I, like many of you, was dreaming about a greyhawk hardcover the other day. Then I thought to myself, if I was given the job (hey - its my dream), how would I go about it, and what changes would I make?
Some people on the board have talked about moving time forward a little and messing around with a few countries, perhaps reducing the number a bit. At first I didn't like this idea, but I am starting to warm to it. You also have the possibility of killing off a few NPCs. This I'm not in favour of, because I really like a lot of the current ones.
So here I present what I would do. Perhaps you would like to contribute what you would do....
Firstly I would move time forward slightly to give me scope to mess with things a bit. So we are now at CY 600. I'm not planning any major wars through this period, but perhaps a few minor regional wars and some changes to countries.
I would flesh Tenser out a bit more, perhaps creating a small organisation with him at the head, based on promoting and defending good (as opposed to CoEight -> neutral).
The Scarlet Brotherhood still holds Scant and a few other parts of Greyhawk.
I would strengthen Rary's hold on the Bright Desert and make it clear that he is looking toward expanding (perhaps into the Gnatmarsh or even the Duchy of Urnst).
The Principality of Ulek has pushed the orcs back into the Pomarj, and Turrosh seems content to fortify his borders. He has formed some sort of alliance with the Scarlet Brotherhood. There current plans seem unclear, but perhaps orcish troops from the Pomarj will attack south-east aerdi on bhalf of the SB.
Celene has a change of policy and finally opens up. I'm very tempted to have Queen Yolande killed off.
A couple of former vassal states of Keoland are incorporated back into Keoland, willingly.
Sunndi suffers a major invasion from the Great Swamp by Wastri and his swamp minions. They survive but have had to call on Irongate and demi-humans to assist them.
Ahlissan, now strengthened after years of peace, is again looking menacingly south. King X wants Sunndi and Irongate and he senses weakness in both at the moment.
Irongate has openly supported the Rebels of Onnwal, and they now claim everything bar Scant. But between helping Onnwal rebels and assisting Sunndi, Irongate is weakened. A secong magic portal has been finished which links Irongate and Greyhawk (the first was to Mitrik).
A few independant towns (similar to Dullstrand), especially in those areas that aren't clearly owned by one state (or several lay claim to).
The army of the Pale has made strong gains in Tenh and it now seems likely that Tenh will become part of a larger Pale nation.
Shield Lands and Furyondy still attack Iuz, and though they have failed to make major advances, they have had some notables wins against Iuz forces.
Thats about all I can think of off the top of my head. Slightly fewer separate nations sounds good, but there would have to be a good reason for it.
What would you do??
Non-Brotherhood thieves walk about without hands, mages all have helms chained onto their head, Priests worshiping non-Suel / Brotherhood approved dieties would have their tongues removed, the commonfolk would man the mines and the fields, etc etc
Abysslin
I might even go a bit further than CY 600 -- perhaps to 607 or something nonintuive like that. However, 600 is nice because that's one human generation apres the 576 CY start of the WoG boxed set.
In the 7th Common century, Tenser should have a significant organization -- though as we saw after he was killed, Tenser's org. is a cult of personality kind of thing. In CoG, he is listed with an 18 CHA...
Likely he's reconnected with all of his old fae allies as well as that cloud (or was it mist) dragon. While Tenser focuses on the Central Flanaess, I think his gambit extends as far west as the Celadon Forest and Rary's Bright Empire (see infra).
Scant would be free and several years at that. There would still be a great deal of intrigue as the Wreckers and others fight the clandestine sabotage and assassination of the Scarlet Brotherhood, but the freedom of Scant would reinvigorate sea trade, which though perilous is crucial for the Flanaess.
The Scarlet Brotherhood would still hold the Olman Isles and several of the Amedio forts on the eastern coasts of the Hook, [but see my later post contradicting this suggestion!] but the Hold of the Sea Princes would be beyond their direct control. Again, agents would advocate for the SB from the shadows, but the Hold would be a patchwork of warring factions between the former Olman slaves (now roughy united and based in the former Duchy of Berghof) and the former Seolders. The Black Lion would fly over Monmurg. Port Toli would be a free city and Hokar would be one of the last bastions of the old Princes (alas with many Brotherhood agents).
