits as it calls upon the force of entropy, not fining a vulnerable point in the creature's anatomy. This ability is useable once per day.
Special: This does not stack with the smite ability offerred as a class feature or as part of a granted power (such as clerics with the Destruction domain).
This would also permit a character to gain the Extra Smiting feat showcased in the Defenders of the Faith splat book. I wanted to include the Improved Sunder feat as a sort of justification for why it would be effective against constructs. This prerequisite, as well as the faction requirement and the inability to stack with the smite ability of certain classes could justify why the attack would be effective against creatures immune to critical hits. Additionally, the smite ability may offer an alternative to the temporary Constitution damage and spur some other ideas.
Annihilation Spell [Metamagic]
Your magic uses Sinker knowledge of pure annihilation to enhance its destructive power, causing fault lines of disintegration to accompany the normal devastation of a given spell.
Faction: Doomguard.
Prerequisite: Two other metamagic feats.
Benefit: This may only be used with a spell that deals damage to a single target. If that spell successfully deals damage, the target also suffers an enhancement penalty to Constitution equal to the level of the spell. A successful Fort save (DC 10 + spell level + ability modifier) halves the Constitution damage. If the target’s Constitution is reduced to 0, the target is reduced to dust as the disintegration spell. Against inanimate objects or objects with no Constitution score, the Constitution damage is simply added as force damage. An annihilation spell uses up a spell slot 2 levels higher than the spell’s actual level.
The important note being the enhancement penalty, basically meaning the spell cannot be used to deal continuous damage. I'm not sure how to deal with the healing of said damage at the moment. Note that this is completely different from the original in that it doesn't require being applied to a single spell when the feat is taken.
That being said, I'll now read the other topics
.Originally posted by Orias
Aspect of the Tanar’ri [General]
You have delved into the darkest and most savage parts of your soul, and learned to bring forth your own inner demon.
Again, very cool feat, but I personally do not see why the prereq requires a 15 STR. It may be just how I am looking at the feat, but I think the feat entirely depends on your perception & actualization of your heritage/culture, & how you percieve yourself & how you are able to express your rage.
I think the WILL save should not include the number of times hit in a round, just as that adds a little bit of speculation. It says to make a WILL save everytime the person with Aspect of Tanar'ri deals, but does the "hit" include the number of times that the target was hit by anyone, or just the person with the feat?
I rationaled that the feat would require strength because it not only draws on personal might, but on physical power. The tanar'ri are in my mind at least somewhat teared to sheer might, and Strength will always be the attribute most heavily associated with it.
The Will save can be clarified to define "hit" as the number of times struck by the character using Aspect of the Tanar'ri.
As for the matter of being flat-footed, the start of the round is NOT the only time when you can be caught flat-footed. Rogues, for instance, have feats that can cause opponents to become flat-footed (ie Quicker Than the Eye). Now, flat-footed means that the person is basically no longer dodging attacks (as D&D assumes characters always are). This is the idea of the feat. Not only that, but the character is basically walking forward without thought for their own body or for the blows that are being made on them, effectively meaning they are an easy target for anyone who dares approach them. That is why they are given the penalties of a helpless target. Perhaps it would be simplest say to say they're DEX is reduced to 0 for purposes of dodging attacks and abilities.
Originally posted by Orias
Deathwish [General]
Truly exemplifying a disdain for life, a few dustmen seem to appreciate (as much as they appreciate anything) making victims bring about their own death prematurely.
I don't really understand why one of the prereqs happens to be Necromancy. I can understand enchantment, because you are implementing a strong control over a compulsion effect than not, but in all actuallity, I don't see why a better understanding of death magic has to do with an understanding of trying to control someone in a way which you may convince them to take their lives. If this were a sort of manner by which you are able to supernaturally convince the person of giving up their life-force, then I could see Necromancy, but if you are just asking them to slit their wrists, jump off a bridge, whatever, I see no reason for a person to have a better need of life/death magic.
I view this ability as directly tampering with the target's force of life. You are not merely ordering their body to do something, you are altering their very life essense to turn on itself and commit suicide. This manipulation of a character's life force stems from the school of Necromancy. In fact, I may say creatures protected from Death effects are immune to this as well... In any case, I do believe this is, as you said, convincing the person of giving up their life force. Thats what suicide is ;). One also must consider that compulsion effects are not always direct, for instance suggestion is a compulsion effect yet the target undertakes the actions without the direct control of the caster. Use of this ability with that spell would entail removing the eternal will to live from the person, and not the caster's control of the target's body.
In the end, it really is all about how you envision the ability.
Originally posted by Orias
Disenchant Factioneers [General]
You know enough about the factions that you can find logical holes in their beliefs that will shake the faith of all but the wisest members.
This is an especially cool feat, although I don't understand the high WIS requirement, I think finding "loop holes" in faction's beliefs would actually be an INT matter, & not a WIS. That, & the requirement of two 17s for a 9th level character (the first level that you can take this feat) for an ability that you can only use on one person for a couple of rounds is kind of asking a lot of player's stats. I personally would change this feat to being able to be done once or a few times a day & lowering the stat prereqs a little bit.
The difference between intelligence and wisdom is always a gray area. Intelligence represents an individual's capacity to learn new facts, and make something new of them. It is the realm of formal logic. Wisdom, is the realm of abstract principles and perceptions. The experience one gains from an encounter and true meaning of an event. To support this I merely have to point out that divine spellcasters, those who deal with the abstract and moral/ethical, use Wisdom. For the same reason this ability, which relies on delving into the philosophy behind the faction, requires the Wisdom to see a fault in abstraction. Get me?
As for the stat requirements themselves, I believe it should require a large amount of Wisdom and Charisma to not only find a GOOD flaw in someone's belief in such a short time frame, but also convince them of it for a time. However, I may consider having it work on multiple targets as the other abilities. Thoughts?
Originally posted by Kalidor187
I would like to offer up a question about one of the skills. The Knowledge (Factions and Guilds) seems a little strange to me. After reading through the 3.5 books, I don't see why this couldn't simply be Knowledge (Sigil Local). The FRCS uses a similar approach when detailing their iconic characters and I think it could just as easily work here. The Knowledge (Sigil Local) could work exactly like the Knowledge (Local), allowing a +2 bonus on Gather Information checks thanks to Synergy.
I completely agree that Knowledge (Local) for Greyhawk is totally different than Knowledge (Local) for Waterdeep, so why not continue that same logic to Knowledge (Local) for Sigil? The Knowledge (Local) applies to legends, personalities, inhabitants, laws, customs, traditions, and humanoids. Since factions and guilds would be the driving force behind the politics of Sigil, this seems no different to me than a Knowledge (Local) check for a Prime city where the driving politcal forces are the local thieves' guild, a cabal of wizards, the church, merchants guild, the productive dwarf community, etc.
