I just noticed it while thumbing through the 3.5 DMG. On page 171, under the table for common subraces they give the (by merit of this listing) default Oerthian title for several races. They list Duergar as Grey Dwarves, Woodelves as Slyvan Elves, and yes Wild Elves as Grugach.
I think its great that there are more tidbits in the core books than just the Deities listed in the PHB. Hopefully we'll see more tidbits in future supplements.
Let me know if I've missed anymore Greyhawk tidbits.
I have built my campaign to have a Greyhawk feel without references that could lead someone to believe it was just another FR campaign.
I am sure that the Grugach will find their way into a FR based setting. Which I hope doesn't happen because they will be further raping a campaign setting that with the proper support could stand on its own.
I read your aricle on Canonfire. Prior to finding this information. A unique blend of Greyhawk lore with the The Complete Elves Handbook of second edition......Why does that sound like a coffee commercial...never mind.
Good work!
Way to go WoTC.....Hook em' when thier young! It makes me sick.
It's an obvious ploy to lead new gamers to the Forgotten Realms setting
Ahhh, its wonderful how almost no Greyhawk discussion thread is complete without the mandatory bashing of Forgotten Realms . . .
The Red Wizard prestige class is actually one of the few PrCs that are FR in origin, yet translate over quite well into any generic campaign setting (including GH). Simply change the nation tie and badabing! The Red Wizards of Iuz are born, or the Scarlet Wizard's Order, or Rary's Red Order.
Way to go WoTC.....Hook em' when thier young!
Yet the many, many mentions of GH material doesn't lend you to think that the evil corporate bad guys are trying to hook kids on the RPGA Living Greyhawk?
The fact that one or the other of these types of comments is almost a must for any GH thread is what really makes me sick. This is a GH thread. You want to talk FR take it over to the FR thread then and have a blast.
I really have nothing against the "Realms". I just don't appreciate it when Realmsers refuse to play the game when its not in that setting. It really has come to a point where I have people walk out of the game when I don't utilize that setting.
Upon later discussion, most they admit that its because they just don't know Greyhawk. Some go on say they don't want to know it, or that there isn't any current material other than the LGG. Which they don't see as having any "crunchy" bits that they can study.
As far as WoTC's policy of trying to sell and resell current FR product, it's obvious. As for the evil "Machinations" of the corprate machine. I really don't subscribe to it. My statement is one of frustration at having to deal with the lack of support for Greyhawk. In turn this leads newer players to jump into the FRCS.
I personally am a big proponent of introducing Greyhawk back into the mainstream. The current stance that WoTC has on the subject is non-conducive to that goal. It infact pushes the new players away.
Now if the player has been playing FR forever, and prefers that setting. I will not begrudge you your setting. Just don't begrudge me mine.
I agree that WOTC does indeed push FR. In fact, if it were me running WOTC, I would do the exact same thing. Its business.
As for your opinion of FR players, you (as we all are) are colored by your own personal experiences. I would however, recommend the following thread to you on the FR boards where they have a similar FR vs GH discussion (and like any opinion based discussion, some are better than others).
Thread
I too am frustrated by the lack of GH support, but I also understand the reasoning why it isn't supported more. I didn't for the longest time, until actual reading a particular rant on the Sean K. Reynolds website that is actually about the cost of an RPG product, but actually gives you an understanding logically why WOTC does not pump out dozens of products that the 'majority' are not going to purchasing en masse.
Reynolds' Rant
To quote a few:
"Greyhawk is to Vanilla"
"Greyhawk has no depth or character"
"There isn't enough detail on the gods"
And my personal favorite....
"Ah c'mon, it is Gygax's world and he and his friends mentioned their characters in the PHB and DMG"
I would make comments about grammar and comprehension over there, but that would be......in courteous.
I think this kinda points out that what has been said here is true. Greyhawk needs to be repackaged for the newer generation, who no longer has access to all the "depth" material that has gone out of print.
In response to a point someone made over there, "the original boxed material wasn't very useful" Well, by comparison to the elaborate work put into the Forgotten Realms after that....he's right. FR supplements to date have had a lot more "crunchy" bits. It also spoon feeds you the story already written by the main players for that setting.
As for Reynolds Rant-
Well, I tell you what. I always subscribed to the notion that Greyhawk fell prey to corporate politics. But the fact that the product may not sell well is a great excuse....
Greyhawk is to Vanilla
I actually laughed out loud with that one. Vanilla just happens to be my favorite ice cream. I guess that's why I like GH over FR then.