It is worth the money for the extra information in it (well barring the Defiling rules of defiling from a different location than you cast)
Even if you don't want to advance your campaign through the canonical metaplot, there's a lot there to plunder (everything Sean mentioned plus the new PC races aarakocra and pterran).
I'm with Sean on this one: the thingie is worth for the new geographical informations (these can be used almost without change in the before Prism Pentad era as well).
Dark Sun is probably my favorite D&D campaign setting. What I loved the most about Dark Sun was that it was DIFFERENT, especially considering the time it came out (late 1991). It took the standard fantasy/D&D/Tolkeinesque cliches and stood them on their head. Also, when I played in 1991 I gamed with a group of Marines I had been to the Gulf War (I) with - memories of hot sand and wastelands were still fresh in our minds.
The problem was that as the game went on - through the novels and the subsequent suppliments - the game's metaplot reversed this cool "different" aspect of the game. It took what was set up as a radically different world and (if anything) pushed it back towards being a standard D&D campaign, leeching most of the originality out of the setting. The dark, mean, harsh struggles that made the world an interesting place were solved through metaplot, and the game world became a lot less interesting...
For instance, in the "DS1" boxed set, it is revealed that there is a single dragon in the world. It's an amazingly powerful being, and it's origins are a mystery. By the time the "DS2" was printed the dragon's entire history was revealed - and the dragon was also killed off by powerful NPCs. Sigh...
As suppliments came out they became progressively less useful. This was frustrating to me as someone who loved the setting, as I wanted more info on the world as it was when it started - not info on the watered down (bad pun) mush it became.
By the time "DS2" came out, the metaplot had become inseperable from the setting. All of the novels were made canon, and the game suffered as a result.
"DS2" concentrated less on the incredibly cool setting and more on the setting's secret past. The whole point of "DS1" was that the world had been ravaged by magic - but the specifics were left as a big question. The revised edition gave the answers to these questions, and thus stripped the world of a lot of its mystery. It also seems to change the focus of the game - from being about a savage world where the struggles are for survival to being about the rather unimpressive mysteries of the past.
Even though I own everything written for Dark Sun, I prefer the setting as it was presented in its DS1 days...
Even though I own everything written for Dark Sun, I prefer the setting as it was presented in its DS1 days
I agree with you there. I'm still not a huge fan of the whole Blue Sun, brown tide, and rebirth aspects of history, but all in all, I still think the 2nd box set remains far more original than most standard settings. I don't like the fact that the 2nd box set didn't have seperate player and DM sections for those new to the setting. And I can't stand the fact that the novels did what should have been left for the players to accomplish: learning about the Blue Age and killing Borys. But that's an ancient gripe that should be left to rest.
Originally posted by Mach2.5
I agree with you there. I'm still not a huge fan of the whole Blue Sun, brown tide, and rebirth aspects of history, but all in all, I still think the 2nd box set remains far more original than most standard settings.
It's very original, sure - it makes for interesting Burroughs-esque fantasy. But somehow it doesn't *feel* like Dark Sun. I realize that's very non-specific...
If anything, I'd say that it is worth getting "DS2" as a suppliment to "DS1," and leaving it at that. Look at it as "DM only background..."
But that's an ancient gripe that should be left to rest.
Very, very true. Still, when someone asked about the difference between the two editions, I figured I'd throw in my opinion.
;)
Originally posted by mickshrimpton
Were any of the rules & mechanics changed in DS2 (PC's still start at 3rd level, lots of psionics, stats of 5-20, etc)?
Off the top of my head, they added some PC races (Aaracokra? Okay, I can't spell it - the bird people) and made some minor tweaks. They also added a new stripped-down set of psionics rules that could be used to replace the 2E Psionics handbook.
As far as the Prism Pentad accomplishing what PCs should have been left to. Well, yes, it did. That's why we set our games back in time some, or just ignored it all. We have a friend who never read the books who played DS with us for a year who never heard of Tithian.
(he did learn about Rajaat, though, firsthand, poor soul...)
Originally posted by CaffeineGenasi
We always set our game in the time of the Sorcerer Kings and used DS2 for info, we didn't like the plot twists it provoded or what it tried to foist on you as, THE NEXT FIGHT or whatever, with the kreen crap.