If there needs to be a difference, I would sincerely like to know why. Thanks!
The difference being quite simply that the factions are no longer based in Sigil, and thus have much less direct influence. Their importance is now more connected to the entire multiverse, and the skill reflects that status. In addition, the sheer information about the factions easily rivals the amount of information one can study on a plane or Sigil itself.
And as said, I cannot say how Knowledge(local) works in this regard. I know in 3.0, Knowledge (local) was a very confusing thing because it was never clear how it was to be specialized.
Although many here do not regard everything WotC published regarding Sigil as cannon (such as Die Vecna Die), there has undoubtedly been a serious lack of material that has been deemed official. This is where dynamic cutters like the folks at PS3E come in. I do try to use whatever material I can get my hands on. That having been said, I would refer readers to the DMG 3.5 page 167.
Sigil is controlled by a number of factions, all of which may be politely described as "philosophers with clubs." These factions are categorized along the lines of traditional alignments, and they control different parts of the city and different services therein. The ultimate ruler of Sigil is an enigmatic bing known as the Lady of Pain, a floating female humanoid with bladelike hair. The full etent of the Lady of Pain's abilities is unknown, but it is widely assumed that her power equals or exceeds that of the deities.
I understand that the PS3E material was prepared without access to 3.5 rules. However, now, WotC has published in their material that factions once again run the day-to-day operations of Sigil. Now the Knowledge (Local) for Sigil using the suggestion below and the new Knowledge (Factions and Guilds) that you have proposed imply that one Knowledge is covering much of the same ground as another since factions have in the past and apparently now influence affairs in Sigil.
I respecfully disagree with the statement that information about factions easily rivals the amount of information one can study on a plane or in Sigil itself. It is like saying one infinity is larger than another. Maybe this is just where we differ in our perspective.
Using the example provided for Knowledge (Factions & Guilds) in the release, it shows:
DC Task
10 You know the belief and known agendas of the organization, as well as its symbol.
By way of comparison, a Knowledge (Local) check would reveal much the same information about the Red Wizards of Thay.
I would submit that since the DC is 10, this could also represent common knowledge (d20 roll averages 10.5 with no modifiers for Int).
Just as you would use Knowledge (F&G) to identify leaders of the organization, I would submit that Knowledge (Thayan Local) would be used to identify the current leaders of the Red Wizards.
Now if you're suggesting that the information about factions and guilds goes into much more detail about each faction and planespanning plots, I think this could be handled via Knowledge (Sigil History). My reasoning for this is that factions spring up from their respective philosophies. However, it wasn't until they started competing with each other in Sigil that they really began their planespanning plots.
The next question would be 'why would I suggest two skills when you present one?' Fair enough. I would submit that Knowledge (Sigil Local) includes knowledge of Sigil that is not directly related to factions and guilds. This could include criminal groups, aristocrats, locations of portals, the best place to have a drink, entrance to the wererat warens, etc. It provides knowledge of the relatively current faction picture in addition to the usual tidbits of information normally associated with a typial village and its immediate environs.
Knowledge (Sigil History) on the other hand would cover the background of each faction as you have implied, along with factions that no longer exist. Furthermore, it could also cover various persons who have been mazed and the various theories why each person was mazed, the impact of battles of the Blood War on Sigil, times when both fiends and celestials attempted to seize control of Sigil and the results of each attempt, etc. The more obscure the knowledge being sought, the higher the DC. For those who attempt to use that epic level crap to find out about the origin of the Lady or weaknesses or some such, they'll be mazed soon enough.
As everyone can see from my profile, I am in Kosovo. I'll try to illustrate my point using real world examples.
A Knowledge (Local) check DC 15 would reveal a local politician's role in organized crime, such as blackmailing judges. Another check DC 17-20 might reveal the specific judge that is being blackmailed and why this particular judge is vulnerable.
A Knowledge (History) check DC 15 would reveal the impact of the Battle of Kosovo Polje to the psyche of ethnic Albanians, Serbians, and Ottoman Turks and how this battle caused the people of each group to develop thoughts that evetually led to the creation of political organizations as well as what would become international organized crime and their historic contacts.
I would state that this is the equivalent to my suggestion.
A Knowledge (Political Organizations) check DC 15 would reveal this same politicians role in organized crime, blackmailing judges. However, it would not provide details about the what judges are vulnerable and why they decided to target that one. A check DC 15 would also reveal the same information about the influence of the Battle of Kosovo Polje on the development of political organizations and their respective philosophies. However, This knowledge check would not provide the information about the development of organized crime and thier historic contacts.
I think this describes the PS3E skill.
So, the options are using two skills versus using one skill. You get more options with the two skills, but you use more skill points. As far as that goes, I guess it is simply a matter of personal preference. I just thougt I would present an alternative for consideration.
I..I..I can't believe it says that...
I can only be happy that I am too tired to truly take in the sheer wrongness of them saying Sigil is controlled by the factions.
Suffice it to say, Planescape is a entirely different cosmology than D&D 3.0, and we are NOT following that.
*goes hit head against apartment wall*
Originally posted by moogle001
I view this ability as directly tampering with the target's force of life. You are not merely ordering their body to do something, you are altering their very life essense to turn on itself and commit suicide. This manipulation of a character's life force stems from the school of Necromancy. In fact, I may say creatures protected from Death effects are immune to this as well... In any case, I do believe this is, as you said, convincing the person of giving up their life force. Thats what suicide is ;).
What I meant by what I was saying, is if you caused the person to give up their life force then & there, not through the peripheral of suicide. I mean, as if you were to magically convince them to die, & they just kneeled over & gave up their life. If you are convincing them of jumping off of a building, or slitting their wrists, then I don't think necromancy would be used at all, because that is just a physical commandement, directing the brain to inflict personal harm on itself which may then cause death.
If the latter is the case, you can do that with many spells, it just seems more focused than a suggestion or command due to the philosophy of the Dustmen, but I don't see how the life forces are being tampered with, but just the person's mind & persona.
Another slight problem with this feat is that you are required to be level 12 before you can nab it. At that point, if you are focused in Enchantments, you are probably going to have the ability to replicate this concept through other spells.
Thanks for the replies!
*Where* did WotC state that Sigil is back in the hands of the factions?
("Righto, cutters, looks like we got some work to do!" - Blinko Bobb, Anarchist firebrand to the members of the Spider Egg cell .)
Originally posted by moogle001
First off let me thank you for all your comments. While I strive to make sure all our material is both useful and balanced, I did basically compile all these in 3 days, and thus there are bound to be issues that need addressing
I rationaled that the feat would require strength because it not only draws on personal might, but on physical power. The tanar'ri are in my mind at least somewhat teared to sheer might, and Strength will always be the attribute most heavily associated with it.