Rary would have found the Scorpian Crown and succeeded in his attempt to unmake it -- thus restoring the land, which would be gradually recovering in many places. However, his meddling would have prompted the consolidation of the former Flan tribesmen of Itar. Vathris would be the perennial king -- manifesting now four times a year to lead his people beyond the Plain of Spears and against any comers (though always heading toward the ruins of Utaa).
The Principality of Ulek would not have regained its lands and would instead be in a period of stalemate. While the Principality finally conducted a powerful strike (supported by troops ferried behind the lines via ships), the sheer numbers of the Mak's forces eventually ground the advance to a halt. The dwur prince and his mixed forces simply lack the numbers to win the war of attrition necessary to attain the Jewel River competely. (Note I'd keep Corond, unlike LGH.)
[However, the Pomarj might be about to fall. That old quasi-deity, Krovis, might be about to awake.]
The SB would definitely continue its involvement with the Pomarj. While not friendly countries, they are allies of necessity. Likewise, the Bright Empire would have alliances with the Pomarj (possibly more "friendly").
Queen Yolande withstood the coup that Prince Brightflame and the Knights of Luna finally attempted, but in a quizzical act that non-olves cannot understand, Melf has become his cousin's Consort. He now leads the march-wardens, who are sore pressed to maintain the Jewel River.
Geoff would finally be recovered though the Hornwood and Barrier Peaks would remain fell places given to disgorging substantial forces of humanoids and giant-kin.
Sterich would be reincorporated into Keoland as a march -- after the throne discerned no other solution to problems amongst its ruling and noble houses. Istivin would remain a fell place, deemed cursed by many but inhabited by those too desperate or foolhardy to leave. The remaining dwur and noniz of the Stark Mounds would be vital to the continued health of both Geoff and the March of Sterich.
I like the idea of Sunndi suffering from a major invasion, but I think that after initial significant losses of land, the new kingdom would be steadily regaining its territory. Sunndi would have received aid from Dullstrand, Irongate, the olves of the Rieu- and Menowoods, the dwur of the Glorioles, noniz of the Hestmark Highlands, and even Lord Drax of Rel Astra. Drax's Iron Knights were ferried through Dullstrand and proved decisive in regaining the open lands. While distasteful to many within the young kingdom, the "alliance" with Rel Astra would also help Sunndi remain free of the United Kingdom of Ahlissa.
With Scant reopened and Naerie firmly an Ahlissan port, Irongate would be back in the riches. Its coffers would be overflowing but its leaders not blinded to their many subtle enemies. Because of the opening of the Sea of Gearnat, no teleportal to Greyhawk City would be necessary. Although trade to Hardby must confront the pirates of the Pomarj, the old port of Nessermouth and a rebuilt port near lost Sennerae (controlled by the Flan of Itar) would provide relatively safe ports of call before the hazardous sail into Woolly Bay.
The Lordship of the Isles would be split, after expatriates of Lo Reltarma joined with the counts of Jehlum and Luda to take Sulward and then the entire island of Diren. The Scarlet Brotherhood retains Ansabo and rules Ganode from Duxchan. Temil is the southernmost base of the free isles.
The Theocracy of the Pale would control Atherstone, Harpender, and Oxton. Stonehold would hold Nevond Nevned, Narleon, and Calbut. Tolran Hill, Redspan, Wotton, Braycott, and Stroun would be mostly like Bandit Kingdoms -- but with significant segments of the population interested in reviving the old Duchy of Tenh. Stroun would be a particularly strong proponent -- supported by the bards of the Old Lore, who reclaimed the Hall of the Wave and inspire the strong army therein encamped, which has successfully fended off both the Pale and Stonehold's occasional attempts to own more land.
[I think I'd kill Eyheh III -- perhaps assasinated, perhaps killed in battle (when he finally ventured to Redspan?). I think a warrior-prince (or druidic-princess?) could make an interesting leader for the dispossessed of Tehn. I envision the ruler very young -- thirteenish -- but having fanatical followers. Perhaps this child-duke/duchess is believed to have prophetic powers? Maybe this divine ruler has never been wrong when directing battle?]