I must admit that I LIKE the idea of the - as you put it (well) - NEXT FIGHTS represented by the Kreen and Dregoth. As much as I dislike the rest of the plot twists of the Pentad, I like the idea that once the Tablelands get a taste of freedom they get slammed by the big threats from off-stage. (Very grim, perfect for Dark Sun.)
But you're right, it isn't exactly "pure form Dark Sun" as presented by the first boxed set - which I prefer. I'd set a campaign well before the events of the Metaplot/Pentad - with Kalak on the throne in Tyr. A good campaign could go on for quite a while in this setting, and if/when that revolution does come it will be more shocking.
Edit: By the way, cool name, CaffieneGenasi!
Funny thing that one of the characters will be the daughter of the same player's character from our 2e DS campaign... But I like it!
As I heard, poor Denning was actually kicked out from his self-made world (Athas) by TSR, so he intentionally killed all the joke with revealing all the mysteries of the past. I could imagine he were rrrrreeeeeeeeeeeeaaaaaaaaaaaaalllyyy ****** off...
thats a great campaign. Did you ever go any further with it?
Back to the story. We got caught in the area between the planes (we don't use Manual of the PLanes, so this is all a homebrew explaination of the planes), kinda like the Void from L5R. This guy has the essence of a god and is performing this ritual to become a 7th level deity (We DID have Deities and Demigods
). The other players wore him down significantly, but he was just too powerful. I did a nice little time-hop to the future so that at least one of us would have a chance of destroyin him. He ends up killing all of the other players, figuring I teleported away in fear. He gets in the middle of this ritual right as I appear, get a surprise attack on him, and kill him. The adventure was originally supposed to have us all survive and become minor deities (the power split up evenly amoung all 5 of us), but I took it all instead (and because my mind was merged with a Dragon, our bodies became the Avatars of the one being we became). So, I get all these godly feats and new hit points etc etc and raise my buddy's. Problem. The only way we were able to enter the Realm Between Realms was hrough this weird doorway which was now shut and nobody had any planeshifting abilities to find the right doorway home. There's infinite worlds around us and each could be deadly. We end up stumbling onto Athas. I'm not stripped of my godhood, but I am stuck in my current humanoid avatar form until we can leave and most of my God powers are useless here. But that's okay. Currently we're just trying to survive the heat. The warriors's armor and almost all of our weapons have become not only the target of many thieves, but are in serious danger of destruction (some are very powerful artifacts indeed) and we've caught the eye of more than one Dragon King, who see me as a direct threat since I am a halfdragon. Our DM is doing awesome, too because this isn't you average "I'm an all powerful epic Character" adventure. Being over level 30 we're still in danger of death almost constantly.Btw its nice to see that there are a number of people who like DS as much as me
Originally posted by Cessna182
Off the top of my head, they added some PC races (Aaracokra? Okay, I can't spell it - the bird people) and made some minor tweaks. They also added a new stripped-down set of psionics rules that could be used to replace the 2E Psionics handbook.
(Sorry about the thread necromancy, but I just started reading these boards properly).
They also had alternate tables for Constitution and Strength, allowing non-warriors to get more than +2 hp/die (but at a slower rate), and removing exceptional Strength (which lead to silly results when there were 5 steps between 18 and 19 when you had stats between 5 and 20).
Personally, I like that the 2nd ed of Dark Sun allowed for some more variety in the setting. Partially through actual expansion (the Jagged Cliffs region and the stuff north of the Tyr region), but also through making the city-states more different from one another. I also liked that there were several concrete threats to the Tyr region (Dregoth, Kreen empire, Dead Lands). I didn't like the way the SKs were killed off, but I kinda liked the result.
One word:
"Burp"
Of course, it was all very tragic, but that kind of fits in more with the entire world than: "Whoops! Did I just break my sword off in your nose?"
I've had discussions about ways to make the world better following the book version, and I've even used them from time to time. Think Dregoth, think Dead Lands, think Kreen Empire. There's a lot of ways to go that are interesting, but I tend to agree with Cessna: DS lost something when the mystery was explained.