The Will save can be clarified to define "hit" as the number of times struck by the character using Aspect of the Tanar'ri.
As for the matter of being flat-footed, the start of the round is NOT the only time when you can be caught flat-footed. Rogues, for instance, have feats that can cause opponents to become flat-footed (ie Quicker Than the Eye). Now, flat-footed means that the person is basically no longer dodging attacks (as D&D assumes characters always are). This is the idea of the feat. Not only that, but the character is basically walking forward without thought for their own body or for the blows that are being made on them, effectively meaning they are an easy target for anyone who dares approach them. That is why they are given the penalties of a helpless target. Perhaps it would be simplest say to say they're DEX is reduced to 0 for purposes of dodging attacks and abilities.
My problem with the requirements is that I think they are a little bit too high. I mean, I know Planescape has somewhat more powerful EVERYTHING than other games, but getting two 15s in two unrelated stats is kind of asking that the player either have extremely well rolls to be able to spread them out to two different stats, or you are going to need magic items to boost the stats up enough.
I understand that the Tanar'ri are usually pretty "strong" creatures, but I don't think that recognizing your heritage is essentially one that requires a STR of 15, which in game terms is a pretty high strength, 10 being average, & Teiflings generally having much slender & skinnier compositions.
I know that I didn't create the feat, so I definetely view it differently from the person who made it, but I don't think to recognize your aspect of the tanar'ri & to express your demonism requires you to replicate being a tanar'ri to an extremely close level, just your ability to recognize it, & to essentially convince others, to frighten them by being able to express where you have come from. I can see STR playing in a bit, but a 15 for a once a day burst of a little extra damage, drop in AC, being flat footed, unable to use magic items or cast, is kind of asking for a lot. But that's just my opinion, & I think 30 point buys are just on the line of being "too powerful" characters.
Regardless, the italicized portion in my previous post is a direct quote from the DMG. I'm surprised no one else caught this. I don't visit the boards often enough to know if it was addressed already, and I didn't want to double-post anything. I'm glad I brought some good news to a few people.
The wrongness of it... yes, it is a sad day when the factions have some control of the affairs in Sigil. I guess the Lady finally decided the factions learned their lesson, or maybe she cut a deal with some power, or maybe the lack of factions made the Cage a boring place, or maybe a someone brought her some triple chocolate cheesecake. Simply put, no one has figured out the Lady and no one knows her motivations.
Most are interested in bottom lines, and according to WotC, the bottom line is that factions are back in the Cage running things.
And actually, that's lifted word for word from Manual of the Planes. In a way, though, it's slightly more problematic appearing in the DMG than the MotP.
But in the same way that Pelor appears in the PHB but has nothing to do with Forgotten Realms or Dragonlance, Planescape as a campaign setting will have its own take on things.
FYI, some of the 'new' material in the DMG 3.5 is material that has appeared in other books, MotP, ELH, FRCS, etc. There is some actual new material, but some of the references I may use probably do appear elsewhere.
Pelor appears in the core materials, but is not an integral part of the other campaign settings. So, I concede that this does not force anyone to use their material, but it certainly leaves the option open to have factions in Sigil. Since this is what most people are familiar with (Faction War occurred relatively late in the series), I would hope that the PS3E team would continue to use what is familiar. Most factions will try to move into their old haunts, while others may feel that their rivals weilded too much influence and attempt to subvert them.
I think this could make for some interesting politics in the Cage when several factions are actively seeking members of the Revolutionary League in order to subvert other factions. How about the Harmonium posing as members of the Revolutionary League in order to arrest people for trying to subvert law and order? How about the Revolutionary League plotting with the Harmonium to subvert the actions of the Revolutionary League? How about the Revolutionary League plotting with the Revolutionary League to subvert the actions of the Revolutionary League?
However, I think you'll be happy with our treatment of the factions. The default will be post-FW, but a few years later. The factions are still scheming and squabbling. They all pretty much consider Sigil the prize. The problem is the Lady's edict. Most everyone took the most literal interpretation of it at the time, just to be on the safe side. But no one's positive what she meant, especially since she used one of her dabus to deliver the message. The factions are still there, they just aren't in absolute *control* of anything. Some of them are getting fidgety, though, and are going to be testing the waters right quick.
You suffer from a mild manic-depressive condition, where the oppressive meaninglessness of the universe often either brings you low or drives you to bursts of desperate energy.
Faction: Bleak Cabal.
Benefit: At the beginning of every day, roll 1d20. On a result of 1 or lower you are depressed and can only perform a single standard action per round for the day, but you gain a +4 circumstance bonus on Will saving throws. On a roll between 2 and 20 you are manic, gaining a +2 morale bonus to any attack rolls and a -2 circumstance penalty on saving throws. You may choose to add or subtract your Wisdom modifier (if positive) from this roll, but a natural roll of 1 always results in depression and a natural roll of 20 always results in a manic state. If you ever suffer through three consecutive days of madness (either a manic state or depression), you must make a Will save (DC 20) or progress further into insanity. For every consecutive day of madness past the first three requires another Will save with a cumulative +4 to the DC. A failed save means you gain an Insanity score (see below).
Special: Upon failing the Will save you gain an Insanity score equal to ½ your character level. For spellcasting (determining bonus spells and DCs), you use your Wisdom score plus your Insanity score in place of Wisdom alone. For all other purposes, such as skills and saves, use Wisdom minus Insanity in place of Wisdom.
Being treated for insanity requires a Bleaker with at least 8 ranks of Heal to treat the character, making a Heal check at the end of each week of treatment (DC 15 + the patient's Will save modifier without Insanity modifiers). Each successful consecutive weeks of treatment allow the patient to lose one from their Insanity rating. A failed week of treatment results in temporary Wisdom damage equal to the patient's Insanity rating. Treatment cannot be performed while the patient has Wisdom damage of any sort.
Once per day, you can see and act with the clarity of true madness. Use your Insanity score as a positive rather than a negative modifier on a single roll involving Wisdom, such as Listen check or a Will saving throw. Choose to use this power before the roll is made."
-What about classes that don't use Wisdom for Bonus Spells and DCs?
-You mean a 1st level bleaker wizard with 10 dex would have a Reflex Save of -2 for 19 days out of 20???
As for the saves, it is not quite 1 out of 20, as your Wisdom check isn't quite that simple, but yes a low level character would likely have the negative to saving throws and the benefit to attack rolls.
Keep in mind that you are INTENDED to eventually become insane, and this is a gate-way feat of sorts.
but i believe in what the Bleak cabal believes...