[We should include the Rovers of the Barrens. Let's have them regroup and entreat with their traditional Tehnese enemies. Circumstances makes allies though remember that their cultures are substantially different (start elaborating this by thinking nomads v. settled).]
The Shield Lands would remain unclaimed besides the bit of land attained during the Great Northern Crusade. Belvor would be at the end of his life, still stubbornly advocating his eternal war [and perhaps seriously considering how not to leave it behind -- a fallen paladin? Recall Demogorgon's deathknights!]. Iuz would remain on Oerth -- though he would be less accessible daily to the Greater Boneheart, which increasingly would not coordinate but instead strive against each other's inscrutable plans.
The Wegweir would press the Land of Iuz's western border and raid regularly across the Dulsi River. Many of the Bandit Kingdoms would reassert functional independence though the priesthood of Iuz would remain significant in most cities.
The Horned Society would continue to travel throughout the north, building its cult steadily -- spreading devil worship and Nerull's gift.
North Kingdom and Ahlissa would remain tense, having ground each other's advances. Rauxes would remain lost to the Oerth. Grenell would be near the end of his life. Xavener would have many children and have survived multiple attempts on his life -- including one from his own wife.
That's it for me, for now!
[Brackets] indicate portions added. Other grammatical corrections are not so indicated. Enjoy!
I hope, one day and if I can ever get a group together, to have the PC's shape that part of the world with their actions as they are drawn ever deeper into the machinations of rulers and would-be monarchs.
In my scenario, they will either work with or against the 'True King of the Aerdi', depending on their choices throughout the campaign. This guy is essentially the heir to the Rax throne, before the Ivid's took over, and he wants his birthright back.
But he's only one of dozens of powergroups and individuals working towards domination of one area or another and the PC's will have to go on many quests and in so doing will make lots of enemies and friends who they'll have to call on to prevent age of darkness descending upon mankind (by age of darkness I mean more along the lines of the dark ages, ie. plague, famine, pestilence, loss of technology and lore).
Over the years, they'll be able to help or hinder the advancement of the Pale and their attempts at annexing both Tenh and northern Nyrond. They'll be able to help or hinder the Duchy's efforts in city-building within Nyrond (a legal, if unscruplous act which gives the duchy more power and influence in the area so that eventually they can claim it as their own) as well as help or hinder North Kingdoms wholescale take-over of Almor and Ahlissa's subsequent declaration of war upon North Kingdom (since the attempt, whether successful or not, would weaken NK). Eventually they will uncover several plots of individuals to gain power within such nations as they become more and more at home in the courts of nobles. Such prove to even be part of Scarlet Brotherhood efforts but most are simply greedy individuals looking to advance themselves by any means.
Lastly they will aid or hinder the True King's efforts at destroying the corrupt and evil power-bases within Ahlissa and the North Kingdom and the establishment of a New Almorian Kingdom. Such efforts will bring them into contact with Delglath the Undying, Xaene, Ivid V, Lakaster, Drax, Grenell and Xavener, among others until they either succeed in bringing about the new dark age (if the True King fails and they contributed to that failure) through the destruction of the most ancient storehouses of lore and magic and religion (those repositories of the Great Kingdom) and the subsequent plagues and famines and pestilence which will spread throughout the Flanaess to touch as far west as Veluna, as far north as Stonehold and as far south as the Pomarj, or hailing the birth of a new Great Kingdom as the states of Ahlissa, Almor, North Kingdom, the Pale, Nyrond and Tenh are brought under its banner.
By then, they'll be 20th-level and ready to perhaps become hero-gods
But maybe CY 610 or later to allow for a few more changes.
Meaning, maybe stur things up a bit more. After all, if not much has changed, why would anyone want to buy a new book?
Below are some random ideas & thoughts along these lines - as long as we are dreaming.