When I first read what they were about, I thought "Hey, but that's what I've been saying for the last 15 years!!!"...
and I don't think they were first intended to be insane...
since the base setting said they tended mad people, not they were part of them...
and since i'm not mad at all... (even if I share their vision of life)
I'm sorry that you made the Bleakers insane people...
but, hey, it's just a game...
So, I truly find this feat unbalanced, since you always get a malus and never have a true benefit. Why should I take it, if it wasn't a prerequisite of other Bleak Cabal Feats?
As for the Bleaker philsophy, I'm not an expert on the faction, so it'd be best to argue this matter with others, particularly the writer should he rear his head. But I do know that it is made clear that the Bleakers continuously battle some form of madness because of their beliefs - hence the name Madmen. In 2E I believe Bleakers had to undergo a period of some madness. Of course "madness" doesn't have to be played the same way, and its up for discussion with the DM what an insanity score really means.
Later Planescape products reinforce this.
Bleaker madness is nothing new.
how do i can to avoid the madnes????????
HAPPY FIRST POST TO ME!
Originally posted by CATLAND93
The original feat is 1-depression 2-20 manic state!
how do i can to avoid the madnes????????
If you have a Wisdom bonus, you can use that to help avoid the effects.
Or you can avoid it entirely by not taking the feat. You will lose access to three other feats (Hyperactive, and two that require an Insanity score), and one PrC. By opting out of that chain, you still have access to 5 feats and 2 PrCs, along with the others you would normally have access to for level, class, etc. The majority of Bleaker abilities don't require you to be a complete loon.
Originally posted by christuschristus
you still have access to 5 feats and 2 PrCs
I missed this aspect... sorry, and thank you for your answers.
Hopefully, the factions will be well-rounded, with a variety of character types possible.
Threads like this one are the reason for which I registered. What is the status on feats? There is much to playtest and clarify in the document that is currently available for download. There are poorly worded feats, feats that could be rewritten to comply with 3.5e mechanics, and several feats that are arguably overpowered. I know because I've been using them for several months.
Before I start making suggestions - is there someone who is already working on editing the feats? Am I getting worked up over something that is actually just a draft?
For my own part, I've got a list of material to correct on the chapter 7 draft that's been compiled by both myself and other folks who've read it and given me a review. Aside from some punctuation to correct, there's a few actual facts to correct in there as well that slipped in somehow. (A fuzzy and friendly shop owner in the Lower Ward is suspected at this time of hacking my computer...)
Benefit: At the beginning of every day, roll 1d20. On a result of 1 or lower you are depressed […] On a roll between 2 and 20 you are manic […] You may choose to add or subtract your Wisdom modifier (if positive) from this roll, but a natural roll of 1 always results in depression and a natural roll of 20 always results in a manic state.
I'm going to have to chime in again and say that this it is just plain ludicrous. Assuming the "between" is inclusive of 2 and 20, your chance to be "normal" is equal to (Wis mod-1)*5% on any given day. That is a massive shift from the "on a 1 you're depressed on a 20 you're manic" that is given in 2e (Factol's Manifesto, I think, there isn't the manic bit in the main boxed set). You might as well just get an insanity score when you take the feat since even with a 20 wisdom, you'll be manic or depressed on over 50% of 3 day periods.
I personally think that depression bit should stay the same, but the mania should only set in on a 10+ minimum (maybe even a 15+ or something even higher than that).
Amoral. I would change the feat from "make a Cha check vs caster level to resist an alignment detection" to "the caster has to make a caster level check versus DC 20+Cha to be able to detect alignment". This is mathematically similar and has two advantages. First, it is very similar to the spell resistance mechanic, and thus easier to remember. We could even change the text to, roughly, "you get SR 20+Cha modifier versus alignment detection". Second, I assume that the target isn't automatically aware that someone is detecting his alignment, and having the caster make the roll reinforces this notion. Psychological tricks. :D
To make it exactly the same chance as it is now, it should be 22+Cha. We could round it to 20+Cha, or round it to 25+Cha and call it spell resistance (this way it is a bit stronger but spell penetration applies).
These are real nuances, and more of the comments I have in store are of this kind, but in my experience every little bit helps. Especially the standardizing of mechanics. Things add up quickly, and twelve rules that "could have been better" can make a worse overall impression than a single outright broken one. And there are more than twelve here...
Change the wording from "suffers a penalty to Constitution" to "takes Constitution damage".
Add an example somewhere in the description which says "Spells dealing continuous damage only apply the Constitution damage during the first round of effect. For example, a Melf's Acid Arrow will deal 2 points of Constitution damage in addition to its normal damage upon hit, with a Fort save, DC 12+ability modifier, to take only 1 damage". Apart from the continuous damage bit, there are people out there who still don't understand that a metamagic'ed spell is still of its normal level for all intents and purposes. The example serves three purposes: preventing continuous-damage exploiting, clarifying that even if it occupies a 5th level slot it only does 2 points of damage, and, well, being an example, which is a good thing in itself.
Ascetic. I suggest that the points can only be spent on checks, saves and to-hit rolls. I shudder at the idea of an 18th level wizard using this ability to Time Stop for 1d4+10 rounds, or to summon a horde of creatures in one spell, or to deal his choice of death with Prismatic Spray spells, or to drain opponents with Enervation, or a poison-user to deal immense Con damage with one blow, or... well, let's just say that when introducing a new ability, the word "any" must be treated with extreme caution. ;)
The Will save is 10+Cha mod+number of hits. This doesn't work; a single mighty blow is as frightening as multiple light wounds. Besides, no creature that I remember has any special attack which depends on number of hits. I'd make the DC a flat 14+Cha, and the effect a fear spell with caster level 3. A given creature only needs to save once per encounter.
I'd change the duration to 3+Cha mod, to make it similar to raging.
Giving dex 0 doesn't work IMO. There already is a mechanic for someone who is not caring to defend himself, and it's called "being denied the positive Dex modifier to AC" (I don't think that "flat-footed" is being used outside of surprise rounds any more in 3.5, though I could be wrong). Dex 0 (-5 to AC) is reserved for rocks and characters that are bound or held. Stuff that isn't even moving.
Besides, modifying stats just for some purposes is a foggy rule in any case.
"If you're held or dazed the effect continues indefinitely" - what, even beyond the normal duration? I don't get it. I'd just drop this line.
Like any complex thing, this feat cannot be balanced without playtesting.
Also, 3.5 style is not to give "as a wizard..." for spell-like abilities. Instead, we should use "caster level is X, the save is based on Y". In this case, caster level is equal to character level, and the save is Int-based.
Authority. Same thing; instead of talking about clerics, it's better if we say "caster level equal to your character level, DC based on Cha".
Baatezu Cunning. Add nongood to the requirements, as well as to the requirements for participating in the strategy. Also, if an action deviates from the plan slightly, then the bonus should decrease by 1 for that action only, not for the entire plan. Same as for actions that deviate completely; it's only that action which receives no bonus.
Blasphemous Presence. The skill penalties should not apply if the target is using Listen, Sense Motive or Spot on you. He's focusing on you, that's the point of the feat.
Borrow Style. Distinguishing between feats that are "distinct and visible" and feats that aren't is often too hard and may lead to arguments. Let the ability apply to any [fighter] feat, it's not unbalanced anyway.
Also either clarify what it means to be "studying your target", or drop it. As it stands now, it is confusing and doesn't really influence the feat.
Brawn over Brains. Why a Charisma requisite? Strong mental resiliency is represented by Wisdom. Charisma requisites are better suited for feats that influence other people.
Brick Thrower. Up the Strength requisite to 15+. The reason being, with a 13 the feat is useless.
That said, IMO it would be more cool if the feat did something more unique. An example would be allowing Power Attack-style modifiers with thrown weapons.
Cadence Strike. Do you still need to confirm the threat? Or does it work like Power Critical? Add an example. Either way, it's very powerful.
Censure Outsider. Change to "you may stun them". I can see situations where one would rather the enemy to run away, and getting a feat shouldn't make you lose an ability.
Channel Potential. Specify that a wand with 0 charges is just a stick of wood, so the item must have at least one charge left.
I think "refining" is the right word. From what I'm posting - commenting on more than half of the feats - it may seem that I think the entire document is to be scrapped. Not so! It is good, but it can be made better. I feel that as long as there is room for improvement, we should strive to make PS3E as close to perfection as possible.Cipher Training. I don't understand the +1 to Diplomacy. Since Skill Focus now gives a +3, we could have this feat give a +2 to Concentration and the other bonus as well.
Cipher Trance. Add the description of the "dazed" status at the end of the feat, so that one doesn't have to pull out the DMG to see what it does.
Cycle of Existance. Troubles here. First, the feat is weak in a standard campaign (it may be adequate in a campaign where raising the dead is harder than normal). I mean, it replicates a 4th level spell once. The character gets to be raised once. Naked. Far from his friends. With one less level. And possibly as a kobold. Worse, he could pop up anywhere and he just has to pray that the DM doesn't throw him on a hostile place because otherwise he could very well just die again. So it's even worse than reincarnate. And after his rebirth, he is effectively down one feat in comparison to anyone else. A cleric gets raise dead at 9th level, and even before that most parties can afford a raising or two.
Secondly, this is a pain for the DM. After the feat has kicked in, he has a split party on his hands; worse, split across planes and with the reincarnated PC having no quick means to get back (he's naked and without spell components). Unless the rest of the party is so powerful that they can scry him, plane shift, teleport without error, and then get back to the task at hand, he is going to have a split party for quite a long time. Not good.
Here's what we could try: first of all, make this feat reincarnate you on the same plane where you died. This makes rejoining the party a lot easier, though risk of re-death is still a problem.
Then, one of two choices: if the one shot nature of the feat is important for flavor reasons, make it so that the character doesn't lose a level while coming back from the dead. This makes the feat more worthwhile at all but the highest levels. Alternatively, make it so that reincarnation occurs every time the character dies (unless he is first level, or soul-trapped, or has become undead - this gives the DM enough options in case he really needs him dead).
Originally posted by Zappo
Alternatively, make it so that reincarnation occurs every time the character dies (unless he is first level, or soul-trapped, or has become undead - this gives the DM enough options in case he really needs him dead).
Back in 2e you could theoretically reincarnate an unlimited number of times if you were a Godsman, but the fact that you could at best come back at 1/2 your previous levels was a big restriction on it (since that was how reincarnation worked). I am pro unlimited redos with the feat, but I think that it needs a bigger drop in xp than 1 level. Maybe 2 levels and you can't be raised through any other means shy of true ressurection?
I don't think there is need for a bigger penalty, or limitations on other means of resurrection. At low levels, the feat is powerful but not excessively so; the character is guaranteed to be reincarnated for free while his pals rot, big deal. He is minus one level, no equipment, on a random place, of a random race. At high levels, the feat is a hindrance; the party always has to lug around a raise dead whether as a scroll or prepared, because if the PC dies he must be raised within one hour or he will basically suffer random race change and teleportation without his equipment. The coming-back-to-life part just makes the party save some money; hardly worth the danger of reincarnation.
Defiant Turning. If I have twice the levels of the target, will I destroy him? If so, that's not technically unbalanced, but it is a freakin' nasty thing to do. Either way, it needs to be explicitly stated.
Deny Edict. This doesn't sit well with me. No existing mechanic that represents resistance to something works like this. I think we should try to avoid introducing new mechanics for old concepts. In this case, I would either make the feat grant a big ST bonus versus compulsion (if the feat is "just" exceptional mental resiliency) or grant a big SR versus compulsion effects only (if the feat is an actual supernatural power).
Disruptive Aura. I don't like "-1 competence penalty". Penalties as a general rule have no type. Also, I would consider using the full Charisma modifier as the modifier; it makes the feat simpler and I don't think it's too powerful. Finally, creatures with the [Chaotic] descriptor should be immune; I just can't see this power working on a slaad.
Enhanced Hearing. Make it clear that it works against any opponent that you can't see, not only invisible opponents. Examples: in darkness, in heavy fog, or when you're blind.
Enhanced Touch. Reading painted messages and determining color by touch seem a bit excessive to me. I'd up the DCs substantially, placing the color thing well into epic levels. But I also have a suggestion to make the feat more interesting: what about allowing the character to gain some kind of limited tremorsense as long as he is concentrating? One full round and a concentration check to activate the ability, then lasts as long as you concentrate and stay still. If disturbed or if moving, make a hard concentration check or it terminates.
Entropic Blow. Ow. This looks overpowered to me, but I admit I haven't playtested it. I'd up the requisites, maybe make the BAB requisite 8+, so that the feat is an alternative to Improved Critical. Also, I would make using this feat a standard action (so that you can't use it during a full attack).
Eye for Injustice. This is extremely unclear. Is the character just staring at the target, or is he talking to him, or is he conducting an actual investigation involving searching places and questioning people? How long does it take to use this power? Is it an exceptional or supernatural ability?
And why a Search check? Sense Motive would be more appropriate, opposed by the target's Bluff check. Add a few simple modifiers according to how much time has elapsed.
Eye for Treachery. Being near-impossible to resist, this feat is very powerful. I'd either up the requisites, adding 6 ranks of Sense Motive, or remove the -10 penalty to Bluff.