1. Add some detail history to the Outer edges (western, eastern and southern) of the known world.
E.g. Zelf invaded by a new group (or a throw-back group - a tiny outpost of Suel empire that never fell into barbarism or disrepair).
2. Have a country that became a fell land 25+ years ago (90% abandon and lost to misc critters and baddies).
This opens up a whole new perspective on visiting the cities in those areas.
3. Have another country that is in recovery mode from being a fell country (say as recently as 5 years ago). The plot lines for baddies still being around, needing construction workers, trade lines, badetry on newly open routes, a lost city refound, etc.
4. Develop some of those outer regions more - giving people a reason to go there - could add a so much to the world.
E.g. Lands to the east - unknown, unexplored, or 'were not there before' - less far across the ocean than believed could add a greater purpose to the eastern shore of Oerth/Flanaess.
Ditto for the south.
5. Change some of the political landscapes.
E.g. Celene changing thier policy and killing off Yolande are a great ideas, about time for a change.
E.g. A Flan kingdom arising, or more surprising a halfling &or gnome kingdom. Not so silly - more of a whole new roleplaying environment/perspective mixed intto a world we know.
6. And on a similar note, increasing the %age pop. of non-humans makes sence to me - the %ages alway's seemed to be too low.
Where do we go from here, anyone looking to put a Netbook together?
Goldwillow
Thanks for those replies. I hope a few more people can respond like you guys did, because I love reading this sort of stuff. Lots of great ideas out there.
Goldwillow - love the idea about an invasion by another race/people from "outside" the borders. I actually considered some sort of attack on Zeif, by "unknown" peoples. This could be a war with the Ataphad Islands or something like that, or people from further west. Cool idea and it would add something new to the setting.
Tizoc dude - you should be writing this stuff for a living. A whole bunch of great ideas there. I love the bit about Drax's Iron Knights in Sunndi, sounds "typically" Greyhawk in that we have this blur of evil, good and neutral - rather than the stark good vs evil of other settings. I love that idea. I've never saved a post to a document before.
Thanks Delgath, looks like we tread similar parts of the world.
Any one else got any cool ideas like these guys?? CY 600-610?
I've changed my mind about the Olman Islands. While I don't favor a resuscitation of the entire Olman Empire, I think that reclaiming the Islands would help make the Flanaess more interesting, i.e. it would open up the sea trade and exploration of the south.
Therefore, I'd do something drastic -- perhaps involving a volcanic eruption or an avatar of Chitza-Atlan. This catastrophe would coincide with a significant uprising amongst the Olman slaves of the Islands and would result in the nigh complete destruction of the Scarlet Brotherhood on both Islands. (Alternately one Island would remain in the hands of the SB -- if so the eastern one, being closer to the Tilvanot Peninsula.)
This action would result in the establishment of a new Olman city-state with Narisban as its port. This "empire" would have holdings on the Hook of the Amedio Jungle, contact with the pirates and islands of the Vohoun (Pearl) Sea, and war with the degenerate Suel of Hepmonaland (and of course with the Scarlet Brotherhood).
In part due to this development, caravels from Rel Astra would "regularly" sail the eastern coast of Hepmonaland, trading with the various Touv kingdoms and coming up the western coast -- to call at Narisban (renown for its heavy ship tax-tribute).
The Olman would not likely have a strong navy, but their outriggers (props to Chatdemon) would be numerous enough to protect the Islands and to offer safe harbor to non-enemies, i.e. everyone except the Scarlet Brotherhood).
This Olman "empire" would be distinct from the Olman kingdom based on the old Duchy of Berghof, but both states would know of each other.
Narisban would again be a mighty port, with ships hailing from throughout the Azure Sea and even up into Woolly Bay. While less secure than Scant, Irongate, or Naerie, Narisban's position would permit trade again to flow along the coasts of the Azure -- with developed ports along the Hook and the free city of Port Toli being a sort of "final" destination (besides Gradsul and Gryrax of course).
This set of developments would be useful because it'd open up more of Oerik to exploration and adventure. Also, these developments would complicate humanity in the Flanaess by fabricating regular Olman relationships and contexts.