Faithless Miracle. This is underpowered. At the minimum required level, a cleric of your CR will defeat the resistance 85% of times. Then it gets worse. IMO, it must scale with level without forcing the character to blow most of his feats on it to keep it useful.
What about a SR of 5 + HD? It's fairly powerful, but it also applies against healing. The second time you take the feat, the SR becomes 10 + HD (alternatively, the feat can only be taken once).
Figuring the Odds: A very interesting feat, but it's open to immense amounts of abuse. I could ask the DM to redo an entire week of game time after failing a Craft check, for example. Or I could use it to perform actions that have a nasty penalty for failing (say, disabling a trap or using UMD), confident that if I fail and blow up, I can change the action to something like tying my shoelaces instead. Even having to redo a combat round can be a real pain at times (I think that if I had this feat during my last epic level session, the DM would have shot me while the rest of the players held me). At the very least, this feat needs to be changed so that it only works on standard, partial, movement and move-equivalent actions. And it would still be very powerful.
Good Smith: At low levels this can be abused for making heaps of money quickly. It lets you make very valuable items in a very short time. Actually, I wouldn't even call it abuse, it's just the way the feat works. It could be called "flood the market".
Then, there must be some Craft ranks as prerequisite. Possibly at least 6. I can't see an apprentice doing this sort of things. Finally, the weapons shouldn't be "blessed", they should be "good-aligned".
How I would change this feat: "Any masterwork weapon you craft is automatically considered good-aligned. This doesn't give it any additional bonus, but it affects damage resistance and other abilities". IE, you have to put some work into making your special weapons. This, coupled with the Craft ranks prerequisite, makes the feat less prone to be used as a money machine.
There is another loophole; it's clearer if I explain the fix: "When you are crafting a good-aligned weapon, any other character helping you must also have the Good Smith feat". This prevents you from overdriving production with 15 assistants giving you a +2 each. If it sounds too harsh, we may allow for up to half of the characters to lack the feat. This allows the classical single apprentice to help you without troubles.
Grab Magic. The wizard IMC has an imp familiar and uses this feat as a source of unlimited invisibility spells. Not overpowered at these levels, but it's quite nifty. Anyway,
- I would specify that it only works on spell effects and not on the effects of supernatural or exceptional abilities.
- I would clarify that this is a supernatural ability.
- If the target has multiple spell effects, then the effect you grab should be chosen randomly. It really doesn't make sense to let him choose; he probably doesn't even know what's happening to him, let alone make a conscious choice as to what spell effect to let go. And how do you "let a spell effect be stolen" anyway?
Great Finder. "Hey guys, check this +2 thundering shocking warhammer I found in that trash heap over there...", said the 2nd level cleric. Ok, not really a big problem since it's very unlikely, but somewhere, sooner or later, it will happen. :D
First of all, I have the feeling that a Search check should be involved somewhere; it just makes sense. Having the check influence the treasure level would either make the feat underpowered at low levels or overpowered at high levels. What about allowing the character to add or subtract his Search ranks from the percentile roll to determine the treasure found?
I'd change the location from "public locale" to "city or town area". You can't do this thing in a single building, there are too many circumstances where it would be far beyond unrealistic. IMO, this xaositect power needs a large, complex area to work. Small places are too easy to make orderly.
Hardheaded. A bit weak maybe? There's a grand total of 6 [charm] spells. Four are just Charme and variants, and one of them only affects animals. Then there's a bunch of monsters, but that's it. Considering the power level of some other faction feats, I think we could safely have Hardheaded grant immunity to charm effects, period.
Heavenly Glory. The check to avoid becoming closer to helpful should be either a Wisdom check or (better) a Will save. "Creatures that are so alien in perspective as to not recognize your celestial qualities" is a bit foggy. What about saying that it doesn't work on, say, aberrations, plants and undead?
Heretic's Strike. A bit weak IMO. What about adding to it the ability to also negate any bonuses to saving throws (protection from evil and similar), spell resistance and damage resistance granted by divine spells?
Improved Energy Resistance. Meh. A bit weak. I don't know how to make it better, either. Anyway, add "Special: you may take this feat multiple times. Its effects do not stack. Each time, it must be applied to a different resistance".
Improved Familiar. This list needs to be expanded somehow, so that for each required level there is something for all alignments. What about a dretch, with a required level of 10?
Improved Sift. With Scry gone in 3.5, this feat must be redone from scratch.
Improved Outsider Turning. Uhm, what's an Outsider? Don't we have Externals in PS3E?
Improved Turn Resistance. Why not phrase this as "Your turn resistance is improved by 4; if you have no turn resistance, you gain turn resistance 4"? Also, since there are Outsider Turning feats, technically all outsiders (...well, externals) are "susceptible to turning".
Influence of Life. Very weak by itself, and not even enough to make Cycle of Existance worthwhile.
Insanity Buffer. This feat suffers from the general problems of the Insanity points mechanic, of which I'll talk when I get to Manic-Depressive.
Insanity Focus. See above.
Insight of the Barmy. I'm a bit leery of "permission from the DM" as a requirement. IMO, "permission from the DM" is an implicit requirement for each and every feat, skill, PrC, race, spell or even base class. Specifying it explicitly for some feats weakens that concept somewhat.
Besides, this feat has nothing special, there are others that are more powerful and others that have a deeper background meaning, why should the DM be especially careful about this one? It is woefully lacking in actual rules, but that can be fixed (I'd use a mechanic similar to bardic knowledge).
Originally posted by Zappo
Improved Outsider Turning. Uhm, what's an Outsider? Don't we have Externals in PS3E?
Exemplar, I believe. But yes, I noticed a similar issue. Or perhaps (although this would make the feat considerably more powerful, so it may not be a good option) it could refer to anyone who currently has the [Extraplanar] subtype.
Intrinsic Value. Whoa, this is pretty good. Maybe a bit too good, I would make it so that 50% of the cost is saved. In any case, the definition of "similar object" must be clarified. Is emerald similar to diamond? What about glass? What about ice? Heh, casting Raise Dead in a glacier could destroy 2500 GP worth of ice, I guess that's several cubic miles. More definition is necessary.
Kill Count. From the requisites, it seems that this only applies to opponents you kill in melee. If so, it should be explicitly said. If not, I would change the requisites.
Additionally, the feat is weak IMO. Especially considering that it requires the nigh-useless Killing Blow. PCs do not meet many consecutive opponents with their same HD or higher, and the bonus lasts far too little. I would make the bonus last for 24 hours, period.
Killing Blow. Why on Earth would someone take this when there are so many more useful feats like, I dunno, Toughness or Skill Focus (profession: hair stylist)? Ok, more seriously, I don't know how to make this useful and I suggest redoing from scratch.
Secondly, substitute "that deals lightning damage" with "that has the [electricity] descriptor". We have good mechanics, let's use them.
Lockdown. As a free action? Faster than a normal attack? Doesn't make sense IMO. I'd make it so that it's an attack instead. Besides, as the feat is worded now, I can handcuff an entire crowd in a round provided that I have enough handcuffs and I can run fast enough to touch all of them.
Lord of the Dead. This feat as it is is only really good for clerics. A noncleric gets to rebuke as a cleric of 1/3 his level, but that's way too low to have any sort of real use. I would make it so that the character can rebuke as a cleric of 1/2 his character level, OR he may add 1/3 his character level to his cleric levels for the purpose of rebuking. The choice is to cover weird multiclassing situations (clr1/barb15, stuff like this).
Also, it is unspecified how many times per day this can be used. 3+CHA modifier sounds fair.
Love Thy Weapon. I'm not too sure on the Power Attack requirement.
That said, the execution here is poor. This has to be the most unclear feat of all. First of all, everyone I know who has read this feat has understood that there is no way to avoid the insanity, and therefore you will gain an insanity score three days after taking the feat. Upon a very careful reading, though, it looks like you may be able to avoid the insanity if your modified roll goes above 20. Now, first of all this is extremely unclear and must be explictly said. Secondly, chances are that the character will get an insanity score within the first week even if he puts his full Wisdom bonus towards avoiding it, every day. Even an 18 means that you have to roll 17 to avoid madness; how many chances do you have to roll 17 or above at least once every three rolls for any length of time? And that's with an 18! You have the save, but it is hard.
The score is initially set to 1/2 your level. Does it change when I go up a level? Either way, it must be explicitly mentioned.
What happens after I've gained an insanity score? Do I have to keep making those saves? And if I fail again, do I again gain 1/2 my level in Insanity points? If not, is there any way at all to increase Insanity?
For spellcasting you add your Insanity to your Wisdom. Holy shangai. This makes bleaker clerics into monsters. Why would my God give me heaps of extra spell and a huge bonus to my DCs only because I'm mad? I'm not even a religious fanatic, only a manic-depressive!
Basically, this feat is terribly overpowered for clerics (who can both control it better and gain a massive benefit from madness) and about good for everyone else.
First of all, I would rewrite this feat because as it is now it is way too unclear.
Secondly, I'd drop the definition of Insanity as a bonus to Wisdom for some purposes and a malus for others. It's much better if we set Insanity to 1/4 character level and say that it's a malus to Wisdom-based skills, Wisdom checks and Will saves, except that once a day it can become a bonus instead. And I'd drop that spellcasting thing, it's overpowered and it doesn't make sense anyway.
Merciful Strike. Can I use this ability on a target that would be illegal for a smite? Eg, a paladin using it on a neutral character? Either way, it must be explicitly mentioned.
Also, 10+damage dealt means that unbeatable DCs can be reached quite easily. Damage dealt raises much faster than saves. The save must be based on something else (STR modifier?).
And why knowledge (arcana), for that matter? Guvners believe in the laws of the multiverse, not necessarily in magic. Oh, and why that complex Int mod+1d4-2 thing which the DM has to keep track of? I understand that we want to make the player unsure on how many times he can get away with this, but why forcing the DM to keep track of yet another number?
Finally, the skill bonus. I guess it's to compensate for the fact that the feat eventually "expires". But it doesn't really make sense.
Here's how I would fix it. The feat gives you the ability to research minor loopholes. A minor loophole is any spell, of a level not higher than half your character level, up to 4th. To research a loophole, you spend time and money as described. No check is required. After doing this, you gain the specified spell as a spell-like ability, with a caster level equal to the character level you had when you finished researching it.
The loophole may be used at minimum a number of times equal to your Intelligence modifier, minus the spell level (minimum one). After that, each time you use the loophole, there is a 50% chance that the multiverse has closed it. In this case, nothing happens and you may never use this loophole again. You can research a new minor loophole, but you can never research the same spell again. You can know and use only one minor loophole at a time.
This feat may be taken multiple times. Each time, you can know and use an additional minor loophole at the same time.
Modron Focus. The character is "unable to to react, with a -5 dex penalty to AC". Call it "Helpless", that's its name. Do not invent new stuff for no reason.
Multiversal Socialite. I admit that I haven't read Faction War; maybe some of the factions have had some drastic change even if they didn't disappear. Anyway, why Fated for this feat?
Outsider Turning. I haven't playtested this feat but I suspect it would present problems. Why? Most powerful undead have turn resistance, or lots of HD. Outsiders don't. Vampires and lichs get +4 turn resistance. A nightcrawler, with 25 HD, is almost impossible to turn before epic levels, but a cleric with good Charisma could be turning balors relatively soon (and balors even have a higher CR than the 'crawler!)
Parting the Veil. The document lacks "Faction: Athar" in the feat description. And it says "the domain must be offered by the deity you serve" - uhm, are we talking about the same Athar? ;)
Pierce Damage Reduction. This feat must be redone from scratch, due to the new DR rules. What about considering the target's DR as 5 points lower, or something like that?
Precondition. I don't know who wrote this feat, but I seriously hope that he hasn't thought about it for more than ten seconds, because that's about the time it takes to realize that it is horribly wrong. Of course, this begs the question of why was something released if it hasn't been given even 10 seconds of thought.
First of all, "the condition must be common enough to occur at least once in an average session". Now, apart from "combat" and "speaking", what else generally happens at least once per session? Not much. This statement forbids pretty much any condition more complex than "I attack whoever attacks me or my friends", which is pretty stupid.
Second, the modron performs the action even if it has already made an action this round? The aforementioned "I attack whoever attacks me or my friends" translates to "I get a free attack every single time any enemy attacks, even if he isn't attacking me". And this is a perfectly reasonable condition, so the thing about DM approval doesn't come into play.
Probability Manipulation. Specify that you cannot use it twice for the same roll.
Purity of Spirit. "Corrupt" spells? Is that something out of the BoVD? Anyway, if "corrupt spell" isn't defined in the Planescape material, it shouldn't be used here.
Riot Leader. "A number of additional followers determined by your Leadership score". Determined how exactly? After this sentence, there is no more mention of the Leadership score.
I think the score you roll should have some influence on the riot's magnitude. Here's what I would do: first of all, convert the plane-related DC modifiers to circumstance modifiers to the roll. A 25 results in a small riot, lasting one hour and involving a number of people equal to the number of permanent followers determined by your Leadership score. Every two points above 25 could make the riot last one extra hour and increase the number of participants by 5%.
Sacrifice Self. Specify that you must be aware of the attack.
Seasoned Officer. Why an INT requirement? I would drop it.
Anyway, don't they say that the best way to know if something is overpowered is to see whether everyone wants to take it? Well, every single Fated player IMC has taken this feat immediately as soon as they read it, and they've never looked back. Actually, they feel a bit guilty about it; IIRC, one of them thought it was some kind of typo. It's that bad.
Please, please, make this feat give only one extra skill point per level... it's still very, very good but at least some people will not get it.
Also, I think it should be clarified about what happens if you take it at first level. Of course, you don't get any extra skill point for the level in which you took the feat, and that includes not getting any at level 1 too - but it should be explicit, just to save time on discussions.
Sensory Touch. Make this "up to" your character level, rather than "equal to". It's only logical.
Sift. No more Scry.
Anyway, I would change this feat so that it simply gives a +1 bonus to hit and damage which stacks with (Greater) Weapon Focus and (Greater) Weapon Specialization. That's powerful enough even for a faction feat.
Slaad Taint. Why "permission from the DM"? Everything requires "permission from the DM". It's implicit. This would be a good feat where the insanity mechanic could be applied - uniformity of mechanics is a good thing.
Sod of Acheron. "-2 morale penalty to all rolls"? Bad wording. There's no such thing as a modifier to all rolls; do my fireballs deal 10d6-2 damage now? You must always specify to what a modifier applies. Similarly, "you permanently suffer a -1 morale penalty" isn't clear.
Surprise Factioneers. As for the other similar feats, we must specify whether it is supernatural or extraordinary, and if it is extraordinary then it should affect everyone within hearing range. If it supernatural, it should be explicitly marked as [mind-affecting] [languge-dependant].
Talents of the Past. Remove "nonrestricted". There are no more restricted skills.
Tongue of the 'Loth. I don't know if this was intentional, but as this feat reads, it is easier to Sense Motive without magic on a character with this feat. The feat only works against magic, and it allows lies to be detected with a -10 on Sense Motive. But I can Sense Motive normally and this feat won't help, so I don't get the penalty! Kinda weird. Since I don't think we want to make a feat that effectively gives you a +10 Bluff in all circumstances AND fools magic, I think it's easier to just drop the talk about skills and say that you are unaffected by any truth-related spell. Also, note that this is a supernatural ability.
Unlikely Event. This cool feat is a bit undefined. Does it only apply to rolls you make, or to all rolls that involve you? For example, are enemies striking me affected? Can it be suppressed at will? Even if the answer is "no" to each of these questions, they still must be answered.
Well-lanned Cutter. Cool feat, but since it's intrinsically undefined, it's better to be as precise as we can. What kind of contacts are we talking about? A bubber in the street isn't the same thing as a busy barkeep, who isn't the same as a factor's secretary! If we are talking random people, one per five levels is too few. If we are talking about bloods with connections, one per five levels may even be too much! Should we rank them, ala Storyteller?
Wounding Martial Strike. Hm... this feat is very powerful. But it has a high Intelligence requirement, which is a problem for fighters. These two factors may or may not balance each other; I'd need to playtest it.
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And since this is the last feat, this concludes my commentary. It's worth using it to give a further example (sadly based on 3.0 rules, and thus entirely academic, but still - this feat was designed during 3.0 after all), to illustrate my ideas and design principles.
3.0 Shuriken + Monk BAB + Wounding Martial Strike = bleeding death.
This is the kind of things you have to think about when designing a game. Sure, a setting such as Planescape isn't written for the powergaming bastards who would use shuriken and WMS, and neither it is written for the rules lawyers who would bitch about what Unlikely Event applies to. But preventing things like that helps making the rules more solid, which is good for everyone. And, more importantly, it proves that we have been thinking about what we are doing, at all levels, both setting and mechanics. Shoddy mechanics are a bad way to introduce yourself.
And it doesn't even take that much - do you think I've been thinking for hours about each of these feats? Nah, mostly I was spotting the flaws as I read them; an editor with some good rules knowledge and a knack for loopholes is more than enough to give this feats chapter the polished feeling which tells professionals from amateurs. So, find a guvner and we're set. :D
Well, I hope the commentary didn't give the impression that I am just seeing flaws were none are. I am perfectly aware that lots of the suggestions I'm giving are about very, very petty points, hardly worth discussing. And for the important stuff - I am sorry that people aren't discussing it much here, but I hope that people will at least take a look, think about them, and then dismiss or accept them. Think about them. That's all I ask.
And, if a suggestion is found valid, please o high-ups of ps3e, do take the time to change the document, even if it's just to rephrase a rule. When I do something, I don't aim for "good enough". I aim for perfection. I like to think that Planescape doesn't deserve anything less.
Originally posted by Zappo
Minor Loophole. Cool concept! There are several problems, though. First of all, this is another of those feats that only work for a certain number of times and then becomes useless. And this is a very bad thing. As if this wasn't enough, you have to spend (a lot of) money and time before taking the feat - why? No other feat has such a requirement.
And why knowledge (arcana), for that matter? Guvners believe in the laws of the multiverse, not necessarily in magic. Oh, and why that complex Int mod+1d4-2 thing which the DM has to keep track of? I understand that we want to make the player unsure on how many times he can get away with this, but why forcing the DM to keep track of yet another number?
Finally, the skill bonus. I guess it's to compensate for the fact that the feat eventually "expires". But it doesn't really make sense.
Here's how I would fix it. The feat gives you the ability to research minor loopholes. A minor loophole is any spell, of a level not higher than half your character level, up to 4th. To research a loophole, you spend time and money as described. No check is required. After doing this, you gain the specified spell as a spell-like ability, with a caster level equal to the character level you had when you finished researching it.
The loophole may be used at minimum a number of times equal to your Intelligence modifier, minus the spell level (minimum one). After that, each time you use the loophole, there is a 50% chance that the multiverse has closed it. In this case, nothing happens and you may never use this loophole again. You can research a new minor loophole, but you can never research the same spell again. You can know and use only one minor loophole at a time.
This feat may be taken multiple times. Each time, you can know and use an additional minor loophole at the same time.
Modron Focus. The character is "unable to to react, with a -5 dex penalty to AC". Call it "Helpless", that's its name. Do not invent new stuff for no reason.
Multiversal Socialite. I admit that I haven't read Faction War; maybe some of the factions have had some drastic change even if they didn't disappear. Anyway, why Fated for this feat?
Zappo, I like your fix to Minor Loophole. This way, the feat isn't wasted after it's used...though the character has to spend XP and gold to get a new loophole with that same feat.
I'd probably do something similar with the Cycle of Existence feat. Having it allow reincarnation once, and then be blown isn't a good idea. Reincarnation already causes a lost level, which is pain enough.
Banshee